[AlvinTheMaker]

My oh my, time for my 9th epic. I was originally planning to call this as Last Ride of the Day, but it seems to be turning to Here I Go Again (still using song/music references, LoL). So gather around the campfire and listen of another adventure in land of midlife-something.

Me and my current W went to therapist recently. Her menopause has been causing all sorts of physical and mental stuff and also some strain to relationship, and I thought it would be good to talk it through with pro.  What I thought would be "no biggie" turned into "biggie" as my W opened up on her past traumas first time ever with professional.  Faster than I could say WhatTheHeckHappened she was forwarded to specialized traumatherapist.

And this brought an important lesson, that therapist identified and shared with us, that I think relates to MLC as well.

In a safe and healthy relationship, past traumas that were previously suppressed can resurface because the nervous system finally feels secure enough to process them. Those deeply buried emotions, memories, or triggers may emerge as anxiety, emotional flooding, or physical symptoms... And that is where we landed. First time ever she is in healthy and safe relationship , and her body and mind is starting to process out 4 decades worth of not-so-happy events 

It also works on reverse. If the person is on survival mode and does not have the capacity to confront deep emotional wounds, they will hunt for unhealthy relationships or seek life alone.  It is way to escape...and this is likely where MLCrs fall into.

So how firetrucked can human mind get. You put in the effort to build safe and nurturing relationship, and yet, the very safety of it allows deeper issues to surface and hit like ton of bricks. Human mind is really something. Oh lucky me lol, just when you think you are out of rat race, midlife-something bounces back to your life in all new format.

Oh well, at least she has chance of getting her stuff together for good. And I feel I am much better equipped with "new crisis," (or most likely this will become MLT)..   But still, this MLC/MLT is a gift that keeps on giving year after year.

Alvin

[FaithWalker]

Oh goodness Alvin.  Hopefully your W can work through this and come out better than when she went in.

[AlvinTheMaker]

Oh goodness Alvin.  Hopefully your W can work through this and come out better than when she went in.

I hope so too.

These are "dangerous waters" to sail in. The ingredients of full blown crisis are there in a sense that whereas she now sees me as a lighthouse and is in love, she can as easily fall to survival mode and unhealthy coping when deep old wounds are poked in therapy.

Best ,and all, I can try to do is let go and let god. And try to keep my own wellbeing as northern star. Both skills I  lacked before my XW's MLC. So despite the not-so-good news, there is also a lot of gratefulness for all that I have learned from this place and people in here🙏🏻

Alvin

[MadLuv]

Wow, divorces due to a MLC and remarried and new MLC.  This sounds more like a transition thought since she is willing to look and address, but I am still amazed at anyone that can get into a new relationship after a long marriage and a crazy ending. She is lucky she has someone that has learned and has the patience and understanding that most would not

[WHY]

I wonder if us LBS attract a certain type of person too, prone towards MLC? 

[AlvinTheMaker]

Wow, divorces due to a MLC and remarried and new MLC.  This sounds more like a transition thought since she is willing to look and address, but I am still amazed at anyone that can get into a new relationship after a long marriage and a crazy ending.

At times I wonder my sanity too, LOL. 

Alvin

[AlvinTheMaker]

I wonder if us LBS attract a certain type of person too, prone towards MLC?

Likely/Maybe... Maybe it is the "good guy/woman trap". If you can make partner feel safe, it seems to be call sign for unhealed trauma to surge. And that is where you may get either MLC or MLT. Twisted logic, but could well be valid. And could explain why here are mostly good people who provided and cared and loved unselfishly.

I knew she had traumatic past, but in the end most people have had skeletons. You can only rely on their word of them being done and dealt, and watch for  behaviour. But if mask is on and it is well crafted...then it's gonna be hard. And of course rose/pink goggles make it harder, LOL


Oh well, lets see where this goes. Hopefully MLT, but still sucks.

Alvin

[Standing Strong]

Alvin!!!

Back for round two (ding-ding). 

Well, at least you knew where to go right away. 

Sorry to hear...... I think LBS are prone to this happening, seen it several times with people I know.

At least she wants help, that's a great starting point.

-SS

[AlvinTheMaker]

Alvin!!!

Back for round two (ding-ding). 

Well, at least you knew where to go right away. 

Yep, emotional support is important.

At least she wants help, that's a great starting point.

Yes, all new perspective. I doubt we would not be here if i had not initiated the therapy. It was definitely a "hell freezes over" kind of thing initially, but I assume it was right time and right person that got her to open.

