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Author Topic: My Story BRAND NEW MAN 11

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My Story BRAND NEW MAN 11
OP: February 23, 2021, 06:55:58 PM
So tonight I had both sons out for a Colombian dinner as this made 2 weeks in a row. S17 did not get ready until the exact pickup time as usual so I had to wait a few minutes. I'm trying to avoid their mom and sitting out front of the house just gives her an opportunity to approach me.

Aside from having dinner, the both of them are still hesitant with accepting things from me. Last week S17 needed boot socks and so I took him to the store. Well thats all he brought. Nothing else.

I did buy the both of them game cards last week but they each picked out the lowest priced one offered at the store. 

Apparently they never need anything. I brought new masks yesterday as S20 only uses the medical ones and he was not interested in an upgraded cloth one. Forget N95, I had the coveted Adidas ones.

I did invite S20 out for lunch on Saturday if he is available. I told him no pressure as it will be just lunch with S17 and myself. I let him know that I will return him home afterwards. He said he will let me know.

I told S17 that he can start learning to drive a car on Sunday. LOL, he has no clue how to drive. S20's permit expired so he will have to see if he can take the exam again but IDK if thats really possible at our DMV at the moment. He said eventually he would like a license so he doesn't sound like he is in any rush. He does "yes" me a lot.

So they both looked good. S17 was his usual self and S20 seemed to be getting more comfortable. He took off his jacket and looked relaxed. Now they didn't leave the car but I'm not unnecessarily exposing them as the food is to go and its only 2 hours.

So I returned them home and I think her car is gone again. I will know for sure on Friday as she was home tonight without the car. I drove home a bit discouraged because its unfair she never left home and it's unfair that she never left our 2 son's.

Its really unfair that I have to operate from this disadvantage. She got all the financial and parental benefits of getting divorced, meanwhile I'm supposed to protect these 2 boy's. Yea, OK. Like thats real easy when I don't live with either one of them.

I'm praying the car was in the shop because I cannot handle a sob story from her on Friday nor any texts. I have S17 this weekend so we will see how it goes.

Thanks for following along everyone and have a good night.

Previous thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11702.0
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« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 08:25:06 PM by Thunder »

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#1: February 26, 2021, 01:20:03 PM
Watcher - so glad that your relationships with your sons are slowly growing stronger.  They are probably treading on thin ice about wanting to accept things from you, and that's  okay for now.  Baby steps.  It's kind of you to offer though, and they know you're there for them.

I'm sure it's difficult when you have no significant time with them, and it seems she's always lurking about.

I hope you don't get a sob story from your w about the car.  Just be prepared, but optimistic, I suppose.

Let us know how it goes.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#2: February 26, 2021, 05:27:39 PM
Hi Seahorse,

Well she has been out all day with S20 and S17 vented the entire drive tonight. First, the dog got out from the front door and I didn't want her to see me. S17 struggled to corral her and dropped her once so I had to go retrieve her.

The dog is in horrible shape and looks old and unkept. I picked her up and she feels like a giant water balloon. She is all water. I told S17 her condition is horrible and he said his mom has written her off and told the boys she is their problem.

S17 asked about the home sale in March. I asked him if his mom brought this up to him and he said no. So I explained the home sale situation. He finds it hard to believe someone will buy our home in its condition. He even asked why doesn't someone force her to maintain it.

He complained about her forcing him to goto Catholic School. So I had to assure him we did not get divorced over Catholic School.

I explained to him we got divorced because there is ABSOLUTELY no future for anyone with her and the only way for the 3 of us to survive is to get away from her as life will never improve under her.

S17 said he has tried talking to S20 and he doesn't offer any opinion. I told S17 its time to save yourself and we might have leave S20 behind.

He said he has a friend his age who is going through the same thing and he talks to him. He knows he cannot allow her to turn him into S20. He said he has a plan. ??? He then followed it up with how stressful it is to get free of her.

So we had dinner and I have a violent migraine. Tomorrow we will go hiking as the temps should be near 50 degrees, however its supposed to rain.

He sounded fed up but he keeps saying he will wait until he graduates in June. We will see.

Have a good night

Thank you Seahorse
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#3: February 26, 2021, 06:20:25 PM
Wow - that's tough. 
So, who did she complain to in the car - was it S17 or you?

I'm so glad that S17 seems to be dealing with things and has a friend to talk to.
It sounds like he gets no support at home.
It seems as if you should be able to let him live with you if you go to court and he attests that's what he wants, and that the house is not good living conditions.
I am sorry that S20 isn't opening up more.
Have you tried to get some time with him alone lately?  I know you've tried in the past... 

The poor dog - doesn't sound healthy at all.

What a mess...  Enjoy your hike with S17, despite the rain...

Sea
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#4: February 28, 2021, 06:21:01 PM
Hi Seahorse,

Yesterday we started our day on a mountain preserve. It was raining so we had some fog as we began our hike. The trails were still covered in snow which was nice and the warming temps had the streams moving nicely. We took the orange trail which was 1.5 miles and is relatively easy.

I told S17 this park has a yellow trail which is considered moderate to hard as the climb is steep and we will try it once the snow melts.

The sun came out around 4pm so we went down to the canal afterwards to look at 2 locks and we figured out that the present day canal is missing their gates thus making it a little difficult to understand how the system really worked. Anyway we found a diagram yesterday to answer our questions.

We had lunch while out and found another George Washington's HQ along the way so we were out 6-7 hours before returning home for dinner.

This morning he was up bright and early and ready to go much to my surprise. It was raining again today and I really had no plans. So I took him to a salt marsh and we hiked about 2.5 miles. It was probably a little more icy conditions this morning so a little more slow going.

Its my job to catch him if he falls so I lead the way and he did have to grab my arm twice for support, lol 😆.

He does ask a ton of questions and he has a general interest in nature. I'm saving the really nice hikes for Spring as there will just be more life with animals and plant growth. The snow is very scenic and I have the pleasure of taking all the photos I want of S17.

I was able to take a photo of S20 and S17 on the first day of school in their uniforms during high school. When S17 joined band I was able to take photos of him. That was pretty much it as they never felt safe in leaving our home.

Yes I find it funny how I went from fearing she would not cooperate with the parenting schedule by allowing S17 to leave the house to fearing she will approach me at my car while I'm waiting for S17.

For S17 I don't think it even phases him anymore. He knows the schedule and he knows I'm coming to get him. He dragged his feet as usual upon returning him home tonight. He says his mom does not care when I bring him home. IDK....

He will be S18 on Thursday so IDK if the parenting schedule even matters any longer, eventhough, he wants to keep the current format, which is fine with me.

After Friday's vent session there was no further talk about his mom. He told grandma he will see her in 2 weeks, I took him home, we hugged it out and he said see you on Tuesday for dinner dad.  ;D

I just finished sending him the photos I took along with descriptions so he can submit them for his interrogation. He has no key for the house. He texted S20 upon arrival to open the door for him which I found interesting. Most kids would text their mom but not in this situation. She was home.

I took off from work this weekend and I'm off tomorrow and I need the sleep, lol.

Have a good night

Thank you
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#5: February 28, 2021, 07:26:29 PM
That sounds like s great day. At least when S17 becomes S18, if you get him home a little late is doesn't matter. Once he is an adult, he can do as he likes unless it is written specifically otherwise in the custody agreement. I don't believe anyone can take away his age of majority rights. So that might be nice once the weather gets warmer.  At least S17 could get into the house and you didn't have to wait around for someone to come home.

I'll bet S17 is looking forward to more adventures.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#6: February 28, 2021, 07:53:07 PM
"sent him the photos I took along with descriptions so he can submit them for his interrogation."

Watcher why are you so worried about her?
She does not need to see pictures of what you two did or where you went.  Let her wonder.
I would send him nothing.  It is none of her business.
This is your parenting time with him.

You get no pictures from her showing what they are doing, or where they are going.
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A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#7: February 28, 2021, 11:11:50 PM
Well, tbh, you probably know why you are afraid of interacting with her.
Part of your recovery job is about working out which bit is sensible caution and which bit is trauma residue, of course.
I'm assuming that the interrogation comment might have been Watcher-funny....it was really noticeable that your soh came out in posts as you started to detach from your xw and her nuttiness....but I'm sure your son likes the photos just for himself so imho that's a good enough reason to send them, whether he shows them to her or not. Jmo.
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« Last Edit: February 28, 2021, 11:13:31 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#8: March 01, 2021, 02:35:30 PM
Hi OffRoad, Thunder, Treasur.

Well IDK if she sees the photos I send to S17 or not. They are just photos of S17 and not me. I dont believe she has taken a photo of S17 in 56 months as she has been too busy with herself. I remember she requested photos once around 2017 or 2018 when we were talking because she had no photos of our son's from high school.

I take the occasional selfie of myself at a running event or now while just running post pandemic. I would much prefer to have someone take my photo but I don't have that option.

S17 has been nowhere. Remember his mother is having some sort of crisis. On Friday S17 woke up and no one was home. I think that sums up his life, especially post pandemic and post inlaws departure.

His mother still works from home and I find that hard to believe after an entire year now. I walked S17 home from the school bus stop on March 13, 2020 for the last time. Up until that date, that boy would never leave his home to see me as we fast walked from the bus stop to an empty house.

IDK what happened but S17 is more than willing to leave that home with me consistently since Dec 15, 2020. Did he really just need that divorce decree finalized ?

He is protective of his home life. I only hear about things while he is venting which he doesn't do often. He mentioned to my mother how he hates Catholic School. He said the same to me on Friday and I explained to him we did not divorce over this issue. So IDK what is up with this anti school stance again that he last exhibited in Dec 2018 and asked me to remove him from the school which I did.

He physically went to school in September and October 2020 before switching to virtual learning in November.

It has to be hard for him. It was very hard for me living with her because I did love her and she did not make it easy. I'm sure he loves his mom and the cognitive dissonance likes to play games as I'm sure he has hope she will change one day.

As for me, I have no hope, lol. Life is much better that way. Stay away from my car Satan before I splash you with Holy Water and watch you 🔥.

I think I will have time to finally run on Saturday. So we will see how dinner goes tomorrow night.

Have a good day

Thank you ladies
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#9: March 02, 2021, 04:42:17 AM
Following along Watcher
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Me - 58, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
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#10: March 02, 2021, 04:12:36 PM
Watcher - your hike with s17 sounds amazing and like a great time for you two to grow together.
I’m sorry that his mother doesn’t trust him with a key.  That must be difficult for him.  My mother was the same way and the lack of trust was hurtful.
I hope that a your run was nice last Saturday.. 

Sea
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#11: March 02, 2021, 06:45:18 PM
Hi UrsaMajor, Seahorse.

Well tonight I had both son's out for dinner and that makes 3 weeks in a row now. S20 still does not talk much. He does greet me upon entering my car but listens to his ear buds for the most part which is fine.

He did wear the cloth mask that I had sent him via S17. He usually wears something that I brought him during Christmas so he does show his appreciation that way I guess.

Both boys were on time for the very first time. I do the text countdown with S17 and hit him up around 100pm and then again at 430pm and finally 5pm. He usually doesn't reply until my arrival text.

S17 chose Chinese food tonight and we noticed the sun is staying out now to 6pm. So in a couple of more weeks the clocks ⏰ will be pushed forward by an hour thus increasing the sunlight hours. Spring is on the way.

I mentioned to S17 that we will be able to walk in the park after we eat once the sunlight improves. After dinner we went to a store where S17 picked out an item and S20 followed suit once he saw his brother was getting something. S20 initially declined my offer.

I dropped them back home and they both seemed generally happy. S20 is in deep thought most of the time. Thats how I would describe him. I told the 2 boys I will see them next Tuesday. I had some gifts for S17 who has a birthday on Thursday and that was it. S17 knows I will have a cake for him on our next overnight.

Have a good night

Thank you
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#12: March 02, 2021, 07:50:22 PM
Just catching up, Watcher.

Nice to read that you are having some time with your kids.  I hope that it continues to happen and that your relationship with both of them continues to grow. 

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#13: March 02, 2021, 07:50:50 PM
Sounds like the boys are settling in to the visitation routine and you are enjoying each other’s company. Their lives have been so uncertain for so long you can’t blame them for being cautious. It will be interesting to see how it continues to develop after S17 becomes S18.
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Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#14: March 03, 2021, 05:26:41 AM
Hello,

Quote
I drove home a bit discouraged because its unfair she never left home and it's unfair that she never left our 2 son's.

She has left everything. She stays at the house and commands over the boys, but how has she taken care of either? Everything is in disarray and decay. Honestly, if I was reading your thread as a literature piece, I would label it a pure Faulkner story set in New Jersey. Even the dog is rotting away.

Quote
He complained about her forcing him to goto Catholic School. So I had to assure him we did not get divorced over Catholic School.

Exactly, the only reason why he went back to Catholic School was because she wanted to get back at you. If he went anywhere else, she would view it as losing to you.

If you think of the dread you feel in her presence, think of the boys and like you said, mix in love and a hope that one day she would change. It is going to take a long time for them to heal. I also believe you are absolutely correct that you would be in any position to help them if you were still living with them in the house with your ex. You would just be another one of her victims.

As far as her escaping the financial aspect, from my perspective, it doesn't appear that she is living it up. She dodging bill collections, living in a house where she can't maintain the property, and her only tatic she has is to put her head in the sand hoping it is all going to disappear. Some life.

Have a great day and just enjoy that you are with your boys.

((((Ready)))))

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#15: March 03, 2021, 10:57:11 AM
I realize that I might be over stepping here but can you and S17 take the doggie for a vet check?   I mean if xW has literally abandoned the poor doggie to the care of the boys they must feel awful they can't care for her properly.  If you felt that bad for her for the 5 minutes you saw her, imagine how bad the boys feel living with her and having no resources to care for her properly.     
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Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#16: March 03, 2021, 12:49:35 PM
Hi Stillbaffled, Dumbfounded, Readytofixmyselffirst.

Yes I can talk to S17 about having the dog checked out by a vet. They did buy her a new harness on Monday and S17 has started to walk her as he informed me last night. Yea I kind of felt S17 let the dog loose on purpose for me to see her.

xW is asking specifically for a copy of the mortgage statement again. I will not give it to her because I have to claim it for tax purposes and not her. Next year she will be entitled to claim the mortgage on her taxes because it will be considered support payments.

IDK if that is why she is demanding a copy of it as it's just a guess on my part. Again the mortgage is solely in my name and it has no bearing on her ability to get her own mortgage. She is not going through her attorney and thats a red flag.

The mortgage balance and buyout information is listed in our MSA. So there is some reason why she wants a copy of the mortgage statement specifically. Ah work has interrupted me.

Enjoy your day everyone

Thank you
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#17: March 03, 2021, 02:45:16 PM
Watcher just tell her...or through S17, the info is on the MSA and she needs to go through her lawyer for this.  You can not help her.

Does seem odd, doesn't it?

Why she wants it from you.
Well not your circus, dear.   8)

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« Last Edit: March 04, 2021, 01:55:17 AM by Thunder »
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#18: March 03, 2021, 03:22:47 PM
Yeah .. nope. All is info she needs is in the MSA. That is all you need xW including things on her taxes or trying to renegotiate the buyout amount. That ship has sailed.
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Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#19: March 04, 2021, 06:36:14 PM
Hi Thunder, Dumbfounded.

I did reply to xW via text and just reminded her that the information she requested is found in our MSA. Then I just placed her back on time out as I didn't want to see an avalanche of responses. Again I have her blocked, however my phone sends her texts to a folder.

So I looked at the folder yesterday and noticed she texted on Tuesday night after I dropped the boys home. Now I also have 10-12 numbers from collection agencies blocked. Yesterday I received a couple of messages from a new number threatening legal action. So , yea, I look at the folder periodically and the new calls yesterday got my attention.

The collection agencies are on a fishing expedition IMO and most likely are looking for her as my credit score is fine and keeps going up. So its not me they want. So my cell phone can be busy some days with nonsense.

Now no one is going to be throwing her out of the house and from what I have read it could take up to a year to force her to sell it if she does drag this out.

I do not trust her, therefore I do not want to talk to her. It's that simple. Plus she sort of dumped me and I'm not ready to deal with her on any level, lol. My email inbox has also seen an uptick in Quicken Loans offers these past 2 weeks.

So things should be quiet until next Tuesday as I have no plans in viewing that folder.

Have a good night

Thank you ladies
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#20: March 08, 2021, 04:50:10 PM
Its still cold outside and I don't feel like running yet. Maybe in 2 more weeks. I think I have no motivation because I set no running goal this year, lol. The Berlin Marathon is actually my goal but I don't have 100% certainty that its going to happen yet. I will know more in June.

Meanwhile I keep reading both the London and Berlin Marathon organizers are very enthused about October like the races are going to happen this year.

I do have 3 new pairs of Brooks Ghost 13 all ready to go. Pixels, Green and Lime are this years crop of colors. Lime looks like it has the potential of getting real dirty so I can only wear that pair in good weather.

I had a Tangerine Brooks Ghost 12 pair that got stained in clay mud on a trail one day. I washed them all the time but the clay left its permanent mark. I also ordered my Nutra Bio Whey Protein Isolate. This one has less than 5mg of cholesterol. Yea I was surprised they contain cholesterol as I picked one out once that had 40 mg per serving. This brand is both soy and lactose free and is touted as not having unnecessary filler as some other brands.

I received a letter from work the other day which identified me as someone who has not yet signed up for the 9/11 Victim Compensation Fund. You know, I don't believe I even work with anyone any longer who I could even ask if they received a similar letter.

I worked down at the WTC site but , you know, there are different degrees of work. I wouldn't classify myself as someone who actually sifted through the site. Anyway the letter said I was exposed to toxic air and thats why I have been identified. I was a young 29 yrs old back then, OMG.

Over the weekend I was processing years 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021. Its amazing how I can remember the events for each particular year precisely.

Tomorrow is dinner night and we will see what happens.

Have a good night everyone
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« Last Edit: March 08, 2021, 04:57:25 PM by Watcher »

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#21: March 09, 2021, 02:09:58 AM
Enjoy your time with the Boys!

I had D10 with me this past weekend and had a wonderful time... Playgrounds, movies (at home), and R (bless her heart) helped D10 with her (late) homework while I went out with the dog and made dinner...
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Me - 58, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 14, D - 10
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#22: March 09, 2021, 05:16:57 AM
Hello,

Quote
I received a letter from work the other day which identified me as someone who has not yet signed up for the 9/11 Victim Compensation Fund.

I received a similar letter only its was in regards to a recall on the Chevrolet Malibu and I could get compensated as well. Unfortunately, I never owned a Chevy in my life.

