[Curiosity]

KellBell, these are some really great insights. Of course, anything that anyone posts here is valuable if it helps them process. Certainly, I processed a lot and I cycled rapidly between overanalyzing W, then feeling like I had stumbled onto true detachment, and back again. I’m not sure that was valuable for anyone other than me, but it helped me work through my stages of grief and into a much happier, healthier, more self reliant place. But this post of yours - those are the kind of thoughts that should almost be required reading for an LBS. Recognizing that MLC is depression - that is hugely important. Similarly, recognizing your own boundaries, and owning your right to not be friends with your xh - it’s absolutely essential to respect your own feelings that way. It doesn’t matter if he wasn’t a monster, it doesn’t matter what he wants. What’s important is what moves you forward on your path, whether that means there can be a friendship now, or in 5 years, or never.

[KellBell]

journaling-

Xh left this afternoon. A couple of takeaways. Friday night - the plan was to pick up our D10 and meet the other two Ds for dinner. (Oldest twin D still won't see him or make time with him.) He called at 4:20 and asked if he could come over and get D10. I told him we just got home, but that I would quickly get her stuff ready for the overnight they had planned. 5 minutes later he was at the house. He sat down, small talk. D10 was ready and he kept talking. I told him he better get going- that he was going to be late. He pulled out his phone and texted other kids that he was going to be late and to go ahead and order appetizers. He stayed and chatted some more. Before leaving he looked at me and said he felt like crying and gave me a hug. Then I walked them to the door and he gave me another hug. Didn't say anything.

In that moment, I could see how lost he was. He's hurting and lost and broken- and it's taking it's toll.

I saw him again today and he stayed and talked a few hours before heading home. The conversation was light and easy, but every so often his depressive talk would creep in. He was yawning and I asked if he wanted an ice coffee or energy drink before he heads back. He responded with "I'm exhausted. I yawn all the time. D10 and I slept for 10 hours last night and I still feel wiped." I asked if he was having problems sleeping or if he has looked into that. He said "I don't know." sighs then says "Maybe I'll just fall sleep while driving and roll into a ditch." D10 was within earshot. And I had had enough. Before he left, I pulled him aside and asked to him please not talk that way. That he has family that cares about him. And that it's not healthy for D10 to hear things like that." He agreed.

In all, it was strange visit. For the most part it was so comfortable and easy. But I was acutely aware of a few things.

First, he complains...alot. About the weather, traveling, employees, schedules, etc. 90% of today's conversation was him complaining. Such a drastic change from Thursday or even Friday. I think he was starting to feel overwhelmed with it all and the darkness creeped in.

Secondly, he's hiding and running. He said as much. He said he hates being around people. He like being alone. Everything and everyone stresses him out and living alone away from everyone (family and friends) gives him peace.

Next, I could visibly see how torn he is. That he's starting to see what he's missing here in regards to his kids. Lots of hugs and I love yous. He became quiet as things were wrapping up and kept finding things to postpone his leaving. And what's so hard about that is that he told his kids he doesn't ever see himself moving back. So he's still actively choosing to be away from them. And actions speak louder than words.

Lastly, I realized I don't want this version of him. He really is a downer and sad. He complains and wallows. It's not healthy for him to feel that way...but I have to think of my children. And this depressive version of him is not good for them. They need someone stable and mentally ok. He's not there. It's hard to watch. It's hard not to fix or even help. But like an alcoholic or addict- he needs to realize he has a problem and seek help on his own terms.

Anyway- he's scheduled to come back for D10's softball tournament in June. I hope he does, but I'm not putting pressure on him to give more than he can right now. I'm upset and disappointed he's not present more, but after this weekend I can see a little better what he's going through. And I'll give him a little latitude.

It was nice to be able to talk to him. Visit and have him in my presence without him thinking I was the devil incarnate. It was nice seeing him smile. I guess for now these little things are enough.

Although I am guessing he will go dark for a few weeks now. I'm sure this was an exhausting weekend for him. Lots to process. I sure hate depression and MLC

[WHY]

I think you’re doing great.  An inspiration to us all.  Hang in there Kell. 

[MadLuv]

He sounds pretty typical. Complaining about it everyone , isolating and self destructive talk. Yet, cycling and missing family. Feel I lived the last 2 years of that. I hope he can refrain from that talk around your kids. You’re right, they do not need to hear that. My XH would make comments on boarding flights, hopefully it will crash. It progressively got worse to ….maybe I will just bleed out etc. Horrific I’m glad you let him know that was not acceptable around D10

I agree with you. That negativity and being around the whoa is me is very hard . Sounds like you have a good handle on it. Carry on !!!

