Author Topic: My Story BURNING MAN 6  (Read 2451 times)

Online WatcherTopic starter

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My Story BURNING MAN 6
« on: April 09, 2019, 05:21:23 AM »
Well we met in a parking lot of the mall last night. I thought we would go inside but we sat in her car for 4 hours and talked. My #1 condition to return home is the removal of her parents from our home. I only have 2 conditions because I want more access to our son's and I want to be a father. At this stage that's the relationship I want to cherish so she doesn't need to make a clean exit from her crisis in other words for me. She would never adhere to condition #2 IMO at the moment anyway.

She is fed up with her parents. A lot of anger in her. I wonder how many times she sits in her car in parking lots instead of going home. We can't enjoy our home Watcher and we can't even see our son's because of that b!tch. On and on about how the boys deserve a father and we deserve to be a family. She is all about the family at the moment.

How do we get rid of them Watcher ? I wasn't subtle. I said we could kill her but she said we couldn't do that .   ::) Well that's all I had.  ;D So it was a venting session and I really have no problem listening to her.

She is a victim of childhood abuse. Do you know how strong you are going to have to be to be my husband ? I am really eff'd up in my head. My mom worked me for 15 years about how bad you were and I eventually believed her. I'm paranoid now because of her abuse. What you experienced with my mom these past 5 years is what I lived with my entire life.

So her mom is the Narc abuser. W admits she has rage issues and said she shouldn't be hitting me. It is something she learned from watching her parents as a child. I failed to pick up her phone call yesterday morning as it was on silent. So I received a rage text. So I responded likewise with a WTF. Having a hard time with projection my dear. That's how the day started and thus she later explained her rage issue with me.

Her online group is a support group and all of them are victims of some sort of abuse. They help each other. If she posts something online it is what she feels at the moment. She is expressing herself. She also admits that she likes attention. She says she is over "that issue"(OM). I will not address it.

In her mind OM was the catalyst. It led her on a search to discover what was wrong in our marriage that led her to pursue another man. Her mom fed her for years that I was unfaithful and she came to believe it.
So she has been discovering and learning about her childhood trauma.

In the meantime she just called me this morning irate because she wants her parents out of the house and I am not helping her. She has evidence of physical abuse so I said press charges and get a restraining order against your mom. Oh I can't do that because I already went that route with you and now they will think I'm crazy.

Her answer is sell the house. She is a victim of abusers and cannot stand up to them. I floated have the boys move in with me and go live with one of your girlfriends. We will let everything at the house shutoff and I will change the locks to get them out. She likes that idea and is thinking about it.

She is putting incredible pressure on me to solve this inlaws issue. WTF does she want me to do. Everytime I have tried in the past she stabbed me in the back. She is really badgering me for a solution. This really is her problem. So she is pissed this morning because I'm not listening to her. She settled down eventually but I'm going to have a long day with her. I already know.

Now she called again and dropped OM's name on me like he is family.  ::) My mom kept him alive for too long with me. I stated simply, treat your mom the way you treated me for 4 years. Go NC and give her the silent treatment. Take away her van that is ours and completely shut her out and make life miserable for her. I told her it works. ::)

Thanks for your support.
Enjoy your day everyone

Previous thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10748.0

« Last Edit: April 09, 2019, 08:27:05 AM by Thunder »

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2019, 05:33:38 AM »
You know this, Watcher, but please be very careful...your w has a long history of triangulation...right now you are the rescuer and MiL the persecuter but the roles have been reversed by your w in the past. And those are the times when stuff has got physical or legally threatening for you and for your job...
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2019, 05:36:58 AM »
Watcher,   BIG, BIG warning signs.  Sorry Watcher but talk, while it is a window into their mind at the moment,  is cheap.  She still wants you to do it all, pay the bills, get rid of her parents.  This is really no different than November. Like I said , you are great at listening to her but she does not "hear" you at all.   Only she can get rid of her parents not you.  If you attempt to help her with it you will land in legal troubles again.  I know you want access to your boys but be careful. I can see you are already getting sucked into the drama.  Set your boundaries and stick to them.  No parents, no gambling and you will consider moving back.  If you bend on those you will most likely have a repeat of November.  Sorry Watcher but you are leading with your heart too much.  Just don't want you to get hurt and in legal trouble all over again.   She needs to be in counseling.  YOU can't fix her!!  Hugs Watcher this must be so tough on your heart.

Offline Whyus

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2019, 05:43:57 AM »
It sounds good Watcher but as the Girls said, you have been here before.
It could be different this time, she seems to be more solving her parents issue than last time, OM is not an issue anymore which can only be good! She even told you what he represented and why she did what she did.
Just be careful, sleep with one eye open and be Aware of your surrounds at all times  ;)
Good luck big fella
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2019, 06:11:20 AM »
Hi Treasur, WonderNoMore, Whyus

Without a doubt this is November all over again. I'm not helping her with the parents. She could easily get them out as she sent me plenty of texts and a photo yesterday and I am saving everything this time. I have run into her out and about with her mom during the past 4 months. I told her. The 3 of you conspired to get rid of me and now you got what you wanted.

Is there physical abuse ? Yes. However that's there dysfunctional relationship. My mom forces me to take her to the casino. If I don't take her she will be a maniac and contact all my friends. Why does she have access to your friends ?  My mom forces me to hang out with her.

Oh if you cared about us you would get us out of here Watcher. I told her you left me. We have had a horrible last 4 years. I was clear that I cannot just move back. She says we will never be able to begin our healing until the parents are out of the picture for good. That part is true.

No WNM she keeps saying listen to me Watcher when I say listen to me wife.    ::)  She is selling it as she did me a favor now by getting rid of me. Oh she definitely wants me to save her.

Yes the situation is extremely volatile. I was contemplating last night that divorce would be such an easier road for me. LOL...You let them in our life Watcher. I wanted to be a stay at home mom. You forced me to work.

Yes, I have a stupid heart for her. Ok I'm at work so my objective is not to see her today. She survived the weekend without me. She went out with her GF on Saturday which is a positive to me. Yesterday was our 2nd day of contact.

Yes we will make it too a month and I will be back at the police station in May. She totally blows off that we have been separated for 4 years and that I was traumatized by what has transpired.

So I don't see a problem with phone contact however, am I listening too much ? She definitely talks a lot but wants immediate results. She definitely does not like it when I don't pick up my phone.

Thanks
« Last Edit: April 09, 2019, 06:13:31 AM by Watcher »

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2019, 06:41:10 AM »
Oh boy Watcher, she is still putting so much unfair blame on you and taking no responsibility for her actions.  Maybe she just can't.  She doesn't see reality at all.
Her mom and you are at fault.  ???

She just wants you to fix everything.  ::)  It's like nothing has changes.  Same song, same dance. sigh

What did she say about the letter and getting the W2 back?  Did she understand why you have to file separately?

I agree with you, phone convo's only are a good idea.
Did you get to see the boys at all last night?

Have a peaceful day, Watcher.  This can't last forever.
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2019, 06:46:26 AM »
Hi Thunder,

I think I have to block her number. She is looking to move in with a GF at 700 dollars a month so I would get the boys and the parents would still be in our home until they vacated.

She wants to know what I think. Obviously she is a conflict avoider to goto this extreme. Is this the Wallower really just finally leaving on her own ?

This is happening too fast at the moment. The boys are going to bring my dirt road cred tour to a crashing halt you know. She is desperate to get the boys, especially S16, away from MIL. She is not 100 percent sure of S18.

So my W will be potentially living with a GF. S16 would potentially live with me and the jury is out on S18. WTF is all I can say. I would also need S18. I'm not leaving him with MIL.

Thunder she cannot focus on anything else, eventhough, I talked to her about the W2. I physically have to stop seeing her Thunder and you know why. No I did not see the boys unfortunately as she had my attention.

This is pure lunacy.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2019, 07:01:02 AM »
So she advised me that this GF is affiliated with her online group and lives alone. I already know who she is talking about because I make it my business to know things. My W is departing this weekend and I will be getting both boys. She will not return until her parents vacate our home.

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2019, 07:07:34 AM »
Do you alone have the legal right to evict them, Watcher? Is the house just in your name or in joint names? I ask bc I suspect - assuming your w does move to the gf's place - that she is doing the equivalent of going outside and leaving you to clear up after one of the kids vomited on a rug...
« Last Edit: April 09, 2019, 07:10:11 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2019, 07:14:15 AM »
I don't know Watcher, it's kind of sounds like she is going to run away to avoid paying the utilities, or the kids, and the parents. Will the parents even leave if they still have free rent?

I'm not sure that will get them out of there, but we'll see.  It kind of makes them your problem then, doesn't it?

Only one thing, if the utilities do get shut off, and she's gone, you won't be held responsible will you?
Please think this over hard and long before you commit to it, Watcher.  It's a big undertaking.
You have a pretty quiet life right now
 
If the kids live with you, the youngest can go to public school.  She would have less say over it, really.
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2019, 07:25:37 AM »
Hi Treasur, Thunder.

She is definitely running away and leaving the mess behind. I cannot leave my kids with the inlaws. Do you think MIL is just going to accept their departure ? Her plan is definitely flawed.

Maybe it's best I just stop talking to her and avoid all contact. Obviously there are benefits to having the boys live with me. She can also change her mind 300 more times today or at any point.

I would be taking them and picking them up from school. Yes there are only 2 months of school left. She plans on staying out forever.

I definitely didn't see this coming.

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2019, 07:28:50 AM »
Do you need a quick legal consult with someone Watcher or do you already have the info you need?
Thunder is quite right...for sure she is throwing the ball over to you...but that also means you may have some opportunities to act in your own best interests that you haven't before....even maybe ones your w won't like or have planned. I think you might have an opportunity to take some control here but you might have to play a mean sneaky game to get it and keep it....I reckon your w is seeing you like the pest exterminator guy and her plan is once you have got rid of the ils, rinse and repeat where you get invited back or kicked out as she sees fit but keep paying the bills. Surely there has to be a point where you don't want to play that game anymore Watcher?

You could turn that game upside down Watcher....take a bit of time to think...get rid of ils and you and your boys live in YOUR house while w lives elsewhere to tackle her issues/slowly reconnect/get professional help for her trauma etc blah blah...just sayin'

Wonder if you would have to get your w to sign a legal undertaking of some sort that she won't return while her parents are there & agrees with them being evicted? Bc of course her mother is going to be in a snit and a half and if your w moves back, game over.

What do you think your w would do as the price of you getting rid of the ils? If you said well, I can do that but you need to agree x or sign y, would she do it? How desparate is she? And what is her plan if you do nothing at all and go back to NC? (Other than ensuring your sons know you want them to come to you and have your number & address)

« Last Edit: April 09, 2019, 07:34:25 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2019, 07:49:39 AM »
Yes a very flawed plan.  He parents won't leave because she does so all she's doing is getting away from them.  You're still stuck with them.

As far as school goes Watcher there are always school buses, you wouldn't need to take them. 

Gosh it would be nice if you and the boys could live in the house with all 3 of them out.  You could fix it up and sell it when your youngest graduates in 2 years.
Only thing would b she's have to pay those utility bills first.   ::)

Oh well you'll work everything out in your head before doing anything that puts you in a bad situation.   You have time, don't stress over it. 

You have your half marathon this Saturday, don't you?   :)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2019, 07:56:40 AM »
You know Watcher, the hardest thing for all of us "fixers" to learn is we can't fix them or the situation they have themselves in.  Only they can do that.
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2019, 08:06:31 AM »
I'm taking a slightly different tack though, Thunder...or throwing it out there anyway...what if Watcher could use the situation as a way to fix some of HIS problems? Not hers, although that might be an incidental benefit, but his?

Which if I have understood right have always seemed to circle round
- how do I stop being the bank for a family that kicked me out and a house I'm not allowed to live in?
- how do I have a relationship with my sons?
- how do I have some control over my circumstances and protect myself from crazy people?
- how do I do all of the above without filing for divorce which i don't really want to do?
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2019, 08:42:09 AM »
My mom did say this is going to crash and burn like Florida. She is running away because the pressure is overwhelming her. Dont I want the pressure to overwhelm her ?

My mom said it would last a weekend and then she will change her mind. The inlaws are never leaving, however I could begin the long eviction process.

MIL would most definitely intercept me at school because she is not giving up her kids thus making this a bigger conflict for me potentially.

I see a lot of money flowing out of my bank and nothing on their end. So I will think about it. W has spun a tale of abuse but it's too soon. I'm leaning going back to NC and just letting this blow up.

All that being said. W will most likely be best friends again with her mom come May.

Thankfully I do have that half marathon on Saturday Thunder.

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2019, 09:11:37 AM »
Your mother is right.  This is just like Florida...running away.  Your W is a grown woman that can get rid of her parents on her own.  I may be the only one that believes this but I truly don't think your W will magically start to get better if her parents aren't there.  They may be a symptom of her crisis but that does not mean once they are gone that she will work on herself.  It's like saying the "OW" in my husbands crisis was the cause and once she was gone everything would be better.  Your W is looking for you to "clean up" her mess.  If she runs away and the parents leave...then What?   You know you would most likely move back in, pay all the utilities off to take care of your boys living environment and give her a clean financial slate to start back up with.  That's what she wants.  Her crisis will not end.

 How many MLCers have these issues that stem from their parents yet the parents have passed on....guess what they still had a MLC.  Your ILs are enablers but if your W got help, when and if she is ever ready for it,  they will not be an issue.  Sorry Watcher, None of us know the answer.  We only have our own experiences to go by and there are huge red flags here waving at you.   If you don't know what to do...do nothing at the moment.  Perhaps stepping back with less contact with her will help.   Her mania is overwhelming.

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2019, 09:25:06 AM »
Tbh, Watcher, this isn't your first w wtf rodeo so it makes sense to trust your gut instinct, pull back to less contact and see what happens. My only caveat would be to try to reach out to your youngest son at least so he can hear your POV from you directly if she does in fact move out without the boys?
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Online KeepItTogether

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #18 on: April 09, 2019, 10:06:29 AM »
Sorry Watcher. This is rough!

I worry that a confrontation over the boys with your ILs (assuming MIL goes to the school) will involve the police. Is there a way to circumvent that aspect?
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #19 on: April 09, 2019, 03:14:32 PM »
Well we had a school issue with S18 so we talked. She is moving out Sunday and dropping the boys off with me to live. She plans on being away 6 months to a year.

She has to go find herself. She wants to goto the gym, go out with her girlfriends and travel. All things she cannot do because of her controlling Narc mother.

She admits she is running away from her problems debt and all. Our boys are 18 and 16 Watcher and it's time for me to allow you to be a father.

So that was our discussion. I told her it sounds like you just want a new life however I look forward to finally being with my sons. So we will see what happens. I can't prevent her from leaving to go find herself.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #20 on: April 09, 2019, 03:21:55 PM »
Well I didn't see that one coming!   :o
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #21 on: April 09, 2019, 03:25:00 PM »
Gosh, me neither.
How do you feel Watcher?
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #22 on: April 09, 2019, 03:50:43 PM »
I am stunned to say the least. I gain 2 sons and feel like I lose a MLCer W again. I immediately have to begin legal proceedings to evict my inlaw parasites so my game plan changes a bit.

Offline gman242

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2019, 04:15:06 PM »
That's exactly how I felt when my W fell silent. BD all over again.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2019, 04:23:59 PM »
Watcher, would it be wise to wait a bit to make sure she is really going before you start eviction proceedings?  She could come right back in a few days.
If she does leave maybe the IL's will leave on their own.

Plus man this sure doesn't give you much time to get things ready..that's only 4 days.
I'm stunned too. 
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2019, 04:30:46 PM »
Well, Busy Bee did recently post about her thoughts that the 4 year mark is significant...
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

Grateful for any appearance of the tiny karma bus  
"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #26 on: April 09, 2019, 05:24:20 PM »
Watcher,

I cannot imagine how you feel. I am with Thunder on waiting a bit, but consulting a lawyer in the meantime. Did she leave anything in writing vis a vis your sons? She might be conspiring with ILs to accuse you of child kidnapping, then extort money from you. They are financially desperate people. If I were you I would write an email to her to say that you need to make arrangements for your sons please confirm that they are going to live with me from Sunday on till you deal with your issues. Also it will be good if you can make her sign power of attorney (concent) over your children's affairs as a sole responsible parent.

