Midlife Crisis: Support for Left Behind Spouses
Archives => Archived Topics => Topic started by: Writingmom on July 02, 2010, 09:14:45 AM
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It seems to me that when H is kind it means one of two things: he feels guilty about how he's treated me OR he's about to do something that he knows I won't approve of.
Anyone notice a leaning more toward one or the other? Neither?
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I also have quickly noticed these two possibilities, or at least that is what I think is happening in his head. I also suspect that his niceness is also a function of what he "got away with" and guilt relief somehow. That also seems to be related right now to his momentum to leave. Every step he makes in that direction makes him happy. I've not noticed one more than the other thus far. I suspect it's hard to tell because of the cycling. I'm starting to chart his moods and what I know is happening/happened. That may not be for everyone, but it helps me. I'm still very new to this though.
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I am sometimes concerned that when H is being nice it is so that he has a comfortable place to stay when he is in town for work. I have also noticed that when he is planning something that he knows will upset or hurt me that he will not look me in the eye and will hardly talk to me treats me like a stranger.
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Yep. No eye contact and jittery. Noticed that too, not that I've laid eyes on the man in awhile. Strange. I wish I could understand how they have remorse for some things and not for others; how they know when they've screwed up and when they're in denial.
Like OP says, believe none of what they say and 50% of what they do. Nice or not, so true.
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My H is always nice to me - only spewed once, and even then was very apologetic after. His niceness is un-nerving to me; sometimes I can't take it - it just makes me cry. Sometimes, he just seems so happy in his new life and that's when he really pours on the kindness towards me. It makes me feel like he has truly moved on and is now trying to make sure that I am happy and moving on as well.
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FHO
My H is the same as yours...he is always nice...somtimes he talks up a storm and other times he is in such a dang hurry to leave. I hardly see him. In a lot of ways, I am thankful for that because it has been easier to detach but on the other hand, I feel the same as you, that he is totally happy with his choices and has moved on with no looking back!!!
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It makes me wonder, CW, if maybe my H really was miserable for all those years and is now so relieved to be out. There were some problems in our marriage, mainly intimacy, but I always felt as though we could overcome anything together. When I said my vows, I MEANT THEM! Sometimes I feel as though his happy demeanor is telling me that he could care less about those vows to me - ugh! So many questions, and NO answers. What a mess.
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FHO
I know it is hard not to think those thoughts but we have to put them out of our heads! Our M's were not perfect...we can own our parts in what was wrong in it and work on fixing those things and that is all we can do!
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CW, you're right, and I know it - I just wish someone would tell my heart! I sometimes get stuck in the shoulda-coulda-woulda's.
Going to get my hair done today - gonna get rid of the extra grey hairs I have accumulated over the last few months - lol.
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WM, my experience with H being nice was: HE WANTED SOMETHING! Always, after he got what he wanted, he suddenly wasn't nice anymore. In fact, anything good that I did seemed to vanish from his memory. iHh
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Kindness, niceness; however you term this is part of their continuing disrespect for the LBS...this is the bottom line.
AND an attempt to continue to suck you into their drama...so they can continue to justify their actions toward you...don't buy into that; detach and increase your distance from their drama.
I always knew when my husband was being"nice" he was doing something he shouldn't be doing, and guilt was driving him to the point that if he was "nice" to me; it would ease what he was feeling within.
Didn't work; I'd always catch him at whatever he was doing, increase my distance even more, refusing to engage him after catching him red-handed, and the anger would come forth once again in a mighty way. Later on, I was so detached, I simply watched him spinning out...and when he finished, asked him, "Feel better now?"
Sometimes the question would bring on more spewing, sometimes not.
He never understood how I KNEW what he was doing....I let him know I would always know when he was doing wrong..and that wouldn't change, like it or lump it.
INCREASE your distance, show him NOTHING in the way of emotion....he is hurting HIMSELF, not YOU....and HE IS WRONG for whatever he's doing to rip down a family.
Anytime you see this, it means something is up..and the pattern NEVER changes on that.
You get to a point where you DO recognize when something is up, and in resignation, you think "What now?"
It is not until Withdrawal is broken that you begin to be able to trust the kindness/niceness/consideration that comes about within them once again.
