Midlife Crisis: Support for Left Behind Spouses
Archives => Archived Topics => Topic started by: Faith on December 20, 2011, 10:55:09 AM
-
I'm just looking for some input and opinions about what is "amicable". My H (stbx unfortunately) is always throwing this word at me when I don't behave as he wants me to. I am as NC as possible for my own emotional safety.
H thinks it's still my responsibility to inform him of all our kids' activities, even though I've told him since he doesn't want a wife anymore he needs to call the school/soccer coach/etc. and get himself put on the necessary email lists for information. He and his parents recently came to my D's choir concert (after I informed him of it) and I stayed away from them. I wasn't rude, I just kept my distance. For this I was again accused of not being "amicable". H thinks I should seek them out for fakey fake chit-chat, but I am just unable to do that anymore (finally have set some protective boundaries).
Now my D, who is normally a great student, is struggling in some classes. Her teachers say she is distracted and not as engaged as normal. No big surprise given her horrible family situation. I informed H of her midterm grades, and now he is repeatedly asking for more details and wanting to "help". I didn't even bring it up, but he immediately said that her grades are not due to our divorce, but that she is a social 14 year old and this is normal. How is he supposed to "help" her? He doesn't live with us and sees her maybe 2 hours a week for "fun". Plus he's telling himself she's just "normal". Nothing is his responsibility of course.
From my perspective, H just doesn't seem to understand what divorce means. That he can't leave his family, but still expect me to be his personal assistant, and he can't jump in and out of the girls' lives to help bolster his claim of being a "good dad". Am I way off base here?? Does amicable really mean I have to pretend we aren't currently in an awful court battle because he has been hiding assets to avoid supporting us? Do I have to be fakey nice knowing he has an OW?
Does anyone else's MLCer throw around this "amicable" word?
-
I'm just looking for some input and opinions about what is "amicable". My H (stbx unfortunately) is always throwing this word at me when I don't behave as he wants me to.
It's a controlling tactic, and it's not exclusive to MLC. There is a lot of social pressure on women to be polite and accommodating and to put others' needs before their own. Women who stand up for themselves or refuse to be pushed around are seen as "unladylike" or "b!tc#y."
As you say, your husband doesn't seem to grasp yet that he is going to be responsible for maintaining his own relationship with his kids. You have it exactly right; he doesn't get to toss the parts of your relationship he doesn't want to bother with and keep the parts that are convenient for him.
-
I don't hear amicable from my H, but I bet I would have if he'd followed through when he declared we're "DONE". FYI here are the verses I like to refer to from Ephesians 5:28-31
So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church: For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. What your husband is doing by insisting on all of the nicey-nice stuff is like a man who has basically just sawed off his entire arm, and as he's sitting there bleeding, he is demanding that nobody bring up the fact that he just sawed off his own arm. "Let's have a nice chat about the weather, or the kids or whatever, but let's not make a big deal over the fact I am bleeding to death okay? It wouldn't be nice."
-
What you're doing is absolutly the way to handle it. Your NOT his personal assistant. It's just a way to keep drawing you in.
My ExH acutally said he couldn't believe how much he missed the 5 PM dinners we had as a family every night. HELLLLLLLLLLOOOO ...EARTH TO IDIOT!!!! I don't live there anymore and either do the girls..what did you think a divorce is? Did you think we were coming up for dinner every night???
Well now I guess we have redefined divorce for ourselves as I'm back living here with the kids. ::)
Oh and if your hubby needs a definaition
Amicable implies being well disposed; amiable is acting well disposed and is commonly applied only to people—though sometimes it is used for occasions, while amicable is not applied to people at all but to human interactions and their outcomes. Amiable first meant "kind" or "lovely, lovable," and amicable first applied to things and meant "pleasant, benign."
-
My ExH acutally said he couldn't believe how much he missed the 5 PM dinners we had as a family every night. HELLLLLLLLLLOOOO ...EARTH TO IDIOT!!!! I don't live there anymore and either do the girls..what did you think a divorce is? Did you think we were coming up for dinner every night???
Hilarious! Yes, they only want to get rid of the "bad", but keep everything that's "good"!
-
Faith - I agree - he is trying to control you.
I'm about six months behind you in the BD timeline, and this year our teenaged sons have all struggled at school. Grades all way down, and teachers reporting they're not concentrating. (okay, so they're boys, but they have noticed a marked difference).
My H also got wind of this, and jumped on the band wagon wanting to help. His 'help' always causes more problems, and lasts a few days at best, until the next time that he wants to jump onto the band wagon again.
It's so very hard to watch our kids suffering, all the while our spouses are declaring it's 'normal' teenaged stuff.
-
Yeah this is the part of the BS he tried to spoon feed me ( and holler if anyone heard any of these)
"Oh the kids will be fine" :o
"I'll be happier so they will be happier" :o :o
"It's better for the kids this way" :o :o :o
WOW ... he should have been shot with a ball of his own sh!t..... no kidding.
-
Yip InThis - heard the lot.
Plus my personal favourites - 'I don't care if the kids no longer respect me, that's how strongly I feel about what I am doing'
and ' I can no longer live by your or your children's morals' (gotta love that one)
-
Yeah what about the one:
"Someday the kids will have thier own lives and what are you and I going to do together??"
The operative word is SOMEDAY STUPID!!!! We aren't done raising them yet!!!
And what are we going to do together??? - who the hell knows??? I ain't got a crystal ball and we are quite a few years away from that part yet.
Jeppers Creepers with the way he went back to the past and ahead to the future it's a wonder I don't have whiplash. Friggin' idiot.
-
I finally learned to do what I do to protect me and my daughter. I am confused lately as we are legally separated and lately he'sbeen emailing and I wonder..is this his way not to be the bad guy?
Last week he sent me a text asking what size our daughter was now..guess he was Christmas shopping..although I did send him the information asked for I had to share with Trusting "what does he think I am ...his wife?"
We have not lived together for 28 months....I still treat him with kindness and respect but he stays pretty much away from me whi h is easier on me.
-
I am confused lately as we are legally separated and lately he'sbeen emailing and I wonder..is this his way not to be the bad guy?
It's a safe bet this might be some but not all of what it's about.
"what does he think I am ...his wife?"
Boy you don't know how many times I've been clse to saying this. Maybe we ought to???
-
Still Standing is right; your husband is trying to control you; and manipulate you to his own ends...to be amicable is to be totally agreeable;(it also means to be friendly; but I know that's not happening right now)that is what your husband is aiming for; as long as it benefits HIM.
He's fixing to find out how things REALLY are, Faith....set your boundaries firmly, and don't back down, no matter what happens; most of all, don't allow him to manipulate and control you into catering to him.