Is she in touch with her brother? May be this time he can come and pick his parents?

Please, take care of yourself comprehensively (including legally and financially).


Offline Ready2Transform

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #27 on: April 09, 2019, 05:55:49 PM »
She's not going to move in with anybody. It's a test within a manic episode. You told her your requirements and none of them are being met, so either stay the course in your own life or get ready for another blow up like December. I am with K that knowing what you do now, it's a good time for legal and financial advice and/or planning. Logic over emotion. One of you has to be the sane parent.
"Unconditional love is the highest of high standards, and while we are letting go of our need to control the process of anyone else, we are taking within our lives complete accountability for our own experience."

http://seriousvanity.com/how-to-cultivate-unconditional-love-and-change-the-world/

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #28 on: April 09, 2019, 06:11:43 PM »
Yes I can hold off on the eviction process and maybe they will leave. She is scheduled to sign her lease on Thursday and I will have a copy of it to demonstrate that she vacated our home. It is a month to month.

We talked tonight and she is obviously nervous so I am trying to offer some encouragement. At the moment neither one of us is seeing our kids. She goes home at 930 and straight to her bedroom.

She says the abuse stops now and she will break the cycle. S16 will not be MIL next victim. We do plan on co parenting. She has free access to our sons. Yes she is moving further away.

She is hesitant because she is missing them already but knows I will take care of them. She knows they will be going with me now to Gettysburg next weekend.

I was adamant. I support her decision fully, however I advised her that I would never except the boys being left with her parents alone. One of us will need to be an active parent. Just in case she changes her mind. She seems focused on saving her son's for the moment.

All that being said this could all go south in a nano second. It's her move and she knows I support her decision. She was hit again yesterday and it needs to stop. So this is her decision and we will see if she carries it through.

It could all be manic BS. She does change her mind.

Thanks

Offline GonerinGhana

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #29 on: April 09, 2019, 06:21:59 PM »
While I didn't see it coming, I'm not surprised either. I think she will be back to Watcher eventually, but really she needs to stand on her own for a while.

Even if she is manic, better to be manic away from an abusive mother who hits her.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #30 on: April 09, 2019, 06:35:11 PM »
I just hope she gets some therapy, Watcher.

Physical abuse is deeply in-bedded in both of those women.

Wonder how the in laws are going to like all the utilities shut off.   ;D

Hey wait...are you taking the dog?  Don't leave her behind.  ???
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #31 on: April 09, 2019, 06:35:42 PM »
I am with Ready. She is not going anywhere, and even if she goes it will be short-lived like Florida adventure. She is just spinning. She is very capable of hitting other people too, and even throwing an iron. So the pictures of physical abuse are only one-sided. We do not know how much physical violence her mother endures from her. Maybe she says that she wants to leave and her mother is trying to bring her back into "married woman" orbit.

One thing we know that if indeed boys stay with Watcher, that will be blessing in disguise. If somebody wants to be a mother there is no stopping somebody to be a mother. She is just checked out. All these pleas for Watcher to come home were exactly for that purpose. She needed him to clean up her mess, take care of her parents and boys.

Isn't it surprising how fast things happen in her world? Seemingly everything started from Watcher needing W2, all of a sudden in 2 days period she is leaving her kids (who she did not allow phone or text their dad) with Watcher. But all along since November she is telling Watcher that she cannot wait to get done being a mother. And already has a lease to sign but does not have money to pay for utilities or taxes. She really needs professional help.

Please Watcher protect yourself. This does not smell good.

Online KeepItTogether

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #32 on: April 09, 2019, 09:11:52 PM »
Happy the boys will be with you Watcher.
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2019, 11:47:48 PM »
I agree with Thunder, don't forget the dog too!
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline UrsaMajor

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #34 on: April 10, 2019, 12:49:58 AM »
Actions talk, Male Bovine Excrement walks...

I'm in agreement that something smells in this whole scenario - the problem is that it's like being between a poultry and a pig farm.. they both stink to high heaven but, unless the wind is blowing straight in one direction, the stink is a mixture of both.....

If she actually DOES move out, you will need some sort of legal assurances that you are solely responsible for the boys.  As far as her parents go, well... Sorry, we've heard this ALL before in November... and we all know exactly how that panned out.... MIL shows up with bruises too and the mutual accusation society starts up all over again until they focus on a common enemy once more - YOU!

None of us can know the full story so any advice we give is tainted but, FFS, make sure that you have everything documented to the extent possible... You are going to need evidence to back up (or refute) any and all claims because you know they are coming...

This is like knowing there is a hurricane coming.... Batten down the hatches but for crying out loud, stock up on all the necessities BEFORE the storm hits.... Then when it does (and you KNOW it will) you can ride it out in safety....
Me - 55
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S - 12
D - 8
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BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
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A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #35 on: April 10, 2019, 01:58:23 AM »
I'm up early because I have my work physical today. My oblique finally feels ready to go so I should be able to return to the gym today.

Yes she is already wavering back and forth. So who knows. I know she definitely is in mania. This is just like last November. I do buy the whole abuse narrative however she is definitely spinning.

She basically is blaming her moms abuse for everything and even for my reaction after BD. Still won't claim ownership for her part. So I keep telling her to "own it" when her BS flows.

I've had no "issues" with her yet but I know she is ticking. Eventually I will displease her. I also have other reasons to know that she is in mania.

Like always we cannot discuss anything from the past. So this is a, hey let's just get back together and experience some hysterical bonding moments.

She has the work GF which I'm happy about. It gives her an outlet outside of the home and MIL. We need our outlets. Right now it's me of course.

Friday was our 1st encounter. I took Sat and Sun off. Monday morning she was pissed about the weekend and we talked in the parking lot after work. We did not need to meet yesterday over school. That could have been handled by phone.

I have gym plans today so we will see what she comes up with later to get my attention.

She's been good with not mentioning online nonsense nor is she on her phone. She mentioned his name once in her morning phone call.yesterday and I didn't bite.

She saw me listening to music yesterday and asked what I was listening to while we were talking last night. I told her Jason Aldean and then silence. She was like what.

I said, you know, dirt road cred, Luke Bryan and I have a man crush on Dierks Bentley. That's my guy. Immediately she says you are a city boy. Your not from the South and need to stop listening to country music. I also have to give up Christian music.

She went on for awhile. Then she brought up my running and how that bothers her. This is in conjunction with my music tastes. You need to be your authentic self Watcher. He(OM) was a runner Watcher and that was his music.

I said I acquired new tastes and interests, just like you dear during the past 4 years. Country music is all about heartache, pain, and sadness. You know. Apparently I can only listen to you and accept and support your new interests.

BTW, that man (OM) has never run a half marathon in his life I guarantee, let alone 4, so don't compare him to me. If country music is a problem for you then it's your hangup and not mine.

So I know she will mention that at some point. Everything I do is dictated by OM. He is controlling me telepathically most likely. Everything is always a sign to her and obviously it's still a problem for her.

She mentions a lot of times "if things don't work out between us" nonsense. So finally I just said maybe it's better we start fresh with new relationships.

Other than that we get along splendidly albeit mania style. Most likely because I just listen. Typical she just wants to be "married" for her benefit IMO. There are small moments where I know it's her, however its 98 percent crisis mode.

She has plans as usual for us but its difficult for me because I do not want to invest to much of myself in this venture if its going to fail. I know I'm a pessimist. We have no problem talking however it's still just talking at the end of the day.

Thanks
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 02:01:17 AM by Watcher »

Offline Silver

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #36 on: April 10, 2019, 02:11:38 AM »
She has plans as usual for us but its difficult for me because I do not want to invest to much of myself in this venture if its going to fail. I know I'm a pessimist. We have no problem talking however it's still just talking at the end of the day.

Wouldn't call that pessimism but very wise to protect yourself. She doesn't feel really that stable that you would love to just jump into anything, does she??
I mean, she just told you that your taste for music and running hobby are problem to her...come on Watcher's W.

 
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

Offline Whyus

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #37 on: April 10, 2019, 03:11:13 AM »
She is moving out Sunday and dropping the boys off with me to live. She plans on being away 6 months to a year.
She has to go find herself. She wants to goto the gym, go out with her girlfriends and travel. All things she cannot do because of her controlling Narc mother.
She admits she is running away from her problems debt and all. Our boys are 18 and 16 Watcher and it's time for me to allow you to be a father.

Watcher this is truely shocking.
If this happens then you can probably reset your BD timeline back to 0. This sounds like a woman who is about to go into full replay and if she likes her new life then you will have Little to 0 Chance with her.
She is running from all responsibilities to be free and Gym and new friends, travel unicorns and bla bla bla......... Seriously, am I the only one who sees this here?
Nearly all These high Level Replay MLCWs started like this.

Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline UrsaMajor

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2019, 03:20:10 AM »
She is moving out Sunday and dropping the boys off with me to live. She plans on being away 6 months to a year.
She has to go find herself. She wants to goto the gym, go out with her girlfriends and travel. All things she cannot do because of her controlling Narc mother.
She admits she is running away from her problems debt and all. Our boys are 18 and 16 Watcher and it's time for me to allow you to be a father.

Watcher this is truely shocking.
If this happens then you can probably reset your BD timeline back to 0. This sounds like a woman who is about to go into full replay and if she likes her new life then you will have Little to 0 Chance with her.
She is running from all responsibilities to be free and Gym and new friends, travel unicorns and bla bla bla......... Seriously, am I the only one who sees this here?
Nearly all These high Level Replay MLCWs started like this.

Uhmmmmm ... No... You're just one of the few who hasn't seen this all happen before... Florida was a runner, take the boys, pack up, disappear, sign a lease and then come back a couple of months later.....

November was a "Get my parents out of the house, Watcher!" At that point, she was going to leave and leave the boys with her parents, remember?  This is a rerun of her old script.....

Whether she really follows through is a different story and, if she actually DOES it, will there be any certainty that a) it will be more than a flash in the pan, b) she won't turn right back around, join forces with Mommy-Dearest, and come up with some new BS that Watcher did <xyz>?, and c) will do ANYTHING to really work on her own stuff?

Watcher has heard this all before....
Me - 55
MLC - 47
Together 19 years - Married for 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Canines (each of us has one)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold and separated - March 2016
Mid-Lifer has filed for D

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #39 on: April 10, 2019, 03:56:27 AM »
Hi Silver, Whyus, UrsaMajor.

She has had multiple gym memberships throughout her crisis. She stops paying and then she is prevented from going. Her current membership is frozen. She is a treadmill and Zumba person.

When I took her to kickboxing she was exhausted and couldn't keep up which surprised me. She doesn't have the energy nor stamina.

She is not hardcore gym. The travel surprised me however she wants to go on trips with her soul group friends. There's a woman's retreat in May and she asked if I could accompany her to Massachusetts.

We would obviously stay in separate hotels as the females have their hotel on female only lockdown. I'm just saying she offered. I had to remind her about our sons.

She is into her online group and wants to go on female retreats. She is into sisterhood and female empowerment right now. Again I support her. Whatever helps. This potential roommate is part of that group.

She doesn't have the money to sustain her venture. She already is having problems with the car payment. Her hair is noticeably gray, she needs a facial, stress lines, gaining weight, nails are not done, not groomed.

She pointed all this out btw. I said she looks hot. That's usually my response. Oh, you thought I was just obnoxious here. LOL, I am full on obnoxious all the time. IDK if she appreciates it. She hasn't killed me yet.  ::)

There is a noticable tug of war between W and MIL just like Nov. W says it started last summer. Eventually she is going to turn on me and align with her mom unless she does leave.

I kind of see her potential leaving as a positive. Let her get away from her mother but I don't believe she has it in her. This is a woman who ran away initially with her sons and parents. The boys are her kryptonite deep down inside.

I was hoping to just do the phone thing to see how long I could extend it using the 27 days in November as a yardstick. That's our longest contact. However, its mania so IDK.

Yes I forgot about the dog. Thanks for the reminder.

Thanks

Oh I forgot. I went to City Hall yesterday and got our marriage certificate so I can email it today to get back on our medical insurance. I also did goto work so I did do other things non W related, lol.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 03:59:41 AM by Watcher »

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #40 on: April 10, 2019, 05:24:29 AM »
So Monday I was getting the I'm being hit texts with photos. Let's meet up Watcher. Hence the 3 hour parking lot discussion in her car.

Yesterday was S18 has an issue at school with his 2 failures. Lets meet up Watcher.

This morning it's the I'm being hit again Watcher I'm calling the police on her as I demanded the return of my car keys. MIL is using our van after W brought the new car.

Basically I'm just listening as she just wants them out of our home and she is venting via text. Who knows what is really going on ?

Shaming her daughter for having sex. Blaming horniness for her wanting to see me. Also I'm putting ideas in her daughters mind.

If it wasn't me then it would be something else about her daughter. The friends are equally attacked when I'm not in the picture. The GF at work is MIL new headache. They go out and drink wine and buy sexy undergarments with each other from Victoria's Secret.

I'm all for the GF at work 100 percent. It would be nice if this 46 year old could become her own woman one day.  :)

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #41 on: April 10, 2019, 09:13:18 AM »
So while I have a break in the mania I have to talk about me as it's been awhile. I had my Fit For Duty physical today.  ;D

My paperwork was a mess so the receptionist wasn't falling for my charm. She was livid. I don't work in the main office so good luck trying to find a computer and a printer. OMG. I was looked on with suspicion. Outsider.

So the Dr said I pretty much have to stop eating bread for my diabetes. With all my kickboxing and running my sugar numbers should be perfect. Well I didn't tell her about the vanilla creme donut.

So my hearing is worse than 3 years ago and that's most likely from my earbud usage. Everything was fine and I have to wait for blood and urine.

W asked me how things went via text and blamed my hearing loss on all that rock country music of mine. So she has some humor left in her.  ;)

The best part was the hernia exam because you have to be nude. Pretty much your in your boxers until the hernia part. I think she likes that part of the exam because no one else checks me for a hernia. Just sayin.

I also did reply to W that I looked good naked so I really wasn't paying attention to the actual test results. Yes she has been texting me all morning. I am her friend I guess at the moment.

I was looking at myself during the hernia check and my body is so ready for medical examinations. I told you my torso and pelvic region  8). I have become so comfortable with nudity during this crisis. Hahahaha.

She found an old cyst on my hip and I had to explain the history of it. She knows I'm into Kickboxing and she takes Taekwondo. Meanwhile I was standing there naked, holding a conversation with a woman, albeit a Dr, and no care in the world.

When I take off my clothes my body looks slammin I noticed. So I have my next half marathon on Saturday and my delusional inflated ego should subside by then I would think.

Being comfortable in my body made my day.  ;D I do have to entertain myself at times.  ::) I did turn down a lunch request already. This MLCer likes to be persistent during mania.

Enjoy your day everyone

Thanks
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 09:15:25 AM by Watcher »

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #42 on: April 10, 2019, 09:47:32 AM »
Ok no more donuts, mister.  In all seriousness though you have to take diabetes pretty serious, but I'm sure you know this.  Especially when you older.  You're not there yet but it sneaks up on you.
It's great you are active and keeping the fat off.   That is a good thing.

Good for you turning down another request.   ;D

Maybe next time she asks, ask that the boys come with her, because you haven't seen them much, to go out to eat do something and see what she says.  Make it a family thing, could be safer.   ;)
Just sayin'...

She has to know this is about them too.  Right?   :)

A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #43 on: April 10, 2019, 12:17:57 PM »
Hello,

Quote
Everything is always a sign to her and obviously it's still a problem for her.

Boy did this statement bring back memories. Everything was a sign to my crazed ex! The sun, the rain, a plant dying, trash in the yard....you name it.

