Author Topic: Snuff 2 (Read 1834 times)

bluerose · « **on:** February 28, 2018, 07:06:00 PM »

This is like the 3rd or 4th time i have started this thread this week. Heres hoping it works.

Previous thread: http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9583.0

bluerose · « **Reply #1 on:** February 28, 2018, 08:00:52 PM »

It worked!!!!

It has been a very long week. Last wednesday evening d13 and i were sitting at the table talking about depression. We both have it. She acknowledged that the coward has it but also thinks that he is just a d!ck. Her words.
She then opened up to me about something she was hiding. She doesnt open up very much and i let her do this at her own pace. She told me that after the parenting time assessments were over she almost committed suicide. I was at work and s20 wasnt home yet. She wrote a note and was going to drown herself in tbe bathtub. I always thought that after the cutting this was a possibility but having her actually say it took the breathe right out of me. I asked what stopped her. She said that she realised that it wasnt the answer. Thank you god. She made me promise not to tell anyone. I think that she doesnt want to disappoint anyone especially her brothers. I told her that she is a beautiful, smart, talented, caring, kind and amazing young woman. Nothing she could ever say or do would make me not love her or walk away from her. If she needs me, im there. No matter where i am or what im doing she is top priority. She cried. I asked her if she needed to hear that. She said yes.
I did talk to my best friend and my sister about it. I had to. I need to handle this in the best possible way. I need help keeping an eye on her. My best friend told me that she knows all that but reassuring was good. She has trust and abandonment issues. She needs to hear it from someone else though. Someone else being the coward. She told me that maybe i should let him know. I cant. He doesnt care. He would just do what he did when she td him she was cutting berself. Run. Its to much guilt for him. I will let him keep walking around happy and blissfully unaware and believing in his own warped mind that he is a good dad. How sad. As for me, i will carry d13 for as long as she needs me to. I have enough strength for both of us as well as my boys.
The coward did come for his visitation this past sunday. First time in a month. He was on time but only spent 3.5 hours with her. I noticed he pulled up closer to the house this time. He hasnt done that in a long time. Its funny what you notice. Just before all this blew up he started filing his nails. He has always been a nailbiter. D13 daid he bought emery boards for his nails. I have never known any guys that filed their nails. Maybe its just the kind of guys i grew up with but still weird to me.
He never texts her or calls during the week until sunday just before he picks her up to askif he is picking her up. He blew up her phone a couple of times when he wasnt seeing her. She said that he wanted to know if she was okay and if everyine else wad alright. He didnt specify who everyone was, just said everyone. I thought that was interesting. She told me that on valentines day he texted her"Happy Valentine's day. Your father loves you". That wasnt him. I think we all know who it was. He doesnt talk like that.
She told me that during their visit sunday he apologized if the divorce caused her any depression or anything. I asked her if the apology was heartfelt. She said it was empty. I asked her if he seemed happy. She said that it seemed that he is trying real hard to hide that he is upset.
This probably all means nothing but it does get your mind thinking.

stillbaffled · « **Reply #2 on:** February 28, 2018, 08:37:11 PM »

BR - so hard to have to hear something like that from anybody. I can't imagine how you felt hearing it from your lovely D. Does your D have a counselor or therapist she can talk to? I know you'll do the best you can for her, BR. Sending support.

Treasur · « **Reply #3 on:** March 01, 2018, 02:04:48 AM »

Bluerose - I've had suicidal thoughts at times on this horrible path and the first thing that struck me was how brave of your D to tell you and how much she must trust your love and wisdom to tell you. Often, voicing these dark things - and feeling truly heard - is a healthy bit of sunlight. When I did it, it was odd...it made it more 'normal' in a good way, less scary to just tell someone. It must have been tremendously hard for you to hear but it sounds as if you are supporting your D well.

Whyus · « **Reply #4 on:** March 01, 2018, 02:14:44 AM »

Quote from: Treasur on March 01, 2018, 02:04:48 AM

Bluerose - I've had suicidal thoughts at times on this horrible path

I think most of us have had such thoughts if we are honest, even if only for a short time. I found my selfish sat on my motorbike at a railroad crossing at 2 in the morning watching the Trains go by. If I didnt have my Boys faces in my head at that time I may not have made it home. IDK, BD and discovering a PA is the absolut worst Thing !!

Your D really is a hero for talking to you about this blue...

bluerose · « **Reply #5 on:** March 01, 2018, 03:52:04 AM »

Still,
It was very hard to hear. This kid has had to take to much and unfortunately i can only protect her from so much. I cant control what he subjects her to. Yes, she does have a counselor.

Treasure,
She is very brave. I think that it would be difficult to admit that about yourself to some one. I think most people especially in our teenage years have like that.

Whyus,
I had suicidal thoughts as a teenager but during i think i have prayed to god just to take me instead of thinking about doing it to myself. You know how much your kids need you through this so how could you abanfon them in that way. It would be selfish and your not.

Thunder · « **Reply #6 on:** March 01, 2018, 04:11:16 AM »

Blue, 13 is a very vulnerable age. Teens are dramatic by nature anyway, then toss in this mess and it can be overwhelming for them.

My 13 year old granddaughter went trough the same thing after her parents divorced. First the cutting, then she apparently had been journaling about suicide. One of her close friends went to my dil and told her, thank God.
They took her to a crisis center for teens and she got a lot of help and counseling, even family counseling.
The doctor there told my son almost all the kids in there were between 13 and 15.

I know you're there for her Rose, but you may want to look into some counseling for her too, just to sort herself out.
She's going to be dealing with her dad for a long time.
Big hug to you, Rose. You're a good mom.

bluerose · « **Reply #7 on:** March 01, 2018, 04:17:14 AM »

Thank you Thunder. She does have a counselor that she seems to like very much. 13 is a hard age but so is 45.

Thunder · « **Reply #8 on:** March 01, 2018, 04:31:32 AM »

Ha ha, yes it is.

I'm glad to hear she has a counselor. : )

Schratz66 · « **Reply #9 on:** March 01, 2018, 09:43:04 AM »

Blue,
I was suicidal when my father left when I was 14 and chose not to have any contact with me or my brother. He turned down any visitation rights in the divorce, and so I not only lost my dad but his parents followed suit with not wanting any more contact with my brother and I. My mother started drinking excessively and I was in charge of running the household. I did not want to live any more, so I understand where your D is at.
Let me give a ton of respect to your daughter for confiding in you - that took a lot of guts on her part and you handling the situation was simply amazing.
Unfortunately you cannot make her dad care or be concerned, but I think she will be okay as long as she knows you are there for her and that you love her unconditionally. Just keep reassuring her that we go through tough times but they don't last and that she will love life again.
She is so lucky to have you

Never say never · « **Reply #10 on:** March 01, 2018, 10:13:25 AM »

BR, I am so sorry that your daughter is going through such a tough time. As if it's not enough that you are, but to add that pressure to your plate. That was so brave of her to tell you. I, too, am glad that she is seeing a counselor. Hopefully, she is confiding in the counselor everything that she is thinking. Did you ask her about that?
As for your husband, even though he is the dad, I don't think it matters either way. For all we know, he could think you are making it up for sympathy. Who knows?
Not only is your daughter one strong girl, you are one strong woman.
As Thunder would say, bug hugs:)

Milly · « **Reply #11 on:** March 01, 2018, 11:58:28 AM »

Rose, I'm so sorry to hear your D13 is so depressed that she has thought of suicide. My S is 13 and I can't imagine someone so young being so unhappy. You seem to be doing everything that can be done. I have this with my oldest D23. I have noticed that having me to talk to in those terrible down moments when it gets dangerous, helps her make it through to a not so bad moment. How very stressful. Our poor children. At least your D has you.

bluerose · « **Reply #12 on:** March 01, 2018, 12:44:31 PM »

Never,
Nice to hear from you. Miss ya. She has not told her counselor. My best friend told me that i need to call her and let her know. Im back and forth about that one. The counselor just lets her talk about anything she chooses. Which is good because its a way for d13 to build up her trust and then talk about bigger issues. Your spot on about the coward thinking im lying for sympathy. Another reason why i wont tell him anything and for tbe simple fact that i feel he just doesnt deserve to know. A father should know and he is not a father right now. Hasnt been one for a few yeats now.

