Author Topic: My Story Beauty into Beast 10  (Read 503 times)

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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My Story Beauty into Beast 10
« on: March 14, 2019, 07:35:56 AM »
Previous Thread

https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10555.150;topicseen


Well I just put a huge update on my last thread so nothing more to report at the moment. Simply creating my new thread for the furry thread police.  8)

I do find it interesting that today I was firm on a boundary with someone (not MLCer) and their response was basically a virtual foot stomp, followed by the silent treatment.

I think before I would have either allowed it from the beginning so as not to upset someone else, or if it had come out how I felt...and they responded this way..I would have chased the person up saying I was sorry, didn't mean it...it's okay...and give in.

So I guess in a personal development sort of way, I am not trying to fix anyone else's problems...or mould myself into what will make them happy.

Yay! :)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Rising Phoenix

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2019, 07:43:33 AM »
Coming along mort xx
Me 50
H51
Married 20yrs
Together 29yr
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang fir 3 yrs now Vanisher other twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline Thunder

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2019, 07:55:35 AM »
Coming alone for the ride, Mort.

Your last thread was seriously so interesting, I had to go back to the beginning and read the whole thing.  A lot of smart LBS's on this forum.   ;)

I was just got to the end and you had to start new thread.

I'll be following this one.   ;)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline UrsaMajor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2019, 08:02:12 AM »
Well, if it wouldn't have been me, it would have been someone else... <snort>

Me - 55
MLC - 47
Together 20 years - Married for 17 at separation
S - 11
D - 8
2 Canines (each of us has one)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold and separated - March 2016
Mid-Lifer has filed for D

Survival Instructions for Newbies
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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline sachat3

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2019, 09:15:37 AM »
Following along Morte

I was the same with boundaries. I let people get away with murder. No more!!
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline Milly

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2019, 09:33:54 AM »
Following your H's antics with interest! I love your sense of humour!
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D24, D21, S14
OW Physical Affair. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 50 last year.

Offline KeepItTogether

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2019, 09:56:16 AM »
Mort--my H has mentioned the whole "wanting to die soon" thing too. So childish and immature. As if, as you pointed out, once the kids are 18 it's fine if Dad dies. Mine just wants to die now. So there's that. You are quite right in saying you have 3 children now. MLCers are in a category all their own, and they may differ a bit, but they are ALL immature, selfish beings.

You are doing great. I am pretty sure I wouldn't have maintained the composure you did. Which is probably why yours felt comfortable talking to you. So kudos to you!
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline Bewildered survivor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2019, 10:11:25 AM »
Attaching

Offline Sunny9876

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2019, 10:54:54 AM »
Following along as we have similar timelines.  I don't post much but always try and keep up with ones that have the same timings.

Sunny

Offline Sam I Am

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2019, 10:59:16 AM »
attaching

Morte:  My H told me one time that he can not think about the future.  It upsets him.  He can only worry about now.   

Wow! 
2019 - 365 New Opportunities  Bring It On!

I choose to feel blessed - I choose to feel grateful
I choose to be excited - I choose to be thankful
I CHOOSE to be HAPPY

BD 10 29 2017  Moved out to OW/A began in  7.17
3/5/18 OW moved/H moved in with F
3/19/18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW in another State
9.4.18  Moved back...Living with Parents OW Out of State 
11.1.18  Moved in with sister  Part of H's belonging are boxed on parents side porch
Dec 18 - OW may be living locally but H not fully living with her
Jan 2019 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings

Started Dating - Spring 1983
Married - August 1985
D29 - 2 children living locally
D -29 Married with 2 children
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School
3 Dogs

Offline Helpingme!

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2019, 12:29:45 PM »
Following along Morte

Offline islandgirl68

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2019, 01:59:18 PM »
If we were unmarried women at the ripe old age of 23-26 we would be spinsters... after that Thornbacks.  (BTW thanks Twitter for that golden nugget 8)). I guess being married and all... Matron are we. Elderly in our 30s ;D

xxx following along Matron Morte xxx
« Last Edit: March 14, 2019, 02:03:26 PM by islandgirl68 »
Me: 34
H: 36
S17; D11; D8; D4
Together 19 years, Married for 2
BD: 4/25/2017 (EA, FA)
BD: 4/10/2018 (EA same OW)
I don't know who this person is. Putting my stand in a box and burying it.

