[Biscuit]

Thanks Ready,

The control thing is interesting actually. W and I had a conversation last week where she said she isn't comfortable with me being friends with her friends or speaking to her family. That's strange I said, aren't you constantly hanging out with my best mate? That's different she said - "she's more my friend now - so why are you always calling her?|. Because Mrs Biscuit - I've called her on a near daily basis for almost 30 years and I'm not about to stop because we have seperated and the 2 of you are friends. And by the way, I'm absolutely fine with you being friends with people who I introduced you to.
Then the conversation moved onto her best friend from childhood. I met my W and her besty from school on the same night. The 3 of us became great friends. Then I started dating W some months later, we all continued to be friends, we lived together, holidayed together, hung out etc.
So in the last 2 years I haven't seen her best mate as much, obviously. But, we stay in touch by text and see each other occasionally. W told me last week that it makes her friend uncomfortable that I contact her. Really, that's odd Mrs Biscuit - she often contacts me.
Anyway that evening I happened to bump into W's best friend at a birthday drinks. Her friend told me then that she was totally comfortable hanging out with me but had done less in the first year or so after BD because W had given her the cold shoulder or been rude to her about staying in contact with me.
At the time W had told me this friend of hers felt uncomfortable around me.   It was nice to know the truth - and that W was , as you say Ready, trying to control the situation.

[Helpnewc]

Biscuit,

Did you have the conversation with your wife?

Help

[Biscuit]

Help,

Had a few conversations in the last few days with her. It seems to me like her trigger at the moment is controlling her 'story' or how others percieve her. When talking to mutual friends they might often say - how are the W and kids? That is if they haven't seen them. I might tell them that they've gone to a museum or on a day out today, something quite innocuous and that they are all fine. If my W were to then speak to this mutual friend and the friend would  say - Oh I heard you and the kids went to see that exhibit last week - then that will really stir anger in W with me. Like I'm somehow trying to control other peoples perception of her.
I've explained to W that who I speak to and what about is none of her business - and the same for her. I think it's going to be a tough lesson for her to learn that we can't control anything others people do and say but can only control our reaction to what is said and done. I know that has been a hard lesson for me to learn in  the last couple of years, but it has been an essential piece of my healing.

B

[Helpnewc]

Yes, the control stuff is so weird.

First you are accused of it. And then they want to control you.

It remains the strangest experience of my life.

The apology seems to have not led to any greater insight.

[Biscuit]

Help,

No, the apology was never going to be insightful, she's still in crisis! But it was an acknowledgement, which to me was an important step - she may have acknowledged to herself that she has behaved badly, but to admit this to someone else I think is a step forward.
Whilst in the throes of the crisis the double standards will continue - yes it crazymaking sometimes for the LBS  - but accept that's the way it is for the moment. Don't accept any blame which is yours not to shoulder.

[Biscuit]

And the need to control others is really just a loss of self control.

[UrsaMajor]

Help,

No, the apology was never going to be insightful, she's still in crisis! But it was an acknowledgement, which to me was an important step - she may have acknowledged to herself that she has behaved badly, but to admit this to someone else I think is a step forward.

There is a quote that says something to the effect of "An apology without a change in behaviour is only manipulation."

[Biscuit]

Good point Ursa

[FaithWalker]

There is a quote that says something to the effect of "An apology without a change in behaviour is only manipulation."

[Biscuit]

An interesting week or so in MLC land over here.

Things with me have been really good. After a long period of work being totally crap (due to industrial action in my industry), things have picked up massively with more work coming in than we have seen in 6 months. This is great for me as I love keeping busy and new projects mean a new creative outlet.

We have been doing end of year taxes and W and I have been on lots pf calls about that. We had a tax problem and so we are cashing in some investments to make things easier (it's just moving money really but it's complicated). W has grabbed the bull by the horns on this and has organised all the meetings to hit the dealines. That has been great to witness as she is clearly back to being really good with this stuff. In order to free up some money we have both agreed to cash in some savings - now here's an interesting turn of events - W has twice what I do in her name in investments, but she suggested she cash in the whole lot and give me some to cover the fact I have less. This was quite significant as she had no need to do so (legally speaking the money is hers) - but offered to share to help me. Thanks Mrs Biscuit - that was actually really kind - especially given where we were a year ago when she wasn't sharing much at all - progress in some way.

I've also had a slight problem with S. He got upset last week about something that would normally have blown over in a day or so. But the next day he's attacking me over text - not only for what he and I had disagreed with but also accused me of crossing W's boundaries and not treating her right. The thing was the way he was sayijng it, and the specific things he accused me of were phrased exactly as W had put them in a discussion a couple of weeks ago.
I thought about this for a couple of days - then decided to ask W about it. I said, "W - our son is accusing me of stuff which we discussed a while ago - and the funny thing is about it is that he knows the specific things and details than you and I discussed. This leads me to think that the only way he could know these specifics would be:
1. He's bugged one of our houses or phones
2. he's overheard one of us talking about this disagreement with a friend
3. One of us has directly told him exactly what was said in that conversation (but I didn't say anything to S - and I can't imagine you would have discussed this either Mrs. B)"

And W immediately 'fessed up and said, "I'm sorry, I discussed that conversation with S - I didn't think he'd hold that against you"
I then said that it was inappropriate for W to discuss what we had spoken about - and involving our son is bound to create problems - she is his mother and of course he's going to get annoyed if he thinks someone has wronged her. She treats S like a friend sometimes more than a child and I pointed out that blurring that line between parent and friend might not be the best way to communicate with our children. She listened and I hope took this on board - but we'll see. Anyway she was very apologetic - but that may be because she got caught out - who knows?