Skip to main content

Author Topic: My Story Empty Space

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
My Story Empty Space
OP: June 18, 2019, 04:38:20 AM
Hi, my thread number something.

Very quick recap again:
BD at April 2017, Divorce at Jan 2018, after being 12 years together with XW from which 5 years married. D11 and S5, joint custody.
Not standing myself but supporting everyone that make that choice with deep respect.

Thought about how to title this thread and I guess that's what I am in at this moment, some kind of empty space between something, not sure what...
Perhaps call it a limbo between what once which and what my life will become, both in sight, neither more important than the other. Empty space in this case doesn't mean life standing totally still or being a bad place to be in. I believe it is what I need right now. I feel I gave so much for the past already that I don't have quite all the resources I'd need to step into anything new yet. It's not actually a down either, perhaps a little blues anyway. I like to think that it could be too a final stop in my short yet intense journey from shock to acceptance.

Journaling

My dear old buddy, dog called 'E', died a night before yesterday. He was almost 12 years old, but until last few weeks, still in ok shape. Last month was clearly worse, something happened to him and I had already booked vet appointment at monday evening. But it was his time to go. I took him for a walk at sunday afternoon, at evening he started to breath heavier, still he ate some and drank water, got to upstairs with me as he always does when time to go to sleep at evening. It felt that he started to sleep at my bedroom floor and I fell asleep myself. I woke up less than 2 hours ago and saw him cramp and then he just died. I was in shock obviously but understood of course what happened, that he left from this world.

I called to local vet hospital emergency duty and they told me I can took his body to them right away. I texted J, still in shock about what happened and she insisted to come over and drive us to vet emergency. She said it's ok bc she was on holiday and didn't have to wake up early next morning. So we did go and I left E to them and requested they would send him to obduction later bc I have to know what was his cause of death. I believe he got a heart attack or something like that. They also take care about cremation and I got a chance to choose from urn catalog.  I was greatful to J, she was there for me, shared my grief. It would have been even much harder to do that trip all alone. Got home at small hours and fell a sleep for a short while. Called to my boss at morning if it was ok to take a day off and she agreed and understood me very well. Got a little more sleep and time to be alone at home, to put his stuff away, to make a walk we used to do with him, alone, for his memory I guess.

At beginning at the summer I looked E and thought that this might be his last summer, didn't have a clue he would be gone before midsummer. Dog is an animal, but never 'only' a animal for it's owner as every dog owner know. It's time to grieve him now, but I accept that as well, he lived a long and I believe good life. I am thankful for the time we got together, he was part of many stages in my life.

Texted to XW what happened to E, she seemed to be very sorry, genuinely. She promised to tell the kids before I pick them up at sunday evening from her's, but we agreed she shouldn't do it until they are back from their holiday trip, but let them enjoy the trip first. They are having a great time, I got several pics and a video from the beach and the pool. I am glad for the kids they are having such a good holiday there.

I guess my empty home this week symbolizes the empty space in a way too. It's not necessarily bad, even it's sad, it's a phase and part of the process, part of life, so that's ok.


Previous thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10733.0
  • Logged
« Last Edit: June 19, 2019, 09:52:31 AM by Thunder »
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10501
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#1: June 18, 2019, 04:44:27 AM
I'm sorry, Silver.
Still remember when my cat Louis died last year.
I really felt at the time that he had hung on to see me through the worst times and that as I was starting to get up off my knees, it was his time to go. Lou was my h's cat and he had really loved him before so like you I told my still then h who seemed sorry but not really upset if that makes sense.
It is good that we can mourn these creatures who share our lives and that we have the emotional capacity to do so. I'm glad that J was thoughtful and kind to you.
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#2: June 18, 2019, 04:50:40 AM
Aw Silver, I'm so sorry to hear about E.  It's hard to lose a friend like that.  They are part of the family.
I'm sure the kids will be sad too so {{hugs}} for everyone.   :'(

With my last 2 dogs, after they passed away, I put their dog tags on a chain around my neck and still took them for walks.   :) 
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

H
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2432
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#3: June 18, 2019, 05:00:02 AM
Sorry about E Silver.
I know that was hard my friend. I have a dog that is 15. I know her time is short. I just try not to think about it.
I'm glad you have J too my friend. It helps to have someone that will be there for you.
  • Logged

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10371
  • Gender: Male
  • You can't please everyone. You are NOT a pizza!
Re: Empty Space
#4: June 18, 2019, 06:15:53 AM
Silver,

I am so sorry about E. There is something about a pet that has accompanied us through the MLC times that makes them extra special to us, a kind of "hold" on our own sanity if you will.... I know that when the time comes for mine to cross the Rainbow Bridge (hopefully many years from now), it will be REALLY hard for me.
  • Logged
Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

  • *****
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 13104
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#5: June 18, 2019, 06:56:42 AM
Yes sorry to hear this.

My take is that as life moves along many events happen that involve my
children and ex-w.
Both of my parents have passed away and ex's father, her mother is in the hospital with stage 4 cancer.

And then there are the good things like the birth of my grand daughter and now we just celebrated her 1 year old birthday.
Also the marriage of both of my children.
So as life goes along you have to deal with all these events.
The same will be true for you.

Be the BEST DAD you can be and really all the rest will fall into place.
  • Logged

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 6168
  • Gender: Female
  • How I long for your precepts! Psalm 119:40
Re: Empty Space
#6: June 18, 2019, 07:12:56 AM
Sorry about E. It is always a blow to lose our pets.

As I have been at this for so long, I have lost many pets along the way - I have just one dog, approaching 10 years old this year, who has been with us all the way through. She is my daughter's dog, so I guess this loss when it comes, will be felt more by her. I worry a little, though, because d24 is about to embark on a 10 month work/study experience in Ireland and I just hope the dog will still be here when she comes back!

So glad that J was able to support you - I think the worse thing for me has been having to face all these rainbow bridge events alone.

Take care Silver
  • Logged
M 58
H 58
S 28
D 25
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5515
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#7: June 18, 2019, 10:06:24 AM
Hugs friend. Losing a pet, which is really part of the family, is so hard. I am happy you had J there to support you. And that xw was kind about it.

Interesting that you speak of empty space as I am alone this week as well. S12 is in the mountains with his buddies all week. It's nice b/c I am able to do what I want and not be constricted to timelines. But then, after everything is done, and I am sitting there alone, that is when the "thinkies" come around. Definitely part of the process that I struggle with the most--how to be alone and to be ok with  it.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2172
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#8: June 18, 2019, 11:32:15 AM
I'm sorry to hear that too. I agree with thunder, they are part and parcel as any other family member. I just had a friend lose a cat a few days ago too. We lost our first one years ago, only 3 years old. I have 3 more now and I hope they last a long time.. It's hard letting go, but it's also good to be thankful for the memories.
  • Logged

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4121
  • Gender: Male
  • Back to being #1 for my daughters!!!!
Re: Empty Space
#9: June 18, 2019, 01:46:30 PM
Hello,

Sorry about the loss of your pet. I know it is part of life, but that doesn't mean we have to like it. Kind of like the mlc garbage, we accept it, but don't have to like it.

I am glad that you support standing even though you are no longer standing. I am remarried and my stand ended years ago. What brought you to stop your stand?

How do you feel about the current relationship you are now in?

Do you see yourself getting remarried?

Just interested,

Ready
  • Logged
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#10: June 19, 2019, 05:17:25 AM
Thank you all, your kind words and support mean so much to me.

Helping, I wish many good and healthy days to your old boy/girl.
UM, absolutely correct. E made my move to my own flat much easier as I didn't have to be alone there at weeks when kids are not with me. He kept me moving at my bad days too, literally, which had a huge effect as I couldn't choose just wallowing alone at home. He was out of MLC reach, represented loyality etc.
OP, I keep your words in my heart. Doing my best.
Mitzpah, wishing healthy days and years to your (D's) dog too and to your cats as well gman. My 1st W had 2 siamese cats at 90s, they were pain in the a** tbh  :o Wish yours let you sleep...
KIT, I recognize the feeling, I am ok when alone, learned to enjoy my own time but at times those thinking moments are tough.

Ready, you asked interesting questions. Not really sure but I guess I made a choice at the end of the summer last year. I had a conversation with XW at parking lot in her car (before my R with J). It wasn't much longer than 6 months since divorce. I asked her if she sees us together again one day. She couldn't answer to it but made clear that she is not willing to risk her 'good relationship with OM' bc 'there is no guarantee that we would succeed if we reconciliated'  :o :o (oh really??) I asked her if she loved OM and she answered 'yes I do, he is a decent guy'.
I said that I heard enough and calmly got out of her car and was really down and confused for the rest of the day.

