Author Topic: My Story (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between  (Read 2795 times)

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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My Story (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« on: January 01, 2019, 02:19:31 PM »
My Old Thread https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9735.0

My New Thread Summary~

Fall of 2015 wants new clothes - just like son wears (18 yrs old at this time) - Ralph Lauren/Polo - Has not been to Dr. in years gets a check up

March 2016 I'll be mad if you buy a billboard for my 50th birthday
April 2016 new truck
Aug 2016 lifting and dieting- started taking a TON of vitamins  Did stop chewing tobacco
Sept 10 2016 BD #1  "I am not happy, something needs to change, this isnt working"  We tried to work on us.  Sex significantly increased from this day.
Oct 2016 behaviors changed a new person - manscaping now, - very private with cell phone - we go away for weekend - couple massage H "cant go naked you are here" Ummm I am your wife!
Nov 2016 Lasik eye surgery- obsessed with looks, scruffy beard was off and on and now is all the time
Dec 2016 Hanging with 27 yr old, started hitting concerts w/me, sexual behaviors have changed - music changed to country rock

Jan 2017 obsessed with TV star from the Bachelorette - even watches the show with me - 180 change in tv shows
Feb 2017 we took a trip to see his mom did a biplane ride - out of character
April 2017 - we attend another concert - drinking has been picking up, Car show event every Thursday thru Sept - drinking sees OW#1 every Thur at event
May 2017 - bought me a diamond necklace for Mothers Day
May 23, 2017 Did not want me to attend a golf outing.  By this time he is emotionally involved with OW #1 (Affair Down)
June 2017 - colored hair - highlighted it with sun to blonde
Aug 2017 - another surgery - mouth (1 of 2) attended another concert - drinking heavily
Sept 3, 2017 - attended another concert - drinking heavily
Sept 22, 2017 - attended another concert - drinking increases more  took me to a young bar after concert
Sept 23, 2017 - attended wedding - more drinking
Sept 24, 2017  "I care about you but not in love with you.  I told you a year ago."  moves out- tells my SIL I dated her for a year to see if it could work BD #2
Sept - Dec 2017 VERY HARD running in a PA with AD.  Gave kids $ for my birthday present and xmas gift,  brings food a lot for us - desserts and meals
Oct 2017 - monstered at son - never have seen him speak to him (or anyone else) in that manner
Dec 2017 husband files for Divorce
Christmas 2017 - goes to California to see mom for xmas.  Had not spent xmas w/her for 9 yrs since his dad died - when he returns a lot of touch n goes
Dec 27, 2017 - flew home - was suppose to be at Dr office with son and me for his surgery not there chose to fly home that day

Jan 2018 AD comes to an end - deleted his twitter account - Still drinking-posts hangover breakfast pictures
Feb 2018 - Has another surgery - My dad passes away he attends services
March 2018  OW files a report with police H touched her inappropriately. (She is trash saw report and lied I was at the same location that night and saw his and her behavior) He is slowing down.
March 31, 2018 - very talkative with us at an Easter breakfast fundraiser - he bought our meals-  2nd mouth surgery/skin graph
April 2018  H questioned by police.  Saw OW/withdraw - Deer in the headlights look he stopped at my work -Diet is done- posted on Instagram his workouts are a hobby- complimented me- snapchat has slowed down
May 2018 - Told daughter he is tired. OW #2 begins- replay behaviors have decreased - does not post "hangover" breakfasts on Instagram any longer, came to house to wash truck, has electrolysis done on his back
June and July 2018 - withdrawn from kids and I, June, H went to Chicago with OW#2 very secretive to D23
July 8, 2018 - First article in local newspaper OW #1 files sexual harassment charges (local police officer also gets sexual harassment charges against him- coincidence nope a group of three people -includes Police Chief-doing this) each day the newspaper ran an article on both of these charges up through 7/23. complaint is unfounded - no charges
July 23, 2018 H was still fired.  Articles continue for months in local paper. - Embarrassing!!!  Husband and kids now on my health insurance
Aug 3, 2018 - told friend his gf isn't happy about newspaper articles/situation- Also told his friend I am not happy with him
August 2018 - meeting with attorneys for D -H filed I had to sign in March 2018, H did not do anything for 6 mos.  Judge forces action on the D.  I called him out via text on something attorney said.  He told me he never said that - I said it doesn't matter your attorney threatened  to take all of our furniture out of our house.  H "We grew apart" "Thanks me for all of your support from the beginning of the harassment case"
Sept 2018 H is good with contact with kids and touch n goes (attorney meeting and texts triggered this) Helps me with case against his old employer on harassment from Police Chief to me. Willing to text about case.  He stopped at the house on a Sat night as I was getting ready to go out with friends- getting mail at 7 pm on Sat night- glad I was 98 ready to go out so he could see,
Oct 2018-Dec 2018 - very withdrawn from us. Came in the house only four times to pick up mail.  He looked me up and down on two of the occasions.  I have physically changed for the good and I had on skirt/ dress and heels on both times.  His friends have noticed my looks too.  I feel great and am very proud of ME!
Oct 2018 ordered a 2019 truck and started FB (this truck will fit in the garage of his moms home- where he lives- hated having his truck out last winter in this cold weather) Daughter told him next time he buys something he better talk with her first as that new truck is UGLY!  He stated "Its what I have always wanted- D23 "Ya as a 20 year old". 
Thanksgiving didn't ask to see kids
Dec 2018 - H finally gets a job, 12/16 kids wrote a letter to H about his behaviors towards them and son writes the intellectual part of andropause and depression.  Texts kids he loves them.  12/17 Starts new job works long hours till 7 pm at night for sure four of the days and Sat 9-3:00 .  D23 says he still workouts now before work.   
Christmas 2018 only saw kids for 5 minutes on Christmas Day to give gift of cash. Less $ than lest year and not even in a Christmas card like last year,
Dec 30th took kids to breakfast, he wore his shirt from the kids, was appreciative told them it was warm.  Kids said he seemed normal

Jan 2019 Not a peep from H to kids- not even a Happy New Year.  posted on Instagram starting diet again to lose the 25 lbs he gained wasup working out at 8 am

OW#2 still in the picture, He doesn't post pictures of her on his Instagram only workout pics,
I do not look at his FB- don't care to know.  He has never told the kids or me about HER,
Still works out, has gained back 25+ of the 55 lbs he lost, no more diet back to regular food, drinking decreased, doesn't dye his hair, no more surgeries or fixes, massages have reduced, vitamins srill reduced, left all of the organizations he was part of (business leader) since losing his job, emailed kids that the new job makes him feel better about himself.
Very distant.  H doesn't monster at us. H and I have very low contact I just let him be and I do my thing as I cant fix him!
« Last Edit: January 01, 2019, 02:20:42 PM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Thunder

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2019, 08:16:21 AM »
What a long ride, huh Hope?
So still stuck, or does he seem better to you?
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Sam I Am

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2019, 10:46:45 AM »
Attaching
2019 - 365 New Opportunities  Bring It On!

I choose to feel blessed - I choose to feel grateful
I choose to be excited - I choose to be thankful
I CHOOSE to be HAPPY

BD 10 29 2017  Moved out to OW/A began in  7.17
3/5/18 OW moved/H moved in with F
3/19/18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW in another State
9.4.18  Moved back...Living with Parents OW Out of State 
11.1.18  Moved in with sister  Part of H's belonging are boxed on parents side porch
Dec 18 - OW may be living locally but H not fully living with her
Jan 2019 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings

Started Dating - Spring 1983
Married - August 1985
D29 - 2 children living locally
D -29 Married with 2 children
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School
3 Dogs

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2019, 02:58:10 PM »
Thunder,
Thank you for asking! 
Well as of 12/31 OW#2 is gone!  Now this could only last a day or two but I hope God is protecting my H  from further destruction.  A friend told me that OW posted something on FB about "Wasted Love" and one of my close friends did some further checking and said that all of the pictures of them have been deleted on her Instagram account.  I will not look on her pages for many reasons 1) she doesn't deserve any of my time 2) I will not put myself in a situation for further hurt 3) she is nothing to me except a "park bench" being used.

You ask if he is stuck?  I don't think he is stuck.  It is hard to say what is going on because I don't pay a lot of attention to him and he is distant from us.  I do have a question for you.  If he hasn't had an awakening will he find OW#3?  Maybe he is gradually waking up and I have no clue to it, lol We just have no idea what goes on in his head!  All I can say is that since I had that text exchange on 8/30 he was great the whole month of September with touch n goes and being attentive to the kids. 
Then Oct Nov and part of Dec he is distant.  Spends no time with the kids,  Then kids wrote the letter and gave it to him on 12/16.  He texted the kids he loved them but that was it. 
He started his new job (long hours) on 12/17 including Saturdays. 
Asked kids to attend two Christmas parties with him 12/20 and 12/2 but they declined as they had plans,
He called the kids to come to his house for xmas presents.  He offered to make food for them and D23 told him that I already was cooking a ham and mashed potatoes..... Kids went up to the house and only spent t10 minutes with him - its Christmas Day!  I did send a box of his clothes with the kids that I cleaned out from our closet.
He took the kids for breakfast 12/30 (1st time since 9/27) told them they could go anywhere they wanted (even their favorite brunch restaurant which is a bit expensive)  D23 chose a less expensive place and they spent almost 1.5 hours together.  D23 said he was talkative, in a good mood and seemed normal.  I asked her to take a good look at his eyes she said he has wrinkles under his eyes, lol. He wore the new shirt the kids bought him for xmas and he said it was warm and that he liked it.  He seemed appreciative- a good change! 
12/30 a friend who I have kept in touch with - he has not for a year +,  told me H FB friend requested her.  He opened a FB page in Nov.
12/31 OW is gone
So I am not sure if you can call it stuck since he has made some contact and hopefully has OW#2 gone for good.

So could he be gradually waking up? Could this be possible?  He has not made any forward movement with me.

Sam I Am- glad to see you following along! Where is your spouse at on this journey? I love your quote on chosing to be happy!





« Last Edit: January 02, 2019, 03:23:09 PM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online Milly

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2019, 04:33:49 PM »
Hi Hope, it sounds as if your H is progressing. He's doing things that are different from before. It could mean that he's peaking out of the fog, it could mean he's in limbo - between replay and liminality. No one can know for sure. You'll know looking backwards. He might decide to run back to replay again and that could mean OW3. They do this when they get a hint of liminality and have not the strength yet to face it. If he should go back to replay, it will be because he hasn't quite resolved all his issues.

It might be none of what I said and he really could be heading to liminality. Some have awakenings and go back to replay, some have a sudden awakening. In any case, changes show movement through the tunnel and that's so much better than them being stuck. Keep us posted.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D24, D21, S14
OW Physical Affair. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 50 last year.

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2019, 06:32:27 PM »
Thanks Milly!  I appreciate advice from all LBS.

