[mcm64d]

Hi All.....Received an email from Kenda-Ruth- Stupid things MLCers say. There maybe another topic on this but there is so much info here.....

Anyway, I highly suggest this exercise. I am just over three months into this disaster as of Nov 2023 and not only did I find it therapeutic but actually sometimes funny. TBH, I am far from perfect and have said and done things I wished I hadn't, but I am amazed that I allowed myself to get upset over some of this stuff. Anyway, some of the silly or contradictory things my stbxw has said to me in about a two month span (I try not contacting, only responding), Hope its not too long a post and you get something out of it. Maybe share some of yours as well? Anything bold is my stbxw talking.

Morning of bomb drop eve: we missed you last night and I wish you could have come out. By that night after starting one of her fights:Can we agree that we are unhappy? Me- no I am fine. her: I am staying at my sister's tonight. Next day BD

BD: I am not coming home, I want a separation. Me: You're divorcing me. Her: (nastily): No I said separation.

All these are After BD:

I had been thinking about this separation for months. It was something inside my brain that snapped that night and I decided I wanted a separation. "We" decided to separate. I always wanted a divorce but couldn't bring myself to tell you right away.

Marriage shouldn't be or take work. We work well together We should have never gotten married, I should have seen the red flags.

I love you but I am not in love with you. I love you like a friend. I don't love you. We do love each other but I have to find out what's best for me.

Of course I want to remain friends. Why throw 15 years of friendship away? I want to be able to cat sit when you have to travel for work. And I want to meet your girlfriends and check them out to see if any alarms go off. I can't imagine you with another woman.

I didn't say that I can't imagine you with another woman, I said you'll need to change so that the next girlfriend won't have to suffer through what I had to suffer through. It won't take long for you to find someone, you're a great catch. You do not need to change for me.

Me: I am sorry you feel like I was a needy a$$ all of our relationship. Her: you are not needy or an a$$, you're a great person.
Subsequently: you are an absolute psycho. I am sorry you are not a psycho. you are a psycho you are a time bomb. I had to walk on eggshells everyday because of you.

This one I have seen as typical of MLCer: I am going to be 100% selfish and finally look after me and me only

The family plan cell phone bill increased. Me: Ok can you pay it until I get a chance to get off the plan. Her:no problem I just wanted to let you know I was going to call them to see why and try to get it lowered. e (to myself): Why would I care ?

The next week the cell phone company needs her permission for me to leave the plan. Her response to me asking her to call: Why are you leaving our cell phone plan?

After a nasty monstering session face-to-face by her I tell her I love her and miss her. Her response, crying: I love you and miss you too.
Subsequently: I never said that and I meant I missed the cat and dinners.

After 15 years, 11 married and seeing each other several times since BD/ separation, my wife:I don't feel safe seeing you alone without someone in the driveway. Me: I have never hit you, come close to hitting you. her: I know

On why I was trying to talk things through. Me: To get a better understanding on why you are doing this and work toward closure if need be. Her: Closure for what???!??!?? What's closure?

Again from what I read textbook MLC: I cannot remember many good times during our relationship

She cannot understand why I cannot keep the house and give her her half. She also got sad that we would have to sell off the assets neither of us would take. Then on what would have been our 11th wedding anniversary she mad arrangements to come to our house at 11:00 to take pictures of these assets to sell online. 3 weeks later I found out she hadn't done anything with those pictures yet. Me: You came here on our anniversary to start selling assets and haven't done anything yet? Who have you turned into? Her: That is just the day it fell on. I would have thought that was a problem to do on our anniversary, I would have thought you would let me know.

Upon telling me she wanted a divorce: I consulted a lawyer yesterday just a consult. I am not hiring one......I want a divorce.
Me: can we get together to talk about this? Her: No I cannot I am at a yard sale.
Subsequently: Of course I hired a lawyer. How else can you get a divorce?

One week after telling me she wanted a divorce she calls asking if I researched a question she had about selling the house. I apologized and said no. She then accused me of stalling the divorce.

