[freefall2flight]

@treasur,

I booked the holiday a couple of weeks ago after spending the weekend at one of my oldest friends. He knows about the situation and invited me to get me out the house.

As much as I enjoyed being busy with two good friends it spun me out a bit as they both know my W as long as I have and it made me sad for some reason that my W doesn't exist liket they knew either at the moment. My two friends were innocently talking about family trips and inadvertently asked me my plans with the girls and I just broke down.

The next morning I thought about how we always took the girls on holiday when my parents are away as they are our childcare over the summer.

Since we have always done this and I was also sad and angry that they would miss out, especially since D6 has talked about all the trips her friends have taken with their family. The situation does impact them but should not impact their happy memories so I wanted to at least have a plan in place, something to look forward too.

My dilemma is that I know this will force my W hand somewhat to change the status quo from the limbo we are currently living in. I do think it wishful thinking that we will all go away together. I really want to protect my little girls. They are only small and they deserve better.

The holiday is domestic and in July.  I guess the possibilities are that she objects to me taking them, decides not to come or joins us.

Main thing is i think the girls need a holiday as that is what we would usually do howe er the ckncewuences of two of thr three possiblities scare me.

@standing

Thank you for your words of encouragement, they are needed. My parents struggle to see why I would want to stand and considering they are pro marriage they incinuate often I should walk. This is not helpful and I have tried to tell them this without stomping over their feelings too

I feel truly sad today. Maybe a comedown from the enjoyable day yesterday and the 60 minute family window we had in the evening. Maybe it's as I am back working in a city today when my wife and I spent many happy times in our early years passing our old haunts.

My heart does hurt today and can't help feeling a bit defeated by the loneliness that overwhelms me sometimes. I still find myself in disbelief of how your best friend can just turn their back completely. Don't get me wrong I am very grateful that the W remains on the property but I struggle to think we are both isolated and for what reason.

Sorry, I feel guilty for bringing the pity party today, espcially when many of you on these boards have it much worse.

Last straw today I have cried on my burrito and it is soggy.

Tomorrow will be better! Maybe even later today!

[freefall2flight]

@reinventing

Yes, all exercise is actually helping and I have managed to loose around 10kg so far. I am trying to revisit some old activities too as well as some new ones. However running does allow me to switch off most of the time which I like.

[xyzcf]

I feel truly sad today. Maybe a comedown from the enjoyable day yesterday and the 60 minute family window we had in the evening. Maybe it's as I am back working in a city today when my wife and I spent many happy times in our early years passing our old haunts.

My heart does hurt today and can't help feeling a bit defeated by the loneliness that overwhelms me sometimes. I still find myself in disbelief of how your best friend can just turn their back completely.

No need to apologize for feeling sad and lonely. We have all been in those shoes and HS is a safe place for you to express your feelings.

Your parents and indeed other friends and family have a hard time understanding why you stay with your wife, why you don't move on and find someone..."you deserve better" you will be told.......

Eventually I gave up trying to explain and eventually people stopped asking me.

The holiday that you have booked for July is something that I do as well as another good friend of mine who is a HS member.  It is a matter of how we decide to treat the MLCer...RCR talks in her articles about unconditional and agape love and I agree with showing the MLCer kindness, empathy and compassion...and one of the ways I do that is to get out of his way (as Standing wrote so well)......however, he is included and welcomed in family times. So we do go away together with our daughter and he spends Christmas with us and times when she visits here.

It was not always easy for me but the benefits outweigh my own discomfort and I have healed adequately that his presence doesn't shake me.

This was my choice for my family.

Other couples who separate or divorce and have children do find a way to have some grace in this...my brother and his wife divorced and bought houses on the same street so the kids could go back and forth between parents  and didn't have to change schools...it wasn't easy for the parents to do this but they considered what was best for their kids.

Your wife may or may not decide to go. That is up to her. You have made it possible that she has the option to go. You are making plans for you and the children to have a summer holiday..because that is important to how you live your life, important for the children to have these childhood memories.

The hard part is seeing "happy" families and couples together and not having that for ourselves.

Exercise certainly helps.