Offline PJ Ames

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2019, 11:14:37 PM »
Along for the ride. Love your sense of humor.
"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Married 1991
S: 24, D: 21 both doing great.

BD #1: June, 2016 - discovered EA with co-worker
BD #2: November 2018 - discovered online relationship with dude she met playing video games; she has never met him in person.
5-day separation (she left), November, 2018
W is trying (a little), but has no remorse. Nowhere near fully-cooked.

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2019, 03:44:50 AM »
So generally after any heart to heart, emotional, or in depth talks....it is never really spoken about until perhaps the next talk.

He has never wanted to acknowledge these moments happen. It makes him uncomfortable to know that he shares these deep feelings with me (even when married). He tends to feel ashamed or weak. Like some how he shouldn't share this stuff with anyone.

So imagine my surprise when yesterday he was texting about going to his dentist, and then he said ''Long term thinking. Interesting concept'' and I said ''Random thought of the day?'' and he said ''No you said it yesterday'' and I said ''I know, But I am surprised it stuck!'' then he said ''It's like a bit of gum in my shoe''

Now first of all I am surprised he even was paying attention to what I said. For a while there everything I said got misconstrued and turned into some huge negative. Literally every word out of my mouth was me somehow insulting him.  ??? ::)

But during our talk on Wed I was saying how I have long term thinking. The ability to know that no matter how $h!te things are right now, I know what I want in the future, so I just keep taking steps toward it...and in the end things will work out. I then went on to say how he has always been an  ''in this moment'' thinker. He decides what he wants today, tomorrow, or this week...and just does it...without thinking about the consequences in the future. And it always seemed to balance each other. He helped me live in the moment and have fun without worrying about the consequences all the time, and I had the steady head to keep us progressing through life. We succeeded as much as we have from the combination of the two...a team in all respects.

Anyway I figured he had drowned it all out. But clearly he didn't. Something about that part of the discussion has stuck with him like a 'bit of gum on his shoe'.

It is so strange to actually hear acknowledgement from him, that he is thinking about the things we talk about. Particularly after months of feeling ignored, and unheard, and avoided. To see HIM coming to ME for advice, and to talk about all these dark things within himself. Of all the people in his life, and in his world, it is me he still feels emotionally safest with.

I really get the feeling moments like these are what make the MLC/LBS journey. I think most people at my current stage would be to broken, upset, hurt, shocked, disgusted to hear anything out of his mouth. After all he is in an active affair with a girl over a decade younger, he barely sees his kids, he is emotionally unstable....on paper he is everything I would avoid. But there is a history and a deep bonding there that makes it more than that.

I think at this stage it is entirely up to the LBS on how they handle the situation, and what the ultimate outcome will be. I think my instinct from being wounded and hurt is to call him out on all his $h!te, to slam the door in his face, to be an ''I told you so you idiot''. To jump up and down screaming ''Stop being a douchebag and come home to your family''. I imagine lots of LBS do that, and then the MLCer will run off, they won't feel safe coming to you. They don't need to hear what they already know deep down. They don't need to look at you, feeling guilt and shame...then be judged on top of it.

So I think moments like this are what they talk about 'paving the way' and 'being a safe harbour' and such. It isn't about constantly being nice to them, or constantly being the bigger person, or always being a perfect angel while they stomp all over you. I think 'paving the way' is swallowing your own ego and pride, knowing the pain that has been caused to you, but letting it go and trying to help just as you would have before. Like you would for any friend. Without judgement or I told you so, or waaaa waaaa poor me.

And it is hard. It is bloody hard!

I don't know. I am not an expert. I am just going off what I read all over the forums, books, articles, x, y, z of research I have done..and my experience with a nuttier than a snickers bar MLCer. Whatever that is good for.  ::)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline UrsaMajor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2019, 03:58:23 AM »
^^^^
THIS!




Me - 55
MLC - 47
Together 20 years - Married for 17 at separation
S - 11
D - 8
2 Canines (each of us has one)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold and separated - March 2016
Mid-Lifer has filed for D

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2019, 04:01:30 AM »
I think it is about the circumstances and the cost to the LBS.
You can't act like a friend if someone is threatening your life or waging legal war against you or screaming monster spew of course. Your safety and your kids come first.