Milly,
Thank you for your thoughts. Your right. Our poor kids. I dont understand why the courts dont acknowledge this behavior in these guys. D13 told me that the few times he has texted her in the last few weeks he was ordering her to work on a book that she mentioned that she wanted to write. She said that he was acting manic about her answering him. I really feel like my feet are touching a fire and something is brewing. I can feel it.

Treasur · « **Reply #13 on:** March 01, 2018, 11:45:34 PM »

I'd be tempted to call her counsellor and give them this information. I would probably tell my D that I was going to do so, and why, and emphasise that I wasn't telling anyone else and that her conversations with the counsellor were still private.

bluerose · « **Reply #14 on:** March 02, 2018, 06:14:45 AM »

Treasur,
That is exactly what my best friend told me. D13 knows that it is confidential between her and the counselor unless it is something that could bring harm to her.

Milly · « **Reply #15 on:** March 02, 2018, 04:01:09 PM »

When my oldest was in high school and I discovered a terrible experience she'd had when I read her diary and confronted her about it, although I had always promised her I would never read her diary unless I thought her life was at risk, that was the end of her diaries, her place of safety, her place to let it all out safely. She got much worse after that.

I'm not a professional so I don't have an explanation for this, but my gut feeling would be to not touch her safe spot, her therapist. It's possible that this therapist is longer right for your D. Letting her talk about her worries is one way of having therapy, the other form is for the therapist to act like a problem solver - Freud versus Jung. One way can work for a while and then the other form is better.
Maybe talking to your D about whether her therapist is helping her face things and whether she's finding strength/ looks forward to going to her therapist, might be useful. My gut tells me don't mess with her safe place.

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #16 on:** March 02, 2018, 05:24:52 PM »

Blue I’m so sorry to hear about your D. But what a gift that she opened up to you. Truly a testament to her trust in and live for you.

I had to chuckle tho when you agreed that 13 is a hard age, but so is 45. Yes, yes it is. One day at a time for us. Your D is so blessed to have you. And you her. Hugs friend

bluerose · « **Reply #17 on:** March 03, 2018, 12:20:18 PM »

Milly,
I have thought of her having a safe place and if i want to mess with it. I havent done it yet in regards to the counselor. Im trying to look at every angle of this before i react or respond. Im not stupid, i know she has trust issues with everyone right now but i would lime to be one of her safe places and i know that i am gradually getting there.

Kit,
Nice to hear from you. I know she trusts me but only on a certain level right now. I dont slap her hand away when she reaches out. I think she is testing me and how i handle it when she does reach out. Seeing if i will do what the coward has done when she reaches out to him.
45 has been awful! Actually most of the 40's have pretty much sucked. I really want my 20's or the first part of my 30's back. No, im not having an mlc.

bluerose · « **Reply #18 on:** March 05, 2018, 03:12:49 PM »

D13 did not go with the coward Sunday for the weekly dady visit. I promised her that since she did so good on her report card, honor roll good, that i would give her some money when i got my income tax back. So she texted him saturday evening to tell him she wasnt going. He wasnt happy. No pun intended. She told him that she had counseling on sunday. I dont think he bought that or maybe it was the wh*r^ talking for him but he said whatever and hasnt talked to her since. She seems to be doing real good since opening up to me. I took her and her best friend to the mall sunday we had fun. Ended up in a store for anime merchandise. It was interesting. I unlike the coward did buy the best friend a few things because i wanted to and i could i love her like my own.
The married guy a wrote about on my last thread came into the bar saturday. He ended up staying my entire shift. I havent seen him since the last time i wrote about him. He asked me where i have been and i told him that i only work friday and saturday right now because its slow. He said that he would have to start coming in on those nights now. I got hugs and kisses on the neck from him. He then started talking a bit about his wife. He said that he told his wife that he hasnt liked her in a long time and was looking for a room to rent. He also threw out how much money he makes. I thought to myself this sounds oddly familier. He then invited his wife and kids in for dinner. They came. He spent most of his time while thet were there on his phone and talking to other people. She told my boss that it was their 10 year weddi g anniversary. She left with the kids by herself. He stayed. He got my phone number. After i gave it to him i did regret it. I enjoy the attention from him and he is very attractive but i dont know if i could take it any further. Not knowing that scares me.
I have been thinking though since he told me what he did about his wife and his behavior towards her reminds me alot of what i have went through and what i have read on here about other people's experiences, i really want to talk to him again and see whats in his brain. I want to know what he is going to say and if its anything like the script they all use. I am really curious about this. Im probably getting into something that i shouldnt be but i cant help it. I really need to know.

Treasur · « **Reply #19 on:** March 05, 2018, 11:49:33 PM »

Quote from: bluerose on March 05, 2018, 03:12:49 PM

I thought to myself this sounds oddly familier....He spent most of his time while thet were there on his phone and talking to other people. She told my boss that it was their 10 year weddi g anniversary.
Im probably getting into something that i shouldnt be but i cant help it. I really need to know.

Please go carefully. It sounds pretty Script stuff. I'm not sure how the benefit of knowing what's in his head would outweigh the damage and chaos of being part of another family's MLC drama. You can help it if you choose differently, please think well.

Never say never · « **Reply #20 on:** March 06, 2018, 12:00:05 AM »

BR, while I know the attention may be nice from another male, I would really tread carefully on that one. You really need to think about the damage that could happen to another family. In my case, the OW told me: "Never, I know how you feel. My husband cheated on me and it took me four years to get over it."

Seriously? How can another woman do to me what happened to her.

It's just my opinion, but I wouldn't go there right now with a ten-foot pole. I feel very bad for that woman right now.

As for your daughter, that is a tough one on how to deal with it. Unless you fear for her safety, truly fear that she is in a dangerous situation, I would leave things as they are. Is it time to move to a different counselor? With the laws how they are, I am not sure how much the therapist can confide in you. If she is not being totally honest with her, then maybe it is time to change things up.

Right now, Blue, you have enough on your plate than to engage in more drama, in my opinion. Please think about that.

xoxo

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #21 on:** March 07, 2018, 09:20:52 AM »

Blue I know you are hurting so much. And my heart aches for you and all other LBS. And that includes that poor woman and her children that you saw. I know you don't want to be a party to the destruction of yet another family. This damaged human may be giving you attention, but I suspect his feelings do not run very deep for you, or anyone else for that matter right now. How disrespectful to bring his family in to your place of work, and then flirt with you and get your phone number. Disrespectful to YOU and his wife.

Now, this next part is from a place of love and understanding. All those things you write about your H's OW. Those terrible names you give her. What a horrible person she is. Remember all that. I won't judge you at all--that is not my place. And I believe you are a kind and loving person who would never intentionally hurt another human, especially in the way you have been hurt. And you are going to do what you are going to do. Just think about it. Really think about it.

