Author Topic: My Story Beauty into Beast 13  (Read 2227 times)

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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My Story Beauty into Beast 13
« on: June 12, 2019, 11:14:56 AM »
Wow guys already on thread 13...what insanity. I think a long time ago for some reason I thought thread 21 would stick out. Getting pretty close!

Previous Thread is:
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10835.new#new

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Update:
Well as many of you know today was the day of my Exam. I think it will be my final Exam on my way to my Bs(Hon) degree. Next year is a research project, so I don't think it has one. I was completely stressed out my nut last night, worrying that I hadn't revised enough. In all honestly I only finished the module reading materials 2 days before. I then had one night to create summary sheets, reminds myself of formulas etc.  :-\

I got an early night, and Beast came over at 7:30 am. He was moody and stressing about what to feed the kids, needed a car seat, and wasn't sure about times. ::) I ended up showing him the times on the board, offering breakfast ideas, and just headed out. Didn't have time to deal with it this morning as I had to get a train.

Now let me just add in total between walking to the train station, then from the train station to the test centre...then back again...I ended up walking about 12 km today. So physically a bit knackered.  :o

Anyway managed to get to the test centre, look over my exam summary sheets a bit, and then went in for the test. I am feeling pretty confident because everything I had reviewed was in there! No odd balls were thrown in. I think I might have lost 10 points max so I am feeling pretty darn pleased. I might just have made a Distinction if I am lucky.  ;D

I also got lucky that it was raining. It sucked because I had to walk in it, but I wanted it to rain so that son's sports day would be cancelled and rescheduled. It would have been the first school event I would have missed because of my exam. So I consider both those a return of good Karma.  :D

Anyway I made it back home just before school pick up times. When I got in Beast was chatting asking how it went, and when I walk into the kitchen I noticed he has bought some groceries. All the basic staples, breakfast stuff, kids snack stuff, ham... I never asked him to do this obviously so it was a nice surprise. In all honesty it was a big help as funds were running low with all the travel and such happening right now. I was genuinely grateful at the gesture, almost teary, and I ended up saying thank you and we hugged. I am not sure if I initiated or he did but...it felt right so whatever. ::)

After he collected the kids from school and we went bowling as planned. He paid for everyone, and then bought us soda's as well. To be honest it is unlike him to be so free with his money. I don't know if it is because he has gotten a bit more money, if it is a guilt thing because he is away this weekend, or if he is just being nice. Either way I appreciate it.

We had fun at the bowling. I won the first game, then middle son won the second game. Everyone seemed to really enjoy it, and it was the first time I have been since before BD.

Afterwards it was back home, and he chatted a little bit before needing to get off as it was getting late (he had already been here 12 hours :o). Out he went, I went in to make dinner...then he came back because he forgot something, and gave everyone a round of hugs...this time I got the one armed shuffle hug that he initiated.  ::)

We won't see him again until after his festival. In the rain. In a tent for the first time. He claims just him and BIL, but I know she is going. ::) Whatever. I am sure there will be fun moments, and I am kind of sad that I have never been to a festival, and he is going to his first one with someone else...but also...I know there is going to be a LOT of b!tc#ing and complaining. I won't be missing that. :P His OCD is going to go mental, the tent will likely get soaked and muddy, assuming he figures out how to put it up...and then you got a 16 year old complaining, and 20 something year old girlfriend to entertain who doesn't like the music, and then you...the happiest guy on Earth.  ::)

So overall feeling elated and like a weight is lifted now that my nights aren't confined to study.

Feeling good that I probably got a decent result even though I was really struggling to finish the workload....

Happy I didn't miss son's school day.

Slightly sad about missing out on a new experience with Beast.

Happy I don't have to experience all the moaning and complaining.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline sachat3

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2019, 12:08:37 PM »
Staying with you Morte
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Offline Thunder

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2019, 02:19:40 PM »
I'm glad you sounded pretty confident about test.   ;D
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Milly

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2019, 03:11:10 PM »
Morte, you are a star! You are such an amazing girl! Well done a thousand times! You see, I am your other mother!

Reading how you only finished your reading work a couple of days ago and still had to do so much and then how long you had to walk, in the rain, just to get there, my gosh, I know it's just a regular LBS day, but you were taking an exam at the end of that day, with 3 little kids you've been taking care of the whole time, I'm just in awe.

I'm so glad karma arrived at the station on time and allowed for you to not miss your S's sport's day. Oh, for those little wins!

Love also that Beast did the shopping, paid for bowling, and gave you the shuffle hug. Maybe he paid for everything because he was feeling happy. A wet tent, mass public toilets, noise, cold, damp, hmmmm where's the hotel? You're not missing out on this one, Morte. If your H comes back one day, you will do the camping or the concert night, but it will be comfortable and you will both love it.

Hope you get some sleep time tomorrow and maybe a bottle of flush pink Prosecco. If I were there, I would get you one!
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2019, 06:31:54 PM »
Hello,

Congrats all around.  Nice job on test. Just one small 2X4

Quote
I might just have made a Distinction if I am lucky.  ;D

On HS, you have already passed with distinction!

Very nice job with Beast. I think it is such a noce win for you and the kids to have a fun evening together. I am hoping for rain and a lightening strike that takes out all of Princess Skittles toenails and gives her a permanent curl that only a witch would die for!

Have a nice quiet evening and congratulations again.

((((Ready)))))
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Offline barbiedoll

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2019, 07:16:21 PM »
Nice job Morte , on the exam. You are indeed a version of wonder women !.

I remember something you wrote a long ( long) time ago. You talked about never forgiving or accepting Beast having an affair. EVER. I remember you being very adamant .  This was before you discovered his baby OW. Then for whatever reason, once the OW was discovered , your reaction was not as you imagined. How do you feel about all that now?  I am just wondering if you believe you could or would attempt to rebuild your marriage , given his "affair".  I believe you are "standing", so the question is odd I guess, but given your former feelings about it, what has changed in that regard? 
Married April 1985
5 children
Bomb Drop April 2013
Thrown out of house August 2013
Affair discovered November 2013 (i guessed who)
Home December 3 2013
The Journey Of Reconciliation .. is for the brave .

Anger is like a candle in the wind ... it blows out the light of all reason.

Offline Whyus

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2019, 11:01:13 PM »
Firstly, Congratulations Morte, we knew that you would totally own your Exam and you seem to have done just that.
To what Barbie asked, I think that is the most natural reaction in the world. I was ALWAYS of the mindset "if my Partner cheats on me then im done, I could not live with it". About an hour after finding out about OM I started to think differently, it was that quick. Thoughts like "why throw away 20+ years because of a couple of months BS?", all These crazy thoughts which are probably LBS script or we wouldnt be here.

Its something you can only understand if you have been there and first Hand experience of being dumped like an old T Shirt .
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. W is actually getting People to accept/Tolerate them.
2 Sons - 19 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline Music45

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2019, 11:47:46 PM »
Well done you. On all of it!
Me: 51
H: 51
S:26 D:19 [They're his kids. I'm Step Mum. They both live with us - though D at Uni]
BD: April 2016
Many false returns.
Effectively moved out Nov 2017 [works away from home. Home occasional weekends]
Moved out full time: July 2018 after he renewed contact with OW.
OW: old school friend lives 200+ miles away.

Offline Silver

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2019, 12:54:31 AM »
Following along Morte. Congrats for the exam. I remember the relief as I finished my studies in 2017 (which lasted almost 10 years total  :o ::))
Remember to party a little  :)

"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2019, 02:18:08 AM »
Wow guys thanks for all the love and support.  8)

Milly- Thanks Cyber mom! ;D It was definitely a struggle doing it all, but the giant study weight is lifted now for a good while, so I can focus on other things. Nothing feels better than that right now.
Maybe he did pay for everything because he was feeling happy. I don't really know. It was certainly odd for him to be so forthcoming so we shall see. I have always wanted to go camping, the kids keep telling me not a chance...sigh. One day.  ::)

Ready- LBS Distinction huh! Wow.. wonder if we will have a class reunion?! It would be entertaining to see her hair frizz up. But then again all she would be is fuzzy hair and a grin of teeth. That might be quiet frightening to look at.  :o  Kind of like those things from the Stephen King movie.

Barbie- What an interesting question. I was very line in the sand about the physical part of the affair. At the time it felt like....a breaking of something only we shared? Giving himself to someone in a way that only we had shared if that makes sense? I felt like them being physical would shatter our connection. I thought that was the only possible thing in this world that could. I had only had one previous relationship to Beast. I thought a physical affair was the worst thing you could do to a person. It is cowardly, deceitful, and I can't comprehend the 'need' to cheat. I know after I found out it had become a PA I actually could not look at him. I did not want him to touch me. It was literally like he was covered in a germ sheet. Physically repulsed me. I had to get rid of our old family car because I knew she had been in it. And to be honest, if he ever offered me a ride in the toy car today I would never accept it. In my mind she is so disgusting I do not want to be touched by anything of hers. I know that seems silly, she is just a person, she isn't the one who did it...but its like...I don't want to be contaminated by her. :P

Anyway, I then researched, and researched and read...and listened to my gut. I knew this was something bigger than 'my husband had an affair'. This is so much larger and more complex then that. There are a few technicalities....technically he was 'out of the house' before he slept with her. I do not have to worry that he slept with her, then slept with me. Also there is some part of me that makes an allowance for the fact that I was his first relationship, he had never been with another woman...I guess deep down I was always afraid that might become a problem down the line (for any man in that situation)...and perhaps that played a part in all of this. None of this excuses what he has done, but...it does paint shades of grey that might make forgiveness attainable.

The biggest lesson I learned in this regard is 'sex' was not what our connection was ever about. I believed sex with another person would break our connection. I was absolutely sure that the sharing of yourself with another would severe the tie. I am not going to lie that it didn't hurt like a mother firetrucker. That I was physically repulsed by him for at least a year. That I am not sure how I will be able to face being naked in front of him...knowing he could be comparing me to her. But regardless of all that...the connection never shattered. As much as I wished it would at times. Something deeper ties us together and I don't even know what it is.

At this moment in time I am ''standing'' but not still. I am not ''waiting for him'', I am ''going with the flow''. I am moving forward with the things I need to make mine and the kids life better, but I am not actively looking for another person. I do miss having one, but...if I am honest I still love Beast and all I would do is compare them to him. That isn't fair to anyone.

I think I have written before and always known...that Beast will come back. I think the question in my mind has always been...will I still be here and do I have the capacity to forgive him?

Most people who have hurt me in my life...are no longer in my life. No exceptions. Until Beast. Perhaps the lesson in all this for me is what unconditional love really is. Not for someone to have toward me, but for me to have toward others. Perhaps the lesson is to love myself and stop relying on others at all. I guess we shall find out.

Whyus- as you say I have a lot invested. 16 years. 3 kids. I moved to the UK from the USA. Hell I even gave up a scholarship to an Ivy League to be here. I spent years helping and building him up, with him through some bad times, but mostly good. We grew together and complimented each other's strengths and weaknesses. I know and appreciate how rare that is in life. He does not. Hopefully one day he will.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline sachat3

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2019, 04:08:09 AM »
Morte again well done on your test. I understand how you feel. I always told people from day one “this split isn’t permanent” and I honestly felt it so deep within me. And whilst I do still believe 99.9999999999% Clington will WANT to return. The longer this goes on the more I think to myself “do I even want him? Will I want him in 2-3-4 years time?” I don’t know.

Sex isn’t what ties us to a person. That’s why there is a difference between sh@gg!ng and making love (cringe!) but you get what I mean. The emotions attached to the act are what counts. Not the in out in out shaking it all about motion.
Me - 27
H - 34
3 children together D2 D5 D7
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017

Online UrsaMajor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2019, 04:47:55 AM »
Well done on the exam Mort,

I remember VERY well hitting the "Send" button when I submitted my M. Sc. Thesis Defense - that lifting of the weight off my back.... The last part of it came when I got word that the defense was accepted by the committee Chair and that I was awarded the Diploma... But thinking that I was done studying was such a relief... It wasn't TOO long after that, that S12 was conceived... so I was off to my next "project" so to say ;)

On the other subjects of the immutable red line of the PA and the feeling that the Mid-Lifer will come back, that is a different topic for a different time....


I hope that you enjoy the relief from the studies!
Me - 56
STBXW - 48
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Mid-Lifer filed for D
Waiting for final decree

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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline hopeandfaith

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2019, 05:25:45 AM »
Congrats on your latest achievement Morte

At this moment in time I am ''standing'' but not still. I am not ''waiting for him'', I am ''going with the flow''. I am moving forward with the things I need to make mine and the kids life better, but I am not actively looking for another person. I do miss having one, but...if I am honest I still love Beast and all I would do is compare them to him. That isn't fair to anyone.

I think I have written before and always known...that Beast will come back. I think the question in my mind has always been...will I still be here and do I have the capacity to forgive him?


Totally relate.  I think you will have the capacity to forgive him.  I also think Beast will be back too.  The only thing I am not sure of is if you will still be there.  Out of the 3 issues, that is the one with the biggest question mark over it from this cheap seat.
BD's in May 09, Sept 12 - suspected OW
Left home Jan 12 2013
OW confirmed Feb 2013
Moved home April 11 2014
BD again in April 2017 - clinging. 
Moved out July 2017
D19, D17 and S15

Online UrsaMajor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2019, 06:01:25 AM »
Congrats on your latest achievement Morte

At this moment in time I am ''standing'' but not still. I am not ''waiting for him'', I am ''going with the flow''. I am moving forward with the things I need to make mine and the kids life better, but I am not actively looking for another person. I do miss having one, but...if I am honest I still love Beast and all I would do is compare them to him. That isn't fair to anyone.

I think I have written before and always known...that Beast will come back. I think the question in my mind has always been...will I still be here and do I have the capacity to forgive him?


Totally relate.  I think you will have the capacity to forgive him.  I also think Beast will be back too.  The only thing I am not sure of is if you will still be there.  Out of the 3 issues, that is the one with the biggest question mark over it from this cheap seat.

I fully agree with this... It is also reminiscent of MY position... I figure that STBX will want to come back at some point and I do have the capacity to forgive (which does NOT however mean "forget")  but, will I still be available when she does? I most certainly will NOT be "there" where she left me...
Me - 56
STBXW - 48
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Mid-Lifer filed for D
Waiting for final decree

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline Whyus

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2019, 07:31:48 AM »

Totally relate.  I think you will have the capacity to forgive him.  I also think Beast will be back too.  The only thing I am not sure of is if you will still be there.  Out of the 3 issues, that is the one with the biggest question mark over it from this cheap seat.
OK, maybe but its not worth worrying about really. IF beast Comes back one day and morte is not there that just means that she is in a better place so she wins! She wins whatever so its all cool. I for one wont be Feeling sorry for beastie Boy if he Comes back and morte is gone. That's his tough luck and his BD to get through, all self inflicted of Course.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 08:07:20 AM by UrsaMajor »
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. W is actually getting People to accept/Tolerate them.
2 Sons - 19 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline FearNot

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2019, 10:26:10 AM »
Big Ups on the exam Morte!!

As for the PA- I always had a line in the sand regarding that as well. That I would NEVER EVER tolerate that. It was my deal breaker. It didn't take long for me to realize it wasn't as black and white as I thought. It wasn't my deal breaker, and I didn't know that until faced with it.

As for standing but not standing still/ will I still be here/ can I forgive? For me... that was black and white in the beginning as well. One hundred percent I would still be there. Forgive- I can do that. Forget..not so easy. Today after all the changes, growth, moving forward, I don't know if I will still be there. I'm slowly learning there is more gray in life than I thought (in good ways) and I can't predict what my choice will be.

Will Beast be back? I think so, but I agree with Whyus, either way you will be ahead!!

Hugs N Prayers,
FN

M 46
H 40
No Kids
Married 5yrs, Together 11yrs
BD Oct 31/17
ILYBINILWY Dec 21/17
2nd BD- Dec 27/17
OW-Confirmed Jan 3/18

 Isaiah 43:1 " But the Lord says.. Fear not, for I have redeemed you; I have summoned you by name; you are mine. "

"It's ok to be scared. Being scared means you're about to do something really, really brave." Anonymous

Offline Milly

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2019, 03:02:52 PM »
Morte, you raise very big questions that resonate with so many of us. Your description of how you felt about your H and yourself with your H, after he'd started with OW, is exactly how I felt, and still do at times when I think of them. Every raw detail you describe of how you might feel naked in front of your H one day, is exactly how I feel. Maybe this is standard for a spouse who has been cheated on.