I hated when I would feel really good and think, ok, I've got this and then come crashing down...and sometimes, when I would find out things, my heart would feel as though it was breaking .......all those songs about heartbreak are true I discovered....  ....it takes a. great deal of time to recover from this, these are deep deep wounds and so don't be too hard on yourself...the hardest thing of all is to let go and not feel like we have the "right" to some kind of explanation or discussion...unfortunately they are not capable of giving us one.

[Reinventing]

I hated when I would feel really good and think, ok, I've got this and then come crashing down...and sometimes, when I would find out things, my heart would feel as though it was breaking .......all those songs about heartbreak are true I discovered.... 

Yes, that rollercoaster of emotions was highly frustrating for me. And that dreaded TIME.

[freefall2flight]

I hated when I would feel really good and think, ok, I've got this and then come crashing down...and sometimes, when I would find out things, my heart would feel as though it was breaking .......all those songs about heartbreak are true I discovered....  ....it takes a. great deal of time to recover from this, these are deep deep wounds and so don't be too hard on yourself...the hardest thing of all is to let go and not feel like we have the "right" to some kind of explanation or discussion...unfortunately they are not capable of giving us one.

This really resonates.  I thought I had started to build back up over that last 3/4 weeks or so however for some reason I have been so despairing since the weekend.  I thought I had cried all my tears but they are back with a vengeance.  At least least I keep it together in front of my girls and my W.

I have started up Kenda's Thrive course again so hopefully that will help.  I think my despair comes from thinking about my children's future.  It is silly really as I know I have the love, motivation and agency to do whatever I possibly can to give them all that I can give them, however it still breaks my heart how my W is with them.  Her decision making does not seem to factor them in.  I know we can't expect them to think in this way but I am finding it hard to adjust to that at the moment.  Especially since she is becoming what she feared in the Mum that abandoned her and her brother, who then years later abandoned her youngest sister and finally abandoned my wife just as D6 was born.  Can they not see the chaos they are recycling (I know they cannot but it is wreaking my heart).

At the moment W is all over the place.  The last 2 days I have worked in the office instead of at home and she is late every morning, forgetting things the girls need etc.  This morning I got up early and did my usual morning routine with the girls and filled the gaps in the bits my wife didn't do.  I have no problem with this, as you all have said, don't have any expectations.  The girls and I all had a fun morning, no rush or stress (my wife's rushing seems to put the girls on edge and then she at times gets sharp with the girls) and they were all ready early in time to watch a few minutes of TV (that's my deal wit them - all your chores done and ready for school and you can relax.  My wife was still late, even though she had to do nothing for the girls and got up late.  This is where the combo of ADHD and MLC complicates matters even more I feel.  Both issues she is doing nothing to address.

Last night she was late home and so didn't make dinner for the girls.  Luckily even though I was returning from the office, I got home before them to cook something quickly.  She was very distant during dinner (Tuesday is a day we agreed to always do family dinner) and eagerly rushed away suggesting she needed to get the girls bed clothes ready.  Its a shame as along with family dinner we also have games for the girls on the Tuesday too and this did get cut short.  However my wife for those 15 minutes did seem to enjoy herself and get involved with the girls.

Last night I did broach about the holiday I had booked with my W after the girls went bed. I timed it just before I went out GAL for the evening as I wanted to give her space to digest.  I announced in a 'sky is blue fashion' that I had booked a holiday for the period whilst my parents are away in July this year (my Mum looks after the girls in the summer at times whilst we are at work).  I said I had booked a 3 bedroom accommodation as I wanted to give her the choice to come with us.  She became very fidgety, rubbing her face and hair. and said 'okkkkk'  I then added I thought it was important for the girls to have a holiday to look forward too, especially since D6 had been taking with her friends about their plans and had been questioning what we were doing.  I concluded by saying I think the girls need a holiday and then said 'heck' I need a holiday too and I am sure you do too (to the W).  At this point she "yes butted" me to which I did interrupt her to say you don't need to decide now and that you have time to go away and think about the choice you want to make.  I then said by and left for my activity.

I chose last night as I have found out her 'original' best friend is coming over tonight (the sensible one that my W initially avoiding talking too as apparently she would not understand and is too straight laced!  I thought it may have been worth planting the seed yesterday knowing my wife has the opportunity to raise this with her friend who is very similar to I in that she is very methodical and logical (although she is loyal to my wife).