Hugs friend

bluerose · « **Reply #22 on:** March 11, 2018, 10:10:52 AM »

Never and kit,
I dont think i would have the balls to let it go far but its the things he has said that sound so much like what the coward has listed as his reasons for leaving that grab my attention. I want to get into his head. I need to understand all this. Its so hard to explain. I know that he isnt trustwothy and likes drama and that is really a turn off. I want to know what they say to the ow. If it really is all script. So far, what he has told ne he has said to his wife is. He texted me saturday afternoon. It was random and didnt make any sense. I think it was an attempt to start a conversation with me. I did not answer. I have heard that him and wife run around on each other. My boss at the bar pulled up her fb and she put men as her intetest. What married woman does that?
D13 went eith the coward today. I again noticed that instead of staying back in the driveway,as far away from the house as he can, he pulled up to my car as close as he could. Close to the house. I close the curtains when i know he is coming. When he pulled out of tbe driveway he pulled back farther than needed. He was driving the wh*r^s little car.. He lined himself up so he could see in the window. He couldnt of course. I know im probably analyzing this to much but its just weird to me. You know, the lityle things.
I called s20 to ask him something and he is with d13 and the coward at the bowling ally. From what s20 said last week they hadnt even talked in quite sometime. Again weird. I really feel like he us up to something.

Never say never · « **Reply #23 on:** March 11, 2018, 05:28:52 PM »

BR ... you are not going to get into the head of this man right now at this stage of the game. This is a 2 x 4 for you because it will not turn out well for you.

All of the information you need is here on this site ... along with articles and other tools.

This man sounds like he is in the throes of his own MLC. He would be using you for whatever is going on in his head. It sounds like he would tell you what you want to hear.

BR, you are not going to learn anything from him. I really worry about the damage that can happen here.

We are all here to support each other, but I don't like this. I'm sorry ... I just don't

You will not be able to get into his head. He can't even get into his own head. Do you really want to be the OW???

bluerose · « **Reply #24 on:** March 11, 2018, 05:41:10 PM »

Never,
I appreciate your concern. I really do. It is not my intention to be an ow. I dont want that. I just wonder why it was ok when a few people on here wanted to pick the brain of an ow that posted on here whining about her married boyfriend and me wanting to pick a cheaters brain isnt?

Nas · « **Reply #25 on:** March 13, 2018, 09:58:18 AM »

Just catching up on things. I'm going to slightly disagree with what others have said. I think if you are careful not to get emotionally involved and you are completely up front when talking to him, you could glean some good insight (example, "Hey cheating married dude, I would never have a relationship with a married man, my H cheated on me, I think cheating is a form of abuse and causes so much hurt and I wonder why you think it's okay...")

bluerose · « **Reply #26 on:** March 13, 2018, 11:05:49 AM »

Thank you Nas,
He is attractive and the attention is nice but when he hugs me , i feel nothing. I just am curious about what they say to ow about the wife and how they go about it. I want answers from the coward that i know that i will probably never get and i think this might help me. I dont know how it will but i just feel like some people come into our lives for a reason and this might be the reason.

Thunder · « **Reply #27 on:** March 13, 2018, 02:16:22 PM »

Blue, who picked the brain of the ow? That's as scary as scary gets.

Both of them will make no sense. That why they find each other. Two cra cra's together.

I would agree with Nas, IF you weren't attracted to him, but you are.

I think Anjae picks the brains of her MLC male friends, but I think they are just friends, as far as I know.

Everyone just cares about you, Blue.
Hugs

shimmerofhope · « **Reply #28 on:** March 13, 2018, 03:02:55 PM »

If you found him disgustingly ugly would you still want to pick his brain? I haven't read your backstory on this guy but is is there other evidence of mlc or could he just be a flirt or cheater. How do you know he is mlc? Does he have other signs? Please don't think I'm judging. I find myself in a similar situation. A guy I work with tends to flirt with me. He s married of course. I like the attention but I don't think I would act on it. He is attractive. But if I didn't find him atttactive, I would not allow the flirting. So I guess I'm not as innocent here as I thought. In my mind, i think he flirts to be nice nothing more. I would not want to be part of hurting another family.

Milly · « **Reply #29 on:** March 13, 2018, 04:34:35 PM »

The one thing that stands out to me is how vulnerable we are when we're suffering. We find reasons to justify attention we receive because we really need some. We're lonely, attractive, nice people and we just want to be wanted, hugged, noticed. When I think of it this way, I see how my H got involved. He still had a choice, but it's not easy to think straight when we're not in a strong place to begin with.

bluerose · « **Reply #30 on:** March 13, 2018, 06:08:35 PM »

Thunder,
I dont know if you remember or not but about 4 to y months ago an ow posted a thread about her married boyfriend pulling away from her. I cant remember her name. Some on here wanted to keep her talking to pick her brain. I was upset that she was even on this site.
As far as being attracted to him, he is cute but less now just because of the little bit he has said about his wife. I know that he is a liar and a cheat. Been there done that.

Shimmerof hope,
I dont know. I never said that he is in mlc. To be honest it never occured to me. I think he is just a flirt and a cheat. Like i said i am real curious about the script they use.

bluerose · « **Reply #31 on:** March 13, 2018, 06:27:20 PM »

Milly,
I am not justifying his attention because i am lonely. I dont think about him, call him or text him. He asked me if i had facebook or snapchat and i dont do that either. I chat with him when he comes into where i work. I dont initiate physical contact with him. He hugs me and has kissed me on the neck while doing so. I havent kissed him. .

shimmerofhope · « **Reply #32 on:** March 13, 2018, 07:09:56 PM »

:if you consider him a friend, you might get some answers, but if he's interested in you, you'll only get lies. My opinion anyway. Someone had responded to you that he,was mlc he's probably just a jerk. Lol. Keep us informed.

I think the guy I work with just flirts because I'm alot older and he knows I didn't want my divorce. That's why I think he is just being nice trying to make me feel attractive or something. I hope we will all have our answers one day or answers we can accept.

bluerose · « **Reply #33 on:** March 13, 2018, 07:49:07 PM »

Shimmer,
Never had mentioned that it sounded like he was mlc. He could be. He is at the age and he is on his second marriage. Its funny that you said if i considered him a friend. The last time i talked to him he stated rhat we were friends. My boss doesnt trust him and says that it seems like he is preying on me. She thinks he is using us to cover up another affair. He talks to her like she is his therapist.
I do want answers. None of this should have happened.

bluerose · « **Reply #34 on:** March 15, 2018, 03:29:09 PM »

D13 went for her visit sunday. The coward kept her for 4 hours. Unusual. He took her bowling. S20 went with them. She said she had hear earbuds in most of the time while they talked. They were at the bowling ally less than 2 hours and he brought s20 home. He then took d13 to s22's house. He was in their house for 10 minutes and took s22 outside to talk. He was there a total of 2 hours. Again unusual. He then brought d13 home.
Curiosity got the best of me tuesday night and i asked s22 what dear old dad wanted to talk about. He said nothing really. I told him that his dad had said that i chased the boys away from a relationship with him and that i have it in writing if he would like to see it. He just shook his head. I asked him if he really agreed with his dad when the coward said that tjis divorce was the best thing for all of us and i have that in writing too. S22 said he has never said that. I asked him if he thought his dad was a better person and father now. He said no. I dropped it after that. We actually talked this time, no yelling. I know i shouldnt have brought any of it up but im having a bad week with it all, again.
S22 did tell me that the cowards sisters youngest son is getting married and the wh*r^ and him are going. That hurt. In 23 years we only went to funerals for his family. No birthdays, graduations, weddings or baby showers. No family get togethers . Now that she has taken my place they get invited. Another slap on the face. I hope his family burns in hell.

nah · « **Reply #35 on:** March 15, 2018, 10:01:59 PM »

Quote from: bluerose on March 13, 2018, 06:08:35 PM

I dont know if you remember or not but about 4 to y months ago an ow posted a thread about her married boyfriend pulling away from her. I cant remember her name. Some on here wanted to keep her talking to pick her brain. I was upset that she was even on this site.

