[limitless]

Hello All,

It's been a while since I posted on this forum.  I don't know where my last thread is (probably filed away and locked).

This year will be 13 years since BD (in May).  It all seems such a long time ago.

I read through this thread - and an earlier post asked the LBS when he/she thought that their MCLer's crisis had ended.  Hmmmm.  I don't know that my ex ever completed his crisis.  Maybe he did - when he sent me that long email of apology in 2018/19 for this actions in 2010 and beyond - just before he married OW#1.  I don't know.  I don't see him or hear from him.  If his crisis is over - he is a changed/different man.  Or, his crisis has just become a way of life.

The only things I know are the things that my kids share.

It is such a shame.  The kids.  I don't care how old they are at BD - or how old they are today.  They still suffer.  The relationships (or lack of relationships) that they have with their Dad....what can I say - it's just very sad. 

I am aware that he barely sees them....and when he does - he cannot connect with them.  My ex thinks that his relationship with our son is quite good.  My son just accepts his Dad as he is - and avoids him mostly.  The girls have a harder time.  My oldest - is angry/hurt by the lack of relationship and effort made by her Dad.  My youngest d - the same - except she will confront him. 

My younger D - recently had a heart to heart with her Dad.  She tires of his lack of involvement, interest, etc. in her life.  She told him that she needed him to be more involved with her....needed him to know more about her life....needed him to ask her questions about her life (instead of rambling on and on about himself all the time).  She shared with me the conversation that they had.  I asked if he explained why he didn't ask her about her life.  She replied - I don't care why he doesn't ask.  I want him to ask.  Simple enough.  Then, at dinner he went on again about himself and his life....his work....the shows he liked to watch on TV.  She stared at him.....Don't you want to ask me what I like to watch?  She sighed - telling me that she could see that it was going to be a process - trying to rebuild the relationship that was broken so very long ago.  They agreed to call and talk on the phone with each other weekly.  (He usually will only text).  I guess that's a start.

Also, something must have clicked as he then contacted our oldest d and has set up time for the two of them to have dinner together.  That's different.  He seems to be making an effort. 

He will be 70 years old this year.  I wonder if he realizes that he missed out on 13+ years of their lives?  Maybe he does - at this point?

I only know that my kids deserve better.  They deserve to have a Dad that they can rely on...talk to....be part of their lives.  Hopefully - he has it in him to stick with it.  I wish that for them.

As for me....I retired a year ago (early)....and I would say that for those of you who can - I would highly recommend it.  I don't miss the grind of work.  I like it that everyday is Saturday now....except for Sunday - Sunday is Sunday.  I have ongoing dates with my friends for lunches, mani/pedi, massages, and such.  I'm a member of a local club - where I am part of a middle aged woman's dance group.  We have a choreographer - who teaches us a new routine each year.  I bought myself a bike - and ride on the beach path (at least each week). 

I did some traveling last year - Paris, Italy, Cincinnati, Wisconsin - and a few trips to Vegas.  I plan to do more traveling this year.  I have my black kitty - Freddie (named after Freddie Mercury).  No significant other. 

Life is good.

It's very difficult to imagine myself being married to my Ex.  In the rear view mirror - I would say it's best that our relationship ended.  I wish it could have been under different circumstances...we don't get to chose what wrapping paper our gift arrives in.  And, we don't even have to acknowledge that it was a gift.  But, it was.  It was the gift of freedom.  I only wish that i could re-gift it for my kids - but I can't.

For those of you who are currently suffering and trying to make sense of everything - I am so very sorry that you are going through this.  Unfortunately, there is no skipping - you have to go through it.  If I could wish anything for you - I would wish that you come to the conclusion (sooner vs. later) that life is precious and it is to be enjoyed.  The longer you wallow in your sadness....it is just wasted time.  You can find joy - regardless of what your significant other decides to do with his/her life.

Take care,

L

[UrsaMajor]

Hi Limitless,

Long time, no read!

MLC'ers seem to have a common issue with being able to see past the end of their noses (it's all about  ME ME ME ME ME) and to relate to others, especially their kids. They put an amazing amount of faith in the "Kids are resilient" nonsense and expect that the kids will be just fine with the MLC'er being absent in their lives or totally so self-absorbed (or both) and that is simply just not the case.

Yes, some may (like your S) just accept that the situation is the way it is and avoid the Mid-Lifer. Others confront them, others still have a hard time and stop putting in any effort (and justifiably so - If it hurts to stick a barbecue fork up your nose, stop sticking the barbecue fork up your nose, right?)

Congratulations on early retirement! After my MLCxW did her number on both of our retirement accounts in her D (she got hit worse than I did), early retirement is not in the cards for me... In theory, I can retire in about 7 years at 67 but we'll see how that goes...