I really don't think he is at that point, and the reason I say that is because I haven't seen an awakening.  I would think that I would see more.  If they have an awakening would he have remained for two months distant?  I will also need to see if he runs back to OW#2.  They are so unpredictable!

I am glad he got a job and can focus on that.  Can anyone tell me if his long hours at work 8:30 -7 pm 4 days a week and then 9-3 pm on Saturday if that could effect his progress in anyway?
How often do MLS run back to replay after having an awkening?  Can they go back to OW at this point?

Also, with him being distant we only get to see a portion of what he does, so what we think is going on will be wrong.  I can only write on the facts that are in front of me. I will keep posting any news and pray for H to progress through the tunnel.  Any and all advise is certainly appreciated.
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline RedStar

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2019, 07:11:14 PM »
If they have an awakening would he have remained for two months distant?

Hi Hope, sorry that I can't address your other questions...but your one above reminded me of something that denjef31 said:

Quote from: denjef31

Thats when i had my awakening. It still took me another 6-8 months to even try to turn things around. It was like I could see I was getting left behind but i wasnt strong enough just yet to make my way back. I finally found the strength to sit down and share some things with him and my feelings but by then he was already dealing with MLC caused by FOO issues, divorce, and 2 deaths back to back of people very close to him. So in essence you can get a life they will notice but they wont do anything still until you are almost slipping away.

If I remember correctly, she said nothing to her H for those months. So...yes? Maybe check out her threads about her MLC. First one is:

https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412.msg544741#msg544741

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2019, 05:18:31 AM »
Thank you Redstar! 

That is so funny that you wrote that because as I laid in bed this morning thinking of Milly's post and my reply it came to me what Denjef had wrote.  I actually have that printed out and with other articles.  I guess time will tell what is going on until then I appreciate everyone's posts and thoughts.  I will remain with no expectations and keep living life with my kids.  Shouldn't je be making more of a connection with the kids if this is where he is at?  He did ask my son about his grades (in college studying civil engineering).

Another question- Can they break up with the OW and stay in replay?  I mean he has been in for 27 months.  Has anyone heard of someone finding a new OW that has been in Replay for this amount of time?

Thank you to everyone who have posted and for the support I have received in 2018- I look forward to a much better 2018!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Thunder

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2019, 07:05:46 AM »
Hope, all your questions are good questions.  The problem is no one can accurately answer them.

Yes it sounds like positive movement with your H, but it could be just that ..positive movement.

Every MLCer is different.  I think you're smart not having any expectations.
He could go a number of ways.

He could go back to the ow.
He could find a 3rd.
He could be not looking at all.
He could be in liminality, which could explain the time 2 months distancing.
Or he is slowing awakening.
Or it could mean he's just cycling.

You will just need to keep doing what you're doing, eyes off him and keep them on you.

Time will reveal what is going on.

Hugs
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2019, 10:48:07 AM »
Thanks Thunder I agree who knows what he will do! My H seems to have the cycling of contact when OW was on the picture. He withdrew the first three months then had a good month of contact and then withdrew again. So I see it more as cycling. What is interesting is the break up just shorty after the letters from my children.  Time will tell!

Sam- I forgot to ask you- Does your H monster at you? I have not seen very many that do not like my H.
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online One day at a time

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2019, 11:01:33 AM »
Mine never really monstered Hope. He said plenty of hurtful comments between BD1 and BD2 because we were still a couple.. once he decided he was done and I stopped resisting, he actually became very subdued.. which is very unusual for him.. My H was very opinionated and argumentative before MLC.. he hasn't been like that for months, at least not with me.. not sure what he's like with other people because whenever I saw him, it was just him and me, the exception was mediation and even then he was quiet.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2019, 11:58:34 AM by One day at a time »
H - 42 (40 @BD1)
M - 42 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.


"One of the happiest moments in life is when you find the courage to let go of what you can’t change"

Offline Sam I Am

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2019, 12:02:57 PM »
Hope - My H never had a monster episode except for when he was pushed.  I pushed him one time on purpose regarding an asset.  He didn't get nasty....he said to me...You have never ever seen the really ugly side of me.  I replied No I have not and if you bring it out I reserve the right to walk away and not put up with it.   He also kept responding to "do you want a divorce...is that why your asking me to sign off the asset.  If I sign off, we might as well get a divorce and sell and split everything.  Why do you want me off that asset.  I told him why....I don't trust her to try not to get her hands on it.  He replied....The only way she could have access would be if I married her and I told her right away I wasn't gonna marry her.  Then back to the asset and divorce issue repeated again.  I didn't let him threaten me with the divorce.  Just said if that is what has to be done to protect our assets, then so be it.  Later he projected that dealing with me before he moved was stressful and I felt it too.  I said...not for me.  I am sorry you are so stressed but if this is so right for you....why are you stressed.  He shut up and drove off.  Never got a response.  Later he was looking at me weird.  I looked him straight in the eye and Said....don't worry about me.  I will be ok.  Take care of yourself.  He started to cry and turned his head away from me.   This happened days before he moved away.

The only other time he monstered is when my D told him when he was leaving that she didn't need the stress he was causing.  She was 8.5 mos pregnant and said she has to be careful with stress for me and my babies sake.  All he heard was I am causing stress and you are blaming me if you have a miscarriage.   He didn't take it out on me...but he paced and grumbled for six hours.  Refused to talk to her or go see her before he left.  When he settled down, he said I don't know what to do.  I told him to go see her so he has no regrets.  He did.

That is the extent of the monster.  He used a lot of projection and blame and told me how terrible a person and wife I was...but he wasn't mean.  He said those thing very matter of fact. 

Just as he never monstered, he has never wasted OUR funds.  He wasted a lot of his own money on gambling.  Another replay activity that has slowed to come to a near halt.  Not spending hours at the poker machines like he was.

In the very beginning he did say his part in all of this was that he bottled things and has been doing it for the last 20 years and he can't forgive me for something he accused me of from 20 years ago.   Not monsterig....just his projection and blame all at me.   

I know a few others that are not seeing monster either.   

If I had to say anything about Monster....it would be I see charming Monster.  Anytime he is nice and starts buying things....some bad news is coming.   Makes me just stay further away from him now.  I saw it happen to me two times....once before BD and once before he left for Missouri.

2019 - 365 New Opportunities  Bring It On!

I choose to feel blessed - I choose to feel grateful
I choose to be excited - I choose to be thankful
I CHOOSE to be HAPPY

BD 10 29 2017  Moved out to OW/A began in  7.17
3/5/18 OW moved/H moved in with F
3/19/18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW in another State
9.4.18  Moved back...Living with Parents OW Out of State 
11.1.18  Moved in with sister  Part of H's belonging are boxed on parents side porch
Dec 18 - OW may be living locally but H not fully living with her
Jan 2019 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings

Started Dating - Spring 1983
Married - August 1985
D29 - 2 children living locally
D -29 Married with 2 children
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School
3 Dogs

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2019, 12:20:49 PM »
My H is very nonconfontational and I think that is why I don’t get the monstering. He has said two things that were not nice and he didn’t say it directly to me. When he monstered to my Son it was because I was cutting grass and H felt son should have been. The only reason I have been given for his filing for D was because “we drifted apart” plus I got the “I have done things all my life for everyone it’s now my turn to have fun” “I don’t want the responsibilty anymore”
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Sam I Am

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2019, 01:06:29 PM »
H never told me he didn't want to be responsible but he proved it early on.  Walked away and left everything on me.   I have broad shoulders.  I took care of everything but I am doing it for me.  This way I know the bills are paid and I won't loose assets.   The dogs are taken care of.  The property etc.   He just bounced and sat around drinking and gambling for months on end.  He was really living the great life.  So very sad.
2019 - 365 New Opportunities  Bring It On!

I choose to feel blessed - I choose to feel grateful
I choose to be excited - I choose to be thankful
I CHOOSE to be HAPPY

BD 10 29 2017  Moved out to OW/A began in  7.17
3/5/18 OW moved/H moved in with F
3/19/18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW in another State
9.4.18  Moved back...Living with Parents OW Out of State 
11.1.18  Moved in with sister  Part of H's belonging are boxed on parents side porch
Dec 18 - OW may be living locally but H not fully living with her
Jan 2019 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings

Started Dating - Spring 1983
Married - August 1985
D29 - 2 children living locally
D -29 Married with 2 children
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School
3 Dogs

Online Treasur

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2019, 02:01:09 PM »
My H is very nonconfontational and I think that is why I don’t get the monstering. He has said two things that were not nice and he didn’t say it directly to me. When he monstered to my Son it was because I was cutting grass and H felt son should have been. The only reason I have been given for his filing for D was because “we drifted apart” plus I got the “I have done things all my life for everyone it’s now my turn to have fun” “I don’t want the responsibilty anymore”

Funny, bc as a (broadly) sane person, I look at your 'highlight' list of what has been happening in his life over the last couple of years...and Fun is not the word I would use to describe it. Hot mess. Manic chaos. Insane soap opera. But not my idea of fun.   ???
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2019, 02:23:24 PM »
Treasur-

Thanks for the laugh!  His life has been a total mess!  I have tried to keep his chaos on him and to not let it reflect on us, but that has been hard with all of the newspaper articles!  I kept telling my kids that it is his actions and his consequences, we did nothing so we should not have to walk with our head lowered.  Easier said than done.  I know I would avoid the grocery store just to not run into people due to the embarrassment.  I did get over it and now walk with my head held high.  I am proud of the changes I have made and am so much stronger than I have ever been.
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2019, 03:03:10 PM »
I would like to hear from LBS's that have a MLS in the later half of Replay or entering into Liminality, one that has had an awakening and If the OP is still in the picture.   Also, anyone have a MLS who had an awakening and return to OW?

If you could share your story that would be so beneficial to so many of us. 

BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2019, 05:50:10 PM »
H never told me he didn't want to be responsible but he proved it early on.  Walked away and left everything on me.   I have broad shoulders.  I took care of everything but I am doing it for me.  This way I know the bills are paid and I won't loose assets.   The dogs are taken care of.  The property etc.   He just bounced and sat around drinking and gambling for months on end.  He was really living the great life.  So very sad.

When my H lost his job and the health insurance for him and the kids he told me he wouldn't be able to afford to continue paying the bills.  I now pay all the utilities and mortgage.  He filed for D and doesn't live here so I figured it was my bills to pay.  He has continued to pay for the house insurance and I don't always give him a check for my car insurance.  LOL he can ask for the $.  He is also paying me $950 a month for him and the kids to be on my health insurance plan.  I think they want us to fail but we are strong woman and are proving to them that they are not needed!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Sam I Am

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #18 on: January 04, 2019, 05:54:42 AM »
One of my husbands "complaints" when he left was that I didn't need him.  The OW needed and appreciated him and he could help her out.  Hmmm.  He said to me "you will be fine". 

Well, I am better than fine.   I am strong and I will not fail.  I'll just work harder in all aspects of my life to make me a better form of me.
2019 - 365 New Opportunities  Bring It On!

