Author Topic: My Story 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year  (Read 4115 times)

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
My Story 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« on: September 11, 2019, 10:12:09 AM »
Welcome to my new thread. Wasting no time as there was an interesting discussion going on about our inner child and how some of us LBSs feel as if our life with our spouse's was fake, or something to that effect.

Quick recap-update:
Since BD, I have moved twice. In November it will be a year in this little hayloft the kids and I call home now. It is the perfect place for us.

I work for the new owner of my old winery, plus I do some translation work for my friend/estate agent, plus I have my little flat up and going on Air B&B, which I do myself.

My kids are getting older, My D25 has finished her masters and is working in the US. She is coming back for a visit in November. My D22 just graduated and will be leaving to do her masters in London in a week. My S15 has been accepted into a tennis academy in the North of Italy. I miss him but this is his dream.

This Saturday I'm going to be joining the others on the Tuscany trip. This will be my only holiday this summer as I've been earning for my kids, so I'm really, really looking forward to it!

What's changed in me this 2019, is that in January I told myself I was in denial about H returning. H went away to London for Christmas to be with OW. The first Christmas together, and in her country. I forced myself to be more aware that the chances of him coming home were very very small. It helped me detach to a certain extent.

Then in February, H charged up my D25's credit card and didn't have the money to cover it. He asked me to lend him the money, I said no. I ended up covering it anyway as my D25 asked me for help. This ended up with D25 cutting me off for a few months.

A couple of months later, H admitted to S that the credit card mess and the fact that D25 wasn't talking to me was all his fault. H had some nostalgic moments with S whilst walking around Florence, told S about places we would go on dates.

Since then, the judge finalized my H's separation case, and now H and I are legally separated. After a month, H requested a D.

Soon after, H said he would grant me a D (hadn't asked for one), if  I took away the wage garnishing order I have and refuse alimony for myself. If not, he threatened to sue me for €250,000 for money he spent while at our old property while he lived there. I said no.

Very clear that H is in big financial difficulty, presently car less and moves around on a bike.

Other noticeable changes in my H this 2019: Had lunch with S at tennis school in front of everyone, and stayed to watch S playing for the first time in 4 years, even though he knew I was coming to watch too. Had a few touch and goes, stealing glances at me, offered to mow my lawn twice, took a shower in my house, paid back small debts he owed me, stayed in my house with S while I went away for a weekend (hadn't slept in my home since before BD), re-connected with my cousin in Rome, whom he knows I'm very close to, sending her and my aunt his love, agreed to give more maintenance on top of the garnished wages so that S could go to the tennis academy, came to help me when I hurt my back and held me gently and kindly. He has withdrawn a little since then.

I asked H to watch doggie for a few days while I'm on the Tuscany trip. He has agreed to do it at his house. He is going to use my garage to store his impounded car until he sorts his fines. We have been in contact about that today since he went into my garage without forewarning me and I just happened to find out when I went in there to look for something at lunch time.

I laid out a strong boundary that he needs to inform me before he goes. That he can't remove anything without asking me first. That he can't make a mess because I need to be able to find my stuff. This caused an exchange of 10 emails. His emails got better grammatically and softer as they went on. I'm still on email only communication.

H is still with OW although she hasn't been around here much. We can tell because when she comes, he has to rent a car.








Previous thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11008.150
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline UrsaMajor

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9369
  • Gender: Male
  • Live like they are never coming back
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2019, 01:27:30 PM »
Attaching.... Don't want to miss the Tuscany reports
Me - 56
xW - 49
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline Evermore

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 216
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2019, 02:24:09 PM »
Following along Milly. Very envious of Tuscany trip and looking forward to reports!
M: 49
H: 51
Married 20yrs, together 23yrs
D: 20
D: 18
BD (that I didn't recognise as such) Easter 2018
BD 9th Sep 2018
OW (45) - he met her in the pub a week before BD, told me about her a week after BD. Thinks 'their planets have collided' because 'their eyes met across the room' and they had an 'instant connection'. Lives with her. Is building a life with her.

Offline barbiedoll

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2195
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2019, 06:36:40 PM »
Wish I was going to Tuscany.. sigh.  Following along . Sounds like you have mastered "boundary" makin!
Married April 1985
5 children
Bomb Drop April 2013
Thrown out of house August 2013
Affair discovered November 2013 (i guessed who)
Home December 3 2013
The Journey Of Reconciliation .. is for the brave .

Anger is like a candle in the wind ... it blows out the light of all reason.

Online stillbaffled

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4505
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2019, 06:45:13 PM »
So ow doesn't ride bike with him, Milly?!?   ;)

Have a great trip! 
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

Offline Rising Phoenix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1337
  • Gender: Female
  • Mlc- Cake eater for 3 yr now vanisher
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2019, 09:08:02 AM »
Attaching milly xx
Me 51
H52
Married still, 22yrs
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline Rising Phoenix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1337
  • Gender: Female
  • Mlc- Cake eater for 3 yr now vanisher
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2019, 09:11:17 AM »
On the rare occasion my h contacts me I can either get teenage text speak or if he is annoyed at me which seems to be all 99% of the time I get very formal texts with words a professional or lawyer would use. He must look them up on the internet! He plans his formal texts very carefully I think. Xx
Me 51
H52
Married still, 22yrs
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline Finding Joy

  • Trial Subscriber
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 616
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2019, 10:06:31 AM »
Attaching Milly!  Have fun in Tuscany!
Married 19 years
Husband is 42
I am 39

BD1-April 2018-Unrecognized by me until way later, he is unhappy, wants counseling.
BD2-October 2018-ILYBNIL, wants a divorce, this after I found out about OW 1(EA), Unsure if he and OW2(PA) are still together?
April 2019 He got an apartment and moved out.

4 kids 5-14 years

But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2019, 10:30:19 AM »
Hello everyone and thank you for attaching.

So I thought I had laid out strong boundaries about my garage. This morning I went back to my garage with my D22 to look for the documents I really need.

I like to welcome the guests in my little apartment with a bottle of white wine. I leave it in the fridge so it's lovely and cold for them to open right away upon arrival. So for this purpose, I keep a few bottles in my garage. Yesterday, when I went to the garage by myself, I noticed that I was out of wine. I keep in in a old wood cupboard, in it's cardboard wine box of 6. Now I knew I was getting low, but didn't think I'd ran out because I would make sure to top it up. Also, I noticed that the cardboard box was gone, too. I wouldn't do that. I keep it there to support the wine. But I convinced myself that I had finished the wine, and maybe the cleaner lady who helps me at times, had thrown the box out.

So today I arrived at the garage with D22 with a bottle to leave for the coming week while I'm away. Except, suddenly, the box was there and there were 2 bottles in it. Sound like a fairy tale? That's because it's the MLC fairy tale. So I email H and say: I see you brought the white wine back. What about the red?'  Now, I wasn't sure he'd taken any red but since it's sitting there in a pile and it did look smaller, there was a chance he had. Then I wrote: 'I asked you to inform me before going to the garage. I need total transparency. Do you agree?'

A couple of hours later, H emails, 'Yes, I brought back the white wine. I did not take the red!'  His grammar. So clearly he feels offended that I should accuse him of stealing....the red. Stealing the white is ok because he brought it back. I think he thought he could quickly sneak in and bring back the white wine before Mummy noticed.