But if circumstances provide some calm waters and you are emotionally detached enough to not rush to fix or take it too personally - in a sense to see it like a window into their ramblings in their own head - then great. Most of us would want to do that; years of love and friendship don't just disappear, maybe even for them actually. We may not know the MLC version but we knew the preMLC version intimately, flaws and all. It was one of the shocking things for me that the h who used to chat with me about all kinds of things for so many years, and vice versa, suddenly simply didn't want to talk to me at all. Apparently in my circs ever again! I guess there is a benefit to talking to new people who didn't know you before....although I suspect many don't talk much at all actually...but there are things that only someone who has known you well for a long time might 'get' I suspect so there is a cost to the MLCer eventually if they have completely cut that off isn't there?

I honestly thought for a long time that my h would eventually need to talk to me.

Funnily enough as I am slowly recovering my own emotional health and no longer want any contact (or anything really) from my xh, I could probably listen now in a way I couldn't when I was flailing around for answers. Actually it would be easier to listen bc I would no longer trust him enough to share any of my important thoughts or feelings. However, my xh made his choices so he will have to talk to his new wife,his psychiatrist or himself I guess  ::) Or random strangers in the street  ::)

You are doing just fine, Morte...Beast is stewing...no idea where that will take him of course. It does sound as if he is still confused but the big difference is that he no longer sounds as if he is blaming YOU for his confusion. Maybe that's the change? .

How is the great romantic fiction challenge going? I truly hope he doesn't want you to be a proof reader though! (Although Miss Skittles may not have the skills!)
« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 04:07:24 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline Tyks

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2019, 04:10:43 AM »
I am actually grateful for MLC in many ways. I am.no longer a fixer of other people's crap and it feels great. I live for myself which I always thought was selfish but I think there is a fine line for selfish and fixer. It took almost three years of work to get that under control and I still slip somerimes.  I always thought that I had to be that fixer and chase after everyone for their love and support as well, and make sure they were happy and their needs were being met, which is not true at all. Real people should love you for you and not what you do for them.

I am.not.going to hijack and post everything I have learned but this kinda goes with what you said about what you used to do.

Me 49
Him 49
22 years together - Married 20
BD1 - August 26, 2016 - ILYBINILWY
BD 2 - August 28, 2016 - OW discovered EA - Kicked him out
D16 D19
April 2017 - Legal Separation Agreement
August 2017 - I filed for divorce
Divorce final February 12 2018

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2019, 04:14:30 AM »
Amen to that, Tyks  :)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Online Whyus

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2019, 04:29:12 AM »
Following along of Course........
so true about talking and listening (if it doesnt harm the LBS). I too have had quality conversations with XW. Its normally the case when we meet which isnt very often. The first few minutes are awkward but we both chill out quite quickly and then we just Chat as we used to (no R talks though of Course).
We feel safe tagether but no more, it is weird but your doing well Morte  :)
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2019, 10:39:13 AM »
Hello,

Quote
I think 'paving the way' is swallowing your own ego and pride, knowing the pain that has been caused to you, but letting it go and trying to help just as you would have before. Like you would for any friend.


It is letting go of the anger and bitterness so that you can heal. Then you become a source of positive energy that attracts others. Your journey is to reclaim yourself.

Quote
I am actually grateful for MLC in many ways. I am.no longer a fixer of other people's crap and it feels great.

This is a solid point. Sometimes focusing on other people's issues and problems enables us to avoid looking at ourselves and the work we need to do.

Quote
He decides what he wants today, tomorrow, or this week...and just does it...without thinking about the consequences in the future.

This is where I truly feel sorry for your H. You have three young children and the one thing he doesn't realize is they won't be young forever. Two is just one year, and its gone forever, the first walk, the first words, the first day at school, the first bike ride, come and go in a flash.

He's missing out on all those great memories and moments, all because he can't face reality. From my perspective, somewhere, somehow, your H became dissatisfied with life. That somehow he missed his moment and that there should be more to life, than three kids and a good wife.

For better or worse, he's trying to hit the reset button and start over. In time, that will lose its appeal and he will only be more miserable and unhappy. Not only will he be older, he will realize his own kids are older and he missed a major chapter in their lives.

And that is an awful, terrible feeling when it hits him down the road.

Quote
I think most people at my current stage would be to broken, upset, hurt, shocked, disgusted to hear anything out of his mouth.