He really doesn't want to be "seen" as the 'bad guy' unfortunately his behavior shows you the opposite of the way he thinks he is....he's in total rebellion at this point; the child within him is seriously overriding and controlling HIM in ways that you never thought possible, but it's happening.
The down hill spiral for him started when you gained temporary custody of the house; and he had to move back out..things are slipping through his grasp faster than he ever anticipated; and he's grasping at straws, causing MORE damage than he would have if he'd just simply left things alone.
But it is not within a typical MLC'er to simply leave things alone; like someone who constantly picks at sores to make them bleed because they can't seem to stop themselves; the MLC'er tries to locate all of the weak spots they can find, and tries to keep the wounds open and raw, not to mention keep the whole drama aspect going all of the time.
Learn to ignore his emails, texts, going completely NC unless it's a true emergency; don't play into his hands and drama; you do NOT have to answer him unless you CHOOSE to.
I hope this helps; as long as he's acting out; he does NOT deserve ANY kind of attention, nor do you have to be "nice" to him although I would suggest being firm if I had to deal with him....even children will create as much drama as they are allowed to create until they are stopped in their tracks.
Food for thought.
-
faith your h is probably referring to this
Adj. 1. amicable - characterized by friendship and good willamicable - characterized by friendship and good will
friendly - characteristic of or befitting a friend; "friendly advice"; "a friendly neighborhood"; "the only friendly person here"; "a friendly host and hostess"
lovable, loveable - having characteristics that attract love or affection; "a mischievous but lovable child"
peaceful, peaceable - not disturbed by strife or turmoil or war; "a peaceful nation"; "peaceful times"; "a far from peaceful Christmas"; "peaceful sleep"
He uses this to suit himself tell him to the look up the definition of FATHER/PARENT xxxxxxxxxxxx Ohhhhhh yes h and whilst your at it look up the definition of marriage and husband ::) ::) ::)
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
-
"As long as it benefits HIM." No truer words have been spoken.
MLC'r see only Self nothing or no one else matters.
Being "amicable" to an MLC'r is giving in to Monster's demand.
There's a reason they are called "Truth Darts"
Mac
-
Faith,
During my marriage I was the one who ended up looking after all the admin stuff and school affairs etc.
So in one on the first mediation sessions we had I put into the parenting plan that H needed to organise his own correspondence from the school and find out things for himself as I was not going to tell him. He's got everything sent separately to him now and it's been working well. I really didn't need that extra burden. We do share other things that happen which the other would not know about but he does still maintain he hasn't caused them any harm. I stated to him they were having trouble sleep ing and his immediate response was "That's not my fault the're not sleeping". Reeks of guilt if you ask me. There's still no concern for them. He's just angry the're not ready in the morning when he comes to collect them as the're so tired all the time. Mind you, I'm not shirking my responsibility as their parent to get them to be on time but I did let H know they feel worse about things at night when they lie in bed and think about it all.
The 'Bounderies' series of books are a good resource.
Hugs,
SP
-
Amicable in any other context means friendly and accommodating. There is give and take and spirit of goodwill.
In MLC land, it's a total lie and complete B.S. IMNSHO.
They use your willingness to play fair against you, they manipulate, lie, and cannot be honest with you let alone themselves.
-
The link to RCR's article Blind to Destruction
http://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/mlc_overview_depression_blind-to-destruction.html
-
Thank you everyone, it's good to know I'm not alone in my thinking. When we have to be at the same place, H will often text before hand "I plan to be amicable, I hope you do too". Um....I plan to completely avoid being near you. But I know it feeds his self talk of being the "good one" while I am the difficult one. He decided that years ago anyway and I can't control that.
Stillpraying, I am actually reading Boundaries right now and I agree it is a great resource!
HB, thanks for assuring me that it's fine to ignore his texts & emails. He keeps accusing me of "not working together" - again when I don't behave how he wants. I need to be firm and confident in my dealings with him.
In this for the long haul & Kikki, yes I've heard all of those. It was a relief (and shocking) to find this board and learn that they really do all speak from the same script. Word for word in most cases. My D17 even told H that he would be accountable to God for his actions and he said he knew and would just have to accept that. :o That was a rare moment though, every other time those comments are met with "it's not my fault and your mom will have to answer for what she has done".
With God's Help, I know exactly what mine would say if I told him to look up the definition of husband/father (maybe yours would say this too). "I WAS the perfect husband for our entire marriage and got nothing in return. YOU should have seen what a great husband you had. Our marriage is over but I am still a GREAT father" End of discussion. ::)
-
Thanks for the link Don'tGiveUp, it was good to read that again.
-
From Faith
"My D17 even told H that he would be accountable to God for his actions and he said he knew and would just have to accept that."
Soon after bomb drop when my wife was telling me about her decision to file for divorce, she told me something very similar to what your husband said. She also told me she did not feel God, and that He was silent to her. Within just a few weeks after bomb drop, my wife had made statements about each of the Four Enemies of the MLCer that Jim Conway describes.
-
HB, thanks for assuring me that it's fine to ignore his texts & emails. He keeps accusing me of "not working together" - again when I don't behave how he wants. I need to be firm and confident in my dealings with him.
At one point I was reading your main thread, and the one thing I saw missing was firm boundaries; and started to say something about that; but hesitated at that time; now, I see things are getting worse and worse as time goes on. This is because your husband is so very clearly out of control; and he's gotten worse about walking on you.
When boundaries are set; he is going to get very angry; because he doesn't feel you have the right to set limits on him; but HE DOES have this right to set them on YOU...this is a good example of how it's one set of rules for them, and another for the LBS.
The thing is, boundaries are definitely for YOU; but understand you set your boundaries; yet, be prepared to honor HIS, too. MLC'ers are childish in this way; but firm boundaries CAN cause them to begin growing in various aspects; that is IF they don't decide to run away for good if they decide NOT to accept the limits you place on their behavior toward you.
Honey, you really don't have anything to lose in this situation; your husband is completely OFF the deep end, and needs to be reeled back in any way you could to call him down and put him in his place.
He's the one who wants a divorce, but he also wants you at his beck and call; and you do need to give him a healthy taste of what it's like to be divorced ahead of time.
He needs to get a sense of what life post divorce would be like, and it would involve NC between the two of you to begin with; so begin with that; and progress along, as you need to.
As long as he acts the fool; continue to stay NC with him; this is NOT punishment; it's to allow YOU to start healing; and to show him that he cannot treat you just any old way; and keep the drama going, if that makes sense. It's also called consequences for one's actions....if you treat someone like crap; don't expect them to keep taking it; a boundary is called for to protect oneself.