The most important thing is not your wife leaving helping her, it is you fixing yourself and reclaiming your sons.

I don't know if your wife leaving is going to help or not. It sounds like fleeing which is avoidance by the MLCer. She could go and never come back, she could go and come back worse, or she could go and come back a new woman ready for Watcher. The most important thing is that you can't fix her or heal her. However, you can help yourself and you can influence your sons.

Just make sure you stay off the roller coaster. Because when you get on it with them, they wait until they get to the highest point and try to throw you off.

Fist bump,

Ready
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #44 on: April 10, 2019, 05:14:54 PM »
Hi Ready,

Tonight she is a wife. We went out for tea and had it out like a husband and wife. I'm not going to keep my mouth shut. Oh be a father BS to your kids. How could you walk away from them now.

Too bad. Figure it out yourself. I was treated like sh!te for 4 years and now I'm the bad guy because I'm ending school and I could care less if S18 graduates.

She is a victim of her parents. Oh poor baby. Who the eff threw me out of the house over 20 times, called the police 8 times. Oh now she cannot remember her violent ways. "See Watcher, you won't forget". LMAO...

Yes and see wife how you conveniently won't remember your behavior. The Mother Theresa of MLCers. Oh I was going through something Watcher. Well I said it's my turn to take 4 years off now and go through something.. See ya. Blaming me for the parents in our home. That is so rich.

How can you abandon S16 as he adores you. I wasnt allowed to be a father. And there was so much more but we went our separate ways.

Look we need to fight. I can't act like she did nothing during her crisis. Partying every weekend with her parents at the casino while I had the short end. Blaming everything on her parents and blaming me for making her work.

She's lucid.  She can handle it. I will not fix this problem.

So I'm going to bed as she texts away because she is scared sh!teless. Too eff'n bad. It's her turn. I'm sure tomorrow we will be calm but I need a break from wife of the century.

Have a good night


Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #45 on: April 10, 2019, 05:55:03 PM »
 ;D

Love the truth darts, Watcher! It's about time she hears the truth about the last 4 years.

NONE of this was your fault. I mean none, zero, and you didn't let her blame you this time.
No you can't fix her, she has to do that for herself, just like you did.
I bet it felt good.   :)

Have a good night, Watcher.   ;D

A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline GonerinGhana

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #46 on: April 10, 2019, 08:01:47 PM »
I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Let's presume she really doesn't remember all the details. You did leave the house. So for someone whose memory is foggy, it does look like you abandoned her. You didn't follow the LBS script because you are the one who ran away and left the home, when it usually is the opposite. So without the clear memories, imagine what it looks like.

I'm not sure now is the right time for the truth darts. But what has been said is said. I think it would be helpful though to observe for a while. It's hard to tell where she is in the MLC process at this point. Only with time will it become clearer.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #47 on: April 11, 2019, 01:48:12 AM »
Hi Thunder, Goner.

OK I will try to approach this post from a MLC perspective. Its either mania or some type of awakening. We have the last 3 nights together after work. I'm still on break from the gym so she is not bombarding my world yet.

I spent 5 dollars on tea last night. We usually meet up somewhere in separate cars and I jump in hers and she drives around and talks. Last night we had a brief stop for eyebrows fixing or whatever you ladies call it. In and out 10 minutes.

We were going to walk in the park however it was too cold and I really didn't feel well as I'm all congested. So tea and then soup, I forgot.

She loves to talk and I love to listen. I've said this before that I do thoroughly enjoy being with her. I do agree she is a lifelong victim of abuse and she is even a victim of the past 4 years and told her such.

Here is where we differ. Watcher is no victim. I told you Watcher that I was handling this situation in my own way. (That would be dumping your husband for another man). You couldn't control your behavior. (Its not like it was 2-3weeks. It's been 4 years of her handling it).

She is attempting to wrap the past 4 years perfectly with a nice bow to boot. I don't need answers but don't shove your lily white version of your MLC in my face. The past 4 years are none of my business BTW. Why does she have to make that declaration? Just shut up and unnecessarily don't antanginize me.

I don't want to hear from her that I'm not letting go of her crisis behavior. Oh see Watcher, you will never forget. Maybe she should stop talking then.

So we departed ways because she begins to talk really stupid. I pulled over somewhere and vented here because I needed to. Meanwhile she was texting me about how she was not giving up without a fight so I eventually replied that I just needed to breathe a bit.

We talked afterwards to end on a better note. She sees me as her husband. This is what you wanted. Everytime I come for you then you leave. Then I fall back to my parents as I have always had to because you are not there.

She has a big problem with my work schedule. How can she expect me to be a husband just like that ? She wants the boys to have a father. I asked her what is your definition of a father ?

She likes my life. The running is positive and she would like to attend as a family unit. There's more to life than a casino and I want to expose our sons to culture and I like the things you do Watcher. You can have a positive influence on our boys.

Gettysburg next weekend and she would like the 3 of us to accompany her to her female retreat in Massachusetts. She will be on her woman's retreat and the boys and I would do our own thing. Those are her ideas.

Yes she is panicked about school in September. Your vendetta against my mom is stronger than your love for S16. She maybe absolutely correct. I hate that woman.

She has a lot of female friends which is a positive. She really never had friends before so I would never recognize that whole reconnection with friends. She just has friends now. One invited her to walk in the park last night however she was with me.

Her plan to move has sunk because I will not help her. She cannot do it alone. She also griped why she just couldn't move in with me. It's my moms house. Its not my house. Also, my family isn't going to accept her with open arms nor should they.

Yes she has a problem with memory and yes she is having a problem with why I will not re commit to her. She even used the term foggy brain.

All of a sudden it's why did you hold out then (stand). Why did you never divorce me Watcher ? Why didn't you give up on me ? I thought you wanted to be married.

My parents did their part. They abused me to stay married. They kept me from leaving. This is what you wanted. I simply replied. I am forcing no woman to stay married to me. If you do not love me, then you have no business being forced to stay married to me Mrs Watcher.

I'm telling you that I survived the crisis Watcher. Now, for her, crisis is OM. She finally understands his role. She, however, is still in crisis as she embarks on this abuse angle now. I didn't tell her that.

She even said. I know you have this all figured out already Watcher. You know exactly what I've been going through.

She really is well researched online with multiple positive forums.

I told everyone all along. The boys are her heart. Walk away from them and she would take notice. Now she is taking notice. She knows I have walked away.

She can't do anything about her parents however it's her job to repair the father son relationships. She destroyed it.

She still doesn't have to answer where her money goes and I'm the provider. Well I don't want to hear that because that sounds like the old life to me and Dierks Bentley is going nowhere.

Unfortunately my only barometer will be time. I'm willing to see how long this can last. We are at a standstill on the utilities. Neither one of us is paying them. That could be a problem.

I know she could be buddy buddy with her mom again in no time. She wants to be a team and work against her parents.

Look she wants to sell the house. Get an apartment for the 4 of us. Clear out the house and leave the 2 old people with an empty house. That actually maybe plausible at some point. It probably is the only way we can get rid of them.

She is not on board with eviction and she is not on board with calling the cops on her mom and pressing charges. If I go the eviction route than W will just fall back to their side. So idk.

So we will see how this morning goes as I anticipate she is being abused texts.

Thanks
« Last Edit: April 11, 2019, 02:04:11 AM by Watcher »

Offline UrsaMajor

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #48 on: April 11, 2019, 02:48:19 AM »
I'm not going to be very popular here but....


Quote from: Watcher
Gettysburg next weekend and she would like the 3 of us to accompany her to her female retreat in Massachusetts. She will be on her woman's retreat and the boys and I would do our own thing. These are her ideas.
So, at least for Massachusetts - you are NOT going to "be a family." You are going so to provide her with a driver..... And do something with the boys.... You can do that without driving her to her retreat...

Quote from: Watcher
The past 4 years are none of my business BTW. Why does she have to make that declaration? Just shut up and unnecessarily don't antanginize me.

Uhhhmmmmm ... WHAT? The last 4 years are none of your business? WTF? What is THAT supposed to mean? They happened to someone else? Some other Watcher?  Some other Husband?  FFS..... NO ACCOUNTABILITY FOR HER OWN ACTIONS....

Quote from: WatchersWife
Everytime I come for you then you leave.
Yeah, because you call the firetrucking COPS on my happy a$$ or throw irons at me or start smacking me in the head until BLOOD comes..... No $#!T I leave! It is called "Personal Protection!"

Quote from: Watchers
Yes she is panicked about school in September. "Your vendetta against my mom is stronger than your love for S16"
Uh... no.... I have talked about this with S16. Private Catholic school has NOTHING to do with Mommy-Dearest and EVERYTHING to do with S16. I'm not paying for Mommy-Dearest to go to private school and Mommy-dearest has NOTHING TO SAY about how our sons are schooled.

Quote from: Watcher
Her plan to move has sunk because I will not help her. She cannot do it alone.
Bull... She could if she really wanted/intended to.... That was just a shot over the bow to haul you back into line

Quote from: Watcher
Yes she has a problem with memory and yes she is having a problem with why I will not re commit to her. She even used the term foggy brain.
She has a problem with accountability, with accepting responsibility for her actions... 

Of course she has problems that you will not fall back into line and under control ("recommit" my a$$  ::))

Quote from: Watcher
I simply replied. I am forcing no woman to stay married to me. If you do not love me, then you have no business being forced to stay married to me Mrs Watcher.
WORD! EPIC TRUTH!!!!!

Quote from: Watcher
She can't do anything about her parents


Yeah... she can..... if she wanted to ...

Quote from: Watcher
however it's her job to repair the father son relationships. She destroyed it.
Absolutely - Her actions, her choices, her consequences.... HER responsibility - All she has to do is to let you have access to the boys and to get her parents the F OUT of the way...

Quote from: Watcher
She still doesn't have to answer where her money goes and I'm the provider. Well I don't want to hear that because that sounds like the old life to me and Dierks Bentley is going nowhere.
Of course... She has no responsibilities in terms of finances and you do...


Quote from: Watcher
We are at a standstill on the utilities. Neither one of us is paying them. That could be a problem.
Yep... It could be.... But it isn't YOUR problem....

Quote from: Watcher
I know she could be buddy buddy with her mom again in no time.
Yep.... Just like November... Just like last spring.... Just like the fall before that...

Quote from: Watcher
She wants to be a team and work against her parents.
Until she doesn't...... Like in November... Like last spring.... Like the fall before that....

Quote from: Watcher
Look she wants to sell the house. Get an apartment for the 4 of us. Clear out the house and leave the 2 old people with an empty house. That actually maybe plausible at some point. It probably is the only way we can get rid of them.
That is THE most passive-aggressive piece of Male Bovine Excrement to come down the pike in ages....  Not to mention Escape and Avoid... You DO remember that they filed theft charges against you for taking YOUR property out of the house right?  And now she's talking about clearing the house out totally and leaving her parents there? How much equity do you have in that house? Put it in a pile of $10 bills in the front yard and set fire to it... Same difference...  Selling might be plausible but you can certainly get rid of her parents and keep the house IF THAT IS WHAT YOU WANT and she quits stabbing you in the back when you do it....

Quote from: Watcher
She is not on board with eviction and she is not on board with calling the cops on her mom and pressing charges. If I go the eviction route than W will just fall back to their side. So idk.
So, in reality, she doesn't REALLY want Mommy-Dearest gone... she wants to stir the pot and create drama.... then she can sit back and say:


She can stop being abused if she so wishes. It takes work, it takes time, it takes a backbone but it IS possible....
« Last Edit: April 11, 2019, 02:51:13 AM by UrsaMajor »
Me - 55
MLC - 47
Together 19 years - Married for 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Canines (each of us has one)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold and separated - March 2016
Mid-Lifer has filed for D

Survival Instructions for Newbies
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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #49 on: April 11, 2019, 03:26:22 AM »
Watcher, this is your life and you will do as you think best.
From the outside fwiw it seems as if there is a pattern...and you have two modes, NC or listening to your w tell you what she wants you to do. And of course as things have unfolded, you have learned and tried different things.
From the outside this is a mess full of lots of messy bits and truly almost like a maze....you head down one path, splat into the police being called...another, splat your w changes her mind...another, splat your w deluges you in texts.
For four years this has been your new normal. But it is not normal, Watcher.

How much do you want to get out of the maze, Watcher? How much do you want a different normal?
Bc your w is invested in the maze bc it works for her in some way. Nothing you can do about that.

If you want different, you will need to take a deep breath and look at what you can control and stop and start which does not require your w's agreement, permission or involvement. Not easy, but none of these barriers to a better new normal will magically fix themselves if they have not done so in 4 years.  So, if you don't change the record, how will it change? And if you don't want to...and that is your right too...do you know why?

As UM says, there is a lot of BS and WTF floating around. As I said on another thread, we habituate to the not normal slowly but surely as humans, so some of the BS and WTF may be yours too bc of that. Which is why outsiders may see things differently. No criticism from me and fully accept your right to keep doing what you are doing.

Looking objectively, does it seem normal and wise to you to be planning a weekend trip with a w who just a few months ago filed false claims against you (or went along with it) that potentially jeopardised your job for instance? Or to be listening to someone for hours and hours in a conversation who has no interest apparently in anything you say or feel or want unless it meets her wishes? Wishes which change rapidly? Agreements like mist?

T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline Whyus

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2019, 04:34:35 AM »
UM:- "I'm not going to be very popular here but.... "

I think that you will be more popular than you can imagine. You are BANG on, this all makes no sence to me atall.
Watcher, I have no idea how you have survived 4 years of this terrorism because that is what this is basically.
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2019, 05:41:10 AM »
Hi UrsaMajor, Treasur, Whyus.

I am just recording our conversations. I'm not planning on going on any family trips with her. I agree to no accountability nor responsibility. I try to post as much as possible.

I have been to the house and there is a clear divide like last November. That conflict is real. However, it's most likely temporary as they feed on dysfunction. She says it's been this way since last Summer.

Her paralysis in addressing the parents is laughable. It's not my house Watcher as you removed me from the mortgage. Yes because we couldn't refinance with her horrible credit and she is mad because she has no access to our equity.

She is on the deed so therefore, she does own the house, so she really would have no problem getting rid of them. Deep down she doesn't want to get rid of them.

Oh don't think for a second Watcher that your family is stepping into our lives if my parents depart. Thus that is her hesitancy. I've turned down 3 transfers and 2 in state moves to new housing over the years because she couldn't cut that cord. She simply won't cut that cord with her parents.

Bringing my family into the dynamic is ridiculous. Who said I wanted them in my life ? That's her paranoia. So she started dropping F bombs so I new to depart her car. She thought I was verbally beating up her parents so she equally went after my family, who, do not live with us. She wants to avoid the issue. Her parents in our home.

She comes up with a million ridiculous options instead of addressing the simplest route. Call the police and get a restraining order. I will back you dear. Or the both of us can unite to legally evict them. Nope, those are bad ideas Watcher.

We will give them the silent treatment and maybe they will leave. Meanwhile she goes straight to her bedroom and is out with me until 9pm sitting in parking lots.

Everyone is depressed in our house Watcher. I agree. The snake is the problem. I actually have to pull back on my commentary because she already knows my position.

There is no positive for me getting back with her. Nothing has changed on her end. She is offering me the old dead marriage.

September is a long ways away so she is panicked pretty early. The parents must leave and I understand that is only condition #1. She would then have to establish and maintain professional counseling and enter a gambler's addiction program as a start.