But, until then? Well, you keep half an eye on the situation..knowing that he's NOT doing this to YOU...he's hurting himself...and you no longer buy the "nice" routine. You watch for whatever is coming out of that darkness he's hidden it in for as long as he's been ABLE to hide it in there.
Nothing done in the darkness ever stays there, it always comes out into the light to be seen/heard.
In other words, the truth of a situation will ALWAYS come out, and that truth will set you free, indeed. :) The niceness is just a cover for their evil-doings..they're thinking that you won't ever find out what they are REALLY about.
It has also been said that the truth is stranger than fiction, and I definitely believe that. :)
This is "child's play" within the crisis. Children will do much the same thing when they have done something wrong...they will be very nice until they've been busted, then they are upset.
Food for thought.
Have good one. :)
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Thank you, HB. It does help to be reminded that distance and no emotion are needed. I got the mother of all spews last weekend. Now it's not so much that he's being nice as he is trying to engage me in kid arrangements as OW is in town and kids have thoroughly been sucked in to the "fun" of all that.
Does he want to throw it in my face by saying, "Whatever you think, but he wants to stay here tonight." Twist the knife, why don't you.
I am trying not to engage. Oldest son can text. They can work it out.
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HB
You are spot on. My H took all the family out for a meal twice. Both times I found out he had taken OW away on holiday!
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Their niceness does not have one cause.
Sometimes I think it is relief, not guilt. When my H goes out with OW, or writes to her and gets things off his chest, he is happy in the same way that he is when he's had a day to himself. He feels happy, not trapped, and is able to be nice.
The guilty look is slightly different. He's nice in a more sheepish sort of way.
He also wants to feel that I am OK, especially when he feels at a good point. He cares, but wants to be free. Once, after spending a weekend at our country house, he told put his arms around me and said "I'll always love you, even if I'm married to someone else". I was furious, and it took him a while to realise why, then he felt stupid/ clumsy.
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Another piece to the puzzle; another type of aspect. Please read for your mental health; I don't doubt some of you have been puzzled as to why they are sometimes very nice; and doing very nice things.....you'll see why in the above post.
Bumping for the newbies.
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Hi:
I think I'm going to be up all night pondering this one tonight.
My H shoveled our driveway and deck today (though he usually does), cleaned two bathrooms, took two of my three for haircuts and did the dishes. I had a busy day of chores and financial stuff myself, but...
He usually does clean when he is agitated. He cleans to the point of "eating off the floor clean". It's either he is helping out or that or he is getting ready to list our house. I remember one day when he said he was "trying to love me" and said "I cleaned the garage for you!". huh? I was happy with the garage - it was fine. I never asked him to clean the garage, and texting his EA after cleaning the garage somehow wasn't doing it for me anyhow!
He has been looking me in the eye a lot this weekend, and being friendly, yet still a little snappy to the kids....like a cranky old man. About six month prior to BD he got quite cranky, and I remember thinking "Oh shoot! He's going to be cranky as he gets old - I got a cranky one!" and that's the personality I see now as well. (He is early 40s btw...too young to be perpetually cranky!).
I have a feeling he has an appointment with a lawyer this week. That's what my intuition tells me. It will be his first if he does and it will be very hard for him to go.
Frightening!
I wish I could trust and think he is just being nice and cleaning up. Maybe I am paranoid and monstracizing him and he did to me, because he has hurt me so much and my guard is up.
Tylenol PM here I come.
Good night everyone! I hope you are all finding enough peace to sleep through the night. xo
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(He is early 40s btw...too young to be perpetually cranky!).
You are right, but this IS MLC; probably got Andropause thrown in the mix...and so he will be perpetually cranky for awhile..worse than a teenager. :)
I wish I could trust and think he is just being nice and cleaning up. Maybe I am paranoid and monstracizing him and he did to me, because he has hurt me so much and my guard is up.
The housecleaning and taking two of the children for haircuts to help you, is PURE guilt on his part.
The other, well, sometimes they find it in their hearts to help with the "heavy" stuff they know you have trouble with.
