Midlife Crisis: Support for Left Behind Spouses

Midlife Crisis => Our Community => Topic started by: PacificLove on April 28, 2016, 07:55:00 PM

Title: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on April 28, 2016, 07:55:00 PM
Someone please stop me!!!

So here's an interesting question... took W car to get gas tonight and noticed her bags in the trunk. Wondering if she's going to OM tonight, if she does I'm tempted to go place a note on her window and tell her to forget about the weekend unless she's willing to come clean and stop the A.  Or should I just let it go... so tough!


previous thread: http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=7681.0
Title: Re: Someone stop me...
Post by: PacificLove on April 28, 2016, 08:49:28 PM
Alright cooler heads have prevailed... what would showing up and proving what I already know to be true help the situation in anyway, it would likely only make things worse... she'll do what she wants and it will just make things more tense between us. So I need to stay strong, her guilt will eventually overcome her (yes I know she feels no guilt now - or very little...)

Title: Re: Someone stop me...
Post by: Thunder on April 29, 2016, 06:00:11 AM
I'm glad you changed your mind.  It would have done more harm than good.

The other thing is Pac you have no idea what she is feeling.  She could feel the guilt but not letting you see it.
Don't assume anything.
Title: Re: Someone stop me...
Post by: PacificLove on April 29, 2016, 09:06:46 AM
I'm glad you changed your mind.  It would have done more harm than good.
Oh I oscillated on this all night, barely slept. But figured if I did go I'd only make my birthday worse. I'm still tempted to confirm mileage when she gets home this afternoon but may hold off until Sunday.  (he lives 35 miles away and her place is only 5 miles). Woke up for the first time in 12 years on my Birthday to an empty bed but my D came bouncing in a short-while after with her gift for me. Treasured moments for sure.

The other thing is Pac you have no idea what she is feeling.  She could feel the guilt but not letting you see it.
Don't assume anything.

There's guilt there, I can see it in her eyes and by her behaviors, she's just not opening up about it. I can also see she herself is conflicted by going away this weekend (we both are)... I was thinking of sending her an email this morning "letting her off the hook" if she doesn't want to come and prefers to work, but at this point am thinking of just letting it go. I firmly believe she's in a tug of war right now between family and OM, and am pretty sure he's putting some pressure on her. At some point she'll be forced to make a decision. Just as she's lying to me, I'm sure she's lying to him as well.

Title: Re: Someone stop me...
Post by: PacificLove on April 30, 2016, 10:18:48 AM
Quick update on the weekend so far... it's exceeded expectations but at the same time know not to read too much into it.

W treated me to a beautiful beach-side resort, D is here so it's not as romantic as it could otherwise be, but at the same time neither of us are looking for that right now.  Good conversation, every now and then she brought up future talk but I quickly tried to steer the conversation away or remind her that it's hard to discuss those things right now. So far haven't really seen her on her phone all that much (other than when she's in the restroom). She even left it in the hotel room when we went out for dinner.

As we fell asleep last night she reached out and held my hand. Good start to the morning, with some fun plans for the day.


 
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: Thunder on May 01, 2016, 07:34:41 AM
Happy Birthday, Pac!

I'm glad things are going good.  Just enjoy the moment.  No stressing.   :)
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: Shining Star on May 01, 2016, 08:38:49 AM
I am happy for you.  Sometimes, it is nice to feel normal for a little while.  Enjoy every moment.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on May 01, 2016, 09:26:39 PM
Back home... was a great weekend all in all, no arguments, pleasant moments and even a dinner just the two of us last night. This afternoon reality started to set in though as she started talking about some weekend plans coming up and who's weekend it was to watch D. Pretty sure she's spending the night here as she doesn't seem to be making any headway to leave (and D just went down which is usually the time she get's ready to leave) will be interesting to see what bed she picks.

As we talked over the weekend I'm becoming more convinced this is a MLC and not just an A  :( That likely means I'm in for the long haul. She shared a lot about where she was with her faith (questioning it) and how she wants to get out and do a bunch of different activities with her GF's, she was even mildly disappointing she missed a golf date with one of them today. (shared with me the text between her GF's as there was some funkiness too it)

Her texting between her and OM, if any was almost non-existent through the weekend. I caught her looking at her phone a few times in bed last night but he wasn't sending anything to her. She even left her phone in her purse for extended periods or at the hotel when we were around the resort.