I just hope that my wife does not make rash decisions based on her inability to stand being around me most of the time.  The best times are when we are together having fun as a family e.g watching family TV, doing an activity or playing games.  Any other time including dinner she is very awkward.  I am very comfortable talking with the girls about their day, what they learned, what they enjoyed, what they may do the next day, what they are looking forward to at the weekend.  This is a value I believe in greatly, talking to one another at dinner time was a big part of my upbringing.  My wife struggles with this and does not really get involved in the conversation.  if i stay quiet to give her the opportunity to start conversation with the girls she generally stays silent. She is either in her head or on her phone.  If she decides not to go it is going to greatly increase the urgency for her to do something (anything at all as she is currently in wallowing limbo paralysis most of the time apart from her high energy bursts for nights out) to get out what she deems to be the worst life ever which will in turn impact the girls.

The limbo is tricky.  As much as I am gald she is still close by like i previously mentioned, it does seem to cause me huge anxiety.

On a positive not, I went for a run this morning as I was really struggling with my emotions and that has somewhat helped. I have also had a good cry writing this post.  Thank you all for your support.

P.S sorry if I have repeated or ranted.  I still don't feel myself at the moment but I am sure I will get there

[Treasur]

The limbo is tricky. 

Yes, it is. I can’t overemphasise how remarkably well you are doing, given where you are right now. You probably can’t see that quite so clearly, but those of us who have been around for a little while can see it. Is it perfect? Or easy? Or how you want things to be? No. But every small bit of calm and normality and contentment that you inject into your life and your kids’ life is like anti-limbo effects medicine....and you are doing tremendously well.

As much as I am gald she is still close by like i previously mentioned, it does seem to cause me huge anxiety.

That’s very normal for a far from normal situation when our nervous system tends to flip between waiting for the next metaphorical hand grenade or trying to make something firm in the midst of uncertainty. It will get easier with time, my friend. Either bc events (or your own choices) will create more pockets of solid ground instead of limbo or bc you will find ways to live well around the limbo. Or a bit of both. I suspect, reading your post - and I can’t tell you how common and normal this is for we LBS in the early days - some of the anxiety is heightened bc you are trying to predict and compensate for your wife’s current behaviour. Even maybe watching it a little too closely like a bug under a microscope to look for ‘signs’, either good or not so good from your POV. With time, and a little bit of conscious effort, as you emotionally detach more from your expectations and her behaviour, this gets easier bc your lens focuses more on other things. Like ‘family dinner’, or games with your kids, or even the holiday, you will find your own way to approach these things which does not feel contingent on her actions or involvement....and that tends to chip away at that feeling of limbo. It also tends to build our confidence that, whatever happens and even if life turns out a little different than we planned, you and your girls can be ok. Plus tbh it starts to show your wife in very practical ways, without you saying a thing, that there may be some effects from her choices that don’t seem quite so shiny, that if she chooses to leave the family, there will be plenty of ways in which the family will build a good future life that simply will not include her. Not in a punishing way from your end, just bc that is how life tends to work as an adult when we choose a different path for ourselves....we tend not to be able to have our cake and eat it for very long 

Plan for your holiday on the silent assumption that your wife won’t go. Why? Bc, if she follows the MLC playbook, there might be a lot of flip flopping from her between now and then. Easier to plan for what is not ideal from your POV and be hopefully pleasantly surprised if she joins you and is pleasant to be on holiday with  Tbh I would not even mention it again to her unless she raises it with you.....just go about your life and start looking forward to the fun that you and your girls will have.

[MadLuv]

I don’t have much to add, but that for me what finally helped with the anxiety of it all was to not look back or forward. Just dealing with the now. If you just try and stay in the now it does help with some of that anxiety of the situation and the uncertainty and the craziness of it all. Your doing so well and no matter how you feel at any given moment just know that it will continue to get better for you and your emotions in time.

[xyzcf]

On a positive not, I went for a run this morning as I was really struggling with my emotions and that has somewhat helped. I have also had a good cry writing this post.  Thank you all for your support.

