[Bewildered survivor]

This is an interesting discussion.

I have a couple points or questions. One about age and the other about other factors involving prolonged affair.

There’s lots about what caused MLC & it being about age (as well as other factors=perfect storm) & replay being about going back in time to redo. My MLCer hit 40 & went nuts- BD was 7 months after his 40th birthday. Although brewing way before then. He never ever mentioned anything about aging or showed any classic signs of issues with his age- but then he was never a talker. He didn’t really act younger & his changes were more about things like his opinions, likes & dislikes etc. He is now with a much older woman- not a younger one. So although the very classic affair down not the stereotypical younger woman. Although she does not act her age. Her mentality is much younger- so perhaps she’s going through MLC at 50 herself. He is acting much younger now- but I don’t see him to know. I can just tell from what girls say & through legal correspondence. So although Ow is much older, is AD to the max- I really can’t see his mother in her. So what is her purpose? Was it just that she was available?

My other question is- if family accept and enable the affair- does it last longer? I’ve just heard Ow has met the rest of extended family & been accepted as my replacement. Although I almost cringe for his parents as either they are blind or just putting up or clearly have no morals!! It’s pretty cringe worthy as she’s sooo unacceptable. I think they’re making it easier for the both of them to carry on as if it’s the most normal thing in the world. I personally think if the MLCer behaviours (ow) is enabled it’s just like if a drug adult is enabled by being given money for drugs. It feeds the problem. So until his family say no we are not going to pretend it’s all ok & enable you anymore- we are going to do what’s best for you & face the consequences of you hating us...the affair will take much longer to breakdown and therefore prolong & hinder the crisis.

[megogirl]

Was it just that she was available?

Per RCR, it was that she was "willing."  (Although, I suppose that means the same thing?! idk)

Everything you just said is right on the $$$.....the parents DO enable the MLC'er.  Like, to have an affair and to blow up the family unit is totally "normal."   

I believe that at first, they're completely mortified - along with everyone else - but eventually acclimate to everything their MLC'er does. 

They slowly review *your* actions over the course of the marriage, and then make *you* out to be the villain.  Because there's no way that their offspring could POSSIBLY commit such heinous acts!  More projection, but now even worse - because their projection IS enabling their MLC'er to continue with all of their bull$h!te!   

Just my 2 cents xxx

[Anjae]

Bewildered, it is possible not all MLCers for whom the issue is age related will talk about it. They may show it in their actions. Mr J did not mentioned it before he left, but after BD when OW1 was made public. His famous "I only have now to do this". This was never explained. OW? DJing? Lead a life without me? Something else? All of those? For a little while after BD he also used to say "Now I need to do this, when it is over we will go back to be a couple and lead out life. Just the two of us". By then, among angry monster and MLC crazy, he had some awareness that whatever "this" that he only had now to do was temporary. Now turned into 13 years and he is nowhere being done with Replay. He is not even near his pre-BD and right after BD self.

OW/OM is not always younger. It can be the MLCer's age or older. There are others here whose alienator is older than the MLCer. I don't know why some MLCer go for someone much younger, others for people about their age and some for older people. Aside from the ones who go for much younger people, it may not have to do with the alienator's age, but more, like in your husband's case, the person's mentality/way of being. Your husband's OW can be going through MLC herself. It is not unusual for two MLCers to get together. Or it can't just the way she is. Hard to know.

... if family accept and enable the affair- does it last longer?

Very good question. I don't know. Mr J's family was welcoming of both OW1 and OW2. OW1 did not last long in the open, OW2 lasted 10 years. Was it because Mr J's family was welcoming or was it because of the nature of their relationship? I don't know. It could be said Mr J's OWs are acceptable. Highly educated, professional, well behaved women (in the sense they are not drunks, addicts, smokers, hell raisers, etc.). FIL was a philanderer and had a steady OW. MIL never liked it. Mr J detested it. SIL didn't like it, but accepted it. That may explain why his family was accepting. It may also be Mr J sold them, as well as to OW1 and OW2 a pack of lies as MLCers often do.

Families hardly ever say they are no longer going to accept the affair. They do not want to lose their son/daughter. In Mr J's case, especially with OW2 who lasted so long, it wouldn't make much sense for his family to say they were no longer accept it. We were separated when she come along.