H reminds me of my S these last couple of years when he would affirm he'd studied, checked his homework online, done it all! And the more I would question S, the stronger he made his claims, almost to intimidate me, guilt me for accusing him of lying. Well, we know how that went.

I have not answered H's last email.

Tomorrow I have a busy day. I have a tasting in the morning then I work from home, then I'm going to pack. Saturday is a big day.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline KeepItTogether

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5083
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2019, 10:44:54 AM »
'Yes, I brought back the white wine. I did not take the red!'

OMG I just cannot! Yes, you are definitely dealing with a 12 year old MLCer there. Wow. And taking your wine. Ummm, no!

Well Milly, I think you DID lay down some good boundaries. But they are only as good as the person who is subject to them. And in this case, H clearly doesn't get it. I'm not sure what the answer is, other than bar him access to the garage. Of course, maybe now that you said something about it, he is on notice that you are aware of the wine-snatching. So maybe that will take care of the problem. I hope it does. Bad enough these people have lied and cheated. Now they are stealing too. Yay, does the fun never end?

Good news is, you have tenants in your rental. Go you.
Me 48
H 47
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline Sam I Am

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1598
  • Gender: Female
  • https://affaircare.com/the-180
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2019, 10:51:44 AM »
attaching!  Enjoy Tuscany!
10.29.17 BD-Moved out to OW/A began in  6.17
3.5.18 OW moved away/H moved in with F
3.19.18  H moved home into spare room 
7.14.18  Moved to be with OW (another state)
9.4.18  Moved back-Living with Parents 
11.1.18  OW moved back.  H living w/her in D's basement room. 
11.18 - H started visiting on holidays
11.26.19 Call from H.  BIL died suddenly.
1.19 - H announced to my inner circle that he moved to sisters  inc all belongings
2.19  H volunteers to house and dog sit whenever.
Spring 19  H visiting house and doing chores on a regular basis

4.83 Started Dating
8.10.85  Married

D -29 Married with 2 children  Lives Local
S - 27 Engaged in Prof School across country
3 Dogs (he left them all behind - taking care of them but not really visiting or interacting with them yet)

Offline Mortesbride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2605
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2019, 02:02:54 AM »
Brief break from packing to catch up with everyone. Cya soon. ^_^
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline UrsaMajor

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9369
  • Gender: Male
  • Live like they are never coming back
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2019, 02:36:29 AM »
You set a boundary. He broke the boundary.

Now, what are the consequences for him breaking the boundary and how will they be enforced?
Me - 56
xW - 49
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2019, 11:34:43 AM »
Attaching. Have an amazing trip!!
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2019, 12:18:36 PM »
UM, I get what you're saying: I'm enforcing boundaries, what am I doing about him breaking them? Hmmmm, I've got a ways to go with that. So, I want to call him on stuff he does, but not in a way that he feels backed into a corner. I know how that would go, we've been there before: he starts shouting, I get mad, one of the two stops communication, H goes back into the tunnel more convinced than ever. It's really hard to enforce a boundary and not get trailed into a fight. It's happening tonight.

So, after the wine fiasco, H emails last night that his car won't fit in my garage with the items of furniture I said I needed (where I store my linens, etc. for my rental). He writes provocative (bully) messages like: Are you sure you need that stuff? I email back that yes, I need it and no, there isn't anywhere else I can put it. Then I say, Is there any reason we can't be whatsapping? This communicating by email is really annoying.'

So tonight, he whatsaps. I think the last time was a couple of years ago. His messages are still provocative:  Are you sure you can't store it somewhere else?  Then he gets pissy.
H: Do you really think my car can fit in your garage with all that stuff?
Me: I have no idea. I see others have cars in the garage and some furniture.
H: your garage is probably smaller. It's only for a short time, can I just take the stuff away for now?
Me: No, I need it.
H: Well then that's a no to me using your garage then isn't it?
H: You say you want to help, but you really don't.
Me: I don't really know how to answer that last message.
Me: Have you measured the garage?
H: No, but I can just tell by looking.
Me: I suggest you measure it then. And please use a nice tone of voice.

It's been an hour, no answer yet.



Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline heroIam

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1953
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2019, 01:17:12 PM »
Attaching milly.

I just shake my head at it all like I have for 5 years!
See you soon!
“In the end, you’ve got to be your own hero because everyone’s busy trying to save themselves.”

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2019, 04:11:22 PM »
I'd be tempted to say 'oh dear, looks like the garage option won't work for you then'.
No further work required by you, no shouting needed, no drama, no more thefts, not your problem... ;)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline forthetrees

  • MLCer Type: Vanisher
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3080
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2019, 05:07:17 PM »
The odd piece is that he assumes you already knew the dimensions of the garage and the car and were making a pseudo nice gesture. The other piece is that he´s pissy at you but he is the one who caused the car going into default on the loan. So, you´re supposed to fix his problems and not make any comment or facial gesture that implies he brought this upon himself. If OW is so wonderful, why hasn´t she figured out how to get him out of this mess? Seems that your original offer was to help him out if it did not inconvenience you. Sadly, it would, so he´s SOL.
me 51
H 51
M 27
BD 1/15/ 10 then BD 8/21/10
D final 8/13

Online terra

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 155
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2019, 10:01:06 PM »
Attaching, Milly.

Are you leaving tomorrow? If so, what if you just tell him “It’s ok for you to find another solution. Will talk to you after I get back.”

Then close the door on it and just love your time and peace and experiences in Tuscany.

I also think it’s ok to be frank and tell him no on using the garage at all. Or only under your supervision. If he balks at that or gives you the sad/mad/astonished rubbish about “You don’t trust me”... the answer to that is “Yes, that is true. I don’t trust you.” And walk away from any further discussion about it, because you already know it will just be weird MLC wrangling and an unproductive use of your good and valuable time.

Any way you slice it though, you aren’t obliged to do him any favors. And if you choose not to do the favors, guess what! That’s a reasonable and legitimate consequence of him having treated you poorly. It’s not petty or punishment. It’s one way to show that you’ve meant it, about your stated boundaries.

I hope you just LOVE Tuscany. Enjoy!

« Last Edit: September 13, 2019, 10:03:07 PM by terra »

Offline Savoir Faire

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5461
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #19 on: September 14, 2019, 07:10:46 PM »
I agree with the others, if he doesn't like it and expects you to jump through hoops to accommodate a cheating liar, then tell him he's welcome to find somewhere else to store his car.

He already knows you don't really want to help him (his words) ;D ;D

Consequences, consequences.........
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Offline One day at a time

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1159
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #20 on: September 15, 2019, 01:38:43 PM »
Enjoy your Tuscany trip Milly!! I so wish I could be there with all of you..

As for your H, he really has a cheek, doesn't he? After everything he has done, he's pissy because his car would not fit in your garage? The sense of entitlement is infuriating! Yep, he's welcome to find another option  ::)
H - 42 (40 @BD1)
M - 42 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.
Confirmation H and OW are together, presume PA  - 3rd June 2019

"One of the happiest moments in life is when you find the courage to let go of what you can’t change"

Offline UrsaMajor

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9369
  • Gender: Male
  • Live like they are never coming back
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #21 on: September 16, 2019, 03:38:00 AM »
UM, I get what you're saying: I'm enforcing boundaries, what am I doing about him breaking them? Hmmmm, I've got a ways to go with that.