P.S sorry if I have repeated or ranted.  I still don't feel myself at the moment but I am sure I will get there

You don't have to worry about repeating or ranting. This is a safe place to say how you are feeling and you need not "pretend" at all. I am fortunate to have HS members who live in my city and we used to get together frequently which was very helpful.

Crying is our body's way of dealing with grief. I wold be more concerned if you could not cry.

The running brought me back to something that I discovered, because I could not seem to turn off my thoughts about him and what had happened, it was important to have a "break" where my mind could be empty....I discovered golf..because when I'd walk up to hit the ball, my focus was only on that moment...as madluv said...staying in the present. Recognizing those moments that are "positive" such as how you felt after running allows you to identify where your nervous system is at...you stated something that shows that you are very aware:

I still don't feel myself at the moment but I am sure I will get there

I "lost" the person I was comfortable with, xyzcf disappeared and for a long time I did not recognize her if that makes sense..eventually, she did emerge again..different, however recognizable once more....not feeling "myself" was quite disturbing.

I think my despair comes from thinking about my children's future.  It is silly really as I know I have the love, motivation and agency to do whatever I possibly can to give them all that I can give them, however it still breaks my heart how my W is with them. 

On top of your own loss of a partner and lover, best friend you are dealing with how this will affect your children, and rightly so....we do not want anything to hurt them, and the lack of love from a parent is damaging. The LBSer is in the middle...trying to deal with their own feelings of grief and sadness, losing the "family" that once was as well as trying to help the little ones...it is exhausting and our fears for them add to our distress.

I will never understand why my husband would prefer the life that he is living to the family and love that we had together. For me, this small family of three was worth fighting for, I would protect it from any harm.......he totally turned his back, not only on me, but on our precious daughter. This is true for MLCers, you will read it over and over again...and there is nothing that you can do.

It is good that you made plans for July and good that you told her. She may vacillate back and forth, may even tell you she will come and back out at the last minute...be prepared for that.

There is a wealth of information here and the many stories will give you some idea what to expect as well as confirm to you that this crisis is real and similar in many cases. Every family and every situation is different. There really isn't a right or wrong way to go through this because actually, in spite of what we think, nothing that we do matters to them and their journey.

Follow you intuition, continue to do what is right for you and your family and right for the person that you are.

[zartheit]

Just dropping by to say that your resilience in the immediate aftermath of having your world detonated is incredibly impressive to me. It may not feel like you're strong now but sometime soon I trust you will. My own situation had me completely melted, just a skin balloon containing the liquefied ingredients of a human being, and I didn't turn a corner until after she moved out.

In an attempt to build trust in my belief that you'll regain that inner strength soon enough, I can share that I remember feeling completely unknown to myself. I had no clue who I was, what I was doing, what I wanted. I just knew that I was hurting and frightened. I was frightened beyond comprehension. I had many people tell me that it would all come with time, but I genuinely did not believe them. I'm happy to say that they were correct. When I "found" myself the first time it was anti-climactic. It felt like playing peekaboo with a baby. I simply opened my eyes. I've had a number of more "momentous" discoveries since, but I like to keep in mind that it need not be so grand.

Seriously, your whole approach has me nodding my head. You are keeping it together phenomenally well. From my perspective, whatever you're doing is setting you up quite nicely.

[xyzcf]

zartheit stated:

In an attempt to build trust in my belief that you'll regain that inner strength soon enough, I can share that I remember feeling completely unknown to myself. I had no clue who I was, what I was doing, what I wanted. I just knew that I was hurting and frightened. I was frightened beyond comprehension.

Very well said. Thanks for sharing how deeply you were affected.

Recently I had friends visit who I have known for over 40 years. They also knew us as a couple. My friend made a statement that I found quite shocking. I had visited them after BD, she said to me "you were terrified of him".

35 years together with my best friend and she was right...because we don't know what they might do next, because it hurts so deeply and although I wasn't physically terrified of him, I certainly was terrified but what he was doing and how that affected me.

Honestly, I was a pretty normal individual before this happened, good childhood, no major trauma, happy marriage....I even experienced two episodes of dissociation over the years so don't negate how severe this can affect us.

The other side is though that we do come through it...we are actually amazingly resilient.