Author Topic: My Story One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…  (Read 456 times)

Offline Laugh or CryTopic starter

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My Story Re: One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2019, 06:29:04 AM »
I do wonder if part of the issue is your wording.  For instance, my husband likes watching sports.  For years I complained if he watched too often.  But, because he liked it I found a way to get on board(so long as it was not in excess).  I began to make fun food(dips, chili etc), and though I did not sit down to watch the games, I would read a book in the same room etc...and more importantly not complain.

I think what people are saying is, you can get involved in your h’s hobbies without manipulating or lying.  Also, there has to be a balance between what you like and they like.  A one sided relationship breeds resentment.  I am a Christian, and try to be kind to my husband even in this MLC.  I chose love(though it is hard to love who he currently is).  But, I can be kind and gracious without lying, pretending, or manipulating.  It takes two people for a marriage to work.  It seems to me we do our part and give the rest to God.  Your h has free will.  We can not control our spouses, or outcomes. 

You may get him back, but at what cost.  You are lying to yourself and him.  If we truly leave it in God’s hands and trust him, there is no need to sin in order to achieve God’s will.  Because of course it is not God’s will for us to sin.

I do agree completely that it is important to be kind, to be polite, to be light(as much as possible), to not be the complaining, nagging wife.  I also agree that we can participate in hobbies, movies etc that are more suited to them and look for enjoyment.  But, your wording comes off as manipulative and controlling.


Replacing complaining with any kind of positive interaction will nearly always work in our favor, I think; your decision to make fun food was an excellent one!

Unfortunately, my husband doesn't have any hobbies, but if he did, getting involved would still require pretending to like them, since adopting hobbies without appearing to like them would make him think I was a psycho, not someone with stuff in common with him.

And just out of curiosity; when you switched from complaining to providing your husband food and hanging out in the room with him, were you letting your face and voice show the anger, frustration, or whatever the negative emotions were that led to complaining, or did you FAKE being pleasant and friendly?

There actually DOESN'T have to be a balance between what I like and what my husband likes. The friend I've mentioned before, who although disliking sports, has been watching them with her husband, wearing matching sports jerseys, for over 20 years? He in return shows no shred of interest in the knickknacks she collects, shoes, or anything else that she likes. She doesn't expect him to like what she likes, because he's a man. Every other woman I know in a 20+ year happy marriage has a similar story. None of them have ever displayed the slightest hint of resentment, any more than they express resentment of the things they need to do for their children while their children do nothing for them in return; that's just how family works.

But even if I would somehow be different from them, I'm good with that; I would infinitely rather feel resentment with my husband in the house than be resentment-free and alone.

It's a common saying that it takes 2 people for a marriage to work, but that's not actually true. There are marriages where neither person does any particular work, they just drift along doing whatever, and it seems to work for them. In a traditional marriage, the woman did 100% of the relationship work herself; the man brought home a paycheck, washed the cars, mowed the lawn, cleaned the gutters, and if she was lucky, might remember her birthday... but he didn't validate her feelings, support her personhood, pay any attention to her hobbies other than to express contempt, or any of the other things we demand of men nowadays that they were never expected to do for the rest of human history.

It turns out that we CAN control our spouses and outcomes to a certain extent. I'm proving that right now.

This isn't the proper place to discuss religion, but I will say that everything I'm doing is directly in line with what is taught in my church, and what the wives in successful long-term marriages there do. It is considered part of respect and honor for your husband to be meek, in other words controlling your thoughts, feelings, and behavior completely, and indicating to him at all times that his likes, wants, preferences, actions and words are all good and right, as long as he's not sinning, and sometimes even then, especially if he's a nonbeliever like my husband is.

"Manipulative" is a loaded word, because it suggests that something harmful is being done; that's not the case here. I'm not trying to harm my husband, take something from him, bilk him of his money, take away his children (a moot point, since he doesn't have any), or anything else negative; I'm attempting to get him to take hold of the absolute best thing he will ever have available to him in his life outside of a relationship with Jesus… his WIFE. And as for controlling, I hope I'm coming across that way, because I'm making it clear over and over that I AM controlling things with my husband, rather than the other way around... At long, LONG last! There is no possible relationship of equals under these circumstances, and since someone has to be in control, I would certainly prefer that it be ME! He has had control of my life, to my infinite detriment, for more years than I care to remember; now, I'M controlling things for his infinite benefit. I'm deliberately using psychological principles to alter how he thinks and feels about me, with the intention that the altered thoughts and feelings will change his behavior towards me… And IT'S WORKING!!!!