And out comes the 2x4.... Sorry Milly but you are STATING a boundary... you are NOT enforcing them... Enforcing means employing consequences if the boundary is broken.... And that is what is currently missing in this scenario...

So, I want to call him on stuff he does, but not in a way that he feels backed into a corner. I know how that would go, we've been there before: he starts shouting, I get mad, one of the two stops communication, H goes back into the tunnel more convinced than ever. It's really hard to enforce a boundary and not get trailed into a fight. It's happening tonight.

Consequences are unpleasant for the most part, both for the person levying them and the person who has to accept them by dint of their own behaviour.. It is called "being held accountable.". However, they are an integral part of ensuring that the boundaries that are set out are followed... Otherwise, the boundary is useless and the violator has the confirmation that the Boundary setter was not serious or does not need to be respected...

So, after the wine fiasco, H emails last night that his car won't fit in my garage with the items of furniture I said I needed (where I store my linens, etc. for my rental).


He writes provocative (bully) messages like: Are you sure you need that stuff? I email back that yes, I need it and no, there isn't anywhere else I can put it. Then I say, Is there any reason we can't be whatsapping? This communicating by email is really annoying.'

So tonight, he whatsaps. I think the last time was a couple of years ago. His messages are still provocative:  Are you sure you can't store it somewhere else?  Then he gets pissy.
H: Do you really think my car can fit in your garage with all that stuff?
Me: I have no idea. I see others have cars in the garage and some furniture.
H: your garage is probably smaller. It's only for a short time, can I just take the stuff away for now?
Me: No, I need it.
H: Well then that's a no to me using your garage then isn't it?
H: You say you want to help, but you really don't.
Me: I don't really know how to answer that last message.
Me: Have you measured the garage?
H: No, but I can just tell by looking.
Me: I suggest you measure it then. And please use a nice tone of voice.

Then he is welcome to find a different solution that fits his car. It is NOT your job to rescue him or to fix the problem he has created by getting his car impounded... He is, again, falling back to the "Blame Milly for my problem" schema..... He has effectively created a problem for himself because of his actions. He is expecting you to fall all over yourself to provide him a solution and, when it is NOT the solution that HE wants, he is getting pissy and being a bully... Gee... Imagine my surprise.... Next thing you know, he'll be filing a lawsuit claiming that you are responsible for covering the costs of whatever needs to be done to get his car out of hock... OH! WAIT! He's already done that in a round-about way with the impending threat of the Quarter Million Euros lawsuit........

I really hope that your Tuscany trip is fun and that you can get away from H's MLC Madness for a while..... You deserve a break... and H deserves a 2x4 to the back of the head...
Me - 56
xW - 49
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #22 on: September 16, 2019, 10:39:36 AM »
What UM said.  It is your house and your things... you are not ever responsible to put yourself at a disadvantage to fix someone else's problems. That is NOT self -care. 

 
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline CanLetGo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 990
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2019, 05:01:59 AM »
Hope you are having an amazing time in Tuscany!
Me 45
H 49
3 young adult kids
BD December 2013, left home August 2014, D June 2018
OW 17 years younger

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #24 on: September 28, 2019, 03:29:34 AM »
Hello everyone, it's a week since the Tuscany trip ended and I thought I'd check in.

As others who were on the trip have said, there was truly something extremely soothing about being around others like me. I don't just mean others who know exactly what I'm going through, who don't judge me still loving an often cruel H, but being with people like me as people.

There were 9 of us, so maybe easier to see the pattern when there's more to compare it with. We were all kind, embracing, helpful, the first to jump up and fetch the water, the first to clean up, the first to run and do whatever was needed. We listened to each other, offered support, advice if it seemed wanted, gave each other space in a way you can do only when you really know someone.

At 5+ years since BD, I was the one who was in this crap the longest. What I came out of the experience with was a sense that I am further ahead in my own journey than I had thought. Seeing the others at other stages, I saw myself when at that point. This is a comfort to me because it implies that I will eventually reach a very good place if what we are told is right.

What I saw was that I am in a very accepting place now. I saw my IC this week and told her. She asked if I was in an accepting place of resigned place. I realized that I am in a resigned place, quite a different place but nonetheless, a more peaceful one than before so I will take it gladly.

How I think I came to this place I imagine is a combination of time and having tried everything I could think of to get my H back and make myself happy until there was no point repeating stuff that got me nothing. I am now resigned to the fact of what's happened, the destruction of our family, the destruction of our hard worked for finances, the changes that I might not have a companion again in my life. And as melancholy as what I'm saying might seem, it's actually a much more preferable place for me. It's a bit like giving up but giving up the pointless stuff, which to be honest, used up so much energy.

Back to the Tuscany trip and what I got out of it. There was a lot of MLC talk. I'm sure we all wondered if that is all we'd talk about and would we want that. The reality is that there was a lot of talk because we needed it. Imagine an opportunity to speak to people who really get it for days until you got it all out of your system? Then we talk about so many other things, too, because we visited towns, ate out at fun places, had so much gelato, people bought special souvenirs, we sure had plenty of other stuff to talk about.

What I realized by the end of the trip was that all of the people there with me were truly lovely. Not one of the people on the trip would have been unbearable to live with. In fact, everyone would have been a wonderful person to spend your life with. We were awesome.  By being able to compare myself to the others, it build my confidence in myself. I realized I really was as good a wife as the wives who still have their Hs. I came away feeling much more confident about myself and what I brought to the marriage. I think the trip helped me take one more giant step forward on my healing journey.

In normal life. I had a very busy week of work, which is how I like it. S was supposed to come back last night for the weekend but he was playing a tournament and winning so he had a match last night. He lost the semifinal but won 3rd place and was given a coup. It was an international adult tournament so he was thrilled. His first little success since he went up to the academy. He is on his way down to Florence right now. H will pick him up at the station and take him for lunch then drop him home. He will go back up tomorrow afternoon. S told me he will bring his big tennis bag stuffed with his dirty laundry for me to do. So not all those big tennis bags have rackets in them, you know!

So, last Saturday, end of Tuscany trip, Anon spent the night with me in my little pink fridge house because she had an early flight out the next morning. H was using D22's car (my only car at the moment) and had to come pick us up. H had been looking after my doggie while I was away. First time since BD. We'd asked him several times over the years but he'd always said no.

So Anon got to see my MLCer (so did a couple of others) in the flesh. My impression of how he was that day: in replay. He was dressed like a bad MLCer, was texting openly on his phone in front of me even though I have told him not to, he drove aggressively, spoke like he was on cocaine. He talked a lot to Anon because he'd ridden his bike to her part of the world when he was young. I think H was obviously curious of where I'd been and with whom. He asked masked questions about how many people were on the trip and from where. I could tell he was very nervous when he first arrived but relaxed more as we drove.

Anon and I had a lovely afternoon and evening together. We sat outside at my little house and had salad and coffee, chatted of course, then had a little dinner in my old village.