Glad to read that your life is on track and you are enjoying it!

[xyzcf]

You can find joy - regardless of what your significant other decides to do with his/her life.

Ah Limitless, you have always been so wise!

I have seen some of your pictures of your travels and dance group. "Retirement" gives us the opportunity to explore so many different things that we didn't have time for before...I am amazed at how busy I am!

I hope that your children continue to connect with their father. That has always been important to me but not all kids and not all MLCers can manage to do that.

COVID, the economy, wars, some health issues ...so many things have taught me to live each day as fully as possible because as we know so well  it can all be gone in a flash.

If your travels bring you up my way stop by.....always room for you and any friends you are traveling with.

[Songanddance]

Limitless - so good to hear from you.

Everything you wrote about the broken relationship with your children and your XH really resonated.  My S will never have a good R with his Dad, he wants so little to do with him.  It is incredibly sad that the MLCer chose self over children and their needs and their dreams and hopes.

I too can vouch for early retirement although I have turned mine into my own freelance business and the beauty is that it is all on my terms. If I don't want to do something I don't have to. I have the luxury of saying NO.

Keep living, keeep dancing and keep in touch!

[Trustandlove]

Hi, L, nice to hear from you!

What you said about children resonates with me as well; it really is sad.  Mine were small when this started, they are now in their mid-20s but the effects are long-reaching.  All 3 struggle in one way or another, it's affected their self-esteem, their own relationships, their outlook on life.  We can say that "kids are resilient" all we want, but I don't think they are.   They continue to need me to be the rock, probably more than many others their age. 

Overall they are doing well; they have all graduated from university, all have good jobs, have good friends, have lives.  But this casts a long shadow.

As to my MLCer; I haven't now seen him for something like 6 years; he sees the children very rarely.  One son just avoids, has the occasional superficial conversation; the other does meet him now and again for a short time but always comes back disappointed, saying "father not being a father", my daughter has probably suffered most, as how her father treats her (and me) has affected her view of how men treat women in general.  She so needs him, but he just isn't there, and indeed has been quite nasty at times.  She went something like 3 years without seeing him at one point, it's been over a  year since the last time now. 

One son so doesn't want to be like him, that he expects unrealistic things of himself.  He will get through this, but it's not easy. 

All have tried to say something over the years, they have given up.

As to his crisis; I have no idea what he is like right, but from what I hear (or see the odd photo somewhere) it seems that his crisis has become a way of life, as you say.  I can't say that I like what little I hear/see. 

But on some level I will admit that I still miss him, I miss the person that was.  My children do as well, although they don't remember much any more, which is also sad. 

My life is also now "normal" -- many joys, normal ups and downs, not much drama, which is good.  Retirement not yet on the horizon, but I'm planning new things to do this year which keeps me going!

I'm glad you have been able to retire and enjoy the next phase of life!

[limitless]

Thanks for all those responses.  Good to hear from you all!

I sometimes wonder if my Ex and my relationship has turned my kids off relationships and marriage.  I know that this new generation isn’t getting married early (like I did) but none of my kids have a significant other - and none is urgent for marriage. 

I hate to think that this is caused by their parents’ story.

I just wish the best for them and, when and if they choose a mate, they will make good choices. 

L

[UrsaMajor]

I sometimes wonder if my Ex and my relationship has turned my kids off relationships and marriage.  I know that this new generation isn’t getting married early (like I did) but none of my kids have a significant other - and none is urgent for marriage. 

I hate to think that this is caused by their parents’ story.

I just wish the best for them and, when and if they choose a mate, they will make good choices. 

Not sure if it is strictly MLC-related but I do have the feeling that they are making their decisions, at least partially, based on their experiences as kids.... My partners kids (S33, D22, S19) are all pretty ... well, let's just say "selective"  in their choice of partners (especially D22) and, if it doesn't fit, they are not afraid to end it and start over. None of them are married and none of them is considering it at the time either...

D22 is currently in a relationship with a fellow physics student who is a really nice guy and who treats her well. Both D22 and her mom (my partner) have said that D22's BF is very similar in many ways to me so  I guess that might be a good thing

S19 is too busy getting his trade school done to really consider a relationship and S33 is on a journey of introspection and getting himself together after ending a short-lived relationship.