You know the take it all with a grain of salt; and watch to see what comes out of the dark. :)
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My H is all over the place here! I never got much of monster, and even then I don't think I got full force of it. It has been the 'nice' that tears me up and keeps me spinning. It helped once I saw a pattern with him though. I know that nice usually means he is about to do something awful or is just tied in with his guilt somehow.
I kind of think it is his (lame) attempt to ballance the scales. Very childish like HB said.
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Ok, I've tried not to analyze my h's recent actions for that exact reason: I'm not in his head and I don't know his motif.
My h is in withdrawal and lives on his own. While I was gone, he left me Christmas presents and even wrapped them (a first), he took my car to the mechanic, got it cleaned. Then last week when I was sick, he replied within seconds when I asked if he could co
e over to take care of our dog as I was in bed with fever. Before he left, he was REALLY nice and asked twice if I needed meds and soup (he seemed happy to see me after almost 2 months).
Did he do all this just out of guilt? He's not living with me and chose to do all these things for me.
Or is this his way of showing he cares? He's always shown his love through actions...or is this where "it's in his actions"???
Thanks!
Just a little confused here...
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Thanks HB: I love your input, always.
I didn't last too much through the night. As I fell asleep I set my worries aside and instead prayed for everyone on this board, plus an elderly friend of mine at work whose wife is gravely ill and he now cares for her at home because they have exceeded their 100 days of nursing home care and he can't afford $800/day for facility care. SOOOooo sad. A true tragedy....dnd he is one of our heroes - a Vietnam Veteran! Where is the justice!?! I so admire his dedication to his wife...truly inspiring.
So I prayed and I asked God to be by their side. I then prayed and asked for strength for whatever was brewing in my H's head that was going to come my way. I was afraid to go to work and have a process server show up at my office today! God seemed to say to me "Just stay still. Lay still. Keep your thoughts to yourself and sleep".
So I did. I had nightmares. First someone was chasing me and I woke up a bit past midnight and realized my H hadn't come to bed yet - third time in three nights he stayed up later than I and past midnight. In the olden days (last year) I would have realized he was on the computer with his EA, but the night prior I peered over to the first floor and he had fallen asleep on the couch. Same thing last night. For the last month or so I have felt the EA is truly over.
So I went back to bed - had a second nightmare about bees chasing me - sticking to me - not stinging yet but so close. I could shake one off and another would land elsewhere on my body. I woke up and my H was next to me sleeping away.
I have to confess that I get quite agitated when he sleeps soundly and I am an anxious wreck!
I wanted to wake him up for comfort but remembered what God had advised. I asked again and got the same nudge of an answer "stay still". I challenged "really"? Hmmm..wonder if I'm imagining it. I seem to wonder that a lot when I don't get the answer my impatient self wants to hear!
Well...truth be told - I did wake my H and said I was having nightmares and asked if I could snuggle close. He kinda half grunted a non-commital answer and that set me off a bit (setting me off means I quietly seethe and turn over...I am impatient but not much of a covert temper).
So...I said a silent apology to God and asked my H - "Are you ok? You seemed quite bothered today". He said "no, I'm fine". I said "I don't think so". He said "Just the same old stuff - I'm annoyed I haven't done anything about this situation". (By this he means he hasn't been to an attorney to initiate a separation, though I did tell him last week that I went to my own attorney because I felt threatened and unsafe by him saying he's going to leave for over a year/ I told him I needed to know my options and how everything works, yet for now I am choosing to stay).
I took the challenge. I said "Well, maybe you're starting to realize that's not the answer, and not the entire problem". I am careful not to negate his feelings of our marriage issues, which has some validity - I'll say 20%, but moreso IMHO, it is within him and his abandonment issues from childhood. It is his spiritual search and purpose for life that he is avoiding giving himself the right to feel and explore.
My H didn't answer me. He stayed quiet in the dark. I decided to heed half-way to what I thought God had told me and close my mouth then and there. I simply smoothed the lines out of his furrowed forehead in the dark two or three times and simply said good night. I'm sure he was relieved I didn't press the issue more as I would continued on have months ago, in high distress.
I rolled over, apologized again to God for my impatience and went back to sleep.
