[MyBrainIsBroken]

https://www.beautyafterbruises.org/blog/didyouknow

[rubyhearted]

Has anyone else noticed how Thought Feeling and Activity on Anjae’s tree holds so true with many MLCers? Many of yours undoubtedly have all plus the FOO roots. Fascinating stuff. Even if they don’t have “the addiction gene” your patterns can be engrained as is the discussion about smoking. My MLCer is looking at his own behaviors now that he is taking meds for ADHD. It is giving him a mirror. He was never addicted and does not seem to have that either. It still does not excuse anything. Only that it puts some of his behavior in perspective.

[rubyhearted]

MyBrain the C-PTSD is especially interesting in children although it is more commonly seen as Detachment Trauma Disorder is fascinating. My S15 still suffers detachment from his father (not MLC) and step-dad (MLC). Too much abandonment. His dad abandoned him by being abusive and then not being able to take care of himself. Them MLC H booted us like a worn shoe. S15 panics if I leave the house overnight and misses school as a result. He needs me and has little ways of showing me that he needs to connect at home. He overly exercises and virtually starved himself almost as punishment in a way to set himself apart from his peers. Sad. I would not be surprised if a lot us have kids who are DTD and will need a lot of therapy. Once we can get them there.

[Not Applicable]

That's not very encouraging MBIB. Even if my H were to figure out he has CPTSD, we don't live anywhere near where there would be any sort of appropriate therapy available. 

It would be nice to hear about some MLCers who managed to get through it WITHOUT therapy. There have to be some.

[MyBrainIsBroken]

That's not very encouraging MBIB.

I agree. It wasn't meant to be encouraging but I thought it might be enlightening for those who wonder why MLC takes so long. I've been in therapy for childhood trauma, abuse, and neglect for almost five years and still am not ready to start EMDR. We may be starting sometime in the next couple of months, once I'm stable enough to be able to tolerate it. And it will probably take quite a while longer, even after EMDR starts, because there are a lot of layers to work through, although I hope that I'm wrong and it goes quickly.

[Treasur]

Nice to see you, Brain x

Fwiw as only my experience, EMDR works like a snowball. Starts slow and then gathers speed without you consciously trying to make it do so. In a good way. Bc your brain keeps doings its thing between sessions, I found that there was a sort of washing machine effect at the back of my brain which would occasionally throw out some random stuff but again in a good way...the first session was the toughest and every one after that was a bit easier and moved me forward in bigger steps than the last. Took a few months but in my case EMDR was like a strange magic 

[Anjae]

No shortage of proper professional help here, both national health sercive and private.

However, here things are seen a little differently than in the US, including how to approach subjects, duration of treatments, even diagnosis itself.

It would be nice to hear about some MLCers who managed to get through it WITHOUT therapy. There have to be some.

Many, if not most MLCers manage it without therapy. MLCers do not tend to be diagnosed with PTSD or C-PTDS. MLC tends to self-resolve.

Usually, PTSD or C-PTSD is not the reason why MLC takes so long. Very few on HS have a MLCer that was diagnosed with PTSD or C-PTSD. I don't know a single real life MLCer diagnosed with one or the other.

If anything, going by HS, it is the LBS that end ups diagnosed with PTSD or C-PTSD.

Where did the idea that MLCers have PTSD/C-PTSD come from? Going around the threads we don't tend to read the MLCer was diagnosed with PTS/C-PTS, including those who have been seen by professionals.

I doubt all MLCers have C-PTSD or even PTDS. Many, if not most, of them become fine on their own after Liminality.

It wasn't meant to be encouraging but I thought it might be enlightening for those who wonder why MLC takes so long. I've been in therapy for childhood trauma, abuse, and neglect for almost five years and still am not ready to start EMDR.

You have. It does not mean MLCers suffer from the same issues you suffer or need the same things you do or if they do that it will take them as long as it is taking you.

What is not encouraging is going back to pass diagnoses to people who were never diagnosed with issue A or B or carry thinking that because it is what have others, including MLCers, must also have.

Ruby, having or not having the "addiction gene" in itself does not mean someone will be an addict. A higher percentage of Europeans have the war gene. We are as much, or as little, beligerant as others. The gene in itself does not lead to higher levels of agression.

