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Our Community / Re: When MLC and aftermath turn tragic
« Latest by Ready2Transform on Today at 07:05:50 PM »
It's all very sad. I have to agree with the others - this likely is not MLC. I hope your friend can move toward acceptance in the future, but that first she focus on what is likely horrible grief to work through with the loss of her child. As far as what to say or do, I would just show empathy as you would to any other suffering any loss, and not approach the marriage subject unless she asks. We all deal with the grief in our own way, and since so much has been made public for her, maybe just respect what privacy she does have.
Our Community / Love Comes Walking In
« Latest by beyondblessed on Today at 06:55:52 PM »
A hearty congratulations to both of you, BB! 

I hope you're making the wedding cake!!

SB, I don't know about the cake for the actual day of our wedding,  since it is a destination wedding/honeymoon and I'm definitely not packing all of my baking supplies and dragging them along😆  And, no way am I traveling over 12 hrs with a wedding cake lol  Our wedding is at sunset and after,  we plan to go out with our families for a nice oceanfront dinner.  I can't think of a better way to start our new life together.

Once we return home...and here's to hoping we've found our new home by then 🤞🤞, we plan on having a nice house warming/reception for friends and family.  For that, I can assure many different gourmet cupcakes and desserts 🥰

Our Community / JohnnyBravo's story
« Latest by JohnnyBravo on Today at 04:40:39 PM »
Garden cart? Shoot, I already have two wheelbarrows... :)

I've heard about the weed cloth fallacy; I use it as much to keep the gravel from sinking into the dirt as for weeds. They had plastic under there before (from 30-40 years ago), and I wanted something that would let the water through. It does keep weed roots from getting too deep so they're easier to pull out, though.
Our Community / Re: JohnnyBravo's story
« Latest by forthetrees on Today at 03:42:19 PM »
Garden cart- less likely to tip:) Weed cloth is a fraudulent product.
Our Community / Re: When MLC and aftermath turn tragic
« Latest by Jo on Today at 03:39:55 PM »
Thank you Nas and Thunder. I'm SO glad I asked!

I've never stopped to evaluate the comparisons of a person coming out at mid life with what many of us identify as mlc traits, or precursors to an almost predictable mlc fracture "playbook".
1.  Detachment: It makes sense that a person coming out would need to emotionally detach from their current life, in order to prepare for the next chapter. But perhaps in the coming out, the detaching partner would want to protect their wife and children? Laying a base for acceptance.
2. Lies and sneaking around, this is probably something they've been doing all their avoid being outed before they were ready?
3. Emotional affair then physical, affirmation and confirmation of their true identity?
4.  Some folks spend money as a coping mechanism for stress. Some use money to impress their next partners. Hetero or homosexual?
5. Reinventing history, to assuage perhaps the identity guilt with their spouses of opposite sex? A safe landing post coming out for both partners?
6. Some folks in identity crisis also use reinventing themselves physically (some plastic surgery), and attempting to run from the aging process. Perhaps, the mid life homosexuals coming out also think time is running out to be the real me, or all I want to be?
7. Rush to remarry, although not yet divorced from current spouse? I can see this as a comparison.

I also learned that the husband also offered to give his wife "everything" (they're mega, mega millionaires), homes, jewelry, etc. but wanted to only keep one thing, his exotic car collection. He did want 50/50 shared custody citing that he was divorcing her, not their children. (Willing to sacrifice everything to be

Lots of family secrets were exposed. (And I don't mean about him being gay), I mean things that are legal in their native country are not legal here in the US)..This woman is being hit on all sides.

Again, I'm so glad I asked cause I've had a paradigm shift in my beliefs about mlc.
Our Community / JohnnyBravo's story
« Latest by JohnnyBravo on Today at 02:57:27 PM »
Ursa, what does TGF stand for? (I assume GF is Girlfriend...)

I put out the halloween decorations today. (It seems early, but the neighbors are already at it...) W was the big halloween decorator. She had made some cute decorations, some of which we tossed when she left. (I'm wondering if we shouldn't have, but they were easy enough to make again.) There was one set that she did want me to save for the house, that we both worked on. I wasn't going to put them out, but decided to anyway. The neighbors like them, and in case she decides to do a drive by, it will be a little connection. (While we were packing up her stuff, she said she might do the drive by, but I doubt it.)