I honestly believe she doesn't think I know about the A - despite me confronting her 4 weeks ago. I think she thinks she's got me convinced it's nothing - despite me believing she's spent the night there a few times in the last few weeks.  So herein lies the danger.. and options:

1) Leave it as it is, continue to work on myself and hope that things will die a slow death on there own and let her continue to either believe she has silent approval or that I have no clue whats going on
2) somehow remind her that I know (even go as far as to call OM Spouse) to put some pressure on it to end.

I've been doing a lot of research on exposure the last few days, I don' t know if it's the right approach here or not, especially if she's truly MLCer.

Anyways, all in all I'm glad we had a great Birthday weekend. I don't know if this put us further back or if it perhaps was a reminder of how we could be together. I know though that as long as the A is alive, it's hard to work on any forward progress for the R. The past 6 months have certainly taught me that.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: Reinventing on May 02, 2016, 01:17:58 AM
Quote
I firmly believe she's in a tug of war right now between family and OM, and am pretty sure he's putting some pressure on her.

Another way to say this is, "I firmly believe she is in a tug of war right now between family and the high that comes from infatuation hormones."

You already know there is an OM and she knows that you know. At some point you can decide that you know and that your focus is on you and your healing. Believe me, I understand the lengths our brains will go to deny, hope, try and see any little piece of evidence to the contrary, in order to not accept the ugly truth that our spouses are having an affair. Just know that your brain will do that. When she is nice you are going to tell you self that it's over between your W and the OM. Just know that your hope for things to go back to what you thought they were is very, very strong.

Unfortunately, things will never be the same even if OM disappears right now. What is happening to you is traumatic and you need to heal whether she gets her high from cocaine or OM. Your life has fundamentally changed and that is what you need to focus on. You and your healing.

This takes years to play out. Whenever you can, accept that she has an OM, that she lies to you and to OM, that she may spend time with you when he is out of town anyway, and that he is a drug to her right now. She is unstable and having an affair, and as you continue to respond to her instability, you remain unstable as well.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on May 02, 2016, 01:10:08 PM

Another way to say this is, "I firmly believe she is in a tug of war right now between family and the high that comes from infatuation hormones."

.....

Unfortunately, things will never be the same even if OM disappears right now. What is happening to you is traumatic and you need to heal whether she gets her high from cocaine or OM. Your life has fundamentally changed and that is what you need to focus on. You and your healing.

Thanks for the reality check... still part of me wants to try and have some control over the outcome, perhaps that's why I keep coming back to the idea of exposure. A good quote on another forum though was that "once you expose you can't go back" I think that really set in for me to perhaps wait a little longer, I realise that waiting could further evolve their relationship but at the same time exposing could kill any chance at reconciling if it goes the wrong way. Right now she sees me as a beacon light home, if I expose she will see me in a very different light...

Oh the decisions we have to make as Betrayed....
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on May 02, 2016, 04:20:13 PM
Came across this interesting read today by Anne Bretch about fighting for your marriage... certainly resonates with me a little as to where I am (Anxiety, wanting to take back control)

http://beyondaffairs.com/affair-recovery/should-i-fight-for-my-marriage/

Anyone else tried something similar? or thoughts on it? There's fighting and then there's standing... it sounds like she sort of accomplished both.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on May 03, 2016, 09:27:03 AM
Really struggling with Patience this week... perhaps the past weekend wasn't such a great idea, it reminded me of how "good" we can be together, I only hope it did the same to her but have my doubts  :-\  I think I will take it as a learning lesson to avoid time together unless she's willing to come back to the R.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: honour on May 05, 2016, 06:19:18 AM
Came across this interesting read today by Anne Bretch about fighting for your marriage... certainly resonates with me a little as to where I am (Anxiety, wanting to take back control)

http://beyondaffairs.com/affair-recovery/should-i-fight-for-my-marriage/

Anyone else tried something similar? or thoughts on it? There's fighting and then there's standing... it sounds like she sort of accomplished both.

From the article you linked to:
"You ask: Should I fight for my marriage?

You get to decide. Don’t be over responsible. Don’t be under responsible. "

Articles like that one abound on the Internet. Anyone could write flim-flam like, "You get to decide. Don’t be over responsible. Don’t be under responsible."

If you are having to fight for your relationship, in my view, you are with the wrong person.