I remember her. I also remember being one of the ones that wanted to pick her brain but also I was one of the ones that didn't accept her excuses either.

As for the married man experiment.... I get exactly what you are doing b/c I did the same exact thing about two years ago. Now before everybody gets all heated up, I am the first to admit that I was not angel the first 2-3 years post BD BUT I had a very very strict rule of NO MARRIED MEN, and I stuck to that rule like glue. The requirement was not just a little not married but very not married, in other words,... "separated", about to be "separated" or even divorce is in the works... nope, the ink had to be very dry for at least a year for me to even think about it....

So, the married man experiment... yep there was a contractor at work that started to flirt with me. At first I was considering it then I realized he was married. Then he started to send me extremely inappropriate emails. So what did I do? I went along for a few weeks and had my entire team laughing their @sses off at this ridiculous man. Then I told him exactly what I thought about a married man sending those emails. Did I change a thing? Probably not. But it was interesting to get into his head for a short time.

Maybe it's none of my business but I really wish The Leaver had come across a "flirt" like me, just enough to scare the bedazzled jeans off of him for a few minutes.

bluerose · « **Reply #36 on:** March 16, 2018, 12:31:14 PM »

I wish the coward would have met someone like that too!!!

bluerose · « **Reply #37 on:** March 17, 2018, 12:37:48 PM »

I was babysitting my little angel today and we had to go to a couple of stores to find a st Patrick's day shirt to wear tonight for work. My boss told me about this last night and i cant not find one. Anyway i take little guy with me and we are in a store and i run into a friend that i havent seen in over a year. Him and the coward were friends and me and his wife were friends. He said that about 6 months ago the coward called him, out of the blue. The coward wanted to know why he hasnt called him. Our friend told him that a friendship requires 2 people and you havent called me either. He hasnt heard a word from the coward since. These 2 have not talked in 2 or 3 years. It got me thinking about how they reconnect with old friends they havent talked to in a long time and was wondering if that it may have been an attempt to do so. I hate how i over analyze things but he has nc with me and when i hear stuff like this it makes my brain go onto overdrive.

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #38 on:** March 17, 2018, 01:49:43 PM »

I do think they try to reconnect with their old lives at some point. And since they do obviously shut out everyone they ever cared about, makes sense that a reach out like this is a possible reconnection attemp. I think they do several before it sticks. And certainly if they have a controlling OP in their lives (and let’s face it, most are!), they likely are blocked from doing it. They need to grow emotionally enough to make the break fro the OP before they truly reconnect tho—well that’s my understanding of it anyway!

My H cut off all his friends too. And family. He reached out to many when he peeked out of the tunnel, but then went dark again when he went back into the fog.

Don’t worry about over analyzing Blue. We all do it. And when you have a vanisher makes even more sense. Be gentle with yourself. And have fun tonight. Hope you find a shirt!

bluerose · « **Reply #39 on:** March 18, 2018, 09:41:50 AM »

Kit,
I did not find a shirt but my boss gave me a blinking shamrock necklace to wear. The place was rowdy and busy last night and i made good money.
Its funny with the coward, he didnt cut all friends off. Just most of them and he seemed to have gotton closer to his family. He gave up our family for all that. I hope it was all worth it.
The married guy came in the bar last night with his wife. He did give me hugs throughout the night and asked me why i didnt text him back. My boss talked alot to his wife. She said she would fill me in about it when we had more time.
At the end of the the night my boss came up to me and said, you are never going to believe what his wife just said to me. She asked my boss if she was into women. .y boss said no strictly men. The wife said , to bad he likes that. Back in august my boss and me were talking and she said then that she wondered if they were swingers or something a d told me to me to stay away from them. This just keeps getting more interesting every week.

bluerose · « **Reply #40 on:** March 18, 2018, 01:03:27 PM »

The coward kept d13 for 2.5 hours today. He took her to mcdonalds and the park. She was on a swing and he was on his phone. Its a beautiful day here. He had a loaner truck from the place that is fixing his. He can afford to fix his truck but not take his daughter and do something with her. Why even bother getting her?

bluerose · « **Reply #41 on:** March 20, 2018, 06:47:08 PM »

D13 just told me something about her visit sunday and i dont know how to feel about it. She told me that the coward is going to see his lawyer tomorrow. He is going to drop everything. The sunday visits, the fight for weekends, everything. It will be her responsibility to call him to hang out. He will not call and invite her anywhere. It will be solely on her to see him.
I knew something was coming but for him to put it all on her is just shocking to me. How can he do this? I will admit i have posted on here that i wanted him to go away and just leave us alone but i wanted that for me not her. Im selfish. I feel like this is him saying goodbye to her. She said that she probably wont call him. I feel like this is another way for him to blame me for him not seeing her but now he can also blame her. My heart is breaking for this child yet again. He is completely gone. The wh*r^ can now truly have him all to herself like she set out to do. I convinced that he really doesnt want any responsibility for his only daughter ever agai and the wh*r^ has played him like a fiddle. I think forgiveness in my heart is now non existent. I have no compassion or pity for him. How can he do this?

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #42 on:** March 20, 2018, 08:37:32 PM »

Blue it is especially hard to see what they do (or don't) to our kids. I swear, if my S didn't play lacrosse he would NEVER see his F. They are truly a mess. And some day....SOMEDAY...it will hit them. That they missed their children's entire childhood. Your sweet D will never be 13 again. And he will regret it. But sadly, nothing you can do about it. All you can do is be the best Mom you can. And I know you are a wonderful strong mama bear. Only thing is, you can't make H be a better dad. He's in a deep dark place. Sorry friend. It sucks when we see our babies in pain. Hugs.

bluerose · « **Reply #43 on:** March 21, 2018, 05:23:08 AM »

Thank you Kit. D13 and s22 have said in the past couple of weeks that the coward doesnt like the designated day and time of the visits. He wants it to be spontaneous. I really dont understand his thinking. Maybe he finally realised that is how it is going to be through the court. Even every other weekend is going to have certain days and times he gets her. Does he actually think that he was going to go through this whole process without any sacrifices or consequences? The price of his so called happiness is hefty. Is this not the teenage way of thinking?

UrsaMajor · « **Reply #44 on:** March 21, 2018, 05:39:29 AM »

Well wah wah wah wah...

Too bad for him.. yeah, that is the price you pay for being a Mid-Lifer... Schedules, responsibilities, and all....

bluerose · « **Reply #45 on:** March 21, 2018, 06:48:44 AM »

Thanks UM. This all still shocks me.

bluerose · « **Reply #46 on:** March 24, 2018, 10:02:45 AM »

Its been a crazy so far. I found out that i am probably getting a promotion at work. Job 1. It comes with pretty decent raise which will help.
I talked to my lawyer the other day and told her what d13 told me. She said that if he follows through with it, it may be the best thing. She believes he will just fade out of the picture. I asked god a while ago to make this stop and for him to just go away. This isnt the way i wanted it to be wprked out but i have no control over any of this and i dont care anymore.
I found out yesterday that my mom has cancer. They think that a hysterectomy will take care of the problem. It is a very curable one. The only time i cried was when i had to tell d13 about it. My parents ars very close to her. My little girl doesnt need anymore on her plate. She handled it well. I told her that having cancer doesnt mean your going to die. I reminded her that my cousin had leukemia 18 years ago and is still alive and kicking. Letting her know that seemed to help her. I hope.
She did also tell me that the coward asked about me Sunday. As far as i know he hasnt done that in quite some time. He wanted to know if i was still working my day job. She told him yes. She doesnt think he knows that i quit the factory and have a new job. Its really none of his business anyway. My friend said that he asked because of the guilt he still has for what he did. I hope so. I hope he lives with it everyday and it consumes his soul. I have been really questioning myself lately on wether im still standing or not. I mostly think no. I dont think i will ever be a big enough person to have forgiveness in my heart for him. There is just to much hurt and disgust in there for for that.