[Songanddance]

I sometimes wonder if my Ex and my relationship has turned my kids off relationships and marriage.  I know that this new generation isn’t getting married early (like I did) but none of my kids have a significant other - and none is urgent for marriage

Agree - but then marriage isn't the be all and end all of life.  My oldest D (then 30) married in 2017 and divorced in 2018 because her spouse just "became a different person" and she realised she'd been in love with the idea of marriage and settling down and sweeping all problems under the carpet.  She also realised at the wedding itself that 90% of the friends that attended were his and not hers.  At the wedding!
Now she has worked on herself, she has met a wonderful young man who also believes in self work, mindset and growth and is highly successful in his own field of work. The two of them together are two independently minded individuals who have a very common bond and absolute respect for each other.  They are getting married later this year.
My other D is a single mum and co -parents well with my GD's dad and for the last 3 years has been seeing another man.  She kept it quiet for 2 years not because she didn't want us to know but she only saw him once a fortnight during those 2 years out of choice.  She just isn't interested in  settling down - and she has also started a fabulous self growth journey so a serious relationship with a view to commitment is not for her.  He has 3 children from his previous marriage and his EX is a piece of work (narcissistic, petulant and always brings the children into any argument she has with him) He walked away after she became verbally and emotionally abusive.  My D has made it very clear to him that he has to work on himself before he could ever be ready to have an R with her.

My S believes he sounds like H  anytime he behaves or uses phrases like H used to.  My S has re-written history so much that he believes H abused him both physically and emotionally from a toddler onwards.... I know this isn't true - I just know it.  H adored S so much but sadly S has taught himself the viewpoint that for H to abandon his family when he was a teenager meant that H never loved him and always treated him badly. 
S is also working on himself and is very clear that he has no intention of having a relationship with anyone because he thinks he will destroy them - he wants to heal and he wants to "grow up" his words but until then relationships are off the table.

I really doubt that any of this would have happened if H and I had been more open, honest and whole during our marriage before BD.  If I had learned not to be a people pleaser and conflict avoider....If H had learned to face his teenage trauma ....if, If IF!

So whilst I am sad that my children were messed up, I'm glad that they became courageous enough to learn about their own flaws and human frailties and that they, like me are always learning and growing.  As for H - he's still stuck and probably always will be. 

[OldPilot]

I sometimes wonder if my Ex and my relationship has turned my kids off relationships and marriage.  I know that this new generation isn’t getting married early (like I did) but none of my kids have a significant other - and none is urgent for marriage. 

Your first post was excellent and wise as always.

As far as this one - I thought that I would agree but then  both of my children have married and have given me grandchildren.

So the thing I pray for is that they can stay married.
As we all know that can be a very difficult job and is not a straight and easy path.

[Mitzpah]

Hi everyone!

I hope you are all well, I was attracted to this discussion due to Limitless's observations on how all this has affected the children... I really think it does - my children have had difficulties in their relationships over time. My eldest son recently had a momentaneous break up due to misbehavior on his part - and she discovered in the exact same way I did, which was particularly painful for me. He came home for a couple of weeks and we talked some things over without me getting too involved. I encouraged them to work it out themselves and assured both of them of my love, but that my son needed to take responsibility for his acts. Interestingly, I was so upset at the whole situation that I reached out to his father and he was similarly affected. When they sorted things out, they came to me and told me - of course, I was very happy that they had managed to come to terms and found a way to move forward together - I again reached out to his father expressing my hope that our son would stay the path now and his response was: "he'd better!!! I will make sure he does!"

My daughter is very wary of committing herself to a relationship and she has been hurt frequently. Currently she is in a relationship with someone in Ireland, except they live on opposite sides of Ireland, maybe that is why it works!

It has been 12 years now - yet I still hope and pray for complete restoration - he still lives with OW and her children (I think they live there). He spends Christmas day with us and it is almost like old times, except he goes at the end of the day. I often send pictures of the dog to him - he never initiates communication nowadays, however, he is generally cordial and will ask after my mother (who is living with me) when I send him the pictures.

It is a peaceful life, no strife or arguments. I have a lot to do with my mother living with me, she is an invalid and confined to a wheelchair, armchair and bed - we have 24 hr care - a full time maid. I work full time and rarely have any free time - I continue to be involved with my church community and my nieces live near us at my mother's former house.

I would very much like my husband to come home, I miss someone having my back, I miss the easy intimacy, I miss married life.

I have recently taken in a young dog, in addition to the elderly couple of dogs I inherited from my husband! It is a rescued French Bulldog - he is about 10 months old and a great companion to me - he likes cuddles and follows me around everywhere. The boxer female is a little jealous but because he is a male, she tolerates him The other lady dog doesn't like him very much and has  had "words" with him on occasions 
I can take him out with me, he walks on a leash very well and now they allow small dogs in most places  like malls and even supermarkets. Everybody stops to talk to him and he loves the attention.

I miss you all, life is very busy for me at the moment, not much fun, but very busy and God is good to me.