I choose to feel blessed - I choose to feel grateful
I choose to be excited - I choose to be thankful
I CHOOSE to be HAPPY

BD 10 29 2017  Moved out to OW/A began in  7.17
3/5/18 OW moved/H moved in with F
3/19/18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW in another State
9.4.18  Moved back...Living with Parents OW Out of State 
11.1.18  Moved in with sister  Part of H's belonging are boxed on parents side porch
Dec 18 - OW may be living locally but H not fully living with her
Jan 2019 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings

Started Dating - Spring 1983
Married - August 1985
D29 - 2 children living locally
D -29 Married with 2 children
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School
3 Dogs

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2019, 05:10:06 AM »
SHE'S BACK! Yes, the wh#re is back in the picture.  He was seen Sunday at the wh#re's daughter's volleyball game and she also started following him on Instagram again. 
Must have been one of those teenage breakups, lol.  This has no affect on me, only on him.  It doesn't move me forward or move me backwards, I am still where I was on this journey. 

H did share on FB a post about SON.  That he will always be his little man and that he loves him.  It was not written by him just shared, but it was the first time he posted anything about one of his children on FB.  Contact has been very low with the kids again.  He did make food on Sunday for the kids to pick up and bring home. 

I boxed up another pile of his clothing and will have him pick it up.  Besides that nothing is going on.  I hope everyone is doing well!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Sam I Am

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2019, 07:31:30 AM »
Sorry to hear that "SHE" is back.  Just like a bad cold, the symptoms come and go until they are finally over it. 

What is impressive is that you are not allowing her presence to unsettle you.  That is awesome!  Keep taking care of you.  We have to let them go through this as hard as it and let them finish. 

You are impressive!
2019 - 365 New Opportunities  Bring It On!

I choose to feel blessed - I choose to feel grateful
I choose to be excited - I choose to be thankful
I CHOOSE to be HAPPY

BD 10 29 2017  Moved out to OW/A began in  7.17
3/5/18 OW moved/H moved in with F
3/19/18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW in another State
9.4.18  Moved back...Living with Parents OW Out of State 
11.1.18  Moved in with sister  Part of H's belonging are boxed on parents side porch
Dec 18 - OW may be living locally but H not fully living with her
Jan 2019 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings

Started Dating - Spring 1983
Married - August 1985
D29 - 2 children living locally
D -29 Married with 2 children
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School
3 Dogs

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #21 on: January 08, 2019, 06:50:33 PM »
Sam-
Thank you so much for the kind words! We all know these relationships will not last forever, we just do not know how long. Even with that said, it is up to us to hold our head up high, walk with dignity, and know that we would not want them in the state they are in.  Each one of us will make it through this journey, maybe not with the outcome we hope for but we are strong woman and deserve only the best.  Praying for the best, take care!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline engagewithlove

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2019, 12:28:23 PM »
I would like to hear from LBS's that have a MLS in the later half of Replay or entering into Liminality, one that has had an awakening and If the OP is still in the picture.   Also, anyone have a MLS who had an awakening and return to OW?

If you could share your story that would be so beneficial to so many of us.

Hope you MLCer sounds very similar to mine.
I have been wondering the same thing about my exH. I think he is in the latter part of replay and has slowed down but is definitely not done. The OW is still in the picture, but he has gone from buying a house with her and intending to move in, to telling our kids he won't move in with her. I think he has had a mini awakening as he realised he really doesn't want to play happy families with OW and her kids. I get the feeling they are on again off again like teenagers. No proof as I really don't pay attention to what is going on his life.

A year ago he made comments to several friends about how much he missed MY family, missed the kids, but there was no effort to pay more attention to them. This year he is making more effort to connect with his own kids, and actually talk with and listen to them, so I see some improvements but he is still running from me.

You also question about monster, and just wanted to add that my H rarely truly monstered at me in a verbal or physical way... it was more about taking control when he didn't get his way. A subtle hint he was still monstering is his insistence I get my own health insurance. 6 months ago it was 'get your own,' this year it's 'I'm happy for you to stay on but pay me a portion to cover you'.
At BD married 22.5 yrs, M 44, H 48
D14, S12, S9
miniBD1 Aug 2016 'not sure I want to be here'
BD2 29 Jan 2017 ilybinilwy, moved out 3 Mar 2017
Financially separated 5 Sept 2017, house sold Dec 3 2017
D final Sept 2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2019, 01:17:05 PM »
Engage with love

Thank you for responding. Our stories do seem similar. Does your XH talk with you at all? You said he was running from you and was curious to what that looked like for you.  You said he had a mini awakening, what did you see if anything? Was this after your divorce? How did he start to connect with the children again?

Thanks!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2019, 01:24:03 PM »
Sam-

Thank you for the support and kind words!   We just can’t let our spouses take our happiness away. It is up to us to make the best of each day. Today, I received notice that my H has rejected the Sepetation agreement and wants to go forward with the D.  It is sad that he can’t see how much he is lived by me and our children. He is throwing away a lifetime of memories for his temporary feelings. It is a sad story but it’s his sad story. I will continue to make the best of my life without him. When the time comes to sign the papers it will be very difficult, but I am strong and will survive.

Difficult roads lead to beautiful destinations!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2019, 01:31:29 PM »
My H has started to post on FB about the kids. Today he posted about his beautiful daughter who is turning 24 tomorrow. The post that he shared about not being the perfect parent but for her to know he loves her very much. Has anyone seen this type of change in their MLC spouse where they begin to notice the kids again ? If so, what point were they at in MLC ? Prior to or after an awakening?

I know it is different for all but I think it would be nice to see where the majority have fallen
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline serenity

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2019, 01:46:20 PM »
My H is over 7 1/2 years and I’d say over the last twelve months or so he’s started noticing his children and granddaughter again. It’s been a slow process though!

I’d say he’s at the tail end of his crisis but still not out of it.

X

Online Treasur

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2019, 01:50:35 PM »
Tbh I wouldn't see fb posts as anything but a sign of 'mr sadz thinky' or textbook MLC impression management. Unless you are 15, a fb post is not a relationship is it? And if the message was just for your daughter, he could have sent her a card/note/text saying the same thing...no public attention. How does your daughter see it?
« Last Edit: January 10, 2019, 01:53:57 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

Grateful for any appearance of the tiny karma bus  
"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline Unraveled

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2019, 02:14:46 PM »
Hope,

I think mine has also had some kind of awakening (OW still in picture).  He kept threatening to file for divorce, so I told him to do it and then more or less goaded him into it (long story).  He has stalled it every way imaginable.  Months and months have gone by and nothing has happened.  He was doing all kinds of crazy things to get my attention, but I ignored them all.  I finally had to talk to him about one of the kids and we had a pleasant phone conversation (he called me) after he told me he would only communicate via email (by email I said I wasn't mad at him, didn't hate him, and wasn't trying to upset him).  I honestly think he was worried about how I would be with him and needed to reassure himself that I wasn't mad.

A few weeks later he asked to see me after more than a year.  He stayed for several hours talking about the kids and what they have been up to (told me nothing about his life and I did not ask).  Then he told me he thinks it is best to dismiss the divorce and refile in a few years when our youngest graduates and said he did not want me to sell our house (which he previously tried to get me to sell).  I said I didn't see the point in holding off if we would just be at the same place. 

He has now stopped communicating with his lawyer and is missing court deadlines (although he responded to me nicely when I had to contact him about a financial matter).  He has significantly reduced the written communications with the kids, but finally saw one of them after 6 months, recently spending 4 hours with him.  He gave me money for Christmas gifts for the kids for the first time since he left.  When he does write to them, he actually asks about their lives now instead of sending them stupid articles or videos. 

Who knows what goes on with these people or what they are thinking at any given time.  My suggestion is to not focus on him or the divorce and to live your life.  Who knows whether yours will go through with it or not.  Mine has cycled from the beginning, although this time is different for lots of reasons.  Either way, I'm moving forward for me and the kids.

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #29 on: January 11, 2019, 06:53:46 AM »
Treasur-
I agree it is not a relationship, but to have him acknowledge the kids is a start. He mentioned them for the first time and they were both heartfelt posts. On his daughters he actually wrote very nice words. Yes, he is probably doing it for attention but I would rather his attention seeking is in this matter. We all know his attention seeking could be much worse! Lol.

Unraveled-
It seems that your story and mine are a bit similar! I am glad your H has made some progress. How long have you been at this? You sound great and focused on you!!

Serenity-
7.5 is a long time but you sound like you are doing well. Did your H threaten D ? Is he at home or away? OW in the picture?
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline engagewithlove

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #30 on: January 11, 2019, 06:37:44 PM »
Engage with love

Thank you for responding. Our stories do seem similar. Does your XH talk with you at all? You said he was running from you and was curious to what that looked like for you.  You said he had a mini awakening, what did you see if anything? Was this after your divorce? How did he start to connect with the children again?

Thanks!

Our conversations are only ever about the kids. I always wait for him to initiate anything beyond that, but it cycles and there hasn't really been much talk for a while. The last conversation that lasted about 10 minutes was about D15 school report early Dec 2018. Prior to that I think it was about Feb/Mar 2018 where he sat next to me and we watched our daughters water polo game together. We discussed things beyond the kids, but nothing deeply personal. He has only asked once about my parents (who treated him like a son for 25 years) and has never asked about my siblings with whom he had very good relationships until BD.

When he is 'running' he doesn't get out of the car when he picks up/drops the kids off, or he stands on the other side of the football/hockey field, and he struggles to look at me. When he is in a touch and go he'll ring the door bell or stand near me during the kids sports and might join in conversations e parents are having on the sideline.

I call it a mini awakening as I don't think he's seen the true damage he has done, but I think he senses he will loose his Kids if he keeps going as he is. I noticed the change when he went away for work for 2 weeks, ending with when he called to discuss D15 school report. While he was away he sent messages to the kids that had some emotion in them. Describing scenery and using words rather than a fist punch or love heart emoji!! I just get some sense he is listening to the kids and talking to them beyond sport or his interests. He is also reaching out to them more often to go training together (S13 is a swimmer).