I guess after that I decided that I refuse to be a plan B for a 'decent guy' he has been together with 6 months. After all we had together. MLC or not, I didn't feel like I could do that and have my self respect and dignity at same time, so I chose me. I decide to be done and to see her as a mother of my kids and try to make as good relationship as co parent with her as I can. The decision was kind of sad but very liberating too. We are free to choose, like they were when they stepped out of the relationship, but we have to choose. Being in the middle is standing still in my opinion.

My R with J has been honest, I told her from the start the situation and never promised her anything about the future and she has been ok with that. She would deserve more than I can give but she has a freedom to choice too and this far she chose to be with me. I told her that I would'n blame her if she walked and chose someone who can invest more into the relationship than I can at this moment for I am balancing between my own space and time and relationship time (no, not MLCish space but space to feel and think whatever comes, space to keep recovering and healing).
This is the only way to go right now. But I like her really much, we are at same level in so many ways and I'm feeling easy to be with her. That's all I can say really, time will tell.

No I don't see myself getting remarried, been twice and that's enough. I'm happy with the rings I already have - the metal one with the cross in it and the silver one. That's all I need.






   








  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

A
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3346
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#11: June 19, 2019, 05:25:44 AM
Hi Silver, I’m so sorry to hear the loss of your loyal four legged friend...
This, too, takes time to recover from, I’m sure. ((((((HUGS))))))

I’m glad that you are still sharing your story.  It shows your healing process and coming to terms with the new normal.  Thank you for that.

I think you are wise in how you deal with the new R.   What I read is that you are 2 mature independent people that have learned much from your respective life experiences. 

Wishing you nothing but the very best.
God bless.
  • Logged
My first thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8164.150

My reconnecting thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10524.msg699615#msg699615

Live-in MLCer

Feb 2015: BD. 
Oct 2015: ILYBINILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4677
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#12: June 19, 2019, 05:43:11 AM
Silver - I am sorry to read of the loss of your fur baby.  As others have said, it seems especially hard when it's a pet that goes through this crisis with us. 

Your insight on your relationship with J is good.  I am glad you have been very upfront with her about where you are currently at.   
  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#13: June 20, 2019, 12:39:04 AM
Thank you, Acorn. You have guided me since the very beginning, in many ways. Hugs my friend.

still, thank you, nice to see you  :) I have lost your thread, do you still have one?? What happened to pole building? Is mrs 6 Surnames still in picture??

I have tried to get accustomed dogless home. Somehow, after the shock I can already see that this was maybe the best for E. He was rather old and now he lived in good shape almost until the end. And the end was quick, happened at home while I was there and kids weren't, which is good too I believe. It would have been even bigger shock to them. Maybe it's easier for them this way after all though it will hurt them when they hear the news. I myself am fine, it was his time and that's it.  I am letting myself mourn him as long as needed. He lives in my heart for the rest of my life, so much good memories about him and our time together will live on. But I am fine. Will I get a new dog is a tough choice, not perhaps soon anyway but as a dog person I really have used to live with at least one dog at home for very long time so we'll see...

Empty space shouldn't be filled too soon for I believe it has it's function, in this matter too.














  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#14: June 20, 2019, 04:27:30 AM
Silver

You are such a wise Man. I like your recent post and have been sad about ‘E’ but your positive outlook about the children not being there, you being with him and it being quick is the best way to look at it.

As a new puppy owner I know how deep the feelings are and we previously had 2 cats die so I really understand. When our last cat died it was so sad but having to tell the children was the worst part, my then age 8 D said ‘but she’s so cute’ although I had been saying for a while that the cat was quite old trying to prepare them. They needed the day off school and we bought a smaller easier pet that day to help us through. It worked a bit. I also got them a photo of the cat put on a little cushion so they could cuddle that which was well received. I know you won’t underestimate this loss for the children and them getting used to their new normal again.

Empty space is a great title, or I suppose it’s really ‘E’mpty Space 🐾
Rose 🌹
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#15: June 23, 2019, 11:06:40 PM
Thank you Rose,

Love to read how you dealed with your children when you lost a pet. You're such a good mum, my friend.
Yes I guess Empty Space is partially 'E'mpty Space, there are literally empty spaces at where he used to sleep, where his cups were etc.
Surprisingly though, I already have partly used to him not being there, even it's not more than a week when he left. I guess I was readied myself for long time to this, knowing his age.
I even started to have thoughts about new dog, this soon  ::) I'm not going to probably soon anyway, if I ever will but you never know  :)

Journaling

Kids and XW got home from their trip at saturday night. XW didn't tell them about E before sunday morning after a good night sleep they had. Wise choice in my opinion.
At sunday morning D11 sent me a Whatsapp message how sad she was to hear about the dog. As S5 woke up and heard the news, they got video call to me. They asked questions about E, D11 was crying, S5 was very sad too obviously but like 5 year old energetic child only can, few moments later he was already showing me toys they got from the trip  ;D

Kids were supposed to come to me today, at monday after my workday but we changed the plan a little with XW as they wanted to visit me sunday evening already. XW brought them to my place for couple of hours and even offered to pick them up later so I didn't have to drive  :o We talked about E and how it happened, they sat on my lap both and I showed them some pics about E that I took right after he passed away. May sound questionable for some, but I knew it would help them to process about what happened and as the dog looked very peaceful, like sleeping (he was put into his bed with his blanket), I wanted to give that image to them as well. Like it wasn't anything horrible, he just left peacefully. For most parts it was the truth too, there wasn't really a big drama, everything happened so fast. I'm positive I did the right choice to show them some of the pics, I showed few to XW too when she arrived. The visit was good, we had some fun too and I'm sure it's much easier for them to come to our home today when I'm picking them up after work.

So much for E, may him rest in peace, forever loved.

For more MLCish topic, I tested my detachment level a little couple of days ago. I haven't been FB friend with XW and I'm definitely not with OM  ::) For some reason as I was just surfing around in FB, I searched OM's profile. Not much information there for non-friends but I saw him updated his profile picture (which seems to be public) just a day or two ago. Pic was nothing special, very normal prof pic, but for some reason I decided to look if XW had liked it. So I did and of course she was, with heart. After that in comments they even shared couple of sappy 'love you, love you too' type comments. I noticed that it didn't touch me that much, I wasn't like down, but it didn't feel neutral either. That kind of stuff still triggers me, can't say badly or for long time but they still do. Maybe it's only natural for LBS not to wish all the best for your MLC spouse and her/his new partner, I accept that. But have to admit, it would have been really nice to notice no reaction in me at all  ::) Too early for that I guess. XW did have her ring back on yesterday too and she looked relaxed and well. So I guess they are doing fine with each other, thinking of kids, it is good bc she is obviously more relaxed with them too.

I think it is time for me to name OM for something else, bc other man just isn't the right word anymore in my case. Just like I switched MLCer to XW before.
Is there any decent abbreviation in English, how do you call your X's new spouse in general, like in real world, not in Lala land cases?
   

 
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10371
  • Gender: Male
  • You can't please everyone. You are NOT a pizza!
Re: Empty Space
#16: June 24, 2019, 01:39:37 AM

For more MLCish topic, I tested my detachment level a little couple of days ago. I haven't been FB friend with XW and I'm definitely not with OM  ::) For some reason as I was just surfing around in FB, I searched OM's profile. Not much information there for non-friends but I saw him updated his profile picture (which seems to be public) just a day or two ago. Pic was nothing special, very normal prof pic, but for some reason I decided to look if XW had liked it. So I did and of course she was, with heart. After that in comments they even shared couple of sappy 'love you, love you too' type comments.


I noticed that it didn't touch me that much, I wasn't like down, but it didn't feel neutral either. That kind of stuff still triggers me, can't say badly or for long time but they still do. Maybe it's only natural for LBS not to wish all the best for your MLC spouse and her/his new partner, I accept that. But have to admit, it would have been really nice to notice no reaction in me at all  ::) Too early for that I guess. XW did have her ring back on yesterday too and she looked relaxed and well. So I guess they are doing fine with each other, thinking of kids, it is good bc she is obviously more relaxed with them too.

I am not sure if one EVER has NO reaction at all.... even when I saw xW1 after 16 years with her H... 5? there was a bit of a

reaction....
I think it is time for me to name OM for something else, bc other man just isn't the right word anymore in my case. Just like I switched MLCer to XW before.
Is there any decent abbreviation in English, how do you call your X's new spouse in general, like in real world, not in Lala land cases?