If your relationship is not smooth, easy, harmonious and enjoyable then you are with the wrong person.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: Samurai on May 05, 2016, 06:37:32 AM
If your relationship is not smooth, easy, harmonious and enjoyable then you are with the wrong person.
If your relationship is smooth, easy, harmonious and enjoyable, you are in a movie. ;)

In real life you have to work for it.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: honour on May 05, 2016, 06:44:59 AM
If your relationship is not smooth, easy, harmonious and enjoyable then you are with the wrong person.
If your relationship is smooth, easy, harmonious and enjoyable, you are in a movie. ;)

In real life you have to work for it.
How are things working out for you, in real life?
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on May 09, 2016, 01:20:46 PM
So weekend overall wasn't terrible, W texted me on Saturday night asking if I wanted to join her and D for dinner, I declined saying I had plans. Got home later though and got drawn into an argument, I should have walked away but it actually ended up being somewhat enlightening.

I brought up the fact that I know she's seeing OM, she's still denying anything going on, saying she just crashes there occasionally when in the city, she then accused me of still following her and that I need to stop since we are separated. Fair point (and I know I should).

We then talked a bit about Divorce vs. Separation, she is determined not to file as she wants us both to maintain our lifestyles, houses, etc. if we filed, neither of us could afford to buy each other out of our main family home, but I'm free to date if I want - not what I want right now...

After thinking about it over night, I do have it pretty good right now, I have D pretty much full-time and get to live in the family home. Financially we are both contributing our proportionate amount - she's the one making most of the compromises (or getting the benefit of seeing D with minimal responsibilities and OM without any consequences) depends on how one looks at it.

Sunday morning I apologized for lashing out and she responded by saying no-need I have the right to be angry. She invited me for breakfast with D for Mother's day and I agreed to go along. More or less nice day together, as if the previous nights argument didn't happen although she made a few references throughout the day about finding a more permanent solution to her temporary accommodation. Probably a minor set back in terms of DB.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on June 03, 2016, 12:21:18 PM
Wow, been almost a month offline however have been active in other forums... we have now been separated over 2 months, W has not shown any monster, in fact she's been trying to be pleasant and reaching out and wanting to spend some time - but no indication of returning to the R. I've been trying to stand off a bit, accepting some requests but not all.

I've found a lot more info (some accidentally) that indicates she may be wanting a real change in lifestyle. She recently purchased two books on Amazon on Polyamory, and when I review her "viewing" habits of the last 6 months on stremaing, they include shows like "The Mistress", "Secret Diaries of a Call Girl", "The Affair" and movies like Cruel Intentions and Eyes Wide shut. Add to that the photo shoots she did of her self last fall... I don't know if I really know her right now.

Are these signs of an MLC'er? or a Sex Addict/alternative lifestyle that's been held inside for the last 10 years? When we first met we had a very active creative sex life but it has gotten somewhat stale and repeatable. We tried to spice it up a bit last fall after the first BD but since then have not been intimate at all.


Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on August 16, 2016, 05:45:22 PM
A few months has passed, yeah I've been more or less absent from this and other forums as I've been taking some time out to detach and work on myself. Finally being productive at work and giving W space. Temptations are still there but I try and refrain from monitoring her the best I can... More and more I'm convinced I'm dealing with a MLCer but one that is very much "engaged".... a summary of my sich below:

The not so good:
mid 2015 - BD, EA discovered, almost moved out
Early 2016 - BD #2, ILYBINILWY PA confronted, denied, moved out
has been living in temporary residence since then
More or less emotionally detached from each other since May
Looks like a permanent place is becoming available in Oct.
Becoming more secretive when at home - locking bathroom doors, hiding stuff, etc.
Has changed her physical appearance, bought a sports car, changed jobs, changed diets and was dressing provocatively - that's simmered down the last 6 months
Anniversary passed unacknowledged by either of us (except D)
Arguments prevail every now and then about finances or childhood responsibilities

The good? (here's where things are confusing - but give me glimmerings of hope)
Still maintains kid, financial and household responsibilities
Txts' me most days with something (usually kid/finance/house related) 80% of the time she initiates
Spent a great B-day, M-day and F-day together, D's birthday is coming up and we'll co-celebrate (my decision to include her)
Sends pictures randomly of D
Hasn't brought up R or D since May
Maintains most stuff at home - even provides some dinners/groceries
Hasn't moved her belongings out
Every now and then brings something up about the future - usually finance/investment related
Has shared some of what she's talking to IC about
Usually have a family meal together every other week in the family home (never planned just happens to be on her night with D when I don't have plans)

I'm content the way things are right now but with a permanent place for her to live coming up in October some decisions may need to be made. She's been good so far around finances, responsibilities and so forth with a track record of 8 months so I'm tempted to leave things as they are to not rock the boat too much... but at the same time feel that this transition may call from some stricter boundaries and harsher realities.