I just hope you have a great dinner and time with either both or at least one of your sons.

You seem to be doing fine and when it warms up, you will start running again.

(((((Ready)))))
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#23: March 09, 2021, 10:06:23 AM
It is going to be gorgeous out there this week Watcher. Dust off  those running/hiking shoes!!  Spring is coming. 
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Married 1998
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D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#24: March 09, 2021, 07:37:28 PM
Hi UrsaMajor, Readytofixmyselffirst, Dumbfounded.

Well tonight marks 13 consecutive weeks of dinner now on Tuesday night. Only S18 tonight as his brother was full from already eating earlier in the day. He chose Chinese food again which is fine. I introduced him to having his meal steamed and he likes it prepared that way now. S20 wasn't feeling it a few weeks ago when he tried it steamed, lol.

We are keeping with the parenting schedule per S18's request and I think the structure is good for all parties involved. His mom doesn't seem to be giving him a hard time yet with seeing me.

He asked if there were any scheduled holidays coming up. I told him that I have Memorial Day and I believe his mom has him for Easter. He says he hasn't celebrated Easter in years. I guess I could make up St. Patricks Day, lol.

He kept asking when school ends so IDK if he is concerned about the parenting schedule coming to a close. I did tell him we can just keep it going as long as he likes. I mentioned how the weather is about to make a turn for the good and we discussed hiking which he brought up.

I noticed he has all his bullet points that he touches on with me. School, basketball, places we have visited and plans we have discussed.

I have him this weekend and he is looking forward to Friday's pickup. He apologized for being late today which surprised me as he has been late evey single time thus far, lol.

We will celebrate his birthday this weekend and we have an appointment for snow tubing on Saturday. He also wants to practice driving. He looked good tonight as there was no venting about his mom which is good.

I dropped him back home and his mom was sitting in her car in the driveway with S20 and the house was dark. So no interaction between her and I which is also good. He just looked really at peace tonight.

Have a good night

Thank you
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#25: March 10, 2021, 01:13:48 AM
I dropped him back home and his mom was sitting in her car in the driveway with S20 and the house was dark.

How weird is THAT?

Especially since S18 isn't permitted to carry a house key.... just... odd.....
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#26: March 10, 2021, 04:08:33 AM
Watcher, it's so lovely for us to read of you and S18 (my goodness!) having a relationship again, and how he has his subjects to go over with you, and how you saw him 'at peace' last night. Such a wonderful image. Poor kid, maybe he's beginning to see light at the end of these difficult years and can begin to be a regular boy with normal aspirations.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#27: March 10, 2021, 05:06:25 AM
Hi UrsaMajor, Milly.

Yes it is odd he doesn't have a key and the house is usually completely illuminated or blacked out. S18 mentioned the door would most likely be left unlocked. I saw his mom's car door open and I was like, son, you gotta go, like right now, lol.

I did let him know that I am available to drop him off or pick him up if he wants to see his friends and he seemed to like that idea. Being that he is virtually schooled he is really cooped up more than usual. Then again 3 kids at the school just came down with covid so they are not immune from getting it.

In school learning is optional at his school so now the entire school will be virtual for 2 weeks. I believe 6 or 7 kids have caught covid so far. S18 described the great precautions the school has taken inside the school as he did attend until Nov 1st. However, its basketball and wrestling seasons so doesn't sports kind of defeat their classroom precautions.

Yes he loves the virtual learning. No midterms, no finals, homework due in at midnight, lol. Yea and I have to pay for this nonsense, hahaha.

I'm waiting for really nice weather to take him hiking on Mt Tammany and Stairway to Heaven as they are both incredibly scenic. He seems interested in kayaking and we both have bikes so that is also an option.

Now I was thinking last night that he probably doesn't want to be hanging out with his dad but I did remind myself afterwards that I really represent the door being open for him to get outside of the home. So, yes, hopefully its his turn to walkaway from her crisis. Yes I would love for him to be a regular boy with normal aspirations.

Enjoy your day

Thank you
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#28: March 10, 2021, 11:04:10 AM
I love watching this all blossom. Let there be cake and birthday presents!!

I kept my S virtual during basketball because I was sure there would be an incident and then HOW would that work with him being in class. I just saw it as needless stress on his teachers and classmates not to mention the switching back and forth from in-person to virtual. But we got through the whole - albiet shortened - season without a single COVID issue.  Back to in-person on Monday here.

Love to see you stepping up for mundane Dad things like drop off and pick ups.  How wonderful it must be for your boys to know there is someone to call if it all goes south.         
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#29: March 12, 2021, 08:25:04 PM
Hi Dumbfounded.

Well the pickup went smooth again tonight as S18 was wearing shorts and a t shirt in 70+ degrees. We are dropping back down to the 40's for the weekend.

So I realized during our drive that his mom is using him as a conduit. He started with the pricey university over community college conversation again. So I asked him what else is your mom asking you to talk to me about.

Oh she just wanted to remind you about teaching me how to drive and she is looking to buy me contacts.

I didn't let it upset me however this is just a new form of control. I don't believe she is going to be a problem with the parenting schedule because she is lining up my life.

On a positive note she didn't come out to my car nor has she texted me. S18 looks generally enthused to be out and we were already making plans for April and May. Tomorrow we have an early start as we have a ski resort scheduled.

Yea IDK if I'm going to adjust to divorced life as its similar to married life. Maybe I lack maturity as I don't want to hear her input on anything. Just making observations.

Have a good night

Thank you
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#30: March 13, 2021, 03:17:40 AM
Here's a unique idea, Watcher.  If his mother wants him to learn to drive so bad why can't she teach him?  She has a car and she lives with him.

I taught my oldest boy to drive, the other two took Drivers Ed.  There's nothing in the rule book that says which parent should teach them.

Just sayin'...   ;)

I think you're right, it's about control.  Next it will be... now he needs a car, Watcher....oh and maybe you can put him on your car insurance too.  It will never stop.

Hope you two enjoy tubing today!
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#31: March 13, 2021, 06:32:49 AM
Hello,

Quote
So I realized during our drive that his mom is using him as a conduit. He started with the pricey university over community college conversation again. So I asked him what else is your mom asking you to talk to me about.

Oh she just wanted to remind you about teaching me how to drive and she is looking to buy me contacts.

I didn't let it upset me however this is just a new form of control. I don't believe she is going to be a problem with the parenting schedule because she is lining up my life.

It's crazy. But to be fair, I sometimes have had to use my kids to get my ex to do things as well. Otherwise, nothing would get done. I'm talking about whether I need to schedule a vaccination or teeth cleaning when my daughter was visiting or follow up care after she saw the dentist and was going home.

You know that anything that gives your ex the opportunity to call the shots, to feel as if she has control over you, she is going to try. The difference now is you aren't being played by her. In the past, you would have responded to her texts and her demands. Now they all go in a folder for you to peruse at a later date. She may think she is lining up your life and it's okay to let her live with her fantasy. She's done it for years, what's going to change now?

You can teach your son to drive a car, not for her, but for him. If she wants to dance all night long thinking she got you to do something for her, then let it be. The real winners will be you and your son. He needs to learn skills of life, and use the behind the wheel time to talk to him about his future. How to be financially independent and wise with his money. This is not taught in the schools and definitely not by your ex either.

Just be you, be pragmatic, and wise. Then you may have a chance to mold and build a young man to be ready for life.

Have a great weekend,

((((Ready))))
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#32: March 13, 2021, 10:36:18 AM
In keeping with what Ready said, it will be advantageous to watch that you don't decide to do or not do whatever is opposite of her wishes simply because they are her wishes.  I know that what gets written here is often an abbreviated version of events, but it sometimes sounds like you dig in and don't want to do something simply because she does, when it would be a win for a son or son's to do that thing, though maybe not in her specific way. Agreeing to community college and transfer to 4 year, but not all 4 years at an expensive college is a win for son that doesn't break the bank. Teaching son to drive is a win for him and what any parent normally would do, no purchasing of a vehicle needed though insurance supplied by someone would be needed after getting the license.  Those are wins for sons.  Anyway, it's just an impression I get from some of your postings, and it could be completely off.

In my world, I did and paid for it all, whether xh wanted it or not I could not have cared less. I did it for D and S. But I also did it on MY terms. Xh wanted to be the only one to teach S to drive. Tough. S also went out with me. Good thing, too because when the driving test came around, xh forgot to check the lights on his car, one was out so couldn't be used for the driving test. I was also there in my vehicle, so S took my car for his test. Xh could want whatever he wanted, it wasn't stopping me from doing what I thought was in my children's best interest.

IMO, you do what is best for you and your S's, paying zero attention to what she wants or doesn't want. If your wants align, so be it. If they don't,  lay out what you will or will not provide, based on what is best for you and your boys.

I hope you have a fabulous weekend. Adventure awaits.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#33: March 14, 2021, 06:42:49 AM
Yesterday we had beautiful weather as the sun was out with temps in the 40's. The only snow to be found was at the resort as the surrounding area was all brown. Neither one of us had ever been tubing before and my only experience on ski's was when I was 15 yrs old.

One does go incredibly fast down the mountain as giant rubber mats are used at the bottom to slow you down and bring you to a bumpy stop. I don't see how one could fall but apparently it does happen as 2 people were carted away by ambulance.

I could tell he was taking in the views while on the lift up the mountain. He said he was a bit nervous until he saw the little kids doing it. He is not so sure about skiing or snowboarding as we watched people taking lessons.

Afterwards he said he had a lot of fun and now it looks like zip lining is next. He did say that it probably would be even better to go back during the winter and I agreed.

Last night my mom had her St Patrick's Day dinner and S18 is more than engaging in conversation with my family. My SIL had asked if he ever had corn beef and he replied, yes, but its been awhile.

There are 5 birthdays within a 24 day span in our family so they were celebrated last night with 5 cakes. I was introduced to this nonsense sometime after BD as I became cake #4. S18 is now cake #5. Yes they can be a bit overwhelming but I think he is doing fine fitting in.

So we shall see what I find in my "xW" honey to do list today.  ;) Oh maybe I should be clear. Ex W. Oh maybe its these dang acronyms. Ex Wife. Maybe I should capitalize it for emphasis. EX WIFE !

Enjoy your day everyone
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#34: March 14, 2021, 07:00:20 AM
Hello,

Quote
One does go incredibly fast down the mountain as giant rubber mats are used at the bottom to slow you down and bring you to a bumpy stop.

I bet both of you had a blast. I am so glad you are enjoying each other's company and building positive memories together.

Quote
Afterwards he said he had a lot of fun and now it looks like zip lining is next. He did say that it probably would be even better to go back during the winter and I agreed.

Watcher, you are one adventurous man.

Quote
So we shall see what I find in my "xW" honey to do list today.  ;) Oh maybe I should be clear. Ex W. Oh maybe its these dang acronyms. Ex Wife. Maybe I should capitalize it for emphasis. EX WIFE !

Yes and a real big emphasis on EX.

Enjoy your Sunday,

(((((Ready)))))

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#35: March 14, 2021, 07:30:45 PM
So last night S18 announced to my family that he was going to learn how to drive today when they asked what were our plans. Everyone then began to remember their foray into driving and shared stories.

Now I'm thinking maybe its not confidence and he is instead just naive. Also, he places to much faith in me that I'm always going to do the right thing and IDK if I like that. In my family the driving issue is not even open for a debate. Its tradition that we all taught each other.

I let him sleep in late this morning and then we went to drive. He learned how to step on the gas, apply the brake, use his turn signals, make turns and steer.

I was nervous but I did have him laughing with my nervousness. After 2 hours I announced it was time for lunch. There were probably 4 other cars that showed up and there was a parent teaching their kid to drive. I told S18 the objective was to avoid those other cars.

Sunday is a short day. We went back home and it was basically time for dinner and then departure.

So we will see how dinner goes on Tuesday night. S18 is not letting go of me. I am actually tired and I'm going to bed.

Good night
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#36: March 15, 2021, 02:44:14 PM
S got his own cake!!  That is fabulous!!  Loving all the fun you guys are having.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#37: March 16, 2021, 07:13:02 PM
Hi Thunder, offroad, Readytofixmyselffirst, Dumbfounded.

Tonight I arrived early and saw S18 walking the dog in the neighborhood. The dog looked better tonight and she is still a ball of energy and was excited to see me. So I waited until their walk concluded before going over to the house.

Both boys came for dinner tonight and they are always wearing the clothes and shoes that I or my family brought them. We have to exchange one gift on our next weekend because it's the wrong size.

It was cold out tonight and they chose fast food which left too much time available. We discussed the relationship between their cat and dog and that got S20 to open up and he and his brother were telling stories and filling me in.

After dinner I asked S20 if he wanted something from the electronic store. He usually tells me no, I'm good. Tonight he answered with an enthusiastic maybe. So they each made a purchase which is standard when I have them together. Next week I will take them to the shoe store instead as S18 needs to pick out hiking shoes and it may encourage S20 if he is with us.

After the electronice store I got coffee because I'm trying to fill time and we talked as I drove around aimlessly.

I dropped them off back home and S18 said see you next Tuesday after making sure we were not seeing each other this weekend. They both looked fine so we will see how it goes next Tuesday.

Have a good night

Thanks
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#38: March 18, 2021, 07:24:51 PM
We had rain today and I was stuck in the office. I have to work this weekend but I should be able to run on Saturday and Monday as the temps will finally be decent.

So she texted me on March 5th thanking me for letting her know that the mortgage information she sought was in our MSA. "Thank you sir, that was very kind of you". She is so strange. Now she is not being polite. This is how she always responded to men online who paid her compliments. Those exact words. Well at least she didn't wish me "many blessings" this time.

She also sent me either photos or documents that were automatically deleted after 5 days. So I think I will leave her unblocked for now as we have to agree on a realtor and I don't want her to use the excuse that I am not cooperating with the home sale if she does send me something pertinent. Highly doubtful though.

The buyout deadline has passed and I really don't know what happens now. So we shall see.

Have a good night
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#39: March 19, 2021, 05:47:20 AM
Hello,

Quote
So she texted me on March 5th thanking me for letting her know that the mortgage information she sought was in our MSA. "Thank you sir, that was very kind of you".

Yes, your EX is unique.  I had an uncle that was stationed on the Philippines at the start of WWII. To ensure that McArthur safely left, he stayed behind and spent the entire war as a POW. When he returned to the states, doctors stated the experience aged him 20 years. He used to say he was a 68 year old in an 88 year old body. I think I can safely assume that you ex has aged you at least a decade. Just sayin.

Quote
She also sent me either photos or documents that were automatically deleted after 5 days.

Is she a member of the mission impossible squad?

Quote
The buyout deadline has passed and I really don't know what happens now. So we shall see.

I don't either. However, I would have fallen over in disbelief had she met a deadline.

Have a great weekend,

(((((Ready))))



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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#40: March 19, 2021, 07:35:08 AM
Hi Readytofixmyselffirst,

Oh thats how I took it. She has aged me considerably throughout the past few years eventhough we are the same age.

Yea I keep learning about my phone. Now this is my work cell phone so IDK if its a Samsung feature or work itself. It could also be because I had her in a blocked status. IDK. Apparently someone can send me a standard text and thats fine.

If it requires me to download whatever one sent me , other than your standard text, then I have only 5 days to open it on my end or it deletes.

I'm not surprised either that she failed to meet the buyout deadline. It will become an issue in September when she cannot get S18 into college because the high school will not release his transcripts since tuition was not paid due to the house not being sold. Its a domino effect. Everything starts with the selling of the house or not. 

So I'm in no rush at the moment. I will sit and wait until the legal system takes action against her or not.

I'm glad I never signed that promissory note like the school requested. She has failed to pay tuition. She has failed to meet the buyout deadline. She will refuse to sell the house. So let's all goto court together when they drag me in for not paying my forced share of school tuition and we can settle all these matters.  ;)

Enjoy your day

Thanks
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#41: March 19, 2021, 10:33:07 AM
Is it not specified in the MSA, Watcher, what happens when - entirely predictably - she failed to meet the buyout deadline? And does the legal process not require you or your L to enforce it? I'm assuming bc it is your xw's track record that she will just keep ignoring stuff until she can't any longer?

Wonder too if it is worth slowly talking to your sons about what they want to do when the house sells? Do they know that they could have a place to live with you if they wish and how that might work?
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#42: March 19, 2021, 11:42:29 AM
Hi Treasur,

Yes it is specified in the MSA that ,as the plaintiff, I have to legally go after her to have the house forcefully sold. I've been told the process could take up to a year with me spending more money.

Looking at my attorney's track record I would say I won't hear from him until May as he usually gives her a 2 month extension on every issue. I'm not contacting my attorney and he is on short time anyway. I only need him for the house sale and then I am done with him.

I believe I need an aggressive attorney when it comes time to address the ending of child support. If S18 is not a full time college student in September then CS ends according to state law and I don't believe I have the right attorney for that issue.

Its her CS to fight for and not the responsibility of my attorney to hand it to her on a silver platter. I feel the same way about the division of pensions. If xW is not pursuing her pension rights then I am not handing it to her freely nor will I be represented by an attorney any longer who just wants to make life easy for my xW at my expense.

I am glad she has failed to address the buyout as it takes the onus off of school tuition and the pension division which my attorney wanted handled last December. Those 2 issues no longer interest me. I will inform my attorney I am only interested in receiving my equity now. That is the only priority. Afterall the high school is waiting patiently for their money.  ;)

So ,yes, I want out of paying CS sooner rather than later as I want to rid this woman from my life. I really don't care how that sounds or looks. She has to fight for it and if she screws it up, like she did with S20, then so be it.

So I unblocked her because I don't want to hear any excuses. She had asked me numerous times for my mortgage statement and I ignored her. Finally I texted her that the information was in our MSA so I put it to rest.

The MSA says we both have to choose and agree on a realtor. So I thought to myself the other day, how can we agree on a realtor if I have her blocked. Meanwhile, can you hear her victim's cry in her best Scarlet O'Hara. "Oh your honor, I've tried contacting Watcher and he never replies". This way there will be no opportunity for her to paint me as the one who is not cooperating with the home sale.

I am already operating at a disadvantage because I am the plaintiff and I need my name off the mortgage and deed while she is living in the home. Apparently the plaintiff has to do all the work to achieve their freedom.

I will see what S18 says after he graduates and I look forward to enjoying the Summer with both son's. Currently I have enough money saved to purchase a new home but I would like to wait a bit longer. Yes I plan too much but I really have to make a good decision at this point in my life and cannot afford to make a mistake. I did just turn 49 afterall.  ::)

S18 said he wants to wait and see how things are once he graduates high school. I believe he would prefer to live on campus somewhere. S20 is never leaving his mother. I am not an option for him.