Enjoy your day
Thanks

Offline GonerinGhana

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #52 on: April 11, 2019, 05:49:49 AM »
If she isn't willing to get rid of her parents by a legally defensible method, then I'd say all deals should be off. I think you should reiterate the two options you presented above one more time. And tell her contact me ONLY when you are ready to do one or the other. And then cut her off. You could even throw in that you will file for divorce within x number of weeks/months if she doesn't do it. You know my story and you know I had to do something similar with my H regarding living arrangements and that it worked to get what I needed. This is not a move to end the crisis but it is at least a move to reclaim your home.  At least the home is an inanimate object and if you can get it back in your control then you can do what you want with it.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2019, 05:51:02 AM by GonerinGhana »

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #53 on: April 11, 2019, 06:30:41 AM »
Hi Goner,

Yes I need to reiterate those conditions to her again at some point soon. I have given her 2 viable options and she is all about working as a "team" afterall. Clearly she will not move against the parents. Yes, I agree this will not be a move to end the crisis.

Financially her back is really against the wall and it's that new car. No money for her gray hair, nails, facials, etc.... That's why she doesn't want to pay utilities. She needs female upkeep money.

She refuses to budge on the utilities and the side door is actually going to fall out with the frame and all. The toilet runs non stop. There are other house issues to add to her stress.

So, yes, at some point I will re state my point and go NC again. I have nothing to lose and no pressure on me unless she causes legal or financial problems for me which is possible.

Thanks


Offline GonerinGhana

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #54 on: April 11, 2019, 06:41:10 AM »
Well, then maybe some thieves will take care of clearing out the house for her.  ::)

There is no easy solution to all of this. This is what you need to remind yourself. Your wife may be a damned if you do and damned if you don't situation. But at least if you can wrest control of the house back in the worst case scenario you could sell it, take the proceeds and get transferred to San Antonio and leave it all behind. As I said it's the only inanimate object in this whole scenario and therefore seems to me the best place to start in making any progress for yourself from here on out. But if you don't, as you see, the house could fall apart and be damaged even further if it has an open door anyone can enter. I think it is reaching a breaking point where your inaction is likely to cause damage to the equity you have in the house. If you can get her to remove her parents or work with you reliably to do so, then you can even say the hell to her afterward. But you should not have to put up with squatters in your home, no matter who they are.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2019, 06:42:38 AM by GonerinGhana »

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #55 on: April 11, 2019, 01:11:28 PM »
I'm glad to hear that with the "gift of time" you are seeing the situation more clearly.  The more the LBS heals the less we tolerate MLC behavior.  Sorry Watcher, she just isn't ready to get the help she needs.  She just wants an instant fix. She has no remorse and wants no accountability.  Like you said, she wants no bills but money for her hair, nails, trips, etc.  That's a MLCer in Replay or a Bi-polar in mania.  Focus on you and your boys and try to retreat a bit from the mania.  Your wife is dying to pull you into her drama.  Show her you are in control not the other way around.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #56 on: April 11, 2019, 01:54:35 PM »
Hi Goner, WonderNoMore.

I'm going with mania because I am the object of her desire so it's hard to see at times. She told me that she will be out with her work GF on Sat and Sun which I found amusing that she is letting me know.

I have a potential trip to Ithaca/Niagara, NY all next week and it could save me, however I still don't have my work credit card so I will see what happens. I need to get away fast.

There's a lot I'm not mentioning and one day I may have the nerve. Yes she wants no responsibility. I thought we were working on our marriage already Watcher, lol.

She wants to listen to nothing. I said November was bad. She replied November was great. I said I forgot, it was December that was bad. She replied, well we got out of it.

She's in Bonnie and Clyde mode right now. She is a big fan. She has strange idols. So I am trying my best not to be her Clyde.

She came to a conclusion about moving because she cannot do it without the boys. So she may look for an apartment for the 3 of them which would work for them IMO.

So she has so many father plans for me and she is all rah rah rah on family. However, it's just talk as we don't see our kids. So I will get them out this weekend while she is away during the day.

She has a one track mind and it's all about Watcher. I have to laugh. How does she survive the other 330+ NC days a year without me. I kind of see why I need those 330+ days alone now.

Hopefully my trip will come through on Monday and I land in both Ithaca and Niagara. I guess I will be moving around. WNN she is so not ready to get help.

I am pulling back with help from this weekend and hopefully my potential getaway.

Thanks

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #57 on: April 11, 2019, 10:00:46 PM »
So the short end of the story.

 We had dinner, OM nonsense, and she needed to borrow money for her 1st car payment and phone bill. We departed ways. She had an epic meltdown via text as I refused to answer her calls so that's it. This will just never work.

The End.

Well she won't end. Throwing up, crying, anxiety ridden. Some quotes " I mistreated my parents for you", "I gave you a chance", "I'm fighting for you the way you fought for me", "what have I ever done to you" so many more....

She is emotionally all over the place. My sister is staying with me tonight so I have to leave the house because she is threatening to come over. Dinner was at 5pm, we parted ways at 11pm and her epic meltdown ended at 140am.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2019, 10:42:04 PM by Watcher »

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #58 on: April 11, 2019, 10:50:37 PM »
I'm sorry, Watcher. You must feel very tired of this.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline GonerinGhana

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #59 on: April 11, 2019, 11:26:56 PM »
She realizes she is having an MLC, but unfortunately her idea of an MLC is the stereotypical one that includes the red sports car.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #60 on: April 12, 2019, 05:39:18 AM »
Watcher, I just hope you didn't help her with her car payment or phone bill.   :(  Let her mother worry about the car payment, she's the one using her car.

Oh boy and his is the woman who thought she could afford to pay for an apartment?

All serious cra cra talk Watcher, but you already know that.  Try not to let it effect you, none of it is true.  So delusional.

Just stay away and try to relax now.  I agree The End.   ::)



A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #61 on: April 12, 2019, 06:07:42 AM »
Hi Treasur, Goner, Thunder

I have to laugh Goner because we are told not to have relationship talks which is fine. I can talk to her about anything. I'm comfortable. Her crisis wore out my own anxiety, fears and insecurities. Along the way my confidence returned.

She is a hot mess. She views me as her spouse. She wants to be married like it's that easy. She sees what she went through the past 4 years however thats where it stops.

She doesn't yet acknowledge that I went through something. She is not grasping that concept. So she is having a difficult time with accepting that life has changed IMO.

She brought up OM at dinner last night but it was all negative. She was disparaging him and maybe reminiscing.

Obviously we saw each other again after I posted. She is just eff'd up in the head. I'm just some guy with no script. So I listen to her. Am I doing the right thing. IDK...

After midnight she is a scared little girl. Maybe the facade crumbles as the day proceeds. I hear all her anxieties and fears and insecurities. She is one huge fragile mess of a woman.

She believes we are working on things, lol. IDK... I don't believe we are working on things. We talk to each other civilly and spend time together.

We talked about one specific female co worker. I know a lot of her co workers and unfortunately they know everything about our mess as W informed me that she has gotten into trouble 3 times at work over OM.

So this co worker always asks about me. Prodding her. That good man is going to get away and not wait forever type of thing.

A lot of how I never had her back throughout our marriage came out. I never helped her. That would be her perception because she has always been a financial disaster.

Emotionally I am fine. I guess I'm detached. I question how many more cycles do we go through and can I last. I can divorce her and we will still have kids and she will still cycle.

She believes she missed her chance to divorce. She wanted to divorce at BD, go on our separate journeys, and re marry again if it was meant to be. Her parents objected to her divorce plans. She uses the word journey a lot.

She believes I have a GF. She wants to check my phone which I object to and she is suspicious. I get text messages and phone calls and who knows if I left Hero Spouse on in my browser. Of course I decline her request. I can't take the chance that she finds our forum.

I don't have free access to her phone nor do I want it. Someone asked me if she says 'I love you". No she doesn't nor do I expect it. We have been intimate. There has been no fighting and I call her on her BS.

She says she cares for me. Calls me her husband. I can tell by her touch that she cares. I'm not talking about sex. There's just a certain touch that we share with our spouses that let's you know. At least that's how I feel in my situation.

I did see my boys and they both look very good. She is really selling these boys on me. Her main problem is her preoccupation with FB and her Soulmate forums which dictate her life. She is very distracted even while driving. She doesn't drive in logical routes to the point where I finally had to say where on earth are you driving.

She drives in circles getting me back to my car. I'm quiet because I want her to figure it out but eventually I have to point it out to her.

So its Friday morning and I am still alive and breathing. I guess I will see what the day brings.

Enjoy your day

Thanks


Offline UrsaMajor

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #62 on: April 12, 2019, 06:15:35 AM »
We had dinner, OM nonsense, and she needed to borrow money for her 1st car payment and phone bill. We departed ways. She had an epic meltdown via text as I refused to answer her calls so that's it. This will just never work.

The End.

Well she won't end. Throwing up, crying, anxiety ridden. Some quotes " I mistreated my parents for you", "I gave you a chance", "I'm fighting for you the way you fought for me", "what have I ever done to you" so many more....

She is emotionally all over the place. My sister is staying with me tonight so I have to leave the house because she is threatening to come over. Dinner was at 5pm, we parted ways at 11pm and her epic meltdown ended at 140am.

Man,

That is WAY beyond "emotionally all over the place." That is rampant mania... Just in your selection of quotes, she flipped from one side to the other... From being abused by her parents her whole life to mistreating her parents for you?  Gave you a chance? FFS

What has she ever done to you? Oh, I don't know... How about tossing glasses of water in your face? Throwing irons at you? hitting you 'til your ear bleeds? Calling the cops umpteen times? Calling your work with trumped up nonsense? The list goes on....

Note: After your last post: Your phone is a government phone, right? She CAN'T "inspect" it... The "You have a GF" is , in my view, projection and insecurity.... and is counter to her
Quote from: Watcher
it's why did you hold out then (stand). Why did you never divorce me Watcher ? Why didn't you give up on me ?
  from 2 posts ago.....

Agreed.....


Me - 55
MLC - 47
Together 19 years - Married for 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Canines (each of us has one)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold and separated - March 2016
Mid-Lifer has filed for D

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #63 on: April 12, 2019, 11:58:07 AM »
Hi UrsaMajor,

There are just so many problems here. The one positive is we get along and enjoy our time together. The inlaws situation remains unaddressed. The house conditions remain in repair. The utilities remain unpaid. She has the new car payment.

So do we have such a good time together because I'm accepting a lot of her behavior. The fantasy or her new life philosophy persists. I have to listen to soulmate talk all day long. I'm her soulmate btw. However, her spiritual TF partner is OM. That's what these people believe. So I have to be one understanding spouse because one day the TF's will unite.

She recognizes the TF partner is not happening because he is not responding. This online philosophy and group is her life. I can understand it however she allows it to dictate her life and bases life decisions on them. She is not on the phone in front of me however she does use Whattsapp with them often.

Financially she is just toxic. That new car is going to hurt her bad. The moment of financial devastation is here. She asked me to buy milk and orange juice today. See how she continues to put me back in that box. Meanwhile she does not compromise at all.

Come back home Watcher and accept that you will be paying more bills. I have thrown out enough truth darts. Last night, I reminded her you left me 4 years ago and I had to fend for myself.  That's a fact. Her response. So are you going to help me Watcher. That pretty much is her attitude.

I see my plans blowing up so I need to pull back. Problem is her dire financial straits are keeping her latched to me. There is just no incentive for me to go home. Nothing has changed. So today I'm taking a break as I missed a lot of sleep yesterday and I have to prepare for my half marathon tomorrow.

She will have other intentions for suse.

Thanks

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #64 on: April 12, 2019, 12:47:14 PM »
Come back home Watcher and accept that you will be paying more bills????

She did not say that, please tell me it was a joke.  ::) ::)

I hope you rest up for tomorrow.  Got your music all ready?

A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #65 on: April 12, 2019, 12:54:20 PM »
Watcher,
 Your plans don't have to blow up...you are in control unless you let her take over.  I understand you like to spend time with her...I guess in some way you like observing her "mania".  It is a window into what state she is in.  Maybe it's me but I don't see any improvement with her. She is still spinning.  I'm not sure she will ever stop cycling without professional help.  I've never heard of anyone with these kind of cycles with mania stabilizing without meds.  My only advise is to stick with your boundaries.  No parents,. no gambling and professional help and you might have a chance. At the moment none of those things are going to happen and they may never happen.  Don't lose all the progress you have made.  Keep your independence, your workouts and some personal space.  Hugs...wishing you the best.  You will know in time what to do. 

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #66 on: April 12, 2019, 01:18:05 PM »
Watcher you do  not need to listen to this nonsense day in day out. When in 2014 my MLCH would open his mouth to mention OW name, I would leave the room. You have a right to talk what interests you and have actual exchange, instead of being an observer in the monologue theater. She is spinning, and I think her financial issues exacerbating this mania. She does not want to get rid of her parents, because by her own admission they pay for food, do cleaning, laundry, etc.  I bet they would like to buy food for only two people, as opposed to 5. She knows that they cover her expenses, and this is the reason she does not want to apply pressure on them. She did not want to leave, because in that case she would have been responsible for her rent, food, utilities, etc. Now she does not need to worry about food and roof over her head as it is provided by you and ILs (however terrible they might be). Her only responsibility is utilities and upkeep of the house. Not a lot for someone who makes 60000K/year.

Your wife will turn on you once you quit listening to her nonsense or God forbid say something that is half way critical.

Good luck, I am with WNM protect yourself.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #67 on: April 12, 2019, 03:37:25 PM »
Hi Thunder, WonderNoMore, Karm.

LOL, No she did not say that Thunder. It is my perception of the situation. I just got 4 hours of sleep after work because I had little last night. I just noticed she texted me.

She wanted to see if I could get S16 from school and the other message was at a different time telling me she was at the mall if I wanted to see her and asking if I was ok because I had not responded.

I simply replied that I was tired and just woke up. We have had little text contact. Obviously she is not home. She will be out to 9pm and then go home.

I let her know I have a half marathon tomorrow and she will be going out with her GF's.

4 nights in a row were enough so 2 off days would be nice. Let's see if she survives tonight because I need real sleep.

Yes I still have my running and Monday I will be back to my gym routine. So I do see a slowdown.

WNM, yes she needs professional help. I do question my participation with her. It never ends good. Now in November I walked away and she was equally agreeable after 27 days. Going back to the house one day in December brought on our conflict and drama.

Yes I do get a glimpse into her mind and it finally showed itself again last night at dinner as she talked. So nothing changes with her thinking.

It's sad that I don't have expectations anymore. I'm used to her mania where she is present.  Full of great ideas for herself, our relationship and our family.

It's impossible to use reason or logic. She's not listening to those type of conversations from me. So that's the sad state of our family. I get these mania moments with my W. I get an opportunity to see our son's.

Then it will end and I will be her enemy again. Due to the really bad financial situation I should go back to NC this weekend without actually announcing it.

IDK what my purpose is now. Like you said, she could live this way forever. She has no concept of money but the most dangerous factor is she has no concept of my expenses. The family survives because of me financially. I can't spend money everyday.

We have had dinner twice so I think that's fine. However, I've already turned her down for spa treatments, facials, her hair appointment, her retreat in Massachusetts, other lunch and dinner invites. So she would render me broke for sure.

So then, does NC really just protect my 2 sons on one end and me on the other. They get to goto school and live in their home, however have no parents. She is in all function mode with school and S18 at the moment btw.

So do I just wait, albeit living my life, until she is normal again. What if she is never normal again ? What happens if this is as good as it can get ? What is my responsibility while engaging her in mania ?

Do I just constantly crush her ? I know that sounds weird. She has feelings. Do I stomp on them ? I know how that sounds. She is not normal, therefore, she is injured quite easily.

I already apologized to her for having sex with her because I feel like I'm taking advantage of her and the situation. Yes she invites me to bed and I should be more responsible. Then it brings me back to more questions again. This could be as good as it's going to get Watcher.

I know she has put me through a lot. I feel very bad for her because during mania I get to see how screwed up she really is in the head. It's hard because I see my old wife somewhere in that mess of a head and it breaks my heart.



« Last Edit: April 12, 2019, 03:42:29 PM by Watcher »

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #68 on: April 12, 2019, 04:04:00 PM »
Watcher, when I saw my H go into his deep depressions a few times, it broke my heart too.
I could see the pain he was in, I could see physical and emotional pain, but I knew I had to leave him alone and not try to fix him.