Then your description of your stand, how it's not still, that is how I feel, too. Then your strong feelings that your H will be back one day, but will you still be here? These are my thoughts, too. I guess this last question depends on how long it takes for the MLCer to get through his crisis. Then whether we'll be able to forgive the PA? I'm looking to those who went before me and taking some hope from that, especially Barbie, whose posts were extremely painful to read a couple of years ago, so much easier now. I tell myself, if Barbie can get beyond the affair, maybe I can, too.

It's a work in progress for us all. Thank goodness we can open up about these very sensitive issues right here on HS. I think we would explode without each other.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Shelly7435

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2019, 06:32:46 PM »
Following along.  :D
M 52
H 47
M 12 years; together 17 years
D17, S27
Summer 2014 - H wanted to runaway
9/14 I was diagnosed with Breast cancer
11/14 Surgery for BC..3 day after my father dies
11/14 BD 2 days after surgery. I have no passion for you.
2/15 moved out
Dated each other all year affection back on..
3/16 moved home
7/16 Diagnosed with Breast cancer again
8/16 No affection again. I knew something was wrong.
9/16 Another surgery for Breast Cancer
9/16 BD 11 days after surgery discovered -EA with much younger W from Work. That is over. I think he has meaningless flings. Work is his mistress
10/16 I filed for D (financial reasons)
10/16 I moved out.
10/16 Now off and on vanisher
5/17 Divorce final

Offline Whyus

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #18 on: June 14, 2019, 12:40:26 AM »
Then whether we'll be able to forgive the PA? I'm looking to those who went before me and taking some hope from that, especially Barbie, whose posts were extremely painful to read a couple of years ago, so much easier now. I tell myself, if Barbie can get beyond the affair, maybe I can, too.

Barbie, I hope that you dont mind me writting this.
Milly, Barbie is an extra strong human being who has been through so much and is still "suffering" for lack of a better word. She is a perfect example for the work which still has to be done AFTER a return which DOES NOT always happen. Its the length of the MLC+ the return Phase which also takes years. Its a lot of work and more pain, are you prepared to go through a similar Scenario as Barbie? We all Need to ask ourselves this question or at least realize that its not over when/if they return. That seems to be where the real work starts. I for one honestly do not think that I am strong enough to go through that. XW would have to be fully cooked or nearly fully cooked for me to even contemplate starting anything with her again so in my case its healthier for me to just be done and get on with my life.


It's a work in progress for us all. Thank goodness we can open up about these very sensitive issues right here on HS. I think we would explode without each other.
This is so true, venting is not to be underrated. We have to let it out somewhere.
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. W is actually getting People to accept/Tolerate them.
2 Sons - 19 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #19 on: June 14, 2019, 03:14:04 AM »
What great and unexpected discussion. Look what you started Barbie!  ;D

I got a personal email pm with tons of good questions for me to consider so I replied to the poster, but I also want to share my answers here. I find these are helpful for me sometimes, and maybe for other people to consider to.  :)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Generally I haven't really thought about it in terms of him coming back, or if we would reconcile, or yada yada.

My days are far to busy to constantly stress about that.

Before my exam I had already decided this was going to be ''the summer of me''. By that I mean I am not looking to get Beast back, not looking to find a new man....I just want to focus on me. I have never done that. I want to get healthy eating and exercise going, read some books...I used to love reading and now the only reading I do is for my Uni or MLC. So I bought my first book for fun and I am looking forward to that.  ;D

What is beast doing in terms of introspection to change himself?
Well my guess would be he runs from introspection as much as possible. I think he has hiccups where he has to face reality and the insanity of his own actions. Quiet moments when he is alone or thinking of us. Then he has to make a choice: accept responsibility and change his behaviour to mop up his mess, or run from the room screaming. I am sure you can guess what he seems to be doing lately.  ::)

What does he need to change?
He needs to grow up in a nut shell. He has to realise he didn't miss out by not having a drunk party phase. He needs to realise that there is more to relationships then just what the other person can do for you. He has to understand what true love is...not infatuation, or great sex...but love. The kind of love where you are there for them even when they are not themselves. He needs to find some peace within himself. He is never happy even when he should be. There is a deep seeded sadness within him that will likely never go away, and he has to find a way to soothe it without someone else.

What do I require of him to allow him back?
This is a tougher one to answer. Honestly at this stage I do not know the answer. I know in my gut if he asked tomorrow I would not be elated or excited. My heart would be happy, but my gut and my brain would say ''not yet''. Obviously I would be waiting for things like true disappearance of the other woman, consistent actions, some sort of remorse that all the old timers talk about. But...there is some other missing piece I would need that I haven't even identified yet. I know it is there, I can feel it, but I can't tell what it is yet.

Is Beast improving his situation or career? Isn't he in public housing with a poorly paying job?
Beast is in council housing, with a minimum wage job. He quit his University degree half way through (such a pity). He has now decided to become a writer. I think he is a good writer as he is very funny and extravagant with details...the problem is he has no drive. I will be very surprised if he ever finishes a book...never mind publishing it and writing another. He is great at starting things, but not finishing them. Little disappointed he never saw the Buddhist monk on a bicycle through though. I really wanted a picture of that. ;D

 On a more serious note, no I do not think he is trying to improve his situation. He thinks he is going to become a famous writer, so he spends some free time writing... he has been 'put on a list' to get his own public house instead of living with MIL... and he hasn't even attempted to attain a certificate or diploma or anything for the study he did. It is basically just hanging in limbo somewhere. I guess he is to busy with trips to the zoo and rock festivals with his teen brother to worry about stuff like a career.  ::)

Is Morte willing to carry Beast financially forever?
This is an interesting question. Before BD I would have said something like ''I don't love people for money, we are married 'it's our money'. It doesn't matter who makes more. He supported my while I studied, so if I am successful after study he helped.''. But that is no longer the case is it? Now the case is he left me to be a single mother of three kids, coming up in my final years at University. He dumped all the financial and emotional responsibility at my door so he could go to festivals and bang a wannabe Disney princess. Somehow that mattered more than being here for his family. It mattered more than helping his wife of 16 years secure the last bit of her study so she could get a career and dig us out of the poverty ditch. Writing that paragraph has actually got me a bit teary eyed, so I would say the answer is no...and there is still a lot of anger residing here. But it isn't about the money aspect...it is about the abandonment clearly. Anything I earn since BD is on my own shoulders. It is something I earned by myself with the weight of three kids, a mortgage, and a nut job spouse. He can rot in hell if he thinks he is somehow going to claim he 'helped me do it'.  >:(

I will add in here though that I do not think I will financially carry anyone forever. If I am going to be in a relationship with someone they need to contribute. That doesn't necessarily mean money. If I find a guy who is willing and happy to run the home and take care of things like I have done the last decade, I would consider that pulling his weight. A person's worth can't be measured by how much is in his wallet, at least not in my eyes...but I am not going to have a lay about leeching off me either.   ???

Going deeper on that I think it is because I know that people who are lay abouts, with no drive, no ambition, no direction...go no where. They are content living a mediocre life, generally with mental health problems, have 0 loyalty or sense of responsibility, and think the world owes them something. Or so my experience has found. Please don't confuse this with being about money. There are plenty of lay about rich kids who this applies to, and plenty of poor people who I admire as they are the hardest working people I know. What I am talking about is a character thing, not a financial thing.

A degree and a new job will open up opportunities, do you think you will still be a good fit with Beast?
Well right now I am not a good fit with Beast that is why he doesn't live here!  :P But on a connection level...sense of humour, history, past, that type of thing? I think that will always be there. Even after 2 years of d!ck bag moves it is still there no matter how many times I have tried to pick it off like a scab. ::)

A good fit as a partner though? At this moment in time my answer would be no. Not because I am studying or when I get a new career but because.... I need a partner not another dependant. I don't need someone I have to emotionally calm down every time it rains on the picnic, I don't need someone around who can not control their emotions...that I have to coddle and calm down like a three year old child. I don't need someone who is more interested in buying more concert tickets when the kids need school uniforms. I don't need someone who feels the NEED to lie about everything that comes out of their mouth, even when it doesn't firetrucking matter.  :o As you can tell my answer is probably no, but not for the reason you suggest. I think at some stage I will outgrow him and all the massive love for him will be lost somewhere.  :-\

-Comment about many people with clinging boomerangs giving chance after chance-
I am not entirely sure I am a chance after chance kind of gal.
-My first bf fell into drinks and drugs, and I tried to stick by him and help him out of it. I gave him many chances here...but when he decided to talk to another girl online...I dumped him. I was not going to be pulled down by a guy stuck on drugs and drink, who was now showing signs of disloyalty. He did not get a 3rd chance after that.

-My mom has constantly screwed me over in my life for numerous little things....but two main events stick out in my mind that required 'forgiveness' and 'second chances'.

The first when I was a teenager her and my sister were in a room with my sister's friends and my mom was joining in with the mocking me and making fun of me. She was trying to get on my sister's good side, trying to be ''the cool mom'' and she shattered my heart that day. I was so upset I was crying and went to pack my stuff to go live with my dad. I was upset because during all the custody battle's and the pain that came with that, my sister had 'sold out' and went to live with my dad because he bought her things....I refused and stood by my mom. I lived in extreme poverty with a bipolar woman for years, just so she wouldn't be alone. Just so she felt chosen and loved. And then this was my repayment. To be mocked and ridiculed and laughed at, by my own mother and my sell out sister. Something broke between me and my mother that day.

Years later I tried to forgive her. I tried to accept that maybe, just maybe I never saw the whole picture. Clearly my mom has bipolar and maybe that was the cause. I decided to give her a second chance.

I had been going out with Beast for some time, and we were going to get married. I left my mother my last paycheck before I moved to the UK. I was in a sales job that I was really good at and it was a pretty substantial check. It was enough money for her to buy tickets for her and my sister to come to my wedding, buy them dresses..etc. She went so far as to text me asking about the colour and style of dress. Told me she was getting passports.....and then she used the money I left her for my wedding to move across the country back to her home town. Disloyalty and selfishness again.

I speak to my mother but..nothing has ever been the same since then. Expectations are -30 and love? I am not sure love is the word anymore. I love my mother because she holds the title of mother, I do not love her as a person which is terrible to say but the truth. If I die I would not want my mother to raise my children. I would not expect her to show up to hold my hand on my last day. But I respect she is my mother, I guess 'she tried'. Blah.

Anyway...theme of the day is. I seem to be able to give people second chances for most character flaws, drugs, moody behaviour....but when it comes to disloyalty I do not. So far that seems to be my unforgivable trigger. Interestingly when I type the word disloyalty I actually get a sick gut turning feeling and my mouth goes all that metallic watery way right before you throw up. That is kind of weird right?!  :o

Bringing it back round to MLC...not sure there is anything more disloyal than abandoning your wife and kids for a stereotypical younger co-worker affair...leaving all financial and emotional burdens on your wife, then blaming her for the privilege of putting up with your crazy ass in the process. ::)

Has Beast gone to a therapist to work on his issues?
Beast was in therapy all through his teens. He went out when he met me. He went on a NHS waiting list to see a psychologist/psychiatrist about a year before BD because his anger, lashing out, and depressive episodes were getting out of control. It wasn't until a month after BD they finally got back to him. By then it was to late, he was well into MLC or whatever. He went for 1-3 sessions then decided he didn't need it, he just needed rid of me and he would be cured. ::) That was 2 years ago and he still isn't. Recently he mentioned the work told him he needs to sign up again to see someone, I know he went to the doctor and they 'referred' him...but I don't think he is actually speaking to anyone. Right now he is running around in Egypt next to De-Nial, thinking he is King Tut.  8)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Nerissa

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #20 on: June 14, 2019, 04:32:48 AM »

What does he need to change?
He needs to grow up in a nut shell. He has to realise he didn't miss out by not having a drunk party phase. He needs to realise that there is more to relationships then just what the other person can do for you. He has to understand what true love is...not infatuation, or great sex...but love. The kind of love where you are there for them even when they are not themselves. He needs to find some peace within himself. He is never happy even when he should be. There is a deep seeded sadness within him that will likely never go away, and he has to find a way to soothe it without someone e


I think you are clear sighted. My concern would be that these are personality traits which are tough to change.  You’ve noted that he is going to be a successful writer but has not training and writes little.  I know some successful writers  - the kind who win ‘best first novel’ or children’s literature kind of prizes.  None make a living.  I also know a lot of good writers who are hobby writers and make not even pin money.

I also note he was in therapy through his teens. (I’ve edited out a comment I made that I think was unfair)

 I’m not convinced that people who have the trait of flying into fantasy change that much.  I think they get worse.  My H is and although I’ve thought he will come out of it, I remember his parents who tended towards fantasy, especially his Mother, and she got worse with age.  Because he didn’t like her behaviours when he was younger, I thought him different, but he is following the pattern.

It sounds to me as if you were a loving, forgiving daughter to a mother who didn’t mother  you and you are working bravely to be strong as you did when younger.  I wonder if, without realising it, because the language you use is that of strength and independence, you are repeating your own childhood patterns and using up some of your obvious abilities and drive in maintaining a safe base for your H.  It doesn’t come without cost to the LBS and we all need to ask ourselves, underneath the desire for a whole family, security, familiarity etc, what is it we are getting out of standing.  This answer is usually very well hidden under the notion of enduring love.  I wonder if we should
Think of the word enduring  not just meaning long lasting , but in its often used meaning - to endure something painful stoically. 

I’m one who is very willing to flog a dead horse.  My strength -  determination -  that is useful when it is pointed at the right target becomes a weakness when I point it at the wrong one. 

This might not be relevant to you - it’s my own stuff being projected, but I admire your strength and hope you use it in all the right places and not where it isn’t deserved.  We choose partners that are familiar in some way and it occurs to me that your relationship with Beast might possibly replicate some of the patterns of your relationship with your Mum.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 05:34:08 AM by Nerissa »

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #21 on: June 14, 2019, 05:19:55 AM »
Lot of insight here, Morte, including the bits you simply don't know yet.
I think Beast has a long history of anxiety right? So as you say growing up is about finding his own way to self-soothe amongst other things.

I suspect that investing in any reconnection is probably much less about love or even forgiveness than we first thought. The LBS is forced to move forwards and a reconnecting MLCer simply may feel like a step backwards that an LBS is no longer willing to risk. As you say, a partnership is very different from a broken dependent...as much as we love them, it just may be something we are no longer willing to carry or invest in. Perhaps it depends on how solid and secure the rest of our life is? And if we can 'quarantine' the important progress from their behaviour or needs? Maybe once we take off our fixer hats we just really, really don't want to put them back on for anyone else but ourselves and our kids.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #22 on: June 16, 2019, 06:19:43 AM »
Nerissa- I am not entirely sure these are personality traits. Sure there are personality traits that help you learn these lessons faster, or never need to learn them in the first place...but some are just natural maturation.

Seeing your friends doing something and wanting to join in because you have never done it isn't a personality trait...that is an immature kid letting peer pressure lead him to do things.

Teenagers go through numerous relationships before they realise that love isn't just the puppy dog feelings and good sex you have at the start. That takes time, a few failed relationships, and discovery of what you need. Some people go through more relationships to find this out than others...that part is maybe a character trait...but they are all lessons we all learn at various times.

I don't expect he will ever finish a book. Nevermind become a successful writer who can make a living off it. If he were to ask me about it I would say he should do it as a hobby and see how it goes, while focusing his career on finishing his study he was almost done with and would have him finish the job he bailed on that made 3 times as much as he was making now. But it isn't my choice, and not my job to fix his mess right now. So he can live with MIL, work minimum wage, and try to write this novel he will publish on amazon for 99p or whatever. Be the next Stephen King I am sure.  :P

''I also note he was in therapy through his teens. (I've edited out a comment I made that I think was unfair)''.