But let's see where this goes. Long journey ahead, regardless of what lies ahead.

Alvin

[sachertorte]

I am sorry Alvin that this has happened. And I want to say that LBSes are amazing, magnificent, starlights and sunshine of the earth! Y'all certainly kept me afloat when things were far from their best.

I hope you take care of yourself. Lavish some of the beautiful compassion that let someone feel so safe they go home to their fears, on yourself. You so deserve some tranquility and warmth of life.

[AlvinTheMaker]

Journaling.....

So, round two is now reality. After a month it feels both familiar and different at the same time. I guess that just highlights how MLC is a mix of many things. While affairs or loss of love may be the A-bombs that turn midlife crisis into a CRISIS, it doesn’t always take something that extreme for relationship to plunge into dark waters.

Beginning of W's therapy has not been easy. In the past few weeks, I’ve heard the word 'escape'  several times along with various brainfogg-baked thoughts to run off, delay or distract. She says she is committed to working on her traumas and us, and there is some progress, but from cheap seats (or maybe I have best seats, LOL) it seems so fragile. But maybe it will change with time. These are still the early days.

And there is fear. Lots of fear for things big and small. She is like a deer in the woods, listening for even smallest of crack.  The other day she smelled smoke from fish i was cooking and jumped to hug me in fear our fire alarm would go off. And there is fear of me abandoning her  - that is her fearful-avoidant demon pushing and pulling. Yes, the honeymoon lovebombing is now over and I'm getting a royal treatment crashcourse of this unhealthy dynamic running rampage.

It seems she is consistently standing at a crossroad, choosing daily whether to face her demons or fall back to mask-and-run pattern she has held onto for decades.  So far facing the demons seems to be winning, but it is such subtle matter that it can swing either way any given day. Though it pains me, I know this is her battle. Not much I can do besides giving time and space.

The biggest difference this round is me. You dont go hell and back without learning transferrable skills.  Now all of it is handy.  Six years back I was not a good LBS and poked-and-trialed a lot. But now I know that the baseline teachings are likely the most valid option, especially when situation is like mine. So I....
Give space, dont push or poke.
Respond, don’t react.
Go slow—then even slower.
Listen actively, respond mindfully.
Build trust and safety.
Detach for personal well-being.

Oh yes, MLC is a gift that keeps giving.

So what's ahead for me... First step is a weekend photography trip. My first solo trip in two years. It's gonna be fun.

Alvin

[Treasur]

I am very sorry that you find yourself on the edge of someone else’s crisis again. Can’t imagine how that would feel in your shoes. Or how one might see and deal with both the similarities and differences in a second round with a different person. But as you say, we learn some useful tools in how much of it we allow to be about us and I hope your photography trip brings you some pleasure and space to breathe.

[marvin4242]

Hi Alvin:

I am also sorry that you find yourself in maybe familiar territory again. But you do sound very centered and as well positioned as one can be. Hopefully this time it is a case where your W, with support and help including yours, will take the hard but good road and deal with her traumas. I truly hope that she does and you both end up on the stronger/better version of your relationship.

You know this, but don't forget to take care of yourself. And if memories of the last time come up it sounds like you are very good at doing your own work.

[AlvinTheMaker]

Journaling…

Just watched a fascinating science documentary called "Love Hurts: The Science of Heartbreak" by CBC.

What really stood out to me is that there may be a promising medical treatment for the intense emotional pain many LBS experience after a traumatic breakup. The proposed remedy is surprisingly simple and affordable: propranolol - yes, the common, inexpensive blood pressure medication—combined with six 30-minute therapy sessions where traumatic memory is re-activated.

This treatment has already shown 75% effectiveness in cases of PTSD, and current research is exploring its impact on heartbreak with promising results too.

Most likely most licenced therapists are not even aware of such remedy.... But maybe this sidenote helps some other poor soul entering the LBS path. It's no cure to MLC, but it could make life of fellow LBS a lot easier.

Alvin

[forthetrees]

Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind come to life.

[marvin4242]

Alvin: thanks, really interesting, had not seen it. Found this which further expands on what you were saying:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4331383/

Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind come to life.

Ha! I like to use "better living through chemistry!"

[AlvinTheMaker]

I like to use "better living through chemistry!"

Precisely.... What this approach does is it decouples fear response from memories when using trauma re-activation. Nothing is lost, it just becomes "easier to live" as primitive fear reaction is no more hijacking all systems.