He had to sort himself out, all by himself, but it was very hard on me.

You never know for sure if she will ever come out of this because you really don't know what is wrong with her.  The manic episodes could indicate Bipolar, or some thing else.  You have no way of knowing for sure.  None of us do unless she gets diagnosed.  But it does seem she needs some kind of professional help.

By her mom saying you knew she was sick when you married her, makes me think there is more going on than you knew.  But you were so young, how would you have known anything like that?

Lots going on in your head right now, Watcher.  Just try to get some sleep and rest up for tomorrow.
Good luck, let us know how you do.   :)
« Last Edit: April 12, 2019, 09:45:24 PM by Thunder »
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #69 on: April 12, 2019, 05:08:42 PM »
Hi Thunder,

I am so out of shape for this race tomorrow, hahahaha. The sun will be out in the 50's so finally some nice weather.

I'm doing well with my financial boundaries. I'm not doing so well with my personal space and time boundaries. Today has been my 1st full day off from her since Sunday. It's a constant tug of war with her. She wants it all now and I want to go slow. I don't have a problem talking to her on the phone and seeing each other once or twice a week but I don't want to see her everyday.

I do see her control and manipulation. She wants me home for a reason. To control me. Instead of running with her everyday, because that's how I always handle the situation, I'd prefer to slow my contact down.

We have no problem talking. She does talk normal until she drags me into her fantasy world view. Her parents and the finances are a HUGE problem. Two HUGE roadblocks. She won't get rid of them. I don't believe she will ever get rid of them.

She drifted to fantasy world at dinner. She demanded to know if I had contacted a particular friend of hers online. She doesn't accept my answer. I say no. "See your lying to me". I've answered these questions before btw. Did you look at OM and his W FB. She doesn't like my no answer.

I know her mom has contacted her people. I've shared info that I have on MIL and BIL. She called her brother from dinner challenging my info then she called the man BIL contacted. This happened in 2017 and we already have gone over it.

Now the male co worker is also fully invested in her fantasy life. He knows everything and feeds this garbage. So that explains why she could have been agitated last night. Male co worker may not be happy that she is talking with me again. His function is clearly just at work and nothing more. IMO she uses him for her Narc work supply. He is way too invested in her at work. She does have Narc traits. I'm not blind.

Male co worker helps her understand me. That's her explanation. Eff him. LOL..... Oh male co worker wants to beat up OM. He serves as her work protector.  A little too interested I would say. OM simply protected himself IMO. So the fantasy is constantly fed everyday at work.

So I will talk to her at some point and explain my position again nicely.  If she is not agreeable than we don't have to see each other.

Have a good night
Thanks

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #70 on: April 12, 2019, 07:49:29 PM »
Watcher,

I agree with Thunder that your wife needs professional help. There are so many troubling signals just based on the information that you share with us here. And it does not look like much changes occured since November. Except that OM has become even more elusive fantasy.

Most of the people here work in some capacity or the other in the office environment. If we conduct survey on how many have male or female co-workers who are privy to the most intimate details of our personal lives, that number will be zero. Is there anything in the TMI zone?  I think your wife breeds on drama. She likes to create drama whenever she goes. I simply do not understand how can someone go to work and discuss her love life regardless how close they might be.

Does she have any explanation for drugging you to court this winter? Or she has forgotten about this too. You could show her the amount of money you spent on the lawyer. That will re-fresh her memory.

I wish you good race and well-oxidized circulatory system. You will need this to deal with her.

Stay strong Watcher.



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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #71 on: April 13, 2019, 01:16:56 AM »
Hi Karmirtsaghik,

I found it disturbing how this OM narrative is readily known amongst her colleagues. The male co worker eggs her on and is feeding the fantasy. His end game is quite clear to me. Now she is extremely delusional so aside from male co worker, I really could not see why people would be so invested in her personal life for an OM who rightfully filed complaints against W.

I've tried to explain the concept behind her thinking to the forum. The fantasy really has just become her life. I also have my role in her fantasy. So do her parents, etc....Absolutely nothing has changed. Looking back now I believe all our contact has been manic episodes sparked by panic/stress.

In November it was the canceled family medical insurance. In April it was her tax debt and car. The car payment is 498 dollars so I believe I have found the mysterious 500 graduation fees.

So tonight she texted me around 1030 pm. She had some random questions about my race and whether I was taking our son's. I have a 6am departure so that's a big no when you have teenagers. Around 1130pm she called and said she was at a friend's house and had no keys to the marital home. The boys were not answering their phones.

So I drove over there to let her in and obviously she woke me up. She was sitting in her car so I went straight to the front door which was unlocked and S16 was still awake on the 2nd floor. So I left without saying a word to her and immediately blocked her phone number. So contact began with a phone call on April 8th.

So I will return to my life however I'm sure she will keep pushing for a little longer. I needed a free day today to break my addiction as she was starting to work her magic on me. Last Friday we had a hysterical bonding session as that was our 1st night together. I took the weekend away from her. Monday the pattern repeated with hysterical bonding.

The last 3 nights were better as she slowed down and we really didn't do anything on that level. However, she sells me sex all day long so it's reaffirmed through texts and her thoughts and interests and photos. So IDK if anyone else has gone through hysterical bonding but it's really intense. It gets you hooked quickly and I haven't experienced it since BD in July 2015.

So that was my main objective in breaking with her this morning. I needed this 3 day weekend to be free of her and it will be. After tonight I'm just done seeing her. Really the conversation at dinner last night killed my desire as she revealed all her online and work nonsense for the 1st time again.

S16 greeted her. I thought how nice. She departed at 8am and returned at midnight. See you tomorrow S16. I guess at midnight because it's Saturday and S16 sleeps late. Tomorrow is girls night out. So I learn more about her life. She is up to a lot more than just hanging out with mommy.

Now she did invite me out tonight and I declined. She refuses to go home because of her parents. With the mounting financial pressure I dont see how long she keeps it up. I will depart now so she most likely will have to cozy back up to her parents at some point or become really aggressive with pursuing me.

So not much sleep. I did sleep after work but that really was for yesterday's disrupted sleep. So we shall see how today goes.

Thanks




Offline Mortesbride

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #72 on: April 13, 2019, 05:56:54 AM »
Holy crap I am just catching up with your thread after a few months away and dear lord...

It looks like you got your head shoved inside a hurricane.  :o

This $h!te is all over the place, but it does seem like a familiar pattern from what she has done before.

She keeps sucking you back into the storm.  :-\
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Online readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #73 on: April 13, 2019, 06:04:19 AM »
Hello,

Quote
So IDK if anyone else has gone through hysterical bonding but it's really intense.

Let me think? Uh nooooo.........I went from September 2009 till November 2013, as a celibate. Ex Mrs. Ready had nothing to do with me at all. I was invisible with little or no contact even though we lived in the same house.

However, she never called the cops on me or tried to do anything to hurt my career. That was her lifeline as well. She was crazy, not stupid.

The part I really have a disdain for is the co-workers. They can obviously see she is not rational and rather then either leave her alone or try to help her, the one guy just messes with her head.

I could also see her not being an exemplary employee either. She has a lot on her plate and it probably distracts her at work.

I wish there was something in my situation where I could really relate or give insight for you. Unfortunately I can't. Yes, my ex had her fantasy romance with OM. However, her actions were those of a long winter of quiet depression. I saw very little mania. There were moments but nothing like the yours. If mine was a windstorm, yours is a tornado.

If you have a race today, just hit the course and clear your mind. Keep to your plan and seek actions that help you.

I hope the oblique is better. I will hit the gym later this morning before I go to a volunteer clean up for a park in my community.

Fist bump,

Ready

"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #74 on: April 13, 2019, 08:25:11 AM »
I’m so sorry Watcher. How traumatic and exhausting. Yes, she’s definitely still in crisis. Best to stay away if you can.

Good luck at your marathon. Perfect timing I’d say!
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #75 on: April 13, 2019, 09:41:18 AM »
Hi Mortesbride, Ready, KIT.

I finished the race and I will describe it later. She called at 3am and it was blocked. She called at 830am and she wants to know why her bed was empty. WTF did you wait for me for 4 years Watcher? Do you want this marriage or not ? You can't keep running Watcher.

I know you have a heart filled with compassion. You have to forgive me already. Why do you keep coming back just to leave again ?

So I replied I forgave the betrayal however you keep bringing up OM, male co worker and everyone else when it suits you. Male co worker showed her porn sites. Great. I loved hearing that when we were in bed btw.

It's a slap in my face constantly. So I read her the riot act on male co worker since she wants this eff'n marriage so badly. I don't want to tell her what to do but that guy needs to go because he is getting off on keeping OM alive while she is at work.

She started calling me a Narc. Fine. I told her if she were sincere, the parents would be removed so our family can begin to heal. I told her I need to heal and it's impossible with her mother.

She had girls night last night and all the women are perplexed. What does Watcher want ? LMAO... I did not leave the marriage for 4 years. She did.

W says I was rude for leaving without telling her goodbye and she is tired of sleeping without me. I thought we were working on our marriage Watcher.

I had enough so I blocked her again. She was able to leave me a message wishing me luck and reminding me not to abandon our sons. LOL....

Ok I will be back later
Thanks

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #76 on: April 13, 2019, 10:05:18 AM »
Watcher, if patience was an olympic category, you would have been an olympic champion right now. It looks like your wife is trying to sell sex (which she knows you need) for some material favors under the guise of building family or you being the father for your sons. I think she would have prefered if your name was ATM.

It is outrageous that the co-workers know what color is her underwear, but you were not informed of her hospitalisation. If she was serious about you being the father, this is what she should have done while being hospitalized. Many issues could have arisen that could have affected your sons and you as a parent have a full right to know.

She does not have money but goes to retreats, girls night out, walks in the malls. I works two jobs and make decent income, but I carry my lunch from home, because I think it is outrageous to pay 15 dollars for one bowl of chopped spinach with some veggies. 80 % of my wardrobe is from second hand stores. I own fantastic clothes, leather purses, and jackets. All from second hand stores. I am proud the way I live. I have no dept. I sleep well at night.

Good luck to you Watcher.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #77 on: April 13, 2019, 10:18:23 AM »
So bizarre, huh?

Why are you not in bed with me?  Because your parents are still in the house.

Why do you keep coming back just to leave again ?  Because you still bring up co-worker and OM.  Nothing has changed.

What does Watcher want ?  He wants the parents out of his house and for you to get help.

You can't keep running Watcher.  I will until you follow the 2 conditions I gave you.  Parents and help.

I thought we were working on our marriage Watcher.  What are you doing to work on our marriage? I don't see anything from you.

 ;D  I'm just helping with your answers,  Short and sweet.  Maybe anything too lengthy gets lost on her.

Ok, tell us about your race when you get time.

A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #78 on: April 13, 2019, 12:14:43 PM »
Hi Karm, Thunder.

Well I think she is keeping me married everyone. ::) She informed me that today is girls all day/ night out. I already knew that as last night must have been impromptu because she invited me out last night first.

She had been drinking wine last night so she was out quickly hence she didn't know until 3am that I did not stay. She is into wine now. Never drank before.

Anyway she is very excited because the ladies are taking her to a place where she can find certain items that she wants us to use with each other. Just think her April theme thus far.  ::) Its not that hard. OMG.... LOL....Hmm, it's not Bed, Bath, Beyond.

Why are these women being so proactive with her ? I'm glad she has female friends as she does need them. I do know most of them. A mixture of legit single moms and a few married.

More importantly she has ordered me to take out our son's and get moving. So I have to go see my son's.  ;D

So the course was relatively flat. Surprisingly I was exhausted by mile 8. I wonder why. It was in the 50's and I was drenched. At one point I started to get chills which is not an good sign.

So I stopped at every water/ Gatorade station and loaded up. I did also walk a lot as my absence from the gym probably played a role in my stamina as much as the lack of sleep.

The last 5 miles were a struggle. I finished at 2:34:00 roughly. I'm still waiting for official results so that's my slowest. Previously I ranged from 2:20:00-2:26:00. So I'm a bit off. I did walk alot.

So that was leg#2 of the super medallion challenge. Next one is in Brooklyn in October. Today was in Queens. Flushing Meadow Park where they have the U.S. Tennis Open.

Now this has always been my crisis gripe. She always went out and left the boys alone without informing me. Now she is informing me to go hang out with them.

Also the constant checking in and telling me who she is with and where she is going. I'm not used to that.

Well anyway, I have to go drag my tired self to see the boys and take them out. It is a beautiful day.

I agree she can only take short answers because she hasn't been listening to me thus far. Thankfully she has friends now and they have brilliantly kept her occupied for 2 days.

Ok I will be back.

Enjoy your day
Thanks

Offline Busy_Bee

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #79 on: April 13, 2019, 12:28:45 PM »
 ;D ;D ;D ;D
Watcher, I'm going to adapt your W's questions with Thunder's modifications!
Just hope I won't confuse my x :)

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #80 on: April 13, 2019, 12:33:02 PM »
Watcher, that's nice of her to let you see your own kids.   :(

But at least you can go somewhere with them, so enjoy it.

I would just caution you not to go in the house after you drop them off.  You never know what could happen there.  You sure don't want to be there when she gets home.   ::)

Have fun!   :)
« Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 12:41:33 PM by Thunder »
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #81 on: April 13, 2019, 12:45:02 PM »
Watcher,
 I don't know how you do it.  Please be careful with her mania and the all night texts , phone calls.  It is you who will wind up sick and/or emotionally drained.  All the sex talk and now with the girls buying "toys" sounds still like manipulation to me.  She's working you and I guess you are suppose to  provide money for things for her if she willing to sleep with you.  That doesn't sounds like a marriage, like love.  It sounds like pure mania and manipulation to me.  From across the forum it looks like she is wearing you down.  Please be careful or you will crash and burn again.  Only this time you will be way more angry at yourself for getting sucked back in the drama again. Red flags are waving all around you!!! 

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #82 on: April 13, 2019, 10:41:48 PM »
Hi BusyBee, Thunder, WonderNoMore.

Yes she kept it going all day with the texts while out. I did see the boys and took them out for a bit however they really have their own interests.

I didn't see her today. I left the house at 9pm. IDK. It's kind of depressing there. So W has this friends element now where she just stays out. MIL was out and the boys were home.

Yes it's all manipulation with her. So tomorrow I'm off and then I have a late work week so I will roll with physically not seeing her. It's better I stay away from her and the games.
Its definitely not going to get better as she spins and her debts continue to mount.

Just get to graduation and then divorce maybe my only way to proceed. All games.

Have a good night
Thanks




Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #83 on: April 14, 2019, 06:38:22 AM »
For me the beginning of the end was our dinner conversation on Thursday night. We went to a hotel that night and had a bottle of wine. She dropped the bills on me at that point. So I immediately got dressed and we left. That was our last physical contact. Our hotel ventures are really not sexual. I think it's more about being away from her parents and the kids.

So Friday night she went out with her friends. She knew I needed to sleep for the half marathon. So she calls me at midnight with her no house keys story. I arrive at the house and the door is unlocked. I've noticed it's always left unlocked because she comes home after her parents are in bed IMO.

She immediately went inside and I left. I woke up Saturday morning and noticed a blocked call at 3am from her. Just demonstrating that she was intent about me not having sleep. Then she called me 45 minutes prior to my race to argue. I sent her a text on Fri telling her my race plans and said enjoy your ladies night out. I meant for Saturday obviously since she already had told me.

So she starts a fight over that text. How did you know I was with my GF's on Friday. See that's the BS I have to deal with. That's paranoid behavior and her inability to understand a simple text. So she's all riled up over a text where I said have a good time.

She then launched into that whole marriage nonsense which I already stated. So after the race she told me her plans. Sent me a photo of a puppy that someone is giving away. Hey Watcher should we get another dog. Then she sends a photo of a little girl who she is with and states my friends say I should try to have a girl. What do you think Watcher ?