Your husband is exhibiting some very bad behavior; and he needs to experience this "limiting" of his abusive behavior toward you.
Keep us posted on what goes on.
If you continue trying to deal with him; his actions are going to destroy what love you have left for him, if they haven't already.
Love to you,
HB
-
Thanks HB. Can I ask you, how should I handle it when he interprets my ignoring of him and boundaries as "refusing to work together." Should I come right out and say that divorce means no contact, or what would you suggest? I've told him before that I want very minimal contact because it is better for me, and he accuses me of causing our kids "pain" by letting them see me treat him badly. He tries to use the kids a ton. This does NOT get to me at all as I know it's ridiculous, but I would love to have a one line answer I can just repeat to him when he makes these accusations.
As for my love for him being destroyed. I believe it already has been. He is absolutely set on divorce and has us over $30k in lawyer debt already with his court battle. I can find no redeeming qualities in this man at all anymore unfortunately. :( At this point my only hope is that he comes around enough to at least desire to care for his kids and give up this battle to try to leave me penniless. For the first 18 months, I truly believed that God would bring my H to his knees, that He would reveal the changes in me that needed to happen, and we would be a testimony of a restored marriage and leave that legacy for our kids. I wanted that SO badly, but it's not going to happen and I've had to accept it. It still breaks my heart. Thanks so much for your help and care.
-
Thanks HB. Can I ask you, how should I handle it when he interprets my ignoring of him and boundaries as "refusing to work together." Should I come right out and say that divorce means no contact, or what would you suggest? I've told him before that I want very minimal contact because it is better for me, and he accuses me of causing our kids "pain" by letting them see me treat him badly. He tries to use the kids a ton. This does NOT get to me at all as I know it's ridiculous, but I would love to have a one line answer I can just repeat to him when he makes these accusations.
You've told him so many times, you're starting to sound like a broken record, Faith...I really feel for you. He's in MLC, and his rebelliousness is such that he's going to ignore anything and everything you say.
You might remind him that since HE'S the one who wants this divorce, then you don't want any more contact with him except for emergencies. You need to put his decision BACK on HIS shoulders; and also remind him there are consequences for his actions.
Or you could say; and I believe this is what you need to say to him each time he starts up: "You wanted this divorce, now you can LIVE with the consequences of YOUR actions" keeping this on HIM; then shut him down; and don't reply to anything else he sends. take back control of the contact; and limit it severely...this is what came to mind, as I know he's the one who wants this; NOT you.
Do you really HAVE to talk to him, other than to schedule time with the children? I would not talk to him any more than I had to, neither would I answer him any more than I had to.
He did this before, didn't he? You would ignore him, and he would go crazy at times to get your attention...and because you were trying so hard to survive, you'd eventually give in.
He's a CHILD at the moment, Faith; and children will act up as much as they are allowed to before you "call them down."...well, giving him the same answer each time, and shutting him down is the equivalent of "calling him down".
Yes, he will get angry; but then maybe he'll starting thinking about what he's doing/has done..but then again, in the shape he's in; who knows? The Lord says your husband is totally out of control; in ways, he doesn't know what he wants, in other ways, he wants what he wants; and since you're not doing what he wants, he harasses you because he CAN. He said that once your husband gets what he wants, he's going to find he didn't want it after all; but then it will be too late.
He also confirmed your next paragraph:
As for my love for him being destroyed. I believe it already has been. He is absolutely set on divorce and has us over $30k in lawyer debt already with his court battle. I can find no redeeming qualities in this man at all anymore unfortunately. :( At this point my only hope is that he comes around enough to at least desire to care for his kids and give up this battle to try to leave me penniless. For the first 18 months, I truly believed that God would bring my H to his knees, that He would reveal the changes in me that needed to happen, and we would be a testimony of a restored marriage and leave that legacy for our kids. I wanted that SO badly, but it's not going to happen and I've had to accept it. It still breaks my heart. Thanks so much for your help and care.
Just so you know the Lord DID work hard on your husband; but He's not going to "force" people to do what He knows needs done; and He won't tamper with free will, either. Your husband didn't listen; when he heard the voice of the Lord, he literally "shut Him out" of his mind, and refused Him entry. The devil then got a deeper foothold on your husband, and his behavior became MUCH worse within a short period of time.
Right now, EVIL is influencing your husband; BUT--who's to say after he gets what he THINKS he wants, he might not try to turn around. Time is still on your side, here; and there is hope as long as there is at least a shred of love for your husband within your heart.
I've seen the Lord take control of various situations and work them out; He says don't lose hope, but understand your husband may NOT return to you; he has gone so far; done so much; and it's nearly destroyed you not just emotionally, but financially, and in some ways, physically as your health has suffered some from this.
Faith, the Lord will honor what you ask Him for; and if you ask that your husband be removed; He will grant this for you; as the damage is SO deep; and you've done all you can do, and then some to STAND for your marriage; and your husband continues to move further and further away from you....to the point he only sees you as "useful" to him; and someone to harass constantly.
If you ask Him to work on your husband, to eventually restore your marriage; He will also honor that request; said to remind you that this would be the HARDER road to walk; and it would take a LONG time; but also understand your husband STILL might NOT choose to return....
Free will and decisions play a huge part in what He can and cannot do. Circumstances has a tendency to change a great many things in various situations.
The Lord is taking care of you and your children, Faith; He knows it's hard at the moment; but He IS within the midst.
I do NOT post things like this often; but it's all coming to me in a flood; the Lord is NOT pleased with your husband at this time; in fact He is EXTREMELY angry with him; and He says that your husband will pay a very hard price for all that he's done to his family and his wife.
Never discount the power of the Lord when it comes to His Mighty Hand...and pay strict attention to your Intuition because you will receive further instructions not long from now in regards to your wayward husband.
I hope this helps.
-
Hi Faith.
My H's D was final three months ago, but that has in no way affected my stand for a restored marriage. God will give us beauty for our ashes and sometimes God might have to totally bury our dead marriage in order to bring forth the beauty of a new one.
We just have to trust that God knows what he is doing. We cannot put a time limitation on God as He works in ways that are higher than our ways. And, do not think that your husband will not be brought to his knees whether the D goes through or not. Your H will reap what he has sown. That is a promise from the Lord. Walk with Him and He will vindicate you as He is a God of justice. God sees how your H is treating you and how he has disrespected God, his marriage vows, and his responsibilities as a husband and father. Your H will have consequences for the choices he has made - whether he believes that or not.
So sorry you are dealing with his childish behavior. Stay strong. We are all behind you.