Hmmmm ... Maybe ... Twatwaffle? Or in his case, he is H3, right? Third one?
  • Logged
Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

  • *
  • MLCer Type: Low-Energy
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 698
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#17: June 24, 2019, 04:33:01 AM
Catching up, Silver. So sorry about E.
  • Logged
"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10501
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#18: June 24, 2019, 05:30:11 AM
CH (current husband)?
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#19: June 24, 2019, 05:36:36 AM
Thanks UM, PJ, Treasur

Twatwaffle?? That would be better than Other man?  ;D
Guy is not husband yet (at least what I know) but soon to be maybe. So maybe he is STBHOXWFKAMLCER (Soon to be husband of ex wife formerly known as midlife criser).
You can still send me suggestions though, haven't decided yet.

 
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#20: June 24, 2019, 06:32:44 AM
Silver

Ha ha.

How about XW’s BF?

I am glad you showed the children a photo of E. When it happened with us we all saw the cat after she died before H took her to the vet for cremation. It really helped and I asked S fairly recently again if he thought it helped and he said yes it really helped so I think you did the right thing. Good on you thinking straight in a mini crisis (most things are ‘mini’ now compared with this crisis). 

E 🙏

Rose 🌹
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#21: June 28, 2019, 01:30:50 AM
Thank you Rose,

Doesn't BF stand for 'best friend'?
Well maybe they are that too now  :o

Journaling

E's remains arrived in beautiful small urn, wish I could post a pic... it's grey, sealed (I think, don't want to open it anyway...) one with painted paw on it. It's funny but getting it was like getting something of him back, well I did literally but you know what I mean don't you?  ::)
I was thinking first about digging him a grave, perhaps to our summer cottages where my primary family's 1st dog is buried too. But thinking again, I think I just keep him at home, with me and us. Have to find a decent place for the urn though, not sure if it took much of a fall to floor to break and having 5 yo energetic child there are obviously some risks in the house  ;D

I've recovered fine from losing E, I wrote to his breeder and told the news, she was sorry of course but pointed that (almost) 12 year dog is relatively old and that most of his siblings have already crossed the bridge. She thanked us for giving him a loving home and I thanked her for co operation.

I'm thinking about getting a new dog already  ::) but that's not something should do in hurry really. There's always the fact that life without dog would be much simpler to me as I'm living by myself every other week etc. Then there's always the puppy phase, which is rather time consuming and tiring as well, though they ARE so cute as puppies  ;D Then again.. having lived with the dog(s) for decades, it's not that easy to be without either, dog person is a dog person and there would be space for a small one at our home...
Life is full of choices and for this one, consequenses will be purely on me (unlike in MLCer's thinking)  ;D

XW has been quite nice to me, which is maybe 'new her' but tbh I sense monster still sleeping inside. More probable explanation is that as we have several mediation appointments coming, regarding where we will put kids to school in the future as she is obviously planning move together with OM (not far but we have to reconsider kids' schools anyway then) she tries to keep things calm between us. That's okay and I really hope we will find a solution to the school subject without having to start fighting about custody. Some may remember that just few months ago we sat at social worker's office at the appointment that XW made and she would want to change primary parent agreement (for her moving plans obviously) as her benefit. Social worker asked me if I agree to do it and I said absolutely not, there is not one reason to me to give up S5's primary parency. She then said that they can't do anything about it and XW broke down right at the meeting... I told then that if she insists having primary parency for S5, after the agreement WE BOTH AGREED an year ago, she has to do it by the court, that I'm ready for it but won't prefer it because it will cost a lot of money for both of us and wouldn't actually improve our relationship as co parents.

That's when social worker sent us to mediation process which has now started, mediator met XW already once and will see me (alone) next week and at august both of us together 2 times. If no agreement is found, she either has to deal with the fact that if she moves, she has more kilometers to drive to take and pick up S5 (who will be 6 when school starts) to/from school, which would be designated by the fact that S5 officially lives with me OR take the whole custody stuff to court which I don't quite think she would do, but never know. I am ready for it if that's what it takes.
So there are decisions ahead with this one as well.
 
I still feel (minor and brief) bursts of anger at times when I see her. Not every time but can't deny the fact that happier she lookes, the more easily all those feelings of how unfair everything was etc. come back. It's stupid in a way bc if she feels good or even ok, she is better mom as well to our kids. But I've been thinking the best way to cope those feelings is not to deny them either, nor try to force them going away. My strategy is from mindfulness concept, I acknowledge the feeling and welcome it and if I'm alone, I speak out loud how I feel, in a neutral but honest way. Usually doesn't take more than few minutes to be good again and able to keep on doing whatever I am doing. It's a good strategy.

2 weeks work and then 4 weeks off! Summer holiday in sight, waiting for it.

Have a as good weekend as possible, all you brave beautiful LBS persons where ever you are.  8)






  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#22: June 28, 2019, 02:45:01 AM
Silver

I thought it meant boy friend and gf for girl friend but you are probably right, oops!

You sound good
Must dash
Rose 🌹
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10371
  • Gender: Male
  • You can't please everyone. You are NOT a pizza!
Re: Empty Space
#23: June 28, 2019, 02:47:28 AM
BF/GF is normally Boy/Girl Friend.... NOT to be confused with BFF (Best Friends Forever) or TGB/TBF (Toxic Girl/Boy Friends)
  • Logged
Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#24: June 28, 2019, 04:43:19 AM
 :o I'll let him stay OM, way easier that way  ;D
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

A
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3346
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#25: June 28, 2019, 06:02:59 AM
Quote
.But I've been thinking the best way to cope those feelings is not to deny them either, nor try to force them going away. My strategy is from mindfulness concept, I acknowledge the feeling and welcome it and if I'm alone, I speak out loud how I feel, in a neutral but honest way. Usually doesn't take more than few minutes to be good again and able to keep on doing whatever I am doing. It's a good strategy.   

I love the way you handle the bumps on the road, Silver.
Practising mindfulness is something you and I picked up in our LSBS journey and has helped us immensely.  Like you, I go to it when I’m under pressure of any kind - work and all human relationships.

I’m glad you are keeping up with it as I think mindfulness is one of the best ways to learn to respond and not react, to acknowledge one’s emotions authentically and not bury them, to open the pressure valve on pent up aggravation. 
((((((((HUGS)))))))))), my dear friend.  :)
  • Logged
« Last Edit: June 28, 2019, 06:07:24 AM by Acorn »
My first thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8164.150

My reconnecting thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10524.msg699615#msg699615

Live-in MLCer

Feb 2015: BD. 
Oct 2015: ILYBINILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#26: July 07, 2019, 11:45:40 PM
Thank you Acorn, you are so right about that, we can't run away from our emotions, but we can learn to deal with them. You have done it so well since the beginning, just one of the reasons you are so important example to so many here, my dear friend.

Journaling

I had my first appointment in mediation, which should be focused on concrete plans like where children will go to school if she moves from her current place. I met the mediator without XW, whose appointment already took place. Next appointments will be for us together in few weeks. Mediator emailed us a draft which included what we both want to put in the agreement. Most of XW's lines were appropriate stuff but the last one was something like "no speaking about our divorce anymore as it has an influence on our relationship as parents". I shouldn't "blackmail" or "threaten" her either anymore  :o :o :o That tells a lot of her thinking, since divorce every single thing we disagree about turns into drama in her mind and she starts use words "blackmail" or "threaten" or "preventing her to go on, be happy" or whatever. That's why she had a breakdown at winter when we had appointment in social official. She thinks that she should never have signed a contract about sharing primary parency and that was the worst mistake in her life. Social worker then asked me if I'm willing to make changes to that contract (about primary parency) and I told her that I have absolutely no reason to do that and the only way she can get primary parency for both of the kids is going to court (which would be really hard and expensive thing to do and may just end either way).

Just look this from my view for a while... My W started to seek replacement to me, her H, in her crisis, which included EVERY single phase and script from the MLC -playbook. In very short timeline she found several guys to alienate her one way or another. She told me back then that she can't think about kids in her choices and that they will be ok anyway, as kids always do and people divorce which is normal etc. She knew that my ONLY GOAL was to keep our family together and stay married. She started D process as I found out about her planning to set a date with her dentist, blaming me being paranoid etc. She told be then that she has now right to do anything she wants to and so do I, because that's how she think 6 months thinking time before D can get official is for  :o  I found out about her EA (at least) with another OM couple of months after that, nothing ambiguous in it, and still she denied it all and blamed me being controlling, jealous and paranoid. She opportunistically used my fear and weakness (I snooped her) to entitle her leave AND not that's not all, she made a police report about me too which ended me to pay several hundred of euros to her as compensation - bc I broke the law by snooping her phone.