[KellBell]

I found these links while researching depression. Interesting to hear first person POV and how depression feels and why they act the way they do.

There are two articles, each has three parts.

Why Depressed Men Leave  https://www.storiedmind.com/self-esteem/why-depressed-men-leave-1/

and The Longing to Leave   https://www.storiedmind.com/anger/the-longing-to-leave-1/

links to the other parts are at the bottom of the article. Interesting reads for information. Sometimes I search for explanations when the WTF!? gets to be too much. I usually just end feeling sad after reading them, but it helps reset the notion that this all them. And nothing to do with me. Anyway - thought I would share.

[beyondblessed]

Kell....it has absolutely nothing to do with you.  You, like the rest of us here, are just collateral damage.  Still, recognizing that fact doesn't make the fallout any easier or less painful.  It hurts so much because WE see what's going on, but WE can't fix THEM.  It's frustrating and heartbreaking at the same time.  That's why it is always suggested to live like they aren't coming back.  Very, very few will ever have the courage and inner strength to do the work that needs to be done to right all the wrongs they've been compulsed to do.

[WHY]

It's hard to understand that if you showed these articles to a MLCer, that they wont click and at least ask themselves, "is this maybe whats going on?".  I mean, they hit every checkbox.  It's beyond coincidence.  How come they have to deny it?

[Thunder]

WHY I've said this before, my XH has a very high IQ.

When I read an article on MLC that fit him like a glove.  Surely he should be able to see this was exactly what was going on.  I know it is said not to show them articles on a midlife crisis, or even bring it up to them, but I honestly thought he had to see it.  He's not stupid.

You know what?  He read it and got very irritated and said..."That does not fit me at all, you are just not understanding."

I was floored!

Never again did I bring up MLC again.  They won't relate to any of it, they just think we are in denial.

I would not recommend it to anyone.  Keep it to yourself and share your thoughts here where people understand.

[KellBell]

why- I think when someone is struggling to make sense of things and not feeling like themselves and questioning their lives (which has to be completely overwhelming)...the last place they want to look for fault or blame is inwards. At the point of BD, in their minds, they have tried every other option, considered every other source of unhappiness and already placed blame. So much easier to leave than to look at themselves. That's why they have to do it their way and figure it out on their own terms and in their own time. After BD, you are the enemy and would you ever take advice or criticism from the enemy? nope

beyond- I'm not sure I agree. The gaslighting was insane for me. I was questioning and doubting my last 25 years. Questioning every significant moment, memory and decision. How could I not see? Maybe I was a terrible wife? How am I not loveable? I'm a very pragmatic person and by researching depression and MLC and reading all I can- it has helped my brain make messy sense of this chaos. I realize it's not my fault. My xh has told me it's not about me. And so I have taken myself out of the equation. The not knowing, not understanding and lack of explanation is what I feel slows the processing from taking place. As humans we want to know why, how, what , where...very few people I know just accept consequences blindly. So that's why I research. When I have a particularly low day (which are few and far between these days) I need that confirmation that it is his problem. It sucks, but it's his issue and his choice on how to recover. And realizing that is huge step in the 'moving on' process. It also helps me detach. Why waste my time and energy on something I can't help, fix or influence? I guess everyone has their coping mechanisms. But for being less than a year out- I think it's working pretty well for me.


I journal alot in the hopes that other lost LBSs read something that may help or gives comfort. Every situation is different, yet the same. Just trying to share what I've gleaned from my experience.

[KellBell]

journaling-

My oldest D (one of the twins) works for the family business. They had a conference to attend this week. D is accomplished and amazing and was receiving compliments and being commended by others at the conference. Her dad stepped in and would diminish those in a weird way. Like he was rationalizing her success. She called me from the airport to decompress a bit. And I just feel sad. Like how low can your self esteem be that you have to take away the attention your daughter is receiving? He should have been beaming with pride, extolling his own words of praise - instead he took that away from her. I'm not sure if it was just due to insensitivity, selfishness or being passive aggressive since she is the one daughter who won't talk to him. Either way, it makes me sad. Sad for her...to be treated like that in public by your dad. And for him...to be in such a state that he felt that was acceptable. Regardless, it was inexcusable and just adding to the pile of sh*t he'll have to someday face if he wants a relationship with her.