This morning he offered to take my S18 on a few college trips. I couldn't believe it! This has been a bone of my contention for quite a while now - that my H hasn't helped in this college search effort at all and my S is feeling unsupported. I have been on 6 campus visits, helped with the application process, and my H has done nothing!
I do believe my S's leaving is one of my H's triggers - a tough thing for him to face for multiple reasons. It was at 17 that he was abandoned and IMHO those feelings are surfacing as he watches my son age and experience things that I support him fully on, whereas at that time in his life my H was left totally on his own. :-[ Ironically (?) the same thing happened with my H's father at the same age, due to his own father and sister's accidental deaths.
But...its time to break that cycle....
Today was a pretty good evening. My H called to say he'd be home late which is another bone of contention I used to have - when dinner would be on the table and he would then call and he'd say he'd be another hour. I can't stand that! Anyhow, my H got annoyed at the dinner table at my S13 who was being a bit beligerent. My H was about to snap at him and I just interjected "Teenagers! You teenage boys! Argh!" My H smiled, like "I didn't realize that..I forgot about these testosterone issues..." and we sailed through it. My S13 likes to be referred to as a teenager so he actually appreciated the comment. Situation diffused. *phew. Sometimes I get lucky. Hope this andropause GOES AWAY!
Thank you for letting me vent.
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Did he do all this just out of guilt? He's not living with me and chose to do all these things for me.
Purple, bear in mind that he's in a different place now; and his choosing to do something for you was not out of his guilt, but out of his heart...he still does love you; and he cares about what happens to you.
Don't you remember when he was deeper within the tunnel; he did nice things for you because he felt guilty?
That changes as they come forward...my husband was in Depression coupled with Withdrawal when son and I were sick; but he cared for us because he wanted to..he was in a different place at that time.
Remember where he is, before you draw conclusions..remember things CHANGE as they move forward; and he is in Withdrawal at this time...but still making time for you.
Bless your heart; I knew you weren't trying to analyze his actions, but it's hard NOT to, especially when someone is speaking for a different place in the tunnel.
But yours is truly in a much better place, now.
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I had nightmares. First someone was chasing me and I woke up a bit past midnight and realized my H hadn't come to bed yet - third time in three nights he stayed up later than I and past midnight. In the olden days (last year) I would have realized he was on the computer with his EA, but the night prior I peered over to the first floor and he had fallen asleep on the couch. Same thing last night. For the last month or so I have felt the EA is truly over.
So I went back to bed - had a second nightmare about bees chasing me - sticking to me - not stinging yet but so close. I could shake one off and another would land elsewhere on my body. I woke up and my H was next to me sleeping away.
The first nightmare is indicative of your fears chasing you; and you fear what will happen if you are caught, so you keep running away....if that makes sense. So, you are running; if only in your mind.
The second nightmare is a warning that you are about to be stung or hurt; yet, you are keeping whatever is going to 'sting' or 'hurt' you at bay for the time being. The landing of the individual bees mean the time is at hand for whatever is going to happen; you've been "touched" but not hurt, as yet, if THAT makes sense.
Usually dreams indicate what is happening in your life; or things that will come in the future.
I will say this, you should have obeyed the Lord when He told you to be still..there is a time and season for saying things to your husband; and only the Lord knows when the time is right to either be still, be silent, or to speak certain truths. Pay careful attention to what He tells you to do, and do it.
So, I advise listening to, and obeying Him to the letter in all He instructs you to do.
Not getting onto you; just speaking from experience; when I disobeyed the Lord, things got worse; but when I stood still, and paid strict attention to His instruction to me; things got a whole lot better.
I learned through HARD experience that it is better to heed Him than to speak out of turn..things can get very bad.
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This thread is one that I also question, My H only had moments of Monster in the beginning, Just a few rants and raves. Nothing really serious, and I believe it came from me pushing, Like for instance. The first major Monster came when I had my emotional breakdown and tried to commit suicide. And he flipped a lid and screamed bloody murder at me while trying to get me to throw up pills I had taken on top of a drunk-in stoop I got myself into. ( I'm not proud ) but it happened, and he yelled at our D12, teeling her He was never going to be with me again!!