-
Yeah what about the one:
"Someday the kids will have thier own lives and what are you and I going to do together??"
Right off the script. Mine said the same.
They're doing what RCR calls "reducing." As in, reducing their guilt.
Don't get mad, don't get emotional, just understand it for what it is.
H tried to blame me for not informing him of my whereabouts so he could "help" the kids when I left town for a weekend. (Our "kids" are older teens.) His blaming and spewing is an attempt to remove responsibility from HIM for repairing and maintaining a relationship with his children. A friend informed me right away, "It is NOT your responsibility to manage the relationship between your H and his kids." And I don't. I stay out of it, until such time as I detect that his behavior is imminently harmful to my children (apart from the disaster he caused by walking out on us with OW).
When he turned monster and sent me three angry texts accusing me of not helping him to help his children, I simply replied, "I do not stand between you and your children." Then I left it at that. His relationship will be the result of his efforts alone, not mine. I will not be blamed for anything he does or doesn't do. He really thought about those simple words, and he knows I am right.
Further, I agree with the other posters. Don't get angry, don't get emotional, just define your boundaries. You are not his wife and thus you will not be responsible for caring for him when he does not reciprocate. It's very simple. If you know this to be true and you act like it is true, there is no reason to be angry. It's simply a matter of fact.
You know your H is irrational now. So be compassionate but firm. Be assertive.
If he says the clouds are made of ice cream, don't get angry. If he insists that you fly around the room backwards, don't get angry.
Simply tell him the fact, "I am not your wife. You do not get the benefits that go along with me being your wife when you are not my husband."
-
I'm pretty much in NC with my H. I really prefer to handle all communication via text or e-mail so I can really think about what he is actually saying to me. Sometimes I have to read things two or three times, because I'm so used to accommodating him, interpreting for him, distorting what he says to minimize the poison, etc.
I think what your H means by "amicable" is, "helping me to not feel guilty about what I've done and continue to do...make it normal, make it acceptable by pretending everything is ok."
My H suggested, as did many of yours, that we all be friends--him, OW, and me. This would certainly be amicable, wouldn't it? That way, he could have his cake and eat it too, and everything would be so...amicable!
Somewhere he has read about these "amicable divorces" and it's all your fault you don't share his vision! Why, if things were amicable, you could be his secretary mommy, and OW could be his fawning toy! He could be king of the castle!
Because YOUR feelings don't matter--YOU and everyone else is simply a fixture in his life.
Nnnnnnnnnnot!
You have a responsibility to live your life to its fullest. Unfortunately for now, he has chosen to excise himself from it.
I like what HB says about reminding him that the design of his life has been HIS choice.
Go to charging neutral.
Hang in there--you're handling this really well!
-
My take on the ‘amicable’ part of the MLC’ers script is that it means that they get what they want without any resistance from the LBS. We have all heard the words spoken to us many times, along with the ‘I hope we can still be friends’. The actual idea of being fair or reasonable, and so ‘amicable’ is a totally alien concept to them.
Put boundaries in place and consider what is ‘amicable’ to yourself, not the MLC’er.
-
Faith:
My X was hell bent on destroying the love we shared for years it was only through the installation of "Boundaries" which protected my heart and feelings that have allowed me to continue to Stand and Shine.
Boundaries are to protect you. Being "amicable" has to be your decision not his. After reading your threads and the damage that your MLC'r has wrought frankly I'd have a hard time not punching his lights out.
Wishing you peace on your journey not of your making
Mac
-
I agree, amicable, is all about what they want. My H told me after BD he wanted us to be friends. WTH??? I cannot be his friend.
There is nothing amicable about our Divorce. He wants to pay me very little. He asked me for a list of my monthly bills once.
I sent him a figure that I needed each month. He text back, you are f'ing crazy if you think I am giving you that much every month.
I did not reply but guess what, that is what he is paying me. I just wanted to say ha ha to him. But I didn't. The final amount
has not been figured yet but my Atty told me it won't be less than what he has been paying me all these months. Right now I get
3/4 of his take home pay. When a couple if going through a Divorce, it gets really ugly because the H's don't want to pay usually.
Well I didn't not ask for this. I married him for life. Now these are HIS consequences for his very bad behavior. I really hate it being so ugly but H and his Attorney are the ones making it ugly. Not me or my Attorney.
Mac49, that is exactly what I would like to do to my H, punch is lights out, LOL!
Faith, I am thinking of you. Our stories are so much alike. I think we have the meanest H's and they are in such denial as to what they have done to us. I feel as you do most of the time, that my H has destroyed any love I had for him. But whenever I think that,
I always get that gut feeling that tells me to hang on, things will get better.
Take care.
HUGS TO YOU
NB
-
Faith,
In the short time I have been on this board, I see changes in you. You are much stronger than you were, much more in control of yourself. I just read HB's words to you and I am impressed. What a message there...
My h also is suggesting an amicable divorce, he suggested it over a month ago in an email and asked me for document numbers which I sent back to him. He has not gotten back to me yet about it. I agree with what people have written here - it is all about them and how they appear to themselves and imagine they appear to others ::)
My kids have also suffered at school, but they have come through... what this does to our kids is awful and I think that one of the things we as LBS's can do is focus more on them to help them over the hurdles as our MLCer is obviously not up to it. It is part of being the 90% part of the marriage at this time in our lives. The time that has been gifted to us ::) can be used in this manner too!
I have no contact with my h. really, although he still visits the kids at home and has lunch there when he feels like it, obviously, it is always when I am not there! He also has free access to the kids, mine a bit older than yours so I can't really interfere.
Faith, you can do it with God's help - the battle is His!
-
HB, Thank you for your lengthy and intuitive response to me - I truly appreciate it. I believe God uses you to minister to all of us here and I trust your words. You are totally right that I have ignored H several times for a period of time, but then he has managed to suck me back in with crazy allegations and such. I have gotten much stronger and feel like I can make that firm boundary now. It's so hard to give up the fight to make them see reason and logic, but it has to be done. I have had to encourage my D17 to give up that battle too as I see the frustration and anguish those conversations cause her.
I want to thank every one of you who have posted such encouraging words to me here. I would love to respond to every one personally, but just can't handle it emotionally right now. Just know how deeply I appreciate everyone who took the time to respond - you are such a wonderful group of people. I am praying for all of you.
-
Faith,
I'm reading your thread and HB's posts and really feel being spoken to also. maybe I'm wrong, but I always get a sense when something said just resonates with me and I feelo God directing a word to me also. My H is far from God. I can see it in his actions etc. Of course he justifies everything and believes he's forgiven even if he's not repentent. He also makes sure to point out the 'damage' I am doing to the children and the things I 'should' be doing (as he maintains he is doing ::) ::) ) if I want to be a good parent. It's just laughable really. Like he thinks I just buy it all ::) .