This past week, I've been communicating regularly with my H about  stuff like my garage and S. We now communicate by whatsap. He answers all my texts pretty quickly and when he doesn't, he apologizes for not having answered sooner. He is much more polite about my garage, says he wants to make sure that I have everything I need and where I want it. He has not yet brought his car. H even called me this morning because I asked him to bring something back. This is the first phone call in years. He was very friendly on the phone and called me by my name.

There has definitely been a great improvement in our communication since the beginning of August. This makes life much easier for me. It would be nice if it meant good stuff, but even just being able to communicate about S or anything in real time makes things so much less stressful so I am grateful for this.

H's oldest sister is coming to town with one of her sons in a couple of weeks and she has contacted me to see if I would meet them for dinner one of the nights. I'm pleased about this. I haven't seen her since BD. I had a strained relationship the last years before BD. She was the family bully and really made it obvious the last two years before BD that she thought I was a problem and that her brother would be better without me. I think she only made things worse. She's difficult, superior, bossy but I am curious to see how she is now. She has sent me a Christmas card every year since BD, addressing it to Mrs. Milly's H. I liked that.

I am going to tidy my house up now for S's arrival. I have bought him his coke.

Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Mortesbride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2605
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #25 on: September 28, 2019, 03:45:07 AM »
I got to say I was very curious how that drive went!

He seemed terribly shocked at the giant bags of wine bottles!  ;D ;D

He probably imagined something akin to the likes of Beast's ''Cult'' title.

Oh well, let him sweat.  8)

I agree with everything you said though. Not one person there would have been difficult to live with. In fact I think I even commented about how nice it was to be with you know...actual caring adults.  ::)

It was certainly nice to feel like you are with people cut from the same cloth so to speak. A rarity these days.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Anon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 773
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #26 on: September 28, 2019, 12:22:19 PM »
Ah Milly,,, yes,,your MLC h is still in replay.  It was my first and almost instant thought I had.   We LBS’s can spot a replayer in a second from a mile away, can’t we.  ::).  It was an interesting drive for sure as I haven’t conversed with any other MLCers.   The similarities between your h and mine are striking.

I am in Tuscany withdrawal - missing it so much and pining for the connection with the tribe.  I’m currently distracted now as I am visiting a close friend in the US.   She is a spin class addict and well,,I’m not,,so I have a bit of time to read and post since she has gone to a spin class. 

My last day in Tuscany with you in your village was wonderful and I’m glad I was able to see the pink fridge!  In case anyone wondered- it’s real, the pink fridge is real 🙂
 



Offline No expectations

  • MLCer Type: Clinging Boomerang
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3304
  • Gender: Female
  • One day at a time. And time is my friend.
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #27 on: September 28, 2019, 02:00:00 PM »
Hi Milly! I've been away so long, but am so glad to hear how well you're doing!  I wish I could have been in Tuscany  with all of you, it sounds divine.

You've come so far. You're so much more sure of yourself and not worrying about what h thinks.  I wish I could give you a great big hug! 
Married 11 1/2 years, together 18.  BD 9/2016, 2nd BD 10/16.  H moved out 10/16.  2 AS's from my first M.  Me 55, H 50. OW 23.  Moved back 4/18.  Reconnecting and working on our M.

"And once the storm is over, you won't remember how you made it through; how you managed to survive.  You won't even be sure if the storm is really over.  But one thing is certain; when you come out of the storm, you won't be the same person that walked in...that's what this storm is all about."

"The trick is to enjoy life.  Don't wish away your days, waiting for better ones."

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #28 on: September 29, 2019, 02:07:14 AM »
Thank you guys for following and posting.

Morte, caring adults is the right term for people like us. Given the choice these MLCers have: caring W/psycho OW, it really tells you that if someone prefers to live with a psycho, and tells you that you were the reason the marriage had to brake up as in my case, then my H is probably psycho too right now. 

Anon hope you are having fun on with your friend. Loved you pink fridge comment!

NoE, so lovely to see you pop back on HS and on my thread! Thank you for your words of support. As my H becomes more comfortable communicating with me I hear your words in my head about not frightening the squirrel.

It’s a sunny Sunday morning here and I’m sitting watching my S play tennis with one of his old friends. I’m so enjoying this. I have my travel mug filled with yummy coffee and I’m spending time with my adorable S.

He has been so sweet since he arrived. I have noticed that he has matured since he has been away. The tennis champion is very strict. He will not allow the kids to get away with anything. They need to be up early and have all their gear prepared. S said the first week they would all forget to pack something but the champion would get so mad that now they all prepare their stuff the night before. Cell phone time is limited to 30 minutes 3 times a day. They are not allowed to eat any junk food at all. Swearing will get you into huge trouble. I’m very pleased about this. My S was lacking an authority figure since BD. I think this will do him a world of good.

H picked up S from the station yesterday and took him for mcdonalds then dropped him home. S says H was fairly quiet but dressed the bad MLCer. S says H is very interested in his tennis now and asked lots of questions. H also told S that he has been talking to me. S said we were going out to dinner last night to celebrate my birthday next week. S couldn’t remember which day of the week it landed on but H said ‘Tuesday.’ He knew.

Church bells are ringing. Game is starting, going to enjoy this.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Online stillbaffled

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4505
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #29 on: September 29, 2019, 08:22:23 AM »
Milly - so glad you are having a great day watching S and spending time with him.   I agree with you....the structured and disciplined way he has to live in right now is good for him.  I often think that many of the students I work with would benefit from a year or two of serving in the military. 

I would sure love to see the pink fridge!  It sounds like you all had a great time in Tuscany.  I hope another trip will be in the works in the future.  It would sure be fun to have a huge national THS convention somewhere wouldn't it? 

BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #30 on: September 29, 2019, 08:27:37 AM »
What a lovely unexpected benefit for your son of the academy....and of your faith and strength in finding a way to open that door for him. Even actually that your h's heart softened enough for him to step up in a way that he would not have done in the past, Milly. Feels like one of those moments when God or the universe gives us an extra gift that we didn't even know we needed.

And all my best wishes for what I hope isva lovely birthday next week, full of peace and calm and lashings of prosecco x
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline Shelly7435

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 851
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #31 on: September 29, 2019, 04:20:43 PM »
Lost your thread for a while.. but I found you again.

So glad you had a great time with all the lovely lbs.. in Tuscany.  Wish I could have been there.
M 53
H 48
M 12 years; together 17 years
D18, S28
Summer 2014 - H wanted to runaway
9/14 I was diagnosed with Breast cancer
11/14 Surgery for BC..3 day after my father dies
11/14 BD 2 days after surgery. I have no passion for you.
2/15 moved out
Dated each other all year affection back on..
3/16 moved home
7/16 Diagnosed with Breast cancer again
8/16 No affection again. I knew something was wrong.
9/16 Another surgery for Breast Cancer
9/16 BD 11 days after surgery discovered -EA with much younger W from Work. That is over. I think he has meaningless flings. Work is his mistress
10/16 I filed for D (financial reasons)
10/16 I moved out.
10/16 Now off and on vanisher
5/17 Divorce final

Offline KeepItTogether

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5083
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #32 on: September 30, 2019, 09:28:26 AM »
Oh I am so happy that you got to spend some time with S. I know how much you've missed him.  And what great validation that this was the right thing for S in that he is maturing and taking this all very seriously. Blessings all around.