Enjoy your day

Thanks Treasur
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#43: March 19, 2021, 04:53:30 PM
Hard to believe that S18 will receive a diploma with unpaid tuition. He may not even be able to walk with his peers. With her track record, she´ll spring that on you at the last minute- thereby not allowing time for the realtor and sale. So you´re not stuck being the "bad guy", is it worth a conversation with S18 to let him know that you will not be paying at the last minute to allow for graduation ceremonial stuff unless his mother has met her end of the deal?
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#44: March 19, 2021, 05:07:11 PM
Hi Watcher!

I just wanted to say, do not overwhelm yourself with everything right now.  You have so much to think about, maybe take it in small pieces.

May I suggest, how about a short email to your lawyer saying:

"The date set for my XWife (name) to buy me out of the house was March 15th.  I have heard nothing from her so I'm assuming she obviously has not the means to do so, so I just need to know what the next steps we take to get the house sold.  Please advise.

Also she wants to send my son to an expensive college neither of us, nor my son can afford, so according to the MSA I do not agree with her choice.

Thank you, looking forward to hearing from you"

Watcher it could take months to sell the house so your son will have plenty of time to finish HS.

I guess just maybe start with that.  Small pieces.  : )
Kind of a one day approach.

Let September go until that comes up.  That's months away.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#45: March 19, 2021, 07:26:32 PM
I also agree that the cart should not go before the horse, but I'd be proactive and as Thunder suggested, ask your attorney what your next steps are. Don't get in your head too far about any of it, but set yourself up to steer the ship. I would not mention any of this to your son as its not his problem. He has enough to deal with without the unfinished business and unresolved angst between you two.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#46: March 20, 2021, 04:43:56 PM
Hi FTT, Thunder, Ready2Transform.

Well today was the first day of Spring so I finally was able to get back to running prior to work. I ran the standard 5 miles bringing me to a very paltry 44.79 miles on the year. I went with Brooks Ghost 13 Pixels Black/Blue/Nightlife design.

I ran in this Magnolia tree park but unlike last year at this time there was no budding yet. Winter was milder in 2020.

I haven't run since Feb 16th so everything is sore now. I will be able to run at the beach on Monday as the temperatures finally look good at the 50-60 degree level all next week. The weather looks real good for hiking next Saturday.

So we will see what happens next week.

Have a good night

Thank you ladies
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#47: March 20, 2021, 06:16:21 PM
Hi Watcher, glad you got out and had a run today.

Regarding your S's graduation, I can only see it from my point of view and how I would handle the situation if it were my own S and D. I know that I've paid for everything for my S and D so far. I didn't want them to do without. I made up for what their loser, useless father had decided was a good enough life for them.

I paid for the birthday parties, the driving lessons, school books, the high school graduation parties, the 18th birthday party, university and masters degree. It's wrong of course that my H got to get away with this, but it was more important to me that my kids got what they deserved.

We made choices that were expensive for me, but doable. We didn't choose the expensive school your W (and my H) would choose. We found very good alternatives that with a lot of struggle on my part, made it happen for my D. Now I'm doing the same for S with his tennis. I paid for my oldest D's graduation from college in the US. H didn't come and didn't pay. I am still glad I did it even if it was wrong I had to pay it all myself. For me, it was about my child having what she should have, because she did not choose to be born to a thoughtless, selfish parent like her father.

I don't mean to sound as mean as maybe my post is coming off as, every parent must do what they feel is right. I know we want to stand up to the MLCer and set boundaries against their cruel, thoughtless, and abusive behaviour. I struggle when trying to work out what is a boundary against my H, and what is a boundary that is actually going to end up against my S. I say S because he is the one who needs all my money right now.

Especially your S18, he senses you are a real parent, the reliable, dependable parent all kids need and think they have. You have the power to give him a normal life. I feel that if you don't contribute to his high school graduation ceremony and photos or driving lessons, it will be one more thing his mother's crisis has deprived him of.

You have the capacity to avoid that. Otherwise, he will not have those photos (and neither will you) to show his own kids. The lack of them might always be a symbol of a hole in his adolescence that others don't have. Whilst others will be dressing up to have their photo taken, he won't. He'll have to explain. Kids will wonder why he's not getting driving lessons when everyone does.

Sorry, don't mean to blame, I don't think this is coming out quite right. Just want to say, if you have the money, why not pay for S18 to have what you would have given him had you still been married. He is doing so well right now. He doesn't need to wonder why he doesn't get to have what others are getting.

Hope you don't take offense from my words, Watcher. I mean no offense, just lots of love between you and your boy. 
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#48: March 21, 2021, 08:18:20 AM
Hello,

Quote
Regarding your S's graduation, I can only see it from my point of view and how I would handle the situation if it were my own S and D. I know that I've paid for everything for my S and D so far. I didn't want them to do without. I made up for what their loser, useless father had decided was a good enough life for them.

I do agree with this to a point. But this goes further than meeting the needs of the children. Watcher's ex wants control and to keep control. If Watcher pays the tuition and son walks and obtains diploma, the next step is to enroll in an extremely expensive college that will keep Watcher on the hook for years while she uses her son's loans and financial support funding to pay for  her lifestyle. If Watcher can get past the deadline to enroll, then ex is out of the picture and Watcher can then support only his son and not his ex.

If the expensive college goes through, it will be a heavy hit on Watcher and eventually his son because looney tunes is not going to put a dime towards supporting her son.

I hope I got this right from reading the prior posts from Watcher.

(((((Ready)))))
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#49: March 21, 2021, 11:21:16 AM
This is me not understanding, having put one through college, with another in college. My kids are responsible for their college tuition AND  I could not apply for them, they had to apply. I had saved up money for it, so my Ds loans are minimal, but the tuition and loans are not my responsibility. They were and are hers.

Watcher, does your MSA say you, and only you, are responsible for your kids' college tuition and that they can sign up for any college they choose and you pay for it? If so, I can see why you'd be angry with your attorney.

I do feel bad for S18, though. He was stuck living with his mother and didn't even want to go to the private school. The education did him no good if he can't get proof he graduated and may put a kink in his entire life through no fault of his own. That really stinks.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#50: March 21, 2021, 11:37:46 AM
This is me not understanding, having put one through college, with another in college. My kids are responsible for their college tuition AND  I could not apply for them, they had to apply. I had saved up money for it, so my Ds loans are minimal, but the tuition and loans are not my responsibility. They were and are hers.

Watcher, does your MSA say you, and only you, are responsible for your kids' college tuition and that they can sign up for any college they choose and you pay for it? If so, I can see why you'd be angry with your attorney.

I do feel bad for S18, though. He was stuck living with his mother and didn't even want to go to the private school. The education did him no good if he can't get proof he graduated and may put a kink in his entire life through no fault of his own. That really stinks.

I'm of this thought too, though the last person I enrolled in college was myself, more years ago than I like admitting! A parent can't just go do this, and certainly, the deal won't be sealed on a promise-to-pay note - a college would not enroll W's son without being paid, and at 18, your son's debts are not yours, unless the MSA tells a different tale. What area of study your son is going into is more the issue in the choice of college or trade school, and I would be scared to rob him of that, either way. Not having a clear career path as early as possible makes for a shaky future, and time will keep moving forward for both of your sons regardless of what happens with this ongoing dissolution of the marriage.

Sometimes we give these people more power than they really have because it's easy to believe it, after so long. I was many years NC before I really got that, so I'm not spitting empty words there. The head space my xH leased for free shackled me and my thinking for a long time. You hold more power than you know, W, and so does your son. But you gotta quit thinking about her and what she'll do, and being in react/respond mode for that. You are the person with the power. In your own life, and for your kids.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#51: March 21, 2021, 12:36:24 PM
"I hope I got this right from reading the prior posts from Watcher."

Nope Ready you are absolutely right.   :)

The thing is, it's not enough he pays for their huge mortgage every month to keep a roof over the boys head after being kicked out, she wants to drown him financially so he can not move on with his own life. She's very clever. She will never pay half that HS tuition or anything else, as is stated in the MSA.

She made Watcher pay all the tuition for both boys for years, with no help from her, even though she makes $60,000 a year...so he ended up deep in debt.  He is finally digging himself out.  Another huge debt would only put him back in that debt and he will never be able to move out.

Watcher is doing everything he can to get his S18 to see that continuing to live with his mother is not the best choice for him without pressuring him...just leading by example.  I think he is now starting to see the benefits of living with a real, loving family and he's enjoying it.  Grandma's spoiling him.  ;D
His mother has a huge house with many bedrooms and S18 is starting to make one of the rooms his.

Sorry Watcher I don't want to talk like you are not here.  Are you here??    Ha ha

You really have nothing to explain to anyone.  You are following your MSA to the letter.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#52: March 22, 2021, 10:35:49 AM
What you want to avoid is having any of xW nonsense cripple the kids going forward.

These are my thoughts. Get a lawyer you are happy with and file a Motion with the Court to enforce the MSA the object of which is for you to pay the HS tuition and get S18 his transcript and have her 1/2 of the tuition bill be an additional lien on the house.  You get an Order approving a realtor and selling the house - and you sell it in this booming market and get your money back from the equity and be DONE with her.  Then you sit S18 down and talk man to man and you figure out college - both of you free from her nonsense.  Maybe he does a stint at community college first.  But you get that boy free and let him move forward.   

Hopefully there is enough equity to pull it off.     
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#53: March 23, 2021, 05:30:53 PM
Hi Dumbfounded, Thunder, Ready2Transform, OffRoad, Readytofixmyselffirst, Milly.

Tonight both boys went to dinner. S18 never replies to my texts when I let him know I'm on my way or have arrived so its an uncomfortable few minutes in front of the house. I guess I would just leave if he didn't come outside as going to the front door is not an option especially since their mom was home.

S18 and I were both wearing shorts so S20 felt he had to explain why he wasn't. He is still a bit nervous I guess as I didn't need an explanation. S20 doesn't talk much but I do get the sense that he wants to be there.

We had Chinese food tonight. We don't have that every week and S20 has eaten his full meal now 2 weeks in a row. Tonight he surprised me that he finished his meal so maybe he is getting comfortable.

S18 informed me that he received an email from school and the graduation will be via car so I told him he will go with his mom then.

After dinner we went to pick out hiking shoes for S18. He really enjoys picking out his shoes. I noticed that with his sneakers a few weeks ago. So he took his time before he settled on a pair.

I explained to S20 why we were picking out this type of shoe and gave him the option of getting whatever he wanted and he chose to get a hiking pair for himself. So now they both have hiking boots and shoes and it gives them options. Even if S20 doesn't go out with me at least he has the hiking shoes and boots to use  on his own time.

S20 will always "yes" or "no" me so he has to be led. He sees his brother getting something so naturally he wants the same for himself.

There was no excess time to drive aimlessly around tonight. I stopped for coffee and then took them back home. The dog was sitting on the front stairs patiently awaiting our arrival much to the boys surprise. S18 commented that his mom must have forgotten to let the dog back inside.

The dog was very excited to see them. I'm punctual and follow the exact time allowance of 5pm-7pm so she probably didn't have the dog waiting long for us.  ::) Probably let her out at 6:59pm.

So we will see Friday as I have S18 this weekend.

Yesterday I ran 8 miles at the beach and my hamstrings have to get accustomed to running again as they are sore. The weather has been beautiful. I think we may finally be exiting the cold weather. Well hopefully.

Have a good night

Thank you
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#54: March 24, 2021, 04:05:01 PM
Lovely post, Watcher. I'm so happy both your boys are getting to spend time with you. Love how your S20, the scared puppy, is now feeling more and more courageous. Things must be nice on that Tuesday night dinner. I feel that him wanting to get hiking shoes might be a sign that what S18 is saying at home about his weekends with you, are fun sounding. I'm so happy for you and for your boys. x
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#55: March 26, 2021, 09:03:21 PM
Hi Milly.

Friday night is just a stay at home dinner night. It takes me a little over an hour to drive home from work and then another 2 hours round-trip to get S18. Most of it is just typical Friday traffic.

S20 and the dog were on the front lawn when I pulled up to the house. He was trying to coax the dog back into the house and eventually they both re entered.

Their mom was not home however I still do not leave the car as its just not proper since we are divorced and I don't live there. S18 did not vent so things must be fine in his world currently.

We are going hiking tomorrow so he already knows I will be waking him up early as the temps are going to be nice in the 50's and parking is always a concern.

He had his new hiking shoes on so he must be ready to go.

Have a good night

Thanks
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#56: March 27, 2021, 06:22:49 PM
So today we went to Delaware Water Gap to attempt the #1 hike in NJ known as the Red Dot Trail on Mt. Tammany. Well we arrived around 1030 am so forget it as the parking was all gone. S18 was shocked by the parking conditions so it was a real eye opener for him. I was a bit annoyed as I had to look for a new location to hike.

So I let it go as I drove to the next location. S18 may have known I was annoyed. I did tell myself that I'm no longer just getting up and going out as I please as I did all last Summer. For the top hiking destinations one needs to be on the road by 6am and S18 told me, well thats not going to happen for him, lol.

So I will just have to find 2nd tier hikes and plan kayaking for afternoon appointments instead of mornings in the future for example. In hindsight its just as well as Mt. Tammany was jam packed and we still have to be covid responsible.

We ended up going to this Hacklebarney State Park and neither one of us had ever been there before. The weather was beautiful in the 60's today so we hiked 3 miles on the Red Riverside Trail along the Black River. There really was nothing to complain about as we were right on the water.

This hike is listed as one of the top destinations for Fall Foliage in NJ. S18 said his new hiking shoes were great and we both regretted not wearing shorts as it became hot. The hike did give him some good experience for walking on boulders.

Afterwards we went for lunch as S18 is regimented with his meal times so that is also something that I am mindful of while we are out and the food he likes is usually miles away from the mountains.

After lunch we went clothes shopping as I see him always wearing these same pair of heavy cotton pants. So he picked out a few pairs of lighter dri fit material ones and he also picked out some dri fit shirts which are more suitable for hiking.

Then we went home as he will not use a public restroom. He always says he doesn't have to go which can't be true. So thats another area where I have to be mindful.

We had dinner tonight as he certainly likes to eat. Tomorrow we go for round 2 of learning how to drive. He can sleep late on Sunday but with the weather getting better now, he is going to have to adjust to being up early on Saturday and not waking up near noon.

I had him up at 830am today and I think thats as good as it will be, lol.

Have a good night
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#57: March 28, 2021, 06:37:53 PM
Today S18 claimed he woke up at 9am however I did not see him until noon for breakfast. I did hear the shower going around 1130 am. It rained today and we had already planned for S18 to go driving so there was no rush to get him moving.

He asked if he was still going to drive in the rain and I didn't think that was a reason not to so off we went. Its been 2 weeks since his first lesson so he started a bit sluggish with his turns as he utilized the grip of death on the steering wheel.

He knows how to use the brakes and thats all I care about, lol. We just continued to work on using turn signals, properly stopping, making turns and just overall diving. He looked more comfortable today and I was very glad after that 1.5 hours came to a conclusion.  ;) Potty training was much easier and less stressful.

Sunday will be his driving day and he has now been out twice driving for a total of 3.5 hours. So we will continue to build on it as his exam is not until August and the driving school will be most likely scheduled in July.

We did go to lunch afterwards as eating is part of his routine. Oh he did hit the curb once so I wasn't to thrilled about the state of my tire. Then he immediately hit a pothole and I calmly said, you might want to avoid that hole next time.

We returned home for dinner and he yucked it up with grandma on how there were no accidents. Yes I'm really surprised I was patient this weekend.

On the drive back to his home he mentioned how he would like to attempt Mt. Tammany on April 10th. Yea he even knew our next weekend date. I let him know that kayaking season also begins on our next weekend as I learned today.

I dropped him back home and he said he will see me on Tuesday. Now I'm going to bed as I'm tired after a poor night of sleep. I think I ate too late at night and it kept me up. We both agreed that this weekend really went fast.

Have a good night
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#58: March 29, 2021, 01:34:01 AM


It's not a pot hole unless it bend the rim ...  ;D
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#59: March 30, 2021, 06:31:23 PM
Hi UrsaMajor.

This morning I could not find my arm band so I had to buy a new one. I went with a yellow one because I have too much blue in my running wardrobe. It is so much easier ordering online and just picking it up in the store on the way. The same goes when ordering food online.

I went to the beach for a 10.5 mile run and the sun was out however it was a bit windy. The sun was really strong today as I already have color or wind burn. Too many bicyclists today along the path as I think public schools are on break.

Too much sun and absolutely no clouds in the sky so photography was not the best today.

I have been talking to S18 about our dog and how she will tire out at some point as the temps increase and lay down along her route in the shade. So low and behold S18 texted me today and that is such a rarity as neither boy texts me.

He said it "finally happened" and accompanied his text with a photo of the dog sprawled out laying in the shaded grass along her route. That made my day. Not only did he text but he took a photo and sent it to me. Hmm, maybe the photos I send him of our adventures have had some influence. IDK.

So then it was dinner time and tonight marks 16 weeks. Both boys again tonight and S20 chose the venue. I did let the boys know that the Cicadas Brood X are coming this year. They were too little to remember the last time they emerged back in 2004 but its going to be some event as our property easily gets 50,000+ LOL....

Currently I'm listening to Eric Church "Hell of a View" and Luke Combs "Forever After All".

I dropped them off back home and said I will see them next Tuesday. IDK. Pretty uneventful routine night.

Have a good night
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#60: March 30, 2021, 11:55:22 PM
Uneventful and routine is not all bad, is it?

Glad you are getting to enjoy your time with them.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#61: March 31, 2021, 09:38:45 AM
An uneventful routine night.  How long it it take you to get here? Congrats!! 
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#62: March 31, 2021, 09:50:13 AM
I am loving the bonding that is clearly happening with you and your boys, especially S18. S20, is warming up though it sounds like. Enjoy the warm weather. Not the Cicadas though--ew.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#63: March 31, 2021, 03:28:53 PM
Oh, Watcher, I'm getting all warm inside reading your latest updates. Your boys are getting stronger. The little/big S20 squirrel is getting more courageous. S18 is blooming. I'm sooo happy for you. Another win for all LBSes.

PS: I had been missing your colourful running attire. You are very good at describing your gear. I can see you having your own column in a running magazine.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#64: April 03, 2021, 01:25:16 PM
Hi Milly, KIT, Dumbfounded, UrsaMajor.