I'm sitting here sweating after cleaning out the bungalow/shed since H removed all his junk last week. It looks great and we can now store stuff that we've been keeping in the house. So therapudic. It's quite a warm day here so I am getting a good work out while at it. :)
Another good book I've found helpful which discusses bounderies and a whole lot more is '10 life saving principles for women in difficult marriages'. I'm reading it again on the train to work and it just gives me strength and helpful tips and examples of how to handle things even thoguh I'm not with H any more.
Hugs
and have a very happy christmas and new year.
SP
-
SP,
Those accusations about how we're "hurting" the kids must be part of the MLC script too. They really are ridiculous. My H also believes he's forgiven and that he and God are "just fine" because he was driven by me to his bad behaviors. Our marriage was a mistake and not God's will, therefore it is God's will that we divorce and H is set free to be happy with someone else. The stuff they convince themselves of is incredible, and it certainly doesn't come from any Bible I've read. What makes me furious is when he tries to convince our daughters of these lies. I pray constantly that they will have wisdom and discernment to know the truth.
Thank you for mentioning that book! It sounds like something that could be very helpful for a couple friends of mine too, so I will definitely check it out. Congrats on getting your bungalow cleaned out! I agree, it's very theraputic to rid our space of their stuff once they've gone. I can't imagine sweating though as it's very cold where I live! :P
Merry Christmas to you too!
-
Yeah what about the one:
"Someday the kids will have thier own lives and what are you and I going to do together??"
A gentle correction here, this sentence is NOT part of the MLC script; it indicates "future" speak, and part of this particular MLC'er wondering ahead of time what will happen once the children leave home; and he/she is LEFT with the spouse. It can be part of their consideration when making a decision about THEIR marriage. And, they may or may NOT speak of this; InThisForTheLongHaul got a very RARE look into her MLC spouse's mind when he spoke in this way.
This tells me he's seriously considering staying with her at a later time when he makes a final decision on HIS marriage; that's assuming nothing happens that changes his mind once this decision comes to the fore to be looked at.
This is also assuming that SHE will still want him; but this particular question/doubt that she might NOT want him to return to her, hasn't occurred to him, just yet, but it will.
They DO think they run the whole show, and this particular controlling aspect IS a part of the MLC script; they are controlling and manipulating; but at times, you will see "hurt" children within them, even at the very height of their rebellion.
For now, he's asking a lot of questions; most of them are within himself, part of his journey...this is also part of the LBS journey as they ask these same types of questions of themselves in a different way.
He's wondering if there will be anything "left" to work with once the children leave home; and it indicates he's aware this is will come in the FUTURE.
As a matter of fact, my husband and I had this discussion not long after he exited the tunnel the first time back in late 2002; and at that time, there were NO signs of MLC in him at that time; his secondary crisis didn't come until almost two years later. This was a reasonable question for us BOTH to ask, as there IS a transformation to the couple they were before the children came along; the only difference is the couple is older; knows more, and this same question can come at a time when the children are nearly grown.
I remember when speaking with my husband, he spoke of things we could do; and a type of life we could lead once son had left home...he voiced that this would make a great many changes in the way we related to each other, and he was right about that.
It is often forgotten the MLC'er's SPOUSE is one of their issues, because they are part of their PAST LIFE, not to mention one of the four enemies as per Jim Conway the MLC'er must resolve during the crisis.
I have never seen the quoted statement as a "guilt reducer", or even passing blame onto the LBS; this is a FACT of life; children are born, grow up, and form their own relational bonds with others and start households of their own; it is the way of the family to continue this pattern of the life's cycle.
This is also a valid question; and on occasion you CAN get some very profound things our of their mouths, as they continue their search for a "better" life, and deal with some of the real questions at hand.
Empty nest is a very real thing; my husband and I both went through this; and it called for an adjustment; believe it or not, it can also bring on a emotional crisis of a sort; because once the children "fly the nest" the first feeling the parent has is they are NOT needed anymore.
If your work has been done on your children to prepare them for lives of their own, they should NOT need you in a physically caring way(financial support, for example); except for advice at times, and as a sounding board. Just like you did; they must be allowed to make their mistakes, fall on their faces; and learn to survive, and thrive as mature adults.
NO child was ever meant to remain with mom and dad for their entire lives; there comes a time when the birds must fly the nest and survive on their own.
I was "sheltered" "controlled" and "overprotected" as a child, and the work that should have done was NOT done on me; my HUSBAND had to teach me to be self sufficient; and this was NOT his job; but he did it; and I'm thankful he did.
In turn, I was determined our son would NOT be shortchanged in the way I was; so I started preparation with him when he was still a teenager; teaching him as we went along.
The question remains here is what are they going to do when you are gone for good? Neither me nor my husband have our parents anymore; we never had help from either set; if we had allowed this, they would have CONTROLLED us, and we did NOT want that.
We did NOT want to be "parented" when we were ourselves, grown adults, and parents ourselves.
I asked for advice when I thought I needed it; and my husband asked the same of his parents when HE thought he needed it...otherwise, they were not allowed to interfere in our business.
We survived as we should have by pulling ourselves up by own bootstraps; and bearing this in mind, I taught son to be self sufficient.
He know if he needs help where we are; but he doesn't ask...call this "pride" or whatever; but he's SUPPOSED to operate in this way; as he has left our household; and has now formed one of his own.
Anyway, I digress...
This was what I remembered from experience; and I saw NO "reduction" of guilt in a statement of this kind.
A "reduction" of guilt is when they are using the children to manipulate and control the LBS; or even using other things within the situation at hand to accuse the LBS of the same things they are doing by using projection to try and get what they've done OFF their backs; and the LBS does NOT need to buy into this aspect....THIS is the MLC script at work.
They will use anything and everything to "reduce" their guilt; and the accusations, and projections WILL fly; right along with their confusion, and spewing; that is also intended to intimidate; and otherwise try and prevent the LBS from standing up to them and setting limits. They are all about control and manipulating circumstances to fit their OWN agenda.
Be gentle as doves, but wise as serpents when dealing with your MLC spouse. :)
Sorry about the hijack, Faith. :)
Take care. :)
-
HB, Thank you for your lengthy and intuitive response to me - I truly appreciate it. I believe God uses you to minister to all of us here and I trust your words.
Honey, bless your heart; I prayed really hard for what to say in answer to your question; and was startled when the "flood" started coming out of me to you.