She "found" current OM surprisingly IMMEDIATELY after our D got official (sure he wasn't involved while we were still married, right??) and the guy stepped into my kids life, in the situation when they should have been given at least few months to adapt to new situation, living in two homes etc. XW didn't care any of that, to her the most important thing seemed to be to "move on" fast. Now they are engaged and I'm pretty sure married too very soon if I know my X spouse at all.  Fine, nothing of that is my business anymore, but as she seems to think that I should sign something like SILENCE AGREEMENT now about everything that happened or let her decide about kids schools etc, however she wants to, where ever she plans to move.

Well... I just don't think so  ;D

It's true that we have got along with all the everyday stuff relating to kids in last 2 months, much better than before. But in the big picture, not much has changed, she still is entitled to do anything and feels free to blame me about anything.

Sorry for the rant, needed to get that out of my system.

 
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

W
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3568
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#27: July 08, 2019, 01:37:43 AM
Well... I just don't think so  ;D
Neither do I! She is a dreamer mate!
Sorry for the rant, needed to get that out of my system.
No Need to apologise, its totally unfair for her to ask for you to be silenced, your not a dog  :-\
  • Logged
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. Is tolerated by LaFamiglia
2 Sons - 20 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#28: July 08, 2019, 08:09:01 AM
Silver

Rants R us! That’s what we’re here for. And we completely agree and get it.

I still can’t believe she got you charged for snooping.

Well... I just don’t think so

Yip, that just about covers it.
Rose 🌹
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5515
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#29: July 08, 2019, 12:23:47 PM
That tells a lot of her thinking, since divorce every single thing we disagree about turns into drama in her mind and she starts use words "blackmail" or "threaten" or "preventing her to go on, be happy" or whatever.

Yes Silver, every time you disagree with her, you mess up her fantasy that ALL will be perfect after the D. She is still looking for someone to blame for her unhappiness. You are the best person for that!!

Please do rant away. The selfishness and hypocrisy of all of this is crazy at times.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

  • *
  • Trial Subscriber
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1084
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#30: July 08, 2019, 12:27:51 PM
Wow, I'm so sorry.
Yes, rant away!!!


-SS
  • Logged
W - 39
M - 43
Together 25 years, M 22
No kids
BD - 27th April 2019

H
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2432
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#31: July 09, 2019, 06:58:20 AM
Rant away my friend. All she's wanting is for you to be as miserable as she is. So of course, try and blame you. You did the right thing. Rant it out here my friend, let it go.
  • Logged

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2491
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#32: July 15, 2019, 06:59:42 PM
Attaching

You could call OM HCM (Her Current Man) or FOW (Flavor Of The Week) but I think OM sums it up just fine or OM2 or whatever.
  • Logged
M-42
H-44
S-20 (mine)
D-18 (ours)
S-15 (ours)
Friends 7y before M
Married 14y
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniv.
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17 (told me 4 days before)
Eng. off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
New GF 2/29/20 (Told me 4/22/20)
Marrying her 4/24/20 (Told me 4/22/20)

Link to my journey: 
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11404.0

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass - it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Don't become a container for bitterness.  It's a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes - some things have to break apart so better things can be built."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4121
  • Gender: Male
  • Back to being #1 for my daughters!!!!
Re: Empty Space
#33: July 16, 2019, 04:48:37 AM
Hello,

Quote
Most of XW's lines were appropriate stuff but the last one was something like "no speaking about our divorce anymore as it has an influence on our relationship as parents". I shouldn't "blackmail" or "threaten" her either anymore  :o :o :o

At first, I read this as her attempts to control you. What it really is that she wants you to go away permanently. Be the good ex and disappear.

Quote
That tells a lot of her thinking, since divorce every single thing we disagree about turns into drama in her mind and she starts use words "blackmail" or "threaten" or "preventing her to go on, be happy" or whatever.

Anytime you disagree with her or have an argument, it destroys her ability to hit the reset button in her life. What she wants is for her to move, keep the kids, and act as if you never existed. Most of us talk about a new chapter in our lives, but we are still connected to the previous chapters. She lives her life as short stories and ends each one with no connection. There are no sequels in her life.

You need to stick this out and realize that this is best for your children. Mark my word, in 8 to 10 years at the latest, if she marries this man, she will be done with him and moving to the next "happier life" with someone else. How is that going to help your children?

Rant and rant so more, but know that this is in the best interests of your family.

Fist bump,

Ready
  • Logged
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#34: August 12, 2019, 05:58:37 AM
Hello and thanks for replies!

Being away for a while, made a conscious decision to have a hiatus from HS, had a really nice 4 weeks off work and I spent most of it at summer cottage, partly with my primary family and my kids too for 2 weeks. 4 week holiday is REALLY nice but getting back to work after it is a bit...not nice  ::)

Journaling

XW and I will have appointment this Wednesday at mediator, the main goal is to get agreement to kids schools in the future. It's related to XW's moving plans. I wrote about it before so I'm not going to bore you about it again, anyway it stresses me a little bc the school choices will have an effect to all our lives for many years to come. I am not expecting very good result, at least from this appointment. We will have another appointment next week if (and when) needed to get it solved.

Yesterday our S5 started a new hobby (soccer, football to me but I'll keep it soccer here). It was her week so I wasn't prepared to go but she texted to me yesterday morning that it would be good if I came, to hear all the information they may give etc. So I went, thought that S5 would be delighted if I came too and so he was, really! He asked if I stayed the whole hour and cheer to him and turned to look at me every now and then during the "game". The game is not maybe a proper word for punch of over eager 5-6 year old kids, running after the ball all at same time, sometimes forgetting what they are actually doing so that coach had to beg them get back to game. At times S5 just walked to completely other direction where the game was going on and suddenly seemed to remember what this was all about and run back to ball like maniac. It was absolutely great, kids were so excited and enjoyed just running around  ;D

XW was a little surprised I came over and tried to chat with me about this and that. I said tried bc I didn't feel like, I kept my words few and at football stuff only, she probably got it bc she started then to look at her phone, I moved a little further to get my peace to focus on game. I was glad I went and of course to see that XW didn't ask OM to come (or maybe she did but he couldn't go, whatever) as it was MY son's very first soccer game in "real" team. It was big deal to him, both parents were there to support him and tbh XW was actually nice to ask me.

Today she texted me that she had dream about me and us  :o In her dream we talked about OUR divorce in peace and with no anger and about all the emotional stuff too. In her dream we seemed to have a mutual understanding that we both we at "breaking point" in our live and that's why everything happened as it did. I didn't reply to her but my reply would probably be something like oh, whatever you say, have a nice day.



 





  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

W
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3568
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#35: August 12, 2019, 06:49:05 AM
The game is not maybe a proper word for punch of over eager 5-6 year old kids, running after the ball all at same time, sometimes forgetting what they are actually doing so that coach had to beg them get back to game.
Sounds like your national Team mate :-)
Im glad you got to the game thugh and it was considerate of your XW to tell/ask you about it.

Today she texted me that she had dream about me and us  :o In her dream we talked about OUR divorce in peace and with no anger and about all the emotional stuff too. In her dream we seemed to have a mutual understanding that we both we at "breaking point" in our live and that's why everything happened as it did. I didn't reply to her but my reply would probably be something like oh, whatever you say, have a nice day.
That does Sound like a suitable answer from you, I dont understand why she would tell you of this but who knows how they think.
Im glad that your Holiday was nice mate :-)

  • Logged
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. Is tolerated by LaFamiglia
2 Sons - 20 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

  • *
  • MLCer Type: Low-Energy
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 698
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#36: August 12, 2019, 09:14:01 AM
Welcome back Silver.

Ah yes, kids sports are awesome. At that age all sports are pretty much the same: basketball, baseball and football are all basically "Chase the kid with the ball." Fun times and great memories. Enjoy!

And that dream. <vomiting emoji>. It's like they somehow want to blame the universe for their selfishness and poor decisions.
  • Logged
"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5515
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#37: August 12, 2019, 10:24:30 AM

In her dream we talked about OUR divorce in peace and with no anger and about all the emotional stuff too. In her dream we seemed to have a mutual understanding that we both we at "breaking point" in our live and that's why everything happened as it did.

I love the whole "everything that happened" phrase. As if they had no control over anything. Just accidentally fell into  OW/M's bed. oooopsie.

"I had a dream about you" is classic passive aggressive.

But, all in all, very happy you were included in S's soccer game. Truly that is what it is all about. He was elated that you were there along with his mom. That kind of stuff means the world to a child.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#38: August 15, 2019, 12:07:43 AM

Sounds like your national Team mate :-)


WHat?!  ;D More like RUGBY mate!  ;D
Without Bale your national team is piece of cake to us  ;) and he is getting older too...