But, I think there are other factors at work. D was final in Sept, he changed jobs at that time and the kids met OW. So a big month. For 6 weeks, in the lead up to D15 birthday, OW was there every time they were with him, then nothing for 6 weeks. I think he realised the happy family thing wasn't going to just work because he said it must. Doesn't mean he's not still trying, I just think he has decided to go at a slower pace.
At BD married 22.5 yrs, M 44, H 48
D14, S12, S9
miniBD1 Aug 2016 'not sure I want to be here'
BD2 29 Jan 2017 ilybinilwy, moved out 3 Mar 2017
Financially separated 5 Sept 2017, house sold Dec 3 2017
D final Sept 2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #31 on: January 13, 2019, 06:07:46 AM »
Engage-
It does sound as if there is some forward movement taking place.  You mentioned your daughters birthday, mine just had her 24th and when she came home from having dinner with her dad she said “we bonded” that was nice to hear.  Besides sharing items on FB about the kids (for the first time) he also wrote in D24 FB and called her by her nickname from when she was a baby. That name has not been used in 20 years! He sent her a text also but it was short. He seems to be talking more with her right now. We will see if that lasts.
H has not reached out much to S20.
I did notice that he is more conscientious on his $. The difference on what he gave kids last year for Christmas compared to this year, for D24 birthday he set a budget dinner and $50 or $100 and no dinner. This is a change.
Daughter also told me that H said he took a nap on his day off. His new job has him working different hours no more 9-5:00. I like the 7 pm nights less time to see the wh^re. He has Wednesday’s off and that is the night he took D24 for dinner.
Ever since the kids gave H letter (12/16) we have seen a bit of a change. Let’s see if he can keep progressing. Divorce will be finalized in April and he had to meet with his attorney last week. They say the awakening is gradual, let’s pray this is s start.
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #32 on: January 13, 2019, 06:15:38 AM »
My H is over 7 1/2 years and I’d say over the last twelve months or so he’s started noticing his children and granddaughter again. It’s been a slow process though!

I’d say he’s at the tail end of his crisis but still not out of it.

X

When you say 7 1/2 years are starting at the beginning of MLC or from BD? I have been curious to how people calculate the time.

Glad to hear your H is progressing!!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Thunder

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #33 on: January 13, 2019, 06:35:16 AM »
We usually start it at BD, because that seems to be when the crisis really takes off.

Up to that point is more depression, confusion and anger building up.  Sometimes for a whole year before they make the decision they want out.
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #34 on: January 17, 2019, 03:37:54 PM »
Thunder,
I am curious to your view on my situation after you have seen my history for the past 2.5 years.  Are you calculating mine from BD #1 or BD #2?


So I met with my attorney and noticed that my H did not submit his retirement statements.  I think he thought he could pull one over on me.  My attorney has asked to get a copy of the statement and my H has submitted a one page screenshot that does not show the full retirement. Obviously, my attorney will request the full statement.  The judge set a deadline of Tuesday and we still don't have it.  I feel as if my H is fearing the loss of a portion of his pension.  There has to be some clarity for him to feel this.  He will also be losing the house and all of the contents.  Thoughts?

 
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #35 on: January 17, 2019, 04:37:00 PM »
My thoughts.....

Well, I got 85% of our estate in the settlement, although its not "official" yet.  I actually called my L yesterday to see if I am still "married", or in fact, "divorced."  Very strange.

Apparently there is one last bugaboo that L & I are waiting for THEM to do, because it apparently costs money, and "we won't pay for HIS divorce."  Same ole, same ole.

I will say this: I got all of our marital houses' contents within that 85%.  Bear in mind, many of these things are HIS.  If I didn't have such a strong intuition that we will be back together again once all of this crap is over-with, I never would have agreed to effectively be his "storage unit."

Perhaps you also have the lions' share of your H's crap.  None of which, of course, he is thinking about, nor remembering, at this time. 

And so it goes.....
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 05:26:32 PM by megogirl »

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #36 on: January 17, 2019, 05:35:23 PM »
Megogirl,

I am getting all of his to ols, book collection, grills, lawn mower, weed eater, pictures from his youth, his dads memorial items including ashes, this all blows my mind that he is not even thinking about this stuff!


So my H just called my daughter as she is leaving for a cruise on Saturday.  He talked about being aware of her surroundings, do not talk to strangers at port, stay in your group,  Do you have cash?  You should get a credit card for future use to have for emergencies.  Asked to call him before she leaves.  When she got off the phone with him I asked her if she feels like he has been acting like he cares about her again and she said yes it is different.  So what is going on here?

This is typical of my old H to be extra protective to his daughter.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 05:36:34 PM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #37 on: January 18, 2019, 02:07:15 AM »
A little late but attaching none the less.

I still have many things of my H in my house. In fact when he left he only took his clothes. He was a massive tech geek and we had a large TV in bedroom with a fire stick and surround sound. I redecorates the bedroom 9 months post BD and H insisted I kept the TV and firestick I refused and he reluctantly took it. I have the odd baseball cap here. despite me giving him them. They make their way back here. I even have some screen wash for a car. I do not even have a license. I have his childhood teddy which has sentimental value as his dad bought it him and his dad died 18 years ago. Also have a few items of his dads here.
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #38 on: January 18, 2019, 03:05:03 AM »
Sachat3 welcome to my thread!

It is so interesting to see how many have left so many items behind. My H played video games and left the Xbox One system and TV, told my son that I could sell it. That I have not done. Do you think they are just not thinking or that they really think we will be there waiting and they plan on returning?  One thing I do know is that they are not thinking clearly by these actions.

Megogirl- I LOVE your positive attitude that one day your H will return!

One last note from this week. I texted H to see if he would be willing to pay half of my sons contact lens. He said he would and I told him also about daughters lens. He said she was old enough to pay for them- agree. But I told him herbibe box is expensive due to a bad eye. He asked how much was my half that I agreed to pay and said he would pay that too.

I feel he has been making some strides forward. Although it is too early to tell what is going on and where he is at. We will just sit back and take the good we are seeing.
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #39 on: January 18, 2019, 03:48:42 AM »
Part of me thinks my H knows in himself he will return. After BD and before I found this site and knew how to act properly. Me and H had a conversation and it got heated. I shouted “Ypu will live to regret this” to which he replied “I know I will”. He also tries stopping me making permenant choices that would affect his life when he returns. For example H doesn’t like cats. He likes dogs. I’m I different. I like both but D7 wanted a kitten...H heard us talking about it and said “no no no. Your not getting a kitten. I’m not dealing with that” why would he be dealing with it if he never planned to return? He’s also not redirected any of his post. He orders off eBay and Amazon. They still come to my house. He still pays my sky TV bill as I said it was too expensive and wanted a cheaper option. He’s kept sky and is paying for it. I do think they leave us little signs about if they intend to return but it’s just picking up on them. I also believe (from what I’ve read aswell and just general ideas) it’s mainly LBS that stop any return. I guess sometimes the LBS has had enough/can’t wait that long etc etc
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #40 on: January 18, 2019, 04:07:31 AM »
Thank you for your thoughts and insight. My H still has his mail coming to the house. He only pays the home insurance the rest of the bills I pay. He has been gone for 15 months, left after BD#2. We are in the process of a D initiated by him in Dec 2017. It will be final in April 2019. Our relationship was very good and this was a shock to so many people besides me and my family. With that being said I have had hope he would return but as April comes closer I am losing all hope. It will be my choice after the D if I choose to let him back in our lives.
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #41 on: January 18, 2019, 04:55:56 AM »
I mean I’m no expert, I’m only 14 months from BD. But from what I’ve read it appears it’s mainlh the LbS who ultimately chooses. But then I’m quite positive about everything and I refuse to use this time negatively. I believe wholeheartedly that everything happens for a reason. So there is a reason we’re all going through this horrible thing. And there are lessons to be learnt.

I understand your feelings about your D being finalised BUT in the grand scheme of things. That’s not always the final call it might appear.

I think the main thing to remember is baby steps in the right direction are better than nothing and what will be will be. You have the strength in you for this journey.
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #42 on: January 18, 2019, 11:37:30 AM »
Sachet3
 You are correct he may decide after the D he wants to come home. I will have to make a decision at that time.  Right now, I want him back in our family. But that may change if he takes too long. I need to see him to WANT me in his life and obviously right now he does not. I have been at this for 28 months (since BD). I hate that he is tearing up our family for his selfish reasons!

I agree on baby steps- they are great to see! You get a little hope that they are crawling out of the tunnel. Although, we all know they have a long way to go. Something has to be going on with my H for the last few weeks. He has been much more attentive to daughter.

Does anyone know if they start to get real feelings back for kids and or spouse around awakening or at another time in this MLC ? If so, when?  Sachet3, I will take these baby steps!  I do have the strength for this journey, but I just want something small to keep hanging on. It’s not that I am giving up- it’s that he made the choice I am not what he wants and will not waste much more time on him. In March it will be 30 months, if I don’t see that I am important then I will move on. I truly believe in my vows but it takes two to make a relationship work. Just my thoughts today- who knows they may change next week 
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #43 on: January 18, 2019, 12:13:03 PM »
Yea I agree. There will come a point where your done. And only you can decide when that is.

I often wonder, when I myself will give up. Will he want to come home before then or will it be too late? I’m only a few months over a year and still have very small children (D2, D5 and D7) and I don’t know how much these weigh in as heavy factors. I guess only time will tell.

I don’t know about the feelings but i feel like I may have read somewhere they do still have the love They just don’t realise it as they are hurting so much and it’s buried deep
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #44 on: January 18, 2019, 05:06:44 PM »
Hope -

We share almost identical timelines - your BD was 9/16, mine was 10/16 - just one month apart!  You seem to be losing steam, which I totally get.....HOW LONG WILL THIS TAKE?!? 

The way I see it is: I'm come this far......so why quit now?!

I guess I've sort of made it a personal challenge.  I have difficulty with balance and movement (MS), so any "challenges" are few and far between (I can barely walk, let alone run a marathon!) 

RCR is such a wonderful inspiration, and it took her own H 3.5 years to return.  So, there's (also) that!

Keep the faith xxx
« Last Edit: January 18, 2019, 06:32:34 PM by megogirl »

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #45 on: January 18, 2019, 06:38:00 PM »
Megogirl-
Thank you for the post and yes something is up with me!!
 I just feel as if he divorces me why should I still stand. Maybe I am just trying to protect myself for April. I truly want my marriage, my husband, my family in tact!! I think I am facing reality straight on and know that I need to protect my heart to get through this.  I am strong and am still fighting each day for a wonderful outcome! I am not giving up today or tomorrow :)

My H did reach out to D again as she leaves in the morning for her cruise. He reminded her to be safe and that he loves her. He has shown so much more feelings in the last 10 days and the last month there seems to be a shift. Could this be the beginning of his awakening? Starting with D ?

Not sure if I posted before on him paying for my half of D contact lens and 1/2 of sons too. I am seeing small positive steps.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2019, 06:55:19 PM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #46 on: January 18, 2019, 07:12:32 PM »
Please know that I've been in your shoes.....

When RCR posed the question "can I still Stand, even if I am/get divorced?", I thought she was insane...but fast-forward 27 months, and I TOTALLY understand what she'd meant.

Sadly, any legal proceedings take place while they're still in crisis.  They just don't understand the magnitude of what they're doing....until they're finished with the crisis.  And since it takes years to get through, the D usually wins "the race."

In my case, I have accepted "remarriage" as a very real possibility, and accept that it's just legal semantics (according to our Covenant with God...we've never "not" been married!)