bluerose · « **Reply #47 on:** March 25, 2018, 03:36:58 PM »

So d13 went with the coward today. He had her for exactly 2 hours. They drove around went to a store and then the car wash. He asked her if she thought about the weekend thing anymore. She told that she thought he was going to drop the weekends and just hang out whenever. He said that he still needed to have weekends as an option. He became agitated with her and raised his voice and told her there are 2 reasons why you dont want to come.
1. You dont want to spend time with me.
2. You dont want to be around the wh*r^.
She told him that it was neither. She just dont want to go on the weekends. He told her that he is her father and not someone she can just push away. He is trying to be a father to her and she wont let him. I have known for a ehile that he was shifting the blame of their relationship in to her but this really confirmed it for me. D13 said that she wanted to punch him in the face.
She told me some another thing that i found pretty interesting. She told me that he asked about my parents. He wanted to know how they were after their surgeries. My dad had a hip replacement 2 weeks ago and my mom had a dnc last week. One of the kids had to have told him about this or he wouldnt have even known. The thing is, as far as i know, he hasnt asked about them in 2 to 3 years. At least not d13. Why now? She said that she didnt tell him that my mom gas cancer. I asked her not to.
When he dropped her off me and d13 went to the store. When i pulled out of the driveway i noticed that he was over to our neighbors house. He stayed for over 2 hours. He hadsnt been over there in almost a year. Why now? From what my neighbor gas said he doesnt contact them. This adds to the fact that he contacted another friend 6 months ago after not talking to him for about 3 years.
Is this movement? Is he having a moment of clarity and peeking out of the tunnel? WTF is going on? I really hate that i analyze everyrhing. I have always done this. Im driving myself crazy right now. My adrenaline is pumping.
My best friend said another reason, and i thought of this before i talked to her, is that he could be growing tired if the wh*r^ and making it look like he is with d13 so can go where he wants without her around. Is he trying to reconnect with people? Is he feeling out how people he was close are going to treat him? Does he even care? HHHHEEELLLLPPPPP!

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #48 on:** March 26, 2018, 12:36:11 PM »

That’s the problem Blue—we have no idea where their head is at. Usually the only was we know for sure is after they come out of the crisis and see it all clearly in hindsight. That said, it does seem like he’s making some efforts. And truly, only a matter of time before OWs True colors are revealed.

Sorry to hear about your mom. The prognosis sounds very good though. And tell your D that there are more cancer survivors than not these days—I am one of them!

Milly · « **Reply #49 on:** March 26, 2018, 03:35:36 PM »

Blue, I'm sorry to hear about your mom, and I'm sorry for D13. However, your H sounds normal for someone going through a MLC. It's going to take more time and patience if that's what you want.

You are doing great as a mother. I have a S13, I know how hard it is for them. They're still little. They want their dads to be like before. They want to have that fairy tale family. They are putting on a brave face and they don't need additional bad news, like your mom, even though she has a great chance of beating this, which will go a long way to helping your D see that bad things can have happy endings. Just like Kit said, she's proof, and she's great, isn't she?

Blue, just take it one day at a time. I think it's much more important to your D13 that you be doing ok than her dad making some miraculous change. I know that's a lot of responsibility, but you are all she needs. Take care. xxx

bluerose · « **Reply #50 on:** March 26, 2018, 04:53:31 PM »

Thanks kit and milly. There are alot of survivors of cancer and im glad your one of them kit. I know she is going to beat this and it could have been alot worse.
It makes me feel a little better to know that this is normal for someone in mlc, even though i know he is not normal. So far from it. When you have someone who has vanished from your life the way he has every little thing gets your brain going. I dont get to see his body language or if he looks ok or anything from that matter. It makes this really hard.

bluerose · « **Reply #51 on:** March 29, 2018, 01:29:23 PM »

S20 bought a used truck last night. His car old car broke a few months back and he has been saving for a new one. He called the coward to ask him if he would put him on his insurance policy because it is really expensive for someone his age to get his own policy. The coward said no, my insurance will sky rocket. Well mom came home and took care of it. He is yet again on my policy.
Im a good father. Im a good father. Yeah, i dont think so!

SteelSpine · « **Reply #52 on:** March 29, 2018, 08:28:04 PM »

I get it -- he's a good father when he feels like it , when it's convenient, if it doesn't cost any money, and if everyone plays along the way he wants them too.

I am sorry to hear about your mom, blue. I'm glad the prognosis is good.

Thunder · « **Reply #53 on:** March 30, 2018, 02:37:23 AM »

Blue, I'm sorry to here about your mom. It's hard to deal with the worry, on top of everything else you're going through. Hopefully the surgery takes care of it. Is she having it done soon?

It's very hard when you have a MLCer who is so self centered and only thinks of himself.
The only thing you and your kids can do is expect nothing from him. He isn't going to help with anything, so just don't ask him and none of you will be disappointed.

He is not being a good, supportive father right now, so expecting him to act like one will only cause more hurt and aggravation.
You just can't force someone to care, blue. I'm sorry.

Your kids are lucky to have you there for them.

Nas · « **Reply #54 on:** March 30, 2018, 06:34:34 AM »

Just catching up on your thread, Blue. I'm sorry about your mom. I am currently kicking cancer's butt and I know she will too.

Also sorry to hear about your MLCer's latest foolishness. Typical MLC, he wants his daughter to be responsible for keeping their relationship going.

I don't know if your H is depressed but I generally assume all MLCers have some level of depression constantly. When I read it through the lens of depression, it unfortunately makes total sense. The depressed brain says no one really cares or loves you, so it almost seems like he's unconsciously trying to make his young daughter "prove" her love for him by making her have to always go to him when she wants to see him. It's really a tragedy what happens to a depressed person's thought processes.

Not surprised at all that he told her son he wouldn't put him on his insurance. They will always let us down when it comes to anything to do with money. Really, really sad and just shows you how messed up his priorities are right now.

Sending good thoughts for you, your kids and your mom!

bluerose · « **Reply #55 on:** March 30, 2018, 08:08:25 PM »

Steelspine,
Its never convenient for him to be a good father. Maybe the wh*r^s kid gets the good father.

Thunder,
My mom is going to the hospital next week to find out when her surgery will and what will happen after that. Hopefully it hasnt spread. As for the coward, i ask him for nothing. I ran out of expectations for him long ago.

Nas,
Im glad to hear you are kicking cancers ass. You are one tough lady. Give it hell. What you said about the coward and d13 made alot of sense. I always like to look at things at a different perspective.

Thank you to everyone for your well wishes and prayers for my mom. They are greatly appreciated and comforting. I hope everyone of you has a wonderful holiday.

Mitzpah · « **Reply #56 on:** March 31, 2018, 04:35:12 AM »

Quote from: bluerose on March 30, 2018, 08:08:25 PM

Steelspine,
Its never convenient for him to be a good father. Maybe the wh*r^s kid gets the good father.

Bluerose,

First of all - Happy Easter to you and your family!

I am sorry to hear of your mother's diagnosis, I hope that her exams and further exploration are positive and that cancer is gone for good. I know how hard it is to deal with elderly parents and their malaises. My father died less than a year ago and I sorely miss him. My mother is adapting to widowhood after almost sixty years married, it is not easy for her.

I agree that we cannot expect our children's parent to support us and be there for us, however, I don't see why they should not know of the serious issues that face us and our children. I think your d13 should be able to tell her father of your mother's cancer diagnosis - he may not be of any help to you but at least he knows and from what you said, he is interested in knowing of their wellbeing. Don't you think that telling your d13 to deliberately not tell him, kind of controlling?