I had to laugh at Anon's observation that your H was indeed still a replayer. Yes, we LBS are now very adept at spotting them a mile away aren't we?

I'm glad you got to see how far you've come by seeing the rest of us and where we are in our journeys. Makes me feel better that I will get there too. It is hard to see our progress in a vacuum for sure. And certainly we all progress at our own speed and timing. But, most of us, those who want to heal, do keep moving forward, whether we want to or not. And even whether we think we are doing anything productive at all. You are living proof of that my friend. Talking to you and hanging with you for that one week, I would never have know the traumas you have endured. You are indeed the very definition of strength and grace.
Me 48
H 47
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline Not Your Monkey

  • MLCer Type: Clinging Boomerang
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2327
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #33 on: September 30, 2019, 09:44:58 AM »
It sounds like your son is really thriving now and that's great. Sometimes I think that sometimes when something bad happens, it opens for something even better than if one continued on the same path. It sounds like your son's life really has turned around 180 degrees from the troubles he had with school last year and he is finally in an environment that will help him to succeed in all aspects of his life and where his talents are appreciated and developed. Not to mention the coach sounds like he will provide a good male role model for your son. I'm really happy for you and him.
Beware "MLCers" telling lies.

Offline Acorn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3111
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #34 on: September 30, 2019, 10:36:06 AM »
It sounds like your son is really thriving now and that's great. Sometimes I think that sometimes when something bad happens, it opens for something even better than if one continued on the same path. It sounds like your son's life really has turned around 180 degrees from the troubles he had with school last year and he is finally in an environment that will help him to succeed in all aspects of his life and where his talents are appreciated and developed. Not to mention the coach sounds like he will provide a good male role model for your son. I'm really happy for you and him.

Exactly my thoughts, too, Milly.
That young man is receiving some important life lessons from a no-nonsense mentor. 
That’s wonderful!
Live-in MLCer
Feb 2015: BD.  H has a Nuclear meltdown. 
Oct 2015: ILYBIANILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #35 on: September 30, 2019, 10:49:09 AM »
Your S is doing well and you got to see your boy!!  That is all that really matters! 
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #36 on: September 30, 2019, 10:57:20 AM »
Long day at work today and just sitting on the couch now with doggie and a glass of wine. It's so lovely to come here and find so many encouraging messages.

Still, thank you for validating that the structured life my S is living in now is good for him. Being a teacher, your opinion means a lot to me. It's funny you mention the military, because the comparison had come to me, too. I'm not sure everyone would do well in such a strict environment, but for some weird reason, a kid with chaos at home, does do well with rules. Funny how we want to be kind to our kids when they're suffering by spoiling them, as I did. When in actual fact that was more damaging for him whilst still in the middle of this disaster. I imagine that a strict regime feels dependable. As long as you do as you are expected to do, you will be praised and safe. As for the Tuscany trip, I would be very happy to have a Tuscany reunion every year if others want to come.

Treasur, as usual, very wise words from you: the unexpected, added benefit from the academy. That also caused my H's MLC heart to soften a little. Yes, life has turned around for my S. He so deserves it. Thank you for understanding.

Shelly, lovely to have you on my thread again. Come next year!

Kit, miss you! Thank you for the kind things you say about me. I would say the same about you. Yes, funny how we can spot those Replayers! I think I had 4 of them behind me on the road tonight on my way home: 4 Ferraris clearly driven by 4 MLCers: overtaking on corners, on hills, just so irresponsible and plain stupid. You said something very wise, those of us who want to heal WILL move forward. It's inevitable, unstoppable. And that is basically the secret to surviving this MLC as far as I'm concerned.

NYM, thank you for the kind things you say about my S. I think you are absolutely right that sometimes a bad thing can lead to a great one. Certainly, when we learned that my S had failed school this past June, it felt horrific. Yet if he hadn't failed, I might not have started talking to the academy teacher about S. I know my S is very appreciative of the opportunity he's getting now. This weekend as we talked of the expenses for the tournaments, which are too much, and he moaned a little about the training being boring. I said to remember last year, to think about whether he'd rather be hitting baskets of balls, or back at his school from last year. He told me he reminds himself of that every time he thinks the training is hard. Perhaps without the school failure, he would never have put up with the demanding work that's required of him at the academy. And I agree with you about the strict coach being a male role model, a desperately needed role model. My H had a very strict dad whom H and his siblings were terrified of. But their dad would shout because he was angry, not for positive reasons like the coach. The coach told me that first they make a man of the boy, then the man becomes a player. The coach's anger is to make the kids better people. Incredible bit of luck actually for my S.

Hi DF! Thank you!

Nothing new to report. I have not heard from H since Saturday morning when he phoned me about  something small. He has a rental car at the moment so that probably means OW is here. Predictable that while she's here, H is distant from me. No biggie, it's the bleeding obvious.

Tomorrow is my birthday. This is the first birthday ever in my life that I will be alone. I didn't feel like going out so I have not spoken to my friends. It's a work day and I will be tired anyway. I would have booked myself a massage or something but my S is costing me a fortune. Last week alone, €600 for tournaments. I guess my S's tennis will be my champagne. I might sound a little sad, but I'm not too bad actually. I remind myself that S and D22 are where they are supposed to be. Both following their dreams successfully. That is my gift.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Nerissa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 635
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #37 on: September 30, 2019, 11:11:23 AM »
I’m Glad you had a lovely weekend together and that S is settling well.  It really is an example of one door closing and another opening and so wonderful to see some gold come out of this mess for you all.  Xx

Offline Mortesbride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2605
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #38 on: September 30, 2019, 12:03:50 PM »
Happy Birthday Milly  :-*
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Savoir Faire

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5461
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #39 on: September 30, 2019, 08:53:38 PM »
Wishing you a very Happy Birthday Milly!!!
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Online Puzzled

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 515
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #40 on: September 30, 2019, 11:00:57 PM »
Happy Birthday, Milly!

There is so much you can be proud of -- your children are folllowing their dreams, and you are making the best of a difficult situation. Reading about your life and thoughts is absolutely inspirational to me.

Your H is thinking about you and is curious about your new home, your apartment in the village, your new social life.  He may be realizing what he has been giving up.  Some good movement there.  :D
Me: 48 (43 at BD1)
H: 53 (48 at BD1)
D: 11 (6 at BD1)
Met in 1995, married since 2000
BD 1: August 2014
BD 2: October 2015, H moved abroad
August 2018: Received divorce papers in the mail unexpectedly
May 2019: H gave up his job and moved about 1.5 hours to where D11 and I live

Offline Keep believing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1305
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #41 on: October 01, 2019, 03:07:13 AM »
HAPPY BIRTHDAY   MILLY!!!!

Offline Acorn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3111
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #42 on: October 01, 2019, 04:27:15 AM »
Happy birthday, Milly!

((((((HUGS))))))
Live-in MLCer
Feb 2015: BD.  H has a Nuclear meltdown. 
Oct 2015: ILYBIANILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

Offline Thunder

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 22189
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #43 on: October 01, 2019, 04:35:03 AM »
Happy, Happy Birthday, Milly!   :)
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Online Enyo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 129
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #44 on: October 01, 2019, 05:32:36 AM »
Happy Birthday Milly

Have a great day whatever you decide to do.