Welcome back Silver.

Ah yes, kids sports are awesome. At that age all sports are pretty much the same: basketball, baseball and football are all basically "Chase the kid with the ball." Fun times and great memories. Enjoy!


Thanks! Yes it's so pure joy that one can only envy them... And when someone scores the reaction is awesome!


I love the whole "everything that happened" phrase. As if they had no control over anything. Just accidentally fell into  OW/M's bed. oooopsie.


Yup and blaming me of being over controlling at same time... perhaps I should just had looked that "things happen" and accept that my family was falling apart? Not me, sorry XW. Maybe it would have been the right way to deal with MLCer but I still couldn't do it at that time.

Journaling

First appointment in our mediation process held yesterday evening. We sat with mediator (I don't know the right English word for the person but you get the point) and XW for 90 minutes and talked about being co-parents, a concrete level stuff about having parallel parenting policy, you know like what time D11 should be home at school day evenings, how much screen time S5 can have etc. Important discussion and that part went really well, it's good that kids have at least roughly same rules in both homes.

When it came to kids' school decisions, things got more complicated. No reason to open it up here and it wouldn't be interesting to anyone but we have disagreement about this. Mediator asked us to make propositions and we will get back to them next week in 2nd appointment. She also thinks that it should be ok to me if OM would be the one that gives kids to me when I'm going to pick them up instead of her, in case she has something else planned. I said it isn't ok to me and THAT wasn't ok to her. In my opinion, even I do accept the fact that they are together etc and it's not my business anymore, our new partners shouldn't take any part of it. I mean, it's about 10 minutes, once a week, I go there and pick kids stuff and they jump into my car, change few words with XW if there's something about kids matters to talk about (most of our communication happens trough texts or by phone anyway). I see no reason she can't handle that herself like I do and like we have done this far. Well, if one day it is OM who opens the door to me, then it is, I can't really control that so better to be prepared and avoid all the drama  ::)

All in all, the meeting went better than I thought, there are still unfinished business but at least she held herself together better than last time at social worker's last spring (she cried and shouted back then) and I did fine, stayed calm and stood behind my opinions yet indicated that I'm ready for reasonable compromises as well.
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#39: August 15, 2019, 02:04:53 AM
Welcome back, Silver.   :)

Watching those games when the kids are little are so awesome..and funny.
I remember my sons first ballgame.  Right in the middle of it he walked off the field and started playing in the sand, oblivious there game going on.  Every just laughed.
But they do remember you were there watching them.

About your X's dream.  Sounds like she had that dream to convince herself it was not her fault things happened the way they did.  It was just meant to be.   ::)  So by telling you about the dream maybe she can influence you to see it that way too.  I'd say it was a bit of a guilty conscience dream.  Whatever...

4 weeks away from work must have felt heavenly.  I'm glad you had a good vacation, Silver. 
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10501
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#40: August 15, 2019, 02:22:14 AM
Funnily enough your description of your kids game reminded me of something someone told me once about football...that little kids chase the ball but bigger kids learn it is about focusing on where the ball will be next. And that it's pretty funny to watch the difference lol. Glad you were able to be there though.

Not unlike MLCers and LBS maybe  :)

Funny how often MLC spouses seem to want us to agree with what is in their head isn't it? As if somehow they need us to sign up to their reality too even if tbh often it moves around like billy-o. But of course all you can do is respect your reality and do the best you can with it while leaving your w to take responsibility for her own without your two penn'oth. It's an odd 'game' after a long time of being a 'we' on a more shared page though isn't it?
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#41: August 19, 2019, 01:23:19 AM
Thank you Thunder & Treasur,

Funny how often MLC spouses seem to want us to agree with what is in their head isn't it? As if somehow they need us to sign up to their reality too even if tbh often it moves around like billy-o. But of course all you can do is respect your reality and do the best you can with it while leaving your w to take responsibility for her own without your two penn'oth. It's an odd 'game' after a long time of being a 'we' on a more shared page though isn't it?

Yes it is! My XW tried to make her D and decisions as OUR decisions, still seems to. At beginning I constantly corrected her (no, it isn't OUR decision, it is YOUR'S) but now I just leave it and don't bother to say anything to it. I won't agree with her either though.

She still seems to be a bit confused about how she wants and should communicate with me. At saturday she seemed to be in a little monstery mood, according to her texts to me, in which she sounded kind of bitter to me b/c of primary parency stuff and our disagreement about school locations... I didn't got sucked in and she stopped soon texting. At sunday she wrote that she was in minor car accident, and that will have some effect on kids' schedule next week. I asked her did she got hurt in accident herself, she replied that she is fine and I replied "ok good to hear".
I guess that was a trigger to her to send me couple of more texts (which I really didn't expect her to) where she told me that I really matter and am important to her, even we disagree with many stuff and have our fights about things..that caring of each other is somewhere under the surface despite "all the sh*t there is".

I took my rule of three before replying her "Thank you for telling me that". That's it. Felt like touch and go?

This week is important to me, at thursday we are having the appointment #2 at mediator and if everything goes well, we will reach agreement about kids' schools in the future. I have no concern about D11 as she will continue at her current school until primary school is done anyway and after that she is old enough to go any school at area. But it is a big deal in S5's case and as his primary parent I'm not going to make bad decisions (bad in my viewe) only b/c XW is planning a move. She knows that and I wonder if her "touch and go" is due to that, maybe she is trying to soften me for the thursday's meeting?!  :o

 


  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#42: August 19, 2019, 03:00:52 AM
Silver,

I think you may be on to something here.
Anytime a MLCer is being unusually nice, their up to something.   ::)
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

W
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3568
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#43: August 19, 2019, 05:40:53 AM
Silver,

I think you may be on to something here.
Anytime a MLCer is being unusually nice, their up to something.   ::)

Yip, thats why im waiting to hear of some big anouncement from my XW soon. She is being too nice lately and I DONT LIKE IT ONE LITTLE BIT! Something stinks  ::)
  • Logged
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. Is tolerated by LaFamiglia
2 Sons - 20 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#44: August 21, 2019, 04:11:59 AM
Thanks Thunder, Whyus

I agree, never trust MLCer acting nice  ;D Just kidding, no offence.

Brief update, today is deadline to make our suggestions about where kids should go school after XW moves together with OM.
Well, I just read her's and it says that it's impossible for her to make any suggestion about specific schools, because she doesn't know where to and when she is moving  :o
Yet SHE was the one that wanted mediation process about school things. SHE was the one that insisted we decide this before S5 goes to first class (he is in preschool now). SHE was the one with plans to sell her house and move in first place. I've told her that I'm not going to anywhere, I have a nice flat which I can (hardly but can) afford in the area where kids have always lived this far, where their friends live, where D11's school currently is... In good and peaceful area comparing to almost any area in the metropolitan area. Where my travel to work takes 20 minutes even in heavy traffic. Etc etc.

Now SHE is the one that discovers that we can't make this contract atm because she has no idea where to and when she will move and she even haven't put her house on sale yet either.

School application needs to be done at very beginning of next year (for S5) and there is no way she knows where her new home would be by then, even selling the old house may take 6 months hands down. On Thursday (see Rose, I got it right this time??  ;D) is our 2nd appointment with mediator and I decided not to make any other suggestions myself but to apply place to S5 from our school, which is less than half a mile from my place. One of us should try to offer some stability to kids, right?

Wish me luck for tomorrow.
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

W
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3568
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#45: August 21, 2019, 04:20:38 AM
Good luck mate!
It sounds like your XW is all over the place if you ask me Silver. Im sure that you will work it out but she is lost for now. She has no plan but feels that she has to do "something". Maybe she is pissed off, jealous even that you have a nice appartment in a pleasant area and are trying to Keep your Kids surroundings as "normal" as possible for them! Idk, it could be anything couldnt it?  ;D

Have you had to take time off work for These pointless Meetings which SHE wanted? If so I wouldnt maybe politely thank her for wasting your precious time and Holiday leave  >:(
  • Logged
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. Is tolerated by LaFamiglia
2 Sons - 20 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#46: August 21, 2019, 05:23:20 AM
Yep Silver looks like the adult, once again, has to make the decision.   ::)
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#47: August 22, 2019, 05:24:24 AM
Thank you guys.

The appointment went ok and we got some kind of contract done. It is not perfect but gives us a needed timeout. It's rather difficult to make concrete plans when one of us doesn't know where she will live in the near future and when she will move etc.