I've been fixing the landscaping in the front of the house, and was sieving out gravel and re-laying it on weed block fabric. One section I had to work on is at an angle, and after the wheelbarrow got about half full of gravel, it fell over. So, I put a block of wood under the low skid, and started again. Then it fell over the other way. At that point, I needed to come inside and cry for a minute. Before BD, I would have thrown a temper tantrum at the wheelbarrow, but haven't done that since then. I've never yelled at people, only things, but that's something I need to fix. I was doing it more often as the pandemic dragged on, and I feel bad about that for W's sake. After BD, when she said she expected me to be angry, I replied, "That's why I get mad at the stupid little things, so I can handle the big things." At least I'm learning to take a breath instead.

Well, that's it for now. No news is good news.

Our Community / Re: When MLC and aftermath turn tragic
« Latest by Thunder on Today at 01:52:52 PM »
Jo I can't agree more with Nas.

Her H must have struggled with his identity for years.  It's very sad to hear their story, but I doubt this man will change now that he has brought it out.
I also do not see a midlife crisis.  Only an Identity crisis he struggled with.

I agree just reach out to her like you would anyone who lost a child.  Offer any help or support she and her family needs.
Our Community / When MLC and aftermath turn tragic
« Latest by Nas on Today at 01:26:29 PM »
What a heartbreaking story. The loss of a child is something I cannot even fathom, and you're so right that the opioid/fentanyl crisis is out of control.

I want to say upfront that based on your post, I do not think this woman's husband is MLC. That said, it's heartbreaking and she'll feel a similar helplessness as the life she knew falls away and she can do nothing to stop it, and she'll need support to get through the end of her marriage all the same. It'll be incredibly difficult, especially if she's currently in denial.  But I don't think coming out late in life is an MLC fracture - the fear and pressure to conform and hide a huge part of yourself (and especially decades ago when they married) must be so painful. My ex-MIL's best friend is a man who came out after being married for 25 years and having several kids. I know him well and his life story is amazing, with parts that were tragic and heartbreaking not just for his wife and kids, but for him as well. I think a person revealing a previously denied or suppressed part of one's identity (hidden for fear of being shunned or persecuted or just not accepted for who you are in full) is very different than a midlife fracture.

I say that as a prelude to commenting on your question of how to support her.  I would approach the loss of her daughter as you would any grieving mother, leaving the rest of her story of divorce/family struggles set aside as an entirely separate issue that she and her family will work through (and seek support for if/when they feel ready to).

I'm so sorry for your friend, and I'm sorry for her kids who have just lost a sibling, and for her husband who is no doubt struggling with a million emotions, just as she is. When so much pain is actively happening in a short timeframe, it's incredibly overwhelming and debilitating. They probably don't even know what they need right now, at least not in a way they can verbalize.

They're going through so much at once, it's heart wrenching to think about. I really hope she seeks professional support but in this moment, right now, she's probably wholly consumed with the grief of losing her daughter. And of course your instinct is to lend support in whatever way you can. For now, that might be helping with immediate needs - having food delivered, that sort of thing. Letting her know you're there if she needs you. I'm so sorry for what they're going through.
Our Community / When MLC and aftermath turn tragic
« Latest by Jo on Today at 12:24:13 PM »
A year ago, a friend of mine from one of our book clubs reached out to me about a mutual friend who's husband was in a mlc. I reached out to her but she was in denial, changed the subject, and didn't want anyone in our small community to know. So I backed off. What I learned from our mutual friend was that her husband of 20 years had asked for a divorce to marry another man. I have no experience in providing support for that version of mlc fracture, but know that pain is pain, no matter which mlc variety we're experiencing.

I know that the mlc fracture knows no boundaries, races, creed, sex, et al. I let our mutual friend know to let her know that I'm here if she decides she wants to talk.

In this couples 20 year marriage, they had three children. A 19 year old son, a 16 year old daughter in the middle and a very young son 10. I know the youngest is autistic, the oldest son has mental health challenges which has kept him trouble with the law, and the daughter has been a "cutter" since she was very young and had emotional health issues. I knew that she'd been on meds, but I also know the family is quite private, so not much gets out until something happens.

Yesterday at noon, something happened.  My friend's daughter was found dead. It was a drug over-dose. We're all heartbroken for the family, and community. The mutual friend called to let me know. She also said that our lbs friend has begged her mlc husband not to move out because of the unstable daughter. Apparently they are still living together, and but not as man and wife. 

I cannot imagine the pain this woman is in today. I cannot imagine losing a 16 year old child in this way. This fentanyl crisis in this country has become so dangerous, especially for young kids like this who have other medications on board and don't realize the danger in mixing in other drugs.  I'm learning more and more about families having to bury their young children from so many friends. Intolerable pain. I just can't imagine how she's doing today.