 


« Last Edit: January 18, 2019, 07:15:16 PM by megogirl »

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #47 on: January 19, 2019, 12:17:38 AM »
Also from what I’ve read, they only tend to realise what they’ve done when they realise what they’ve lost. So it could be the D being final is his awakening. But it really does sound like he’s making many great steps in the right direction.
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline Sam I Am

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #48 on: January 21, 2019, 06:41:05 AM »
Just remember....it ain't over til it is over!  (Yogi Berra)

You get to choose when it is over!  That is the one thing you have control over right now. You decide to stand or not stand no matter what the circumstances.  Just keep learning and growing so you can be the best person you can be no matter how you choose to live your life.  With or without H or with or without someone else.  Right now it is all about doing what is in your best interest!
2019 - 365 New Opportunities  Bring It On!

I choose to feel blessed - I choose to feel grateful
I choose to be excited - I choose to be thankful
I CHOOSE to be HAPPY

BD 10 29 2017  Moved out to OW/A began in  7.17
3/5/18 OW moved/H moved in with F
3/19/18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW in another State
9.4.18  Moved back...Living with Parents OW Out of State 
11.1.18  Moved in with sister  Part of H's belonging are boxed on parents side porch
Dec 18 - OW may be living locally but H not fully living with her
Jan 2019 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings

Started Dating - Spring 1983
Married - August 1985
D29 - 2 children living locally
D -29 Married with 2 children
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School
3 Dogs

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #49 on: January 21, 2019, 07:45:55 PM »
I had come across these articles/posts ( I and II ).  They have so much feeling in them and I thought they were worth sharing.  I have read so many times that the midlife spouse have so many regrets after going through the crisis to what they did to their family and thier destuctive behaviors.   It truly helped me understand why my H stays away from me and the kids - he can't handle seeing us.

https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=5388.0

https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=5388.80


So, I wanted to know if someone can answer for me when the depression starts to be expressed by the midlife spouse ("they are not perfect" "they have flaws" "I don;t feel good about my self" does it mean they are having some clairty, the fog is lifting, or do they not realize what they are saying? 

In addition, at what point does the midlife spouse recognize they have hurt their family and apologize for what they have done?  Awakening or during Liminality?  (A friends H just did this!)  It is exciting to see such progress.










BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #50 on: January 22, 2019, 10:08:09 AM »
Two new items:

#1 My daughter got engaged on Sunday!  My husbands 1st response was WOW with an emoji.  I wonder if this will have any affect on him.  He congratulated her and once again told her to be safe.  She is on a cruise.

#2 Just left my dental hygenist and she told me that my H back around Oct 31, H told her that he would never marry or move in with OW.  She knows we are still married.  I guess he really thinks he is single sinvce he filed for D.







BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online Treasur

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #51 on: January 22, 2019, 10:12:43 AM »
Congratulations on your family news!
And yup, I think most MLCers do a kind of divorce in their head as an alternate reality and find the real world version rather irritating  ::)....of course, believe none of what they say etc etc  :)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

Grateful for any appearance of the tiny karma bus  
"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #52 on: January 22, 2019, 03:21:53 PM »
I wonder if this will have any affect on him.

I have to imagine this is going to intensify his MLC.  My H had a really hard time when S15 had his first girlfriend two years ago.  H also struggled with his voice changing. 

They are frantic at any signs of getting older.  So a D getting married?  Oy vey..!

I have often wondered what the death(s) of one or both of his parents would do for his MLC.....

   

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #53 on: January 22, 2019, 05:04:45 PM »
Megogirl

Please clarify what you meant by “it may intensify his mlc”  In a good way or bad way?

Thanks!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #54 on: January 22, 2019, 05:14:01 PM »
I don't think necessarily in a "good" or "bad" way, just more of the same....

Because he's already freaking out about aging, so D getting married should only act as a further reminder that he's officially a "King", and not a "Knight."  His MLC should only intensify.

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #55 on: January 23, 2019, 10:01:36 AM »
I wanted to re-post these questions as I am still looking for some answers.

 I wanted to know if someone can answer for me when the depression starts to be expressed by the midlife spouse ("they are not perfect" "they have flaws" "I don;t feel good about my self" does it mean they are having some clairty, the fog is lifting, or do they not realize what they are saying? 

In addition, at what point does the midlife spouse recognize they have hurt their family and apologize for what they have done?  Awakening or during Liminality?  (A friends H just did this!)  It is exciting to see such progress.


Thanks!

BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline engagewithlove

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #56 on: January 27, 2019, 02:59:36 PM »
Hi Hope,
I'm not sure there is an absolute answer to your question. I think depression permeates MLC so it depends on when they say it, how far from BD, and under what context. My MLCer has said things that elude to regret or recognising that he has hurt not just me but extended family, sometimes to me and other times to random friends, but he is definitely still in escape and avoid. It is part of the cycling and may mean they are moving through the tunnel or may earn nothing. Main thing is to stop focusing on where He is in MLC and start focusing on YOU.
At BD married 22.5 yrs, M 44, H 48
D14, S12, S9
miniBD1 Aug 2016 'not sure I want to be here'
BD2 29 Jan 2017 ilybinilwy, moved out 3 Mar 2017
Financially separated 5 Sept 2017, house sold Dec 3 2017
D final Sept 2018

Offline Anjae

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #57 on: January 27, 2019, 03:33:18 PM »
Congratulations on your daugther's engagment.

I wanted to know if someone can answer for me when the depression starts to be expressed by the midlife spouse ("they are not perfect" "they have flaws" "I don;t feel good about my self" does it mean they are having some clairty, the fog is lifting, or do they not realize what they are saying? 

The depression can be expressed by the MLCer even before BD/MLCer leaving. Mr J did that. Other MLCers did that, including some real life one I know. MLCers can express the depression at other different times in their crisis. If they are saying they are depressed, they know, at least when saying it, that they are depressed.

However, that does not mean the fog is really lifting. They may just be having temporary clarity.

In addition, at what point does the midlife spouse recognize they have hurt their family and apologize for what they have done?  Awakening or during Liminality?  (A friends H just did this!)  It is exciting to see such progress.

Hard to know. It will depend of MLCer. They can even say it during Replay, and then carry on with Replay. After Replay, it will depend.
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #58 on: January 27, 2019, 04:07:20 PM »
engagewithlove- My H is 28 months post BD.  Trust me I am focusing on me and my kids.  Its just that I see a small change and of course when this happens I tend to put some focus on his recent behaviors.  So I have discovered that his workouts that are his life since MLC are reducing.  Nov he missed 5 days, Dec he missed 16 days and so far in Jan he missed 15 days.  He is posting or sharing on FB posts about daughters and sons.  It is like he cares for them again.  As soon as I get answers or thoughts from others I file it away and move on.  I know I cant change anything and it has to run its course.  It is just nice to know once in a while that he is making progress.  We all need reassurance to keep going.  Thanks for stopping by my thread and for your help!


Anjae- Thank you for your post and knowledge!  H has never expressed depression but his feeling as I had wrote.  Does he maybe not even realize it is depression?  That is what I am thinking.  It could be getting deeper and he is feeling worse just not knowing why?  The depression at the end of replay must get deeper as two stages can run together.  My thought is as replay ends that the MLCer is probably experiencing both stages at once.  But then they talk about Limbo.... Can they have replay and liminality at the same time when you have limbo? 

Denjef had stated that "As the layers are pulled back the raw emotions and feelings we have been suppressing slowly resurface"  This was in response to her feelings for her H.  I am thinking when she is speaking about the layers, she is talking about as the awakening happens gradually, the layers are pulled back .  Like the waves crashing in on the beach taking a layer away each time.  Is this accurate?

Opinion needed!
1/3 H texted car insurance check was needed.  I told him it was here at the house when he wanted to stop by and pick it up.
1/16 I told him he had mail here that he needed to pick up
1/22 I asked son to text H to remind him that he has mail here.
As of today it is ALL still here including credit card bills (with Tupperware from food he made us).  I am not going to babysit him but this is odd that he doesn't pick up his mail.  What should I do? I shouldn't have to remind him a forth time!  He is an adult and its his responsibility, but my H is very responsible when it comes to finances so this is out of character.  I honestly think he is just forgetting.

Thanks for the Congratulations! :)
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 04:20:31 PM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Anjae

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #59 on: January 27, 2019, 04:39:13 PM »
You're welcome, Hope.

It may be he does not realize what his feelings/what he said mean. He may not know they mean he is depressed. Stages often intertwine at the end of tone/start of another. Replay is quite visible, but Replay, even before Liminality, may have liminal moments and well as moments during which fog lifts. Limbo is not a stage. In fact, Replay also isn't a stage, just part of Separation (we use stage because it is easy).


RCR stages are:

1- Separation
    a) Rejection & Refusal
    b) Resentment
    c) Escape & Avoid (Covert Depression)
       High-Energy: Reply
       OR
       Low-Energy: Wallow
2 - Liminality or Liminal/Overt Depression
3 - Rebirth
4 - Reintegration

Replay is the most talked about part, but it is only a sub-stage of of the first stage, Separation. The reason why it is the most talked about it is because it causes the most damages and problems and it tends to last a very long time.

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/mlc_overview_stages.html

Limbo tends to happen between Replay and Liminality: https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/standing-actions_progress_back-limbo-forward_limbo.html

For Liminality these articles may be of help:

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/mlc_overview_liminality.html

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/mlc_overview_liminality_transition-is-liminal.html

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/mlc_overview_liminality_when-is-liminality.html


Denjef had stated that "As the layers are pulled back the raw emotions and feelings we have been suppressing slowly resurface"  This was in response to her feelings for her H.  I am thinking when she is speaking about the layers, she is talking about as the awakening happens gradually, the layers are pulled back .  Like the waves crashing in on the beach taking a layer away each time.  Is this accurate?

You would need to ask Denjef, but I would say it is more or less that. However, for some MLCers awakening seems to happen at once.

You already told your husband several times about his mail. He is a grown up. He is also in MLC. They shif while in MLC. Your normal husband may had always been financial responsible, it does not mean the MLC husband will be. Like you said, you are not his baby sitter. His texts were answered, son reminded him you had told has has mail there.

You may need to get used to the idea MLC husband may be quite different than non-MLC husband.

upperware from food he made you ... that reminds me of Mr Bursty Kikki's husband (Kikki's and old timer who no longer posts much). Her husband would go by the house, even if he had OW, and leave food for her and the boys. Sometimes at the doorstep. At a point, while at the same time being involved in legalities and not being nice to her at all. MLCers do the most strange things.
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #60 on: January 27, 2019, 05:10:57 PM »
Anjae - I should have worded my post better!  I do know that limbo is not a stage but a state in between separation/replay and liminality.  Sorry about that.

During MLC my H continues to be financially responsible.  Continues to contribute to stocks/retirement and always pays bills on time.  He did give me all of the bills when he lost his job, but he doesn't live here either plus he filed for D. I look at it as they are my bills.  He pays for sons cell phone still and pays for the mortgage insurance and sons car insurance. 

After 28 months I am very aware that my H is not normal, lol!!!! He has changed and it is not for the good- but I have never heard a MLCer change for the good! hahahhaha

H has done the food thing on and off through this.  Sometimes there is enough for me and sometimes there isnt.  I just take it as a bonus.