Well this can be taken many ways. I am going to assume it is something along the lines of ''Surely this means it isn't MLC'' or ''That is a red flag you should have known better'' or ''He will never change''. Honestly it is hard to tell which of these it would be. I would rather you have just put the comment out since I am not prone to cry baby moments of ''oh god they are being mean to me'' so I will comment on those I have guessed in turn. ;)

If you are suggesting that this isn't MLC and maybe he has always just been a nut job? Well I have never been quiet about this. There are a few things it could be, but diagnosis is irrelevant at this stage. All 3 (MLC, bipolar, NPD) would be handled in a similar way...all about time, focus on yourself, distance...it isn't about you it's about them. So hardly matters at this stage.

Should him being in therapy as a kid be a red flag? Probably. But everyone I have ever known has been in therapy at some point in their life. Him having OCD and depressive moments never bothered me for 14 years. They came and went very similar to a woman having a PMS cycle. In fact we used to joke that it was his ''man period'' or ''time of the month'' when he had a few down days. It was part and package of who he is, and will likely always be....but what happened after that is not. I liken it to having someone who used to have a binge drink every couple of months for 14 years, then decided to buy a bar and binge every night. Sure the once a month binge sessions could be a red flag, but they can also just be normal teen behaviour. There ''isn't a problem'' until the 1-2 month sessions become a constant year and a half alcohol induced blood bath. Looking back you can say ''oh he had the once a month thing, definitely a red flag'', but at the time it was just a guy who liked some drinks to watch football or whatever.

Which leads me smoothly into ''this is his character he will never change''. Some parts of him will likely never change, or maybe only mute down. His flights of fancy stories, and wanting to charm a room when he walks in it? Not likely to change. His cowardice in confrontation? Debatable. He used to run from conflict, yet now I see him bowing up like a cobra at times...almost like he wants conflict to prove himself. That is a character trait that might change during MLC depending on his journey. Perhaps he will revert back to run and hide mode, or perhaps it will mature into a ...'not up for conflict but if it comes I will stand my ground'. There are many character traits or things that will not change, but many that could mature and calm down. That is yet to be seen.

If your redacted comment was something else entirely, feel free to suggest it and I will answer it the best I can.

I would suggest every MLCer ''flys into fantasy'' or else what exactly is MLC? I wouldn't say his family are prone to flights of fancy but I might say ….his mother is a rug sweeper. I suppose there are worse things to be, but at times you have to fight for what you believe in. She seems to be the only one in the family that way so it is not a full family problem. Anxiety is a full family problem. That may never change.

In regards to my own FOO issues it does not escape me I have a bipolar mother and a diagnosed NPD father. Granted he was a different type of Narc but I won't get into that. Anyway they say we pick our partners based on what we know and are familiar with. It certainly hasn't escaped me that the only things Beast line up with are things I have experienced before (apart from the hopefully temporary MLC situation that shows both of these disorders at times).

I am not sure exactly what you mean by ''You are repeating your own childhood patterns and using up some of your obvious abilities and drive in maintaining a safe base for your H''.

In childhood I had very little contact with my dad, we saw him every other weekend. When I did see him you had to put on a show at how smart or strong you were. Nothing else was accepted. Displaying anything else would result in mental and physical punishment. But there was the contrast of the ''good guy part of him'' that wanted to show off. So he would take us out to eat, and to the movies and spend money on us...so that we would go back to our poverty stricken mother and (now I see) make her feel like crap. Maybe some part of him did in a similar way that Beast does, to sort of buy love....but I reckon a good bit of it was to show off. So my dad was a balancing act, of balancing out what to show him, not expressing how you truly felt, and knowing what 'mood' he was in before you approached him about anything. I discussed this before as a puppet dancing on a fence.

In childhood my mother was more like my daughter. I have very few memories of her being happy and nice. Most of my memories of my mother are her flying off the handle about something. One minute she was a bad ass going to stomp a hole in someone who smarted off to her, the next minute she was a crying mess because no one loved her. She dated a string of men who only wanted one thing, yet she always seemed to pick up these guys from the gutter. Not once did she date a man of any substance. I think most of them were jobless, had been in prison at some point, and many of them hit her. Yet each and every one of them was ''the love of her life'' when she first met them, and replaced with in a few months. Interestingly she did something similar with her dogs. My mother used to love to take in dogs...honestly a new dog or puppy every few months....at one point she had about 16 of them until the local county sheriff told her she had to give some away. None of the dogs received proper vet care, vaccinations, or frequent worming and such. Many of them died from sickness, parvo, that kind of thing...She always got rid of the older dogs to make way for the younger ones....then would get more...and this continued. I hated it so much. I absolutely love dogs, and I hated the way she treated them. But it was like she needed 'new love' because old love was never good enough. Not from a dog, not from a man, not from her kids. I was always 'old love' and my sister never offered love, so she was a chance to finally win 'new love'. That dynamic still exists. My mother still chases broken men who treat her like dirt, bouncing around like a dramatic yo yo...whilst hating yet chasing my sister for the approval and love she still has not gotten. The only time she calls me is to complain about her life. I am basically a councillor that she just happened to birth, though I do get the occasional guilt trip about how she never gets to see her grand kids (even though I have offered to fly her over, but she can't be bothered sorting her passport). ::)

So I am trying to work out how this ties into Beast? I guess I learned how to deal with is bad moods and get a sense of things from my dad. But Beast has never been physically violent to me, even during BD and monster. He has been verbally abusive during monster, but I wouldn't say he had outside of the year leading up to BD. Beast has always cycled a bit like my mother but his modes are ''tired, can't be bothered, serious'' and ''Yes! I am awesome! Let's go do something fun''. I find both of those modes easy to handle, and they probably happen to some degree with everyone. He has OCD and anxiety but honestly they are kind of irrelevant to his current situation. They were always there, will always be there, and never affected our relationship more than a mild annoyance that he gets high strung doing something new for the first time. I am not sure how much of that is genetic vs family taught behaviour. But that was always okay because I was the brave one and I would take charge, he would come through with me, then he would feel better that 'he' did it.  ::)

Anyway I don't really know how else to respond to the maintaining a safe base for him. I don't feel like that is what I am doing, but I also don't exactly understand what you mean by that. I am me. I am completely different from him in all the ways I need to be. For the longest time that worked well. We were very much a ying and yang. I was brave and courageous enough to fight off his fears, and his fears made me slow down and think things through. Sometimes I can get an idea in my head and just go balls to the walls for it...''I will figure it out as I go''...so having to soothe his fears made me slow down long enough to think it through. I don't think that was always a bad thing. For him my just go for it attitude was inspiring and helped him break out of the anxiety bubble. It was uncomfortable at first, but I think he found it freeing for the most part. I don't think he knows anyone else like me. That probably both excites and frightens him.  :o

As far as ''what do I get out of standing''...That is a weird question to answer. Everyone always talks about standing as if I am just standing in my house waiting for him to walk back in and continue like it was before. I DO NOT see standing like that. In fact standing is probably a stupid word to use. I am ''going with the flow'' and ''focusing on me'' for the first time.  I do not see myself as sitting in my house waiting for Beast to pull his head out of his ass and see what he is missing.

I know exactly what he is missing. I know how great me and the kids are. I know one day we are going to be in a better place with or without Beast. Not to sound egotistical but everything we have achieved this far has been on me. If I had taken the back seat and let him run the show we would still be living in a crappy part of town, in a council flat, with no education, riding around on the bus or bikes...skirting by on benefits. That is not what I want with my life. I got us out of the crappy part of town, got us on the housing market, built up our credit scores, got us a car, got us both learning toward a BS degree (even though he has dropped out), I researched and planned how he could go from a minimum wage job to a job paying three times what he makes now (which he left on the first week after BD). Since he has left I have paid off all my debt, I learned to drive and got my own car in my own name, separated the finances, saw several new places in the UK, planning a solo trip abroad, and I only have 1 research project left before I graduate.

So what do I get out of standing? Nothing. Because I am not 'standing'. I am still moving forward.

I am not sure I am willing to flog a dead horse. If I see something worth while to 'flog' I will flog it, make my point, and move on without hard feelings. I do not hold grudges and bring things up..I do not debate it endlessly just for the sake of it. I do not always take things 'literally'. I more....absorb various viewpoints, debate it in my head and sometimes with the person, look for patterns and flesh an idea out...decide what I think is true...then move on. If I need to make a point or feel strongly about something, I let it be known, without malice. I can have a 'passionate conversation' with someone and have no ill will. Some people can not. In fact if I don't like someone because I find them to dull, argumentative, or just an idiot...I don't even waste my time to speak to them. I get especially irritated when people ask or do the same thing over and over, and never learn or absorb information. That has been there since childhood actually, and can sometimes lead me to being impatient when people need more time to 'get it'.

But I catch your meaning. You don't want me wasting my strength flogging my MLC dead horse hoping to resurrect him into a stallion. Believe me...I got better things to do with my time.  ::)



Treasur- I like what you said about 'quarantine important progress from their behaviour or needs'. That seems very apt and how I view Beast as of late. I guess I have kind of learned a sort of compartmentalisation. What happens in his box stays in his box as much as I can help it. I don't look in his box, I am not interested in what is in his box...nothing about his box matters...unless it affects mine and the kids box. The things that come over and affect our box I deal with. The rest is irrelevant. Sure sometimes I may get a curious itch and lift up the lid to have a little peaksie pie on what's been shoved in there lately, but it is more like a 'scientific observation'. I don't let it effect me emotionally because until he is in mine and the kids box it doesn't matter.

If MLC has taught me anything it is...no matter how much you love a person, you can't fix them. I guess when I was younger I assumed if I loved someone enough they could change or heal or grow. This really has just reinforced that you can love someone enough to die for them, but it has to be their CHOICE to change or heal or grow. No amount of love will do it for them. And regardless of what their choice is, it isn't about you, it is only about them.

You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Nerissa

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #23 on: June 16, 2019, 12:14:28 PM »
Mortesbride, you know your H and your own feelings better than I,so  I hope you don’t feel you need to defend yourself against things which will contain projections from me which have to do with my own experiences and feelings rather than the reality you are living.

I redacted a comment I felt was intrusive and insensitively expressed.  My thinking was along the lines of whether he had shared his teenage challenges with you and whether they were resolved or were still causing problems for him, but I then felt it was an invasion of his teenage self and any difficulties he might have had so I edited it out.  I don’t think I would be likely to believe that someone can never change and I wouldn’t make distinctions about who might and might not be ‘mlc’ because I think  it is a catch-all term to describe our spouses rather like ‘stomach- ache’ rather than a diagnosis of anything specific.  When we humans break, we tend to break in fairly similar ways.  And everybody here is in the same boat and and experiences the same emotions in any case. I

.  I think I do sometimes feel that we can have an idea that mlc will get better somehow and improve and I think too often that doesn’t turn out to happen.  But sometimes it does so no one really knows. 

.   I have thought about my unconscious projections onto you  and I think that as a mother of daughters and ex teacher of young women, I project a bit when I see young women in this situation as I worry that their youth and potential will waste too much of their abilities on men who might not ‘come good’. That is my stuff To own,  not yours.

To me, The question of why any of us stand or wait for spouses who might change their minds and return is no criticism of any of us,  but a question that goes deep and has many layers to peel away. .  I feel it  is about finding out about our most unconscious hopes and fears and beliefs, if we believe that the unconscious exists (and I do) so I intended the question to be  an existential question and not a judgement about choices.  I think perhaps  I didn’t get that across.



,

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #24 on: June 16, 2019, 12:57:36 PM »
I am honestly not bothered.  :)

I don't feel the need to defend myself as such, I just assumed it would be one of the more 'popular' questions I have heard before. Might as well answer them you know?

He did share his teenage challenges with me. He said I was the only person he could talk to about his ''deep darkies''. It created an incredible bond between us that we knew these things about each other. Not just the 'light' stuff but all of the 'dark' stuff too. I know why he hid, I know why he felt alone, I know all the thoughts that crossed his mind. This of course didn't all come out in one big talk...but bits and pieces over a decade. More and more details. Fleshing it out.

I do agree the title 'MLC' is very similar to a 'stomach-ache'. Lot' of things can cause it but, they all look about the same. That is precisely why I did not limit my search for answers strictly to 'MLC'. I felt it was important to research everything it could be...then start narrowing it down in a sort of refinement process. #sciencenerd

I appreciate your concern for me wasting my youth and potential on a man not worth my time. Believe me I cycle with this question a lot myself. I wonder how long it will be before I out grow Beast, or perhaps I already have. I am not certain if he will mature and catch up, or not...or if he does it will be to late. But please rest assured I will not be wasting my time on a man who does not know how important family, loyalty, and respect are.  :)

I think at the base core (or as far down as I have gotten thus far) of the reason for my stand is obviously I love him and I am married and with that came a promise. But deeper then that is I have a deep loyalty streak, and a sort of...waiting because I know he is looney toons right now. I would not feel good 'abandoning' him while he is mentally all over the place, even though he might deserve it. When it is time for me to let go, and move on...I will know.  :)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #25 on: June 16, 2019, 01:41:31 PM »
I think, Morte, that one of the strange life lessons of this experience is that love is not enough. And at the same time that love, maybe a different kind of love, is really all that matters in life. It is a strange conundrum really. Like you, my h and me shared many conversations about some of his own 'dark' places. Maybe it was my naïveté, my own lack of experiencing that kind of darkness in myself, that meant I made assumptions and simply could not foresee that the dark stuff - his demons as he called them - would take him over in the way that they did. And wrestling with what love and loyalty means in the dark is probably at the heart of our own LBS struggle isn't it? But I have no doubt that you have the strength to do what is best for you and your kids and even Beast when and if you reach a point where you need to decide or act differently.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

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Offline Jay78

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #26 on: June 16, 2019, 01:59:31 PM »
Just caught up,

Just wow, your relationship with your mom and you sounds alot like my bio mom. But I will say I have broken that cycle of Physical and mental abuse.

Unfortunately I can't speak for my Ex. Her childhood was also tough but she hasn't broken the cycle her parenting skills is yelling, screaming, verbally and some physical which authorities have been called.

What I struggle with is Narcissist vs MLC speaking for me and me going to therapy and giving therapist insight with W behavior she feels ExW can be bipolar. 

I am learning to not put label on ExW and only worry about me and kids.

Will follow along and good luck
At BD
Lesbian marriage
Me39,W36
S9,D9,S8 adopted all three
Together almost 10yrs
Bomb Drop - April 2017
W movedout - May,2017
OW  May orJune,2017 maybe even longer
Currently 2018
Me40, W38
S10,D10,S9
____________________________________________________
A  DAY AT  A TIME,  WITH GOD ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2019, 01:23:39 AM »
Just caught up,

Just wow, your relationship with your mom and you sounds alot like my bio mom. But I will say I have broken that cycle of Physical and mental abuse.

Unfortunately I can't speak for my Ex. Her childhood was also tough but she hasn't broken the cycle her parenting skills is yelling, screaming, verbally and some physical which authorities have been called.

What I struggle with is Narcissist vs MLC speaking for me and me going to therapy and giving therapist insight with W behavior she feels ExW can be bipolar. 

I am learning to not put label on ExW and only worry about me and kids.

Will follow along and good luck

Well you will find they can kind of overlap.

Some people say a MLCer will show Narcissistic personality traits, and high energy replayers can look bipolar from the outside. You know it is MLC because in time it shows to be a temporary thing that goes away.

NPD is a life long thing, they don't tend to get better...in fact NPD doesn't generally start to show until late 20s-30s and then progressively get's worse. So did I fall in love with a covert narc who has just gotten worse, or has he just snapped and is MLC showing increased Narc tendencies?

Bipolar...well I wouldn't say Beast was bipolar like my mother, but of course she is older..and I was a child with her so perhaps it made my perception more skewed. He has always had a ''few him'' modes as I described. If that is because he is bipolar, or just a Gemini who is to say.  ;) 

All jokes aside if you read over these three conditions you can find a lot of similarities, a lot of the same ''tick boxes''...and with all three there is no way to tell until further down the line. In fact they can all three be very hard to diagnose ''on the first go'' as they can mirror other things.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #28 on: June 17, 2019, 12:24:48 PM »
Hello,

Quote
I appreciate your concern for me wasting my youth and potential on a man not worth my time.
I agree that you are not wasting your time with anybody- especially yourself. You are in school and making progress towards being independent. Regardless of who you are with, the relationship will be because you want the relationship and enhances you- not because you need someone.