As for him being a good father - the way I see this crisis, he has reverted to a very selfish phase and where being a 'good' father is lost in his fog. At the moment, he is only going to look out for himself. That is why we need to be the parent.

JMHO

Never say never · « **Reply #57 on:** March 31, 2018, 04:46:00 AM »

BR, I'm sorry to hear about your mom. Prayers going out to you and your family. I'm sure your daughter is scared, but the prognosis does sound very good.

Also, I hope you get the promotion in your job. Fingers crossed on that!!!

As for your husband spending time with the neighbors, who knows? Remember, we can't get into their heads and we wouldn't want to. Things will happen on their own time.

I'm happy your son was able to get a truck, but go figure, who is there for him ... once again ... good, ol' Mom!!! Of course, your husband doesn't have money for him. No expectations ... no disappointments.

Right now, time to concentrate on you first (remember the oxygen mask on the plane), your mom, your daughter and your son. Isn't it great being the strong one

Keep us posted on your job. If you get the promotion, does this mean you won't have to work a second job?

bluerose · « **Reply #58 on:** March 31, 2018, 08:35:18 PM »

Mitzpah,
Im sorry you lost your father. I know its something we all have to face sooner or later but that doesnt make it any easier. 60 years married. Wow, that is a beautiful thing.
I dont think i am controlling d13 by asking her not to tell the coward about my mom. If she wanted to tell him, she would regardless if i wanted her to or not. I feel lime he has no right to know. He walked away from all of us and hasnt cared in over 3 years. That is a consequence for doing so. He cant have it both ways. Im sure one of my boys will tell him anyway if they havent already. Happy easter to you as well.

Never,
Nice to hear from you again. Thank you for the prayers. We know that she will do well.
I cant figure out the coward right know even if he came with a manual. I still hate the word time, though not as much as i used to.
Thank you for crossing your fingers on the possible promotion. Mine are too. Unfortunately, i have accepted that i will probably always have to work 2 jobs. My goal is to get a job with benefits and that is in the works. I will take the promotion if given to me until the other one calls me. The way i see it is that i have 4 years until the child support and alimony run out. I have these to do the best i can to prepare for me and the kids future. I have to make the most of it.

I got out of work early tonight. My knees were really hurting me tonight. Actually all week. And i didnt really want to be there tonight. Im really feeling rundown and exhausted. Really long week.
Me and d13 went to s22's house to visit. Truth be told, i really wanted to see my grandson. I havent seen him in 2 whole days and was having withdrawals. He is such an angel. S22 told me that his truck wouldnt start and needed someone with a truck to pull him home. He was 2 hours away. The only one he could think of with a truck wascthe coward. S22 called him and he said he would come but first had him do something under the hood which actually solved the problem and his truck started. Do something for one and not the other. How nice.
On the way home, i asked d13 if she told the coward thst she wasnt going with him tomorrow. She wants to spend the holiday with her family. Her choice. She said thst she talked to him earlier today and told him. He said fine. They were on the phone for about 2 minutes. 2hours at the neighbors, 2 minutes with his own daughter. Fair enough. I asked her if he sounded sad that he wouldnt see her for the holiday. She said yes, a little.
I asked her if she missed how it used to be. She said no. I dont hang on to memories because they dont matter. I have to be around him physically but not emotionally. I despise him. My dad left me. The 10 years i had with him wont matter in 20 years. She said a little more but i was so hurt for her i cant remember. He has no idea of what he has done.

bluerose · « **Reply #59 on:** April 02, 2018, 05:22:32 PM »

After working today, i had to go and babysit my grandson. When i came home, i got the mail and i recieved papers from the friend of court and the cowards lawyer. The first one is from friend of court informing me of a court day for the parenting time assessments. It is on April 24th. The second was from his lawyer stating that he wants overnight visits and the child support recalculated.
I told d13 about this. She is furious. Even dropped a couple of f bombs. Is he doing this just because he thinks that the child support will get lowered if he has her for overnights? D13 said that he was going to drop all this. Then he said that he needed weekends as an option. She told him what she wanted and then said he doesnt listen to her. Is this his way of keeping the drama going? I leave him alone. I dont call, text, email or stalk him on fb. He doesnt call d13 at all during the week. He texts her 2 hours before he pucks her up on sunday to ask if ahe is going with him. Texts not calls. I just wish he would leave us alone.

Thunder · « **Reply #60 on:** April 02, 2018, 08:03:30 PM »

Blue, please don't involve your D in the legal stuff. She is really too young to understand any of this.
Leave her out of it as much as possible. Just protect her as much as you can from all his stupid drama.

Just deal with the jack@ss yourself as 2 adults.

He will have a hard time lowering his child support without a really, really good, valid reason. Believe me.

bluerose · « **Reply #61 on:** April 03, 2018, 03:29:31 PM »

Thunder,
He is the one pulling her into this. 2 weeks before easter he told her he was going to drop all of this. 1 week before easter he told her he wanted the overnight weekends as a 2nd option. I let her know that we had a court date now for the visitation to prepare her for what might come.
Last night when i told her about court she was at her friends house for the night. She called me shortly after to tell me that she called him and confronted him. She asked him why and said that she thought he was going to drop it. He said that it isnt a 2nd option anymore it is the only option. He then was mad at her for not going with him on easter sunday after je had told her that it was fine if she didnt. He told her you obviously have better things to do on the weekends then be with me. She started having an anxiety attack and started to cry. She said im sorry mom but i slipped and told him about grandma. She said to him, excuse me for wanting to spend easter with my family when we just found out that grandma has cancer. She said this to him. He said, i dont understand why you are crying. She hung up on him.
He started calling her and she wouldnt answer. He then sent her these texts:

Coward: Answer your phone
Why dont you have your mother call me and i will talk to her
There is no reason to shut me out d13
Either you answer your phone or we will talk on sunday at noon.

She did not answer. He stopped. To me it seems like he is bullying her and throwing a tantrum because he is not hetting his way. She told me she is scared and does not want to talk to him on sunday. Conflict avoider?
Why would he want to talk to me? He hasnt communicated with me about her in a year.
I called my lawyer and told her what was going on. She is tired of him using d13 as the go between. She also had me email a screen shot of the texts d13 and him so that she has them when she talks to his lawyer. She also said that she thought he was going to drop it. I said i guess he changed his mind. She said, this guy is firetruckin nuts. Finally, they are seeing it.
He told me when this started that he didnt want drama in his life but he is the one that keeps thst keeps it going.

bluerose · « **Reply #62 on:** April 05, 2018, 02:25:54 PM »

So, me and d13 were at the grocery store yesterday and our old neighbor was there. This is the neighbor the coward still talks to and visits. This man and his miserable were so rotton to me at the start of this that i havent talked to either of them in 2 or 3 years. He has walked past me and d13 numerous times in that 2 or 3 years and does not even acknowledge us. But yesterday as we were standing in the cereal aisle he says hi blue! He was about half way down the aisle and i was at the end of it and he must have thought i didnt hear him, i did but i just didnt respond, so he says again hi blue!. I again ignored him. D13 kept trying to get me to respond because she thought i was being rude but i wouldnt. He finally gave up and walked away.
Why on earth was this jerk trying to talk to me? After all this time. The coward has taken d13 over to their house occasionally and she has said that they bad mouth me. Mostly his wife but him to.
The weird things just keep happening. My mom thinks that maybe he did it because he felt bad about everything. I think that there is more to it than that. I should have just looked at him and smiled and said hi because now curiosity is getting the best of me.
The coward has not tried to contact d13 at all this week after upsetting her monday. Im a good father!!!!

nah · « **Reply #63 on:** April 05, 2018, 05:06:19 PM »

Quote from: bluerose on April 05, 2018, 02:25:54 PM

I think that there is more to it than that. I should have just looked at him and smiled and said hi because now curiosity is getting the best of me.