Thanks for the articles I have read them all in the last few days.  The limbo one really connects with me but H cant be there yet as I don't think he had his awakening.  Or if he has he is keeping it under lock and key.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2019, 05:22:50 PM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #61 on: January 28, 2019, 12:52:11 PM »
Daughter just got back from a cruise and she stated "dad has been posting a lot on FB about grandpa" His dad passed away 10 years ago.  I said he has also been sharing posts about daughters and sons.  She said she saw that too.


I think one of his issues is/was his dad passing away.  Could he be dealing with his grief? He is getting some feelings back? Or is this just what happens in depression -missing his dad and kids? 
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online Treasur

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #62 on: January 28, 2019, 12:55:59 PM »
Sounds like a pretty standard thinky depression thing...time will tell if it produces anything more constructive than a few fb likes, I guess. Keep your eyes away and trust that if it is more than that, you will see a pattern emerging over time. But perhaps quite a long time lol.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #63 on: January 29, 2019, 07:14:11 PM »
Well had a meeting today with attorneys on the settlement  My attorney said be prepared to complete this today with the judge they want this over.  I was shocked (since I found out today at 7:35 am that I had to be there at 9 am!)  What we found out today was that I would be gaining about 110K from his retirement pension, neither of us knew this.  I was pleasantly surprised.  I had to give up 10K to get health insurance paid by my H for my kids till age 26, kids are worth it!  In the end, we never had the final meeting with the judge and they scheduled it for April.  Everything is settled and this could have been done but its not.  I find that interesting since H wanted this done. 

Also, H said we could file taxes jointly this year and just split the return.  He told me that he has been claiming a higher single rate and paying more in taxes.  Hmm what is the purpose to file joint if you have been paying more in for taxes and now you are willing to split it with me?  Before we left he also told me that he would transfer money into my checking account for the health insurance for him and the kids for Feb.  2 hours later he texted me to tell me that the transfer had been done. I replied with "ok, thank you"

My daughter was with me at the meeting and we were all able to walk out together.  I was kind, confident, and we laughed. He could not look at me, he tried to stay focused on daughter.  I talked/acted normal and it was easy!  I really was proud of how I handled myself. 

H took son out for dinner tonight and invited daughter to go along if she liked.  She had plans already.  I hope the interest in the kids continues.  This is a nice change! 
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #64 on: January 31, 2019, 11:22:54 AM »
Last night H texted son to stop up to the house and pick up food that he had made (beef roast, homemade bread and homemade mac n cheese) to bring back to the house.  We had dinner already cooking, but will have his tonight.  I do plan on texting him and thanking him after dinner tonight but do not want it to look as if I am pursuing him.  Do MLCers think a simple thank you text is a form of pursuing? 

I read that you have to be the better option for them to want to be pulled towards you instead of the OW. I don't want to pursue either, but I have to have contact with him to show him.  I feel that some of the information is a contradiction, unless the information is for two different stages of MLC.  Any information would be appreciated.

Thanks!   
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online Treasur

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #65 on: January 31, 2019, 11:49:06 AM »
Thank you text seems polite, like you would if a neighbour did it. No more, no less.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

Grateful for any appearance of the tiny karma bus  
"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #66 on: February 01, 2019, 02:45:55 AM »
I know what you mean about feeling the contradictions. I feel the same. Should I text this? Pave the way so to speak. Or should I be distant and let him see what he’s missing. Should I be nice and friendly and try and build a friendship. Or do I just coparent.

I decide everything moment to moment. I feel too much forward planning feels forced and fake. If I’m feeling nice I might send him something about the kids. IE “Look what D2/D4/D7 did at school today” other times I wait until he visits and show him then.
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Online Whyus

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #67 on: February 01, 2019, 04:20:42 AM »
Hi hope, i have just read your complete thread and it was hard work if im honest. Sure you see a Little movement and get curious and ask questions but you are analysing every Little Thing that he does. That is not healthy for you, he has full Control over you (and he knows it) even if you say that you are just living your life.
Take youe eyes of him and leave him be, you cannot Change anything and you certainly cannot "nice him back".

I have a question for you, Why is his mail still coming to your house?
Hes moved out and still with OW2! His mailing adress should Change accordingly. You are not his postman.
Also, his leaving Food for you is just cake eating and his self confirmation that hes "not such a bad guy afterall". Your Response should really be "thank you H but I am quite capable of putting Food on the table myself".

It may Sound hard but you will feel better if you dont watch him so much.
Yes, they try and repair the damage with the Kids before turning to the spouce but that does not mean that they always do this. Most just dont wake up and come back, some do but most do not unfortunately.

My XW has been doing alot to get my Boys back into her life, she is starting to act like a mam to them again instead of a big sister but that means absolutely nothing for me. Its a parent child Thing and nothing more, she knows that they have lost all respect for her and is maybe panicking. Your H may be Feeling something similar.

Have a nice Weekend hope, no offence meant and im sorry for being "blunt" but thats what i do best im afraid  ;)

Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline Thunder

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #68 on: February 01, 2019, 05:26:23 AM »
I think RCR says it good to pave the way in the beginning because they are still do unsure of themselves and you leave the door open..a little.

When they get into the tunnel paving the way is a waste of time.  But you planted the seeds early on with being friendly and light.
You can take a harder stand then if you need to.  Dimmer or Darker.
They'll remember you paving the way.  They don't forget it.
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Acorn

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #69 on: February 01, 2019, 05:39:16 AM »
What Whyus said. 

The sooner you purposefully take your eyes off MLCer and all his doings, and quit speculating reasons for them, the better you will feel.

I cannot emphasize this enough: Leave MLCer be and go live your life.  I know how hard it is to do that.  Speaking from personal experience... 

I would like encourage you to step back from the centre seat, first row, of the MLC show.  With the distance you gain when you do that, you may find the questions you have had so far will not matter too much to you any longer. 

To gain that necessary distance, you just might go ahead and start asking questions about how you can do that.  That is the step in the right direction.  Focus on what you can control: you.  Look away from what you can’t control: MLCer and his MLC.

I mean well, hope. 
« Last Edit: February 01, 2019, 05:40:30 AM by Acorn »
Feb 2015: BD 1. H has a Nuclear meltdown.  The next morning arctic cold descends.
Oct 2015: BD 2,  ILYBIANILWY. “We should not have gotten married.”
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Never left home
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #70 on: February 02, 2019, 01:01:24 PM »
Acorn, Whyus, Sachat3, Thunder,

Thank you for your thoughts and words of encouragement.  It is very much appreciated!

I understand that our marriage will not survive this crisis, sad....but true and I have accepted that.  I know I do not need him to survive.  I can financially afford it and have been living like this for long time.  H will come out of this crisis when he is ready.  This will not end the way I had hoped, but know that it doesn't mean WE are over.  The piece of paper will not stop me from loving my husband and for me to have hope that he will want to return to our family.  If he chooses not to then that is his loss because no matter what I will be ok with him or without him.  I have learned through this journey that I matter and so does my happiness.  HE does not make my life happy - I make my life happy!

H and I do not have much contact.  A text here or there from him or him bring meals by for the kids.  I do not reach out to him and that was the first "thank you" text I sent him from all of the meals he sent over for the kids. 

Whyus, I am sorry my thread was hard to read but please know that I am doing really well.

For the mail- he use to get it at the PO Box and now has given me the key to get it.  My house nor his has a mailbox YET.  I do plan on getting one here and having my mail delivered and then he can have the po box key back for his mail.  It is winter here so I am kinda in limbo for that (-50 degree weather is not the time to put up a mailbox lol). 

No offense was taken, like I said I do appreciate everyones opinion.  Yes, I know I an anylzing this movement in him and know I should not - I will do better.  Its nice to see a little progress in his journey.

For my journey, I am doing very good!  I am a new person.  I am confident and a strong woman.  I know I can handle anything that is thrown at me.  I enjoy the TIME by myself to reflect on who I am.  Yes, I said the TIME word!  I love who I have become during this journey.  My kids and I are closer then ever and they can see the strong woman I have become.  I have fixed or improved many things that I was not happy within myself.

I am leaving to meet up a new friend from this forum on Thursday.  (We have talked for over a year now) I cant wait to see her in person as we speak to each other everyday!  She knows me and my story and I know her and her story.  When you write on this forum people reading your story do not get to see the real you or who you have become.  She has helped me through tough times and I have done the same for her. We are both in good places and its because of the advice we have learned on this forum and we can "put each other in place"  when it is needed.  I am so thankful that we were able to connect the way we did!

Sachat3- Thank you for validating my thoughts/feelings.  It is confusing!  I think having more of a timeline of when this is to be done or that is to be done would help us understand more clearly.

Thunder-You are saying that paving the way is for the beginning before they enter the thick of the fog, the middle of the tunnel?  I thought it was for the whole time during the tunnel and especially as they come out of the tunnel???

BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #71 on: February 02, 2019, 02:47:08 PM »
I am leaving to meet up a new friend from this forum on Thursday.

That is fabulous, Hope!

I have wondered what I would even say to a man, were I to pursue dating.  Well the sad, but true answer is --- not much.

Because I really trust no one.  So how does one go into a potential relationship when the whole time you're giving them side-eye?

I only trust women, and very few!

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #72 on: February 02, 2019, 04:28:38 PM »
Megogirl-

I want to be clear that I am meeting up with a female friend.  My daughter is coming with me as my friend has a daughter too.  It looks like we are going to even do some bridal dress shopping with my daughter's newly engagement.

I have no interest in a relationship with a new man.  I love my H.  If I get to a point in my life that I want a new relationship then I will allow myself to be open for one.  I can not go from one relationship to another- nope not ready and will not be for some time.  I am sure I would have a hard time with trust if I was to jump into a relationship.  TIME will allow all of us to heal and we will be able to trust again.

I am very excited to see my friend and her family.  It will be a great GIRLS weekend!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #73 on: February 02, 2019, 04:32:31 PM »
No --- I KNOW she is a she!

What I meant was it's fabulous you are meeting up with a bud from this forum.....you already know you have a ton in common, so can commiserate away.

Have FUN!!

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #74 on: February 03, 2019, 04:07:04 PM »
Thank you, Megogirl!!!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Acorn

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #75 on: February 04, 2019, 04:58:37 AM »
Thank you, Hope, for telling us who you are and what you have been doing.  You sound sensible and confident.
From your questions regarding your H, it was not easy to see that you had focus on you and your life.  Now I know better, thanks to your post re yourself.  So good to read...

Take care and keep keeping the focus on you! 
Feb 2015: BD 1. H has a Nuclear meltdown.  The next morning arctic cold descends.
Oct 2015: BD 2,  ILYBIANILWY. “We should not have gotten married.”
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Never left home
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #76 on: February 16, 2019, 06:49:52 AM »
“Difficult roads lead to beautiful destinations.”
That was the motto for my trip to see My friend. After three cancelled flights and a delay, my daughter and I arrived. Although a day late, it was well worth it. To finally meet someone who you have this bond with is really amazing. We had good conversation, good food and what trip would be complete complete without a little shopping! It felt as if we were long lost friends that have been apart for sometime, in reality we met for the first time. I really think that speaks volumes!  We talked about another girls trip to meet up again and I truly hope it works out!