Most are and based upon his actions, they have every right to be. Many MLCers don't even try to come back out of the guilt and remorse they feel. They feel as if they don't deserve a second chance. Other's don't try out of pride and despite MLC, despite being by the ghosts of Christmas Past, Present, and Future, they can never admit they are wrong.

Some don't want to come back if they know the LBSer is going to extract their pound of flesh and constantly remind them of their actions.

But you and I can't predict their actions because it is their journey and you can only steer your ship.

Quote
Anyway I figured he had drowned it all out. But clearly he didn't. Something about that part of the discussion has stuck with him like a 'bit of gum on his shoe'.

It is so strange to actually hear acknowledgement from him, that he is thinking about the things we talk about.

However, I do commend your conversations with him as you are not telling him what to do but your are influencing his thoughts.

There is an incredible book "Forgiveness is a choice" by Robert Enright. It talks about the steps to forgive and heal. You don't forgive your H for him, you forgive your H for you. It won't happen overnight and your h still is on his journey.

Your conversations have lit a candle for him and while he goes back and forth. You are moving forward and enjoying your "average life".

Keep going strong, love your babies, and most of all love yourself.


(((((Ready)))))
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2019, 10:52:27 AM »
Imho I think we LBS can push ourselves a bit hard on the forgiveness thing.
I believe we can accept and not be angry or vengeful....but forgiving is a whole other level. Especially with someone who has shown no remorse or acknowledgement of the damage their actions caused. And not good to push for necessarily while we are still traumatised or dealing with a monster.
Sometimes maybe non angry acceptance is enough?
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2019, 11:27:35 AM »
Hello,

Quote
but forgiving is a whole other level. Especially with someone who has shown no remorse or acknowledgement of the damage their actions caused.

Excellent point and I am so glad that you brought it up. The major point of the book is that forgiveness is not absolution. In the book, forgiveness is letting go of the anger and bitterness that the other person inflicted on you. No longer will this person affect me. You can forgive those that are not even sorry or show any remorse. It is the ultimate act of truly letting go.

A lot of people commit sin thinking if the ask GOD for forgiveness, all will be forgotten. GOD does forgive, but that still does not prevent someone for facing the consequences of their actions.

Her H will still have to live and deal with the consequences of the actions he has caused. One way of the other. Mortesbride won't be impacted one way or the other because she has liberated herself from the situation.

Just my opinion and a great topic,

(((((Ready))))

"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Offline Anjae

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2019, 12:54:55 PM »
Beast is still lost, but seems to be reconnecting. Or, at least, he is being/wanting to be in touch.

A MLCers only being able to live in the now is like a day of a time/no expectations for the LBS. Meditation also teach us to live in the present. I have been finding it very useful for years.

For me forgiving was easy. I don't have a returning MLCer with whom I am going to have to live. With a returning MLC forgivess may be far more difficult.

As for listening to the MLCer. My experience with Mr J is different than most. I listened to him a lot early on. He talked a lot since he left and would still be talking if I hadn't cut him off. He was also nasty, abusive and leading a life with someone else. Would I listen to him now? No. Things have changed, I have changed. I may read it. May.
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2019, 05:14:22 AM »
While making breakfast for this kids this morning I had a strange thought pattern that makes a lot of sense...no where else to share it so here goes.

Beast used to never like to eat other people's cooking or watch them eat. He didn't like his mom's cooking, complained and had anxiety over restaurants, wouldn't eat home made goods from baking stalls...You get the drift.

During our marriage this was never the case with the things that I made. Sure he might complain about the type of bread I bought or ''oh chicken again'' type comments, but he always ate his dinners, never left them...never complained about the way I ate. It was like I was the exception. If I made it, it was safe.

Until BD. At BD he was to scared to eat a sandwich I made because I might have poisoned it.  :o For a while, even if we bought him a box of sweets for his Bday or something, they remained unopened as if he thought somehow I got inside the package to lace it with arsenic.  ::)

Roll on to Christmas period and he was happy for me to offer him something, and he would hesitate and you could see the mental battle inside himself....and then he would eat it anyway. Sorta like when I used to watch him battle with his OCD.

Roll on to this last Christmas (a year and a bit after BD) and not only was he expecting me to make Xmas dinner, he was shocked and disappointed when it was his mom who ended up making it. Then a few months later he was gardening so I offered him dinner with us spur of the moment. And dare I say he was almost excited?