Sorry, I'm not going to drape myself on my fainting couch and say that there's nothing I can do, that I just have to wait helplessly for him to become a radically different person although he has no incentive to do so, and come back to a situation that he thinks and feels is the same as it was when he left, and give up his newfound freedom for… from his former perspective, nothing. There is a great deal I can do, I'm doing it, and as a result my husband and I are now making astonishing progress towards what all observers declare to be inevitable reunion.

I'm not going into other people's threads and trying to argue them into doing things my way.
If everyone else here wants to just get on with their lives with the other side of the bed empty, more power to them. If you think that taking back some control is so terrible, that pretending to like movies that you don't like is just unbearable, then by all means, don't do those things. Everyone needs to decide for themselves how much their husband and their marriage are worth. I've made MY decisions. I'm sticking by them.




Offline hopeandfaith

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Re: One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2019, 05:10:06 PM »
You make some very interesting points LOC.  You are most definitely in the drivers seat of your life at the moment and I think that is a common wish across this board even if people wouldn't necessarily choose your approach as their own.

There really has been a big shift in traditions throughout a fairly short time in history and I often wonder if men feel like they have just come out of the spin cycle of a washing machine.  What is expected of them and what is not?  Maybe its just my impression of things but it seems like we have gone from expecting them to having no feelings or emotions to thinking just like women.  Neither of these things are true.  We are different creatures.

Your marriage is your own and I wish you much success.
BD's in May 09, Sept 12 - suspected OW
Left home Jan 12 2013
OW confirmed Feb 2013
Moved home April 11 2014
BD again in April 2017 - clinging. 
Moved out July 2017
D19, D17 and S15

Offline Silver

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Re: One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2019, 01:19:56 AM »

It's a common saying that it takes 2 people for a marriage to work, but that's not actually true. There are marriages where neither person does any particular work, they just drift along doing whatever, and it seems to work for them. In a traditional marriage, the woman did 100% of the relationship work herself; the man brought home a paycheck, washed the cars, mowed the lawn, cleaned the gutters, and if she was lucky, might remember her birthday... but he didn't validate her feelings, support her personhood, pay any attention to her hobbies other than to express contempt, or any of the other things we demand of men nowadays that they were never expected to do for the rest of human history.

It turns out that we CAN control our spouses and outcomes to a certain extent. I'm proving that right now.


Isn't it all about how you define "good marriage"?  Marriage can "work" without either being happy in it, if it's defined as you just did.
OR you can be perfectly happy in it that way, if that's reflecting your personal values. I believe for most it isn't and that's why manipulating your spouse to come back wouldn't probably lead to the wanted result.

In my personal opinion, what you wrote above is underestimating men in general and is far from what good husband is, in my values.


 

"I've seen dreams that move the mountains, hope that doesn't ever end even when the sky is falling. I've seen miracles just happen, silent prayers get answered, broken hearts become brand new. That's what faith can do." Kutless

Offline Laugh or CryTopic starter

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Re: One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2019, 10:47:51 PM »
You make some very interesting points LOC.  You are most definitely in the drivers seat of your life at the moment and I think that is a common wish across this board even if people wouldn't necessarily choose your approach as their own.

There really has been a big shift in traditions throughout a fairly short time in history and I often wonder if men feel like they have just come out of the spin cycle of a washing machine.  What is expected of them and what is not?  Maybe its just my impression of things but it seems like we have gone from expecting them to having no feelings or emotions to thinking just like women.  Neither of these things are true.  We are different creatures.

Your marriage is your own and I wish you much success.

Thank you, Hopeandfaith!

Being in the driver's seat is certainly a welcome change, believe me! I agree that there are probably plenty of other people here who wish for that; given the consistent resistance to something as simple as pretending to like a movie that you don't like, I'm guessing that many people won't choose my approach… but on the other hand, since my approach seems to be the only one that actively alters a husband's level of liking and approval, maybe some people will start to reconsider.

You're totally right about how much expectations of marriage have changed in a very short time! A man used to be able to come home from work to a clean house, a cooked-from-scratch dinner, all the other chores and errands handled, and a wife ready to focus on him. Total fulfillment of his duties as husband were limited to bringing in a paycheck and a handful of manly tasks such as lawn mowing. Today, radically more is asked of a man in every area, and not only is he not compensated for his extra effort, he receives significantly LESS than he did before. My husband is old enough to have had a father who received all the benefits of traditional marriage, compared to which modern marriage looks woefully inadequate, even if we had a perfect relationship. I'm hoping to make up for that gap as much as I can now.