Finally the reasons she discussed (sort of) for wanting the divorce:

You have had raging fights with me
Me: When. What were they? She cited 5 in 15 years, nothing broken, no abuse, etc. I remember 2. There were from 2009. I asked her about the others. She refused to talk about them except I baracaded myself in the living room of the apartment we used to live in (at least 5 years ago). How did I barracade myself I asked. Her:I guess you locked the door

Legitimately, she does tell me about the anxiety and social phobias I have. And to be honest, the last few months of our relationship I really wanted to do nothing much with her as I wasn't sure how nasty she'd be each day. But it is a legitimate concern. Not sure this, or any of this, is a good reason for divorce, but I take full responsibility for all of it. It will make me a better person in the future. Anyway I respond: I am on meds and in therapy. Her (and again textbook MLC from what I have read): Too little too late.

Other things she brought up during the "reasons for divorce discussion":
Remember the time I brought Chinese food home for dinner and you got upset that I didn't communicate it with you?
Me: Why was I upset? Was I making dinner or did I already bring dinner home? Her: I can't remember every detail.

Remember the time at my sister's house when we were in her basement trying to get on your nerves and you got upset with my step mother in law for finding it funny?
Me: (sarcastically): You mean I got upset for people trying to get on my nerves? Yes your step mom did not deserve it.

Remember telling me I was being borderline abusive for telling you to take benadryl to help with the itching from poison ivy? I cried for an hour over that.
Me: I told you that for telling me the night before that [I am paraphrasing as I cannot remember the odd way she said it] I deserved to be beaten as a child.

Remember when you yelled at me for complaining about my job and told me to quit?
me: Yes. You have a problem with your job daily anymore and I asked several times to not have discussions about problems at the dinner table. I also remember telling you many more times before that very kindly to quit your job and take some time to figure things out.

And tied for my favorite reason she told me she wanted a divorce (tied with the Chinese food story): You put us aside to work full time and go to college at night. i often wonder what I could have done had I had that opportunity. Oh, I guess you did support me while I quit work to go to dental hygiene school and dropped out.

[xyzcf]

Thanks for sharing. I think it is quite helpful to us, to see that they change their minds frequently and that the reasons for leaving don't make a great deal of sense.

After 32 years married the only explanation I got was "you are too intense and you talk too much".

Here are some previous threads that others have contributed to with the things they were told...these go back to 2019 but I believe there are others as well.

https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11601.0

https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10840.0

It is very difficult when our loved one changes their thoughts so quickly and makes up things that they seem to truly believe about us and our relationships.

[mcm64d]

Thanks for the links.

I am sorry you went through that x.

[Biscuit]

Yeah, all that nonsense... you were the worst husband ever, next minute - you'd make someone a great husband...

Just MLC noise. It's like a weird feedback loop, or trying to understand Quantum physics where something at a sub molecular level can exist in 2 places or at 2 states at the same time. Weirdly on a normal scale and out of a lab things are a bit more binary than that - you're either a bell end or you're not.

[xyzcf]

Thank you mcm64d.

What they say to us does hurt. Sometimes, we start to think, well it must be true what they are saying...but even so, is it serious enough to end a marriage over? Without any conversation or debate or willingness to change?

Because we start to doubt ourselves until we read several other stories and ours sounds so much like others....that we know this is not us.

Once, a very ,long time ago when I questioned that maybe he had his reasons for leaving, I was asked the following:

"xyzcf, what food do you absolutely despise?"

"liver and onions" I responded.

"So, would you eat liver and onions everyday for 32 years if your couldn't  stand them?"

I am not saying that we have to change for them, won't do any good anyway. But I still think that if a relationship is in trouble, there is the ability to discuss, perhaps get some therapy and listen to one another about what they see as a problem and try and find a solution that satisfies both partners rather than blowing up the whole world. But MLCers do not engage in reflecting on what is wrong in the marriage because it's not the marriage and it isn't us.

I might have been able to change "being too intense" but there is no way I was ever going to be able to stop "talking too much" 

[mcm64d]

X,

Please keep talking to me as much as you would like and be just as intense as you feel you would like to be. I am grateful to have met you and all the people here.

[xyzcf]

 

[mcm64d]

I forgot a few.....

No one understands why I am doing this and I am starting to get tired of it. Everyone understand how I feel but don't worry I am not telling them details. I told <Friend's name> I wasn't happy and she agreed saying why would you stay if you are not happy.