I couldn't help myself throwing couple of truth javelins, no use I know but my throwing hand was itching. I still got it I have to say though...  ::)

My intention wasn't to be mean to her, but the way she talks about me and how all problems and challenges between us, what comes to agreeing kids' matters, are due to my need to control and bullying her. Yes she used that exact word  :o and also that I am the one that only thinks about myself, not kids AND that my bitterness makes things impossible.

Right.

So I guess in her opinion I'm still just throwing a monkey wrench into her plans. An obstacle on her path to happiness if you will.
 


  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#48: August 22, 2019, 05:59:30 AM
Sounds like a lot of projecting if you ask me.

Who is controlling and only thinking of themselves??   ::) ::)
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

H
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2432
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#49: August 22, 2019, 06:22:24 AM
Everything she's saying about you is her talking about herself.
  • Logged

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#50: August 24, 2019, 04:34:54 PM
On Thursday (see Rose, I got it right this time??  ;D)

I noticed! Top marks!!

Everything she's saying about you is her talking about herself.


Incredible isn't it, sounds like you and Thunder have it right too, Helping.

Rose 🌹

P.S well done on being an adult Silver.
  • Logged
« Last Edit: August 24, 2019, 04:36:04 PM by Rosetintedglasses »
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5515
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#51: August 26, 2019, 01:57:00 PM
I swear, having to adult when the other parent (MLCer) is so childish has got to be the single most challenging thing to do. But you did so well Silver. Those truth javelins probably felt good and frankly, sometimes they do hit their mark.

The control and bullying comment? Yep--pure projection. They are so very lost. Feeling like a victim all the time has got to be exhausting. I think the women MLCers excel at that. I know of 2 (Sister and bff from law school--both MLC) in my life who both maintain the victim mentality. Thankfully they have me in their lives to set them straight. LOL.

  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4121
  • Gender: Male
  • Back to being #1 for my daughters!!!!
Re: Empty Space
#52: August 27, 2019, 05:03:43 AM
Hello,

Quote
I have a nice flat which I can (hardly but can) afford in the area where kids have always lived this far, where their friends live, where D11's school currently is...

It is hard for kids to adjust to change and they are already dealing with the divorce and everything else. The more consistent you can keep everything else, the better.

Sometimes, there is no choice but to move because of finances or job relocation. That happens all the time. However, your ex wants to move because she and her honey want to be together.

Quote
Brief update, today is deadline to make our suggestions about where kids should go school after XW moves together with OM.

In my opinion, that's not a good reason to disrupt her children's lives. The one who is bullying and trying to force everyone to go one way is your ex. I have not forgotten about the jacket for your son. Really? What were you going to do, wear his jacket instead, sell it on Ebay? Let her five year old son go cold to get back at you. Now she wants her children to move away so that she can live with her new man. There is a lot of evidence on how that puts young children in danger. Statistically, children in a new home with a new man are much more at risk for abuse than in the family home. Your ex is not making wise choices.

You were right to throw a few darts/javelins in her direction.

Keep going and remember, you are putting the needs of your children above everything else.

I really respect that-fist bump!

Ready
  • Logged
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#53: September 13, 2019, 01:28:12 AM
Hello folks, thanks for replying! Haven't had much time to update lately, then again not much to update either in last few weeks.

Journaling

First, thinking about my title, I believe my Empty Space is not that empty anymore, not sure what that was about, maybe just stopping for a while to find out how do I exactly feel and where I'm coming from and going to. Anyway I think it was needed. The fall has started as always, quite busy at work, lots of kids' stuff at school, daycare and hobbies. Makes me appreciate "me time" again too.

Last weekend happened something that made me feel really bad, thankfully just for a while. We had had discussion with XW and made a deal that we both would go to S5's next soccer practice (last sunday) to support him, because he seemed to have some difficulties to get into a team in which many of other kids have been longer than him. Not sure if it was that exactly or maybe soccer is not his sports after all but that's a different story, XW thinks we should support him until end of the year and then let him make up his mind wether he wants to continue or not. For some reason it seems to be very difficult to her to even consider that he wouldn't want to play soccer in the end  ::) I told her that we definitely won't force him to play but I agree that we should support him to go for some time so he really sees what it is all about and then decide.

That was the reason we agreed that we both would be there at same time last sunday, usually it is just one of us. Well I entered as planned, couple of minutes late, and there she was at the side of the pitch, WITH OM. I said nothing though they greeted me, to be honest I was a bit shocked. I didn't see it coming, OM being part of our S5's "support team".  :o
In S5's view it was probably totally ok, but to me it was just another opportunity to feel, perhaps abandoned or swithched is the right word. It still hurts me to see OM doing this kind of "father business" though I knew that he wasn't probably the one that offered to go along, she was the one that asked him.

Well I took a spot far enough from them so I could focus on S5's practice without having to see or hear happy couple. My first thought was to escape  ::) but I am happy I was adult and father enough to stay until the end of practice. I told S5 that he did great and that I'm proud of him and kissed him and left. Seeing them go to their car, three of us like a family, felt bad as I was leaving.

Tomorrow they are going away for a week to their "family holiday", flying abroad, XW with our kids and OM with his. Can't say I feel any better for that either but I'm trying to think this as a good thing for kids, I can't afford take them abroad this year, they will probably love beach holiday and I should be happy for them. I am, and at same time, I'm sad. Once again makes me think that what the hell did happen to my family. Even I don't feel like having a family with her anymore (as I don't).

How easy it is to someone to take one family member and switch him/her to another person, I still don't get it. Probably never will. But she seems to be happy, I don't know if she is but looks like she is. Once again rises a question to me: was it all about me after all?! We like to think it isn't about us, but what if in some cases - like mine - it was?
Either way, it all happened and that's it.

My relationship with J is good, I enjoy being with her, I have feelings for her and vice versa. I feel much better than an year ago. There's lot of good things in my life and I'm capable enjoying them. But maybe timeline is still too short to expect feeling 'completely healed'. Maybe it takes another 1-2 years for scars not starting to bleed anymore in such a cases.


 







  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#54: September 13, 2019, 01:57:14 AM
Sorry Silver, I would have felt the same way.  Sounded kind of manipulative to me.  Her wanting both parents there, but failed mentioning om was going to also be there.

Sort of like getting you there under false pretenses, if you will.
She wants you to accept her om as part of the family and there is no need for that.  She chose to be with him, fine, but she can't force you to like it or be part of it.  You don't need to be.

I am glad however that you stayed and supported your son.  That is the most important thing, isn't it?

Wonder how she would feel if you ended up coming with your "friend" to a game.
Do your kids know J?  Would it seem odd to your S if she came with you?
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10371
  • Gender: Male
  • You can't please everyone. You are NOT a pizza!
Re: Empty Space
#55: September 13, 2019, 02:11:15 AM
The kids and the Affair Partner will probably always have a trigger attached...

But, I am not totally sure that seeing ANY future partner with our kids wouldn't dredge up SOME sort of emotional sludge....

I do agree with Thunder though that an arranged meeting like that does smack a bit of being sandbagged.... and, although I still have this mental picture of Thunder as an


the idea of you having J there as well does have a certain
ish appeal...
  • Logged
Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#56: September 13, 2019, 02:26:48 AM
 8)   ;D
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

W
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3568
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#57: September 13, 2019, 04:18:28 AM
Solver, dont worry About Football too much. Nobody can Play Football in your Country anyway, thats why you support neighbouring countries  ::) ;D

Silver, the others are Right. TAKE J WITH YOU!!!! DO IT DO IT DO IT
  • Logged
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 46
W: 46 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 31) Trainings partner. Is tolerated by LaFamiglia
2 Sons - 20 & 21
1 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Date 21.08.2018
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0

A
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3346
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#58: September 13, 2019, 05:02:56 AM
Hi Silver, I’ll come along to the next soccer practice, too.
Here is an idea: How about the entire Tuscany group crashing the soccer practice?  We will all wear cheerleaders’ outfit and bring along oversized hot pink pom-poms. 

On a serious note, brining OM along smells like a case of ‘bait and switch.’
At best, it appears inconsiderate and immature.
At worst, it could appear as ‘rubbing your nose in it.’
Neither is nice.  But, you being the adult, stayed for the sake of your son.  That’s why you were there, anyway. 

(((((HUGS))))))
  • Logged
My first thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8164.150

My reconnecting thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10524.msg699615#msg699615

Live-in MLCer

Feb 2015: BD. 
Oct 2015: ILYBINILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10501
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#59: September 13, 2019, 05:25:58 AM
We can't always do it in the moment, my friend, but there are simple truths which are just how it is.
You are your son's father. He is your son. That is a unique relationship between the two of you will exist for life in some shape. Nothing can ever change that fact.