Yea that's what I want at this stage of my life. To be locked down another 18 years with an unstable woman. I'm at the finish line. So sex texts throughout the day. I left the marital home at 9pm because MIL arrived. Meanwhile W played the string a long game until 1am. Oh I will be there soon started at 830pm and she kept it going.

She is getting me back for Friday night IMO. So I dropped off paperwork this morning for her in our mailbox and she never came home. She can play her games all she wants as I have nothing to really lose. There is no benefit for me getting back with her. Maybe we both are using each other for sex as I have no desire to return home and I know she is all manipulation.

She got nothing out of me financially. Maybe emotionally but I do know I need to stay away. For me it just takes days, so today is #3 so I most likely broke her pull. I will not reach out to her. I also do not feel that it's my responsibility to remind her about filing taxes.

I see her plan. She will run and stay out all summer long with her GF's. She needs me to feed the boys. S18 already had a headache as I arrived at 3pm. Yes they do make themselves food but not meals. She continues to avoid the issue. Her parents.

The flaw in her plan is she cannot maintain that life. I predict the car will be in repo within the year. She still has no money for her physical appearance and she does look worn. She borrows money from her friends. This was a non pay weekend and yet she had 2 ladies nights. 

So she really doesn't want to be married. We are supposedly working on our marriage and now she is not coming home but wants me to live there ? She announced last night that she has her period. I only mention it to see if her pursuit now ends because she waits to have sex until it finishes.

Today should be quiet as she will be out with her GF. Tomorrow she will be looking for me for financial reasons. The weekends are fantasy time.

So she definitely attempted to sabotage my run yesterday and my Saturday in general. Yes I did get to see my son's but that was still control.

Again I try to post everything. I have no desire to return home. She is a pure manipulator. Some things are her but they are very few. So I stick to my 2 conditions. Removal of parents and professional help.

Tomorrow I am back in the gym finally. I believe the oblique is fine. Now interesting weight development again. My work physical was on April 10th and I was 204lbs. Now I did swet profusely yesterday at the half marathon so that's a partial factor. I woke up this morning, April 14th at 192 lbs. Everytime I get back with her.

So I have a lot of paperwork to catch up on today.

Enjoy your day everyone
Thanks
« Last Edit: April 14, 2019, 06:43:54 AM by Watcher »

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #84 on: April 14, 2019, 06:54:45 AM »
Sounds like a plan Watcher.  The longer this goes on, the more in control of your feelings and actions will be.  As you are healing from this crisis, you tolerate less, you understand more of what you need in a marriage.  You are giving her time to try but realizing you can not change or heal her...only you.  You will figure it out as you go along.  No worries.  Take care of your routine, turn off your phone when you need rest from the mania.  Hugs Watcher...you got this!!

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #85 on: April 14, 2019, 07:10:52 AM »
Watcher, It could be the stress when you're with her that makes you lose weight.
We all know how that one goes. ::)

I'm glad to hear your oblique seems healed up.  Bet it will feel good to get back to the gym.   ;D

Enjoy your day.   :)

btw with the lack of sleep and not being in your normal "race ready" shape you did pretty good.
Your time wasn't off that much.
So is this the last part of the 3/4 part metal races?
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Mortesbride

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #86 on: April 14, 2019, 07:46:25 AM »
Jesus a new dog and a new baby girl when she can't even keep her story straight for one day...  :o ::)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #87 on: April 14, 2019, 07:59:54 AM »
Hi WonderNoMore, Thunder, Mortesbride.

I learn something more each time. She drinks now (maybe self medicating), and does the bar scene. She could have been doing this awhile and I just learned of it now. The last thing I want to do is get her pregnant and I did find it odd that we had intercourse after more than 3 years.

Yes I have to block the phone at night. There will be no more physical contact as the finances are really bad. So, then, is there really any need for us to have contact ? Nothing changes with her so do I just go NC and wait until the next bout of mania. I don't believe this will ever end and what really am I getting out of this if she does get help and returns. 

Yes I'm looking forward to the gym this week. I'm not 100 percent sure this obilique has healed.  The next part of that challenge race is in October. In the meantime Gettysburg, PA is up next on the 28th. I'm going by myself. If I included the boys she would hold me hostage and make every attempt to sabotage that event. So block on her phone.

Thanks

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #88 on: April 14, 2019, 08:02:21 AM »
Yikes Watcher,   She wants a baby?  Better use protection.  Her getting pregnant in this state would be scary for both of you. Like you said it would tie you up financially for 18 more years.  Maybe that's her plan.  She knows you would not leave her financially if she was pregnant.  It's not a good plan but it's may be the only thing she thinks would guarantee her that you would continue to support her for many years to come. Much caution is needed with your wife right now.

Offline Ready2Transform

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #89 on: April 14, 2019, 08:30:51 AM »
Yikes Watcher,   She wants a baby?  Better use protection.  Her getting pregnant in this state would be scary for both of you. Like you said it would tie you up financially for 18 more years.  Maybe that's her plan.  She knows you would not leave her financially if she was pregnant.  It's not a good plan but it's may be the only thing she thinks would guarantee her that you would continue to support her for many years to come. Much caution is needed with your wife right now.

This. And if she's hitting the bar scene and hooks up with anyone else, she could fool you into thinking any pregnancy was no question yours. Caution always. Take nothing for granted.
"Unconditional love is the highest of high standards, and while we are letting go of our need to control the process of anyone else, we are taking within our lives complete accountability for our own experience."

http://seriousvanity.com/how-to-cultivate-unconditional-love-and-change-the-world/

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #90 on: April 14, 2019, 08:32:01 AM »
WonderNoMore, Ready2Transform

That's why I'm staying away from her.  ::) I'm fine in NC however I do fall victim to the fact that she is a woman throwing herself at me when we are alone. It's not always easy to control myself so that's why I need to stay away from her.

Now she had told me a scary scenario in the past that she could get pregnant and then have sex with me at some point to sell it as mine. This comment was in November and may or may not have been in reference to OM. So since she announced she has her period I guess its a good time to stop having sex with her for good as 18 years would guarantee her more support, and, guarantee the inlaws. Who knows what advice these single mom friends are selling her ?

I was careful anyway during our last encounter. She did send me a text last week that I would have to start wearing protection because I act single and she has to protect herself and she, too, would start acting single based on my behavior. Again I'm the one who doesn't want to be married in her mind and clearly projection on her part.
 

Offline Ready2Transform

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #91 on: April 14, 2019, 09:43:57 AM »
Those flags are a shade of red deeper than I think Crayola has developed!  ;D ;D Not funny for your life, but at least you're setting boundaries, looking at the big picture, and taking it all in stride. It's what many of us here hope for you.

If I could go back to my formerly attached and riding-the-rollercoaster-of-mania-with-him self, I would say to her that, though the welcome statement here says 'believe nothing of what they say and half of what they do', that there ARE things you can believe. Don't listen to words, read moods. And 100%, trust how they make you feel. That uneasiness, the logic you can apply to their illogic to see where fantasy is overtaking reality - THAT is the special sauce. You know your middle, common ground right now is sex, but the oxytocin is a bonding chemical. When you see it as an exchange that keeps you tethered, it too will become less desirable.

Draw one long line at the bottom of a pyramid on a piece of paper, and that is your foundation. In the past you may have been able to label this your "marriage" or even your "family" but it is not so today. It is "Watcher". This is your future, your career, your mental well being (you can split all of this into the compartments of "you". The next two blocks on the next level on top of it are your sons' futures and mental well being. And so on. Your FOO. Your friendships. Your wife? Or the pursuit of other relationships, with or without your healed wife (who, as Wonder or Thunder said earlier, will never heal without a plan for lifelong treatment. Like my xH, a chemical imbalance is not going to correct itself. Heck, even like ME who takes a handful of supplements every day to keep from swelling up and going nuts!), is farther up the chain. You aren't in partnership with this woman.

Game of Thrones airing tonight reminded me of my xH reading the novels in 2011 and then dryly explaining every chapter to me (while I was trying to run a business and he was sitting on the couch all day). I told him, "I thought we were trying to spend more time together and work on our marriage," and he pointed at the book and said, "I'M TRYING!!". So to him reading GoT and telling me about it was "working on our marriage".  ??? They don't have the same logic we do, W. They're not capable of being on the same page. Or in the same book! Not without professional help. And that is not on the table soon for you. Take care of what you need to take care of and weigh your options, for you and the boys. Change is scary, but it's not impossible.

"Unconditional love is the highest of high standards, and while we are letting go of our need to control the process of anyone else, we are taking within our lives complete accountability for our own experience."

http://seriousvanity.com/how-to-cultivate-unconditional-love-and-change-the-world/

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #92 on: April 14, 2019, 10:07:29 AM »
Watcher,

I agree with people who warn you about fathering a child with her. Every announcement of her pregnancy should warranty paternity test request by you. She would not stop at anything in order to get hold of your cash. She is not getting rid of her parents. As many much wiser than me friends on HS indicated, your wife needs professional help. Even with that there is not guarantee that she will be healed. She has no sense of personal responsibility. How is she going to take care of another child and a puppy when she does not have money to buy milk or orange juice is beyond me. Or when current dog is left without proper care.

 Alcohol and depression usually is not good combination. She knows you love her and you are kind and she manipulates that. In her actions there is no concern over your well-being or happiness. It is all self-serving, egotistical behavior.

Be strong Watcher and please take necessary precautions in all aspects of dealing with her.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #93 on: April 14, 2019, 10:20:18 AM »
I think this is one of the traps these ow's use on the MLCer's.

They "miraculously" get pregnant and they've got them, financially and emotionally.....and they know exactly what their doing.

I wish more men would take the bull by the horns and not just trust the woman with birth control.
They both need to be responsible.
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #94 on: April 14, 2019, 10:59:33 AM »
Hi Ready2Transform, Karmirtsaghik, Thunder.

She was in contact from Church. She needs to have me today because she is addicted to having sex with me. She wants to goto the toy store. I said I was working. She told me to leave. I declined the offer of all hours sex.  :-\

Seriously,  I told her she strung me along yesterday and it was totally unnecessary. She could have simply said she had other plans. Not that I intended to meet her, however that was her manipulative game and I told her such.

"I would show you my nipples but I'm in Church.  :o Give me a chance." Everything is sex with her. Now she can sext all day long. That's her current mood. 3 or 4 hours from now it could be out of her system. D D D, I need ur D. She cannot accept no. I can't believe your passing on sex Watcher. I'm horny. LOL....

You mean to tell me she hasn't had sex with other men in this state ? Feb 2016 was a very long time ago for me and now everything is open for business,  ::) Where are we meeting ? is her reply to everything I'm saying.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #95 on: April 14, 2019, 11:11:53 AM »
Oh God, Watcher just block her, she will keep this up all day if you don't.  Talking will get you no where.

She sure does need help.  IN CHURCH?  Holy Moly!

A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #96 on: April 14, 2019, 11:24:15 AM »
What is her purpose of going to church? I wonder what kind of questions she seeks to find answers to in Church? Her sex hang ups miraculously disappeared it seems, if they ever existed in reality. Stay away from her Watcher.

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #97 on: April 14, 2019, 12:31:00 PM »
Sorry Watcher but to me it sounds like a trap.  Remember she told you she had her period.  I suspect she would suddenly tell you no it was a false alarm and she's ready to have sex.  Part of mania is often hyper sexual for some people. Stay away.  I don't mean to be negative but I'm really worried for you to trapped in a pregnancy that neither of you are ready for. Another child has never saved a marriage.   Turn off your phone, don't listen to the BS, take a cold shower...whatever it takes.  She knows talking this way gets to you...show her who is in control of their behavior...you!!

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #98 on: April 14, 2019, 03:54:07 PM »
Good point WNM.

Offline Whyus

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #99 on: April 15, 2019, 01:34:51 AM »
I am not goint to write much but Watcher, run to the hills mate. She is using the most deadly weapons that a woman has and we all know what they are.
If she is so horny all of a sudden and going out with her GFs then I have a difficult time believeing that she hasnt been acting single all this time, as you said. She is never home!
Its hard to imagine that you are the only one she has "been with her" all this time but saying that, I dont know her.
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline Silver

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #100 on: April 15, 2019, 05:10:54 AM »
Well you said it yourself, she is all manipulation. Having a baby with her would be the worst thing to do.
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #101 on: April 15, 2019, 06:33:20 AM »
Sounds like you need to step back and remind yourself of those two important boundaries: parents out and she gets professional help.
If that is Plan A, I guess you need a Plan B or C too?

Time and reduced contact does imho allow us to see the wood for the trees a bit.
You can't have a decent relationship with another human, let alone a marriage, with no reciprocity. And your w seems to be intermittently keen to tell you what she wants...but not at all interested in what you want unless it is the same thing.
Other than sex and a LOT of texts....what is your w actually offering to do differently which is in response to what you need now? Does she even know or care about what you want, Watcher? And have you spelled it out repeatedly in words and actions of one syllable?
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #102 on: April 15, 2019, 06:46:02 AM »
To that list I would also add mandatory financial literacy class, the one that she was trying to get S18 out. She does not seem to have any concept of financial management but wants full control of your bank account.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #103 on: April 15, 2019, 08:03:31 AM »
Well first thing is she texts a lot but it's the moment. Like I thought it burned out of her system. That being said we did see each other last night and talked. It's all day long about Narc MIL and she refuses to go home. What are we going to do Watcher ?

She claims she awakened in February and felt like herself for once. I'm an alien Watcher. You may think I'm crazy but I feel Ilike  was abducted by aliens these past 4 years.

I asked her what did our separation mean to you. Separation is the biggest mindfock experience. WTF just happened to me. I came home from that business trip and thought WTF are you doing with your life. I could eff any man I want and I always had my sh!te on lock down. I was a faithful wife and then this sh!te  happened. OM broke through all my barriers. It eff'd up my head and I thought it was because of you and our marriage.

I ran because I never thought you would forgive me. I knew I eff'd up. I waited for those divorce papers everyday and they never came. People started pointing things out about you. I started to notice myself. Why is he not divorcing me ? I thought you would never let me forget. 

She says nothing happened and she was handling things in her own way. I over reacted and made things worse. However, distance from him has helped her because she would eff that man today if given the opportunity.

We still may not work out but we will never get an opportunity to try until my parents are gone. It's the only way I will be able to trust your intentions. I have to try life with just you and the boys to see if we can work.

At another point she brought up that she has a black heart. It's dead. I no longer believe in love. It died last summer. I told you. Your wife is eff'd up. You are a good man Watcher and have a beautiful heart. I said you once had a beautiful heart yourself, maybe it will come back again one day. She says no. That woman had to die. She's not coming back.

So Mrs. Watcher what do we do ? Obviously we can't live like this as our son's have no parents. You refuse to go home now and I refuse to return. Let it all crash Watcher. We will have to start over. She would like me home, however she understands why I will not return home based on my conditions.

This morning we had to do something at school. She blew off work and wanted to stay with me and I had to escape. Oh you are getting tired of me already Watcher. Well, kind of. She is all consuming and I need a break.

So she appears to have found why OM entered her life and is sold on abusive controlling Narc MIL as the reason. She was conditioned for 15 years that I was the problem in our marriage by MIL.

I said something horrible to S16. I told him your father does not love you. I don't know why I said it. I apologized to him for saying it. I know I get it from my mom.

She is paralyzed to act against her mom. How can I call the police on my mom ? So no remorse at all towards me as she is the one who went through something. The boys are the only ones suffering in the long run Watcher. Everyone has problems in their marriage. I thought it was just us.

So we have not moved on the inlaws. That's where it starts. Selling the house is her recommendation and that maybe the way to go. My last commitment gone.



« Last Edit: April 15, 2019, 08:26:50 AM by Watcher »

Offline Mortesbride

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #104 on: April 15, 2019, 09:10:26 AM »

I ran because I never thought you would forgive me. I knew I eff'd up. I waited for those divorce papers everyday and they never came. People started pointing things out about you. I started to notice myself. Why is he not divorcing me ? I thought you would never let me forget. 