The lbs was in my home a few weeks ago, not as just a peripheral friend, but as a realtor. We had a great few hours together. And we were going through my options. But I saw through her fragile smile, and my heart hurt for her with the all too familiar pain in the early mlc months. She has yet to admit to me what is going on with her husband/marriage. I did not bring it up. I don't know how to offer my support at this devastating time, or IF I should, but our community is small and we help our own. I fear seeing me now might be reminder of her other devastating loss.

 As a mlc survivor, I want to help, but also know that until one is ready, all we can do is wait. If this was me, the last thing I would be worrying about was my husband or marriage, but how can we not when you're already in the tsunami of mlc? Our mutual friend told me that she's been suicidal this past year, still wears her wedding rings and doesn't want anyone to know, cause she believes this is just a phase.

Has anyone else had any experience with a death of a child during the spouse's mlc? Any advice on what to say or do? She is scheduled to come by at 11:30 tomorrow with the square footage guy to measure the house officially, but I do not want to call her, or text, her, but assume that this is not happening tomorrow.

Any suggestions or comments?

Our Community / Confused
« Latest by Hpfl3366 on Today at 08:46:41 AM »
Thank you for your replies…
I did a Lot of research when this started. As time has gone by, I have witnessed all the things I’ve read about. The nice guy, then the not so nice.  When he’s been not so nice, he has always apologized. I’ve not been confused until now, I’ve been working on making me a better person and have left him to deal with his stuff at his own pace. He got angry at the support checks because I asked if he could give me $100.00 more per month (and, no, it would not be even close to a hardship for him). There is nothing legal drawn up. I have asked for the minimum amount to be able to keep up with the bills. In the last year, things around the house have broken and gone out that I have paid for and have done most of the work myself. These days since Covid, prices have continued to increase. I thought 100.00 was very reasonable. I am disabled and on Social Security.
He has been very open with me and as far as I can tell, been honest. He said he’s jealous of me for many reasons….for making better decisions than he has, for having a better relationship with the kids, etc.  also, he has said he was a jerk when the kids were little and that he has treated me badly.  He has recently told me he now has trouble sleeping, concentrating and focusing. He has said he loses track of time and many more things that have given me an insight as to his moving forward or backward. He has always said he doesn’t trust anyone but me. Also that he thought he would have so much more time if he moved out, but he was very wrong. That he didn’t realize or give me credit for all the work I did. I suppose what I’m hoping for most is that the “Replay” stage is beginning to end. We also had a VERY good BBQ with the kids. Before that BBQ, he texted me several photos and videos of BBQ’s from years past. About 3 weeks later is when he went ballistic. When he was done yelling, he asked if I wanted to go to lunch and if I needed groceries. I declined. When he was leaving, he wanted a hug.  I was not upset at all when he left. I was relieved. I did notice his face changing while he was yelling. He ended up giving me the extra support money. I gave up long ago, having any expectations, but I don’t know how to make sense of going somewhere almost every weekend, to pretty much nothing. If it helps, 2 weeks ago, he was asking his mom about his childhood.

I hadn’t thought of outside pressure until your post. I knew I wasn’t adding pressure on him to stay in contact (I would wait for him to contact me). But! His work has added non-stop stress for several months. His workforce has been cut in half and he got promoted. He has been working 12-14 hour days, 6 days a week (most weeks), with no end in sight. He said he just keeps falling further and further behind. He also has 2 vehicles that are not running (his doing) and have been that way for a little over a year. 
We have been together since we were 17…almost 43 years, now. He came home from work one night a little over 4 years ago and said (very calmly) “I love you to death, but I’m not in love with you and I want a divorce.”  That night he said he thought he was having a midlife crisis and had to leave to ‘figure his s#@t out. He moved out 1 month later. He gave our son 3 days notice to move home to help me physically and financially, which is why I didn’t ask for more support money from him. That is the only time he said he wanted a divorce. Since then, he has maintained that he does not want a divorce. In short, he left 4 years ago, but we’ve been ‘dating’ for the last 3 years.
He chose to confide in our friends’ daughter, whom we’ve known since before she was born. It was not physical, and no, I’m not in denial. Even if he wanted it to be I KNOW she would not have participated. She’s called us ‘Mom’ and ‘Dad’ her whole life. Our kids called her their sister. They have not any contact for over 3years, but it tore our families apart.  Our daughter (30 y/o) has wanted very little to do with him because of her hurt. So Treasur, you’re right about it being much easier for him to have contact with our son (31 y/o). Husband has also told me he knows how angry our daughter is with him.
Didn’t mean to make this so long. Thank you for your thoughts. 

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