Yes I do believe S18 is coming along nicely and S20 has joined us for 9 of the 16 dinner nights thus far. He has joined us for 6 of the last 7 dinners so maybe he is getting more comfortable.

I'm free this weekend so I went running at the beach this morning with temps at a windy 41 degrees. I wore my Brooks Ghost 13 lime green sneakers for the first time and logged 10 miles. Naturally I had to wear a green Under Armour shirt so I matched.

My Nike banana yellow armband probably would be better paired with my lemon colored Ghost 13's which I have not broken in yet. I only have the one armband so it will have to do for now.

I had my black armband since I discovered country music in 2017 and IDK what happened to it.

Now my course today took me through the clothing optional showers at the clothing optional beach. Yea I know. Thankfully it was 41 degrees and no one was there because if I had to disrobe that would have slowed my pace. I mean I would have looked odd had it been 90 degrees.

That is the only section of the beach where the WW2 gun batteries are still in place. So let's lure the history buffs to the nude beach I guess.

I am up to 73 miles now and last year I had 170 at this point. April was also my best month at 165 miles and I'm not even going to come close to it this year. Tomorrow will probably be just 5 miles.

Other than that its been quiet.

Enjoy your day

Thank you
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#65: April 03, 2021, 02:21:52 PM
You have a nude beach there? 
I guess that is not too crowed in 40 degree weather.  LOL

I don't think we have any nude beaches here, that know of, but I have a funny feeling they would be filled with 20 something women and a lot of 40/50 something men.  Ha ha ha  Just a wild guess... ::)

Seems you need a new black armband Watcher!

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#66: April 04, 2021, 06:32:20 PM
Hi Thunder,

Well apparently so. Even more odd is why does the path traverse through the outdoor clothing optional showers ? The path of the LBS is not for the feint of heart.

So Thunder, I've noticed that I've been running slower than usual and I was attributing it to my hamstrings as they are not quite there yet.

However, I think it might be something more sinister. Usually while I'm running there are many women that I pass along the path with yesterday being a 10 mile run.

Well I've been thinking, I'm not receiving any validation Thunder from those women and its impacting my pace now. Don't women know men cannot run without their encouragement. So my running is suffering from lack of being praised allegedly. Or it could really be my hamstrings. ::) IDK....

So I didn't run today because my fragile male ego could not take 2 days in a row of not getting that necessary female validation. You know, that validation goes hand in hand with Vitamin D.

Therefore I went to Kickboxing and I had the misfortune of having a male instructor today so I really didn't get any validation because you know men.  ::)

Meanwhile I still have to suffer through a male instructor on Monday and Wednesday. Oh my goodness. The weight of the entire world 🌎 is on that poor female instructor I have on Thursday. Only she can save the week for me. LOL....

Have a good night  ;)
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#67: April 06, 2021, 06:59:25 PM
Tonight I had both son's out for dinner again and S20 was dressed nicely so I think he wants to be there. Still not talking much but he is present. S18 asked me non stop questions about when to use a blinker while driving.

I replied don't drive like me. I drive in NYC for work and the blinker is outlawed over there. You put your blinker on in NYC and no one will let you in. Yea you just gotta cut people off and muscle your way in, lol.

So I told him if he wants to pass his driving exam then he better always use his blinker. Ugh, then I had to start using my blinker to set an example I guess.  ::) Well only when I'm in NJ.

He's looking forward to driving this weekend. He still is walking the dog and I didn't ask them any questions about their Easter. I invited S20 to join us on Friday night if he is available and he will let me know.

My mom had Easter gifts for them and I took them to the electronics store after dinner.

They were both punctual tonight. I reminded S18 at 1pm via text and then again at 430pm just letting him know I would be there at 5 and he responded to the latter message. Their mom was home at 7pm when I dropped them back off and thats been pretty much the routine. I will have S18 this weekend.

I signed up for year 2 of the Toll Booth Challenge which is running 289 miles in 62 days. Now the female adulation package was surprisingly sold out this year so I will just have to tough it out on my own now and motivate myself.  ::)

Well last year I had a modified work load because of the pandemic so IDK how I will fare this year while actually working this time around. It starts April 25th and I will be complaining about running 5 miles a day again pretty soon.

The medallion sold me. Its the NJ Turnpike ticket and emblem matched with the Garden State Parkway emblem with tokens which haven't been used in years but it looks really cool. Its actually called the Twisted Toll Booth Challenge this year.

The NYC Marathon is on for this year as I was notified today. I can run it in 2021, 2022, or 2023. My preference is 2022 followed by 2023 as its in November.

I already have Berlin scheduled in September which is also still on currently, and the Holy Grail of all marathons in October in New Jersey, lol. So I plan on running the Berlin and NJ Marathons which are 3 weeks apart.

Godsmack and Kenny Chesney both postponed again to 2022 so this year I asked for my refund. Now I only have 2 Luke Combs concerts left but I'm holding onto those tickets forever.

Have a good night
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#68: April 06, 2021, 11:12:02 PM
You are SO funny, Watcher  :) (she says adoringly.....see what i did there lol?  :) )

What news on the sale of the house process starting? (Bc we all guess your xw will do nothing for as long as she can  ::) ) And what are your thoughts on a house of your own soon?
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#69: April 07, 2021, 09:54:20 AM
Watcher I had to laugh when you said people get upset, in NYC, when you use your blinkers.

It's just the opposite here, people get angry when you don't use them. It's looked at as rude to other drivers.  You'd probably get some hard honks!
Guess I better nor drive in NYC.  LOL

Well I hope the races and concerts get back to normal soon.
Not many are open here yet.

Have a good day!
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#70: April 07, 2021, 10:48:46 AM
In my youth, I took a car load of friends to NYC to see the opera.  After some serious trial by fire, I declared "oh, I see, they just expect you to go " and I abandoned the niceties and the blinker and the driving went much better after that.  Although the reminder of the ride was terrifying for my passengers.

I take the train in to NYC now.     
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#71: April 09, 2021, 12:17:54 PM
Hi Dumbfounded, Thunder, Treasur.

Ooh I received wonderful news come May 7th at 10am, tickets for Eric Church, Gather Again Tour, go on sale.  ;D If you join the fan club that will get one to pre sale.

Listen up LBS, a decade from now when your MLCer may exit the tunnel what are you going to say when they ask what have you been doing with your life. Tell them, you went to see Eric Church and that will haunt them for the rest of their days. Might as well get tickets for 2 concerts like I did with Luke Combs and really pile it on. ;)

Now we need Jason Aldean to announce his tour dates to complete the trifecta of piling it on.

Oh yes, I learned quite early on to stop using my blinker in NYC while driving because it is seen as a sign of weakness. Cutting people off is respected much more. Nothing screams, "your not from around here" like a car utilizing its blinker.

The train going into NYC is great as I did that with the Brett Young concert. Leaving NYC is not pleasurable by train. The concourse is always crowded and they never announce which track the train is arriving on until the last minute. Then there is a bum rush to squeeze through the appropriate access door that leads to the correct platform, lol.

I had an issue with my ankle yesterday so I'm taking a few days off. Well I did goto Kickboxing last night so now I'm taking a few days off. Kickboxing is most likely the culprit and since running is my #1 focal point, I will rest it now before I have to start running on April 25th.

A lot of gray and rain in the forecast this weekend so we will see what happens. Tomorrow will probably be hiking and Sunday S18 will learn to drive in the rain again. Talk about trying someone's patience. Its either 20 degrees or raining, lol.

Enjoy your day everyone

Thank you ladies
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#72: April 11, 2021, 05:55:14 AM
Yesterday was an overcast day so we hiked The Giant Stairs which has a difficult rating. I didn't think S18 was ready for this one so I went back and forth in my head as I drove.

The 1,489 foot descent down from the Palisades cliffs has a typical dirt path in a wooded area with stone stairs in sections. There is a stream that leads to the Peanut Leap Waterfall which looked pretty decent yesterday. It took us 55 minutes to get to the shoreline along the Hudson River and the waterfall from the parking lot.

It was not crowded at all yesterday so that was a bonus. So we continued along the shoreline on a rocky path for another half mile before we reached The Giant Stairs.

I had S18 pose for a photo with the warning/danger/ your mom would kill your dad if she knew what you were doing sign posted at the entrance. The sign said it would take 2 hours to traverse the 1 mile climb. So The Giant Stairs is a collapsed cliff and hikers are climbing over the rubble.

I led the way as we took our time as I really couldn't have him falling off a ledge. There were a couple of spots where one has to really hug the boulders. He did have to reach out for my arm on occasion but we made it through the debris field without him losing his cell phone. We did come across someone who did drop their phone and they were trying to get it out from a hole. So S18 hiked with one hand glued to his pocket from that point onwards.

Oh I was so relieved when we cleared the debris field unscathed. We continued along the shore line until we had to make our 1,493 foot ascent. I had forgotten that was the part I did not like from my first hike. Yea the climb up was rough and we were finally back on top of the cliffs at 3 hours and 26 minutes.

We went to lunch afterwards and he slept on the drive home. He made the mistake of wearing pants yesterday so he was drenched eventhough the temps were about 65 degrees. He told my sister he was exhausted and confided in me that he was only scared in a few spots.

He bounced back quickly by dinner time. They do marvel on how much he eats. My brother and SIL are always there on Saturday visiting.

My mom was upset with the hike of course because it sounded dangerous. She said my older sister asked if I could take my nephew hiking with us next time. Now my initial thought to myself was why can't his father take him and IDK if I want to share my time with S18 even more than I already do with my family.

So hopefully the teenager sleeps late today. I mean he has to be worn down today but I think they bounce back more quickly. Like when we stopped for lunch after the hike I felt every ache in my body as I exited the car. S18 says he didn't feel anything, lol.

Today its supposed to rain and we are scheduled to go driving so I guess its his turn to place me in danger.

Enjoy your day everyone
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#73: April 11, 2021, 01:19:15 PM
That sounds like a great hike Watcher.  I can understand not wanting to share your time with your son, but perhaps nephew can come along once in a while, just not every time.

Hopefully the driving went well today.
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#74: April 11, 2021, 06:44:23 PM
Hi FaithWalker,

It rained today but we still went driving. I broke him out of the parking lot and we went to a state park where he logged another 1.5 hours bringing him to 5 hours now behind the wheel.

There wasn't much vehicular traffic because of the rain and it gave S18 an opportunity to read roadway signs and practice in a realistic environment instead of doing circles in a parking lot like we did during his first 2 attempts.

Overall he did fine and I was less nervous. He is still too close to the curbside and I fear for my tires. Today he had the car up to 43 mph and I was like, what are you doing. He pointed out we were in a 45 mph zone and I replied, I do not care what that sign says. Drop your speed, lol.

He got hungry and I think his driving toleration is 1.5 hours so we went to lunch. Sunday is a short day. Then we went back to my mom's for dinner before I returned him home. We had to wait for the dysfunction train to arrive.

We said our good bye and will see each other on Tuesday night for dinner. Our next hike will be at the beach which traverses through a forest and is relatively flat.

S18 drove down what turned out to be a dead end today and we discovered a WW2 era machine gun nest so now we have to get out and hike it as the park does have a legitimate 3.5 mile flat sandy hike.

Well I'm very protective of my GAL. My family are always interested in my activities. As the forum knows it took my 2.5 years to find activities. Yea they all think I'm living the high life because I travel the entire state.

My nephew would have to do a flat hike. I would never have taken him to the Giant Stairs, lol. I was really flying under the radar until S18 showed up. Now my family are always asking questions as to where we have been.

So we will see how Tuesday night goes as I'm going to bed.

Have a good night

Thank you
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#75: April 12, 2021, 03:40:12 PM
Watcher, just to say I'm still following your journey. So much positive stuff this year that it's almost unbelievable. Love to hear about your hikes and driving adventures with S18. Well done for lasting 1.5 hours doing the driving lessons, I was never able to last more than 10 minutes.

Nice to see you back in your running gear. Very colourful stuff!
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#76: April 13, 2021, 07:23:26 AM
Hi Milly.

Just Journaling

So we will not be having dinner tonight. S18 texted me yesterday afternoon from an airport as his mother has them all now in Florida. IDK if this is a vacation or a fleeing situation since she sprung it to him last minute. He doesn't know himself.

I have repeatedly warned him not to get on a plane with her so maybe this will serve as a life lesson for him if she does not return him. S18 attends school online and his mom works from home, hence the reason behind one of her new phones, so it could be an extended stay.

On a positive side there really is no space for family to house them so xW would have to have her own apartment. She most likely received $4200 in stimulus money for the pandemic that just keeps on giving to some.

She went on vacation over Thanksgiving to Florida also with stimulus money while sicking her attorney on me to pay high school tuition.

As I dropped S18 off on Sunday night I saw S20 and was thinking to myself how I need to get S18 away from him. That will be his future if he stays with both S20 and his mom. He will be 21 in a month with no job, no college, and no future. His mother's constant companion. Meanwhile he is probably close to weighing 300lbs which is clearly unhealthy for him.

So there is nothing for me to do but just monitor the situation. This is why the house will be sold before I put money out on anything. I need to free myself first and I will not enable this situation any further with high school graduation nonsense and college beforehand. The complete eradication of this horrendous individual from my life will absolutely come first. I will not bend on my quest for complete freedom.

I will not overcompensate because my son's choose to live with their deadbeat disordered mother. Today the water at the house is scheduled to be turned off.

So be careful what you wish for when wanting them so badly to come back. Mine can stay away for life. I don't have pleasant thoughts of her anymore and really wish karma would bite her, however, I think some people just getaway with it.

Enjoy your day everyone
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#77: April 13, 2021, 07:33:47 AM
Just a thought or two....

#1 - who is taking care of the dog and where?
#2 - if there is no one in the house, can you get the sale process underway? She has left the premises with no information so, based on her history, one could validly expect her to have done a runner with no intention of returning in the near future.

She has also, in fact, violated the visitation order unless I miss my guess.... I figure that you probably don't have a key to get in though, right?

UM
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#78: April 13, 2021, 09:59:31 AM
I'm very very sorry, Watcher. I hope your son stays in touch and lets you know what is going on.
I'm guessing that as your son is now 18, your legal ground is less solid?
What does your L say about sons and house etc?
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#79: April 13, 2021, 12:39:03 PM
Hi UrsaMajor, Treasur.

Well xW just left me a text message. The boys will be on vacation for 2 weeks and S18 will contact me when they are done. She figured I needed a break. Period. She is just covering herself.

Well unfortunately for S18 I will not be resuming the parenting schedule when he returns. I will not be a pawn in her game any further nor will I continually have the 2 boys yanked in and out from my life. She can have them. 
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#80: April 13, 2021, 02:06:18 PM
Do you think she arranged dog care? Someone who ignores water bills may not be paying for kennel fees:( Do you have the legal right to enter the home as you are an owner and they are not there? If so, you might have a clear idea if she has abandoned it. If so, maybe get it sold as is pronto. If she is going to ignore the custody agreement now that S is 18, it relieves you of holding to it as well and by that I mean that S18 could come live with you and not go back and forth to visit her. There´s a possibility  that if he comes to you, S20 may also make his way over.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#81: April 13, 2021, 03:50:27 PM
Oh Watcher, I'm so sorry. I think everyone has already given you good advice regarding the house.

The boys, though, they did not choose this nor have they any power against their abusive mother. I know you didn't mean it when you say you won't be restarting the parenting schedule.

When you see your boys, you are not a pawn in anyone's game. Your boys need you. Go back and read the progress they've both been making since you were allowed to re-enter their lives. It takes years of repetition at school for kids to learn any subject, it will likely take more than a few months for them to learn how to trust and have the courage to make their own decisions.

They are the pawns in your wife's game. I wouldn't be surprised that they are secretly hoping you're going to make a stand and turn up to see them the minute they return.

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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#82: April 13, 2021, 04:22:11 PM
We have all gone through different scenarios.  I know we have all gone through horrible and confusing times with our selfish MLCer's, but some have gone though very extreme mental, emotional and physical abuse by our X's for years.  It takes it's toll.  The level of violence and control is huge and intimidating.

Sometimes there is no fixing it, no matter how hard we try.  All we can do is save ourselves.

Watcher has been one of these people. (sorry Watcher)
He is finally climbing out of the pit slowly and doing good, only to have another hit from his abuser.  Take his boys away just when he is reconnecting with them again. 

It just may be his S18 needs to see he has to fight to get away from his abuser, which may take time.  He knows his dad is there for him, right now his fear of his abuser it stronger than his trust in his father.

His S20 is completely lost in the abuse and control, but I don't believe his S18 is yet.
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« Last Edit: April 13, 2021, 04:23:31 PM by Thunder »
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#83: April 13, 2021, 07:54:25 PM
I'm not sure what way to put this.
I'm shocked but not surprised? Or I'm surprised but not shocked?

There is no predicting what someone without a conscience or moral compass will do.

Just remember Watcher this isn't an mlc. She's crossed over beyond that.

The abuser is trying to inflict as much pain as possible. Provoke anger in you. Undo all and any good you have done for and with these kids.

These people are spiritually bankrupt. Not an excuse.

I tend to agree with Thunder. These boys are probably going to have to stand up to her in order for you to have any relationship with them.
S18 I really think is going to be more inclined to contact you.

It's going to take a great deal of courage on his part.

As for you, all I can say is: be still.  Breathe. Rant here or wherever else it's safe to do so.

Give the abuser nothing. Not even a return text. Nothing.
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« Last Edit: April 13, 2021, 07:59:53 PM by in it »
There are two ways of spreading light:
Be the candle; or the mirror that reflects it

Don't ask why someone is still hurting you; ask why you keep letting them.

At some point you have to get sick of going through the same sh!t.

Women are NOT rehabilitation centers for badly raised men. It is not your job to fix ,parent, raise or change him.
You want a partner not a project.

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#84: April 13, 2021, 09:32:42 PM
Ah, Watcher, you’re an old hand so rule of 3 and breathe. You know.....respond not react etc etc,

Abusers win if they provoke us to react against our best interests or goals inho. So don’t do that. As in it says, ignore her. Get your L to get the outstanding stuff finished like the house, but ignore her.

Act ‘as if’ with your son, the youngest anyway. Text him when you would normally see him. Maybe a picture from a hike or run? And then show up for the next Tuesday if they return....(bc your xw is bonkers so who knows, sorry). And then imho you need to have a blunt-ish convo with your son about coming to live with you or what he needs to do if he wants to see you to not be controlled....

Don’t give up on them, Watcher. They have been living in your xw’s Crazyland for years now. And after all, how can you expect more courage and manly smarts from them than you are prepared to find yourself?