Wow that was almost helpful and insightful.  ;D

In all seriousness I do wonder if this somehow has an effect on some MLCers. That we are not reacting the way they anticipated.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Online readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #105 on: April 15, 2019, 11:51:55 AM »
Hello,

Quote
It's all day long about Narc MIL and she refuses to go home. What are we going to do Watcher ?

There is no "we" in this situation. This is her issue and problem. Because is "we" becomes you. Then any actions against MIL will suddenly be Watcher's plan and ideas. Not hers.

Believe me, from what you have described, she is more than capable of getting them out.

However, that's my simple opinion and in your situation, I am not going to be sound advice because I haven't really encountered such issues.

For example, if you were having basic car issues like squealing brakes, I could help you change the pads. Maybe the starter. But yours is like rebuilding an automatic transmission. Way, way above my capabilities.

From my perspective, these are your guiding questions:
  • Is Ex pushing this reconciliation for you as a couple or simply she is in survival mode?
  • Is she using your view of MIL to get your buy in and make MIL the new enemy?
  • What are the short term outcomes?
  • What are the long term outcomes?
  • Can I truly trust her?

You've got a lot to think about. Fortunately, you are detached and in a better position to respond to her rather than react.

Fist bump,

Ready

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Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #106 on: April 15, 2019, 12:01:39 PM »
Ready's post made me wonder actually if the real question is what IS still a We responsibility in your mind? It seems as if your w uses We as a shorthand for Watcher...
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline gman242

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #107 on: April 15, 2019, 12:23:18 PM »
I think this is one of the traps these ow's use on the MLCer's.

They "miraculously" get pregnant and they've got them, financially and emotionally.....and they know exactly what their doing.

I wish more men would take the bull by the horns and not just trust the woman with birth control.
They both need to be responsible.

Or MLCers to trap other people... like mine.

I think we have RH - incompatibility, she pressured me to "get checked out", not going in half, as a couple, but because she feared being told she was too old or something was wrong with her. So.. she cheats, ends up pregnant, lives with the guy and 3 years later confesses "I don't know how to do anything other than be a mother".

According to her diary, which I should not have read, she had a few pregnancy "scares" with her previous boyfriend too.

Just chiming in.. reading the thread so far as given me yet another insight into her past behavior..  :o I'd really like to run out of loose threads to unravel.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2019, 12:25:39 PM by gman242 »

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #108 on: April 15, 2019, 12:26:26 PM »
Hi Mortesbride, Ready, Treasur, Gman

Exactly, this is a her problem. That is her theme today as usual. Now it's both toxic and dangerous for our sons to live there and (we) need to do something.

Everything legal that I have suggested she doesn't like. I phrase everything with, I'm sure you thought about this, etc....suggestion. Mostly it's just a constant venting.

Now today she says MIL will explode soon. Something about MIL is demanding 90 dollars from me for internet service that she paid.

W is warning me not to enter the house as MIL has no prob with me losing job. W says the combo of being out with her friends than me will be the catalyst.

Meanwhile W refuses to go home. She has all her photos of brusies but she won't do anything about it. W keeps saying MIL is working the boys against us.

So I can't trust her because she burned me in November over the same issue. Her mom was a Narc in Nov. W takes a 4 month break from me and now MIL is a Narc again.

It really is up to W. I don't live there. W fears she will be made out to be the crazy woman. I do fear S18 getting involved at some point defending his mom. That's my fear.

I suggested W pay to send her parents back to the homeland with one way tickets. Oh that won't work either. So she has shot down every viable option.

Her only solution is to sell the house. That's not an immediate solution though. W is really complicating matters for herself. Again, they could be buddy buddy by next month.

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #109 on: April 15, 2019, 12:37:18 PM »
Any chance the boys can come live with you?  W talks a lot about being worried about them in that "environment." And yet she stays away and is not there for them. Which in her current state may not be a bad thing frankly.
Me 47
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S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #110 on: April 15, 2019, 12:44:06 PM »
Watcher,

She wants to sell the house, because she hopes to get a share of sell proceeds. It is all about money. When you sell the house, the ils become the burden of the buyer? No of course, they should vacate before the new owners move in. How are they going to move out? She wants an apartment to live with you because she knows her expenses will be covered. She just does not want to keep up with her responsibilities.
Remember 2 days ago, she was telling you that you are the reason why she broke up with her parents. Have you ever asked her what does she do with her money?

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #111 on: April 15, 2019, 01:50:39 PM »
Well Watcher, She has warned you to stay away from the house.  If MIL is willing to make you lose your job then perhaps you should listen to that warning.  You need to back off a bit .  Your wife is spinning and trying to get you entangled in her mess.  Be careful on how much head space you are willing to give up.  Maybe if you tell her you will not help her remove her parents or help financially, she will back off.  Her mania must exhaust you.  I hope you can turn off your phone and get some rest once in a while.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #112 on: April 15, 2019, 03:49:29 PM »
Watcher I have to agree with Ready.

There is no "we" in this situation. This is her issue and problem. Because is "we" becomes you. Then any actions against MIL will suddenly be Watcher's plan and ideas. Not hers.
The mil already isn't concerned about you losing your job.  I'd stay a mile away from that house.
Plus like you said they will be buddy, buddy again and you will look like the bad guy.

Now today she says MIL will explode soon. Something about MIL is demanding 90 dollars from her for internet service that she paid.
Meanwhile W refuses to go home.

Is she staying with you or a friend, if she's not going home?

Again Watcher she is running away from her responsibilities.  If she paid the Internet for her then she should reimburse her at least half.  I doubt her parents use the Internet.  Sounds like it's more for the boys.

I honestly think her wanting you to sell the house is more about walking away from the utility bills, than getting rid of her parents.  I would imagine shut off notices are coming out about now.

She just can't keep ignoring those bills.

Besides really Watcher with the house in the condition it's been kept in how could you begin to get it ready to sell?
You'd almost be better walking away from the house and let it go back to the bank.

I hope you are finding some peace somewhere.  Maybe work can be your break.  Just turn off the phone.

So when are your concerts coming up?   :)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #113 on: April 15, 2019, 04:20:32 PM »
Hi Thunder, WNM, Karm, KIT.

I can't sell the house as it needs repairs and I could never show it with the 2 squatters in it. I told her that.

She spent Sat and Sun at her GF and IDK her plan for tonight. Her frame of mind changes quickly.

This is her current plan.

1) Remove her parents from the house on her own
2) get therapy to deal with this OM addiction
3) get couples therapy to deal with us
4) remain living separated until she can figure herself out. just her and the boys in the house
5) I would be free to have a relationship with the boys
6) I can make home repairs ( idk how I feel about that one)
7) She agreed with me to have no more sex with each other until we get things figured out ( the lie detector test said that is a lie) hahaha

So she didn't goto work today. She spent a lot of time at school. S18 can be on track to graduate if he attends 2 extra classes a week to meet the passing requirements. In other words, they are giving him a golden opportunity IMO.

I talked to her briefly tonight and she is all worked up on OM. It just comes out of nowhere as this is not an everyday topic. She is really angry. I guess she is just venting.

I do turn my phone off at night in order to sleep. She is angry today about OM so she is not in a playful mood and has been quiet.

I have the half marathon in Gettysburg on the 28th and the next concert is May 3rd. We were at school this morning so the gym will start tomorrow.

She has gained considerable weight. This is most likely depression along with her new taste for alcohol. Many plans involving her and her friends. This weekend she will be out with them and it is a pay weekend.

No interest in the gym nor exercise. She has money for nothing. IDK why. Not asking me for a dime. She will figure utilities out if she is on her own. Her plan is to call police on abusive mom and have her charged. She has plenty of photographic evidence. That's what she came up with on her own.

We may or may not work out Watcher. We will simply try however, if we are toxic then we are done. We will only know when my mom is gone.

Again. Too much talk. We will see.

Thanks


Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #114 on: April 15, 2019, 07:20:26 PM »
Update

The inlaws have exited our home and removed half of their belongings. S16 advised MIL said her goodbyes and asked him to open the door when she comes again because she has remaining items to claim.

W informed me that phase one has begun and she is giving them 3 days to claim the remainder of their items.

MIL informed W a few days ago that she secured a loan. W informed me that our healing can begin now. We will remain living separated but she welcomes me to spend as much time as possible with our sons.

I have always been very clear with W that I would never force myself on her nor the situation. She has as much time as she needs plus I'm in no rush myself.

She informed me that she is already in therapy with a therapist that deals in Narcissistic Recovery. She will now seek therapy to deal with her addictive behaviors as she calls it.

I can tell she is nervous but she said she is strong and is ready to face what lies ahead. She will figure out household expenditures.

OK I didn't say much. She gave me a hug. I'm not pointing things out to her but the locks will have to be changed and anything of theirs need to be discarded, especially those mattresses. We cannot leave beds in our home to invite them back.

I made no suggestions as it's still not my house nor my situation. The vehicle the inlaws took belongs to us and is registered to W. Title is in both of our names. We do have to protect ourselves. Again I made no suggestions as we will have to take it back or W can sign it over to them as old.

So an eventful/unexpected night. I got to hang out in S16 bedroom til 10pm. It's been a long time. March 2017. So I have a little smile on tonight and I'm very happy for the 3 of them and hopefully the house will be peaceful now.

I have to go buy pringles for S16 before I goto my moms house. That's what he wants.   ;D

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #115 on: April 15, 2019, 08:35:23 PM »
Well I had to wait as the snake is leaving under the cover of darkness. W is a wreck crying in her bedroom. Obviously she does not want me around however she wants me to wait until they are finished.

So this is unknown territory for me and I have no clue what to expect as tonight is just another reminder that this is her journey.

So it is an odd feeling as I'm scared. Does she have expectations of me now ? That type of scared. Like this is really unexpected. It's a whole new level of uncertainty. I have no clue what she is up to. I talked to W at 5pm and she was fired up about how she would discard the Narc.

Neither one of us expected this tonight. At 8pm she was apprehensive entering the house and by 9pm the moving began.




Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #116 on: April 16, 2019, 01:11:02 AM »
Well, that is a bit of a surprising turn of events...no wonder you feel a bit thrown by it. And your w says she is getting therapy now?
All I can suggest is to go slow, Watcher, slow enough that you do not get sucked into your w's spin cycle.
See what happens but from a little bit of distance. And tbh, the moving out of your ils is not the magic fix for everything is it? So, go slow...
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #117 on: April 16, 2019, 04:35:02 AM »
Yes be careful, It's like the end of the MLC affair not the end of the crisis.

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #118 on: April 16, 2019, 05:57:54 AM »
Hi Treasur WonderNoMore.

That's exactly how I see it. The end of the MLC affair. I always felt MIL was the OP.  W says she has to mourn now and it has nothing to do with me at this point. She was crying and visibly upset when I left last night.

This morning she called me and she was venting. She says obviously they had money and they rather spend it somewhere else rather than live a peaceful existence with her.

She says typical Narc not getting things her way so she leaves. MIL told W she just made the biggest mistake choosing me. She had parting messages for each of the boy's.

Of course W already has a million plans and ideas. Now IDK the real story. IDK how life has been in that house. Yes she is still in crisis and ,yes, the huge financial mess remains.

So W called me this morning and asked me to remove the offending mattresses. She removed the smaller items that they left behind. Now our home is empty of their belongings.  ;D

So I am at Kickboxing this morning after 20 days off. I hope this oblique works because now I really need it to.  ::)

Thanks

She also just called and wants the locks changed today if I could do her that favor.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 06:01:21 AM by Watcher »

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #119 on: April 16, 2019, 06:10:42 AM »
How are your boys, Watcher, bc I guess this is a bit of a sudden change and maybe drama fest for them too?
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #120 on: April 16, 2019, 06:23:08 AM »
"they had money and they rather spend it somewhere else rather than live a peaceful existence with her."   :o

She has to be kidding, right?  There was nothing peaceful about it.
Sounds like she just wanted them for money so they could pay the bills.  Now she's mad their leaving her to pay them and going on their merry way.  Pretty smart on their part, get away from it all.

Let's just hope Watcher, she will not now expect you to do take over their role..
Maybe this is a chance for her to learn to pay bills all by herself, with her own money.  One can hope. ::)

Enjoy the gym, hope everything feels back to normal.  :)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #121 on: April 16, 2019, 06:25:10 AM »
Treasur,

We talked to them together individually. Basically W just asked them how they felt. S16 didn't want to express his feelings. He held them in. S18 looked annoyed last night.

I stayed with S16 for awhile and he is comfortable with me. I really dont ask questions as I let them open up to me instead. S18 takes awhile with me. Both boys have been told I'm a bad guy for so many years and it's going to take them time.

I will be picking them up from school today and W dropped them off. So it will be an adjustment for all.

On top of it I still have so many issues with her. Too many conversations about what type of men she likes and what type of women I need to avoid. You know. Crisis babble.

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #122 on: April 16, 2019, 06:29:43 AM »
Watcher, maybe now they could take the school bus like real high school kids.   :)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #123 on: April 16, 2019, 07:45:36 AM »
Hi Thunder.

Yes the school bus would be nice. We had one of our bizarre conversations yesterday prior to their departure. I told her she is comfortable having sex with me and she shouldn't stay with me for sex or the kids.

I told her what I was looking for in a woman. Sex is just one element. I told her that I want a woman who wants to be with me and loves me. Not someone who is afraid to let me go.

She replied that she has no heart. I just don't have one any longer. It involved this marathon discussion about the men she is attracted to, as if, I am one of her GF's. That gets to be annoying.

She does not want me anywhere near "Hey you". Daggers. She wants her name, lol. That woman will not be my kids step mom, lol. She thinks I'm in a bubble where woman don't talk to me. "Hey you" was at school yesterday. Like I said. Daggers.

Get with her Watcher and kiss your paycheck goodbye, hahaha.

So that's why I get confused. She wants me back and says we will work on us. However, she talks about other men and cautions me about women. It really is confusing.

So I'm very aware that she is still in crisis. I'm ecstatic that the inlaws are gone. W has plans this weekend. I'm off from work and can get the 2 boys out for once.

W even told me it's going to take awhile. The boys were fed too much negativity about you Watcher. She still claims no ownership to her part at all. She is Ms. Innocent but I guess it will only come out in therapy.

Enjoy your day
Thanks
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 07:47:04 AM by Watcher »

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #124 on: April 16, 2019, 08:15:27 AM »
She talks about other men and cautions me about women. It really is confusing.

No not really Watcher, it's control.  She can do what ever she wants but don't you dare, or kiss your paycheck goodbye.
What ever that means.  ::)

You just stay in place where she wants you.   ;D

I told her that I want a woman who wants to be with me and loves me.   Good for you!

Thanks, enjoy your day too.   8)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Mortesbride

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #125 on: April 16, 2019, 08:24:11 AM »
Not already kissing your pay check goodbye?  ;D
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #126 on: April 16, 2019, 09:07:06 AM »
LOL I know Mortesbride, Thunder.

My paycheck is already being kissed goodbye but other women will make me spend it on them and take me for everything in other words. Sort of like her, lol. Therefore, my money would be diverted.

Again she is all talk. Watcher do you want to go through this sh!te again. I said no. I will just divorce you outright if there is a next time. So that's why she wants the therapy for herself.

Obviously I am hesitant on investing too much of myself into this venture because I am the one who will be hurt again. Her parents are gone, however, I dont really know the backstory. I know W gave them the silent treatment.

So I'm cautious. W mentioned, good, now I have no one looking over my shoulder 24/7. She knows I pretty much don't care what she is into. I can't care because we are not in a relationship.

She sent me her bar photos. I said nothing negative. Time will tell what this is really about. Is it financial ? Is it about partying ever weekend with her GF's and having me take care of our son's as a responsible baby sitter.

She already mentioned a road trip with her friends is planned which is fine with me,  as even when we were legit married I never put restrictions on her.

I get to hear the we are friends first line. I'm her husband but idk her definition of that term. She is into our son's at the moment and their need of a father.