In my current relationship, my wife doesn't need me. She was more than capable of surviving and had been alone for nine years prior to being with me. She dated and went out, but was not going to just be with someone because she was afraid to be alone. In fact, she was going to let her subscription expire to the dating site and I was her last 'date' before she let things go for a while LOL Five years later, we are going strong!

The point is that you are not wasting your time.

What I admire is that you are not trying to look into the tea leaves and see if Beast is coming back. You are not trying to think of a way to make him go through the tunnel faster, nor are you plotting a plan to have Princess Skittles kidnapped by gypsies and sold to the highest bidder in Kiev.

Which brings me to the next point,

Quote
As far as ''what do I get out of standing''...That is a weird question to answer. Everyone always talks about standing as if I am just standing in my house waiting for him to walk back in and continue like it was before. I DO NOT see standing like that. In fact standing is probably a stupid word to use. I am ''going with the flow'' and ''focusing on me'' for the first time.

Standing is more than just waiting for your MLCer. It is about getting up after you have been knocked down. I prefer standing from a boxer's point of view. As long as I am on my two feet, I am in the fight. That's standing. Not sitting on the couch comparing yourself to others and your entire identity tied to the choices of another person.

The only part where I differ from you is "going with the flow". To me going with the flow is immediately filling the void. Our MLCer's go with the flow. They just try and make themselves happy even if in the long run they are hurting themselves. Going with the flow is not deliberate or intentional. It is just a decision made in the moment.

Your mother became involved with less than desirable men. She looked at each one of them as the 'love of her life'. From my perspective, she more addicted to the hormones of initial romance and picked men she could easily drop and move onto the next high. Who knows? Or maybe deep down inside, she felt that this is what she deserved? Either way, she went with the flow.

In your situation, did you drop beast and go look for someone new? Did you look for someone to fill the void? That's going with the flow. Standing is more intentional and focused way of living. Even if you and Beast never get back together, I think standing gives you the time to respond rather than react to the situations unfolding before you.

Quote
I wouldn’t make distinctions about who might and might not be ‘mlc’ because I think  it is a catch-all term

This is a great point and we can all wrestle with it. My contention has always been along the lines that the MLCer or whatever term you want to use is in an identity crisis. The only difference I see in your H and other MLCers is that most MLcers resort back to their adolescent period to resolve the issue because they feel as if they have missed out on something. Your H saw what adult hood represented and decided to continue being an adolescent. A Beastie Peter Pan. Slight difference, but a crisis of self.

I think you are doing well and it is okay, and in fact welcomed that you ponder your thoughts as well as your actions. You have more than yourself to consider and their future lives truly depend on how your treat them and more importantly, how you treat yourself.

((((Hugs))) and more ((((Hugs)))

Ready


"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Offline KeepItTogether

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #29 on: June 17, 2019, 01:52:36 PM »

You are not trying to think of a way to make him go through the tunnel faster, nor are you plotting a plan to have Princess Skittles kidnapped by gypsies and sold to the highest bidder in Kiev.


LMAO--that was funny!!

Morte, your introspection and brutal honesty about yourself never cease to amaze me. Asking the hard questions and being completely honest is really the only way to grow.  And I would say you are doing that masterfully.

I also like Ready's definition of Standing. It is NOT waiting by any means. But you don't necessarily need to define what you are doing anyway. B/c at the end of the day, you are DOING so much for yourself and your beautiful children.  Maybe Beast will catch up. Maybe not. That question doesn't matter right now though does it?
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline Acorn

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2019, 02:01:52 PM »
The word ‘standing’ has knobs on it.  It sounds like ‘foot rot’, ‘stagnant and stinking’, ‘idiotic non-movement’, ‘stupidly stuck’, etc. 
There must be a better word than that. 
The imagery it creates couldn’t be farther from what LBS needs to do.

Come on, Morte, give us a word that can replace ‘standing’.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2019, 02:02:59 PM by Acorn »
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Offline Disillusioned

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2019, 02:08:38 PM »
The word ‘standing’ has knobs on it.  It sounds like ‘foot rot’, ‘stagnant and stinking’, ‘idiotic non-movement’, ‘stupidly stuck’, etc. 
There must be a better word than that. 
The imagery it creates couldn’t be farther from what LBS needs to do.

Conscientious objector   ;)
M=51
W=47
D=8
BD Feb 17 Thinking of divorce
Atomic BD June 17 Spying revealed OM at work
Still home.  Threatened to leave several times and has asked me to leave about a dozen. 
Says divorce proceedings will start Jan 18.
She has scheduled mediation Feb 7,  2018
I moved out March 16, 2018
Several mediations, mostly instigated by me.  Foot dragging by STBXW.  Nothing filed. Yet.
5/2019 STBXW filed D behind my back despite signed agreement to mediate.
I retain attorney.
STBXW still hasn't told me and no further action.

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #32 on: June 17, 2019, 03:14:44 PM »

The only part where I differ from you is "going with the flow". To me going with the flow is immediately filling the void. Our MLCer's go with the flow. They just try and make themselves happy even if in the long run they are hurting themselves. Going with the flow is not deliberate or intentional. It is just a decision made in the moment.

Your mother became involved with less than desirable men. She looked at each one of them as the 'love of her life'. From my perspective, she more addicted to the hormones of initial romance and picked men she could easily drop and move onto the next high. Who knows? Or maybe deep down inside, she felt that this is what she deserved? Either way, she went with the flow.

In your situation, did you drop beast and go look for someone new? Did you look for someone to fill the void? That's going with the flow. Standing is more intentional and focused way of living. Even if you and Beast never get back together, I think standing gives you the time to respond rather than react to the situations unfolding before you.

Clearly you and I have two very different ideas of what ''go with the flow'' means. Go with the flow for me is more like....you are thrown into a rapid turbulent river rapids...Now what do you do to survive? You can swim and fight and use up all your energy trying to swim upstream until you eventually give out and either drowned, or have to float with the tide.....or you can choose to lie on your back floating, watching the sky as you flow with the river...until you arrive at a bank full of energy ready to fight.

My mother chasing man after man is not going with the flow...that is swimming up the same stream. If I had dropped Beast and started to look for a man.. I would be swimming against the stream. Using all my energy to stay in the same place instead of just letting the river take me where I am meant to be.


Morte, your introspection and brutal honesty about yourself never cease to amaze me. Asking the hard questions and being completely honest is really the only way to grow.  And I would say you are doing that masterfully.

I also like Ready's definition of Standing. It is NOT waiting by any means. But you don't necessarily need to define what you are doing anyway. B/c at the end of the day, you are DOING so much for yourself and your beautiful children.  Maybe Beast will catch up. Maybe not. That question doesn't matter right now though does it?

Thank you, and no it doesn't.  :)


The word ‘standing’ has knobs on it.  It sounds like ‘foot rot’, ‘stagnant and stinking’, ‘idiotic non-movement’, ‘stupidly stuck’, etc. 
There must be a better word than that. 
The imagery it creates couldn’t be farther from what LBS needs to do.

Come on, Morte, give us a word that can replace ‘standing’.


How about flowing and growing?  ;D

Or maybe LBS leveling up.  8)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Online UrsaMajor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #33 on: June 18, 2019, 12:12:17 AM »
Mort,

I am with you on the "Go with the Flow" definition....

Going with the flow is taking the path of least resistance in order to have the time to recharge, renew, and work on what each of us thinks we need to work on.  I TOTALLY agree that going out and getting into a Rebound Relationship is swimming against the Rip Tide because we will invariably end up with some broken individual... after all, just like the Mid-Lifer, Broken attracts Broken.
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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
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Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2019, 07:43:08 PM »
Hello,

Quote
Clearly you and I have two very different ideas of what ''go with the flow'' means.

Yes, we do. I am from the deep south. "Go with the flow" means take the easy way and not make waves. Do what everyone else does and be quiet.

For example when the teenagers where picking on the young man, 'go with the flow' would mean, leave them alone. It's not your problem.  Another example would be, why stand? Woldn't it be easier to just get a divorce and find someone new. That's my definition of going with the flow.

So, we are not far apart in our ideas, but just our terminology.

(((Hugs)))

Ready
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #35 on: June 20, 2019, 11:12:01 AM »
Update time. Can't believe I haven't updated MLCer shenanigans since my Exam.  :o

I suppose at this stage it just starts to be the same old same old...blend of nutter butterness.

The main highlights thus far:
-He has now went out of his way to download a game that me and son play together. A game he said was 'trash' and mocked me for a year for playing. He has played with me and son 3 times since he got it.  ::)

-I previously have mentioned that for some reason, 2 years on, he still keeps two pictures of me in his wallet hidden behind a picture of the kids. The day before his festival he sent me a picture on WA of these two with the caption ''Here's a blast from the past'' so I replied ''Time for you to burn them?'' he said ''That's harsh'' and I said ''What else would you be doing with old pictures of me from 2 years ago''. Instinctively I knew he was taking them out of his wallet to protect them from the rain and mud, but I wondered what he would do with them. Would he stick them in the bin finally? Would he put them in the box with his ring? Would he put them in a drawer until he got back?I don't suppose it matters with social media and all that...but for some reason they signify something and I wondered what it means if they are gone now? (More on this later)

-He was gone over the weekend for his festival. I was convinced it was him, BIL, and of course OW. I guess I just assume she goes everywhere now as that is safer and avoids disappointment type feelings later. If I assume the worst then it can't hurt me type mentality. I was feeling a bit of FOMO (fear of missing out). A bit bummed that I didn't get to go see all these bands and experience a tent and festival vibe, but partially because he was going to experience all these things without me. I couldn't help it, it was there. Even though I knew at least 85% of the trip would be complaints and moaning. ::) Anyway turns out it was a wash out...news articles about people leaving before it even started. Mud so thick people were dislocating their hip trying to walk in it. :o I felt less FOMO then ha! :D Later I got all the horror stories including a broken tent, toilet so covered in faeces it made him vomit everywhere, and laying in a tent from 2-11pm one night alone. He repeatedly mentioned being alone since BIL went off with his friend, and I of course was sceptical, but I think he might actually be telling the truth as a few situations didn't make much sense if she had went... For instance they left at 11pm and didn't arrive home the next day until 9 am. When I asked him why considering it is like a 5 hour drive he said he took three wrong turns, and ended up having a nap. I said ''Not just take turns driving?'' and he persisted with the ''BIL can't drive who else would be driving?!'' Type chat...I will eventually speak to BIL so I guess it is safe to say she didn't go as BIL will tell me if she did. It is kinda irrelevant if she did or didn't I suppose at the end of the day, I just find it super weird that you would lend your car to your 'BF' and his brother to drive down 6 hours to a festival all weekend and not want to go? But at the end of the day their whole situation is firetrucking weird so... ::)

-Wed he came over for contact. I thought he might r/s as there was kids school events on Thursday...so usually he would just swap days. This time he decided to double up and see them twice. So Wed he came over for 2 hours or so. The weird thing (funny I know) is when I called him to confirm if he was coming or not he actually answered the phone?! I know...sounds ridiculous when you say that but anyone with a MLCer knows what it is like. Don't think the man has answered the phone to me straight away in nearly 2 years....granted I do not phone often. Anyway he confirmed he was coming so I brought the kids home from the park to meet him.

-I asked him if we could get school uniforms for the kids since his work has a sale, plus he gets a discount off the top. Originally he moaned about not having money and I simply said ''I am not expecting you to pay for it, I could just use the discount to save me some money''. He then made a big deal about how we couldn't be seen in the shop together because ''He couldn't be bothered dealing with all the rumours''. I could not help myself and I burst out laughing and said ''I know! Can you imagine?! Going to the shops to buy school uniforms with your wife?! The insanity!!!''. He then started to skirt around some third party type comments about ''they will make his life difficult'' type chat, pretending as if he is talking about the old ladies at his work. ::) I said ''What you mean to say is someone will go off their nut with jealousy?!'' and he was like ''No..no...uh...'' and just sorta looked away. Bingo! ;)  So I said ''Look I don't really care, how about I make you a list, and you can go in and get the stuff then? I don't really care how it get's done, I just need the uniforms for the kids and having that money off would really help''. (P.S saved myself £60!  8) )

-Today was the two older kids sports day. That meant Beast was basically here from 9 am – 6 pm. He arrived in style flipping me off as he drove by.  ::) I continued to walk as if I never saw him. He then text me ''Rude!'' and I text ''Sorry I don't know any jerk weeds who drive toy cars that would be flipping me off.. ::)'' he eventually caught up and we went to see the kids. Sports day was great but of course he filled it with his cursey commentary. :-[ Odd comments and declarations about how he ''doesn't live in reality anymore''. I just joked and said ''What happens when reality comes back?'' and he got quiet and said ''I will deal with that when it happens''.

-Most of the day was chit chat. The same ''no one is the same as us'' ''no one gets my humour like you'' comments. A lot of 'millennial jokes'' which i funny since OW is basically one.  ::)

-Had dinner with us, thanked me for it...went on about that being the best meal he has had since the last one I cooked him. I suggest he watch a video I saw called ''3000 ways to make an egg''. :P

-Post dinner he begins to tell me about how much of a stud muffin he is. ::) He is back to the gym since April apparently?! ??? All the women just want a piece of him. ::) Can't keep their hands off... panties are hitting the fridge cooled floor in the dairy aisle as he sashays across to produce... ::) ::) ::) ::)
I think I being to say ''uh huh'' ''I'm sure'' and roll my eyes. He then says ''but I was like 'Woah there little lady I got enough woman problems as it is'' and I said ''Yeah, self inflicted ones'' and he looked a bit sheepish and said ''never said it wasn't''.  These conversations only ever make me think ''idiot''.

-And the answer to my question, about what he did with my picture after two years? He has carefully wrapped both of them, and the kids one in clear cling film and put them back in his wallet. I guess he only took them out to water proof them. And I will be damned if for some stupid reason that doesn't make my heart go 'awww'.  :o ::)
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline DCD

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #36 on: June 20, 2019, 11:29:34 AM »
Dear Lord...there is so much I forget about what my MLCer used to say - i mean i do remember that it was ridiculous and like you, the word "idiot" often popped into my head - but holy hell did you bring it all back for me.  You handle him SO WELL...i snorted my way through your post.  i love it all but this:


-Post dinner he begins to tell me about how much of a stud muffin he is. ::) He is back to the gym since April apparently?! ??? All the women just want a piece of him. ::) Can't keep their hands off... panties are hitting the fridge cooled floor in the dairy aisle as he sashays across to produce... ::) ::) ::) ::)
I think I being to say ''uh huh'' ''I'm sure'' and roll my eyes. He then says ''but I was like 'Woah there little lady I got enough woman problems as it is'' and I said ''Yeah, self inflicted ones'' and he looked a bit sheepish and said ''never said it wasn't''.  These conversations only ever make me think ''idiot''.


hahaaa!! amazing - both for his idiotic comments and your succinct, right between the eyes, shot back.  Husband had his 'hard body' stage where he would walk around pulling up his shirt 'casually, without a thought', showing off his 4ish pack.  whatever...  ;D

some days are yellow
some days are blue
on different days, i'm different too
you'd be surprised how many ways
i change on different-colored days.
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Offline KeepItTogether

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #37 on: June 20, 2019, 12:25:54 PM »
He then made a big deal about how we couldn't be seen in the shop together because ''He couldn't be bothered dealing with all the rumours''.



This made me laugh. Last year I was speaking at a Cancer Society Gala. H texted me in the am telling me how proud he was of me and that had he known, he would have come too. I told him it wasn't too late, that I could get him a ticket--they were $150 each. But he said no b/c he didn't want to take the limelight form me, that people would "talk."  And that  there would be many more events where we would go together in the future like this. Ummmm yeah. OK.  To use your word Mort....IDIOT!
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline Milly

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #38 on: June 20, 2019, 01:04:45 PM »
Morte, it's always fun to read your post Wednesday updates. I come here for some light relief. Hope you don't mind me saying that.

The camping festival sounded really awful! So happy for you! Nice for us LBSs when the unicorns didn't turn up but instead the gremlins came and poured mud all over everyone and real poo all over the toilets! Sorry, but your H/MLCer deserved it. Naughty Milly.