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« Last Edit: April 13, 2021, 09:35:39 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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#85: April 14, 2021, 01:03:08 AM
I agree with Treasur here....

When xW1 was at her worst, I dropped the ball for my D(now 30) and that is something that I regret to this day. I let mom have her because to do otherwise was opening myself to xW1's Monster abuse. For me, it was a good decision but for D(now 30) it was and remains a catastrophe. D30 has the emotional maturity of an 18 year old on a good day, is grossly overweight (as a "protection mechanism" against having to feel emotions), and sees no reason to get involved in any relationships more than casual friends with anyone..... Our contact is beginning (finally) to improve but it is still one-way (me to her) rather than an adult mutual R.... 

Looking back, if I had been able to remain in contact in SOME fashion with D30, just to let her know I was there and in her corner, I think (and hope) that her life would be much different than it is today and the R I have with her would also be better...

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#86: April 14, 2021, 08:35:27 AM
Hi FTT, Milly, Thunder, Init, UrsaMajor, Treasur.

Well I do not reply to any of her texts because I know she craves a reaction. She wants payback for my filing for divorce and the only way to discard me again is through the 2 boys since I won't play. The disordered need to win and the serving of divorce papers was a great humiliation for her because she views me as property.

I was not on the forum in 2015 when she ran to Florida. This is how it began. Like she texted me yesterday, "oh the kids will be on vacation for 2 weeks". Soon it will be, "oh we decided to stay another week", then another week. At some point she might say something like, "hey your son's need money to get home".

She is letting me know that she is in control. She will even tell S18 to contact me when he returns. Like why would he just not do so on his own. So I guess she does not know that S18 already texted me on Monday to let me know he was going to Florida.

I do have to say though, I love when S18 refers to her as "she", as in, she planned a surprise trip to Florida. xW did not tell me where they were vacationing. That is also from her 2015 playbook. Keep the other parent guessing.

I went by the house this morning and it looks like no one is there taking care of animals. I will drive by once at night to see if any lights are on. If it remains dark then the pets are either being watched by a friend or they are with her.

Her car was not home so I guess she could have drove, left it at the airport, or let the animal sitter use it, if there is an animal sitter. The disordered don't have timers on house lights nor do they pay to have their pets dropped off at a pet care facility.

I have no keys for the house and I don't believe I really would enter it even if I had keys without some legal permission first. I may own the house but its her residence legally.

So we will see what happens.

Enjoy your day everyone

Thanks
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#87: April 14, 2021, 08:02:39 PM
Well that just stinks Watcher. My heart feels so sad for you and the boys having to jump through all her disordered hoops 24/7.
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#88: April 15, 2021, 02:04:24 AM
If she follows the same scenario, then, after the first "We decided to stay another week" message, the only contact that you wish to be looking at is to your lawyer. Let her swing in the wind and whack her like a bad Piñata. 

As far as S(now18) goes, yeah, he is technically an adult so that is a bit out of your sphere of influence but the sale of the house (which was supposed to be underway by now) is now on hold until she decides to come back and THAT is contempt of court. If she were still in the house, it might be different (queue the "pity party" complete with crocodile tears) but she has decided to go on a "holiday" and that would not sit well with a judge I don't think, especially when she has not adhered to her part of the MSA...

You might want to text S18 to see what's up with the dog just to make sure that the dog is actually being taken care of...
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« Last Edit: April 15, 2021, 02:05:25 AM by UrsaMajor »
Me - 58, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 14, D - 10
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

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A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#89: April 15, 2021, 08:03:56 AM
Hi UrsaMajor, Dumbfounded.

Well I drove by the house after the gym yesterday just to get a visual of the property. Last night I drove by after work and the house was completely dark. However, the storm door was not closed properly. That stood out. Thats why you have to go initially just to establish a base visual and then look for any deviations on the 2nd drive by.  ;)

So that led me this morning to drive by #3 with her car sitting in the driveway, for the first visual, and someone inside the home as windows were open. So one of her gf's must be taking care of the pets and there is no need for me to look any further.

Now if S18 does return home then it will be 100% on him to re-establish contact with me since both he and his mother have broken the parenting schedule. Meanwhile, I really don't believe we can go back to it now as it had been since it was broken and my time was discarded and disregarded.

Tuesday I felt caged at work as that was the day I received her text. Yesterday morning I was able to attend Kickboxing so I will just fall back into my life now and there should be no problems.

I do not have to put my life on hold for anyone and this is not a simple just get over it moment. So we shall see.

Enjoy your day everyone

Thanks
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#90: April 15, 2021, 12:12:13 PM
S18 doesn't realize HE broke the visitation, because he was swept up along with his mother. Consider that both of your boys are emotionally stunted. As a suggestion, you might tell him that you feel the visitation was broken and disregarded (everything on the table and in the open) and that if he wants to continue to hang with you he will need to contact you to set up whatever times he is comfortable with. That now that he is an adult, you and he need to have adult conversations around when you see each other. MSA be danged, since he is now an adult. Treat him like one, give him the respect due to anyone, and give him the chance to respect you back.

If I were him, and knew my house was being sold, I'd be terrified. If he was really told at the last  minute they were going to Florida (ostensibly for a visit rather than to scope out a living arrangement), that would be even more terrifying because I'd figure it was a living arrangement visit. But that's how I would feel. I have no idea how he feels about it.

S18 did a great job hiking along with you to the scary places. I'm not sure that sounds like fun, but I bet it was a challenge. ;D
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« Last Edit: April 15, 2021, 12:13:56 PM by OffRoad »
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#91: April 16, 2021, 01:43:15 AM
I'm siding with OR here.

S18 may not have a clue that, now that he is technically (physically) an adult, that he is also responsible for the visitation. He is under HARD mom's thumb and is not really in a position yet to stand up. I would only say to look at how long it took you to really break free of her clutches and consider the fact that a) S18 has been /is still living in the home with her, b) has just reached the age of majority where he has a legal basis to stand up to her machinations and has zero experience with how that works, and c) he is (at least from his perspective) completely dependant on her... He has now JUST begun to experience that you are, in fact, willing and able to engage and support him.

He has been fed the line that you have run away from them at least since the D-Bomb was dropped in her lap , if not before and that is going to take time to counteract.

As OR said, now that he is technically (again, physical age is what counts and not emotional maturity) an adult, it would be advantageous to you to engage with him on that level and develop an adult R based on mutual respect that also shows him that he does have other options outside of cow-towing to mom....

UM
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#92: April 16, 2021, 09:45:36 AM
I agree with OR and UM.  You have been out from under her control for years and look how long it has taken you to get your head screwed on straight.

These boys have NEVER been out from under her control. They know nothing else. No other way of living or being. S18 doesn't know how to drive or handle money or make money. He was just at the very beginning of learning about these things with you. I can only imagine how unsettling that was for a person who wants total control over someone.  So, she pulled the plug on that.       

These kids need a path out of this mind firetruckery.  I understand that they have to take the path out on their own but someone has to clear it for them so they can see it.   
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#93: April 17, 2021, 07:31:10 AM
Hello,

Yes, you are right that she is punishing you. From my perspective, she is actively trying to hurt you. This isn't MLC; this is war. I really am at a loss of words because of her actions towards you.

If you fight her, you are going to have to go down to her level and it could get real ugly, real fast. You may or may not save the kids. If a trained attorney couldn't figure her out; how is an 18 year old that has lived his entire life under her regime going to fare?

I also agree that the house sale is a necessary step as it removes another obstacle. If she moves to Florida, that makes it harder for her to enforce the MSA. Also, you are in a waiting game with her. No tuition paid, no college acceptance, no obligation on your part. I believe that he has to be enrolled in the fall for continuation of education to be part of the agreement. Am I correct?

That would be a huge break for you and the first step towards becoming free of her once and for all.

Other than that, I really have not much to add, you are in a tough situation and unfortunately, so are your sons.

Have a good day,

(((((Ready)))))

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#94: April 17, 2021, 01:52:58 PM
Oh Readytofixmyselffirst,

Your utilizing the wrong forum frequency. Don't you remember the special program Sir Osis and UrsaMajor installed where men can talk freely without so many female eyes watching. Remember its ##?$?##, ##?$?##. Don't you remember how the women were told the forum was experiencing "technical difficulties" last year.

Whew that was a close one UrsaMajor. No worries, I explained everything to Readytofixmyselffirst on the Dark Hero Spouse Forum.  ::)

debug ##?$?##
debug ##?$?##
run program //:normal
Normal Hero Spouse //:run

Hi Dumbfounded, OffRoad, Readytofixmyselffirst, UrsaMajor.

Yea I ran this morning. So I went to the beach where it was nice and sunny and the temps were fine at 48 degrees with 12 mph winds which is fine for running. It grew cloudy and cold afterwards.

I ran 9.3 miles which brought my 2021 totals up to 83 miles I believe. My 289 mile challenge doesn't begin until April 25th so I'm taking it relatively easy at the moment. I went to Kickboxing last night and I have an appointment again tomorrow morning.

I'm off form work this weekend and this was my free weekend anyway. Afterwards I drove to the Nike Outlet to exchange a pair of pants for S18 which I can only do on the weekend.

Covid restrictions had a line of about 25-30 people waiting outdoors and it was a bit cold by that point as I was still in my running attire. S18 took off the tags so I thought it would be a problem but I was surprisingly in and out with no problems.

Oh I did order a new heart monitor belt which I use at Kickboxing which collects all sorts of data. I have been wearing the monitor since the pandemic hit for running but it does tend to leave a nasty rope burn on my chest, especially if I'm running 5 days a week. It tends to get worse with the heat and humidity.

So the company has developed a new version where it can still be worn across the chest, on the bicep, or on the wrist. The company claims 95% accuracy if worn on the wrist or bicep compared to 98% across the chest. Well it will save me the rug burn 🔥 while running now.

Its also good to use for swimming as its trying to push me towards completing a trialathon. The beach path was packed today with bicyclists and its still just a tad bit too cold for my taste at the moment.

Yes running is good for me I guess.  ::)

Enjoy your day everyone

Thank you
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#95: April 17, 2021, 02:45:36 PM
Wow! The heart monitor belt is waterproof, too? Glad it fits on the wrist, as that seems more secure in the water to me.

Have you ever tried a Spartan race? Those are quite interesting.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#96: April 18, 2021, 05:03:16 PM
How´s your heart rate variability?
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#97: April 18, 2021, 06:21:13 PM
Hi OffRoad, FTT.

The swimming depth is listed at 10 meters for the new heart monitor. I have looked at Spartan races but that was back in 2019. People do tend to run those with their friends however I would still have to wait for life to return to normal.

Well I checked the last 2 days data. This afternoon I walked at the beach and I ranged from 106 bpm to 130 bpm for about 2 hours.

Kickboxing this morning had me at 130 bpm to 160 bpm for a 45 minute class. I dont go that hard at kickboxing anymore. In 2019 I hit 212 bpm for a 1 hour class but that is the brink of passing out IMO, at least for me. My 2019 bpm were normally in the 180's to low 200's.

Running yesterday 9.3 miles had me ranging at 148 bpm to 176 bpm. I generate better results from running even when it comes to calories.

Kickboxing was my dominant activity in 2019 and the pandemic switched it to running so I'm a little more careful with my legs now. There are a lot of exercises in Kickboxing that I just won't do anymore if I think I might injure an ankle. Meanwhile my leg muscles are usually tired and sore.

I walked 6 miles today just to stretch my hamstrings and walk my sore thighs and calves which surprisingly does work.

The system is color coded with blue being the lowest, followed by green, yellow and red. Running is always a solid yellow. If I have any green then that means I was tired and ran poorly. I can never hit red while running. Maybe if I ran a fast 5K I could but I tend to run for distance.

Kickboxing used to always be yellow/red in 2019 and now I'm more of a blue/green zone.

So I went to the beach today after Kickboxing just to walk as the weather was probably low 60's with wind. I did discover some bunkers that housed artillery pieces and one would think I was actually walking in Normandy.

Yea your post summed it up pretty well Readytofixmyselffirst. My mom mentioned it today but I really have no clue if they are coming back in a week as I stated xW doesn't have to clue me in on anything.

Have a good night

Thanks

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#98: April 23, 2021, 07:47:25 PM
Just journaling

I had a long work week with 2 overnight shifts which I don't like anymore at my age. Five days of Kickboxing in a row until today because I had a 3 hour commute home due to traffic and I couldn't make it in time. So its been a catching up on sleep week since it was disturbed.

I received an email from the employee assistance program today and they let me know about a couple of upcoming divorce seminars which I find odd because I only told HR when I had to have an excuse for adding medical coverage outside of open season.

Anyway I have no interest in attending since my divorce is final. I met this woman in 2015 after BD so her email sort of closes that chapter I guess. She advised me in 2015 to get a divorce so I wonder what she thought when she saw my name again.

Tomorrow is supposed to be close to 70 degrees and rain is scheduled for Sunday so I have an appointment for kayaking. I have to start running on Sunday for this 62 day 289 mile challenge so I will give hiking a day off tomorrow.

I also purchased a mountain bike and that was going to be my activity tomorrow but it is not going to be ready. Bicycling is a good way to supplement one's running routine. I'm really going to utilize bicycling as an act of recovery between run days.

Yea IDK how I'm going to figure out the running and Kickboxing schedule yet. Kayaking and bicycling are more leisurely activities for me. They are not workouts.

I had a lackluster gym performance yesterday so its just as well I had a day off today. Anyway the results are usually seen after a day off I've noticed as the body is calm I guess.

I have my work physical in 3 weeks so I really have to get myself prepared now, lol. Its usually clothing optional or maybe thats what the nurse just tell's me, IDK...I just follow the instructions.

Other than that its been quiet and I'm going to bed.

Good night
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« Last Edit: April 23, 2021, 07:49:15 PM by Watcher »

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#99: April 25, 2021, 07:28:20 AM
The weather was beautiful yesterday for kayaking with sun and temps about 70 degrees. This was my first time kayaking in April and the water levels were quite good. I made the reservation the night before, whereas, last Summer I needed a week or 2 in advance, which leaves one at the mercy of Mother Nature.

There were only 3 people on my launch and the guide said she remembered me. Well I think all us masks 😷 look the same. More likely I stand out because I am solo. Anyway she is an ecologist so she liked to talk about plants and trees a lot for some reason. Yep she certainly had an interest in trees and plants.

I went on the Batsto River which is now my 2nd time and the foliage is just starting to develop so maybe in mid to late May there will be more colorful growth. The turtles were out in abundance sunbathing. The most common I found were the redbelly turtle.

The grasses are just beginning to grow and are still below the water surface but there is a nice clash of color going on underneath the reddish water with the forming green grass. The course was 6 miles and that took me 3.5 hours to complete as I didn't really stop. There was a beautiful white swan as I exited into Batsto Lake.

The guide explained on the way back that restrictions are being eased this year so scheduling an appointment should not be as difficult as last year moving forward.

He was selling me on the Mullica River which I have done twice already and I agreed with him that is the nicer course.

My mountain bike was ready for pick up last night and I will be able to use it on Friday when I'm off from work. I plan on testing that out along the canal.

Today I have a light rain and I have to start this run challenge so we will see how much I can get done over the next 5 days before Friday.

Enjoy your day
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#100: April 27, 2021, 01:42:03 PM
Today was day 3 of the running challenge  bringing me to 16.08 miles and just slightly ahead of the 13.98 mile pace for 3 days. The average run requirement is 4.66 miles per day and it really only becomes a problem when or if I miss a day.

I'm running in the mornings this week and it's still cold meanwhile it usually takes about 5 minutes to shake off all the aches and pains associated with the aging process that we all face.

My new heart rate wrist workout monitor arrived today so I will finally be able to save my chest from more rope burn as its looking pretty bad already after 3 days of running. The only obstacle I see at the moment is finding time to run as I missed a lot of work last year due to the pandemic and easily knocked out this challenge of 289 miles.

So Kickboxing will take a back seat for the moment as I will wear myself out doing both in the morning. I'm off on Friday so I might be able to run in the morning and attend Kickboxing in the evening.

My Saris bike rack also arrived today so I will be able to ride on Friday or Monday as those are my off days. So maybe no Kickboxing on Friday or maybe all 3.

I still have not heard from xW's children as xW, xS18 and xS20 presumably are beginning week 3 now in Florida.

Enjoy your day
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#101: April 28, 2021, 01:31:47 AM
Have you tried sending an SMS to S18?

At least to let him know you are thinking about him and missing your time together?

You might be surprised and get a reply back if Mom hasn't confiscated this phone... Or, if she has (or blocked your number or any of the other BS tricks she has pulled to date), you won't....

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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#102: April 28, 2021, 10:49:57 AM
Watcher, sorry to hear you haven't heard from the boys at all. I would send a message, maybe you already have. My experience, even with my good kid (D) is that they are lazy about communicating when they don't have to. They don't just chat to say how are you.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#103: April 28, 2021, 02:18:06 PM
So can you stop paying the mortgage on the house now if they have done another flit? Or take legal possession of it to sell it as you are paying the mortgage?

I agree with others about texting your youngest son.
But I also think you must be feeling like it is long past time to get a loony rollercoaster-free life. I presume there must be some legal options when one party reneges on the MSA....
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« Last Edit: April 28, 2021, 02:25:37 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#104: April 28, 2021, 08:07:37 PM
“ I still have not heard from xW's children as xW, xS18 and xS20 presumably are beginning week 3 now in Florida.”

I scheduled myself an eye exam after reading this. xS18 and xS20. Really????
Go ahead and call me dense, but I need someone to explain to me just how exactly your CHILDREN who have been in a whirlwind of chaos and dysfunction for YEARS are to blame for anything, and how a man could be upset by his ex-wife and therefore write off his children as ex-children.

You’re the parent. They are the children. They have been in a distressing situation where they’ve had no control for a very, very long time. It’s a parent’s responsibility to make children feel loved, safe and wanted, not vice versa.

Hearing a man with hurt feelings refer to his sons as xS18 and xS20 is frankly bringing tears to my eyes. Sorry if this angers people, but Watcher, your exW has been dysfunctional for a long time and your anger with her should not be offloaded onto your children who didn’t have the benefit of a stable home life. Yes, they may be near adults now, but they were young when this all started and they’ve gone through an awful lot of turmoil. So if you can give a plausible explanation of how your children are responsible for your emotions, I’d love to hear it.
Sorry, I guess I mean your ex-children.  ::)

I’d also love to hear from any parents here who are on board with declaring your children “ex” simply because they lack the ability to handle a dysfunctional situation in a way that you want them to.