Now, a question (or two) about MLC. I did some reading and want to make sure I understand this correctly.
In Limbo, the MLCer realizes the relationship with the alienation is not permanent- consciensly or unconscionsly.
In Limbo they can avoid liminality and continue to seek replay.
Limbo may be the first place where a MLCer has an awakening.
The awakening is gradual for most. I read it as described in a process of three - the mlcer’s pity awakening, next- the how can I make my life better and reconnect with my kids, and the last one - oh crap what have I done?!  Has anyone else heard of it like this?
Do replay behaviors diminish in Limbo?
Intermittent Liminality is part of the Limbo transition and begins in Replay, typically after the awakening.

I hope everyone has a great weekend. We have more snow coming (3-5 inches) so I am not looking forward to that. I also had a friend and my sister-in-law lose a parent on Valentines Day😥 I pray for these families as they say their final goodbyes. My weekend will be a long one to say the least.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2019, 07:07:29 AM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Thunder

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #77 on: February 16, 2019, 09:26:37 AM »
Hi hope,

The definition of limbo is: an uncertain situation that you cannot control and in which there is no progress or improvement.
It's like they get stuck between two stages where not much happens until something propels them forward.

Paving the way can yes be continued all through the crisis, but in the beginning it is more important because they are still very confused and not very far into the tunnel.  Their not completely gone. They will be more receptive to it and remember it when they come out of the fog.  Once that fog rolls in paving the way might not have the same effect.

Hope that helps some.   :)

Hugs
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #78 on: February 22, 2019, 12:56:11 PM »
I am wondering, from experience, when do Mlc’ers start to get feelings back?  Maybe feelings is not the correct word but they start to show they care about their kids (a little). My H (a sloth) has had more contact with the kids since end of Dec. Yesterday for the first time he even mentioned me. (I know it’s a miracle I do exist, lol)   He said about a picture to D24 “mom and I went there” and to S20 he asked “ do you need my truck or are you taking your mom’s car (4x4) to college?” -We had 6 more inches of snow! He contacted both kids and made food again- His love language.

H is sloooowwwwlllyy showing concern for the kids. Which makes me happy! I want them to all have a good relationship! He is also taking them out Sunday for breakfast.

He took a few steps backwards on a couple of Saturday nights with alcohol consumption. He has reduced his obsession with workouts to a more normal schedule. He use to workout daily now it’s 1-2 times a week. But did have a 10 day period of no workouts. The kids have commented that he seems more normal too. Still withdrawn from me, has his wh*r^, and hangs with her and his 27 yr old friend. All other replay behaviors have reduced or are gone- from what I can see at my distance. He is making progress - of course at the speed of a sloth (2.5 yrs from bd).

For me, I am good - just living life and enjoying it! I don’t let anything he does bother me. It’s his problem not mine 😀. Happy Friday!! We need Spring!!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #79 on: February 24, 2019, 02:31:54 PM »
Update:

Well, I knew something was going on with my H.  On Wednesday 2/20/19, he posted #comfortfood.  This is what he posts when things are BAD.  A friend informed me that the relationship was rocky and that as of 2/23/19 they are no longer together!  (1st breakup was 12/31) She said that the wh*r^ has deleted all pictures of them on Instagram and stopped following him and he has also stopped following her.  Pictures are on FB still.  Lets see if this break up lasts! 

Leading up to the break up this is what has been seen in February:

Friends of ours saw him out 2/8/19 with the wh*r^ at a show.  She said that she saw him and they were "on each other" (I assume arms around each other-didn't ask didn't want to know details). When H saw them he walked over and talked with them-he was talking about his truck and his new job.  The 2019 truck he bought has had issues and he told them that he didn't want to buy a bigger truck and spend more money.  After he left their table he went back to his table and she said he just sat there.  A change in his behavior was obvious.

My last post I wrote about him mentioning me for the first time in forever. Making meals, asking S20 about college.

2/20/19 he talked to daughter about her finances and told her that he does not have much money after he pays his truck payment, car insurance for him and S, the health insurance for the three of them, the house insurance and cell phone bill.

Today 2/24/19 the kids went with H for breakfast.  When they returned they said that H brought me up three times. 1.) They were speaking about a yacht and H said when mom and I were in San Diego we saw a yacht that had their own helicopter.(This trip was about 10-15 yrs ago)   2.)  When he parked the car at the restuarant next to a jeep, he stated to the kids that is just like your mom's car.  3.) he told the kids to tell me that he would be dropping off tax papers so I could take them to the accountant.  H contacted S to stop up and pick up some dinner- there was enough for al three of us. Again, making meals is his love language.

It seems he is trying to fit himself into the family.  Talking as a parent to the kids, showing that he cares about them, remembering the past with me, just little things along with the BIG one that he is no longer with the wh*r^! 

He has been trying to act more like a father to the kids since end of Dec 2018/Jan 2019 showing concern.

I wonder if the finance awareness started in Dec.  Xmas 2017 ($250 each x 3=$750) compared to Xmas 2018 ($150 x2 $100 x1=$400)- his gift of cash to the kids was reduced and more realistic.   

Divorce settlement date is set for April 3rd.  This is the D that the judge pushed to get off of his docket,  H did nothing for over 6 months, until judge made us have a meeting. Last meeting in Jan, H learned he would be losing over $100K of his retirment to me.  I wonder if he is feeling the pressure and maybe doesnt want the D.

I have read that they begin to remember thier past with thier spouse.  Can anyone tell me when this begins or where the post about this is?

I am detached and doing well!  When I was informed of the break up I did not have a big internal reaction.  I take it day by day.  Taking in the good and hoping he will reach out soon to me.- No expectations!!

Love to hear your thoughts :)

BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #80 on: February 24, 2019, 03:04:24 PM »
My thoughts are AWESOME, HOPE!! (remember our BD's are only a month apart!)

My D is now final and I got 85% of our estate and $300k in retirement.  So, clearly he wanted to settle quickly for OW.

I still think we'll be together when all is REALLY "said, and done!"

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #81 on: February 24, 2019, 04:00:31 PM »
Megogirl,

Thank you for your post.  I love to hear from you, not only do to our timelines being similar but also because of your positive attitude. You sound good and that is because of YOU!  You are an amazing person, you have taken care of yourself and look at the long term goal.  If you have to give up a few years to have an amazing life in the future well then I think it is worth it.  Take care Megogirl and I am sorry to hear that your D is final.  (((Hugs to you)))
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #82 on: February 24, 2019, 04:39:24 PM »
Awe....thanx, Hope xxx

I definitely credit any optimism that I do have straight back to RCR....who has taught me everything I know about this $h!tety boat we've all found ourselves in.

It's definitely hell, but at least she's made some sense of this.  I am FOREVER INDEBTED to this (mystery) woman!  For what I truly believe will end with a family saved from destruction.....
« Last Edit: February 24, 2019, 04:40:45 PM by megogirl »

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #83 on: February 27, 2019, 06:28:30 PM »
So I love this post that Sam I Am informed me about.  Storm Rider had posted it and it was reposted by Treasur.  I think there are so many of us at this stage that I thought it would beneficial to post it on my thread for myself and for others.

Second Half: less teenage, some awareness of LBS needs, more follow through, replay activities subside,  less blame for LBS/others, some boundaries kept, gradual shift, still OW, under stress cycle back to replay activities/attitude, less intensity, less energy, more sure of choice to leave so less need to push LBS away.
Replay Bounces: might look like "the" bottom but no deep processing yet.
1st = practical/financial aka "why does bad luck happen to me, not my fault", dips back into hard Replay.
2nd = despair aka "I did this, who am I now? No way out of it", still dips back, no big picture, small fixes.
3rd = realization aka "Oh #@$%, this really has hurt people close to me.", assembling the puzzle pieces

I see my H in the first bounce.  He has spoken anout the financials and knows that he doesn't have what he had prior to MLC.  He is being more responsible although with money.  I will look forward to bounce number two. 

My H's brother had a heart scare.  H called my D24 to tell her about it and she said he sounded scared.  He luckily only needed a stent and was able to go home today.  H has a fear of death, which he expressed to me back in 2017.  Will have to see how this affects him. 

OW is back talking with H.  They are like to junior high students.  Its unreal, thank goodness it their problem and not mine!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #84 on: March 04, 2019, 04:30:49 PM »
Well its been over a week and H still has single as his status on both social media accounts.  She is a clinger and will not let him go- and I am sure he likes that!  I believe she is the one who has been breaking it off. Just my instinct since he posts his #comfortfood on IG when $h!te is going down.  Why would he post that if he broke it off-he wouldn't.

He was with her for her bday on Saturday night but he did not post anything with her. Of course, she had to post a lot of pictures to help her insecurities.  As a psychologist, she is really not too smart!  It is like a one sided relationship her doing all of the work and him just going with it. She continues to stoke his ego.  What kind of person comments on a IG pic of him working out and says "I like you"- how juvenile!

My vent session is over and now for me,  I am having a great week and continue to be happy with who I am.  I had some dental work done- chipped my tooth- and the I was able to give such a positive uplifting talk to one of the gals who was having a bad day.  She gave me a hug and said Thank You!  I told her I would be back next week and she looked forward to seeing me again.She also asked me what book am I reading to have such a positive attitude.  I gave her an author Michael Nulty that I follow on Twitter.  If anyone needs a motivational person in their life - follow him!  Have a great night everyone!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #85 on: March 04, 2019, 05:02:25 PM »
She is a clinger and will not let him go- and I am sure he likes that! 

Hey, don't sell yourself short!

Because -- whether you realize this or not -- you're actually a large part of it. 

They actually get off on the love "triangle."  It's forbidden, and thrilling.  It makes them feel alive again (even studly!)

I speak from: 1. research; and 2. my own experience as an OW in my early 20's.  Had an affair with my BFF's then-boyfriend (now H).  I was totally sucked into the drama, and actually imagined myself to be acting in a tv soap-opera (?!)

Soooo....I have a "unique" perspective....because I've lived it.  I was just 23, as opposed to 43.   


« Last Edit: March 04, 2019, 06:14:34 PM by megogirl »

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #86 on: March 05, 2019, 03:07:23 AM »
There is no love “triangle” I have nonexistent this whole time. Well, at least he has made me feel that way. I have no clue what is really going on in his head. He avoids the home and me. That does tell me that he can’t bear to see me or be in the home as it reminds him of the past - his good life!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline megogirl

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #87 on: March 05, 2019, 01:09:33 PM »
There is no love “triangle” I have nonexistent this whole time.

Ohhhh.....none that you're aware of!

But men get off on the idea of being "fought over."  So even though your name might never even be mentioned, you are still a character in their movie....the "wicked wife." 