The Lord has taken care of you all this time, Faith; and He continues to do so....you already know your husband is on the losing end of things; and he doesn't know it; but he will, in time; SEE what he's done.
I am PRO Marriage all the way, and if a marriage can be saved, I work that direction, as the Lord encourages me to encourage others to stay with it; using myself as an example.
Yet, the Lord, too, for reasons of His own; will deliver a LBS out of their marriage; and I will not always know why, but the LBS will always know...some things aren't meant for me to know as a definite.
Yet, the Lord, when I was going through, presented the possibility to me that my husband could have decided to walk away forever; this was HIS choice; and it didn't matter what I wanted....another aspect of learning we can't control what others do, the decisions they make, nor do we control their growth; although we CAN influence it in various ways; by setting boundaries, and being willing to do whatever is necessary to help them face their consequences for their actions.
I was very discouraged, and broken hearted as I posted what I did to you; but I obeyed the Lord, as not everything I get is good, there is some bad mixed in, and when He gives me a message for someone, it must be given in full; or I will pay serious consequences for disobedience.
Some people don't understand this aspect in me; but after having been chastised several times in the past for "softening the blow"of what I was told to say; I don't want to go that route again; and pay the price for disobeying the Lord.
My gifts are designed to be used for HIS GLORY, NOT MINE; and He uses me in various ways to help others; and sometimes that means delivering some hard news to others; but I do what I'm told, regardless.
He counseled me afterward, as I got pretty upset about what I'd had to post to you; I was thinking I was "adding" to your burden, but He said you would rather hear the hard truth, than to hear something empty that was designed to try and make you feel better.
You like knowing what you may be facing ahead; and I'm the SAME way...but it's hurts so much to see you in so much emotional pain; and I didn't wish to add to that.
He also reminded me that for every door He allows to close, another will open at a right time with something better. He also reminded me that I didn't hold the future in my hands, HE DID..and He strengthened me after He spoke with me.
What really made me feel better was when He reconfirmed that He held you and your children in the literal palm of His Hands; and that He WAS taking care of all of you.
I knew this, already, but for once, just needed to hear Him tell me this again.
Faith, you know I love you; I always did; and somewhere in your heart and mine we knew it was coming to this as your husband was getting worse and worse in his behaviors, and nothing you did was stopping him. You HAD set some boundaries before; but he violated them over and over.
When he shut out the Lord, and allowed the devil to control him; this was a final straw in this aspect....He doesn't give up on us; but like I said, He will give us enough rope to hang ourselves, if necessary to get our attention....and your husband is almost at the end of this rope.
It is a scary thing to fall into the hands of a living God; and we know He is NOT dead; but very much alive, and still working within each individual situation. :)
I hope this helps further....I'm OK; I was just a little shell shocked last night; not to mention very tired after that post. :)
Love to you,
HB :)
-
In my H's case the quote was more like, "I just didn't see a future for us when the children were gone. We have nothing in common."
This was said at BD. It was used as justification for seeking love from another woman. It is not a reducer statement.
The desire for everything to be "amicable" is an attempt to reduce guilt.
-
In my H's case the quote was more like, "I just didn't see a future for us when the children were gone. We have nothing in common."
This was said at BD. It was used as justification for seeking love from another woman. It is not a reducer statement.
This was and is definitely justification for his actions against the marriage...this and many more things can be said not only at BD but beyond as well, as the crisis progresses.
Big difference between that statement and this one:
Yeah what about the one:
"Someday the kids will have thier own lives and what are you and I going to do together??"
Which, like I said, was a valid question. :) This is just to clarify the difference.
The desire for everything to be "amicable" is an attempt to reduce guilt.
This desire is an attempt, like you said, to TRY and reduce their guilt; to maybe get the LBS to "buy into" what they are doing; so they don't feel guilty.
My point here is there is a huge difference between these two statements; justification for their overt actions toward their marriage and spouse, and attempted reduction of guilt within themselves are two different aspects.
One other thing you might consider; they are telling the truth about their feelings as THEY see it considering that perception is everything during the crisis, their state of minds, and what they are facing; there are times during the crisis they have NO feelings for their spouse at all in any way, shape or form. This is due to the emotional changes within them.
Right or wrong everyone has a right to how they feel, and the MLC'er is NO different than anyone else.
It is really easy to advise distance, detaching, and leaving them to twist in the wind until they figure themselves out; but this is NOT an easy process to accomplish, either, as it's easier said than done.
But the only way to save yourself and your sanity is to do these three things so you can survive and thrive.
One last thing knowing what they are doing, and trying to understand what they are doing; is NOT going to make this process go any faster; it can serve to suck you in so deep at a later time because you can't let go that you'll have more and more trouble extracting yourself from the quagmire of your own making...simply because the more know you know, the more you want to know; and the less it helps you to focus on YOU.
There was a time when I could NOT get any more answers for awhile; I was focused TOO heavily on him; never mind the fact I had enough to go on for awhile and really needed to keep walking my journey.
It was only when I let go in ALL ways that I started learning once again in various other aspects.
I have answered question after question after question on various aspects of MLC over time; and for each question I have answered another one comes...and that's OK; but when you allow your need or want for understanding to interfere with your journey; you are hurting, not helping yourself.
There is NO sense to be made of a process that NO sense CAN be made of.
I'm an analytical personality as a general rule; I like to take things apart and see how they work; and there was one a time when I looked anywhere and everything trying to figure this out.
I consider myself fortunate that I was able to get as much as I did in the way of answers/understanding; but even my own understanding didn't receive all and everything, and there is an "end" to my own knowledge, wisdom and understanding, just as surely as there is an ending to the crisis; whether by resolution or death of the MLC spouse.
With that said, I still don't have every answer there is; I don't believe anyone will ever attain it all.
I hope this helps. :)
-
HB, thank you again for your insight, care and encouragment. You have no idea how often over the past 2.5 years I've visualized myself being held in God's hand. It always brings comfort - thank you for reminding me.
My H had our girls on Christmas Eve and spent much of the day sending me nasty texts. I finally told him "you keep telling me you have 'moved on', maybe it's time you actually do", meaning I feel that a person who has "moved on" wouldn't keep spending his time trying to instigate fights with his stbx. What started his current rage is this....and I'd love feedback from anyone as to whether or not I handled this correctly.