Its great that your son is close enough to be able to pop home on some weekends but it is also a good lead in to a time when he is further away for longer periods.  Its also nice to know that the mess in the house is your mess - no surprises.

I've had a busy week since I got back from Tuscany and today is my first day back in work - and also my first time in front of a computer and a chance to add to threads - I also hope to have time to update my thread today, quite a lot has happened in my MLC world this last week!

I had a fantastic holiday in Tuscany - and I definitely would return there is so much more to see.  It was lovely to meet you, and every one else and even though you were also on holiday you acted as host and a most gracious host at that - thank you. 

Enyo X
Me 61
MLCer 58
M37 years, Together 39 years
S28 & S26
BD Aug/Sept 15
Moved Out Aug16

Offline DCD

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 500
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #45 on: October 01, 2019, 05:35:54 AM »
Happy Birthday, Milly - enjoy your day :)
some days are yellow
some days are blue
on different days, i'm different too
you'd be surprised how many ways
i change on different-colored days.
 - dr. seuss

Offline FromAbroad

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
  • Gender: Male
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #46 on: October 01, 2019, 05:49:54 AM »
Happy birthday Milly.  :D

It was a pleasure meeting you and getting to know you.
Enjoy your day in beautiful tuscany
M 39
W 37
D12 D5
15Y Marriage

08-2016/12-2016 OM1 EA with 21y old client (he turns her down)
10-2016 MiniBD - Wants to leave but changes her mind. I just saw it like she being angry and calming down again
08-2017 BD1 - ILYBINILWY speech, OM2 which she knew for 1 week and had seen for just 1 hour
11-2017 - Moved back in
05-2018 BD2 - Seeing OM2 again.
06-2018 - I leave the house
08-2018 - OM2 out of the picture
08-2018/11-2018 - Goes on 8 Tinder dates sleeps with one. (OM3)
12-2018 - Wants to reconnect.
xmas 2018 - BD3 says she can't do it and confesses to OM4
05-2019 - D filed
06-2019 - D Final

Offline Never say never

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3368
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #47 on: October 01, 2019, 06:28:14 AM »
Happy Birthday, Milly!!!  I hope you have a great day.  I think of you often.

xoxo

Offline Maleficent

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 291
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #48 on: October 01, 2019, 07:57:34 AM »
Happy Birthday, Milly!!!!

And I am so pleased your son is doing so well and growing up at the tennis academy!
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

Offline Loyal

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 425
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #49 on: October 01, 2019, 10:45:10 AM »
Happy Birthday Milly :)

I`m sure you`re in your H`s thoughts today. as it definitely seems like he`s making sort of snail like steps in the right direction.
Me: 56 (when he left in April 2017)
MLCer: 57 (when he left in April 2017)
Together since: 1986
Married: No
Children:No
Begin of P`s MLC: around Spring 2010 with breaks inbetween when he behaved like his pre MLC self.
OW: YES , he`s living together with an old spinster who just happens to live up the road.
Animals: 1 doggie, belongs to both of us but MLCers has abandoned him too.

"Surrender to what is, let go of what was, have faith in what will be"

Offline Anon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 773
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #50 on: October 01, 2019, 11:07:14 AM »
Happy Birthday Milly 🌷. Miss you.  Please have an extra glass of Prosecco for me and eat an extra slice of cake too.   

Offline Philadelphiagirl

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 460
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #51 on: October 01, 2019, 12:39:31 PM »
Happy Birthday Milly!!! xxx

Offline CanLetGo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 990
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #52 on: October 02, 2019, 03:24:28 AM »
Happy birthday lovely lady! Glad you had a nice visit from S, and great to hear it’s going so well for him 😘
Me 45
H 49
3 young adult kids
BD December 2013, left home August 2014, D June 2018
OW 17 years younger

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #53 on: October 02, 2019, 08:21:06 AM »
Happy belated birthday Milly!! A trip to Tuscany and visit from S. Sounds like a good birthday year to me!!   
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline Yellowroseoftexas

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 167
  • Gender: Female
  • I HAVE 2 CHOICES-BE HAPPY OR BE HAPPY
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #54 on: October 06, 2019, 03:30:31 PM »
HAPPY BIRTHDAY MILLY
I rarely post (boring life) but read post periodically.  So proud of you young lady.  This place feels like family.  When there's victory for one it's victory for all.  With that being said, congrats to your son for placing in his tournament.  OUR boy is doing marvelous (said in a Billy Crystal voice).

One day in crossing the little pond for a visit.  I have to see the pink frig for myself before I can declare it's real. I'm in Texas so it will quite the trip. 

You posted on my thread about Hearts Blessing. Can you link, instruct, tell me how to find this thread? I have problems finding my own thread. 

Married 21 years
Bomb 💣 Drop O7-2014
Husband Left 09-2014
Divorce 2015
S26; D22; D19
No contact 2015-2018
Contact and Positive communication-01-2019
Unsure if he’s dating
******************************
“I walked a mile with Pleasure;
She chatted all the way;
But left me none the wiser
For all she had to say.

I walked a mile with Sorrow;
And ne’er a word said she;
But, oh! The things I learned from her,          
When Sorrow walked with me.”
Robert Browning Hamilton

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #55 on: October 09, 2019, 02:12:56 AM »
Thank you all for your lovely birthday wishes. They really did help make my day. I was expecting to have a really sad birthday this year since it was my first one completely on my own but then I woke up to so many birthday wishes. There were messages from my kids, old school friends I hadn't heard from in years, and you guys of course. I felt remembered. Then my D22 had organized for a giant bunch of lilies to be delivered. They're still in a vase on my table, although starting to wilt. I will keep them there a little longer. I hadn't bought lilies in years because of their strong fragrance. H developed allergies and would forbid me from buying flowers that smelled or fragrant candles. The smell of the lilies brought back something from my past although I couldn't put my finger on it until I did. I had lilies in my wedding bouquet. I had forgotten how they smelt. The scent brought me back to that day. In some bizarre way, I felt that H was in my house on my birthday this year. Stupid but the thought pleased me.

I have not been posting because I have nothing to say, my life is pretty boring these days. I am back into my usual routine of work and tastings. It's still pretty and sunny here and I have been able to have breakfast outside with my cat and dog at my feet. Yesterday afternoon I transplanted some lavender from the pots in my courtyard to a chopped barrel in my front. It had never taken off in the courtyard, but looks great in the barrel. I have pots of hydrangeas and yesterday I cut off the remaining healthy looking flowers and tied them up and hung them upside down in a dark corner to dry. I hope they'll make it until spring then I'll be able to put them in a vase or a basket. I love dried hydrangeas.

H has been distant these past 10 days or so. He's distant with S, too, so either OW is here or he is in his vanisher mood. This is very much his pattern. I had several touches and goes this year, none last year, so the pattern is easier for me to see. He used to disappear on S in the past and I would think what a terrible dad he is, now seeing how he disappears on both of us just reaffirms that he goes through stuff we simply don't know anything about.