The talking stud stuff is just so bizarre. My S used to walk around showing me his muscles all the time last year when he was 13. Maybe your H is 13 right now.
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OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Finding Joy

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #39 on: June 20, 2019, 06:23:19 PM »
Attaching!  I tune in every week:)
Married 19 years
Husband is 42
I am 38
BD-October 10 2018-ILYBNIL, wants a divorce, this after I found out about OW 1(EA), I believe he is on to OW 2(PA)
BD 2-March 2019-He is getting an apartment

4 kids 5-14 years

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Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #40 on: June 22, 2019, 04:51:44 AM »
So a not so nice update I am afraid.

Last night I decided to finally try the bottle of wine I bought for my exam completion. It has been sat in the fridge but I am not a big alcohol drinker. By that I mean I probably drink 3 times a year or less. I had 1 and a half glasses of wine before $h!te hit the fan.

I see a post on FB from my devil sister that says something along the lines of ''keep my sister in your prayers, not my business to give details but she needs help'' ...obviously not me so she must mean our half sister. (But anyone who is not me might think it IS me. :o) I then check my private messages and this is word for word what she sent me ''If ur not aware of what's going on.. get ahold of our sister n let her kno u love her''. Talk about firetrucking cryptic right? Did her dog die? Did our ex step mom die? Did she stub her toe? Did her boyfriend break up with her?! What the firetruck kind of communication is that?! ...

Luckily it didn't take long for my mother to start phoning me. Woman is queen of the grapevine. Apparently my sister's brother has either shot himself or been shot, and died on his way to be airlifted. My mom shares this as if it is common knowledge gossip, before moving on to complaining about my sister. When I asked why that was the message the Devil sent instead of something with a bit more context...apparently she told my mom ''I washed my hands of Morte when she let me get arrested, and then told me I was an unfit mother because my dog headbutted my daughter'' and a continued list of complete utter dog $h!te. 

Now I was internally enraged. First of all...I VIVIDLY remember the day she got arrested. I was 16 years old and remember driving home from work and arriving to the house with two cop cars outside, one with my dad in it, the other with my sister. They were both bloody and I was scared to death someone was dead. I remember the cops asking me who I was, where I had been. I remember them telling me that her and my father had got into a knock down drag out...she smashed a skateboard over my father's head, then when he was choking her on the hall floor, she apparently tried to hit him with a nearby drill. This whole scene is forever etched into my memory because I suppose it was in some way traumatic, though I don't think of it as such now. I remember not knowing what to do, and phoning my mom and Beast at the time. I remember having to tell my mother how to pick up my sister from the jail.

And here is the devil now somehow saying I was home and allowed her to get arrested?! :o It is so insane that it just switches me instantly to rage. Liar trigger I guess.

The second I have posted about I think. When I went to visit and she had an aggressive dog who BIT her daughter in the face. There were two visible tooth marks on her daughter's nose. I told her she needed to get rid of the dog, it was dangerous, and would bite again. Her defence was ''If the dog wanted to hurt my daughter she would have ripped her face off'' and ''You are making a hurricane out of a mole hill''.  :o I said next time her daughter might not be so lucky. SHE took this to be me calling her an unfit mother...all I have ever said was that she should get rid of the dog who bit her daughter. 2 years later the dog had to be put down for biting a postal worker. And now 6 years later the story is the dog ''head butted her daughter and I called her an unfit mother''. :o

I really don't understand how you can twist stories like this so much. Beyond the lines of logic or reason. Honestly it is like a MLCer at times, but she has always been like this. To the point when she bit the teacher at 3 years old in nursery and got flung out...somehow THAT was my fault too. I have lived in Uk for the last 16 years and things that have happened to her while I am ACROSS THE WORLD are somehow my fault.  ???

Honestly I can't even explain how insane it is, and how insane it makes me feel. So I find it best just not to speak to her, and try my best to just listen to my mom's rantings about her on her weekly/monthly call.

So now that that context is out of the way....I have a rush of emotions all at once.

I knew the kid from the time he was born until he was about 6 (before I moved to the Uk.)

So I feel sad because I kinda saw him grow up, first in person, then via pictures. I am sad because my half sister has just lost her brother. I am sad because my Step mom has lost her child in a horrible way. These emotions are all normal empathy I suppose.

But I honestly also kinda feel nothing in a way. These are people who I have only spoken to at my dad's funeral. In the entire time I have been in the UK none of them have reached out to me, or even really responded when I reached out to them. What am I supposed to say to console my sister when we haven't spoken in over 4 years? I don't even have a phone number for her, and could only message her via FB.

No matter what I do the Devil will deem it wasn't good enough, even though she felt the first appropriate thing to do is plaster it all over FB, and send cryptic private messages like that was somehow going to convey the gravity of the situation.

I know that another FB message is tacky and get's lost in the sea of all the other messages I can see posted about people who ''once hung out with him'' and are forever changed by this. The same fake messages I saw posted on my dad's page that actually really annoyed me. People posting who hadn't seen or spoke to him in years, people who barely knew him...I don't want to be one of them.

I want to show support to my sister, even though it has never been shown to me, yet I have absolutely no idea how to do that. And I know even if I do it will be deemed not enough.

And the whole thing combined with a glass and a half of wine kicked up an emotional hornets nest of FOO.

I feel things for these people because they hold the title of ''mother'' or ''sister'' but nothing for them as people. I do not know them. They are strangers to me now. They were toxic and abusive when I did know them. Granted some of it is because we came from our situation, but still..I feel like they didn't even try to overcome it. Then I feel bad for feeling nothing.

I had no one else to talk to and didn't really think better of it so I WA Beast.

He asked what happened, listened to me (or read my texts rather), asked how I feel, what I am going to do.... I then said ''Sorry to bother you'' and he said ''Don't mind being bothered'', more chat...I explained how I am feeling and he said ''Are they worth feeling anything for''.  I explained I love them for their titles but not as people. He then said ''Miss them?'' I said ''no'', he then said ''Miss anybody?'' and I just replied ''...'' then went to sleep.  I woke up this morning to a text from him asking me how I was this morning.

This morning I am just...I don't know.

I feel bad for my step mom and my half sister because I know they are in pain. I feel bad about the way he was killed/killed himself.

I want to be able to express myself to them but have no way to do so, and don't want to feel like a hypocrite.

But the main effect it has had on me is realising just how broken my FOO is, and making me question how broken I am.

Why is my MLCer the most stable person I can talk to at a time like this?
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline barbiedoll

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #41 on: June 22, 2019, 06:00:38 AM »
Wow Morte... honestly , that is just a "hornets nest of FOO" for sure. It just stirs it all up indeed and as useless as this is , its likely "normal" reactions. I know that my therapist says to me ..." If you have extreme reactions to something or someone , be curious . Because that is where your work is ". That has become very useful to me and I do use that logic when I feel extreme reactions. Wounds that are not healed or need some attention. The minute I believe that I have healed some FOO...I am tested again and realize that I have been ignoring them ... NOT working on healing them. Ugh . And yes...I then wonder just how "broken" am I ?

I VERY frequently longed to reach out to my H when he was in crisis and out of our home ... I was devastated and hurting and needed to talk to someone . BUT , HE was the cause of all my distress. It was like the "victim" running to the perpetrator for comfort and support. WTF??.   I never once did that but I wept that I couldn't.

It is a sad situation that you describe indeed. What to do?   Is it a feeling of obligation ( after all they are "family") or a true emotional desire to offer compassion and support?. It is the question I ask myself ...then I act on that . Perhaps something as simple as a card to your step-sister is the best that can be offered. I know it is not that simple Morte...it will get you all tangled up in FOO... perhaps there is some "work that remains unresolved there ".   Hugs !

Married April 1985
5 children
Bomb Drop April 2013
Thrown out of house August 2013
Affair discovered November 2013 (i guessed who)
Home December 3 2013
The Journey Of Reconciliation .. is for the brave .

Anger is like a candle in the wind ... it blows out the light of all reason.

Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #42 on: June 22, 2019, 06:37:46 AM »
Hello,

Quote
Why is my MLCer the most stable person I can talk to at a time like this?

That really saddens my heart. During my times with my MLCer, I had the full support of my family. Mom, Dad, brothers, and friends. Even her family- especially the deceased SIL (Long story, for another day).

First of all, you have posted the reality of your situation. You can't control these people. Often in an environment that you were raised, you have two choices, leave or join.

That's it. You are not going to change them. You could give your sister a million dollars and she would still project all her anger and hate on you. I don't know her, but anybody with the capability to hit another person with an object to hurt them is a person that rages inside.

My advice, post your condolences, and move on. Live your life as an example that might influence but not control others. Raise your kids in a safe and sane home. Get a job that enhances your life mentally and spiritually.

You are on your way,

((((Hugs)))

Ready
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #43 on: June 22, 2019, 08:03:36 AM »
Fwiw, Morte, the very fact that you can post this kind of FOO history as calmly as you did is evidence that you are NOT broken by it. That you can see the dysfunction and not join in.
You may have some dents...but you are not broken bc you left and refused to play the game. And that also means your kids are not part of the game.

And reaching out to Beast? Well, first of all I'm glad he responded, was kind and did not make it about him. The better bit of Beast perhaps. The bit that was part of your escape all those years ago. Probably too why you reached out to him bc he knows the history, and you, in a way that others don't.

And your dents? I don't know how/if you think they are part of the situation with Beast or influence what you want or don't. But I can see how much strength and courage you have to survive the FOO you had and why a sane healthy family matters so much to you.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #44 on: June 22, 2019, 02:57:21 PM »
Barbie I think it is more obligation because I know a person 'should', but also I feel bad for my younger half sister. Not because she has been particularly kind or nice to me, just because she is my family I suppose. That deep loyalty streak runs under the core of who I am. Even for people who don't deserve it. Kind of annoying actually.

Ready it was very much a case of growing up and 'not fitting'. I don't know where I came from. I have this sense of honour, justice, loyalty, truth...I don't know why. I can't really even see anyone who was near me who had it. And every time I looked around and saw people without it, I felt out of place. That is the feeling I have from the tiniest memories. ''I don't belong here''. So my choice was to leave clearly.

My leaving bred resentment in my devil sister, indifference from my half sister, disappointment from my father, and guilt trips galore from my mother. But I couldn't live in it any more, and I needed 'normal' and 'happy'. And it worked for a time.

Treasur I am afraid these stories are just the surface of what I have been through. There are so many memories I have of physical and psychological abuse. Inflicted on me by adults, and forced fighting between us children like we were dogs in a fighting pit. Some memories stick out more than others. I think I somehow blocked most of the really horrible stuff out...or more...hid it behind an emotion blocking wall. I remember it happened, but I do not feel it anymore.

I absolutely would not want my kids any where near my FOO. Perhaps for a visit but nothing more. Even if I never get back with Beast I would not return back there. I might go somewhere new, but never back to my FOO. I wouldn't inflict that upon myself or my children. They deserve better.

I was actually pleasantly surprised at his reaction, he seemed sympathetic and not annoyed by my disturbing him at midnight. A deeper part of me knew I could talk to him about this, because as you say he knows all this. I have shared it with you guys in bits as an unidentified person on a forum, but no one in real life knows all this...no one bar Beast. In the same way I know his dark bits, he knows mine. I guess I knew he would be receptive even in his state, though one day that might bite me in the ass if he goes further down the MLC tunnel. I guess I took a risk and it payed off.

And a ''sane healthy family'' was the only thing I ever wanted. Typing that actually sends me into a flood of tears. That was the whole reason I moved here, married Beast, did everything ''by the book'', got married, had kids...the whole point was to have a ''sane healthy family'' and then MLC took it. Be it forever or just temporarily. That is the crux of my deep pain with MLC and what I feel I have truly lost.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline hopeandfaith

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #45 on: June 22, 2019, 04:49:52 PM »
Oh Morte,  I wish you could see yourself as we all see you now.  I think most of the time you do but understandably, you have been dragged back to the pit of your past momentarily.  Lord knows how you managed to build a sane healthy family without any sort of model to go by.  It must be your internal guidance system that shows you the way.  The same system that has you showing kindness & compassion to Beast.  It is in YOU so perhaps these times are a reminder that it can't be taken from you. 

I struggle big time with the fact that 'the book' lied or at the very least, not many people seem to read the book.  Now that I know this, do I want to change the way I show up in the world? - not particularly....I still have to sleep every night.  I am working on my expectations of others though because a holier than thou attitude from me is only going to cause me pain - they just don't care.  Anyhoo, I digress.

Sending your support to the family is a hard one.  There would be some real pain going on there but you are never going to be able communicate with them on any meaningful level about that.  If they want to communicate about something this big on Facebook then perhaps that is where you meet them.  It is their chosen language/medium. 

Really pleased (and not totally surprised) that Beast was there for you last night.  The bond is strong.
BD's in May 09, Sept 12 - suspected OW
Left home Jan 12 2013
OW confirmed Feb 2013
Moved home April 11 2014
BD again in April 2017 - clinging. 
Moved out July 2017
D19, D17 and S15

Offline Milly

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #46 on: June 23, 2019, 12:06:42 AM »
Morte, I'm sorry you had to deal with Devil sister. I have one of those, too. I can see it stirred up a lot of pain.  I understand your feelings of having to engage because of their titles, but with these kinds of people you are doomed if you do and doomed if you don't. I'm much older than you, and I've finally had to accept that there is no way of having a relationship with my Devil sister, unless it's to accept everything she throws at me, whilst revering her. Still, even doing it that way, there's always a risk she'll find something I said wrong, and tell everyone around me a made up version of something that happened that I wasn't even aware of, never mind a part of, and alienate my family and friends from me.

I give up on my Devil sister. It saddens me because I have that sense of justice you have and that desire to have the good family I didn't have. But I've only realized since BD because Devil sister didn't even ask once how I was doing, and through the help of my IC, that these feelings of guilt thrown upon me by my Devil sister and mother, are their problems and not mine. I'm very sorry for you, though, because you are so young and MLC hit you, and you have 3 little kids, so a bit of sympathy from your family would be really helpful, never mind being made to feel worse.

I'm sorry for your step sister's brother. I wouldn't wish that upon anyone and of course that family is hurting very badly right now. But they didn't reach out to you to help you in any way did they?

What was nice was that Beast leant you his ear and sympathy. That's a good sign. He knows you, and there does seem to be a very strong bond there.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Music45

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #47 on: June 24, 2019, 12:44:35 AM »
You are so strong Mortes. Life has thrown you some extraordinarily difficult hurdles and you are still going. Still in the race. I agree with Treasur - the fact you can document all that shows how much of a survivor you are.
I wouldn't know where to begin with advice but all I would say re reaching out to this family is do whatever you need to do for YOU. Do what you need to do so you can feel happy [if that's the word] with your choice. If you'd feel better to contact, then do that or not. Do what you can live with and if you don't know what to do, do nothing.
Sending ((((hugs))))
Me: 51
H: 51
S:26 D:19 [They're his kids. I'm Step Mum. They both live with us - though D at Uni]
BD: April 2016
Many false returns.
Effectively moved out Nov 2017 [works away from home. Home occasional weekends]
Moved out full time: July 2018 after he renewed contact with OW.
OW: old school friend lives 200+ miles away.

Online UrsaMajor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #48 on: June 24, 2019, 01:25:03 AM »
Dear Mort,

I fully agree with what Music45 wrote. Reaching out is for YOU direct to them. Devil Sister can go to ... well... Hades. It is NOT about her (and, of course, that pisses her off).  Her revisionist history is simply a way that she uses to deny responsibility for her actions and the resulting consequences of them.  I have one of those too but a Devil Brother that I have not had any contact with since our Grandmother died in 2007. He was (and presumably still is) a con man, a thief, and a liar who I have no use for so I can understand where you are coming from. Therefore, they no longer figure into the equation....

So, short story longer - Do what feels right for you for whatever reasons feels right and do it with NO expectations.....

Me - 56
STBXW - 48
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Mid-Lifer filed for D
Waiting for final decree

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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #49 on: June 24, 2019, 04:52:17 AM »
Thanks everyone for the support.