H was to pick the kids up to spend the night with him and his family and celebrate Christmas Eve. Late the night before he was coming, he informed my D that he would be coming hours before our agreed upon time. Both girls had plans for the day and weren't happy with the change - neither was I. He refused to budge, even after I got involved, and said he would be there in the AM to pick them up. I finally told H that if he insisted on coming hours early to pick them up, he could wait in the car until they were ready to go. When he came the next day, my younger daughter answered the door and let him in. I came and told him I'd like him to wait in the car as I had stated earlier. He became very beligerent and kept repeating that he would wait for HIS KIDS "right here". He stood there for 30 minutes against my wishes (remember he is the "amicable" one). After they left, I consulted with my lawyer who confirmed that since I have sole temporary use of our home, H does NOT have the right to enter and we can seek a harassment/restraining order if it happens again.
As my lawyer instructed, I sent H an email stating that he cannot enter our home without permission and if it happens again we will have to call law enforcement and get a restraining order. This is what set off his texting rampage. He again told me that he was trying to be "amicable" and I wanted to subject our kids to watching their dad hauled off to jail. He told me how horrible I was to expect him to wait in the car. He twice told me he would "pray for me" because I am so filled with hate and "anguish", he "hoped I could enjoy Christmas in spite of my bitterness", etc. I responded that HE chose divorce and court, so he will have to obey the court order. He does tell me ad nauseum that he has "moved on", so I finally told him that finding new girlfriends does not equal moving on and that his rage shows he is miserable. I know that's more than I probably should have said, but he has left me alone for 3 days now so maybe it at least accomplished that.
Do you all think I am being difficult by not wanting him to come in the house when he picks up the kids? Sometimes he uses the bathroom, or looks through papers on the counter - it just feels wrong at this point. Would it be better for the kids if I suck it up and don't make a big deal about it, or should I set clear boundaries now that I have a court order to back me up? My first priority is doing what's best for my teenage girls.
-
Faith,
I don't know what is the 'right' answer but it sounds exactly how my H would behave. I also believe in bounderies but it does get confusing sometimes when we want to do what is best for the kids. However, respecting ourselves is also important for the kids to see.
Hugs,
SP
-
Hi I think amicable is my H favorite word..........
Lets be amicable about this......what exactly........ the divorce.......contact with the kids.......H not giving me enough money to live on because he can't afford it[hilarious]........H taking our family home from us.......just a few examples.
So you walk out on a 23 year M, 5 beautiful kids without even trying to make it work and no valid truthful reason or explanation and you want amicable.
Amicable for my H is about what he wants when he wants it.......changing things to fit in with his life and expecting me and kids to just go along with it everything is his way or no way.Like tonight when H wants to change his contact day with kids as his job which is his life now is more important than his kids he does not get his own way so he spews at me.
Am not going to keep changing plans to suit him for a start it unsettles the kids and I'm entitled to a life as well.
Will probably tell his solicitor I am stopping him seeing them
Oh well can't keep accomadating H every need when he does not know the meaning of the word amicable xxxxxxx
-
My H has been amicable actually. After he ran away and hid at ows for 6 weeks ::) sent me a card saying sorry and Mama Bear pushed me away...this new woman wouldn't do that...He said he just wanted to clean up his mess and see his kids. :'(
I played it by ear after that and actually listened to the advice on here and I must say he's well behaved. I laugh when he knocks before he comes into our house. He still has keys and door is always open. I kinda act towards him like we're still married (no papers or talk of D) so that's it. I am LUCKY. I am grateful. If my H acted like NBs or Faiths I'd be on death row for homicide. ???
After reading through all this great advice and postings I do agree with them about IT BEING CONTROL. They want what they think they want when they want it. >:( Immature tantrum if he doesn't get it.
I do think his ow or someone planted that word in his head. Maybe "Tell your bats**t crazy wife to act amicable" MLCER gets a lightbulb over his head (big words) "Yeah, I'm gonna tell her to act amicable! She should. She's wrong." :o :o :o :o Until his Ho Down OW comes up with another word for him to use that's it. LOL! Hugs for you Faith. You've got you're hands full over there and you're doing all the right things as far as I can tell. :)
-
Hahah...."Ho Down."
HAHAHAH! ;)
-
Yes, I do have to agree it's a miracle I'm not on death row. :P Mama I think your theory about OW or whoever planting the amicable seed is spot on. Once someone explained to H what it means and he translated (twisted) it to a definition more to his liking, he latched on for dear life.
Last night I was blessed to be the recipient of his amicableness (?) once again as I read the custody agreement he had his lawyer write up. Included were several paragraphs about what I am not allowed to say around the kids. I am not allowed to talk about financial agreements, I am not allowed to put him down or let anyone else put him down in the presence of my kids. I am not to "lobby" my kids about activities..or something...I have no idea what that one means. I'm not to talk to them about the "parenting schedule" (whaaat?) I am to notify H 2 days in advance of a routine doctor visit for the girls and he can attend if he wants :o. Yes, every teenage girls wants their dad at their physical. He's never been to their doctor's office, I suppose now is a good time to start. The document goes on & on, essentially saying "don't say anything bad about me" in 50 different ways and "I don't want you, but I darn well will still be controlling you".
Now we'll get to pay the lawyers a couple more thousand to make endless revisions of this ridiculous document. Trust me...what I told you is 1/50 of the insanity included in it. Maybe someone here could tell me if this sort of thing is standard? And who actually enforces all this anyway? Maybe the small print states I agree to have my home bugged. :P
-
Oh Faith, that is ridiculously insane. Can this be serious?
-
Hi Faith ~ Your H has truly lost his mind. Talk about controlling, your H wins the prize. No, I do not believe this is standard. I have never heard of such agreement. I think you and I have the two worst MLCers on the board. Just my luck. ::) ::) I won't resort
to killing him off although the thought has crossed my mind a couple of times, LOL. Truthfully, I'm more worried about H's OW and her family coming after me. They are that type of people if you know what I mean. What did your Lawyer say about this document? You sound good. Stay strong!
HUGS
NB
-
Kiki & NB, yes he's serious. He also made up a holiday schedule that gives him ALL the holidays except Memorial Day on the even years and I get them all the odd ones. So he convinently gets them for every holiday this year. How weird is that?? Why wouldn't he want to split them up like I get Thanksgiving & he gets Easter, etc.? He also just can't grasp the fact that they are 17 1/2 and 14 and will pretty much do what they darn well please with regard to visitation anyway - as they have been since he moved out.
I sometimes wonder if his own lawyer thinks he's a nutjob.
I would love to hear from any divorced folks if all this "parent conduct" stuff is normal to have in custody paperwork.
-
I sometimes wonder if his own lawyer thinks he's a nutjob.
Or, another thought - is the lawyer in the middle of a MLC himself/herself?
-
Kikki I agree with you!!! I think the lawyer is MLC also. That is the most bazaar bunch of crap I have ever read.