FOO issues alone cannot be the sole root of MLC. Many people with FOO issues never have a MLC. Even what I have managed to observe all MLCers have, anxiety, stress and depression cannot be the root. Many people have those things and never have a MLC. Those three things will lead to the type of thinking and actions we see in MLCers, but why do those things only lead some into MLC?

Of those with anxiety, stress and depression that never have a MLC many have serious FOO issues as well.

As far as I know, no one really knows exactly what drives one person, and not another, into MLC. I think anxiety, stress and depression may have a certain effect in some people at a point in their lives they do not have on others. But exactly why? I don't know.

[xyzcf]

Thank you for sharing the information about C-PTSD and PTSD and it is good to see you post!

Anything that we can learn about the human brain and how it functions is very welcomed.

In my view, many MLCers especially women have had abusive childhoods including sexual abuse and possibly many men as well who don't  "report" the way women may.

In studying MLC, I see quite clearly the connection between childhood trauma and the development of a crisis later in life.

So thanks again. No one person's view is the only way to see the crisis and I am grateful when people share what they have learned with the rest of the forum.

[Thunder]

I agree MB, thank you for sharing the information about C-PTSD and PTSD.

Anything that we can learn about the human brain and how it functions is very welcomed.
 

[Anjae]

Thank you for sharing the information about C-PTSD and PTSD and it is good to see you post!

It is. However, MLCers do not tend to be diagnosed with PTSD or C-PTSD, LBS get diagnosed with PTSD. What is the medical and neurological explanation for it?

As a general rule, neuroscientists and neurobiologists do not appoach matters the same way therapists or many psychiatrist do. Brain is talking from the perspective of therapy.

In studying MLC, I see quite clearly the connection between childhood trauma and the development of a crisis later in life.

Interesting. I haven't. I know many people that had serious, and I mean serious, childhood issues and never had a MLC. And I also know MLCers that have happy, abuse free childhoods.

In my view, many MLCers especially women have had abusive childhoods including sexual abuse and possibly many men as well who don't  "report" the way women may.

Do female MLCers, or for that matter, male ones, tend to say they had an abusive childhood, including sexual abuse? I do not see it on the threads, and I do not see it in real life. We have several former MCLers on HS and that is not the idea I have from reading their threads.

Aren't we jumping to conclusions? What proof it there that many, or most MLCers were abused as children, including sexually?

Some MLCers were abused as children, including sexually? Most certainly. But many, or most? In what do you base your theory, Xyzcf? How many here have an MLCer that was sexually abused as a child?


As for dissociative disorder. It is a controversial disorder in which many therapist and psychiatrist do not believe, including many American ones. They think it is a illness fabricated by the therapist that leads the patient to believe they have multiple personalities. There are ample serious studies and papers on the matter that can be easily find with a Google search.



You guys are going to have to forgive me, but therapists points of view, and even psychiatrists points of view, don't mean much to me. They tend to be based in peculiar theories and bizarre concepts that cannot be proved. Freud, and even Jung, are totally discredit here and do not tend to be used as medical refences anymore.

Most concepst we talk about, including projection, come from the Freuds (projection is an Anna Freud, Sigmund's daughter, theory) and the Jungs, not from neuroscience/neurobiology, that is, from those who study the brain.

So, exactly where is anything truly brain, as in neuroscience/neurobiology related in what Brain post, considering dissociative disorder is not even accepted as such by many therapists and psychiatrist - neuroscientists and neurobiolgists don't tend to go there.

I would appreciate, concrete, palpable, neuroscionce/neurobiology answers, not unprovable psychology theories/ideas.

In my view there is often a huge confusion between real neuroscience/neurobiology and psychology/psychiatry and the way they function. Also how the second influences the first, when it tends to be the other way round. It tends to be brain (that are also body) issues that influence behaviours, thoughts, etc.

Of course, deep in depression, the skewed thoughts caused by depression keep influencing the person, but the reason is the depression. Same with addiction/alcoholism.

In neuroscience news, scientists have found that an hormone may be related to hypersexuality/sexual addiction (the hormone is oxytocin): https://neurosciencenews.com/hypersexual-disorder-hormone-14962/

Who is to say, hormones, or other chemicals and/or brain functions aren't behind MLC?


P.S.: Even if one considers, or accepts, abuse, including sexual one, in childhood leads to MLC, why many that are abused as children, including sexually do not have a MLC? What is/are the difference/diferences?