Then a few weeks later (last week) I offered him dinner in advance for reasons previously mentioned. I was interested to see if he would back out at the last minute. He did not. He did not hesitate, he ate every single bite, and told me how tasty and amazing it was with what seemed like genuine appreciation. Rare from him particularly to food.

We had talked about why didn't anyone else make him dinners (heavily implying MIL or OW) and he looked uncomfortable at the thought, and said ''Hell No. I do all he cooking''. At the time I interpreted this to mean that I guess she doesn't cook. But perhaps it is more he doesn't allow her to. Perhaps he does not trust her to get the list of things he can't eat right, without poisoning him in a manner of speaking. All it takes is a bit of onion to send him into pain for days.... :o

Anyway it is a strange thought process but another avenue that indirectly shows that even after everything, he still seems to trust me with the things HE deems most important. His deep darkie emotions, advice for how to handle his family, his children, and his food.

Interesting.

You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #24 on: March 17, 2019, 06:08:00 AM »
BIL stayed over for pizza and movies with the kids, then after they went to bed we had a good long chat.

Talked a lot about what he is been feeling, how he feels ignored by MIL....history repeating itself.

His need to escape the house and get away, leading him to party and drink and now miss school. Sigh.

I really hate it when I am right some times.  :-\

He said he has no one to talk to, and it was like a tidal wave came out of him. I think he genuinely appreciated talking to me, and felt better afterwards.

Of course the conversation lead to parts about Beast. Most things confirmed things I had guessed.

But apparently he has been telling BIL at least fairly recently that I am still ''taking all his money''. I confirmed that has not been the case in the slightest since last June, that all he has paid me is X amount in child maintenance... which realistically wouldn't even cover our groceries for three kids.

The only real things of note were apparently he has over heard them talking about wanting to buy a place instead of rent. That should be interesting. How you going to explain already having a mortgage with your wife and wanting one with your girlfriend?  ::)

Perhaps he will do like that car, make her get the mortgage in her name, and offer to pay her...but realistically all the debt would be on her if things crash and burn.

I will not say anything about it, and just watch and see what happens.

On the flip side he said ''Beast is a completely different person while she is in. Then she leaves and I can just say 'hi' and he flips out at me''. I said ''So he is never moody at all when she is around?'' and BIL said ''No he is fake nice him''.

I guess the nice guy fakery is exhausting. And BIL basically confirmed that they must have had a break or something last week because she wasn't around like normal.

Anyway nothing else really crazy or out there. Much of what I guessed here to be fair.

Today MIL suddenly texting me asking me and the kids to come to dinner with her next week. I haven't really spoken to or heard from her since the last dinner out. Very odd.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Anjae

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #25 on: March 17, 2019, 08:51:24 AM »
The only real things of note were apparently he has over heard them talking about wanting to buy a place instead of rent. That should be interesting. How you going to explain already having a mortgage with your wife and wanting one with your girlfriend?  ::)

Who knows. Mr J thought I could get married again even if I was still legally married to him.  ::) MLCers thinking is a mess.

If OW asks for the loan on her own and things crash and burn, well, it was her choice.

Beast may be like many MLCers. Mr/Mrs Nice when around OW/OM and MLC friends, real MLC person when around the LBS, relatives or old friends. Some MLCers even manage to be nice around relatives and old friends.

Which tells me they unload on us on purpose. After all, they can be nice and hide their other side from everyone else. They have selective manners depending of person. That requires thinking/knowing what they are doing. It is the same with abusers. Often people do not believe a man is an abuser because he is a nice, amazing man to everyone. But wife and kids.

Lundy Bancrofts' Why Does He Do That explains abusers abuse mostly because of how they think/their view of the abused. It is the same with MLCers, it has to do with what they think of us/how they see us. We are not worthy, they can treat us as they please/do to us whatever they want.

They see OW/OM differently. Same for MLC friends, etc.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2019, 08:54:23 AM by Anjae »
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #26 on: March 17, 2019, 10:12:50 AM »
I think that's true. They convert the LBS into an object of hatred or a barrier to their happy or something that represents their failure, I think. And perhaps too for a while they take advantage of our (understandable) love, trust, shock and confusion bc they can. And then usually get pretty angry and up the control games when we start responding differently.