In the end I sent my youngest sister a FB private message. The first one was a bit basic and she ignored it. I also messaged her mom (my ex step mom) something similar. Her mom told me what my sister was going through and how she was blaming herself. Apparently she had plans to call him that morning, and never got round to it...now he has killed himself...and she feels at fault. The next morning I sat down and really used my LBS skills to type how I felt and to explain that it is normal to question and blame yourself, but at the end there is nothing she could have done. If she had called she would question if something she had said caused it. Not matter her actions before she would question everything, that is common in this type of situation. I tried to explain depression takes hold of people and they can only help themselves type thing. I was very delicate in my wording, caring, but not emotional. She responded to that, and I spoke with her for a bit. It's the best I can do I am afraid.

It has been a couple of days and the FOO bee's nest has mostly passed. The only thing still sticky is how somehow during all this it became readily apparent just how deep my need for a 'sane happy family' or maybe not even sane...maybe just a 'whole happy family' was.

Don't get me wrong I always knew when I was younger ''I just want to be a good mom''. I always knew I wanted a family.

But now I am reflecting on how much of my life has been unconsciously programmed specifically for that goal.

I left my toxic FOO and metaphorically ran as fast as I could. I had my escape planned before I was even 18 and legally allowed to leave. I got a job on my 16th birthday and instead of spending it all like most teenagers do, I saved every penny. The only money I spent from my pay checks was to put gas in my Dad's truck to get myself to work. Even at 16 I knew that stuff didn't matter, that money was going to buy my freedom. I don't suppose I have ever told anyone that, or even admitted it out loud to myself.

I met and married a guy who just needed someone to give him a chance. I knew how that felt. To feel isolated and alone within your own family. To just need someone to understand you and love you. To give you a chance to make a good happy life. So I took my saved up money, bought myself a plane ticket, flew across the world and married him. We could build what neither of us had together.

I suppose it was risky. Particularly now giving the situation I am in. But honestly I would do it again. I can not express to anyone how deeply those 14 good years changed my life. I felt like I belonged. I felt happy. I felt safe. I felt at peace. I felt like I was finally building my dream that I didn't even know I was driven for. It was home.

More importantly were all the things from childhood I no longer felt at all. The icy cold wall built to block in emotions. The constant vigilance to be ''stronger'' and ''smarter'' and...Alpha?...was no longer there. The pent up anger and aggression. I actually 'felt' things. Sometimes I got overly weepy at watching acts of kindness...they still get me at times. When someone is acting kind with no benefit to themselves, when they are brave, or honourable. I know how rare it is, and it gets me every time.

I also have a tendency now to get a bit teary eyed and emotional at dumb things. Not the stereotypical ''oh my baby is going to school'' kind of crap. That doesn't make me emotional...it is stuff like sitting watching my favourite Disney movie, and a song comes on I remember from my childhood...and I look over to see my kids faces. Just something about that triggers me and I think it is a moment of ''I got my happy whole family'' or maybe ''this is what I should have had''. The reality is those moments trigger a profound sense of gratitude within me. A deep gratitude I don't think you can appreciate unless you have been in a similar circumstance. There is no amount of money in this world that can buy that feeling.

Anyway...what does all this mean and why is it important? I guess for some reason this FOO kick in the bee's nest, and the support and insight of this forum...has allowed to see my life in a little different light. To understand what my unconscious drivers have been. Why things that seems silly trigger me in a deep, profound way....and why the silliest happy family scenarios can make me so emotional.

This answers the question that we all are suppose to ask ourselves here on this site.

Why am I standing?

For the chance to get my whole happy family back.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Thunder

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #50 on: June 24, 2019, 05:36:01 AM »
Oh gosh Morte, I just caught up on your thread.

I'm so sorry this has happened.  The FB messages?  Ptttf!  Just put it out of your head.  You can't change people.  Miserable people like that just don't change, they only try to take others down with them.

You had the courage, at a very young age, to leave a very dysfunctional environment.  I applaud you for that.
You knew you didn't want that kind of life for yourself so you moved and made a beautiful life with your H and your sweet babies.
I hope your H realizes how blessed he is and comes to his senses one day.  He's giving up a lot.

{{{Big Hug}}}
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #51 on: June 24, 2019, 05:55:12 AM »
It sounds as if the universe presented you with one of those moments that whip a cover off something really important. Both about you and about what brought you and the Beast together.

And I gulped a bit when you said about that deep feeling of gratitude and the joy of feeling like 'home'. Yup.

I think you showed grace, empathy and compassion in your second FB message. We all know here how important it is when you are in shock and grieving to feel that someone simply sees and hears you without judgment. I hope that some of what you said might help your step sister in some way particularly if your/her family is unable or unwilling to do that.

So, I don't know where these realisations will lead you or what it will mean for your standing choice. But it does sound as if it reminded you of things to feel deeply grateful for in those 14 years and a clear sense of why you are standing or what for, I suppose. I remember that one of your almost 'red button' past moments was that as you saw it Beast was unwilling to fight for his family. Do you still feel that way now? And bc you are a fighter...in your own nature and as part of your FOO experience as you have described it, is there another way to 'fight'?

What does 'whole' mean, Morte? Or 'happy' in the context of family? Is it an absolute thing for you or a spectrum with a cut off point or a set of alternative versions?

I can't tell you how much admiration I have for your character and grit and honesty with yourself. Sometimes reading your recent posts is like watching a plant grow or a rose bloom  :)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline Finding Joy

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #52 on: June 24, 2019, 07:28:49 PM »
I relate in so many ways to your story!  Having that whole happy family was my lifelong dream due to FOO issues.  I sure hope one way or another you get yours! 
Married 19 years
Husband is 42
I am 38
BD-October 10 2018-ILYBNIL, wants a divorce, this after I found out about OW 1(EA), I believe he is on to OW 2(PA)
BD 2-March 2019-He is getting an apartment

4 kids 5-14 years

But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.

Offline hopeandfaith

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #53 on: June 25, 2019, 04:06:21 AM »
I can't tell you how much admiration I have for your character and grit and honesty with yourself. Sometimes reading your recent posts is like watching a plant grow or a rose bloom  :)

Nicely said Treasur - hitting the 'like' button ;)
BD's in May 09, Sept 12 - suspected OW
Left home Jan 12 2013
OW confirmed Feb 2013
Moved home April 11 2014
BD again in April 2017 - clinging. 
Moved out July 2017
D19, D17 and S15

Offline Whyus

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #54 on: June 25, 2019, 06:19:11 AM »
Sorry morte, im all caught up and a Little sad that your having a hard time. Is sorry that your FOO issues are exposed again and you have nobody to talk to. Im in a similar Situation, i couldnt really talk to my Family about my crap. It didnt feel right to unload on People who I hardly get to see in the flesh ad worry them, a different reason maybe but I still felt alone.
Your H is a real Idiot for putting you through this hell after all you have done for him. It would be nice if a dog would head butt him too, it may wake him up.
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. W is actually getting People to accept/Tolerate them.
2 Sons - 19 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline KeepItTogether

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #55 on: June 26, 2019, 04:57:05 PM »
Wow--you are truly amazing my friend. TO have the FOO you do and yet still manage to be one of the more rationale, calm and methodical LBS I've encountered is nothing short of a miracle.

You just wanted a family. And well, you got one. Yes this one has some warts presently. But don't they all a little?

Sorry about the trauma of your Devil sister's brother. That is really sad. But the words of wisdom and consolation you had for her, in spite of her seemingly nasty side, were pure gold. It reminds me that most people who are hurting deep down are more particularly nasty than others. And most of the time, a little kindness shown to them does far more good than giving them back their nastiness. This LBS stuff seems to translate well into the rest of our lives doesn't it?


Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #56 on: June 28, 2019, 04:05:53 AM »
Well Beast managed to give me his flu or whatever zombie plague he brought back from his washed out poop filled festival. Yay. :(

Monday and Tuesday I had the sniffles but soldiered through as moms do.

Wednesday was my youngest's nursery trip to the beach. I asked Beast if he was going weeks ago, he said yes, I even paid the £5 for him to have a seat on the bus. Tuesday night I reminded him of the times, asked if he was still coming. He replied ''Hmmm..'' I read it..did not respond. I knew what was coming. Some litany of excuses of why he couldn't make it. I didn't reply. About 2 hours after his ''Hmm..'' he then said ''That wasn't much of an answer was it'' and I replied ''Nope''. At least he seems to be catching on. I decided to assume he wasn't coming, but packed an extra lunch and water bottle in case he did. Worst case we got an extra lunch between us.  ;)

Wednesday AM I get a ''not very good weather for the Beach'' text. I completely ignore it. I expected it from the ''hmmm'' last night. Internally I am raging. The guy who gets so upset when strangers ditch him, is now trying to find an excuse to ditch his three year old. But LBS training says 'Say nothing' so I contain my rage, and try to make the best of it in my head. I get our stuff all packed, take the older two to school and me and youngest drag our bags out in front of the nursery to wait for the bus.

Then my phone rings...it's Beast. He says ''You are a hard woman to reach'' and I say ''Not really'' and then he says ''Nice outfit''. :o I whip my head around and here he is coming a dishevelled mess running to the nursery just in time. Honestly I am surprised because he was building up his excuse book since last night, yet here he is at the last second. I suppose his conscious is still alive in there somewhere.   ;)

The trip to the beach was good. We had a great time. Lots of talking so much so I forget all of it to be fair. That is just what tends to happen when it is just us. We talk and talk and talk. You'd almost forget he walked out on me and son and is in the middle of an affair. Details.  ::)

He did go on about his book. He is now editing it. Seems to still be progressing well. I don't know what possessed me to say it but I said ''You know if you actually finish and publish it I will be super impressed. It will be the first thing you have finished of your own initiative and you should be proud of that''. It is completely true so what the hell. He actually agreed saying he has never finished anything and he looked...dare I say...touched? I am not sure. Definitely went down as a positive anyway.

Toward the end of the trip something very unusual happened. As we were walking out toward the park we saw a man passing with a coffee and we both were like ''Where did he get that from?!'' and I joked he must have walked miles for it.  Turns out there was now an ice cream man who was also selling coffees. Beast offered to buy me and son an item. I was looking at the sign to find the prices for coffee but it was no where to be seen. Now keep in mind EVERY time this sort of thing happened before he would INSIST that I ask the person the price, or pick something else because he didn't want to be 'awkward' and ask them. But this time I said ''I don't see a price for coffee do you?'' and instead of getting upset or weird he just said ''No problem, I will ask him''.  ??? What the actual hell?! It sounds so stupid for normal people but considering this has never happened in 16 years I was a bit like  :o :o :o I got my coffee, son got his ice cream, and Beast got one point toward turning into a grown up. ;)

We went to the park because it wasn't time to get back on the bus yet, and son was having a play. They had a very tall climbing frame that had net ladders on both sides. It was perfectly safe as there was no way son could fall (see the nets on both sides) but due to the height...Beast anxiety went into overdrive. He was all ''I don't like him up there, get him down'' panic station mode. ::) I calmly said ''Beast, I know you are having anxiety but please keep calm. I don't want him to get frightened because you are.'' He sorta put a sock in it but was still pacing back and forth, I could see he was internally struggling. Son made it to the top as I was cheering him on, then he climbed down the other side. He was so excited and proud of himself. Beast was worked up into a cold sweat, and decided we were no longer going to play at the park we were going to go sit by the bus. It is funny to note that even after son was off the climbing frame, and we were walking toward the bus, Beast was trying to talk about it not quiet saying sorry but stuff like ''You know how I am'' and I said ''I wonder how much of that is who you are versus how you were raised. I don't want our kids to be raised in that anxiety fuelled way because I see how much you struggle with it''...and that seemed to get him in a bit of a thinky mode.

Anyway we got back just in time for the school run so Beast only stayed for about an hour more to see the older two before skedaddling off.

Thursday I could barely get out of my bed. Clearly I pushed myself to much with all the activities, and everything was hurting. My eyeballs...my teeth. I literally got up to go to the toilet then had to rest before I had the energy to go downstairs to make food. :-\ It was horrendous. Unbeknownst to me daughter texted Beast that I was super ill, and later in the day he brought some stuff round. I didn't even know about it until I heard a chap at my door followed by it cracking open and  ''Hello?!''. He didn't stay long, it was like a scheduled drop. In... dropped off some snacks etc, then out he had to go. But honestly I am surprised he came at all. :o

Today I am still coughy and what not but my aches are gone and my energy level is back up. It also happens to be the day that I collect our new puppy. I am not sure if I posted about it yet...I think I did..but anyway. We are getting a little collie puppy who has nearly an entire white face except for one black patch over his eye. Looks like he is wearing a pirate patch or a dog monocle. Cute as anything.  ;D
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #57 on: June 28, 2019, 04:20:13 AM »
Yay for the Pirate Puppy! Sounds adorable  :)

And yay too for your gently putting the boundary in place that you don't want your kids raised from a starting place of anxiety. As you say, we all see the cost of that.

Like you I am jolly surprised that Beast may actually finish his book...will be interesting to see what he takes from that and it was fair and kind for you to say what you did. Funny, I know they run from us bc we know them so well...off to the uninformed schmoopie cheerleading...but they also miss out on the authentic affirmation of someone who really knows them and their path don't they? Some - and maybe Beast is one - might still partly know how valuable that is for any of us. Certainly most LBS know how hard it is to be your only cheerleader!
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

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Online UrsaMajor

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #58 on: June 28, 2019, 05:06:08 AM »
WOW!  Totally.... WOW!

Yeah YOU!  VERY impressive but nothing less than SuperMort....

Me - 56
STBXW - 48
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
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Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Mid-Lifer filed for D
Waiting for final decree

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Offline One day at a time

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #59 on: June 28, 2019, 05:53:57 AM »
I'm in love with your puppy already!! Interesting about the "no price" and the book.. Maybe Beast is growing up a little bit after all..

I have to say Morte, you give me a reality check.. I was getting a bit anxious today thinking about having to support myself, being so far away from home, having no family around and just feeling this is all too much (small pity party, I know) And there's you... having all of that PLUS 3 kids, a dog and now a puppy, getting your degree... You can do it all and so can I, I just need to stop worrying about it because the worry doesn't change any of it. Thank you, just reading your update made me feel a bit better  :)
H - 42 (40 @BD1)
M - 42 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.
Confirmation H and OW are together, presume PA  - 3rd June 2019

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Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #60 on: June 29, 2019, 02:12:19 AM »
So...now my grumpy neighbours officially thinks we are nut cases courtesy of Beast.  :-[

Now let me give you some history here. Grumpy neighbour and his wife Mrs Pissy have lived next door to us since before we moved in. At first we rented this property before buying it. When we first moved in Mrs Pissy was happy because the tenants before us apparently were not very nice, having cops called etc. I don't know the whole story I just know they got evicted for being 6 months behind on rent, the kitchen cupboards were chewed up from a rampant dog they had, and the garden was a state. Anyway we moved in (Me, Beast, and a then 4 year old and 2 year old). We were friendly saying hello, passing in a wee Christmas card ''from ###''. The usual neighbour stuff.

The first year was 'okay' in that Mrs Pissy would say hello when putting out the bins etc, but the pair of them always look miserable. Not trying to stereotype here but they are a middle age couple 40-50, they have 1 daughter who is a teenager, their garden is pristine and perfectly landscaped...and only used when the weather is nice. But there came a spell in summer time when Mrs Pissy wanted to sit out in her garden ALL day in her sun lounger reading her book. So when I let my small kids into the garden to kick a ball, play bubbles, or in the water hose toy...she would get irritated at the noise, at bubbles 'flying over her lawn', if her fence got even a little wet... Whatever we did there was a problem and she would mutter to herself, and storm in the house. Trying to be a 'good neighbour' I would keep the kids in the house if I knew she was out, or maybe only let them out for 30-40 minutes before bringing them in the house. I made sure the kids didn't scream, they only ''rolled'' the ball instead of kicking it, I tried to blow the bubbles low and on the opposite side...I moved the water toys... I went to ridiculous lengths to placate this lady (Hello Fixer, how are you). This was highly unfair to the kids as during a nice summer they need more then that to go out and play, but I didn't want to cause issues.

Fast forward a few years and we had gotten my oldest dog, and then had a new baby. I wouldn't say anything changed for them really but the kids were older and out more, and sometimes wanted to play ball with the dog in the garden. They aren't extremely loud, my dog only barks at the postman or delivery guy, so life is pretty normal...at least I think. But progressively each summer Mrs Pissy glares more, stares through the fence, storms into her house if we come out... It even came to a point I had a delivery from amazon once that said ''Tried to leave package with neighbour, she refused''. Honestly I was shocked. Who refuses a delivery for the neighbour?!