Me: Am I the only thing that is making you unhappy. Her: What do you mean?

On my suggestion to take the time her apartment lease is to think about next steps instead of immediate divorce, her reply: I don't want to put a time limit on that

So she wanted more time to think about things yet immediately filed for divorce?

AND......the I am so sorry for so many things while crying aand hugging me just to turn everything into my fault.....

[JohnnyBravo]

It's like... trying to understand Quantum physics where something at a sub molecular level can exist in 2 places or at 2 states at the same time. Weirdly on a normal scale and out of a lab things are a bit more binary than that - you're either a bell end or you're not.

Schrödinger's spouse?

[Biscuit]

Schrödinger's spouse? - LOL!

[Baxter1]

MC,

Thank you for writing these! For months I got, we need to separate. The D word was never brought up,
She waving it around now but I feel that’s because the A is putting some pressure on.
And the reasons I was a bad husband? I worked too much, wasn’t affectionate all the way to:I don’t know why, your such a great guy.

[mcm64d]

Yeah that great guy thing always comes back to bite the husband. How dare we!!!! (I am not trying to minimize your plight just trying to see the humor in these things)

The two I saw on other posts that stood out:

I never buy breaded chicken
The dog is too fat

And I thought mine had lost the plot……

[mcm64d]

A couple more that are coming to me.....

I am dead inside.
I cannot help my feelings and they are facts.
This is not about hate
I cannot open my heart strings to be able to be a spouse anymore

Wouldn't you hate a psycho timebomb?? And what the heck are heart strings and how does one open or close them??

[KayDee]

"You need to allow me to fly the nest" - I don't know why I only just remembered that. Too weird, but if regression is a thing - there it is folks

[Nas]

I usually skip these discussions because my literal narcissist husband was...well, a literal narcissist, who just happened to also exhibit signs of MLC.
But just to say how common the theme is, right after BD, he was over the top obsessed with a song called Bent to Fly, sang it constantly and even mentioned having some lyrics tattooed on himself. You can read the lyrics for yourself, it makes me cringe too hard:

https://youtu.be/x0ctImlIThY?si=Ia9-0Us7pxLuQ9m4

(Incidentally, right after he left, he initially lived for a few months in a tiny apartment on Fraternity Row on a college campus of which he was not in any way affiliated.)

[mcm64d]

"You need to allow me to fly the nest" - I don't know why I only just remembered that. Too weird, but if regression is a thing - there it is folks

KD-

Funny you say regression. I forgot about this until I read your post.

Pre BD she had wanted to have wings for dinner and asked if I could make them because she couldn't do them as well as I can. So I waited until she got home. When she came home, she asked where the wings were. I said I thought we could make them together that way she could learn, She let out this repulsive teenager sound that was like a combination of sigh and clearing the throat. Never heard that from her before that......

[Biscuit]

Mine pirouetted around the kitchen singing "Let me go, Let me go" from Frozen - which was quite a sight whilst I was trying to cook the family dinner....

 

[mcm64d]

Biscuit…. You win the prize!!! Not sure what that is but OMG!!!!!

[Biscuit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0MK7qz13bU

"Let me go, Let me go, I can't hold it back anymore" - It was quite a good rendition actually and delivered with real venom.

[UrsaMajor]

Mine pirouetted around the kitchen singing "Let me go, Let me go" from Frozen - which was quite a sight whilst I was trying to cook the family dinner....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0MK7qz13bU

"Let me go, Let me go, I can't hold it back anymore" - It was quite a good rendition actually and delivered with real venom.

[FaithWalker]

Mine pirouetted around the kitchen singing "Let me go, Let me go" from Frozen - which was quite a sight whilst I was trying to cook the family dinner....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0MK7qz13bU

"Let me go, Let me go, I can't hold it back anymore" - It was quite a good rendition actually and delivered with real venom.

I second that.  I was just reading that thinking "how bizarre"

That is a good example of a teenage stage MLCer if I ever saw one.

[mcm64d]

I forgot a good one that made me chuckle today. Not something said, but....