Just another reason really why nothing the LBS does makes any difference at all to their behaviour or feelings. I honestly believe they convert us from a human to an object, a chair as Acorn said on her thread. And some never reappear to see that we are a real human being bc that would be uncomfortable.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
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BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline Rising Phoenix

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #27 on: March 17, 2019, 10:48:35 AM »
They do, we become the object of the self hatred they can’t face. As for ow, I believe they are fake happy until normal every day living together happens. In the fog I think they keep trying to convince themselves that this will make them happy, plus ow stokes their ego. Xx
Me 50
H51
Married 20yrs
Together 29yr
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang fir 3 yrs now Vanisher other twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline Bewildered survivor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2019, 02:17:34 PM »
I can soo relate to the mr nice guy in front of everyone else. Because H was mr nice guy for soo many years it’s hard for people to believe he’s being such a monster to me. I struggle to believe it sometime to. I’m not sure he is exhausted from the wearing the mask in front of OW or anyone else. I feel he wore it for soo many years with me to. He’s always had to be perfect son, husband, father etc that he eventually imploded. As long as I’m around as punching bag and a source of release for his self hatred projection he’ll prob be able to maintain the fake mask for a very long time. I just don’t know how to remove myself from being that ‘object’. As long as our children are small and can be used as tools or objects in his game I’ll always be on that stage playing the villain- unless I give in and let him destroy the kids....which will never happen.

Mort I think it’s good you have some knowledge of the lies he’s telling others so at least you can set them straight. I had this opportunity to until he manipulated his family into cutting contact with me. Now he can lie as much as he wants without anyone calling him out on it. I’m sure deep down they know he is lying but they are avoidant people and struggle to accept he’s no longer golden child and really want to believe him. My MIL shortly after BD actually told me not to believe or trust a word he says because he’s been possessed by the devil and wants to break you-lol. So she knows in her heart what the truth is even if it is easier to deny it right now.

Offline Anjae

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2019, 03:30:35 PM »
Mr J never wore a mask when we were together. And he knew the nice side he was showing OW1 was just that, his nice side. He wrote her as much. Did he ever showed her his less nice side? I don't know. Did he ever told OW2 he was just showing her his nice side? I don't know.

For those with small children it is much more difficult to remove ourselves. However, the nice guy mask and the hate, desdain and seeing us as a thing or the enemy do not go away even if we fully remove ourselves from them. I have been away from Mr J for over a decade and there is barely any contact. When there is, at times it is civil, at others he is still nasty and angry.

Since it has been years we have not been in each other life, why does he remains so angry and nasty towards me? I don't know. Years ago he had a phase he was snappy and rude to MLC and old friends on Facebook. Maybe he does not manage to keep the mask in place all the time. Maybe when he doens't he still blames me. Who knows what is going on in their minds.
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #30 on: March 17, 2019, 06:51:48 PM »
Hello,

Quote
The only real things of note were apparently he has over heard them talking about wanting to buy a place instead of rent.

My opinion, this is an OW push. The more she can pull him towards her, tie him to her the better. Not going to get a marriage. How about a mortgage? Hmmmm

The food issue is really interesting. For example, a lot of people diagnose the MLCer as a narcissist. In psychological terms, a true narcissist is rare. The MLCer may display narcissist tendencies, but not be a true narcissist. Your h is diagnosed with ocd. That is a much more prevalent condition. It is interesting because you typically don't turn ocd on or off. Just like being a narcissist in the truest sense. Your example of the food is very rare and interesting.

It does indicate a high level of trust.

Quote
recently that I am still ''taking all his money''.

That's MLCer talk. Gee I live my wife high and dry and they expect you and the kids to manage on nothing. He needs his money for he and his ho.

Quote
I’m not sure he is exhausted from the wearing the mask in front of OW or anyone else.

It does, it gets more difficult because it takes a lot of energy. The guilt takes energy too. That's why they get angry with the LBSer. Damn you for making me feel so bad.
That's why we become the bad guys.

Your h is stewing. He will continue to cycle. How are the kids dealing with this? Just curious.

((((Hugs))) and more (((Hugs)))

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Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2019, 02:58:53 AM »
Anjae
 I am not entirely sure it is so much an on purpose thing as a....I am at home, they know my other side, I don't have to fake it...thing. I don't think he ever purposefully saved his bad behaviour for here, I think he just didn't fake it at times from exhaustion. Does that make it any better? Not really I suppose, but the intention/motive is different I think. Beast would fit into the category of 'no one would believe this funny, witty, charming guy, has depression episodes, mood swings, and an eating disorder though. And the keeping of the façade is what is so exhausting.