She jokes around a lot but, then again, so do I. She says can't we be just friends with benefits. I call you up every 6 months for sex. She continues to be dismissive about my feelings and what I experienced and it shouldn't be a joke.

So the gym return went well today. 1,000+ calories and the oblique was fine, however I could see it getting injured again if I go too hard at every class. It's still lingering in the background a bit.

Thanks







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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #127 on: April 16, 2019, 09:25:26 AM »
Well I didn't see this coming. I am happy the in-laws are gone. And I am happy you are being cautious. You know her better than anyone and you know the "real" her. Keep focusing on you and your boys. It's all you can do.
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #128 on: April 16, 2019, 02:32:35 PM »
Hi KIT,

Well I picked the 2 boys up at school and they were fine. Talked to the both of them with no problem. Went to our home afterwards where W met us as she was finished early.

She basically wants me to stay in my lane with the inlaws. They are my parents Watcher and therefore I will handle it. Do not engage them. They were here earlier gathering more belongings and MIL was irate and taunting. I just left as I was alone.

Just a nasty vile woman who loves to attack. She lost, for sure, and it shows. I'm not saying I won anything as there is nothing to win. I'm just glad they are gone.

W was displeased a bit with me. After calming down she says someone needs to be the tough one now and then I guess. She likes the silent treatment, however they have keys to our home and why should we put up with taunting.

I will let her do it her way because thats they way she wants to handle matters.

W says the locks need to be changed. Meanwhile W threw out a lot of our old stuff and packed up more of her parents stuff. Basically a spring cleaning. Made a quick dinner for the boys and even offered me food.

Again talking is no problem for us. We took S16 for a haircut and soon we are off to a school function tonight.

The house is quiet. The boys seem to have adjusted quite well and S16 is actually very happy. I met S18 first at school. LOL I was the only parent waiting outside the door like they are 5 years old. I had to let them know where  I was parked.

Next time they know where to meet me so I don't embarass them.  Meanwhile S18 stood there, not mortified, and talked to me while we waited for S16.

The boys are happy. Maybe they are always happy. IDK. W keeps saying these boys are never like this. They are happy because you are here Watcher.

So we will see.

Offline Whyus

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #129 on: April 16, 2019, 10:33:03 PM »
She says can't we be just friends with benefits. I call you up every 6 months for sex.
Yes she can but it works both ways Watcher which means that you can call her up every 6 days for sex  ;D, Nice  ;)

Seriously, it all sounds quite good but there are still red flags flying everywhere, especially talking about the men she likes and "hey you" (I like her).
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Online Treasur

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #130 on: April 16, 2019, 10:46:28 PM »
I get the sense - maybe wrongly - that some bit of you is waiting in a way to decide what to do based on what she does. Which makes sense in a way. But also gives her a lot of control and of course she is someone who changes her mind and pretty much (from what you describe) only cares about her needs, thoughts and feelings.

If you start with the concrete stuff, the basic stuff like money, where/how you live, being a parent (and ignore the relationship/emotion stuff for a moment), what do YOU want Watcher? I have often been unsure of if you have a plan or one that is not dependent on your w blinking first in a kind of chess game. What is your plan about some of the basic stuff? Maybe not how to get there, but where you are trying to get? NC was/is your superpower in a way and you are great at it, but imho if you have no plan now, it will leave your w with all the control and you will be constantly cutting your life cloth to keep up with her mood?
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 10:49:20 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

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Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #131 on: April 17, 2019, 06:05:44 AM »
Hi Treasur, Whyus.

LOL, this whole thing is a Red Flag until she gets help. I wanted back into my sons lives and now here it is for me. Last night S16 was in a Lentin play at school. They had simple supper in the cafeteria that her and I attended.

She made a point on the drive over that maybe "hey you" would be there so thats really rubbing her the wrong way. I will have to put that woman in her place Watcher she said with a smile.

It was prob our 1st event together in the school. She mentioned again how she feels like she has been away for so long.

We walked the school grounds afterwards and she mentioned how she likes me and enjoys being around me. She mentioned the whole I have no heart thing and I'm unable to be in a relationship at this moment with anyone.

She mentioned she broke things off with me in Nov because of OM. So I told her how many more times are we going to break things off because of OM. Do we spend the rest of our lives living this way because of OM ?

So I said nothing has changed. Why will it be different now this time. She says it's an ongoing battle for her.


Other than that we get along fine. We behave like a husband and wife with the bizarre caveat that she is still hooked on another man who is no threat to me.

The parents were always hurdle #1 and they just left so IDK how I feel. She is still very controlling and needy and just needs me. Please don't leave me (divorce).

I believe I've been incredibly understanding listening to her and supporting her but I can't do this forever. So the parents have been dealt with and W is in therapy for Narc abuse. That's all good.

Like she said, she has to get to the bottom of this OM nonsense already. She says there is more to the story but then again can I really believe anything from her.

I had a wonderful day with our sons yesterday. I'm looking forward to seeing them this weekend. The boys are happy and I'm happy so thats where I'm at.

As for her. Hmm, she is affectionate. She doesn't say "I Love You". I don't know if I need her to say it. I'm alone with her alot and it's not all a mania being used session.

She is there but this storm is constantly raging. I listen and I don't pass any judgements. She is a woman who has a ton of issues and its going to take a lot of therapy and time.

Enjoy your day
Thanks

Offline Whyus

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #132 on: April 17, 2019, 06:21:59 AM »
She made a point on the drive over that maybe "hey you" would be there so thats really rubbing her the wrong way. I will have to put that woman in her place Watcher she said with a smile.
You mean that she is going to take "hey you" and put her on your lap?  ;D (sorry couldnt resist (but she should be on your lap)) only Joking, maybe!

It all sounds good watcher but just be careful, im glad that you and your Boys are happy mate  :)
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. W is trying to get People to accept them.
2 Sons - 19 & 20
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #133 on: April 17, 2019, 06:52:51 AM »
Watcher, I'm just curious, what happened when you ran into Hey You, that made her suspicious of her?
Did you guys talk?  Or is she just sensing something there?
I think women are pretty good at sensing that stuff.

Which isn't necessarily bad in your case, she needs to see you can also get interest from other women.

It's a 2 way street.  Friends w/bennies doesn't make you in a relationship.   It makes you friends who hook up once in awhile.  Right?   ;D

So any gym today?
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #134 on: April 17, 2019, 07:53:43 AM »
Hi Thunder, Whyus.

"Hey you" just said hello Watcher with her big beautiful smile and eyes. Yes she stood out and W immediately did not like it. Yesterday I was at the school, talking to W on phone, and another female started saying hello. Who is that Watcher ?

I was left alone for 4 years at the school. I know people now. She is now concerned about a blonde woman from last night who said hello to me. 3 school encounters, 3 different women and now she is concerned. I know maybe 30 more women at school.

"Hey you" gets under her skin because she knows that is exactly what I find attractive in a woman. Remember I know everything about her already. Meanwhile W spent a good deal of time discrediting her. No job, no education, only wants ur money, bla, bla, bla.

Yes, exactly, W only wants me to be her friend with benefits. She doesn't want to share me. "Hey you" is Hispanic. W is Hispanic. W will not accept it. She says I must choose a white woman. Hahahaha.....

All that being said Thunder, she is petrified that I'm leaving and I know she will be devastated if I do leave her.

Her crisis is still ongoing. Her financial state is really the only thing that scares me. I dont care about her online behavior or her real life friends. I entertain the OM nonsense because there is really nothing for me to be angry about.

My only issue with OM is she will use it as an excuse again to break things off with me. Now if that includes taking access to the boys away again then I think that will be it for me.

I can't keep screwing around with their emotions. So we will see. Today is only day #2 post inlaws departure and her life alone in the house. She says I am her husband all the time, she just can't be in an relationship with me.

However, she enjoys spending time with me, spending time in the bedroom, and my involvement with our sons. I guess we will see how long it can last.

As for her crisis who knows when she will make the necessary changes. She is still in it for sure.

Yes I just finished kickboxing and the oblique is fine. So that was day #2 and I'm confident that it will be fine moving forward.

Thanks

Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #135 on: April 17, 2019, 08:05:37 AM »
She says I must choose a white woman. Hahahaha.....

Oh funny.  You can't have someone you are attracted to, though.   ;D
Competition maybe? 
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline karmirtsaghik

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #136 on: April 17, 2019, 08:22:21 AM »
Your wife is a master of double standards, Watcher. Her colleagues (especially the male colleague) is talking porn and introducing sex toys to her, she constantly speaks of OM and posts on-line explicit content, but all of a sudden "hey you" is a problem?

Does she know what "friends with benefits" really mean? It means open relationship, with potential other "friends with benefits".  I guess there will be lots of "benefits."

I wish you lots of patience.

Offline Wonder no more

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #137 on: April 17, 2019, 08:28:25 AM »
Watcher,
 I'm glad you have access to your sons.  Some positive movement there.  I am surprised to hear her say she is in therapy.  Do you see any evidence of this?  I ask because it seemed to come up so quickly. Or do you think she is just saying this to keep you happy or the fact it was one of your things you wanted to hear from her.  Everything happened so quickly, the parents gone and her in therapy.  I think it's great just be careful.  Your wife's issues will not disappear overnight.  Your are right to worry about your boy's emotions.  I'm sure they must be a bit confused and not sure this will last.  I too worry with her money problems that she may go back to mommy's money for help.  Keep doing what you are doing, keep your independence and don't let your wife suck you back in too much too fast. Remember you can't fix her emotionally or financially.  Hugs,  best of luck to you.

Online readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #138 on: April 17, 2019, 08:54:33 AM »
Hello,

Quote
She says I am her husband all the time, she just can't be in an relationship with me.

This is definitely confusing.

Quote
My only issue with OM is she will use it as an excuse again to break things off with me. Now if that includes taking access to the boys away again then I think that will be it for me.

The only concern I have is that when you were NC, you were in control. You were focused on you and your life.

Now you are making decisions based upon the actions/reactions of your MLCer.

My question is "What is your goal?" "What is your end result?"

You are the rational thinker. You are the only adult in this situation. Can't get away from that. Your boys and your own sanity depend on it.

I wish I could tell you from my situation some basic advice, or give feedback, but this is past me. I can't go back into my memory bank and pull back any experience that I can relate to your current situation.

Keep posting and I wish you the best,

Ready

"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Offline Mortesbride

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #139 on: April 17, 2019, 11:42:39 AM »


Yes, exactly, W only wants me to be her friend with benefits. She doesn't want to share me. "Hey you" is Hispanic. W is Hispanic. W will not accept it. She says I must choose a white woman. Hahahaha.....


Maybe Watcher wants to join the Skittles brigade and taste the rainbow now that he is a free man.  ;)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #140 on: April 17, 2019, 01:29:45 PM »
Hi Thunder, Karm, Ready, WonderNoMore, Mortesbride.

I took 3 days off from her and then Monday hit which took the both of us by surprise. Its incredibly too soon. I don't see any evidence of therapy WNM.

Last night S16 had a school function and I went with it and I'm back to work 2-10 for the remainder of the week starting today.

She asked me to change the locks today and I did. Yesterday MIL stormed over screaming criminal to me for the neighbors to hear so I departed. They should have all their stuff now.

I picked up the boys from school today and their break is now in session so they have off all next week. She came home early so I just dropped them off at home and departed.

I still have all my events scheduled and I will continue to plan more for myself as she has pulled the carpet out from under me too many times before.

The only major difference is the parents are gone. MIL is really unhinged. Without a doubt this ends if they are ever allowed back in our home.

Like I said financially I am scared of W. A complete headache. W keeps saying MIL was verbally abusing S16. I haven't asked him. I just question why the parents just up'd and left. It doesn't make sense to me.

My plan is to continue to live my life and sprinkle my sons into the picture. As for her she is one confused mess. She likes hanging out with me.  ::)

If we buy into the abuse angle then it's time for her to be left alone. Its finally just her and the kids and she doesn't need me around to cause any stress.

I see what she is and she is definitely not relationship material. She is still controlling me or trying to micro manage me and I told her so yesterday.

She did catch herself at one point for being so smothering because that just pushes me away. Hopefully things will settle down now for a few days.

It will be all good until something doesn't go her way IMO.

I have a lot of gym to catch up on now because of the oblique situation. So that's my focus for the remainder of the week.

Thanks


Offline Thunder

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #141 on: April 17, 2019, 01:52:29 PM »
Watcher, may I suggest you ask the boys not to let the in laws in the house unless one of you is home.

Your mil loudly calling you a criminal proves how completely angry and unhinged she is and not to be trusted for a second.  She is dying to call the police on you, don't give her the chance.
Maybe stay away until things calm down.

It is odd how they all of a sudden moved out after all this time, and apparently not happy about it.
Who knows the whole story.

Enjoy your time back at the gym.   :)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #142 on: April 17, 2019, 02:09:20 PM »
Very true Thunder,

Who really knows the backstory. Yes, I gave them that speech today and also added they are never to give them their house keys. I'm not going to keep changing the locks. This is only a one time deal.

Now, being that they no longer live there, I'm pretty sure I can get her into some serious trouble if I ever see her inside the home. It just cannot be allowed.

Now that they are out, it must remain that way and the boys do have to do their part. W is selling me on S16 being her next victim and it was already underway, so that will be my angle with the PD if it comes to it.

W was angry with me yesterday because I engaged her mom. Well the woman just brushed right past me as she barged into the house. W wants me to stay in my lane regarding the parents, however, as a homeowner I'm not putting up with these people coming and going as they please and walking away with anything they want.

W wanted the new locks and they are now in place. It's up to her and the boys to defend their peace of mind. I did my part.

Every series of contact pushes me further. If they ever make their way back in our home, I will file for divorce immediately. I waited forever for this to happen and I will not go backwards.

So MLCer better know what she is doing.

Thanks


Online WatcherTopic starter

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Re: BURNING MAN 6
« Reply #143 on: Today at 11:03:33 AM »
The boys are off from school for break so I saw them after W departed. She asked if I had plans with them. S18 was up first at 8am and I asked if he wanted to go get breakfast and he said yes. So I woke up S16 who also said yes.

8am for teenagers is a miracle on their day off. S18 and I  have been bonding now for 3 days. I've always had a hard time with him. S16 is no problem. He is a goofball.

The Diner for 3 is a bit more expensive than the Diner for one.  ::) It's a bit cold so we walked around the mall afterwards and did a little shopping.

We spent about 4 hours together and S16 went straight back to bed when we arrived home. They are happy and S18 is looking good.

I talked to her on the phone last night. She talked to S18 and says he might be depressed over the inlaws. S18 replied to her, what's done is done. I don't think he is depressed. All the arguing and banging on doors is over.

They don't have to hear their mom being called ugly names. Counting Monday I've had 4 days seeing my sons. It's very nice just to say hello, good morning, see you tomorrow, and knowing that there will be a tomorrow. It's simple and, yet, the only thing I wanted.

Last night she called me and asked, ok, what happened to my husband. What did you do with him ? I'm being serious Watcher. How did you change ? Why did you change ?  I gave her my answer.  ;D

She has caught herself a few times and says that she is controlling me and apologizes. She says she is working on it. With the addition of the new locks yesterday, she stayed home and cooked dinner, cleaned the house, did laundry.

She sent me the photos. Her gameplan is to cook for the boys when she comes home from work. She says she finally feels safe at home.

A few texts and a couple of calls throughout the day and we haven't seen each other since Tuesday night at school I believe.

We continue to be friendly. She is stressing a bit about her bills but I just listen.

Oh the dog is in love with me. I buy her the proper food and she is very thankful. I'm the love of her life. Hahaha.

I work late the next 2 nights so no physical contact which is fine for the both of us. Yes, she still makes her outlandish sexual comments. Not as bad, however I definitely hear about it when she is in the mood.

She has had a couple of funny lines.

So right now it's just work and then the gym tomorrow morning. I have nothing scheduled for this weekend. Everything really starts next weekend and my May is pretty full.

Enjoy your day
Thanks


 

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