And propranolol is safe, in fact I've been popping it for 2 years for heart issues. Not sure if it's the reason Im handling current crisis so well, or if it's just about me having done the work

But all in all I think it is great there are new pharma solutions that are something else than "zombifying" with mental issue meds.

Here's how they are trying to make this spread:
https://en.reconsolidationtherapy.com/

Alvin

[gman242]

I wonder if us LBS attract a certain type of person too, prone towards MLC?

Likely/Maybe... Maybe it is the "good guy/woman trap". If you can make partner feel safe, it seems to be call sign for unhealed trauma to surge. And that is where you may get either MLC or MLT. Twisted logic, but could well be valid. And could explain why here are mostly good people who provided and cared and loved unselfishly.

I knew she had traumatic past, but in the end most people have had skeletons. You can only rely on their word of them being done and dealt, and watch for  behaviour. But if mask is on and it is well crafted...then it's gonna be hard. And of course rose/pink goggles make it harder, LOL


Oh well, lets see where this goes. Hopefully MLT, but still sucks.

Alvin

I could tend to agree here.

I think we're all in the same boat as we're the nice / good person the other took a chance on because they're sick of the same old jerks, players a*holes nonsense (doesn't matter MF or FM here .. ) and they can't handle kindness, unconditional love.

They honestly miss or are just used to the arguing, the stress, the cortisol addiction as I've heard it called.

Check out the chaos kid theory. Very apt for most of us.

Some will thrive, some will flounder.

But we as "good people" need to learn to look for the same. I think our problem is we tend to fall in love with potential rather than what's in front of us.

[MadLuv]

Or it can be the opposite.  They say that someone with trauma or unresolved issues seeks out the familiar. If they are an avoidant with covert narcissist traits they themselves can be their own wolf in sheep's clothing . I think this is why evaluating and digging into MLC is so hard. All the variables and reasons.  Even if you think you pick the opposite you can still end up with the same. LBS biggest hurdle is to not shut out the chance of love out of fear of what will come or may come. No one knows anyone fully and how life at anytime will play out. Just my thought.

[gman242]

Madluv, the thing I'm looking for now in any relationship is reciprocation.

Do they show an interest me? Ask questions? Compliment me as well? Listen to me when I'm talking? Etc..

It took a lot of inner work for me to realize that's what I've been missing all these years in most of my relationships.

Because honestly if someone isn't truly giving to you, they're just taking and it's simply not a worthy investment.

We need to be open minded and hearted sure, but we also need standards and boundaries.

[MadLuv]

Gman!!! That is exactly it!!

 My XH seemed so sweet, but as time went on he just wasn’t someone open to easily share deeply or engage in difficult conversations. We then can feel we have invested all this time maybe that will change or we can help them open up etc.  The red flags cant be ignored and I think that is something we learn as well. I’m with you. I just want deeper commitment, communication and not fight for  interactions and the basics in life. So, Im in total agreement!!!

[AlvinTheMaker]

I just want deeper commitment, communication and not fight for  interactions and the basics in life.

Don't we all 

Not much news on my story except W entering 'deeper stages' of  her trauma therapy next week. Lots of 'fun stuff' like frequent nightmares, mood swings and 'chase of beauty' in the air right now.

As for me...still focusing on being the lighthouse. Being trusted and visible when she needs me.  But not pushing in any way for my needs ATM. On best days I'm mr.Wonderfull (touch), on worst days not so much (and go).

Lately I've been focusing on my health issues. I bought one of those 'midlife' lab packages that checks pretty much everything. It seems my thyroid is all whacked up. Not great news, but at least it is something that can be treated. On the upside, no signs of andropause (yet😅).

One day at a time.

Alvin

[AlvinTheMaker]

A bit of news from XW for a change... Through kids of course,LOL.

XW has officially taken back her maiden name. Zero feelings from my part except it would have been nice to be informed (by her) in case there is need of official contact (about kids) some day.  Oh well, if it helps her finding identity or something then by all means. To my son she had explained that there is another person with  same initials at her work, and because it is so confusing during Teams meetings, she goes back to her maiden name. Um, yeah, lol.

What's bit more weird is that she plans to visit the rural town I am from next year with my son. AFAIKshe has zero ties there besides me and summers spent together as a family.  It would be wrong to say I feel alarmed, but bit uneasy maybe.  But let's see how this unwinds.

Elsewhere....  Current W is definitely cooking in midlife transition/crisis of her own. Good days and bad days - maybe more the latter right now. Though things are pretty raw at times, I do feel blessed and grateful for all things I have learned from XW's MLC. Just stand back, detach and let things unfold without any interference goes a long way when your partner is in state of internal chaos.