Treasur
I think that makes it to personal. The way you are talking about it is as if it is a personal vendetta against us. I think...we are more collateral damage. They use us to validate what they have done, to poke us and say ''see look she's crazy, I was right to leave''. But really the only way they can get through the day knowing they have betrayed everything about who they were, is to make it someone else's fault. Lucky us.  ::) In reality that won't last forever.

I don't think what we did makes a difference to MLC happening. But I think each of these small ''touch and goes'' or valleys...when they come to you, in that sorta open vulnerable way. They matter  A LOT. Because they will look back and say no matter how badly they treated you, how much of a jerk, how much of an ass they were...you were always calm, polite, yet firmly stood for what was right. So saying what we does makes no difference....well not to the process, not to them going into it, no way for us to pull them out...but the way they view us at the end, and if they decide to try to fix what was broken we certainly do.

Ready
Of course it is! I think I called that about 3-6 months ago? I said on my thread I was surprised it wasn't already coming up. He is living with MIL and BIL in a 2 bedroom apartment. Add Beast and his affair partner and it is crowded as all get out. I guess I am just surprised the idiot would talk buying instead of rent, but I know this is coming from the fact our mortgage is cheaper then renting...but he hasn't considered the fact that I put down a 15K deposit which SIGNIFICANTLY reduced the mortgage. I have no idea what the banks would even say to a guy and his gf, when he clearly has a mortgage and financial ties to his wife. Interesting indeed.

My guess is she is moaning she wants to move into their own place and live a happy happy life, he is feeling pressured to do it, will say whatever she wants to hear...but also...I think that thought frightens him. After all the whole point of leaving was to get rid of responsibility, and here she is wanting him to knuckle down with more so quickly. He's gonna have to figure out how he is going to lie to me and the kids about it, where visitation is going to happen...and like 900 more things running through his head I am sure. Good luck with that bro. :P

I know he has been DIAGNOSED OCD and there was talk at once that he was perhaps bipolar but he quit therapy before they got further. The problem is when he speaks to a therapist, he is all smiles and dances. He has literally told me they are useless because he just lies to them, and doesn't tell them the truth. That if they knew the truth they would lock him up. :o The eating thing is a stress induced behaviour for the most part. Some how making himself sick is a way to control the situation, and to some degree a way to punish himself. Which goes back to the 'demon will never let me be happy' thing he goes on about in his darker moments. But watching or hearing people eat is a disgusting thing to him, like fills him with anxiety and rage. And then I think the OCD plays a part in the whole, can't eat others food. Who knows right?!

At the moment the kids are fine for the most part. I suppose the boys are mostly to young to notice the problem because they were young when he took off, and the middle son Beast was never to great with to begin. I have always had to push him to try and bond or connect with him. It just never seems to take. Daughter was old enough to remember all the good family times, so she is hit the hardest. She loves her dad but regularly talks about how disgusting or ''cringey'' she finds it. Why does dad do this or that? Why does dad act like he loves you and is jealous, but he is with OW? Why can't he just stop and come home? Why is his brain sick? I answer them honestly, in ways she can understand, but I never bash him. I do not call him names, or do the woah is me dance. I answer her simply and plainly and it seems to help.

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I was watching videos from the Marriage helper (that someone else posted about last night) on limerance and the three stages of an affair. He talks about a stage called crystallisation (2nd stage) where everything in life is about the limerant object (OW). They will give up everything...their job, their wife, their kids...because the highs are so high when the limerant object shows them favour and they think it can last forever. When the limerant object shows them disfavour they go really low and depressive and hyperanxious about how to please them...so they can get back up on the high.

 It was a really great discussion and personally I think it is basically about replay. He also said sometimes the limerant object isn't an affair (it usually is) but it can be work, travel, gambling...you name it. But overall there is a bell curve, what we call the tunnel...as they begin they can peak out more, connect with you more, know what they are doing is wrong and maybe try to stop...but as they reach the top....it is time to vilify us. They HAVE to vilify us to justify in their minds what they have done. It is the only way they can look themselves and their loss of morals and who they were in the face. So we become x, y, z and they goad us, and they prod us to prove themselves right. But he talks about the third stage called deterioration and how the halo effect on the limerant object begins to lose its shine, the cracks begin to show, and only then do they start to see the LBS in a different manner. They no longer have a need to vilify you, they start to see all the positive they had with you, and the positive strength and compassion whatever you have shown. So listening to the video...whatever you want to call it...is the same as what we learn here.