[KeepItTogether]

I think if the FOO accepts OW/OM, it might prolong things because it may prolongs the MLCer reaching rock bottom. They are living their shiny new life and everyone seems totally fine with it, so YAY--they made the right decision. But I don't think they can carry this on forever. If they still have issues...even after they are "released" from the LBS and then the FOO accepts the new person in their lives, and yet they are still unhappy? So what now? What is the next thing to bring about happiness now?

In my own experience, H is living a whole new life. New friends. New family. Everything is 180 different than what we had. But, OW pulls all the strings. H literally lives 100% in her world now. Which is what he did with his mother prior to me. And then when we were married there was a power struggle and he never got comfortable with it. So I acquiesced and did things with his family b/c he lacked the strength to oppose them. Even for silly things--like on Christmas for example--we had to spend 3 days celebrating Christmas with his family b/c it was their "tradition." Never mind the fact that I had a family too and maybe wanted to spend time with them. He could never articulate this to his mother. Never really grew up. Is he doing that now? Maybe. Or maybe he is just being the person he is and lacks the strength and judgment to get out of that situation.  I never wanted the role of telling him what to do every step of the way. But I also never actually TOLD him what to do.  Maybe he isn't and never will be strong enough to do that for himself. In this relationship with OW, he does what he is told.  Maybe that is how he likes it. And if that is the case, we ere never meant to be anyway. So maybe MLC is more for the benefit of the LBS....to get away from a person who will never grow up.  orrrrr, again, maybe now he is with OW, to tell his mother that he is now doing WHAT HE WANTS, and has completely abandoned all FOO traditions in favor of OW. 

Just rambling. But I find it strange that he could so easily give up everything for her, when he could never break himself away from his family for 2 hours for me b/c it would upset his mother. Then again, I never made him choose.

[Anon]

I’ve just heard Ow has met the rest of extended family & been accepted as my replacement.

This was difficult for me too, when my h's ow started going to see friends and family with the ow.   I think though, for the most part, it's an uneasy thing for many of them.   From what I've heard, his ow is not that likeable or personable so they could be scratching their heads wondering why he would give up me for her.   I also believe for the most part that they are appalled at his adulterous abandoning ways and despite putting their best face forward, I think most of them disapprove but without saying anything about it.   I think they are just trying to make the best of a bad situation. 

Does acceptance from families prolong their R?    Perhaps for awhile,, but not indefinitely.   All the family support in the world won't be able to stop their R from eventually going over the cliff as most mlc relationships do. 

[Anon]

So maybe MLC is more for the benefit of the LBS....to get away from a person who will never grow up.  orrrrr, again, maybe now he is with OW, to tell his mother that he is now doing WHAT HE WANTS, and has completely abandoned all FOO traditions in favor of OW.

   This is good KIT.   I have often thought that my life has improved in ways it wouldn't have if there was no MLC.   Tough for me I had to find this out the hard way but at least I found it out eventually.   

[Sunandshade]

I really think many if not most of our spouses are being taken for a ride. Yes they made the choices leading to being under the control of some real psychos, yes they were vulnerable and if you can bear it, deserve compassion, the damage is certainly magnified by the OW (i’m Not sure how the dynamics differ with an OM so I won’t speculate)z. The only growth/achievement is gaining the insight and strength to escape.

[Penelope2018]

I find merit in both Barbies and Anjae's posts regarding the reason for the affair. I know my xh fretted about losing hair for a long time before BD. He would put all kinds of creams and chemicals on his head and sleep with a hair bag on it at night. Seemed to take 100's of supplements too and none of them worked because as I told him, it seemed to be genetic. A lot of people in his family have thin hair or hair that falls out a lot, men and women. That went on for several years before he started lazing about on the couch for hours and hours, sometimes all night watching TV. I knew something was wrong with him but he denied it. Then he got the bright idea to start another business that was destined to fail but I was cooperative because I knew this was a last-ditch effort for him to look successful in front of his family, which wouldn't have mattered anyway because they will never see him like that. It doesn't matter if he makes a million dollars a year and owns 100 houses, he will always be a failure/less than in their eyes. I've known it for a long time but he won't accept it. A year passed and when it was obvious the business had failed, my grandmother died (who he was close to) and bam, the affair started.