I’m sorry, but xS18 and xS20...I’m floored by this display of immaturity and “I’m only your father until my feelings get hurt.”
Unconditional love is what a real parent gives their children. My heart is broken for your sons. Go ahead and call me whatever you want to, but Ffs...
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« Last Edit: April 28, 2021, 08:11:40 PM by Nas »

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#105: April 28, 2021, 09:41:11 PM
Nas is, of course, quite right. I have read some of your posts about meeting up with your sons and thought how very unlike normal teenage/young adult boys their behaviour is. Well, from my limited experience of teenage boys lol. They have undoubtedly been affected by your xw’s dysfunction just as you have, my friend.

Rebuilding a life and straight head after trauma and abuse is not straightforward and takes time, but reaching a point where one can see ones own wood for the trees is part of the process imho. A sense of where to go next that is not defined by it. (I am stumbling along with my own half-formed ‘what now’, Watcher, so I get how hard and slow a path it can be...)


I suspect your ‘ex’ comment was a mix of sardonic humour to minimise it a bit and genuine hurt and frustration. Was it? Or is there more to it than that?

 Is it time, Watcher, to make a plan for what kind of father you are and what kind of home you will set up to offer your sons? Is it time to have a plan that you are committed to which is entirely independent of what others think or do? To make a safe fixed harbour for you and your sons when/if they decide to join you? Or do you already have one?
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« Last Edit: April 28, 2021, 10:02:23 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#106: April 29, 2021, 01:32:23 AM
What seems to be getting lost really quickly is the fact that this recent event would be a huge trigger for any of us. To have one of the biggest events during a BD be replayed at a later date would be very difficult to process. Watcher, having his Xw disappear with his kids without being given a "heads-up" is how his Xw started part of this whole mess years ago. Then to not return after the 2 weeks they were only supposed to be gone? I am sorry, I don't know any of us who wouldn't have a trigger.

With that said, I have been on this forum long enough to have witnessed many a meltdown and rants during those triggers by many LBS. I have certainly posted my own share of them. Many times I don't post them, because quite frankly I know that if I were to sometimes express my FEELINGS in that moment they may or may not be rational, and too many times those words I write might be dissected. And while feedback is good, sometimes we all just need to get the toxic things going on in our heads and hearts out - even when they may or may not be rational or how we in the end behave. They are in fact often reactive.

And when I am ranting and in the midst of a trigger - the last thing I want or need is a whole lot of dissecting and questions about what I am going to do about it. I just need a place to let these feelings go.

I guess my point is - looking a the timing of Watcher's post (and he knows he can tell me to "F-off" if I am speaking out of turn and I won't be upset) - that post about X-kids came on the heels what of should have been his designated night to have dinner with his youngest S, and as we have seen sometimes his eldest. There has to be a lot of anger, frustration and hurt in that mix at the moment.

This is not a post that is to agree or disagree with any of the suggestions. As a parent with kids who have a MLC F determined to really keep pouring on the hurt, I have my opinions and those who know me well, know I will not hesitate to be brutally honest if need be. This is more about perhaps we should all step back and maybe think about our own triggers and realize that before Watcher's words get analyzed and thrown back at him that maybe, just maybe his actions in the past few weeks have shown he loves those boys and might just be dealing with some raw emotions. Feelings that he is expressing in the moment. To the rest of us, they may seem illogical or irrational, but they are his feelings right now.

In my experience, I cannot deal with logic and rational until I have worked through the trigger. I would just kindly suggest that maybe that is what Watcher is trying to do and needs the place to flush those feelings out without being jumped and given a bit of time and space to let the dust settle before he is hit over the head with even well intentioned 2x4's.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#107: April 29, 2021, 04:03:24 AM
Well intentioned 2x4's??  I must have missed those, Mourning.  :-\
Totally out of line for the most part and how were they helpful?

Thank you for your kind words towards a fellow LBS. 

"Do not judge, you do not know what storm I have asked a person to walk through"

- God




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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#108: April 29, 2021, 05:30:35 AM
I think they were well intentioned.. while, I don't think watcher truly meant it.. and I'm sure he loves his boys..maybe take a deeper look at why it was directed at them..
Gosh..divorce wreaks havoc on our kids..

That's a beautiful quote, thunder...
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#109: April 29, 2021, 06:56:09 AM
Very fair point, Mourning and Thunder. Mea culpa.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#110: April 29, 2021, 08:43:30 AM
Quote
Unconditional love is what a real parent gives their children. My heart is broken for your sons. Go ahead and call me whatever you want to, but Ffs...

I'm with you, Nas. It's definitely a trigger for those of us who know what it looks like to have a parent who only conditionally cared for us. We can empathize so deeply with those kids, even having been LBSs. The childhood trauma is still the dominant experience. It caused *me* to have my own crisis, even though I'd done a lot of recovery in my 20s and 30s (so I thought).

Many of us were abused emotionally, psychologically, financially, and even physically by our MLCers. But this place has always been where even on our worst days, we were called out by those who were further on the path if we were side-stepping our healing. I know I am a ton better for Stayed and others (even though I didn't like it at the time) being bold enough to give me the real talk I needed. I know I'm not alone in that. We don't always need validation. Sometimes we need to look at ourselves, and how our words matter. It's a gift to have that reflected, too.

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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#111: April 29, 2021, 09:31:45 AM
"I still have not heard from xW's children as xW, xS18 and xS20 presumably are beginning week 3 now in Florida."

Did no one else see this as an attempt at Watcher's sense of dry humor?

Billyluke you are very wise for a newbie.  You saw through it.   ;)
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« Last Edit: April 29, 2021, 09:33:54 AM by Thunder »
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#112: April 29, 2021, 09:39:56 AM
Hi Watcher,

Well the other day you made a declarative statement about how there had been NC. It was one sentence on the bottom of a GAL post. As a side bar maybe Old Pilot should update his greeting to say that GAL is only reserved for the women on the forum and not men who probably don't even belong on this forum since men are the culprits and women are the victims.

We all secretly know female MLC is a crock of sh!te Watcher. Your former wife was in a bad marriage. Poor thing.

It seems a couple of posters took liberties to claim that you had not contacted your son's and so it began which usually happens here on the forum. Then it went onward to that beating of the dead horse selling of the house, which you never talk about, as your not forcing anyone out of the house. However, let's continue to beat Watcher over the head with it.

Now today your firetrucking Ol' RuggedEndurance, hee haw, hee haw, angry at the woman formerly known as your wife. God forbid if you use the letter x. Oh please point out where Watcher has ever lambasted the woman formerly known as his wife ever. He would love to see the evidence.

So the family is in Florida whereabouts unknown. Watcher only knows because his son told him. Oh sh!te ! You did it again. Hurry up and quickly change that word before cancel culture comes again Watcher. Sorry cancel culture, Watcher meant our son.

Watcher apologizes for refusing to remain on the floor like the b!tch many of you would like him to be. So Watcher would appreciate if you kept your further projection to yourselves and stop attempting to make up sh!te that doesn't exist.

OMG there is an x in the word exist. Holy Sh!te ! Maybe they won't notice Watcher. If Watcher's phone had a middle finger emoji then Watcher would be saluting with both hands.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#113: April 30, 2021, 05:16:04 AM
As a side bar maybe Old Pilot should update his greeting to say that GAL is only reserved for the women on the forum and not men who probably don't even belong on this forum since men are the culprits and women are the victims.
Since I know this was said in jest - its not happening and what I post applies to men and women and certainly no one is suggesting that we do not believe that women can have an MLC
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#114: April 30, 2021, 08:22:50 AM
Hey Watcher. Here to send happy and positive vibes. Sorry you are dealing with all this. Triggers are awful and you have dealt with the worst of the worst. Frankly, as a woman dealing with an MLCer who seems to be forever stuck in crisis, it is nice to read that there are good and kind men still out there (who are NO ONE'S b@tch!)

Anyway, enjoy your running and concerts! By the way, I am now a country music lover. OMG.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#115: April 30, 2021, 10:00:04 AM
Watcher, I rarely post but wanted to send you my support.  Hugs, none of this is easy.  Please keep posting your story.  Posting online has it's good and bad.  We old timers used to say.."take what you need and leave the rest behind".  Just wanted you to know I was thinking about you.  Healing as an LBS is not linear, nor pretty at times.  It's full of ups and downs, hills and valleys and an occasional brick wall.  Hang in there!
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#116: April 30, 2021, 11:22:01 AM
Hey Watcher,

I can hear your anger and frustration. I am sorry that the mother of your boys has taken advantage of the situation  and yet again, hurt you and the boys.

I am a woman and I love my children dearly, not only that, when my h. left, he left the children with me. I was in pieces and not in a good place, I found myself pandering to them, allowing them to get away with things because it was just too hard to be the tough mom. As I gradually found my feet again, I tried to regain the reins, that didn't work too well. I had to learn to have a few simple boundaries appropriate for their age (late teens) and love them well, even if I didn't quite agree with the choices they were making.

One of my big lessons was to never slander/attack their father, I learnt to uphold him in their presence, I distanced myself from his behavior, I refused to be put in the middle, and I refused to allow them to be put in the middle. When their father attempted to do that (as most MLCers do), I would contact him myself and tell him that was not acceptable. He was obliged to deal with me and not use the kids as go betweens. The kids didn't like that either, they lost some of their traction. They couldn't manipulate me anymore and I would not give them fodder to shoot at their dad.

This is just my experience - I understand your frustration, you have been very badly used by your former wife. I know that children love/need/want both parents. As you know, our son died suddenly in his sleep at the age of 25, it is a loss we never recover from, so I do encourage you to get over these obstacles and rebuild an honest, affectionate relationship with both your sons. Do your best to cut all financial ties with your former wife   and anything you do financially in the future with your sons, be ready to pick up the whole tab. I had to do that, and this son who died, I never had the means to send him to college, fortunately, my sister in law was able to put him through his first couple of years. The other two managed to get into public (free) universities. They all had to work to have spending money.

They had their share of teenage angst, anger, rebellion, hard headedness, deceitfulness, etc... ;)  - nowadays, the two of them are very close to me and they are supportive of their father who is not very well off, they do their best to help him out, they have very little to do with ow. Both have jobs and are independent.

Watcher, I hope you can get some peace from all this running through your head.



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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#117: May 01, 2021, 08:16:22 PM
“ I still have not heard from xW's children as xW, xS18 and xS20 presumably are beginning week 3 now in Florida.”

I scheduled myself an eye exam after reading this xS18 and xS20. Really????
Go ahead and call me dense, but I need someone to explain to me just how exactly your CHILDREN who have been in a whirlwind of chaos and dysfunction for YEARS are to blame for anything, and how a man could be upset by his ex-wife and therefore write off his children as ex-children.

You’re the parent. They are the children. They have been in a distressing situation where they’ve had no control for a very, very long time. It’s a parent’s responsibility to make children feel loved, safe and wanted, not vice versa.

Hearing a man with hurt feelings refer to his sons as xS18 and xS20 is frankly bringing tears to my eyes. Sorry if this angers people, but Watcher, your exW has been dysfunctional for a long time and your anger with her should not be offloaded onto your children who didn’t have the benefit of a stable home life. Yes, they may be near adults now, but they were young when this all started and they’ve gone through an awful lot of turmoil. So if you can give a plausible explanation of how your children are responsible for your emotions, I’d love to hear it.
Sorry, I guess I mean your ex-children.  ::)

I’d also love to hear from any parents here who are on board with declaring your children “ex” simply because they lack the ability to handle a dysfunctional situation in a way that you want them to.

I’m sorry, but xS18 and xS20...I’m floored by this display of immaturity and “I’m only your father until my feelings get hurt.”
Unconditional love is what a real parent gives their children. My heart is broken for your sons. Go ahead and call me whatever you want to, but Ffs...
I should schedule an eye exam after reading this post.   Did I really read what I just read?  A judgemental, antagonistic, unnecessarily harsh, and outright insulting reply to Watcher’s post?  Not a single positive word.  Not one. 

You have made some incredible accusations based on absolutely nothing.  For example:
1. I won’t call you dense or by any other disrespectful name, but when has Watcher ever blamed his kids for anything?   And when has he said he has written off his children?  Oh,,by saying they are x-sons?  And for you that’s all the proof you need that he wrote off his sons?   The overwhelming evidence to the contrary in Watchers posts over the years should strongly suggest you have misunderstood his single sentence at the end of a single post. In all likelihood said sarcastically,,,perhaps to vent a fear that his wife will not rest until he is booted from his kids life for good.     
2.  “ It’s a parent’s responsibility to make children feel loved, safe and wanted, not vice versa”.   Do you actually believe that Watcher has not made his children feel loved, safe, and wanted?  Don’t confuse Watcher with his XW.   
3.  “ your exW has been dysfunctional for a long time and your anger with her should not be offloaded onto your children”.   Your kidding,  right?   Again, when has he offloaded his anger onto his children??
4.  “  So if you can give a plausible explanation of how your children are responsible for your emotions, I’d love to hear it.     Sorry, I guess I mean your ex-children.  ::)”.   So snarky and so unnecessary.   I’d like to see you explain why you think Watcher believes his children are responsible for his emotions. 
5. “ I’d also love to hear from any parents here who are on board with declaring your children “ex” simply because they lack the ability to handle a dysfunctional situation in a way that you want them to”.   Unbelievable.  Do you not see how incredibly insulting this is?  To rally the troops to go on the offensive as you have?

Why do you think Watcher needs to defend or explain anything to you when you have done nothing but unnecessarily and mercilessly attack him.  He vented in the smallest way his devastation at losing his kids again but never has he indicated that he has blamed, not loved, or held his kids responsible for his situation.   Nor has he ever said such things directly to them.  If you were triggered by what he said, stop and think that through before you come charging out with guns a-blazing.  He is not responsible for your feelings or reactions no matter how triggered you were.   YOU are responsible.  Your reply to Watcher is filled with one wrong assumption after another.  Watcher’s response to your attack was quite appropriate.   I hope he returns and keeps sharing his journey here. But,,the HS forum may no longer feel like a safe place for him, which is quite understandable unfortunately.   

Finally, what was your intention in posting.  What did you hope to gain?   There is not one single helpful, instructive, or compassionate word in your entire post.   Not one.   Which leaves me with no other conclusion but that you intended to attack and shame without asking even a single question in case you misunderstood.     



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« Last Edit: May 01, 2021, 09:13:29 PM by Anon »

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#118: May 01, 2021, 11:44:22 PM
I’m not here to defend or explain the words used by the original poster; she is entirely capable of doing that for herself if she wishes to do so. The same is true for Watcher, of course.

But I do want to respond on the wider principle of the ‘norm’ for the HS forum as opposed to the specific one bc I think this is an issue that occasionally bubbles up.
This is just my opinion based on my perspective from where I have been and where I am. As Acorn would say, sample of one.

Imho, HS is a place to sometimes vent emotion that has no place to go or feel heard in RL. Often that emotion is entirely understandable and recognisable to others here who have walked in similar shoes. We understand in our bones how life saving (or sanity saving at least) it can be to feel heard and validated without our feelings being judged, so it draws many of us to respond in that way in support. Again imho, that feeling of being heard is an invaluable part of what HS does. Certainly it did for me.

And I think we would all accept that posters - and their emotions or need to vent - evolve over time. That we sometimes post things we feel at the time but no longer feel later. That our emotions evolve and shift as we navigate our circumstances. That there is a difference in how we might respond to a new shell-shocked poster vs a poster who is a few years along the path as Watcher is or I am. Or in situations that are more or less similar to our own experience when our own filters may be at play. That as posters, and responders, we may sometimes use words that don’t quite hit the spot. Or hit it at a time when the venter can’t use it as it was as intended. Certainly I did.

But again imho, there is a difference between judgement (in the sense of evaluation) and discernment (in the sense of seeing things from an outsiders viewpoint). There is a risk in wanting to validate someone’s emotions in support so much that we hold back from being able to offer someone other options to consider or challenging them to reflect on their own choices. One of the great services that HS often offers is a version of the rule of 3....when we acknowledge how people feel AND encourage them to consider actions that are not entirely shaped by how they feel....when we see patterns or looming bear pits for a long time poster who we feel we know a little and who matters to us. When we can offer our discernment or see that how someone frames a situation may be understandable but not necessarily helpful. That sometimes we need to be careful about how we talk to ourselves bc a bit of us might be listening lol. That wood for the trees thing  :) where many of us have been lost or stuck in a loop or limbo that hurts. Certainly I was.

I am profoundly grateful for every HS poster who held me with love and care when I could not hold my own exploded bits together. I am equally grateful for every HS poster who challenged me to see other ways forward when I felt too stuck to use them, who gave me things to try even if they didn’t quite work for me, bc these folks also gave me the kind of hope that comes from seeing a glimmer that might be a way out of living in tremendous pain and confusion and exhausted despair.

Sometimes it really does take a village, doesn't It? And the diverse voices of the villagers; different voices for different times perhaps.

Jmo.
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« Last Edit: May 02, 2021, 12:48:06 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#119: May 02, 2021, 06:47:41 AM
Treasur thank you again for a very thoughtful and on the point post. I have been sitting here trying to formulate how to post my thoughts, and you covered most of it.

BUT I still am going to add the following, knowing it may not be received well. Like you said Nas and Watcher are both very capable of speaking for themselves (as is everyone). I will add my voice as someone who didn’t read the “x children” comment as a harmless joke. Yes Watcher has every right to be upset, every right to vent, and this is a place for that. But if someone else has a reaction to his rant their feelings and RIGHT to post that is JUST AS VALID. With that I will say I am shaking my head at Anon’s post. Not because of what it said, but because it engaged in EXACTLY what it accused the other poster of doing. To quote the end of it:

“Finally, what was your intention in posting?”

Why does one poster need an INTENTION to post their reaction but OP can post without any INTENTION? What is the point of that entire post? To shut down one posters reactions while allow another poster to have similar ones?

My more general comment is there is a little bit too much of what I would call “destructive” hand holding here sometimes. It is no ones job to constantly challenge or correct all the posters unhealthy and non productive patterns. But neither is it anyone’s job to constantly act as cheerleader even when people are stuck, raging, controlling, or dare I say delusional sometimes. I want to make clear I am NOT talking about Watcher in the last sentence, that is a more general statement.

As for the on topic post: Watcher I have been quietly reading your thread for a while. I have not gone back to see the entire history, and in no way claim to know the entire hell you have been through. Having said that I did check and it seems you are well over 5 years into this nightmare. Your son’s are 18 and 20, right? So they are legally and functionally adults. They can choose where they go, with whom they go and why. As much as I can understand your rage I for one will say this from a place of care and concern: its time to address the anger. Its not good for you, and I can not imagine its good for your sons, because no matter how much we “hide” things we really don’t.