Anyway give it a watch if you got the spare time. It really is a good talk. The man talking had a MLC, divorced his wife, went after OW1, she left him, so he went for a brief time with OW2 because he had vilified his spouse so much he couldn't yet re-rewrite history in his mind. He and his wife ended up working things out, got remarried and have been together every since (20+ years). So not only is he a MLCer, but he is also a councillor and sees it everyday over and over again.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Anjae

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2019, 08:56:41 AM »
Beast would fit into the category of 'no one would believe this funny, witty, charming guy, has depression episodes, mood swings, and an eating disorder though. And the keeping of the façade is what is so exhausting.

Think that goes for nearly all MLCers. Not all. My wallower cousin soon was not able to hide is depression and crisis self from anyone. His wife, friends, work and study colleagues, relatives (aside from grandmother and I) all were exposed to his depression, anger and mood swings.

Maybe a wallower, is not able to hide for long since they don't have high energy. I am certain Mr J reserved the nasty for me when I was still around. He was exausted, but he could had went to where he lived rather than come by the flat and unload on me. He kept reserving the anger and nasty through other means when I moved back.

It can be very, very personal. Some MLCers are that way. RCR and HB talk about it. Some MLCers set out to destroy the LBS. Mr J is one of those. I am both someone he wants to destroy, he told as much, and collateral damage. However, I think most MLCers do not have the level of crazy crisis Mr J has. He tried to killed and was physically abusive. That was meant for me and me alone. So was the rest.

For me the thing is (was), too many years went by. There was too much contact, too much info, too much talk and nothing changed. I cut Mr J off. I am polite eif I have to address him, but that is all.

I am certain Mr J seems me as someone who is distant, has no interests in listening to him and is not willing to give him a chance. Now none of that is false. For years it was.


Regarding the "affair". MLCers who have more than one alienator didn't have up everything for alienator number, 2,3, etc. They may had gave up everything for alienator number 1. Mr J always told me he didn't left because of OW1 and that it wasn't about OW1. It wasn't about OW1, but he only left after months of being involved with her. No OW he wouldn't had left. Not that I think it would had made a difference. I would had kicked his MLC self out anyway. He was very angry, nasty, abusive.

So far, I don't know anyone who can explain how a MLCers manages to spend a decade or so with an alienator.

I think someone who has to vilify us to justify what has no excuse does not deserve us in any way shape or form, regardless of the explanation.

Limerance does not lasyt 5, 7, 9, 10 or more years. Cracks show and the shine is long off when such time lenght is reached. Limerance cannoe be the reason for the very long relationships several MLCers have with OW/OM or even their MLC lifestyles.
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #33 on: March 18, 2019, 10:37:32 AM »
You are right. Limerance only lasts for 18-48 months in most cases. Of course there are outliers but...for the most part everything I read put the top end at approximately 4 years. But that is just for LIMERANCE. That isn't to say they look around them and think that the bridge to the LBS is burned so they can't go back, or that they have gotten married or had children with this person by now....or guilt, or proof they did they right thing could drive them.

Who knows, that is all different based on the individual. But that in deep puppy love limerance obsessive stage HAS to end.

Just because they come out of limerance doesn't mean they will come back either. That is an entirely different equation.  :)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Anjae

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #34 on: March 18, 2019, 11:07:25 AM »
Just because they come out of limerance doesn't mean they will come back either. That is an entirely different equation.  :)

It is. Limerance is over used as the reason, but I think limerance is the least of it.

Proof that they did the right thing would not see them depressed, angry, violent. They would be happy. They aren't.
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

Offline Skates

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Re: Beauty into Beast 10
« Reply #35 on: March 18, 2019, 11:16:19 AM »
I always get the "i'm not thinking long term just now" and it annoys the crap out of me!  And of course i am the cause of all of this because i treated her so horrible.
Married 2001
MLC W 44
LBS H 46
D15, S17
BD August, 2018
Left home 2.5 months, home since Nov.
Blames me for all of the negative but none of the positive in her life.

“You beat cancer and then you went back to work at the carpet store?.”
― Rick Sanchez

 

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