Your xw's happiness or not doesn't change it either, even if it affects her behaviour as a person and parent.
Nothing om does can change it either. If he stays around and is a decent-ish human, over time your son may develop a separate relationship with him. Just like he might have with uncles or favourite teachers or a friend's dad or a soccer coach. That might involve activities that you would prefer your son to do with only you. But he only has one father...and that's you. That truth you can take to the bank. And every time you show up for your son, every moment you do something with him or for him, you just make another deposit.
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#60: September 13, 2019, 06:27:29 AM
Lovely to hear your update Silver.

Good on you supporting S at his football. With or without OM!  My opinion on it is that you don’t need to lower yourself to a MLCers level and take J, unless she has a love of kids football matches then of course take her. Do it for you not to get at XW.  If you are on your own S will get more attention from you which is the whole point. I hate how XW has again put you in a difficult position.

I think your ‘empty space’ was bc your dog had just died so it was actually a good thread name.

Rose 🌹
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 503
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#61: September 13, 2019, 06:37:31 AM
Silver, Just writing to say I am so impressed with how you handled the situation.  I cannot imagine the strength and restraint you showed watching them leave together at the end.   
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#62: September 13, 2019, 07:36:29 AM
Silver, Just writing to say I am so impressed with how you handled the situation.  I cannot imagine the strength and restraint you showed watching them leave together at the end.

Yes. Bravo 👏
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#63: September 18, 2019, 03:38:54 AM
Hi and thank you very much all for your support!

Yup I could ask J to come along, I probably will at some point and it would be rather logic too as she has played football (soccer of course but I can't call it soccer, I'm sorry my American friends) for 30 years herself and has coached juniors too etc. She still plays but is off now for an year after major knee operation. She hurt her knee playing football of course. S5 would probably love to see her there.

Kids are at their vacation atm, they are having a good time in warm country (it's cold here where we live already). I am happy for them, trying to think OM as little as possible. He is part of their lives and I can't change that.

Like you said Treasur, it is all about me and them, my relationship as a father with them. I can only do my best as a dad and trust the fact that I can't be replaced, ever, no matter what happens.

Not the easiest lesson in my life though.

Solver, dont worry About Football too much. Nobody can Play Football in your Country anyway, thats why you support neighbouring countries  ::) ;D

HEY MATE TAKE A LOOK AT EURO 2020 LEAGUE TABLES!

  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#64: October 09, 2019, 04:42:32 AM
Hi!

Not much happened in my life since last time but to keep my thread alive, a brief update

Quite busy and tiresome start of fall here, busy at work as every fall and tired in the evenings  ::)
Leaves are red and brown and first subzero nights behind. Have to start consider changing winter tires on pretty soon.
Going to have a week off next week, which is of course nice and gives needed break from work. Kids are having a holiday too and will be with me first half of the week and then with XW the rest of the week. Like I said before, we have quite nice holiday system here in my country  ;) Then again it is needed as next 5 months it will be dark and wet OR freezing here, people would go crazy without holidays.

My relationship with XW hasn't been very good lately. A lots of stuff to argue about, everythin children related one way or another but that's just how it is atm. Hopefully TIME will fix that too. The main issue to me is the fact that OM is now involved in kids' hobbies too, rather often. Sometimes he picks D11 up to her hobby if XW doesn't have time when it is her turn to take her. I told her that whatever but OM can pick her up from parking lot next to my house, so I don't have to face him. She didn't like it but that's how it is for now.

If I really want to get over this, I have to work to start accepting OM as part of their if not daily, weekly life and the fact that I can't avoid meeting him sometimes either. If I get to that point, not being triggered about it this much as I still do, I believe I would be in very good place already what comes to divorce and everything that followed from it. XW herself, as a woman, as my ex, as a person I truly loved, means less and less to me, that is just what happens when decided to let go and stop standing. And that's good, no doubt about it, but I'm impatient to get to the point when I don't really care much if it is her or OM behind my door, picking D11 up to hobby or whatever.

I'm living my life trying to be compassionate towards myself though, it takes what it takes but I will probably get there and one day I can respect her again, to look her ONLY as their mother who, after all, loves our kids as much as I do. In the end, S5 and D11 are only that matter. Their dad just needs time and enought lessons to learn it. This is really not much about me anymore, it's about them.

J is still in picture, we are seeing each other several times a week, she has been frustrated for not getting back to work soon enough after her major knee operation atm... She has gradually became a really important person to me and I can see that she feels same about me.

Life takes and life gives?

God bless you all you brave beautiful LBS people out there, stay strong.   ;)

 
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Empty Space
#65: January 20, 2020, 12:14:13 AM
Hi you all, long time no see.

Sorry for my friends around that I haven't followed your threads for a while, thing is that I got somehow very tired to this whole subject called MLC and to be honest, to all the fighting here as well. Maybe staying away for a while is good at times.

I didn't remember what I wrote in my last update, reading it now I see that I was struggling especially with OM involved in my childrens' life more and more. It really hurted to see him in S6's (he had birthday at december) football training etc. I believe I'm better with that already tho. I've been seeking acceptance and what comes to OM, I may have found some too. He is not THAT much issue to me anymore I guess, at least not at the moment. He is there and will be there and take part to my childrens' daily life, even more if/when they will move together. Accepting him would probably be good for kids, I may just get there one day soon. After all, the guy is the honest one of the couple, not my XW.

Where I haven't got any further in my way to acceptance is resentment, anger, injustice.
I don't seem to get over the fact that XW hasn't and probably won't ever take any responsibility about our divorce and everything that happened before that. She has her side of story in which I am controlling and oppressive man. I wrote her that I took my responsibility about things I did like snooping her etc and have (literally) paid her for that, admitted it all and that I haven't seen her taking anything on her shoulders about WHY I did what I did. I wrote her that I see divorce as one's fundamental right, if there is a reason, and the reason is individual in everyone and in every case. What I still hunger is apologize about her way to do it by lying, cheating emotionally me and making me look like bad guy.

Her answer is that I should go back to therapy and she can't apologize about what never happened.

I fear of becoming bitter (maybe I am already) and getting stucked in this. I would love to be able to forgive her, even she never asked that for as she probably won't. That would be a huge step to me to go on with my life. Where and how to get it, I have no idea. Maybe I'd need someone's help with that.

Despite these setbacks, my life is at least ok at the moment, I am happy to be able to say that  :) I'm doing good with J and mostly with kids too even though it is painful to hear them saying that they wouldn't want to leave, every sunday when XW picks them up for her week. Yesterday S6 got really bad when XW came, I had to dress him up as he refused to do it himself, he was crying and I carried him to her car. He wouldn't want to leave me which is heartbreaking. Still I know that they love their mom very much and she is as important to them as I am and takes good care of them. Divorce is really big deal to children, can't change that fact by saying that 'children will adapt' (as XW did). Of course they adapt, what choice do they have?? But it hurts them bad, and that's something that every divorced person has to face.
 
Have a good week you all!  8)
 
 
  • Logged
"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10501
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#66: January 20, 2020, 12:56:55 AM
Nice to hear from you, Silver. And to heat that overall you and the kids are doing ok.

Fwiw I think Acceotance has a lot of layers. We pin one bit down and then up pops the next one. Just like you did in choosing how you see OM's involvement with your kids. I think part of it is that we have a residual expectation, particularly perhaps when the divorce they wanted is done, that our exspouses will show some grace and acknowledgment or ownership that they did not before. This rarely happens from what I can see and if it does, not for a very long time. Why? Bc your xw needs to believe her own story to feel ok with what she did to you and your kids. And tbh if she had been in a mindset where she cared much about anyone else's feeling but hers she would not have behaved as she did.

So, file under F for Futile bc it is just more of the same. All it shows you is that her mindset has not changed. It may - UM had a recent whimper from his xw that maybe la la land is not so great - but it hasn't yet.

Imho fwiw, don't worry too much right now on forgiveness. It will come when it comes. Focus on chipping bits off the old Acceptance cheese block. The fact that you are even trying to come to terms with it and to accept what you never wanted and didn't create.....that says all you need to know about who you are and that if you feel angry or bitter for a little while, you won't get stuck there ad infinitum bc it is not who you are.

There is a time when life rains lemons, then a time when we just have a big pile of unwanted lemons...and then a time when we make lemonade or trade them for oranges. You are somewhere between lemons and oranges I suspect and it must be very hard to see the lemons of your kids having to adapt to something you never wanted for them.  Jmo...but sometimes we need a bit more acceptance time and then a bit of forgiving ourselves for bits of the story that brought us here before we can forgive others (especially those who seem to feel they don't need forgiveness lol). You're doing ok, give yourself time my friend.
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#67: January 20, 2020, 03:19:24 AM
Silver

As Treasur says, give yourself time. This is all still quite quick (ha ha it seems anything but quick!) and your XW May need another few years before taking responsibility. I hope she does get there. It’s awful that it means you are left with a lot of the blame in everyone else’s eyes.