Mr Grumpy always looks miserable, he washes his car to a routine, takes out the trash in his robe and slippers, and they go for an evening walk after dinner. I don't think I have ever seen either of them smile. He helped me get my fridge in the house when we renovated the kitchen, but other then that he keeps to himself. I don't think he is a bad guy, but I think he is unhappy in his life.  Then one year the snow was really really bad. I had to help shovel it, and Mr Grumpy was out too. That day Mr Grumpy was actually pretty nice. He offered my son a bucket so he could carry down street salts, he helped me clear my drive way, then I helped him dig out his TWO cars. Mrs Pissy of course was tucked up in the house with her cup of tea watching whatever drivel she watches. I saw the blinds twitch every now and then, but she didn't come out once in the HOURS we were out there. I thought maybe this was going to go a way toward helping the situation and was pretty happy.

That spring Mr Grumpy asked if it would be okay to come into my garden in the coming week. He was putting up a new fence around his property and wondered if it would be okay to have access to do the repairs or whatever. Of course I said that would be fine, tidied away the garden toys etc..and let him at it. I came home one day from having the kids out, and notice that him and Mrs Pissy are reposting the old fence onto my side, and have built their new fence where the old one used to be. In essence they have created a double fence between the yards. Personally this didn't bother me as frankly it will hopefully stop her glaring through the fence slats at my kids. ::) Honestly I was more surprised SHE was helping him.

That summer was fine, Beast helped paint the fence, tidy up the garden, we had BBQs and played on good days then....BD.

Anyway we don't have many interactions at all now. My kids aren't out in the garden much during Scottish winter, and we take the dog a walk on good days so they play in the park. But here lately it is summer time so they are 'reclaiming' play time in the garden.

Which leads us up to yesterday.

Yesterday the kids were outside playing with a minion ball. They were kicking it between them and one of them hit it off the shed and it ricocheted into the Grumpy neighbours garden. Sigh. Instead of just throwing the ball back into the garden, or even just saying ''Please don't kick the ball over or something''....Mrs Pissy apparently screams at my daughter ''For F sake, don't kick that ball into my garden!'' before launching it over and storming into her house. Of course this freaks the kids out and they come running inside to tell me (I was currently in the toilet. Why does this crap always happen when you are in the toilet?! You mom's will totally understand  ;)). Now I would be the first to say if my kids did that on a routine basis I could see why she would be annoyed. But this is literally the FIRST time the kids have played ball outside this year. THE FIRST. I asked my daughter what happened 3 times, confirmed with son...making sure she wasn't being dramatic or exaggerating. Inside I was kind of annoyed but not very surprised.

And just about this time...Beast shows up to collect the kids for the weekend ( a first BTW). He has decided to collect them because I am ill, but also low key because I think he wanted to see the new pup. Anyway... daughter makes the mistake of telling Beast doesn't she. She tells him exactly what happened and he was instantly seeing red. Like proper Monstery.  I have seen him get mad like this before, so I tried to calm him down and say ''it's fine, it's okay,'' ''I have to live next to these people'' but he just wasn't having it. He STORMED over there and beat on the door...the first thing Mrs Pissy said to him was ''Keep calm, keep calm'' before apparently inviting him in for a chat. I can assure you that when we could no longer see Beast me and daughter were absolutely sweating it. I am thinking ''Why did he go in their house?! What is he doing/saying/ahhhhhh!''. I have never experienced this from Beast. He has never been confrontational with anyone besides me.  :o

After a few minutes he comes back... and I breathe a small sigh of relief as I see no visible signs of a physical fight. Once he is in he has now taken on this hardman persona that is also slightly elated ''almost high'' on the fact that he said something. Of course I asked him what the hell happened. He said after she said ''Keep calm keep calm'' he said to her ''Look I am not having anyone swearing at my kids,''. She apparently invited him in to chat and started going on about how she has all her fancy plant pots or what have you and doesn't want a ball knocking them over, and claims she never swore, but accepts she did shout....he said ''Look I am not there as much as I was, but I can't be having you shouting at my kids. It made me lose my temper'' and she said ''I could say that the way you were stomping over''....anyway apparently after the 'conversation' he says they seemed okay with him. Personally I think he just certified that we are 'those neighbours' and I am married to a nutter. Sigh.

Honestly that would have really bothered me before. The image that I am married to a nutter. But now I just don't have the energy to care anymore.

I slightly mused on how did I go from a married, 3.5 kids wholesome stay at home mom.....to a single mom of three, with a nutter husband/'exe'.

After this incident I wouldn't be surprised if the neighbours avoid me like the plague. At the end of the day it likely won't matter much as I image we will be moving one day. Probably because 1.) This is a 3 bedroom house, and we can't expect the kids to share once they are all teens, 2.) Divorce may force sale, 3.) I always viewed this as a temporary home.

So time to embrace my life as a single mom of three with a nutter exe. I suppose I should lose my bra and wear a tube top...stick my wine cooler in a beer cosy....fill up the kids paddling pool and sit in it with my hair rollers in. Might as well go all out right?!  8)

P.S. Right before he left Beast said ''At least you know if anyone hurt you I would have no problem killing them''... :o :o Which was really freaking odd
« Last Edit: June 29, 2019, 02:21:25 AM by Mortesbride »
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline stillbaffled

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #61 on: June 29, 2019, 06:05:16 AM »

So time to embrace my life as a single mom of three with a nutter exe. I suppose I should lose my bra and wear a tube top...stick my wine cooler in a beer cosy....fill up the kids paddling pool and sit in it with my hair rollers in. Might as well go all out right?!  8)


Oh Morte.....this just cracked me up!   ;D

Mr. Grumpy and Mrs. Prissy......man, I'm sure thankful for the neighbors I currently have after reading the above.  Yikes! 

I just shake my head and remain baffled, as always, in regards to your "nutter" husband.  Double yikes!   :o
After all, tomorrow is another day.
Together 16 years - married 6
BD - 1/1/16 - his 53rd birthday
His divorce final 7/16
Married OW - 7/17
a consistent semi-vanisher in the same small town

Offline Milly

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #62 on: June 29, 2019, 06:07:38 AM »
Good laugh, Morte! Yes, the nutter, you just can't make this stuff up! However, I'm quite impressed by your incapable-of-asking-for-particular-ice-cream H going over and making sure nobody mistreats his kids. Takes guts to do that. As long as he doesn't murder them, of course!
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
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OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #63 on: June 29, 2019, 12:57:54 PM »
Hello,

Quote
He STORMED over there and beat on the door...the first thing Mrs Pissy said to him was ''Keep calm, keep calm'' before apparently inviting him in for a chat.

Based upon what you have posted prior, I think Beast handled it quite well. I thought he would have started throwing everything you own into their garden. Mrs. Pissy knew she had started something otherwise she wouldn't have started with her calm down routine.

I also liked that he focused on the issue. "Don't yell at my kids." I can accept that. If his kids do something that makes them upset, come talk to you. If they are throwing rocks, yes, yell to make them stop and then come over and talk to you.

Many people forget that children are children and they don't act or think like adults. That's why we raise them into adults. We need to learn to be a little more relaxed when it comes to neighbors with children. I have had my fair share of toys tossed in my backyard. I just carefully toss them back. It's not they are intentionally throwing things into my yard, they are just playing.

Quote
Honestly I was shocked. Who refuses a delivery for the neighbour?!

Well honestly, until last year, I lived in the hood. You have to be careful on what was delivered to your house.

The final is this,

Quote
Right before he left Beast said ''At least you know if anyone hurt you I would have no problem killing them''... :o :o Which was really freaking odd

Now on the off chance you decide to become the next Charles Manson, you already have the first member of your family.

Hope you feel better,

((((Ready)))))

 
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Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #64 on: June 30, 2019, 12:44:32 AM »
Good laugh, Morte! Yes, the nutter, you just can't make this stuff up! However, I'm quite impressed by your incapable-of-asking-for-particular-ice-cream H going over and making sure nobody mistreats his kids. Takes guts to do that. As long as he doesn't murder them, of course!

Yeah this is what is so odd about it. The guy couldn't phone a dentist. He wouldn't complain to the restaurant about giving him a wrong order.. Sure he would b!tc# and moan under his breath...but this?

I don't know. I guess it is hard to explain but definitely a shift happening there.



Based upon what you have posted prior, I think Beast handled it quite well. I thought he would have started throwing everything you own into their garden.


I actually had to laugh because that does sound like some silly ass passive aggressive $h!te he would have done before.

As far as the hood well...we don't live anywhere close to that lol. We live next to the school, in a good street, with good people. The type who probably leave their front doors unlocked, and kids leave bikes in the front garden because no one steals them. I have lived in places like that when I was a kid in USA, this is not that.

Be interesting to see what he says when he comes in today. I assume since he collected them he will bring them back. We shall see.
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Offline seahorse

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #65 on: June 30, 2019, 05:49:25 PM »
Bride:
Reattaching.
Anxiously awaiting to see how the drop-off goes.
Hopefully less anxiety-provoking than the pick-up.

Sea
Seahorses have one mate for life...

Offline hopeandfaith

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #66 on: June 30, 2019, 10:29:43 PM »
Those do seem like quite big changes for your Beastie boy Morte!

I wonder if your neighbours' crazy might have just matched by your H's crazy and he's done you a huge favour.  She sounds like a bully and they normally do well with a telling off.  They actually sound a bit like 2 peas in a pod on some level.

I guess if the ball wrecks a plant when it goes over the fence you could replace it.  Now there's a shocker of a solution hey ::)
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Offline KeepItTogether

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #67 on: July 02, 2019, 04:28:30 PM »
Good laugh, Morte! Yes, the nutter, you just can't make this stuff up! However, I'm quite impressed by your incapable-of-asking-for-particular-ice-cream H going over and making sure nobody mistreats his kids. Takes guts to do that. As long as he doesn't murder them, of course!

Yeah this is what is so odd about it. The guy couldn't phone a dentist. He wouldn't complain to the restaurant about giving him a wrong order.. Sure he would b!tc# and moan under his breath...but this?

I don't know. I guess it is hard to explain but definitely a shift happening there.


Yes well I do think many here have that conflict avoidant thing going for them.  But once they unleash the beast ( literally in your case LOL), they truly do and say  things that are shocking. My H called our real estate agent selling our rental a "C-You-Next-Tuesday."  On the phone in real time. She called my quite upset and I have to ask her 3 times to repeat b/c he is normally quite reserved....and almost a scardy cat. Of course calling a woman such a name is inexcusable. And even more so in the context it was. Totally uncalled for.  Just monster spew thankfully aimed elsewhere.

Yay--beast will kill for you. Fidelity...well...that's another issue. They are children.
Me 47
H 46
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #68 on: July 03, 2019, 12:13:32 PM »
Ah well we are back.  :)

So Sunday he brought kids back, nothing exciting. He was in and out as fast as. Looked a bit haggered from a weekend full of three kids but nothing unusual.

Mon-Tue all was quiet. Unusually quiet. No random texts or anything.

I had a weird dream that Beast booked Disneyland with him and OW for 2 weeks in November. In my dream I was super pissed. Not because he was going with her, but because he was going with her instead of his kids. By super pissed I told him if he went, I didn't want to see his face around here ever again. And I absolutely meant it.

Tuesday night he turned up (online) wanting to play games with me and son (who were already playing).

Wednesday (today) he turned up for visitation at 1 pm with his gardening tools and a change of clothes. He spent a good portion of the day outside tidying up the back garden and I must admit it looks 100 times better. He was chatty and friendly but nothing overly interesting was said.

He was still working at dinner time so I made him a plate, because I was raised in the South and that is what you do. Manners and being polite...I skipped the whole ''Bless your heart'' chat though. ;) It was funny when I was pulling some roasted veg out the oven I said to him ''Watch your arm I don't wanna burn you'' and he said ''Why not?'' and I said ''Your right, do me a favour, hold this pan''  :P

He had a shower, came back down to eat with me and the kids, then got up and washed the dishes?!  :o

Wish I had him this well trained when he lived here... ???

So..sorry to disappoint but nothing new or major really. Typical clinger behaviour I suppose.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2019, 12:14:33 PM by Mortesbride »
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #69 on: July 06, 2019, 08:49:47 AM »
I've found myself visiting the forums with less enthusiasm again.

Sometimes it is days between visits...sometimes I check in on two or three threads before I just wonder off and do something else.

I am sure that is probably normal around here. I guess it would be more abnormal to sit here day after day for hours reading threads that all say some account of nearly the same thing.

People marching on through limbo. Some washing their hands of it, yet still returning. Some stuck here just waiting and hoping. Some in terrible pain. Some have made it toward the end, and are working for what we all hope for.

At the same time that it makes you feel part of something, it also makes me feel....something else that I can't quiet name.

I guess I find it easier just to get up, 'walk away', and get on with it. I still think about Beast daily, but generally only fleetingly. No more consuming thoughts.

Yesterday I dug out my flower bed, that has had weeds growing in it for two years. They have been cut but not pulled out so of course they continue to grow back, and spread. I was to busy with the kids, finances, and the weeds in my head to be bothered with something as mundane as gardening.  ::)

But now we are creeping closer to two years. It feels like it was a long time ago, yet no time at all. Always relative and depending on the situation.

So out I went and pulled weeds, dug out the flower bed, resoiled it and planted my dahlias. Six hours I was out there in all. I have blisters on my hands from the rake, and so much soil under my nails I had to cut them all off because it just wasn't coming out.

Today I hung some solar lights along the fences. I have been wanting them for years, and Beast always moaned and complained. I suppose for a while after they leave you still think to yourself ''I better not do anything to drastic, in case he doesn't like it'', then you go through a phase of barely remembering to change the bed sheets and sweep the floors with all the nonsense you need to sort through. Then you get to the ''F them. It's my house, my rules''. I suppose I have had shifts of that over the last while, but it was always temporary. Now it is a full blown need.

A need to reclaim all the things I WANTED to do, but never got to do. Things I would get criticised for or moaned at. Things that wouldn't make the cut because someone needed something else instead.

So my flower bed has been revamped, solar lights are up, I got some new outdoor chairs, a beautiful crystal and silver wind chime, and I cleaned out the shed of all the useless crap he had been keeping in there....

I have also ordered the kids one of those little summer houses for the garden. I already got ideas for painting, bunting, lights, and such inside. The kids have wanted one since my daughter was about 4. We 'never had the money' and it was always put off. She is nearly 9 now, and soon will be far to big to enjoy something like that. I don't want her to grow up and remember all the things she never got because we couldn't afford it.

So I got it. Beast will moan and complain I am sure. ''What did you buy that for? I could have got a proper shed for that'' but...to bad. I am sure after his initial reaction he is going to want to build it. Not sure the kids want a wonky house though so we shall see.  ;)

Perhaps this is just a summer buzz. DIY and house reclamation after essentially a two year hibernation. Whatever it is keeps me busy, distracted, and benefits my house.

But I can also see how easy it is for people to just walk away. From the forum, from MLC, from fighting a fight that most people don't even see.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline seahorse

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #70 on: July 06, 2019, 08:53:49 AM »
Morte -

Perhaps you're seeking the forum less because you no longer need the guidance, help, affirmation.

You've settled into your own life, yet keep in touch with others who have the same history as you (in parts at least).

Visit when you want.

Your new yard sounds lovely...  YOUR yard!

Sea
Seahorses have one mate for life...

Offline Milly

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #71 on: July 06, 2019, 11:55:32 AM »
Me, too, love everything you did in your garden! Love you're doing things the way you want because you can! It's your pink fridge moment!

My H would also always complain of not having enough money for things for the house or garden or kids, so we were always scrambling. I know now that it's a stinginess in my H, he looked after himself but didn't want to spend on anyone else, not even his kids. Of course, it's my fault too for allowing it.

Anyway, great headway in your space. I found that once I started altering my living spaces in a visible way, it helped me to start living life my way and not just the 'waiting' way. It's a big step forward. xxx
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline readytofixmyselffirst

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #72 on: July 07, 2019, 12:21:00 PM »
Hello,

Quote
I've found myself visiting the forums with less enthusiasm again.