I think you are right. I also think you are better off handling it just the way you did.

bluerose · « **Reply #64 on:** April 05, 2018, 05:48:39 PM »

Thank you Nah. I'm just wonder what exactly his intentions were. Is he spying on me or trying to get info for the coward. He lives less than 2 miles down the road from me.

nah · « **Reply #65 on:** April 05, 2018, 05:59:15 PM »

Quote from: bluerose on April 05, 2018, 05:48:39 PM

Thank you Nah. I'm just wonder what exactly his intentions were. Is he spying on me or trying to get info for the coward. He lives less than 2 miles down the road from me.

My best guess from experience is they might have had some kind of falling out and he's dying to tell you about it.

Maybe someday you will know for sure.

bluerose · « **Reply #66 on:** April 05, 2018, 06:54:52 PM »

That could be a possibility.

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #67 on:** April 06, 2018, 04:31:15 PM »

And remember, Blue is in charge of Blue. So nothing he could say will make you divulge anything. I’m sure you will have another opportunity.

Poor D13. I really hate how our babies are treated!

bluerose · « **Reply #68 on:** April 06, 2018, 07:01:40 PM »

Kit,
It is terrible what these poor kids have to go through with this mess. I know what i have felt like through it all and im 45.
I was working at the bar tonight and i was waiting on a table. It was a man and 2 older kids. I kept looking at the guy because he looked familiar to me but i couldnt place him. When it came time for him to pay the bill he handed me his credit card and i ran it through. I looked at the receipt that they have to sign and the name was the company that the coward works for. It was his boss. I think i only met him 1 time for a few minutes, maybe twice, i was like. Wtf! I have never seen him in there before. I dont know if it was just coincidence or something else but on top of all the other little weird things in the last couple of weeks it just strikes me as crazy. I told my boss about it and she said omg, are you kidding me? What the hell is going on?

bluerose · « **Reply #69 on:** April 07, 2018, 11:31:24 AM »

Before i left for work last night, d13 told me that the coward was calling her. She didnt answer. He started texting her. She didnt answer. He then left a voicemail. It said" d13 ignoring me is not gonna help this. I just dont understand why you are so upset." She still didnt answer and he stopped calling.
It seems like this is on his mind for a little while and he goes into this manic phase for a little while and then nothing. Do they have these lottle manic episodes and then nothing?
It amazes me how he has no concept of what being a father is anymore. Its like he is aware but just cant get the pieces to fit.

nah · « **Reply #70 on:** April 07, 2018, 12:46:50 PM »

I think they cycle, just like we do.

bluerose · « **Reply #71 on:** April 07, 2018, 06:58:44 PM »

I completely agree with that. It just seems like he getscin a manic state about it but it comes and goes.

bluerose · « **Reply #72 on:** April 08, 2018, 02:17:51 PM »

D13 and her bff went with the coward today. I knew she was dreading it because of what happened earlier this week. She took her bff hoping that he wouldnt talk because she was there and i told her before she left that he probably wouldnt even bring it up.
He took them to dairy queen for ice cream and kmart. He bought her nothing. He gave her nothing for easter. He took her over to s22's house like i knew he would. They stayed there for 2 hours. He brought up absolutely nothing that happened. Acted like nothing happened. Her friend said that she thinks he forgot about it. Big surprise.
This guy was so hell bent on talking to her and trying to figure out why she was so upset and he says nothing? He has got to be crazy.
I am so anxious and scared about the up coming court date. I dont want this to be happening. I just want to know why these guys feel that the price of their happiness is the destruction of their family. Is it really worth it? How can you claim that you love and care for your kids and then continuously kick them down? I just dont understand this.

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #73 on:** April 08, 2018, 03:43:11 PM »

I know it’s scary Blue. It sucks that we need a third party to intervene on what should be a family decision. But we aren’t dealing with rational people here. Even assuming he gets what he wants, my guess is things won’t change too much in your world.

Anyway, you are a strong woman. You got this!

bluerose · « **Reply #74 on:** April 08, 2018, 04:53:19 PM »

Thank you kit. D13 just told me that she did return his phone call friday night. He was snippy with her and nothing was resolved. She told him she hung up on him because she was having a panic attack and needed to calm herself down. He said that was no reason to hang up on him and it should be easy to calm herself down. What?
She also told me that they stopped at his friends house today. This is one of the younger guys he works with. They sre making plans to go fishing in a couple of weeks. She heard him say how excited the wh*r^ was about going. Another knife in my heart. It would have been nice if he would have done that stuff with me but i was never good enough. I really believe now that he is happy with her now and never loved me. Im done standing. I hope he dies a very long and painful death.

Mrs.Smiling · « **Reply #75 on:** April 08, 2018, 05:00:41 PM »

I'm so sorry you are feeling this way. It is extremely tough to hear these things. I went down too after hearing he went out of town with Gramma twat. It was a knife...It really hurt...But I moved on from it because honestly I don't even know if it's true. It's just an assumption.
It might all be just talk. Your H knows that your D talks to you. That it could just be that. You were good enough and you ARE good enough. Always remember that. Don't let your H define who you are. I know that the last sentence is out of anger. It is tough, and it is horrible that they act the way they do. But there is nothing that we can do about it but get thicker skin. Remind ourselves that they are not in their right mind and they will do what they want and say what they want just to hurt us. It truly is sad.

Be strong for your D. She need a good role model. You are that wonderful strong role model!
This moment will pass...Just work on being strong for the next encounter...You can do this...

Thunder · « **Reply #76 on:** April 08, 2018, 05:08:22 PM »

Aw blue.

I'm sorry, please just don't waste your energy hating either one of them.
They are not worth your time and energy.

You know he is off kilter and you WERE good enough.
Don't even think like that.

He's in Crazy Land where nothing is real. All illusions.

bluerose · « **Reply #77 on:** April 08, 2018, 05:57:59 PM »

But what if its not thunder? Maybe they are right and are really happy. What if we are the crazy ones?

nah · « **Reply #78 on:** April 08, 2018, 06:21:21 PM »

Ok I'll play.

Let's pretend they never loved us and they finally found their one true love and a lifetime of true happiness.

How does that change OUR lives today?

I have almost thirty years of memories. Meeting as teenagers, our first time living without our parents, buying our first house, our second house, our third house, forth house,....jobs, having children, him cutting the cords and holding our babies still warm from being inside me, vacations, holidays, even small things such as painting, raking, having dinner together for years and years.

I have thousands of really good memories, I felt loved throughout those memories.... he can't take those memories away from me.
I don't care what he is doing now. I don't care whether he is or isn't thinking of me, if he's happy or sad. He still can't take away my good memories. I can choose to focus on all the bad times, or I can keep the good memories close to my heart and keep them there.

I get to choose.... not him.

bluerose · « **Reply #79 on:** April 08, 2018, 06:25:40 PM »

Thats true nah. But i dont want the good or bad memories anymore. I want them gone.

nah · « **Reply #80 on:** April 08, 2018, 06:38:06 PM »

I guess that's your choice too.

I dated a guy who was going through a heartbreak the first year after BD. He also said those exact words. He wished he could erase all the memories he had with his girlfriend.

Even then, when I was drowning in depression and heartache, if I had to choose,...If I have to keep all or erase all, I choose to keep.

There was a time when even the good memories made me cry. I was crying for the loss of our love. It hurt like crazy. I'm so glad that I can again look at those memories with a smile.