We had kids that were 18 at the time of the D and 15.
And it is correct-no matter WHAT the divorce states the kids at these ages DO NOT have to see their father. In NYS the age is 14 that they can decide for themselves I believe.
My ExH wanted to do 4 days with D18 at his house with her at mine for 3.
D15 would only do two days with him.
After a while d18 didn't want to go up because he was always on the phone trying to figure out whether to keep or dump the exskank ::) Then when he dumped her he was on the phone with the authorities trying to get her arrested. Which he did suceed at.
And then d15 wouldn't stay the night to make it two days.
Holidays last year were a fiasco. The judge ordered no support either way.
So left to my own devices?? I let the kids do whatever they wanted.
-
Faith When my h was getting divorced from his first wife( a chambermaid from Poland who he got pregnant at his motel) :o :o :o Their son was 7. H was using those vicodin pain killers. he was abusing vicodin. Her lawyer was the Asst DA in our county . The papers said "H couldn't drink alcohol around his son. H couldn't take over the counter drugs ??? ??? ??? H couldn't smoke around him. H couldn't have son around mama bear . H couldn't whatever they thought up" And she had been cheating on him and left him :o :o It was insane. Didn't help that I got a dwi a few years later. Anyway my point being the judge yelled at them LOL He said "This kid is gonna grow up and get married and have a life. STOP THIS NONSENSE." ;D We always laughed about the no otc products. WTF?
Hopefully your judge might be a smart one. It backfired on them big time. :)
-
Well, I do feel better knowing I'm not the only one who finds this whole thing completely crazy. One of my favorite lines in the document is this "The parties agree to advise the children about the importance of not speaking negatively about either parent around the children". I've read that at least 10 times now & still can't figure out what the heck it means. :o
Mamma, we do have a good judge. Since our temporary support hearing a whole 2 months ago, H has tried twice to get his support amount lowered for this or that, and both times the judge basically said "you didn't bring that up at the hearing so too bad so sad". I have actually wondered if H's lawyer is also an OW by the way they consipire for evil so well together. Either that or she's just enjoying sucking him dry financially by encouraging his antics. She's very unprofessional and nasty, but it did backfire at our first hearing for sure! Maybe she is in MLC - hadn't thought of that! That is very funny that your H wouldn't have been allowed to take a Tylenol or a Tums!
-
One of my favorite lines in the document is this "The parties agree to advise the children about the importance of not speaking negatively about either parent around the children". I've read that at least 10 times now & still can't figure out what the heck it means.
??? Think it's a rather verbose way of saying not much.
Hints that neither should speak badly of either parent around the children - but doesn't say that. Says that the children are to be advised of this matter, not that it should be followed through.
Crazy all right :o
-
I'm just going back to the original topic for a bit.... the "amicable" thing. This is something my H has said as well, that "he" is in a good place to be amicable about all this, that "he" now wants to sort things, and so on. I'm seeing that it isn't being "amicable", it's wanting to impose his desires on us all.
I have got some self-pity mixed in, such as how much pressure he's under but that he's continuing to look after us all (financially), and so on.
I can see that he's trying to make it so it's hard to argue -- after all, he is paying, and it's not like money isn't important.
But I have also learned that while I can't stop him, neither do I have to put myself through his version of "amicable'. There's a lot of just walking away involved, which I'll admit for a long time felt "wrong" -- such as when he asked to meet me to discuss this I felt bad about turning him down. I then realised that I had every right to not put myself through that. I used the time to get good advice, but haven't agreed to meet him, and don't plan to. I don't have to engage in a discussion I don't want to have; I will comply with what I have to do if it comes to legal action, but I don't have to sit and supposedly in a friendly manner destroy that which I hold most dear.
It's kinda scary, actually, because it's again different, but the more I learn about what he is doing (he has been very secretive for a long time) the more I see that I really don't want to be involveld. Also, it may mean changing my r with his sister, which I have valued, but that is something else I am going to have to get used to. There is being nice and maintaining an r, and there is letting oneself be used. I need to stay on the right side of that boundary.
-
Quote
One of my favorite lines in the document is this "The parties agree to advise the children about the importance of not speaking negatively about either parent around the children".
I've read that at least 10 times now & still can't figure out what the heck it means.
It perfectly explains what I always do--"NOW kids it is not good to speak poorly about your father--it is one of the 10 commandments, and I did love him and always will, HOWEVER, that does not erase the fact that he is freaking crazy and this bull has to stop. He wants you to do WHAT..."
That means it's okay to do it as long as you explain why you're not supposed to--I say leave that in, the rest has to go...
Now that I am on the other side of it, there are two thoughts. A contract is only as good as your willingness to enforce it. If you think he is going to keep dragging you back to court because you were 15 minutes late because there was an accident, then you HAVE to get good language in there. The other train of thought, the one I ascribed to was to go for broad generalities that could kinda be bent to fit any circumstance... Some would argue this is better in the first case, also, but some people like, possibly your H need the detail.
We have a mediation appointment on Thursday to discuss my lack of "amicableness." I am looking forward to it--I am so tired of dealing with him... I do not envy you, but remember you will get through it, and keep remembering that no matter how old your kids are, time does fly and they will decide what they want and there will be no arguing about it... Love and light, Lisa
-
Trustandlove my situation is like yours in that.......
H is very secretive
H still pays mortgage [it is a joint mortgage]
All the utilities
My car
Food shopping although not enough to cover my monthly bill........costing him about 2/3 his wages.
I am lucky in that all utilities/car are in H name only so he would be very foolish not to pay as he would hate to have a poor credit score.
H has reduced our outgoings considerably since leaving cancelling.........life insurance,private health insurance,all the kids satelite,reducing house insurance etc
Sept /Oct I had several texts asking if I would meet H so we could discuss finances and move things forward as amicably as possible as the house is too expensive to run long term,despite me telling H that I was not ready and he needed to give me time I felt guilty I guess and gave in.
We did meet with my counsellor/mediator in Oct I had to sit and listen to how I am to blame for all this, did not get around to finances apart from me telling H I am not moving out of my home.
Whilst I guess I was not being amicable it is our family home the only one my youngest 2 have ever known and they don't want to move.
Part of me thinks a new home/fresh start may help me get on with my life but I love my home.
I made a mistake meeting H as it set me back emotionally.
Occasionally H will text about finances but I have asked for NC now.
Like you I won't/can't put myself through it,anything I have to do legally I will but my solicitor can deal with the rest.
-
T&L:
This craziness never ends just manifests in a different fashion/argument. My "X" believes we should be 'friendly" whatever that means that means to someone who lies, cheats and deceives.
Mac