Others have said this so I am just repeating: you have every right to be angry, upset and frustrated. We are all here for you, for you to vent and share. But after that you still should do what is best for you and your sons. You can not change the crazy antics of your W, but maybe, just maybe its time you figure out how to handle it and get yourself to a place where it doesn’t impact you so much. Because otherwise what is alternative?

No amount of “oh I understand and you are so right to be angry” posts here can replace that.
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No Kids, 23 years at BD1 (4 years), married 21
First signs of MLC Jan '15
BD 1 Jan '17, BD 2 Mar, Separated Apr, BD 3 May,BD 4 Jun '18
First Sign of Waking up-Dec '17, First Cycle out of MLC Mar '18-Jun ‘18, Second cycle Jul '18-??
Meets OM Jan '17 and acts "in love," admits "in love" Jun '18, asks for divorce Jul '18

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#120: May 02, 2021, 09:22:02 AM
Hi everyone,

This is Brooks Ghost 13. I'm Watcher's sneakers. Usually he only takes me out running once every 2 weeks because he has so many pairs of us. Well someone on the forum must have really annoyed him because he has been running me like a dog now for 8 days straight.

Thanks, my 500 mile shelf life will not last long at this rate.

So Watcher hasnt read his thread yet. He only regret's using the word "many" and instead should have used the term "a few" to describe the people who don't want to see the woman formerly known as his wife held accountable for her behavior meanwhile these same few go out of their way to continuously hold him to some unrealistic standard.

Tomorrow the motion to compel the home sale will be filed as someone continues to reside within the marital home in some fashion.

Tomorrow also starts week 4 of them being in Florida. I know Watcher used a pronoun now to describe his son's. What a thoughtless man.

His S18 texted on Friday that he would be home over the weekend. Well his S18 now texted this morning that it has been pushed back to Tuesday. Well Watcher told his son to enjoy his vacation. I know, I know. What a heartless monster that man. You should see how he treats his poor shoes. I mean, the man runs me on asphalt.

We will see what his attorney says tomorrow regarding the motion to compel the home sale regarding its timeframe. Oh Watcher did contact his attorney on Friday and gave a brief synopsis of what has transpired and his attorney suggested the motion filing.

No worries, this man did not act on his own and sought legal counsel so that the woman formerly known as his wife would be legally protected.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#121: May 02, 2021, 12:46:21 PM
See you few?
 His son really is old enough to send a text and make contact. He can type words  and everything. So that means he can spell and read. He must know how to plug his phone in to recharge at 18 too. Amazing isn't it?

Keep doing what you are doing Watcher.  Feel however you need to feel. You are doing just fine.

Lets get realistic and stop trying to have someone else meet unrealistic standards.
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« Last Edit: May 02, 2021, 01:16:31 PM by in it »
There are two ways of spreading light:
Be the candle; or the mirror that reflects it

Don't ask why someone is still hurting you; ask why you keep letting them.

At some point you have to get sick of going through the same sh!t.

Women are NOT rehabilitation centers for badly raised men. It is not your job to fix ,parent, raise or change him.
You want a partner not a project.

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#122: May 03, 2021, 05:38:20 AM
Oh Watcher's boxers were going to talk today but I thought better about letting them speak. Maybe a future post.

So I talked to my attorney this morning. He asked if she and I have talked about the home sale yet as it would look better if we have discussed matters before I file a motion to force the sale of the home in front of a Judge.

I explained to him that we last talked about the home sale on March 5th as she was asking me for a copy of my mortgage statement for about a week. I explained to her at the time that all the necessary information regarding her potential loan would be found in our MSA.

The attorney doesn't know why she would be asking for my mortgage statement because it has nothing to do with her obtaining her own mortgage.

He would like me to send her an email or text today informing her of the missed deadline and to provide her with 3 local listing agents. He then said to send her a 2nd text or email next week and that would suffice.

He would then follow up with a letter to her and asking for court costs if she did not comply. In other words we need to prove she is not cooperating with the home sale.

I explained my concerns to him both on Friday and this morning. Oh this is where that conscientious parent sh!te is forced upon me. I explained to him that the high school is waiting for the tuition to be paid from my equity. I also stated that the woman formerly known as my wife has not paid any tuition.

However, I further stated that IDK if she has her own arrangement with the school. I then stated the school will not release S18 transcripts without payment therefore he will not be going to college.

He also said I would not be liable if something happened to the other person residing within the home as I am not the one who invited the person in.

I was going for a cohabitation angle with that one to end alimony, lol, however I also told him I shouldn't be paying a mortgage on a home if she is renting it out to someone else.

He asked me if I think she has fled and I said I don't believe yet. I replied she is not going to cooperate with selling the home, she will not pay school tuition, our son will not be in college, and then she will flee IMO.

I also let him know she cooperated with the parenting schedule so its not like I was slamming her.

He says she is going to be difficult to the end.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#123: May 03, 2021, 07:05:54 AM
That´s progress- establish a paper trail. As horrible as the past month has been, it does set precedence for the boys to come live with you and ignore her, so think long game. Once the house is sold, the boys will be forced to make a housing decision and that may fall in your favor.

Watcher, it seems weird when you refer to yourself in the third person, just sayin´.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#124: May 03, 2021, 08:56:58 AM
So I thought the initial email went well as I type from the safety of my tablet now.  ::) I simply stated the March deadline had passed and we now had to agree on a realtor as per the MSA. I listed 3 local realtors and she can also make her own local recommendations. She replied with a generic, sounds great.

Then I went for a run, day 9 in a row, and now she is blowing up my phone. This is why I stay NC with her. She let me know that "we" have a tuition bill and a graduation fee's bill due.

Well I informed her that I already made arrangements with the school for my portion and she just learned she owes 12K. Then I locked my phone as she is going to try and suck me into her vortex now. Listen she will wait for eternity for me to reach out, and when I do, the floodgates are open. I don't trust my phone hence the tablet now.

I have so struggled with this home deal. We are divorced and the matter has to be resolved I believe. She will stay in that house forever. She doesn't want to or cannot manage her own money. Let her goto her attorney and see if they can make some sort of deal. IDK. That's not for me to tell her. I couldn't even tell her how much tuition she owed. I gave her the school total minus what I owe, lol. Hope they know how to subtract in that tunnel.

Look I really don't like talking to her because she is such a screwed up person. I can't be nice nor can I feel sorry for her. The problem is the 2 boys will not leave her and I just enable her behavior if I make a deal on the home. I don't want to be her caretaker. The issue really is S18 will not leave S20 and my oldest is not leaving his mom.

Its not easy throwing your kids out of their home and that's how I feel. Yes I know she caused all of these problems. Maybe I'm relieved we didn't file the motion yet.  So we will see.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#125: May 03, 2021, 09:29:51 AM
Watcher you had the same arrangement my X and I had when we divorced. 

The kids and I would stay in the house until they turned 18 and were out of HS.  That's not unusual.

Only difference is I had to pay the mortgage payment while I was in the house, where as you kept making the mortgage payments for her after she kicked you out.

After my youngest graduated I sold the house and we split the profit from the house.

It was just what happens with a divorce.  No one really wins, but we were fine.
Your X makes $60k a year, she will be fine too.

About your youngest son, you never know where he may decide to live.
I agree the oldest will never leave his mother but your S18 just may see living with her is a dead end for him.
He may surprise you.

Have a good afternoon!
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#126: May 03, 2021, 09:57:37 AM
Quote
Its not easy throwing your kids out of their home and that's how I feel
I’m sorry, Watcher, I imagine that is a hard feeling to feel. Even if you know that the house has to be sold for you to be able to move forward. Even if you know rationally that’s not exactly how it is.. (So, well done on talking to the L and doing what has to be done, particularly as you say when your xw’s responses are so exhaustingly predictable. This s&it is sometimes hard but imho always exhausting,)

What would help you to feel slightly differently about it? Would it make a difference, for example, if you had a new home with you to offer them whether they accept it or not? Or if you could tell them you will put some money from the sale aside for them to use for college or a car or something like that? Don’t know what the solution might be....just throwing some ideas in the air to see what your training shoes think lol. (Not convinced your pants are a useful voice though  :) )
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#127: May 03, 2021, 10:17:01 AM
Sounds like very small thing Watcher but in any other written communication.
It may help for you to put "you or I" or "you and I".
Two totally separate people.

This "we" stuff is no more.

Even refrain from saying "our kids".
You can refer to them by name or a general "the kids."

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There are two ways of spreading light:
Be the candle; or the mirror that reflects it

Don't ask why someone is still hurting you; ask why you keep letting them.

At some point you have to get sick of going through the same sh!t.

Women are NOT rehabilitation centers for badly raised men. It is not your job to fix ,parent, raise or change him.
You want a partner not a project.

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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#128: May 03, 2021, 02:29:08 PM
You are not throwing them out of the house. She has known about the move for a long time AND she agreed to it in a legally binding document. You are not the controller here; the document that was agreed upon by BOTH parties is dictating what happens. Her surprise in "finding out" that she owes tuition is a joke. Of course she knew she had part of the bill. Seems that part of you is still trying to act in a rational manner with an irrational person.

It may come down to S18 having to choose between living with you or going to Florida- if that is what she opts for. If he does go with her, try not to take it as a blow to the heart b/c he would be going away to school anyway quite soon. I get that he wants to protect his sibling, but at some point he´s got to put his own future first. He cannot save his brother from depression and it´s not his responsibility to push him into treatment. I have the sense that he will put his interests as a priority and that entails casting his lot with you. Even when you pay your share of tuition there is no guarantee that your ex will pony up her share, so your payment may solve nothing other than clearing your slate. The Serenity Prayer or Radical Acceptance might be your best bet.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#129: May 03, 2021, 04:06:10 PM
Hi everyone,

So like I said earlier I sent the text, because IDK her email, and she replied with that generic pop up bubble answer, sounds good. Then I went running and she texted me afterwards regarding school tuition. Afterwards I placed her back on mute basically and her messages went to a folder.

There are some things I have to reply to moving forward but not everything and I don't need to see her messages constantly. So the folder works as its out of sight out of mind unless I check it.

So she sent me more texts and told me how she will do anything for S18 and he wants to goto school in New Jersey which is basically where we live. So her manipulation is spinning IMO.

I heard the same exact line in 2015 when they were in Florida except it was S20 at the time and he so desperately wanted to goto high school in New Jersey. Neither boy wants to live in Florida. That is her problem so she will sacrifice her happiness for her sons. Thats really Narc code for Watcher to sacrifice his happiness not her.

She also gave me permission to take S18 on vacation wherever I wanted to go which was real nice of her.  ::) She has now pushed their return to Thursday. I'm not really concerned about their return date at the moment and I'm sure it will change again.

Meanwhile she had nothing to add in regards to the realtor.

I did run this morning on day 9 of this challenge and have accumulated 46.54 miles and I am ahead of the 41.94 mile pace for 9 days. The daily pace is 4.66 miles so I'm just running a little over 5 miles a day. Once I take a day off then I will begin to fall behind.

Last Friday ,I believe, it was real windy but sunny and 80 degrees. All of a sudden the skies grew dark and it began to hail sideways which was interesting. Well I hit the red zone on my heart monitor for the first time as I was running for my life back to my car.

I did give those complaining Brooks Ghost 13 a day off today. Tonight I went to Kickboxing because I was off today.

You know. I know how to be married. I don't know how to be divorced. I know I'm fighting myself. In both scenarios I'm expected to provide in the same exact role but I question what divorce has given me. Yea thats what I think about at Kickboxing.

I used to visit the boys at the house for years because I couldn't get them to leave it. Our only outside interaction was the school bus stop for years. I visited S18 at band performances until covid derailed that for us.

I was enjoying the 17 weeks of interaction with both son's but she has sort of set us back once again. I know what I have to do. I just dont like that I'm in this situation.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#130: May 03, 2021, 05:19:48 PM
Since she did not need permission to take them to FL, doesn´t seem likely that you need permission to take them on vacation. Oh she´s a hot mess. If S18 has a savior bent, counseling could alleviate him of that burden. You ARE ahead with the divorce behind you as as soon as the house sells, you are no longer beholden to communication with her. Not your circus, not your monkeys.
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#131: May 03, 2021, 05:59:56 PM
Oh Watcher I can so relate to what you said.

Those of us who had been married 20/30 years... how do we go from being married for so much of our life to being divorced?  How do we adjust to that?

It's very hard and very foreign to us.  It's not anything we would have chosen to have to deal with, but here we are.

I suppose it just takes time...maybe a lot of time to heal from.  Like any traumatic event we go though.

I do think sometimes a person can benefit from some kind of trauma therapy for awhile to get one through this, and there should be no shame in that. I don't believe a regular IC has the training for this.
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#132: May 03, 2021, 07:43:04 PM
How is your new heart meter wristlet working out? Is it better, worse, or just a different thing?

You said:
You know. I know how to be married. I don't know how to be divorced. I know I'm fighting myself. In both scenarios I'm expected to provide in the same exact role but I question what divorce has given me. Yea thats what I think about at Kickboxing.
I don't think I understand, and it's OK if anyone else answers me. I didn't expect myself to provide in the same exact role to my XH, but I did expect to do so to my kids, because, hey, not their fault. I didn't really look at it as the divorce "giving" me anything, but I DID take back things for myself. Like your kickboxing is for you, and your running and hiking are for you. What I'm trying to understand is whether someone else expected you to provide in the same role for your XW, which you were not beholden to do but you felt like you should, or whether you expected you to provide in the same exact role? Are you saying that's the role you know, so don't know how to do something different?

I didn't stop taking my son to school (not cheap with the price of gasoline), or paying for his extra curriculars, or paying for my daughter for college, but I sure as heck stopped paying for XH's car insurance, health insurance, doing his laundry, specifically making his meals, etc while he was living here (though if there was enough and he was here, I'd offer what we had). I paid the bills because otherwise they would not get paid. He was a bug in a terrarium.

It's still so fresh for you right now, and there is still more you have to deal with. Are you maybe overwhelmed with not only what there is to do, but what you will do when it is all done?


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#133: May 04, 2021, 01:21:36 AM
Quote from: Watcher
I was enjoying the 17 weeks of interaction with both son's but she has sort of set us back once again. I know what I have to do. I just don't like that I'm in this situation.

Boy can I relate to this!  The situation that we find ourselves in is NOT one that we would choose or want but darned if we don't find ourselves tossed into it anyway, right? Like into a lake with concrete overshoes....  ::)

I know that I am taking a MUCH different tack with S14/D10 and xW2 than I did with xW1 and D30, partly because I am only 20 minutes away (instead of 20 hours) and because my experience with D30 was that we have barely any R now due to the shenanigans of xW1. I also did just about anything and everything to avoid communicating with xW1 because it was either, as you describe, trying to communicate with a vacuum cleaner determined to suck the very life out of me or a rabid Godzilla trying to stomp the life out of me.... D30 paid the price of that and it has taken until recently that we have any sort of R at all.

I hope that both your boys can break free of psycho-mommy and see that you are his best option for the future. S18 though can't save S20 and, as FTT noted, it is not his job to save S20... just like it isn't YOUR job. Being there and available is the best that you can do. S20 will also have to make his own choices as life moves forward and, as a parent, we can only sit by and watch.

When D30 moved to Oregon on her own choice, I was there to offer advice if I was asked and to be supportive (it IS, after all, her life and if she feels better there, then I'm all for it) to the extent I could be (considering I live practically on the other side of the world) and that helped to break down some of the walls....
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#134: May 04, 2021, 03:07:35 AM
I was thinking last night I meant to say I dont know how to communicate now with her since we are divorced and I have been in preferred NC. However, as it was explained to me yesterday by my attorney, her and I need to have communication.

Its been a process. While standing there is always hope so I really didn't have an issue with communication since I was standing.

Then when I filed for divorce I had an attorney who communicated for me. Like when she informed me they were on vacation I could have replied but chose to stay in NC.

For example there are a few items in the MSA that she has to give me but I have not asked her for them yet. So I can't complain if she doesn't give them to me if I don't ask.

That was basically what my attorney was telling me yesterday. Yes we talked about the buyout in late Feb and early March only because she was asking for my mortgage statement.

So I sent the text message to her yesterday knowing that this is now a communication dance as I need to always establish a paper trail for proof just like she does with me.

There is a protocol for selling the home and there are a series of steps that need to be taken before a motion can be filed. For example, my next text reminder to her was not going to be until next Monday just to see which realtor she liked or if she has found one of her own.

I notice this morning she texted me last night asking if I could give her more time to put her buyout together. I replied this morning "yes" because I know there is a protocol and timeframe to be followed.

The court is not going to throw her out of the house. It is going to be an orderly transition and I have to show that I have a history of talking to her about the sale etc....

I would prefer to never speak to her again as its just a weird feeling to deal with such an indifferent person.

And yes it is absolutely a different feeling when you have been thrown out of your family. Remember I was not just thrown out of a marriage. I was stripped from being a father and alienated. Even under normal circumstances its not going to be the same feeling for the parent or spouse who has to leave the marriage/house/family so I don't have to be perfect while posting.

Some people have to deal with multiple traumas after BD that are more than just losing a spouse. Some people are forced to leave their homes, I'm not the only one, some people are alienated from their children, like me, some people even have to give up their pets.

Then a crazy attorney says one day that you have to communicate with the person who caused all your pain and suffering like nothing ever happened, lol.
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#135: May 04, 2021, 04:35:29 AM
Yes, the legal process has its own ‘rules,, sure enough. Tbh unravelling oneself from an old life is just not easy is it?

How much ‘more time’ are you able/prepared to give her, Watcher? (I’m assuming that your xw would take as much as you’d give, years probably  ::) ) iirc some practical things are contingent on the sale so you can’t do x or y until you no longer own part of the house? Or do you need your share of the money? Or just not being liable for the mortgage? Or is it just messy unfinished business that doesn't practically prevent you from moving forward with plans of your own?

We do get it, Watcher - it is one hell of a trauma to have a spouse take a flamethrower to so much of your life and to find oneself often pretty powerless to do much about it. I think I have said before that - whatever the reasons - I often see your xw as a spider with a big self-serving web wrapped around you and your sons. And I guess figuring out what you need to cut yourself free from the web just takes time and a bit of trial and error once you decide that you want to be free of it. Perhaps NC limits the damage from extra threads or abuse but doesn’t necessarily free us from the web? Idk.
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« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 04:49:32 AM by Treasur »
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#136: May 04, 2021, 05:23:08 AM
Hi Treasur, FTT, Thunder, UrsaMajor, OffRoad.