Been praying lots and that has helped and have also surrounded myself with faithful pro-marriage friends. Intervention/exposure has been discussed but I can't get myself around to doing it and feel that perhaps too much time has now passed between my first confrontation that it may come off as manipulation.

Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on November 21, 2016, 01:17:05 PM
3 months - seems to be about the cadence of my posts. Yeah I guess I'm not really active here but often find myself coming back to the articles and posts here on this board as they resonate. My W I believe is full on MLC - she's officially moved out (truck and all) as of about a month ago and D10 is now splitting time between the two of us. I don't get much monster, more or less amicable. I in return have tried to be kind and to some degree supportive with boundaries. I feel like that's a key difference between this forum and others - here it seems to be more focused on the "soft landing" vs. the hard lines. Knowing my W I think that would in the end be the better way for her to return "Pave the way" but it does make it harder to detach.

The OM seems to still be in the picture although I'm trying my best not to notice but some of the subtle signs are just so darn obvious - does she not see them? or does she just not care anymore... I also recently learned that she's likely been giving herself about 6+ years off her age ;-) that will eventually come out if it hasn't already.


Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on March 09, 2017, 10:50:51 AM
I've recently come back to this site after some time away... a lot has happened since Nov, I was all but ready to move on when we had a long conversation over the Christmas break. W initiated it asking what we should do. I shared I was thinking of moving on but open to reconcile if she was... long story short we started reconnecting but as I've read through the articles it's very touch 'n go right now. I think she passed through her low point last October when she formally moved into her own place, she also said that's more or less when the A ended as well... it was the first time she had openly admitted to it!

We definitely seem to be in the "friend" zone but not moving much beyond that. It's an exercise in extreme patience right now and me trying not to be pushy. I asked the other day if I could put my arm around her and I get a firm "no", but she usually reaches out to give me a hug when we say goodbye. We are seeing each other about 1-2/week, casual texting throughout the day and usually talk for a few minutes each night when we are saying goodnight to D. It's definitely been warm/cold though, with somedays staying on the phone and other days where she can't wait to get off.

I remain hopeful for the future, but after a year since she's move out and since BD2 I'm growing somewhat impatient. I guess in the grand scheme of things though this is a short window given the length of our M and what others here have gone through. I'm pretty sure MLC for her started somewhere around mid-2014, with the A starting somewhere early 2015 as best as I can tell.

Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: Samurai on March 09, 2017, 01:24:09 PM
Try to focus on the little progress she makes, not what you would like to happen. 2-3 years minimum as they say.
It looks like you are doing fine paving the path.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on March 09, 2017, 05:16:00 PM
Try to focus on the little progress she makes, not what you would like to happen. 2-3 years minimum as they say.

Thanks this is good advice... so when does it really start? I attribute the start with her change in appearance and friends ~fall of 2014 so we are about 2.5 years in....?
Title: Re: Someone stop me...
Post by: Not Your Monkey on March 09, 2017, 08:57:23 PM
The other thing is Pac you have no idea what she is feeling.  She could feel the guilt but not letting you see it.
Don't assume anything.

I know this is an old post but this is such a true statement. Yesterday I had a conversation with OW and discovered H may be a lot further along in having doubts and regrets about everything than he is letting on to me. From what she told me, he's apparently having doubts about his core reason for the entire MLC. And that I did NOT expect or imagine even.
Title: Re: Confusion over my approach 2
Post by: PacificLove on March 21, 2017, 04:18:21 PM
It's so true I have no idea what she is feeling. I also don't know what she is up to and her behavior has recently become suspicous again.

I do believe she's either in Replay but more likely Re-connection as she's starting to do things for me and the family again. We are having in-depth conversations but I've realized I've been pushy at times which is likely pushing her away and potentially back into the alienator's arms.

I'm contemplating having a boundaries discussion with her around trust - I've caught her in a few lies in the past 2 weeks. I don't plan to confront her on those - but thinking something more along the lines of:

"I realize that reconciliation of our M is not on your mind right now, but if we are to be friends with each other we need to start trusting each other as friends and sharing with each other. That includes any ugly truths we might have or any deception being conveyed. These will be important steps for us going forward as we co-parent our daughter and help serve build on the foundation and repair of trust that has been fractured. Any deception or lies right now will only add fuel to the fire if uncovered or unearthed down the road and feed speculation"

Thoughts?