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

Because I was listening to music my husband likes when he came over today, he was eager to share a song with me that may literally be the worst song I've ever heard, LOL… but after we listened to it and discussed the many ways it was wonderful, he asked me to go out with him Saturday night!  :)


Offline Laugh or CryTopic starter

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Re: One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…
« Reply #14 on: July 12, 2019, 02:25:57 AM »

It's a common saying that it takes 2 people for a marriage to work, but that's not actually true. There are marriages where neither person does any particular work, they just drift along doing whatever, and it seems to work for them. In a traditional marriage, the woman did 100% of the relationship work herself; the man brought home a paycheck, washed the cars, mowed the lawn, cleaned the gutters, and if she was lucky, might remember her birthday... but he didn't validate her feelings, support her personhood, pay any attention to her hobbies other than to express contempt, or any of the other things we demand of men nowadays that they were never expected to do for the rest of human history.

It turns out that we CAN control our spouses and outcomes to a certain extent. I'm proving that right now.


Isn't it all about how you define "good marriage"?  Marriage can "work" without either being happy in it, if it's defined as you just did.
OR you can be perfectly happy in it that way, if that's reflecting your personal values. I believe for most it isn't and that's why manipulating your spouse to come back wouldn't probably lead to the wanted result.

In my personal opinion, what you wrote above is underestimating men in general and is far from what good husband is, in my values.
 

I think the best definition of a good marriage is that both participants are satisfied with it.

For everyone I have ever encountered outside of this forum, that includes numerous little white lies told to keep from hurting the other person's feelings, and to maintain marital harmony. Perhaps the fact that everyone on this forum has been abandoned by their husbands, and everyone on this forum rejects little white lies, is not a coincidence? Perhaps we have discovered an important psychological truth here, that if you're not willing to tell any little white lies to make your husband feel better, you have a high probability that he will be unhappy enough to leave you?

"Manipulating" is a loaded word; it suggests ugly tactics like high pressure, threats, or guilt-tripping to force someone to do something that is contrary to their best interest. Nothing could be further from the truth in my situation. I'm using psychology to act in ways that will cause my husband to like and value me more, leading to an improved quality and quantity of relationship interactions that appear at this point to be leading towards a reunion… and reunion is 100% in his best interest!

What I'm doing IS leading to the wanted result, in fact I'm one of just a tiny % of people on this forum who is getting the wanted result; clear progress to marital restoration. There is every reason to believe that continuing to use the same psychological principles will continue to give the same results, and no reason whatsoever to think that it will suddenly give a different result. Since it appears to be the goal of most people on here to get back together with their husbands, at some point maybe you'll stop trying to claim that what already IS working can't possibly work, and instead start figuring out how and why it works so that other people can use the same method?


Offline Laugh or CryTopic starter

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Re: One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2019, 04:19:48 AM »
Saturday night was another problem-free date!!!!

A friend who is even more into psychology than I am gave me another useful psychological term; reactance. This is what they call it when you ask someone to do something, and they refuse to do it because you asked them to, even if they were already planning to do it; it has a lot of overlap with passive aggressiveness. I did a little research, and reactance, which like passive aggressiveness is extraordinarily difficult to combat much less overcome, can be successfully battled with… our old friend similarity! That's right, the same process that causes someone to like us more also disarms reactance tendencies. Similarity is so powerful, that in an experiment they discovered that something as trivial as causing the test subject to believe that the one who wanted them to do something shared their same birthday made them much more willing to comply.

How do you make that work for you? If you want someone to like you more, and be less reactant aka less of a passive aggressive jerk, let them believe that they have more in common with you than they actually do. Or, you can keep on doing nothing, and hope that your husband is one of the 1% or so that eventually decides all by themselves that they want to return to the wife they have so much ugly history with, rather than having a baggage-free relationship with somebody new and exciting. Totally up to you.  :)

Offline Laugh or CryTopic starter

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Re: One step at a time… or half step, or quarter step…
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2019, 09:11:16 PM »
We had another effortless date night!! At one point, he was resting his hand on my back, which he hasn't done in so long that I nearly jumped out of my skin when he touched me, LOL. I continue to be cautiously optimistic.

 

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