And, make no mistake: OW is absolutely jealous of you.  Because you are the "Queen."

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #88 on: March 06, 2019, 05:49:42 PM »
There is no love “triangle” I have nonexistent this whole time.

Ohhhh.....none that you're aware of!

But men get off on the idea of being "fought over."  So even though your name might never even be mentioned, you are still a character in their movie....the "wicked wife." 

And, make no mistake: OW is absolutely jealous of you.  Because you are the "Queen."

YESSSS!  I love your view and agree that OW is jealous of me, the "Queen"!  Otherwise, she would not feel that she has to post everything on social media and tag him so it is on his page hoping for me and the kids to see.  She feels as if she needs to throw it in our face.  Guess what? We don't look at her social media or his.  I have a couple of friends who watch and tell me what I need to know.  Otherwise nope I don't waste any time on her and her immature and insecure behaviors.  Maybe some day she will grow up and become a "Queen".
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #89 on: March 06, 2019, 11:52:03 PM »
Hope exactly the same as my OW. Isn’t it funny how they are all so similar. My Ow goes to the extreme of taking photos of Hs jacket on a chair with the caption “look who came to see me” almost like it’s a “haha he’s not with me” sometimes I wish I could comment “but he tried to sleep with me just an hour ago” but I’m not so petty. I have friends who went to uni with her so they have her on their socials (long before she was with H) and they send me stuff if I need to see it. Sometimes they send me stuff they find funny like when OW goes out and copies me buying clothes I’ve uploaded etc etc but they ha e gotten quite good In only showing me what I NEED to see because I’m really not interested otherwise.
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #90 on: March 10, 2019, 10:43:28 AM »
Sachat- I am glad we are both in the "I am not really interested"  group!  Detaching from the affair has helped me tremendously.  I am not saying I didn't have bad days, but for the most part I knew she meant nothing to him. She was an addiction that I hope is more than a faded memory.

BACKGROUND:  H did not see the kids from Oct-end of December 2018, Kids wrote H a letter about how they felt 12/16/18, H and ow broke up 12/31 for a day, H has moved his attention from her to the kids at the end of December. H has been consistent in his contact- actually it has picked up.  D24 says he seems "normal"
 
UPDATE:
Feb 20-22 there was trouble in paradise again
Feb 20 made dinner for the kids and contacted kids to go for breakfast on Sunday
Feb 23 H placed his IG as #single also changed FB
Feb 24 H took kids for breakfast and made dinner for us
Feb 25 H contacted daughter as his younger brother was at the hospital with heart issue
Feb 27 H met with daughter and banker for her to get pre-approved for her 1st home, asked D to go for dinner
Feb 28 H had lunch with S after college classes
Mar 1 H brought S some food at work- just showed up with it
Mar 2 H was out with AD for her bday-- I am guessing she pushed for this H was also w/ best friend and his wife
Mar 3 H made dinner for kids
Mar 5 AD actual birthday he was with her - no gifts from him
Mar 6 H made dinner again
Mar 7 H asked kids to go for breakfast on Sunday
Mar 8 AD posts "single" on her FB
Mar 9 H would normally only go out on Sat nights - he stayed home.
Mar 10 H took kids for breakfast

This is great progress for him.  I am not sure what is going on, but it seems he is reconnecting with his kids.  He is not moving towards me, with the exception of him mentioning me and past trips we took.  It was also nice to see that he was with his best friend and not the 28 yr old he hung with.  I had not seen that in months, but then I only know what I am told that is posted on FB or IG.  D24 agreed that it is a change for him. 

I will sit back and see what happens.  I will continue to pray the hedge of thrones prayer for him and hope that he sees his family is important to him and that he belongs with us.






BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #91 on: March 10, 2019, 11:15:54 AM »
I’m the same as you and I’ve said the same to H many a times during arguments and being nice. That I do not care about H or Ow or what they get up to as a couple. I will only intervene when it affects my children. And I stand by that.

Your H is making many good steps. But I would assume before he starts stepping to you he probably is building with his children. I’m not too sure on how the reconnecting side or things work as I try and only focus on the stage we are at. But to me reading it seems all good progress. 
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #92 on: March 11, 2019, 08:23:06 PM »
Yes, he continues to make great progress.  Today he was kidding with D24 about a funny situation that happened 4 years ago.  I feel like he is remembering the good in his past.

My H always said that he didn't want to give me false hope.  I think he will be cautious with me until he knows for sure what he is feeling. I just don't know if he will come to that decision in time for the final meeting for our divorce. 

I have been reading on the awakening and wonder if he isn't in the process of waking up.  I read Denjef and a lot of her post resonates with me.  He is seeming normal, connecting with the kids, being kind, is talking about the past with the kids and mentioning "our" life together, and has eliminated the OW.  Its been 2.5 years since BD so its about time we see positive moments.  I think the soon to be divorce, the loss of $ and family, the letters my kids wrote to him, and the time he has been in MLC/Replay are all significant factors. 
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: Replay, Awakening, Reconnection, OW Withdraw what is the order?
« Reply #93 on: March 14, 2019, 02:52:11 PM »
OK so I have a thought/question.

All of the positive steps he has made are towards the kids only.  Can he be reconnecting with the kids?  When can this occur because I do not think he has had an awakening or maybe he is in the beginning of one.  OW is dumped so this is confusing.  I have searched to find some answers but no luck.  I thought that they had to have an awakening to start making these big movements.  Maybe he is just moving his attention from his ex-wh@re to the kids.  Everything I see falls in to place except he is not making any movements towards me.  I know Denjef sat and watched for three months but our final divorce meeting is in three weeks.  I am lost on his actions. 
« Last Edit: March 14, 2019, 02:54:00 PM by hope2018 »
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline Disillusioned

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #94 on: March 14, 2019, 03:13:37 PM »
BbHelp made a point of the reconnection process.  I believe he said something to the effect that the MLCer connects with everyone/everything else first, before the LBS.  He included the vacuum cleaner.   ;D
M=50
W=47
D=8
BD Feb 17 Thinking of divorce
Atomic BD June 17 Spying revealed OM at work
Still home.  Threatened to leave several times and has asked me to leave about a dozen. 
Says divorce proceedings will start Jan 18.
She has scheduled mediation Feb 7,  2018
I moved out March 16, 2018
Several mediations, mostly instigated by me.  Foot dragging by STBXW.  Nothing filed. Yet.

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #95 on: March 14, 2019, 03:18:34 PM »
BbHelp made a point of the reconnection process.  I believe he said something to the effect that the MLCer connects with everyone/everything else first, before the LBS.  He included the vacuum cleaner.   ;D

Yes, I remember reading that but can they reconnect to kids prior to an awakening? I am just confused on all of these actions. 
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online Milly

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #96 on: March 14, 2019, 03:27:17 PM »
Hope, there is more than one awakening. It's possible your H had one of them, and that has lead him to want to make a move towards the kids. He might keep progressing and eventually reach you, or he could go back into Replay, go on for a while, have another awakening and move towards the kids/you again.

Unfortunately, it's not usually a straight path. However, connecting with the kids is still a very positive sign. I remember reading somewhere on HS or HB, to just enjoy things when they're positive and not worry about the next step. In any case it's going to be slow.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D24, D21, S14
OW Physical Affair. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 50 last year.

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #97 on: March 15, 2019, 03:56:48 AM »
Milly-
Thank you for the post and words of encouragement! I am happy to see these small steps and will take all of the positive movements we can get.  If o recall correctly, I think I read that one LBS said that it was a 6 month span between the awakenings for them.  Does that sound accurate ?  I know each case is different but knowing that there are more positives coming is good for the soul. And well... I am sure more firetrucking immature behaviors too!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #98 on: March 15, 2019, 08:29:54 PM »
Well H went to workout at 4 am this morning. This not normal for him. D24 talked with him at 7 am and he told her was going to try to get more sleep. He posted about loving his children unconditionally! More positive progress. D24 talked about a house that was for sale and he told her not to rush into it and to really figure out if she wanted a two story home. Now last July he told her you are an adult and can make your own decisions. What a nice change!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #99 on: March 17, 2019, 06:27:14 PM »
Just another update of what my world looks like~

To be honest I was a little worried about my H on Saturday night.  I prayed that H would not have contact with his ex-wh@re and that he would not get drunk.  Well, I worried about nothing.  (They broke up on 2/23, although last contact was March 5.)  I hope for his sake he can maintain this path. 

Usually, he cooks on Sundays and calls one of the kids to come get food.  Nope not this Sunday.  No cooking, not even a trip to the gym for a workout.  D24 called him and asked if he was cooking today and he said nope I am snoozing in the recliner. She asked if he wanted some food brought up since we were cooking out on the grill, he told her he was good.  She then asked if he wanted some fresh baked cookies and she got a no to that too.  He obviously didn't want anyone to go there. 
His replay behaviors are very quiet if not gone.  He has had consistent contact with the kids since 12/30, but I did notice that he did not contact the kids on Friday or Saturday.  D24 texted him and he responded with a joke and was friendly but no true conversation.  My guess he is in OW withdraw.

I believe H may have started the awakening process when he started connecting with the kids.  I have not seen any movements towards me.  Can OW withdraw force a further awakening?

For the rest of my weekend, I enjoyed some Irish music and S20 and I made some peanut butter cookies and cooked out on the grill.  A good way to spend my St Patty's weekend!
BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

Online sachat3

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #100 on: March 18, 2019, 03:04:31 AM »
I have no information to offer with regards to Ow withdrawal. I only tend to research where I’m at now. And as H is still with Ow. It’s not relevant to me. But maybe he is I’m not sure how long that would last but he sounds as though he is in some kind of funk.
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline hope2018Topic starter

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Re: (HFK) Replay to Liminality and everything in between
« Reply #101 on: March 18, 2019, 02:46:42 PM »
Sachat-

Thank you for the reply.  I do appreciate your thoughts!  I did read that the most intense withdraw period is the first three weeks.  I have also talked with others that contradict that statement and said that their spouses lasted only a week.  I think it depends on the person's personality and the relationship with the OW. I was also told that if he was in OW withdraw he would have not wanted to go out on Saturday night to the concert.  That during this depression they do not do anything.  So your guess is as good as mine. I'll take it as some type of movement.  So after I posted, D24 came home and she said her dad called her and he made her some cold pasta salad.  She picked it up at 8:15 PM.  He told her he was tired and was going to bed. I am not sure if he made the salad to not let her down or if he made it for himself and had extra for her. It doesn't matter which it is.  The only thing that matters is that he thought of her.  He also told her he going to bed ~ 8:15pm that tells me something is going on. 

BD1 9/10/2016 Not happy, this isn’t working
BD2 9/24/2017 I care about you, but not in love with you - moved out
OW1 confirmed 8/2017 - ended 2/2018
OW2 confirmed 5/30/2018, ended 2/23/2019
H lost his job 7/23/2018
H started new job 12/17/2018

 

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