She was so mad one day shortly before BD and I couldn't understand why, but apparently it was because I stopped doing all the chores around the house that she abandoned (I saw she did this but I figured it was part of what was going on that made her nasty...didn't know MLC then).

Anyway she's running the vacuum and for some unknown reason she stopped and aggressively gave the vacuum the double middle finger. I think she did the buck tooth thing during it as well. I needed a good laugh today, but at the time I was really wondering WTH?

[FaithWalker]

That gave me a chuckle mcm64d 

[mcm64d]

A couple of more recent ones surrounding trying to get her to sign the sales agreement on the house after she made the buyers wait almost two weeks for inexplicable reasons if you follow logic....

a week before the mess below.....her: I need to get this settlement date moved forward, i cannot afford to pay half the mortgage until the end of February me: I havent asked to to pay anything for four months. Frankly don't want to deal with you. Her: ok I will sign the sales agreement tonight

A couple of ours later she has to wait until the signed property settlement agreement they drafted and sent is signed

A week later (all in the same day)
My realtor set a 3PM deadline before having to reach out to the buyers realtor and let them know that my wife refuses to sign the sales agreement. The buyers realtor reached out to mine and told her that they will have no other alternative now but to pass on buying our house. My wife's response: I want to make sure you know I have had my end set since November 20th (me thinking: then why not sign the sales agreement already?) I would like to wait until 3 like we originally agreed My response: You have all the time in the world as far as I am concerned but apparently the buyers aren't on your timeline.....

her: my lawyers (who drafted the property settlement agreement) need 1-3 days to grant and answer it before I can sign the sales agreement I ask my lawyer what that means "grant and answer"- he has no idea what that is supposed to mean.

my realtor asks what is that supposed to mean and at this rate she suggests pulling the house off market and letting the buyers know not to put their house on sale if they'd like to buy mine (as an offer on their house over that weekend would be really awkward). my wife:This is where we are at. I am going to declare Asking for one more week from the potential buyers thank goodness she made a declaration!!!!

I ask her in response: Where are we at??? her unfortunately I was told I would have a solid review by then. I cannot give anymore information other than this. There is nothing I can state.

My realtors response: trying to hold this sale together for you both, can you please get your lawyers to work on this, you are paying them to serve you.

My wife: They have not had the doc for 7 days. They just got it last evening (btw my lawyer dropped it off a day or two before that personally and has the receipt). I cannot give any other info other than 1-3 business days . in one text it went from 7 days to 1-3?? makes perfect sense.

so to recap....it went from not needing to have this property settlement agreement signed, to needing it signed, [to needing 1-3 days to grant and answer, to needing it signed and in possession of her lawyer for 7 days, to needing 1-3 business days to review the document THEY DRAFTED] with the section in brackets occurring on the same day within 3 hours.

[FaithWalker]

Oy vey!

Sorry you have to deal with this waffling.

[mcm64d]

I think it was in the same day my realtor called me and said in 22 years of selling houses and dealing with divorce, she has never had to deal with someone like my stbxw. The more people get to see it, the better I feel about myself.

[lost88]

I thought I would share part of my daily journaling as I read this post and laughed a little.

My specific examples is not what my wife has said but how her actions have changed greatly within the past two weeks. Granted, I’m not that far along since BD but the last two weeks, the rate of change of her relationship towards me, has been as aggressive as a brushfire.

Last week was my dad‘s birthday, and I had him over the house for a while, and my wife returned from work and stopping at the store. She walked in with fresh, blueberries, claiming how great they were and were very large and sweet. She walked right to my dad and offered him some and I was sitting right next to him, and there was no gesture for me.

After we opened our presents as a family Christmas morning, she offered to make the kids breakfast and anything they wanted. Sandwiches, eggs bacon pancakes she pulled out the griddle and a couple other kitchen items she rarely uses. I wasn’t offered anything and ended up cooking my own breakfast after she had finished. That’s never happened ever in our relationship regardless of who is there they all get offered something to eat.

The commute down and back to the in-laws was rather quiet. I’ve been sneezing a lot more lately and sneeze several times in the past couple of weeks and not once have a gotten a god bless you.
This is something she would always do in fact, for even strangers that were nearby

I pick myself up a brand, new jacket and a cool pair of shoes to wear for Christmas Eve thinking that she would notice and have to make a comment. It went unnoticed and was never mentioned, which is shocking to me, but it just shows how selfish and self-centered, her mind has become.