One day at a time.

Alvin

[Biscuit]

Alvin,

Sorry you're going through another MLC / MLT experience - that's something I'm sure you didn't expect again. However, like you say, you've learned so much from XW's MLC that you're perfectly positioned and prepared to handle the experience and maybe even mitigate the worst of it, at least how it effects you.

B

[AlvinTheMaker]

Hi Biscuit,

All true....  Despite the sitch (or maybe because) I feel I have reached closure. On past, present and future.

I feel I have reached the end on my quest for "what MLC is and why it happens".  The below may not say much to most, but right now I firmly believe MLC is emotional/cognitive network becoming activated by some triggering (external/internal) event (normal part), and then left open (the problem).

Does not say much when put like that😂 But it effectively covers all I know of MLC using  psychological terminology. And it also explains everything the veterans (and my personal experiences) says "works".

But yeh, there it is. Something I feel I can truly "believe". Peace for my soul.   And a good place to continue one day at a time.

Alvin.

[TheShore]

…I feel I have reached the end on my quest for "what MLC is and why it happens".  The below may not say much to most, but right now I firmly believe MLC is emotional/cognitive network becoming activated by some triggering (external/internal) event (normal part), and then left open (the problem)…

Alvin, do you feel that activation happens because of missing/surprised coping skills because of trauma experienced earlier in life?  Do you think that fits in somehow?

[TheShore]

…I feel I have reached the end on my quest for "what MLC is and why it happens".  The below may not say much to most, but right now I firmly believe MLC is emotional/cognitive network becoming activated by some triggering (external/internal) event (normal part), and then left open (the problem)…

Alvin, do you feel that activation happens because of missing/surprised coping skills because of trauma experienced earlier in life?  Do you think that fits in somehow?

Whoops...meant to write surpressed (not surprised)

[AlvinTheMaker]

Hi Norianxx,

Activation is normal – it happens to everyone. But the network remaining open… there lies the rub.

It stays open because earlier trauma left the person without the skills to regulate or integrate what’s surfacing. This is the internal root factor.

But it’s more complex than that: the process is also shaped by external reinforcements. Once the network is open, the environment (FOO, LBS, anyone trusted) either helps it close (safe space, calm presence, clear boundaries) or keeps it wide open (criticism, conflict, enabling, emotional volatility).

Here’s the paradox: the LBS’s normal, human emotional reactions during and after the bomb drop often amplify the loop and make it stronger. And attempts to “nice it out” usually fail too, because familiarity itself can feel suffocating and even threatening control to an already unsettled nervous system.

So how this ties together with what Sue Johnson, Gottman etc say.....

Attachment wounds = internal root factor (why the network opens and doesn’t close).

Gottman’s dynamics = external reinforcement (why the environment often worsens the loop).

As sad as it is, the LBS’s best chance of helping isn’t fixing, but minimizing external reinforcement while the MLCrs brain tries to rebuild integration.

And because everything exists on a spectrum, how this plays out is highly individual.

Alvin.

[TheShore]

Hi Norianxx,

Activation is normal – it happens to everyone. But the network remaining open… there lies the rub.

It stays open because earlier trauma left the person without the skills to regulate or integrate what’s surfacing. This is the internal root factor.

But it’s more complex than that: the process is also shaped by external reinforcements. Once the network is open, the environment (FOO, LBS, anyone trusted) either helps it close (safe space, calm presence, clear boundaries) or keeps it wide open (criticism, conflict, enabling, emotional volatility).

Here’s the paradox: the LBS’s normal, human emotional reactions during and after the bomb drop often amplify the loop and make it stronger. And attempts to “nice it out” usually fail too, because familiarity itself can feel suffocating and even threatening control to an already unsettled nervous system.

So how this ties together with what Sue Johnson, Gottman etc say.....

Attachment wounds = internal root factor (why the network opens and doesn’t close).

Gottman’s dynamics = external reinforcement (why the environment often worsens the loop).

As sad as it is, the LBS’s best chance of helping isn’t fixing, but minimizing external reinforcement while the MLCrs brain tries to rebuild integration.

And because everything exists on a spectrum, how this plays out is highly individual.

Alvin.

Wow, thx for the deep intellectual and detailed response, very helpful.

I really enjoy feedback like this.  I do read it once, but try not to get caught in an analysis paralysis —>  I gotta life to live and have to put these principles in application 😀