Your son wanting to stay with you is heartbreaking. It makes me angry actually. You are so generous and such a good father and man to realise he needs a relationship with his Mom too as really this is the worst part of it all.

Thanks for updating
Rose 🌹
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 23235
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#68: January 20, 2020, 03:40:31 AM
Hi Ho Silver!

So nice to hear from you.  I'm sorry you are struggling a bit with the way things are. 
Divorce is ugly and rarely fair, but I think giving it a bit more time is the key.

You young son crying and not wanting to leave you has to be heartbreaking, but your XW sees it.  Whether she ever acknowledges what she did hurt the kids, she sees it.  It will be stored up in that brain of hers and some day she will have to deal with it all and it won't be pretty.

You will never have to feel that kind of guilt or remorse and that just may be when forgiveness will happen.
I believe it's just a matter of time.
  • Logged
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10371
  • Gender: Male
  • You can't please everyone. You are NOT a pizza!
Re: Empty Space
#69: January 20, 2020, 04:52:09 AM
Like everyone else has already said, it is a matter of ... yep... That 4-letter word again.. Time.

I personally think that the Mid-Lifer first needs to realize that, no matter where they go, no matter what R they decide to get into, there they are and NOTHING has really changed. Once they realize they can't outrun themselves, then the real work begins. For some, that may actually never happen because they keep running from one "shiny" thing to the next as a way of avoiding their own deepest and darkest demons.  Once they figure out that they aren't any happier than they used to be, THAT is when the fantasy begins to come crashing down around their ears. That is when you MIGHT start to hear some murmurs how things are not any better and that they are beginning to have regrets. Maybe that leads to an apology, maybe not. That is something that you will have to decide, whether that is crucial to your healing, accepting that it then may never happen... It is then up to you to accept an apology that you didn't get or not...

I know exactly how you feel with regards to S because I was on the other end. D(then5) was crying and throwing a major temper tantrum and I had to carry her to my car. Ironically, about 5 minutes after we were on our way to my place, she was all better and happy again. What it was all about, I have no idea. I can only guess that she was afraid that mom was going to disappear or something. She did make the comment once after one of those fits "What happens if something happens to Mommy and I am not there?"  A pretty heavy load for a 5 year old to carry - being responsible for her mother's well-being...

We haven't had one of those fits in a few years though so it may be a stage which the child "outgrows" over time. Yes, like Thunder said, your xW will remember those incidents at some point if and when she gets her head out of her .... fog.... It is something that I remember all too well but now D(9) is more than happy to come with me when she does.... Again, it is a matter of time....

UM
  • Logged
Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4121
  • Gender: Male
  • Back to being #1 for my daughters!!!!
Re: Empty Space
#70: January 20, 2020, 07:12:14 AM
Hello,

Quote
I didn't remember what I wrote in my last update, reading it now I see that I was struggling especially with OM involved in my childrens' life more and more.

To be fair, I never had OM in my children's lives. My youngest talked to him on the phone once and wasn't that impressed. My oldest never met or spoke to him and has stated she would knee him in the groin if given the opportunity.

In my new situation, I have two new kids. They are both very kind to me and respectful. We have done things together and I have given advice, but I am not their father. It is just understand and being respectful. Then again, their father cheated and left their mother. They have both told me that they love the fact that I have made their mother a happy person and that means the most to them.

Quote
I fear of becoming bitter (maybe I am already) and getting stucked in this. I would love to be able to forgive her, even she never asked that for as she probably won't. That would be a huge step to me to go on with my life. Where and how to get it, I have no idea. Maybe I'd need someone's help with that.


There is a good book called "Forgiveness is a Choice." It is a great place to start. To be honest, I have not totally forgiven my ex either. I have come a long way and like posted elsewhere, it is like layers that need to be slowly pulled back. However, I am in such a good place now that my heart and mind are in a different place.

Quote
What I still hunger is apologize about her way to do it by lying, cheating emotionally me and making me look like bad guy.

To be honest, I never expected an apology from my Ex It is not in her DNA. After the divorce, I have only seen her four times over the past six years. Maybe three phone calls regarding finances or the kids. Then just a few months ago, my Ex called me and told me she was sorry. She said she was sorry for everything. That moved a lot of layers. So, I don't know. It was a step in the right direction and I have felt much better about us ever since.

One thing is that you can't control her at all, and neither can she control you. Now, she is just another person in the world. Her thoughts and feelings about you are no longer valid. My advice is to be a great father and live your life without her in your heart or your head. Put the people that matter the most- your kids, J, and the others that are happy to have you in their lives.

You will be just fine. ((((Hugs))))

Ready



  • Logged
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

  • *
  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 11037
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#71: January 20, 2020, 08:15:47 AM
Hi Silver, gad to see you back posting.

I hope you can find a way to forgive her. On many levels and it will help you as well. Those feelings of anger and bitterness, although perhaps necessary to allow us to process all that has happened, in the end don't do us any good.

Yes, divorce is really damaging to our children, no matter what age. We just continue to be the stable parent for them.

My adult daughter said something over the holidays that I thought very wise, she grieves the father that she once had and accepts the one she has now. I know he cares about her, but he spends very little time with her, almost none really and that to me still indicates that something is so terribly wrong with them.

Try not to let the "fighting" get to you...it is a few people who ruin it for so many many others.
  • Logged
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

A
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3346
  • Gender: Female
Re: Empty Space
#72: January 20, 2020, 10:12:20 AM
((((((HUGS))))))) Silver.

You will get there, given TIME.  You recognize the negative elements (e.g. anger, resentment) you wish to discard.   That, my friend, is a big step forward.  They eat you up if you hold on to them as you know. 

Apologies...  Do I understand you want that from your ex!  I’m quite confident that your need for her apologies will shrink as time goes on, if my experience means anything.  Things (e.g. apologies) that I had thought were important during my H’s crazy time in MLC land, I can hardly remember them any longer.  Your priorities and concerns will shift about until they naturally fall into place, given ...... TIME. 

All the best with your R with your kids and J!

  • Logged
« Last Edit: January 20, 2020, 10:17:27 AM by Acorn »
My first thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8164.150

My reconnecting thread:  https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10524.msg699615#msg699615

Live-in MLCer

Feb 2015: BD. 
Oct 2015: ILYBINILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 2491
  • Gender: Female
Empty Space
#73: March 03, 2020, 05:18:53 PM
Hey Silver, I haven't been around much myself either.  Good to hear from you!
  • Logged
M-42
H-44
S-20 (mine)
D-18 (ours)
S-15 (ours)
Friends 7y before M
Married 14y
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniv.
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17 (told me 4 days before)
Eng. off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
New GF 2/29/20 (Told me 4/22/20)
Marrying her 4/24/20 (Told me 4/22/20)

Link to my journey: 
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11404.0

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass - it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Don't become a container for bitterness.  It's a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes - some things have to break apart so better things can be built."

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1189
  • Gender: Female
Empty Space
#74: July 30, 2020, 06:00:41 AM
How are things Silver?

Hope you are doing ok.

Rose 🌹
  • Logged
Married 15+ years with 2 children
BD1 - 2016
BD2 - 2017
BD3 - Sept 2019
MOW Mar 2016-Jan 2018
OW2 - Feb 2019, age 30
H left home Oct 2017 to stay with his parents
Bought a family Puppy mid 2018 - referred to as ‘P’

Link to advice by my mentor, Phoenix, on what to tell the children about H leaving - reply #33 (it had a glitch)
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9313.30

 

Legal Disclaimer

The information contained within The Hero's Spouse website family (www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com, http://theherosspouse.com and associated subdomains), (collectively 'website') is provided as general information and is not intended to be a substitute for professional legal, medical or mental health advice or treatment for specific medical conditions. The Hero's Spouse cannot be held responsible for the use of the information provided. The Hero's Spouse recommends that you consult a trained medical or mental health professional before making any decision regarding treatment of yourself or others. The Hero's Spouse recommends that you consult a legal professional for specific legal advice.

Any information, stories, examples, articles, or testimonials on this website do not constitute a guarantee, or prediction regarding the outcome of an individual situation. Reading and/or posting at this website does not constitute a professional relationship between you and the website author, volunteer moderators or mentors or other community members. The moderators and mentors are peer-volunteers, and not functioning in a professional capacity and are therefore offering support and advice based solely upon their own experience and not upon legal, medical, or mental health training.