Was the affair because he thought he was getting old and trying to recapture his youth? Or was it because he was looking for someone like his parents who OW is similar to in some ways? From reading their texts, she uses religion as a tool for manipulation. His mother does the same thing. Omg, I can't believe I am doing this. I'm a good God-fearing girl, you're a bad man, you're using me. You're going to go to Hell. She'd throw religion into their arguments every few days. Yeah cause he forced her to date him, a married man, sleep in hotels rooms with him, give her money, pay her rent, go on vacations, mm-hm. And his mother is actually 10x worse. He's a bad son. Always been a bad son. Never listens to his parents. Going to go to hell if he doesn't start praying. Does he even believe in God anymore? Oh yeah, I need 3000 dollars for cousin so and so's wedding, random cousin's school fees, gift for maid's uncle  . Just nonsense. His dad does the same but not as harshly or as often and he's never financially abusive. OW also mostly talks about herself, the same as his mother. Her conversations start and end with something about her, usually one of her illnesses. She never feels good she says which I found out she has gonorrhea so I guess that may be true. She also threatened to commit suicide twice if he left her. Just an all-around nutjob. His mother calls and talks about not feeling good for hours. Takes about 20 meds a day and abuses sleeping pills. Xfil and their other sons have complained about the sleeping pill usage multiple times but she won't stop using them. So she and OW are similar in that regard as well.

Extremely self-centered people. His family will definitely not accept OW and for sure not his father. His older bro already knows what happened and said no. Xfil doesn't speak to his middle son's wife because he didn't approve of their marriage either and that was 15 years ago. He said she was a bad girl and came from a bad family. They live in the same house too. And she's the same one who helped xh have his affair so I guess xfil was right. Crazy house! But anyway, sometimes I think she hinders him. She knows when to lay it on thick. If he seems like he's pulling away she immediately talks about feeling like dying, no one loves her, her father has never loved her, her family thinks she ran away, she has nowhere to go, please don't ever leave her! Sometimes I think he needs this. He needs to be dragged through the mud and realize the grass isn't greener on the other side. Let him ruin himself financially, earn the scorn of most of his family members and look like an utter fool. Maybe when that's too much to handle he'll pull himself out of the gutter.

[Bewildered survivor]

I’ve just heard Ow has met the rest of extended family & been accepted as my replacement.

This was difficult for me too, when my h's ow started going to see friends and family with the ow.   I think though, for the most part, it's an uneasy thing for many of them.   From what I've heard, his ow is not that likeable or personable so they could be scratching their heads wondering why he would give up me for her.   I also believe for the most part that they are appalled at his adulterous abandoning ways and despite putting their best face forward, I think most of them disapprove but without saying anything about it.   I think they are just trying to make the best of a bad situation. 

Does acceptance from families prolong their R?    Perhaps for awhile,, but not indefinitely.   All the family support in the world won't be able to stop their R from eventually going over the cliff as most mlc relationships do.

I wish I could be privy to people’s real thoughts about OW. It would stop me from monkey braining.

All I get is snippets of what is seen by my kids. And that is apparently she was at ease in his massive family & people spoke to her. Doesn’t make her likeable I guess & im sure more people would have been thinking WTF & he’s making a fool out if himself. Wish I could hear that as it’s what I need right now.

So another thought on what prolongs the crisis with ow....In my situation it’s me. Regardless of trying to remove myself from it- it seems their relationship thrives off the conflict with me. So H keeps creating the conflict and draws me back in when it gets quite whilst OW fuels and feeds it. That relationship seems to all be about how they team up against me- through all the legal
stuff and kids stuff. So until I remove myself completely (which I’m desperately trying to do) the relationship continues and process of crisis is prolonged.

[Not Applicable]

There seem to be three main excuses that people make here to avoid the reality of their spouse being with the ow:
1. She is helping him solve his issues and therefore there is some benefit
2. She controls him and therefore it isn't his fault.
3. You're better than her/she's mentally ill so at least I can feel superior.

You can tell yoursef whatever you want but I think in the end if you really have true compassion for your spouse then none of the above matter..