The second came when he put a status on His FB, proclaiming his undying love to the OW, when My D could have read it, ( she didn't know at the time) and I again flipped a lid. and he got in my face. Screamed at me and told me to leave him alone. Still nothing that major. The next morning he came to me and fell apart in tears. telling me he was sorry for acting like an a$$.
He did ignore me and D12 the first 2 weeks of his return. but that didn't last long either.
He has always been nice to me since. has done things for me around the house and we can still sit and talk for hours, without
any anger. He has shown great amounts of affection towards our D and is there anytime she needs him.
Granted, sometimes when he walks in the door, I can clearly see his stress. But within minutes he melts.
I mean melt, by I can see the lines on his face relax and he starts to smile. He has always said that he felt at ease when he is here. and can relax. So this is confusing.
Maybe because I have not really showed him anger? maybe because I have become his sounding board, and he knows it?
Ugh!
I do know that when I told him I could no longer stand, he became agitated. hmmm? Maybe I should be serious, after reading the length this whole MLC can take, Some of you have been doing it for years! I don't think I could do that. I have given myself a timeline. ( If the house goes into forclosure, and I have to move and uproot my daughter ) I am done.
Ive been in it now for 5 months, Gosh! It's so draining on the soul!!
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sy rather then a time line how about check points? One of the other loves here had a timeline but it failed and they decided on checkpoints to see how they were.
This stops you pressuring yourself.
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Shantilly,
Can you help me understand what you mean by check points?
My H keeps stressing that he doesn't want to lose the house. He has said that the last 4 times he has been here.
I know that weighs heavy on him, but I also have told him that if he wants to "save it" he would have to return
home in order to do so, because I am NOT leaving until I am thrown out by the MC.
I am hoping this might be the kicker, to bring him home, but I don't want to fool myself.
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Synicca,
Checkpoints are simply times where you see how you're doing; looking back to see how far you've come; and getting an idea of what may be in the future..and they are as individual as you are.
My H keeps stressing that he doesn't want to lose the house. He has said that the last 4 times he has been here.
I know that weighs heavy on him, but I also have told him that if he wants to "save it" he would have to return
home in order to do so, because I am NOT leaving until I am thrown out by the MC.
I am hoping this might be the kicker, to bring him home, but I don't want to fool myself.
Don't count on this to bring him back; we have a case here where Covenant Keeper's husband completely let the house go; and CK was evicted, more or less.
I would do whatever I could do NOT to lose my home...and I've done that, before; to keep from losing my house.....I like a roof over my head, thank you very much; and NO ONE is going to take that away from me; I remember thinking, if it came down to it; I would work a couple more jobs to keep myself afloat if it came to that.
It didn't happen that way; but it could have.
I learned very quickly NOT to depend on the MLC'er to do anything to help me; I had to help myself; and did.
I faced this in the extended crisis my husband went through; I paid all of the bills; plus our house payment...I was just NOT going to lose all I had worked for; just because he was being irresponsible. This went on for over a year that time.
I was put in the position AGAIN of paying household bills when he broke his ankle and went down for over 3 months last year. Of course, I KNOW this was a different story; but the 'Boy scout motto' still prevails; "Always be prepared".
So, it's something to think about; don't depend on anything to bring them back...in the end, if something is lost including your house; it really doesn't affect the MLC'er like it does you, the LBS.
Food for thought.
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Well they decided after realising the time line wasn't going to work, that it would be better if they saw how they felt every 3 months. So they had a check point. Every 3 months they see how they feel. Do they still want to stand? Do they want to move on? How are they feeling within themselves? All sorts of things. So that is what a checkpoint is for them
HB describes it well
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I just wanted to add my .02 worth to the "don't think that anything in particular will bring them back" bandwagon....
I have thought along the way that all sorts of things might be the thing that does the trick: OW not being "the onek", losing a job, death of a relative, mother's illness, business venture not being what he thought, the list actually goes on.
None of it did it. So far our house hasn't been threatened, but he has said how much financial pressure he is feeling, even while he has been spending large amounts of money on himself. So I have to fact the very real possibility that I will have to take some action to protect the house and children's education. Luckily I have got my own finances in better shape during this time, however that still might not be enough.
HB is right, those things won't really affect them in the way that they do us and the children, and it really is up to us to deal with them.