I don't want to forget having our children, or when he gave me a ring, or all our Christmas's and Thanksgiving, Birthdays, pool parties, etc. That was my whole life. Why would I want to forget a lifetime of memories?

They were good memories, if they weren't good, why would I care that he left?

I believe right now, Blue, you want the pain to go away. Believe me, I get it. You will get there, the pain will fade and someday you will look back at your good times with a smile. Remember, holding onto the anger only hurts you. I'm not saying to ignore it, I was angry for a long time but at some point, It does feel good to let it go.

Thunder · « **Reply #81 on:** April 08, 2018, 07:42:55 PM »

I agree SO much with nah, Blue.

Don't allow him to steal your life of good memories from you. They were a big part of your life, they were real, and they were for him too.

He may be able to force them out of his memory right now, but he won't ever be able to forget them.
He will remember.

You are not the crazy one.

Lioness · « **Reply #82 on:** April 16, 2018, 02:32:40 PM »

Blue, catching up on your thread now! I know exactly about wanting all the memories gone, wishing for a clean slate! I am right at that point!

bluerose · « **Reply #83 on:** April 16, 2018, 02:53:28 PM »

Lioness,
Im making my own clean slate which is why i probably wont be posting on here anymore. I am not standing anymore. I dont care if he ever comes out of this or falls off the face of the earth. I am moving on.
I have been talking to the married guy alot this past week. He wants to get together and hang out and im going. Just talking to him over the past week i have been happier than i have been in 3 years. More confident, im not hungry, i want to get things in my house done that i havent cared about in a long time. Im actually giddy. I know its wrong and i dont care. I feel i dont belong here anymore.

nah · « **Reply #84 on:** April 16, 2018, 03:03:23 PM »

Blue...

A married guy?

KeepItTogether · « **Reply #85 on:** April 16, 2018, 03:12:46 PM »

Not judging you Blue. But I do Wish you’d reconsider. You are giddy now but that will fade.

Lioness · « **Reply #86 on:** April 16, 2018, 03:15:07 PM »

Oh Blue, I am sad to see you go! I feel you are really hurting and trying to muddle through the pain and i wish I could give you a hug and tell you to breathe. I don’t know if meeting a married man will help take away that pain, I don’t believe so. But I understand that at the moment you don’t see things that way. Take good care of your heart Blue.

Disillusioned · « **Reply #87 on:** April 16, 2018, 03:32:38 PM »

I don't know you Blue, and I don't want to sound judgmental and I don't know all the details of your situation, but your last few posts you've obviously been hurt, angry and upset. Like many of us LBS's. Turning to a married man makes you just like your husband, and I don't think that's really what you want, is it? I hope you can take some time and think about what you are contemplating. It's only going to hurt you in the end, not help you. It sounds like you need to take some time and be alone and work on yourself. You don't need someone else to make you happy! You don't need to continue standing if you don't want. That's a personal decision and I'm sure everyone on here would respect your decision either way. But turning to someone else right now will not make the pain go away. It may mask it, but you may end up damaging yourself and the person you are involved in. I think you probably already know these things. I'll keep you in my thoughts.

Tyks · « **Reply #88 on:** April 16, 2018, 03:33:35 PM »

Blue, you have mentioned the married guy before. I know you know this is wrong and if you continue this relationship you are no better than our mlcers, unfortunately.

Nas · « **Reply #89 on:** April 16, 2018, 03:37:40 PM »

Quote from: bluerose on April 16, 2018, 02:53:28 PM

Lioness,
Im making my own clean slate which is why i probably wont be posting on here anymore. I am not standing anymore. I dont care if he ever comes out of this or falls off the face of the earth. I am moving on.
I have been talking to the married guy alot this past week. He wants to get together and hang out and im going. Just talking to him over the past week i have been happier than i have been in 3 years. More confident, im not hungry, i want to get things in my house done that i havent cared about in a long time. Im actually giddy. I know its wrong and i dont care. I feel i dont belong here anymore.

I'm sure this is exactly what all of our MLC spouses said too. I don't care if it's wrong because it makes ME feel good.

Come on, blue. Do you want his wife to feel the way you've been feeling?

shimmerofhope · « **Reply #90 on:** April 16, 2018, 05:41:06 PM »

If they are swingers that's one thing. You are all consenting adults. But if he is cheating, you become the problem not the solution. Can you face your d. Could you face his children? What kind of man takes his family into the place where his potential ow works? He may be attractive but he's a cheating jerk. Like I said, if this is consensual between ALL players, there is no problem. If not, it comes with alot of consequences. I hope you think this through. I personally want to be the only woman in my man's life. Just as soon as I get one. Lol. I really wish the best for you.

Thunder · « **Reply #91 on:** April 17, 2018, 02:30:31 AM »

Blue, sometimes a spouse's MLC triggers the other spouse to have a crisis too.

I hope that's not what's happening. I wish you well.

Whyus · « **Reply #92 on:** April 17, 2018, 04:04:53 AM »

this is so sad Blue,
we are all here for you and can feel the pain and dissapointment in your last post...
IF they are swingers then swing away but with his W too.... If he is a cheating scumbag then please dont go anywhere near him. He is no better than your H and that is not the type of Person you Need to be around right now.

What would your lovely D13 think if she were to find out???
I hope that you read what we are writting, you are not alone.

Milly · « **Reply #93 on:** April 17, 2018, 12:12:45 PM »

Just catching up, Blue. You're in so much pain and since you're preaching to the choir here we absolutely know how painful the heart ache is. Maybe I'm wrong, but could going with a married man feel a little bit like getting back at your H? Maybe a little bit of comfort in being able to show him that another married man does want you? Does find you attractive? I have had the desire to get back at my H, although I hadn't considered going with a married man, but I did consider finding a very young man to show my H that I was attractive to young people just like he was to what we thought was his young OW.

I think when we're really hurting bad, just like when someone is about to take their life, they can't think of anyone else's emotions because they're overwhelmed. Just like a parent can commit suicide in spite of adoring their kids who will survive them and be in terrible pain. At the moment when the pain is too much that person goes numb and acts to remove the pain as quickly as possible, whatever the consequences. It's like looking at one self from the outside - it's not me.

I think you are in terrible pain and just want it over with right now. But you've found the forum and all of us here so that means that you're strong, you wanted to learn how to handle your pain, not like your H and all our Hs who just ran to escape that pain. Here we are wishing we could reach out and give them our advice to help them through their pain so that they would stop destroying everything that matters to them. You, however, do have us. You found us all by yourself. You are much more capable than you think.

And to go back to the post that triggered you, your H telling his young friend in front of your D that the rotten OW was really looking forward to the fishing trip, to me from the outside, it sounded so much like a teenager showing off to his buddy that his naughty girl was excited to do something with him.

I bet your H squirmed inside as he said those words in front of your D, but he had to look cool in front of young buddy. I wouldn't be surprised that the OW is not looking forward to going fishing, she's either doing it to please him, or because she 'heard' that you didn't go. Bet she's crap at it though and won't be wanting to go very often, or he'll have to spend a lot on her later to make up for the fishing part. That is not a healthy relationship.

Blue, if I could say one thing to you that you might hear, it would be that you are in pain because of no fault of your own. You have to learn to survive though, otherwise the next time you are faced with pain you still won't know how to survive it.

Please come her to us and let it all out. Big hugs,
Milly xxxx

Treasur · « **Reply #94 on:** April 17, 2018, 12:42:28 PM »

We're here if you choose to come back, Blue.

I agree with Milly. You're in pain and you want the pain to go away. I hope that a bit of you knows that you're stronger and wiser and better than running from it this way. That you deserve better than this...but we'll be here for you anyway. x