I'm adjusting to living totally alone. For the most part I'm ok. I'm busy then tired so the time rolls along. Occasionally, the thoughts come at me and I'm a little sad. I try not to focus on it. I heard good advice on someone's thread about turning the sad image into a black and white image, and then to reduce it in size. It's been working for me. I could easily focus on the loss of things but I force myself to think of the good things happening with my kids especially. Of course, the sadness is in not being able to enjoy what's happening with the kids together with my H. I can't go there in my mind or I pull myself down.

On Saturday I'm having dinner with my SIL (H's oldest sister) and one of her son's. I was hoping S would join us, too, but he can't come down now since he has a tournament. Shame.

I saw my IC yesterday. We talk about many things, but at one point talking about H and OW I got angry. She said, You're still angry? I said I'm still angry at OW. I was angry at both of them for so long. Angrier at my H since he hurt us all in many ways. Now I have residual immense anger at OW. I told my IC that I'd like to make love to my H just once to get back at OW. I know that's her biggest fear and I'd just love to get that revenge. Now I realize that all these feelings mean that I still have not elaborated all the damage from this crisis. I'm working on it. My IC asked me why I'm angry at OW. I said because she knew, because she paraded around in my home town with my H to humiliate me, because she made things harder for me and the kids, she taunted us, she caused that scene at the restaurant, she doesn't just want my H she also wants to destroy me, to really hurt me.

My IC said that OW needs to destroy me because she knows I'm always going to be a threat to her R with my H. She knows that H is a cheater and just as he cheated on me he could cheat on her. She said that OW paraded around town on my H's arm to make sure that everyone saw that H was with her now to make it harder for H to go back to me. She said that any time they argue, she knows that he could look at me and compare. This is why she holds the tight rein on his communication with me.  I recount this part of my therapy in case it can help others going through this hatred of the OW, too.

I have been going out quite a bit for me, once or twice a week for dinner or drinks. I have had lots of invitations lately. I would usually decline because I'm tired but since I'm on my own, I've felt the need to push myself. The invitations were very benign things with couples or visiting friends, but they got me out and dressed up and I have had dinner in some lovely restaurants. I have to say, it really has helped.

Other things I'm doing to keep myself cheerful has been to put music on in the house while I'm getting dressed. I can't work with music on but the 20 minutes or so while I'm getting ready, I put on the boom box and take it around with me. Another thing I like to do is keep changing my bed covers. Every time I change the sheets, I put on different colours. For years and years throughout my marriage, I would use only white or beige/natural linen. Once I found the things I liked, I never changed them. Since moving out of my family home 2 years ago this November, I have bought (at sales) coloured sheets and blankets, pink, lilac, light grey, light blue, light green, and each time I change them up, even layering them in multi-colours. I don't know why but it gives me a sense of power. Maybe it's the obvious sign that I have made changes since BD, or maybe it's that the bright colours are enlightening, they bring a pretty feeling to the room. I don't know, but it works for me.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Savoir Faire

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5461
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #56 on: October 09, 2019, 03:40:48 AM »
Glad you had so many Birthday wishes Milly, always nice to be remembered.  We remembered you!  :-*

I know ow should mean nothing to us, none of mine bothered me at all, just the fact that he was still sleeping with me while with all of them was the worst, I felt so angry with HIM, not them, they are stupid.

I understand why you dislike ow so much.  There is such a thing as karma though Milly, just watch! Revenge will be yours and so sweet.  I actually don't think any of us will get all that much pleasure from it, we are good people and they are trolls.  We had real relationships and they have teenage fantasy crazy ones.  You will see one day just how 'nothing' she was.

I have been playing with bed linen too Milly.  I tossed the old mattress that saw more action than a James Bond movie ;) and got a shiny new one, new sheets, pillows and everything XH was gone - so lovely  :)  I have any color I like now and my bed is always neat and fresh.  Every time  I walk into that room, I smile. I just ordered silk pillow covers, apparently they are amazing to sleep on.  I'll let you know how they go.

I find at least five things I am grateful for each day when I wake and my bed is one of them.  I take great pleasure in making my house super comfortable  home for us to be in, it gets better every day.

Keep pushing to go out too Milly, it's great for us.  I find I am out so many days and nights now and don't think of 'you know who' anymore.  We all get to a better place in the end but do have to make the effort.

Enjoy your music and sheets and your wonderful life in general.  You are always the prize.



"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Offline Mortesbride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2605
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #57 on: October 09, 2019, 03:57:14 AM »
Milly I think anger at the OW is completely normal and to be expected.

We are only human after all.

I know without a shadow of a doubt that if it wasn't her it would have been someone else. I know that it was Beast who failed as a man to stay loyal.

I know that he lied and told stories, and fed her a bunch of $h!te.

But I spoke to her on the phone. She knew he was married. She knew he had three kids. She knew I was from America and had moved here to be with him.

And she didn't give a firetruck.

So, I don't like her as a person. Her character is questionable, even if it wasn't my situation she affected I wouldn't like that. Huge moral holes.

So I avoid going around town anywhere they might be. Not because I care so much about seeing them together...but because if she smarted off to me I might go into my red ring rage and I have avoided doing that since I was a teen. Don't particularly wanna get myself into legal troubles for someone so not worth it.

But anger? Yeah I still feel anger. Not on a daily basis...but enough to know that I am not entirely sure I could control myself if she popped off at the mouth.

In fact... I probably couldn't.

I think it is perfectly normal given our situations. Particularly with OM/OW who knew damn well.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #58 on: October 09, 2019, 05:22:38 AM »
I don't feel a lot of anger towards ow for all the normal reasons.
My then h wasn't a possession she 'stole', I never saw it as a competition (or not one I was interested in joining lol) and the obligations and promises were broken by my xh. I am content that the little I know of her doesn't seem like a great quality healthy mature human tbh but I also assume that my xh lied to her as much as he did to everyone else. And I am completely sure that I would not have married the man she married bc I am neither foolish or arrogant enough to choose someone with that kind of history. Or indeed under psychiatric care and medicated lol.

But here is the bit I DO resent. Maybe not anger, but definitely deep resentment. I resent her invasion into my life and my family's life before I even knew she existed. I resent her getting a big vote unbeknownst to me about my marriage, my life and my finances. I resent her inserting herself into the territory of my own life and knowing things about me or my marriage that I did not know were being discussed without my voice. I resent that this shoddy deceitful immature woman is linked to my life in any way. I resent the things she polluted I suppose and the absolute injustice of her being an unseen ghost in my life before I even knew there was one. The idea that my then h might have talked to her about my dying father or shared intimate emotional conversations we'd had that I thought were private between us at a terribly vulnerable time with her. I really, really hate that. So, pretty close to anger probably. And she has/continued to do big and small things to pollute my life where she could...everything from online stalking to anonymous notes to watchgate to walking into my L's office to deliver an item of jewellery from my h to her last text earlier in the year. Hate it. Try very hard not to hate her too much bc it gives her power in my mind. But I do hate it. It is...she is...yucky to me.

And I feel proud of every single time I have chosen, over and over again, to ignore her and behave as if she has not touched me. To not do any of the things I could have done to damage her life or share any of the things my xh said about her or himself (while strenously never mentioning her name and denying she existed lol). I have never seen her, spoken to her or engaged with her in any way at all. Not once. Not always easy....but I think that ignoring the disordered as small bits of rubbish noise is healthy for me and tbh probably really irritates her. And actually it was part of quarantining my life from her ow-ness too. So I win  :)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Online Enyo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 129
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #59 on: October 09, 2019, 05:41:39 AM »
Oh Milly I get it!