I responded this morning with a simple yes to her request for more time and put her back on block status. This way I can look at the folder for messages at night for example or whenever because she will text me all day long if I continue to engage her.

I'm not necessarily giving her a timeframe as I'm more interested in just presenting my attorney with a timeline of my cooperation. The fact that the deadline was March 15th and I didn't contact her until May 3rd should already demonstrate to the court that I am not pushing her out.

Meanwhile I haven't even spoken to my attorney since Dec 23rd so now I have communication open with all the necessary parties as we need to sell this house.

So I will reach out to her in 2 weeks to ask how the refi is going and whether she has found any realtors in our area. This way I just check a box that I am communicating with her. However, I'm sure she will contact me in the interim but at least I will be able to present my attorney with dates and such where we discussed this home issue.

I do not need the equity from the home to find my own place to live. However, the equity is needed to pay the school tuition.

Now the mortgage payment and the support payments are relatively equal. Her mortgage or new rent payment is going to be much higher than her support assistance. So that is why she wants to keep our current arrangement.

I've already been paying the mortgage since BD so I'm already used to making support payments and they are not going to increase once the house is sold.

In a perfect world I would prefer for our son's to remain in NJ where I can continue to have contact with them. So maybe she should go talk to her attorney if she cannot refi the house to see if something can be worked out.

Enjoy your day everyone

Thank you
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#137: May 04, 2021, 06:54:11 AM
Some people have to deal with multiple traumas after BD that are more than just losing a spouse. Some people are forced to leave their homes, I'm not the only one, some people are alienated from their children, like me, some people even have to give up their pets.

Then a crazy attorney says one day that you have to communicate with the person who caused all your pain and suffering like nothing ever happened, lol.

Exactly.... and have to do it in a way that shows the entire world that WE are NOT the sick, dumb, bad, and crazy person the Mid-Lifer has made us out to be.... Meanwhile still taking the hits from the poisonous Mid-Lifer spew...
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#138: May 04, 2021, 09:37:51 AM
That all makes perfect sense, now I get it. As long as you lay everything on the table, communication wise, then no one can say you were not reasonable or not trying. But communicating with someone who only cares about their needs and nothing about yours, or even your sons, is extremely difficult and you probably have to use words of one syllable or les, and in excruciating detail, to make it known that you can't pay the tuition until the house sells because you need your half of the equity to pay it. There us an unspoken "therefore, no you will not entertain your XW paying off the house equity to you in payments so she can keep the house" that then might have to be spoken.

Man, do I get that. It took a very AFTER my divorce for xh to sign over the house, even though he was legally bound to do it because I gave up my half of the retirement in exchange. He just stalled and stalled and was such a jerk at the time he finally did it (he wanted to buy his own house and couldn't because he was still on the loan), the people in the bank had the guard move to right next to us.

I hope it all gets worked out soon.
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#139: May 06, 2021, 04:39:42 AM
Ooh now I read all your posts, albeit somewhat fast. So let's stir up the Hero Spouse hornets nest since I have anger issues Marvin, LMAO....

I have anger because xNas was 100 % OUT OF LINE ! PERIOD ! Maybe xNas is the one with the anger issues since she has a history of stirring the pot over the years just like Anjae did for example. There are a few others of that stirring the pot crew who fake outrage for attention and publicly announce they are leaving the forum like 1,000 times and always come back.

So if or when ShockSis ever comes back then it will be open season on her because I have kept my opinion to myself to date. I will use the Hero Spouse 2×4 which is a code word for abusers. Oh please tell us more about yourself newbies so some of us can whack you over the head with it on a future date.

Or we can delve into the subject of standers, mostly male, who like to date but are keeping the door open for their spouse, just in case you know, because some of us just can't keep it in our pants  ;), lol. Those are my favorites.

I'm sorry. I was already married to a woman who dumped her childhood trauma onto me and no one here has that right to do the same.

Furthermore, I no longer have a polite lid and I will swing back now when I am attacked. Maybe some women here can identify with me. Sometimes when women become assertive they are called b!tches ! So maybe ,just maybe, because I finally pushed back, that means I'm angry.

Yep assertive women are called b!tches and assertive men are angry. In reality its called, I'm done taking anyone's sh!te !

So once again I will remind everyone to keep your projections to yourselves. I am not your deadbeat spouse who abandoned you and your children. I am also not anyone's deadbeat parent.

So of course I cannot share today because I will be labeled as being angry and full of rage.

So I hope some of you have a wonderful day today and I hope it rains like a mother firetrucker all day long for others. I'm talking like a Tsunami type of rain that keeps you stuck in the house for days, 😆.
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#140: May 06, 2021, 01:48:19 PM
You don't have anger issues Watcher. Any normally intelligent person would be angry after what you've been through and keep having to deal with.
Anger lets you know when somethings wrong.
If you hold it in it can damage you much worse than expressing it. I understand right where you are coming from.

Sort of glad there was no one I remember telling me there was something wrong with that when I started posting again years ago.  All it was was rant after rant....talk about angry? Whew.

Then I turned into a b!tc#..rather be that than a doormat. 8)
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#141: May 06, 2021, 03:55:53 PM
Hi Old Pilot, WonderNoMore, KIT, Mitzpah, Anon, MourningDove, Init as I failed to acknowledge your posts earlier.

So today they are supposed to be home however she is a pathological liar who just needs to lie for some reason. I haven't asked for anyone to come home nor will I ask anyone to come home.

If my son asks for me to go get him then I will. So far he has not asked. I think she sent a text yesterday morning and its typical roller coaster. It was only 2 days of texts and I was already mentally exhausted on Monday night. She hasn't changed.

Yesterday morning she had a school issue and I will not parent with her. She can send me a bill. So no reply from me. She was asking if I'm seeing S18 this weekend however she tied it into the school issue. Basically she has a problem that she is attempting to dump on me as usual. Oh you can see your son if you take care of this financial problem.

Meanwhile its Mother's Day weekend and she has been in Florida since April 12th. There is no way she is coming home this weekend, lol, and I wouldn't take my son on this weekend anyway even if they did come home. I'm not a mother.

So S18 will contact me when he either comes home or he asks me to launch the rescue mission.

Its been 6 years of the same financial woes. It's a broken record. I'm not being hard on her. I'm just done and I've been done.

The first week was rough but I'm settling back down now into my routine in week 4. Again I will go get him immediately if he says he wants out.

It rained yesterday so I didn't run therefore it was Kickboxing. The traffic has been unbearable lately so no Kickboxing today and I ran instead on day 12 of this challenge. I'm a little over 56 miles and just slightly ahead of the 55 mile pace for 12 days.

It must be getting warmer as I'm finally working my way into the 9 minute territory or I'm just running aggravated.

So we will see what happens the next few days.
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#142: May 06, 2021, 09:55:12 PM
Watcher, I am so sorry for the continued trauma that she is inflicting on your sons and doing her level best to inflict on you. Monstering takes many forms, but I struggle to imagine one more damaging than what she is doing to you and your sons. I hope you are able to find some peace at times during all of this.
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#143: May 07, 2021, 08:18:16 PM
Hi Curiosity.

Well IDK if they will ever escape her. My youngest may tire of it soon if she continues to remain in Florida. People were on me about graduation, driving school, tuition, and I'm sure there are a few more items that I'm forgetting and its all meaningless because she has the control over our son's.

See I realize that and IDK why its still a foreign concept for some including my mom and sister. She opens her mouth and its all lies. Thats why I easily dismiss her.

S18 is going to college in NJ. Oh he will be home Sunday, then Tuesday, then Thursday. Hey are you picking your son up this weekend Watcher. Hey how are we paying for the graduation fees Watcher. Can you pick up the money from me on Friday and then write a check ? Hey we owe tuition money Watcher ?

Do you know how many people on the forum  would have brought up the meaningless MSA ? Some people will not accept that I'm dealing with a criminal mind.

Well their still in Florida which doesn't surprise me as I'm used to her BS. Some would say I refuse to cooperate, lol. The forum likes to speak of establishing boundaries, detachment and not being a doormat until some get upset with you because you no longer are willing too be that doormat.

Oh now I remember her other BS. Senior portraits and Junior class ring for a Senior graduation. Yea let me get on it for the Empress.

Oh you bastard Watcher. How could you not take care of your son's  ? I really love this part because I get to throw it back now on that small minority.

When she did this in 2015 I wanted them back and that was a huge mistake. Now I want her to drown in 2021. I know, so harsh Watcher. I had people on this forum berate me for not keeping the boys in Catholic School as it was a yearly battle with some. The moment I got divorced this same poster lambasted me for not having my own place to live. Hahahaha.

Well who the firetruck paid for the pricey Catholic School, lol. And you wonder why I have been living at my mom's. Hello clueless ! Yea I wish I was mouthy back then but I'm more then willing to settle scores now with a few posters who like to run their mouths.

Right about now someone on the forum is analyzing each sentence to catch me on punctuation or some other meaningless BS. Someone else is wondering why I just can't fly down to Florida and teach S18 how to drive, lol.

I have to put ,lol, or someone will attempt to smear me again and claim I'm angry. Sometimes I have to put Just Journaling and some still don't get it, lol. Yea I had to put ,lol, again.

Today I went running after work and I usually get my funniest ideas while running as I had a really funny post with Lee Harvey Oswald and John Wilkes Boothe but I will let it go. Yea the assasins would actually be posters, lol.

So today was day 13 of running and I'm still ahead of the pace at 61 miles. The Tsunami is coming for me this weekend, lol. Well thats what I get. The hail storm was also sent to me last week while I was running after I had a few choice words with God.

So we will see. It will only take the one wrong person to light the fuse.  ;D

Have a good night
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#144: May 08, 2021, 01:53:59 PM
I was talking with my male co worker yesterday. His BD was in 2013 and he just brought a home with his GF in 2021. He told me how he used to run ultra marathons and now look at the mess he became because of the stress. Yea it looks like his running days were long ago. So he is 43 and she is 31.

So another male co worker says she is going to want to have kids. So that should not be my objective he says as I should stay within my age range, lol. Yea no worries on the more kids front.

I did order an Eric Church concert ticket yesterday for May 2022 and it actually felt good being back on a concert venue site.

I went to Kickboxing this morning and the on and off rain has me hesitant about running. My mom and sister announced they drove by my home. So I just can't escape it. She wants me to take a photo of the 2 feet tall grass for my attorney and mentioned how they were going to drive by at night to see if lights were on.

So I told her to knock it off as I already know whats going on over there and I really don't care to know more. Meanwhile I don't think my attorney will care himself. It is quite comical. She is another person who thinks I can do something here.

xW did announce this morning that they would be home today and I really don't care. It really was a mistake when my attorney asked me to contact her regarding the home sale.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#145: May 08, 2021, 03:56:24 PM
Watcher I don't think the 12 year difference is a problem, but if she wants kids, then it could be.  Hopefully your co-worker has discussed this with his gf before they go any further.  Kids are a big deal. 

In my opinion maybe the best thing would be to give her the 2 weeks to see if she can do the buy out to show you were willing to give her a chance, it's only one more week, but if she doesn't come up with a buy out plan then maybe just file the motion to get the house sold and if she has a problem with it, she can deal with your lawyer, not you.

I think contact with her is not doing you any good, regardless of what you lawyer says.  She is a grand manipulator and an abuser.  She gets no more chances.  The March 15th deadline has come and gone.

I'm sorry your mom is putting pressure on you, she is just being a mom, but she needs to back off now.

Watcher once that house is sold you can get your own place and get some peace back in your life you will feel a huge weight off your shoulders.

Just keep looking at the end game, this will not last forever.
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#146: May 08, 2021, 05:05:24 PM
I agree Watcher the games started all over again because you had to break no contact.

I understand why it had to happen, if my lawyer advised me to do it I would have too. But you've done what you needed to do now, just save all the communication that she sends.

It shows you tried to resolve this and it was not possible. You are being the grown up, shes not.
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Re: BRAND NEW MAN 11
#147: May 08, 2021, 07:02:52 PM
I hope you have documentation of the time window she was in FL as it´s hard to fathom how she was arranging a buyout when she could not meet with folks in NJ to arrange one. This seems like a desperate delay tactic on her part. Has your lawyer explained how you are supposed to sell if she refuses to leave the house? Or if she refuses showings? Can she be locked out in order to satisfy the buyout? Boy, she is pushing this to the farcical range. Do you think it falls into the manipulative arena or that she is over her head and treading water? (Not that you are the one to throw the life preserver.) Seems you are reaching the crescendo of the hot mess and then comes the denouement. I think you can be the safe harbor for your sons without compromising yourself in giving in to your ex. You are way past acting on principle and are in the zone of preserving your finances and sanity.
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#148: May 08, 2021, 07:46:15 PM
Hi Thunder, Init, FTT.

I did discuss my lawyers request with my divorced co worker the other day and he said its normal for the court to want the 2 parties to resolve these issues.

Yes Init she immediately went back to the game playing. Today is day 27 and I heard nothing from S18 on whether he is home or not.

So she broke the parenting schedule ,eventhough I realize he is now 18, however I can't go back to it now. IDK why, I know that I just can't. Its a feeling.

They are the family unit and I am not. Thats what she demonstrated. I'm the outsider. She had someone living in the home and my attorney did have me break NC which opened up my exposure to her nonsense.

I realize I have my walls up but she is such a toxic person and I want no part of it. If the boys are home I have no clue how we reestablish contact. Something happened with me and IDK if I want to expose myself again now.

Its been 6 years of starts and stops and right now the boys and I are at a standstill again. So I have to figure out how I can navigate around their mother if or when they come home.

FTT I believe it's all manipulation. She's been on a 27 day vacation so far so I don't believe she felt she was in over her head until I texted her.

Now when it comes time to actually face the music then she will realize she was in over her head. Yea I don't see how the house is going to be shown. My attorney says once he files a motion the Judge will render a decision in 30 days. He says, in his experience, the person has their oh sh!te moment 3 days before they are going to be removed from the home and they realize they have no place to go.

I think my text shook her a bit. She knows the house has to be sold and she cannot refinance it. So for me its twofold. I don't want to be exposed to her manipulative games and I don't want to see when she actually starts crying for real when she realizes I am going to enforce the sale.

I also think she lives in the current day. She doesn't  look down the road. She was on vacation so she was in her fantasy world.

Yes I want the home sold however I'm not looking forward to the experience. This is going to be my 7th Summer since BD and this has got to be the last one. This has gone on way too long.

Have a good night
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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#149: May 10, 2021, 01:09:04 AM
I agree with you, Watcher. This has gone one WAY more than "long enough."

xW has had MORE than enough chances to get her poo in one sock and get her life together. She has, instead, chosen to keep her head firmly planted up her .... fog.... Well, there are consequences for those actions, whether one wants them or not, accepts them or not.... It is called "adulting," which is what you have been doing for 7 years...

Yes, it will likely be rough on S18 & S20 but you have done what you could within the boundaries she set on their lives (the control, the bad-mouthing, etc.) to make sure that they knew you were there for them but, at some point, they too will have to be active participants and "actors" rather than just spectators if they ever want to get out from under the iron fist....

And, since this is Post #149, you might want to use Post 150 to start a new thread...

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BRAND NEW MAN 11
#150: May 10, 2021, 04:58:20 AM
First of all, Watcher, I want to acknowledge just how very pissed off you feel. With folks here, xw, your l, the legal system, maybe even your sons. Some of your anger has maybe been building up for a long time bc you have been tap dancing around in an emotionally abusive seven year s$itstorm. While being pressured to do x or y by various players (many with female faces) including your own family at times. And you might feel that you got very little that you were trying to achieve no matter what you did right down to a relationship with your sons. I would guess it is possible that you are even angry with yourself sometimes bc of choices you made in the past based on what you thought you knew then.

And it WAS a tremendous level of abuse, Watcher, right from BD. You did well to survive it, my friend, and seemingly have most of your marbles. :) There was nothing normal about your experience and it is not a normal divorce situation; it must feel very frustrating sometimes if you feel that is not acknowledged by others, by the legal system and perhaps most of all here. I’m sorry if anything I have said to you has left you feeling that.

But you are still on the battlefield practically speaking - at least to some extent - and it is hard to recover from abuse, gaslighting, threats and manipulation imho until you can go NC with it. Your xw imho has always seen you as a possession since BD and used your love for your sons as a way to either hurt you or control you. I am not a parent and so I can only imagine how difficult that must be.

I dn’t know what you will decide to do with regard to your sons.
But I do know - or i’m pretty confident I know - that the only way to really heal from abouse and mindf**kery is to surgically remove it from your life. Which means NC with your xw at all about anything. Not money, not adult kids, not her messes, not dogs, not funerals or weddings, not the sky falling in. Complete NC directly and with time hopefully NC at all.Legally speaking, you might not yet be able to do that quite yet.l..but that time will come soon, Watcher. (Although I can’t help but think that many lawyers would have treated some of the issues differently if you were an abused wife....then again, maybe not....the law seems to be very slow on catching up with the reality of this kind of coercive control. I am grateful that my lawyer got it from the off bc she had dealt with it before in a case with rather tragic consequences for the LBS.) You are closer to it now, just as you say. I wish you were already there....if I had a magic wand....and I can’t tell you how different life in my head is now after a couple of years of not only NC but no possible contact. It sucks that healing from this kind of insane abuse takes so frigging long....but it does come and it feels so different when it does. And ironically when it does, the need for such strict NC may even ease a bit depending on circumstances.  ::).....certainly I don’t NEED NC now like I did, I just see no point to having any if that makes sense....bc I ran out of f**ks to give as I started to heal. What happened got smaller as other things in life started to grow bigger. (So NC still works for me but I don’t need the defence of it anymore, I suppose?)

So, vent if it helps.....get cross with us if you want to.....but keep moving forward towards your NC with your abuser day. Those of us who have survived extreme and insane abuse will not be saying you should contact your xw about anything at all......we will virtually high five you every time you find a workaround that helps you stay NC.  :)

We will listen when you shout and cheer you on when you get there. We will hope that one or both of your young adult sons decide to free themselves from the same kind of abusive control and that you are able to rebuild a good relationship with them from a safe solid place.  And some of us here will keep the faith that you WILL get to the life on the other side of WTF even if you doubt it......we want you to have a good happy life, Watcher, bc you matter to us. X

New thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11774.0
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« Last Edit: May 11, 2021, 03:02:44 PM by Thunder »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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