And last, but not least, the daily living has changed greatly. She will always make sure she’s on a separate floor of the house, unless she’s boarded in her room with a door closed. She takes every precaution to avoid me as quickly as she can. If I’m coming down the stairs and she plans on going up, she will stay in the kitchen to determine which way I’m going at the bottom of the stairs so she can go the other way and avoid us crossing paths. Escaping avoid at it’s finest

The distance and cold, I’m referring to an examples above have all increased greatly in the past 10 to 12 days. Nothing has changed with our relationship to make it more negative but obviously she’s going further along in her journey and becoming more secluded and escaping my presence. The lack of empathy has never been a part of her personality, and I can tell which cycle she’s in when I see her face and I look at those eyes. They’re usually or used to be vibrant, full of color and most of the time, at least, in my presence, they’re dark Hollow and almost look like sharks eyes .

I’m grateful and thankful for everyone here and how everyone can get strength from sharing their stories together. I’m especially grateful for those who have been through it, and choose to be a part of the community and giving back to help others like myself. I must admit, I’ve experience plenty of physical pain in my life, but the emotional pain and daily grind of a situation, like this is beyond my wildest imagination, I look forward to being in the rearview mirror and I’m completely uncertain how quickly that will occur. Obviously, I can make my own decision whether I would like to wait it out or accelerate things along for my life. Time will tell …..

[mcm64d]

I am sorry you are going through this Lost. Not sure whether or not I am luckier that she left right away but rest assured (you know what I mean) the change of behavior to cold and calculating is a very common theme for all of us. Doesn't make it any better, but could be seen as a relief to the self, the psyche.

[lost88]

Tks MCM - no one ever joins this club for a good time !!!!
Yeah, that’s the unfortunate thing is everyone’s advice and the way this progresses has been exactly spot on. It’s such a helpless position to be in, especially when you have a conversation and they just lie directly to your face. This is the biggest thing that I haven’t seen many people talk about are those dark shark eyes. It’s almost like they’re possessed. I can always tell the Moochies based upon the eyes and the pupils. I believe she’s getting ready for bomb2 which is likely moving out … shall see

[mcm64d]

Lost I have a tiny but of experience with changes in my MLCer. The night she left me I told her that I have not been able to talk to her lately (and subsequently she told me that she couldn't talk to me about the issues leading to this).

She was standing over me when I said that and her posture immediately changed as did her demeanor. She went out on the deck to sit. When I went out to see what was going on, she was blinking a lot. The look in her eyes and face was like someone was "not there". She ensued to pick a fight with me and tried to get me to agree that "we" were not happy. I wouldn't and she left, and the rest......well here I am.

She was very considerate in moving out, taking only what we would agree upon and if anything was taken that would upset me she would return it. And she was meticulous in how the house looked after taking things for her move. She made sure that the house still had a feel of home for me.

We met a few times after that and it was very civil. in fact, I gave her a hug that she let out this lovely "moan" over like she was so enjoying it. I actually thought this situation was temporary.

But as tiome went by, she went from having love and missing me to loving me as a friend to ilybinilwy to i don't love you to never missing me but only the cat and dinners to meeting up for her to unlease a monstering session (i didn't know what monstering was at the time) I had never seen from her before to telling me after that she could not be alone with me withpoout someone in the driveway....

The only reason I am recapping this is to let you know that changes occur all thought this in my case in her behavior. Then there would be moments where she seemed to genuinely care, like for instance my pharmacy made a mistake in medication claiming to have given me a 90 days supply. When she asked me what was wrong during a call, I explained that and she was so empathetic. Very confusing.

Hoping this is helpful in some fashion and though I am certainly no expert, just try to realize this is not about you and try to be as "you" as you can be through this.

Happy New Year friend.