It's very normal and expected. I took a five year break in action. Just hit rock bottom my friend. Everything all hit at once and I just walked away. I made plans to return back to the forum when I defended my dissertation. Didn't think it would take five years though. My own journey through the wilderness.

MLC takes a long time. We go through periods of time where little changes, nothing happening on any fronts. We have jobs, children, and other activities in real life that take out time. The forum has to take the back seat and so does your MLCer.

One thing I admire about you is that you have your priorities straight. You decision to build a life independent of anyone is wise. To be able to take care of yourself and your children without the support of anyone is paving the way. Your next relationship will not be dependent on another. Whether it is Beast or someone else, your next relationship will be built upon enhancement not need. That your life alone is strong and the other person on your life makes you stronger. Big difference. If gives you a lot more choice and control.

Keep studying and taking care of your family. Come back and post when necessary. I really do appreciate your quick wit and charming stories.

(((Hugs))

Ready

"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #73 on: July 09, 2019, 10:18:16 PM »
Attaching.  I'm one of those sporadic forum visitors that you speak of.  I understand completely.
M-41
H-43
S-18
D-16
S-14
Friends 7y before M
Married 14y
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniv.
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Eng. off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Saw his POF the first month back
1.5y later no signs of anyone new - workaholic

Link to my journey: 
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10630.new#new

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass - it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Don't become a container for bitterness.  It's a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes - some things have to break apart so better things can be built."

"If we don't take time to heal, we will bleed on people who didn't cut us."

Offline Whyus

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #74 on: July 09, 2019, 10:56:00 PM »
Morte, dont worry about the Forum, its totally normal. I try and check in everyday but if I dont then I dont and thats all.
I dont have much to Report anyways except for my GAL activities but I sure wont be complaining about having a boring thread again, we know what happened last time  ;D

I am so happy for you that you cleaned up the weeds and started to Change your home into something that you want and not something that beastie Boy wanted. I done exactly what I wanted in my new house, I even painted a big wooded gardrobe cupboard (which XW loved) black and Grey and it Looks stonkingly good  :o, she would stop in her tracks if she were to see it but its all mine now, just another Piece of her past life which she didt want anymore and has blossomed without her  ;D .
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. W is actually getting People to accept/Tolerate them.
2 Sons - 19 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #75 on: July 12, 2019, 04:03:31 AM »
Was just scrolling through some news articles and managed to come across an article where a famous singer is quoted talking about her late ex who died of a drug overdose and she said:  ''He was the best person ever, and he didn’t deserve the demons he had. I was the glue for such a long time, and I found myself becoming...less and less sticky. The pieces just started to float away.'' 

And boy if that didn't strike the nail on the head eh?  :o

I feel you sister.

Anyway this week I took the kids to see the new Aladdin. It was mostly okay, with a few new songs that made you go  :o but overall enjoyable. Mid way through the movie I had an invasive thought that I was here watching it with my kids (as should be done), and I know Beast had likely sat in this same cinema watching it with Skittles. I took a minute to process how I felt about that. Was I jealous? Was I mad? No. Honestly I felt really sad for him. There is no one else in the world you should share remade childhood movies with other than your own children. How sad to think he missed that to entertain his child woman.  ::) I really dug deep through it to find any other emotions but all there was is a sort of sadness or almost pity. Watching someone be so blind to what is important. But perhaps that is just me putting to much importance on watching a movie with kids.  :P

Wednesday wasn't to exciting. I previously asked Beast (2 weeks back) if he would consider taking the kids away for his Wed visit over the summer. I love my kids but having them from 8 am -11 pm (some nights) is exhausting. People laugh and joke how mom's miss the kids going to school and we are all driven nuts...well anyone who laughs I suggest you get locked in a house with 3 kids, limited money and need to make 5 meals + drinks + snacks+ break up fights over the wrong colour bowl. Meanwhile these chores need done, the floor is constantly dirty even though you JUST mopped it, and someone somewhere has dropped food in a place it shouldn't be. See how long you last. ;)

So this Wednesday he showed up in the toy car (which the kids were only moderately ripping) and took them out from 1-5 pm. It was enough time to recharge and just get some peace and quiet.

Today the kids summer house is supposed to come. I was going to ask the nice neighbour next door (not Grumpy, the otherside  ;) ) if he would mind helping me build it for a pack of beers and some cash. A few years back I asked him to help me put up some wood trim on the stairs and he was happy to help. He works for a home repair company and has sheds and decking and such he built himself. Anyway that was the plan.

Beast of course has announced he is going to do the job. Volunteered to buy himself a power drill just to do it. I informed him if he totally botches the job he gets to pay for a replacement. I am not joking. He gave it the ''don't worry I got this'' line. Sigh. Conundrum.

Not sure when he is planning to do this. He has the kids this weekend, and I doubt he has bought the drill already. I could just go over and ask the neighbour to help me while the kids are away...but then Beast will take a flaming strop that he offered to help and I just spit in his face. Or I don't ask for help, and wait around for Beast to find time to do it.  ::) 

I have found these little DIY projects seem to be 'his way in'. Before BD he would have been thrilled to pay the neighbour to do it. Now he has to prove something. To bad the something isn't the thing we all hope for eh? ''Let's prove I can cut the grass, and build a play house...like most other humans on the planet.''

I suppose that is a little harsh and maybe unfair. Maybe it is him trying to be a nice person. Maybe he is trying to be a good dad. Maybe he is trying to show me he is still worthy and the ''number one guy''. Maybe he is trying to prove to himself I still need him.

And that is as far as my monkey braining will go. He gets two weeks. If it isn't built before the next weekend the kids are away I will ask the neighbour guy, or phone a local handy man guy.

You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Tyks

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #76 on: July 12, 2019, 04:21:54 AM »
Hi Morte.
I do believe he needs to feel needed by you. We have heard people here tell us about that often. My xh was like that (although I didn't realize it until after a year of no contact)

I think you made the right decision. Give him two weeks and if it is not done then get the neighbour guy. Two weeks will bring you to August and how much summer is left after that :)
Me 49
Him 49
22 years together - Married 20
BD1 - August 26, 2016 - ILYBINILWY
BD 2 - August 28, 2016 - OW discovered EA - Kicked him out
D16 D19
April 2017 - Legal Separation Agreement
August 2017 - I filed for divorce
Divorce final February 12 2018

Offline stillbaffled

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #77 on: July 12, 2019, 05:05:34 AM »

And that is as far as my monkey braining will go. He gets two weeks. If it isn't built before the next weekend the kids are away I will ask the neighbour guy, or phone a local handy man guy.


I'd say that's pretty darn reasonable and mighty gracious. 
After all, tomorrow is another day.
Together 16 years - married 6
BD - 1/1/16 - his 53rd birthday
His divorce final 7/16
Married OW - 7/17
a consistent semi-vanisher in the same small town

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #78 on: July 13, 2019, 05:10:10 AM »
So random vent/update.

Little bit of back story. Beast had a friend from over a decade ago that he used to work with. It was his only friend from work (a gentlemen a decade or more older than Beast). He was one of the only 'friends' Beast invited to our wedding. The guy is a bit eccentric, a little bit of an oddball... but he is polite, well mannered, and generally a nice guy.

Beast changed jobs and they kept in touch sporadically. Rather I should say the guy kept in touch with Beast. Every now and then we would get a post card in for Christmas with an update. A random text or FB message out the blue. Then he would go quiet for some time.

Well a couple months ago said friend tried to contact Beast through my number (since it is the one we have had from the start). I gave him Beast's direct number without really saying much besides ''this is my phone, his number is X''. Anyway he has tried to arranged numerous coffee catch up dates with Beast, one of which he cancelled due to someone being ill ....Beast took this as 'being ditched'...and Beast is now playing hard ball refusing to meet up. He always takes it very personally.

Anyway said nutball friend decided to post ON MY FACEBOOK TIMELINE?! A picture of himself next to his elderly mother in a hospital bed?!  :o with a message saying to the effect of: Can't get Beast to lock down a date, Hope you and the kids are well, sorry to hear you aren't together anymore, got my mom into a nursing home?!

Keep in mind I only know this guy from meeting him at my wedding and occasionally passing him in a Mall or cafe and speaking briefly as common courtesy. He is now not only posting images of his sickly mother on my FB timeline (who I have never even met) but writing a huge wall of text in CAPITAL LETTERS?! about my personal circumstances. :o :o :o :o AND since he apparently knows my personal circumstances why is he contacting me on why Beast won't meet up?! Shouldn't I be the last person you ask bro?! ???

I was kinda pissed off. I absolutely hate my personal business blasted all over FB. So I of course deleted the post then send him a text that read:

''Sorry to hear about your mom. I hope she's okay.

I can't really speak to why Beast hasn't met up with you. He hasn't been himself for some time. Currently he lives with his mother and is involved in an affair with a co-worker.

I am happy to hear from you, and how you guys are doing but I would appreciate if you wouldn't post things about my personal circumstances on FB.

I am a very private person and as you can imagine this situation has been very painful for me''.

He responded with a sorry, good wishes type thing.

I dunno. Maybe I was a bit harsh but sometimes we have to draw the line right? I felt like the whole thing was completely inappropriate.

And it is the first time I have actually vocalised what happened with someone besides MIL and my best friend.

It felt odd. I am sure Beast will not be impressed. I guess if he ever meets up for that coffee it will be harder to lie about ''us growing apart'' or whatever. But it isn't really my job to lie or cover up for him.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Online Treasur

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #79 on: July 13, 2019, 05:14:29 AM »
Don't think you were harsh at all, Morte.
I think it was a masterclass in Boundaries 101 and a lot of us could learn from it  :)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline One day at a time

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #80 on: July 13, 2019, 05:32:27 AM »
Jeez Morte, I would be royally p!!$$ed if anyone did something like that to me so I don't think you were harsh at all.. God, I don't know if I would have been able to write such a polite message like you did.. Absolute lack of boundaries! Vent away
H - 42 (40 @BD1)
M - 42 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.
Confirmation H and OW are together, presume PA  - 3rd June 2019

"One of the happiest moments in life is when you find the courage to let go of what you can’t change"

Offline Finding Joy

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #81 on: July 13, 2019, 10:08:56 AM »
You kept your lips zipped much more than I did!  Great job!  I told everyone who would listen what h had done back when I was at rock bottom.  What was that guy thinking?!  Crazy!
Married 19 years
Husband is 42
I am 38
BD-October 10 2018-ILYBNIL, wants a divorce, this after I found out about OW 1(EA), I believe he is on to OW 2(PA)
BD 2-March 2019-He is getting an apartment

4 kids 5-14 years

But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.

Offline MortesbrideTopic starter

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #82 on: July 19, 2019, 04:10:26 AM »
Hello! It's me again! How's it going?  8)

So we got the garden house built for the kids.

Beast went out and bought himself a power drill just for the occasion. He was determined HE was building the house and no one else.

It took us the better part of two days. Granted it was raining off and on so we had to stop at times for fear of you know...electrocution or whatever. ::) He was worried but I told him not to worry, I still have him insured.  ;) He attempted to cover the drill with a shopping bag that had a hole in it during the smaller bits of rain (which worked surprisingly well), but decided against it during the heavier stuff. Guess I won't be paying off the house this year.  ;D

All jokes aside it was like 9 hours on Wed, then it as a bit late so we called it. I didn't expect he would show up Thursday to finish the job (cuz  you know, that takes up both his days off  ::) ) but he did. Happy surprise I guess. That ladies and gentlemen is why we keep it at expectation level 0....then when they do something good it is a happy thing.  :D

There wasn't to much emotional or relationship type chat the first day, but the second day he started to talk. I was discussing having took the kids to the new Disney films and he said ''He is forced to watch them but drew the line at the Lion King'' (because it makes him sad). I sorta ignored an opportunity for a dig here but instead said something about how it is nice to watch the films we watched as kids with our own children. It is true, but also a bit of a truth dart because...well he isn't watching them with his children...

He talks about a lot of people he has yelled at or almost attacked. How it is getting harder for him to control it when he 'gets triggered'. Apparently he told a guy at work to leave him alone or he would ''cut his Fing head off''. Lots of other examples. It is like he is itching for a fight. Not with me...but with the world. He said ''It got worse when things ended between us. I know it was getting bad just before...but after things ended...it's like...I just can't control it anymore. I keep telling everyone I am going to end up in jail''.  :o

He says when he is in the moment he almost enjoys it. He says how he wants to laugh manically in situations that just aren't funny. I have seen this before and confirm he does it. He says it is always the ''after'' when he regrets it.

He knows something is really wrong with him, but he isn't sure what. He offered a few suggestions which means he must be looking it up. In the past I would have interjected with all the things I have researched and offered up possibilities. He would then have said I was ''shrinking him'' and got annoyed. So I just listened, and showed interest, but let him lead the convo.

He said how he needs a new job. I said you needed a new job about 4 years ago and laughed. It is funny, but also I wonder if it would have changed anything. Sure he wouldn't have had an affair with skittles...but maybe someone at the new job. No point in worrying over that now right? If it was going to happen it was going to happen, it is just a matter of when and with whom. I firmly believe that.

Anyway...

We got the house built. We didn't fall out. He spent most of two days here to do it. He almost got in a fight with my ex BF husband. The guy constantly was walking behind our yard looking in the fence like a nosey bastard which triggered Beast. But overall it was okay.

In talking to him I felt a mix of things:
- I feel sad for the person he has become, because the person he was...was pretty firetrucking awesome.
- I feel worried that he WILL actually do something nuts and end up in jail...and then I truly will have no help at all with the kids.
- I feel relieved that I booted him out, and that he took the out. At the time I thought it was a mistake, that I sealed his fate to leave (even though he had a choice). There were times I wish I took it back...maybe wasn't so concrete in my 'work on the marriage or GTFO'. But I am sure it was the right call. Maybe it has cost me my marriage, but it has saved me and the kids. I think if he was still here all this anger would be directed to us...and we would end up in a domestic violence situation.


And I guess I hope that one day he finds some measure of peace again. Even if only for a little while. Even if it doesn't include me and the kids. Because at the end of the day I have known him half my lifetime...and I still love who he was, and who he could be one day...if not so much who he is now.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Thunder

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #83 on: July 19, 2019, 04:30:35 AM »
Very interesting post, Mort.

I think you are absolutely right.  Had you not told him to leave you and the kids could have ended up in a very dangerous situation.  So you made the right call.
Now his anger or Monstering is being projected elsewhere.

I also think it's good he is talking about it and trying to figure himself out.  He's "aware" and that is a very good first step for him.

Whether he can do the healing, or figuring it out, by himself remains to be seen.
It would be nice if he could talk to a professional, but you never know, he may get to the point where he realizes he need to talk to someone.  I hope so.
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline Acorn

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Re: Beauty into Beast 13
« Reply #84 on: July 19, 2019, 05:17:38 AM »
Quote
He knows something is really wrong with him, but he isn't sure what. He offered a few suggestions which means he must be looking it up. In the past I would have interjected with all the things I have researched and offered up possibilities. He would then have said I was ''shrinking him'' and got annoyed. So I just listened, and showed interest, but let him lead the convo.

I think his awareness that something is wrong with him is the first step.  After that comes the toil of internal work over a long period of time.  Well, at least from a sample of one, namely, my H...  I really hope he goes beyond that first step. 

I applaud your stellar response - ‘I just listened and showed interest, but let him lead the convo.’   I personally regard that as being the lighthouse.  Had you offered your ‘shrinking’, he would be unlikely to share his musings with you in the future. I see that this kind of ‘sharing’ was an important part of my H working through his issues. 

About anger.  I was bamboozled by H’s off-the-chart explosions and wanted to understand why. 

What I understand (I’m sure you know this very well) is that anger is a secondary emotion and is preceded by a primary emotion(s), which the person may feel for a fleeting moment and most likely not even aware of.  Anger that is visible to others is only the tip of an iceberg.  Under the surface lurks other emotions, such as: feeling scared, hurt, humiliated, rejected and frustrated. 

Once I understood the relationship between anger and a whole host of other emotions that are behind it, I could have more compassion for H’s pain.

Of course there is also that famous saying, ‘anger is depression turned outward.’

Just my 2 cents’ worth.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2019, 05:19:32 AM by Acorn »
Live-in MLCer
Feb 2015: BD.  H has a Nuclear meltdown. 
Oct 2015: ILYBIANILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

 

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