[Ichoosefaith]

And last, but not least, the daily living has changed greatly. She will always make sure she’s on a separate floor of the house, unless she’s boarded in her room with a door closed. She takes every precaution to avoid me as quickly as she can. If I’m coming down the stairs and she plans on going up, she will stay in the kitchen to determine which way I’m going at the bottom of the stairs so she can go the other way and avoid us crossing paths. Escaping avoid at it’s finest

The lack of empathy has never been a part of her personality, and I can tell which cycle she’s in when I see her face and I look at those eyes. They’re usually or used to be vibrant, full of color and most of the time, at least, in my presence, they’re dark Hollow and almost look like sharks eyes .

Both of these hit so close to home with me. My w moved out December 6th. But while she was living here she stayed in the room 24/7 avoiding me. I even brought it up that she didn’t come out at all on our d birthday and she replied”I stay in there to stay away from you”. Like avoiding me was more important than being there for our child. And I don’t get it. She can’t face me. Even a month living apart I haven’t seen her once. When we exchange kids she like hides so I can’t see her.

The second paragraph about the eyes. I have been saying this for a while and people don’t understand. I spent two decades with her and I don’t recognize her when I look at her eyes. Same thing she used to be so full of light and now they are black and cold and void of humanity. And it baffles me that no one else sees it.

I miss her so much but the person I love isn’t even there. Like I don’t know if that woman is still in there under it all or if she’s gone forever.   Our D is almost finalized and I am so lost. Like a bag in the wind. I spent my whole adult life being hers and planning and working toward a life together , I don’t know how to exist without that ya know.

Anyway im glad to see it’s not just me. That other people see it in their spouse eyes. It’s like looking at someone else entirely.

[amazinglove]

I have dead, shark eyes too! What IS that about?

[lost88]

Like everything w MLC it cycles - but the eyes and that hallow look. It’s very creepy like she’s possessed, empty, emotionless … Im not seeing them as often but I’m not seeing her as often. It’s the strangest and most painful thing a person can go thru …
She’s gone , lost, and hasn’t a clue what to do. It makes me sad that So many of us are in this situation … the escape and avoid has lessened a bit lately but who knows what tomorrow brings.
No one else see’s the shark eyes tho … it seems that’s for the person closest to them who they know they are hurting and doing wrong …like part of them shut down and go dead .. I’d love to get it on film ..No you’re not alone .. it’s day by day, step by step, and decision by decision.

[xyzcf]

Many here have seen  those eyes. Pictures can be quite telling. Even now, in pictures of our family together, my daughter and my eyes are bright and sparkling, his are "lifeless".

"Interpreting Depressed Eyes: The Window to the Soul
Depressed eyes can communicate a lot about an individual's mental health. It's crucial to remember, however, that these signs alone cannot confirm a diagnosis of depression. They can only hint at the possibility, and it's important to consider them alongside other symptoms.

Conveying Emotional Pain
Eyes have long been considered the "windows to the soul," reflecting an individual's innermost emotions. Depressed eyes may represent the emotional pain that the person is experiencing, showing a glimpse of the inner turmoil that they may not be expressing verbally."

https://www.grouporttherapy.com/blog/depressed-eyes

There is a lot of research about body language and what can be learned about someone. Another picture from our daughter's wedding, the 4 of us, three of us holding one another and smiling with delight...he is standing away from us, one hand over the other in front of his body, expressionless.

These are the physical manifestations that we see in MLC. They are real and can indicate depression.

There is a facebook site of people who have MLC spouses. I have seen others post pictures of their spouse in better times and now, and the thing most people are aware of are the eyes.

[FaithWalker]

I also saw this change with my MLCer.  And looking at him in photos after the D when I sometimes got a glimpse.

The most shocking for me was seeing my S23 (S15 at the time of BD).  I was looking at his school photos and there was a shocking difference to his two high school photos taken just 1 year apart.  I could see the pain in his eyes in the post BD photo.  He truly, truly believed that MLCer was divorcing both of us, and not just me.  (My S23 was MLCer's step-son but had been in his life since he was 9 months old and became his SD when he was 18 months old.)

[mcm64d]

I wish now I could see my xw's eyes. That would be very interesting.

Ichoose......you may have given me some insight on my xw stating, after seeing each other a handful of times after BD, that she couldn't be with me alone anymore without someone in the driveway. I couldn't figure that out at the time, but maybe that was her way of staying on her own room or floor.....I have never done anything to warrant such a statement.