I know that OW are just self medication and that our Hs got into these relationships not because of that particular women is any better than we are but because of the feel-good feelings that she provided (in my case by love bombing) as an antidote to their depression, and who doesn't like attention, however of all the escape and avoid activities our Hs participate in this (for me) has been the most hurtful. 

I accept that my H is in crisis, but I absolutely know that he is responsible for his actions and the way he has behaved - After my conversation with my H last week I now know that he feels totally responsible for what he has done.  I was very angry with H for a long time about this but then decided (this didn't happen overnight and there was counselling involved!) that I couldn't live like that anymore - I couldn't remain angry and likely be perceived as bitter and still expect have some sort of relationship with him if only for our children - and for me forgiveness but not forgetting or condoning his actions was the key to this.

However my anger - or as Treasure says resentment - for the OW is completely different - she was not just some benign other women - she was my friend, she knew me well and actually admitted to being envious of my relationship with H, quite apart from Hs betrayal - her betrayal of our friendship hurt tremendously.  I feel she took advantage of a sad situation, me being ill and my depression after that illness and there is absolutely no excuse or justification for the way she has behaved.  (I suppose her H feels the same way about my H!)

This may seem like a double standard but believe me if I were ever to let H back into my life then he would absolutely have to be accountable for his actions.

So I completely get you feelings - I am working at becoming indifferent to OW and when I get to indifference I will be happy - the depth of the resentment I have toward her doesn't become me!  But until that time I actively avoid any place she might be... Not because I couldn't handle seeing her but because I also couldn't guarantee that I wouldn't say something I may regret, and I'm too much of a lady for that!

Enyo X
Me 61
MLCer 58
M37 years, Together 39 years
S28 & S26
BD Aug/Sept 15
Moved Out Aug16

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #60 on: October 09, 2019, 06:01:01 AM »
To be fair, Enyo, a double betrayal like that (and you're not alone on HS) is a different kettle of fish isn't it? Quite different from an ow/om who was unknown to us like the standard co-worker or fb hookup.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #61 on: October 09, 2019, 09:18:56 AM »
Oh lordy, anger at OW. I wouldn't even know where to begin with my rage at MOO2 if given the chance.  A childhood friend, a bridesmaid in my wedding... she stood at my wedding and promised to support our marriage. Then not only did she NOT support our marriage but she took action to interfere in it and destroy it for her own pleasure. She is a despicable piece of garbage. There are some days I think I am more angry at MOO2 than I am at LB.

I try very hard not to hate her, because as Treasur so correctly points out, hate only blackens your own soul.  But lordy, lordy it is a struggle with MOO2 because I loathe her existence deeply, her betrayal of our friendship, her part in the destruction of my marriage, the pain she caused my kids, her kids, our parents. 

A whole different kettle of fish for sure.  :P


Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #62 on: October 09, 2019, 09:38:54 AM »
Thank you ladies very much for sharing your inner feelings about your own OW. It helps me to know there are many of you out there who still have to deal with their anger or whatever at the OW. It makes me feel more acceptable.

I'm going to say that you all expressed exactly how I feel. I know our situations are different, and for a couple of you, it's even worse since it's a double disloyalty, but I would say that I feel all of what you all have described from the worse to the 'less worse.' Treasur, you don't describe it as anger but whatever it is, I have to say that you describe very well how I feel about the OW. The intrusion into my M when I didn't even know yet. The intimate discussions about stuff in my life and my kids lives and our M, and I wasn't included, aware, or even talked to about the subjects in the first place. This just feels so unfair. An OW had a (big) say in the survival of M and in destroying my family, but I had none, not one chance. It was all decided for me by a total stranger.

I know that some LBSs have come to a place where they can forgive the OW. I can't remember, but are there LBSs who forgave the OW/OM who are not reconciled or  moved on with someone new? It probably doesn't matter, I'm just wondering.

I have had the bad luck of seeing OW face to face and had a shouting match. I've grown a lot since then and hope I wouldn't get caught in that trap again. But......if she stirred me up, I'm scared I still would not behave like a lady after all. I do everything  I can to not run into her, that's my safest bet.

My SIL and her adult S arrived in Florence today. I'm pretty sure my H is having dinner with them. In the past, I'd be there, too. Now I wonder if H is taking OW to meet them. I hate that I still have these thoughts, but when you know your in laws for 30 years, you expect them to be your form of family for ever, not your H's lover's.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Keep believing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1305
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #63 on: October 10, 2019, 03:21:32 AM »
Agree with everything everyone has said.  The thing I hate most is the ow knows things about my kids that is no business of hers.  or that she knows things about me that are no business of hers.  My kids dont want her to know their lives, and do not  want to ever meet her.   It is not fair nor right for my h to share things with her.  It is intruding on their lives. and mine.  we know nothing about her except that she has 4 kids.

Offline KeepItTogether

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5083
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #64 on: October 10, 2019, 03:11:35 PM »
I think I have anger, resentment and overall a strong dislike (dare I say hate?) toward OW presently. Not sure it is healthy. But well, she's a husband-stealing skank, so I guess I just don't care. LOL.  Truly I am better than I was, but I can relate Milly. Totally understandable especially since these people are strangers to us, and we took vows with the MLCers. I see people write things like, "the MLCer told the OW lies and they had no idea he was married, or that he was just so unhappily married for YEARS," or "you should be mad only at the MLCer b/c THAT is who really wronged you." Nah.  In my case, she knew he was married. She knew I was in chemo at the time. She knew, and knows, he has a child that he never sees. Hmmmm, come to think of it, maybe I am more disgusted by her than anything else.


My IC said that OW needs to destroy me because she knows I'm always going to be a threat to her R with my H. She knows that H is a cheater and just as he cheated on me he could cheat on her. She said that OW paraded around town on my H's arm to make sure that everyone saw that H was with her now to make it harder for H to go back to me. She said that any time they argue, she knows that he could look at me and compare. This is why she holds the tight rein on his communication with me.  I recount this part of my therapy in case it can help others going through this hatred of the OW, too.



Yes this does help me immensely--thank you for posting it. I often do wonder if H and OW ever fight--he is such an avoider. But of course, he is a different person now isn't he? They all are really. People we don't really know anymore.

I adore hydrangeas too. I can picture them hanging and drying now. A beautiful sight while you sip a little prosecco eh? ;)
« Last Edit: October 10, 2019, 03:12:38 PM by KeepItTogether »
Me 48
H 47
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #65 on: October 11, 2019, 02:57:13 AM »
I guess ow and crisis folks either have no boundaries or don't respect them?
Which is one more reason why boundaries are so important for any LBS imho.
It is a truly odd stage though when you realise that anything you share or communicate with your h is quite possibly being shared and commentated on by a stranger. Maybe it is that sense of being 'invaded' by a malign stranger that makes us sometimes angrier with ow than with our spouse?
« Last Edit: October 11, 2019, 02:58:27 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #66 on: October 11, 2019, 09:28:07 AM »
Very interesting, thought, Treasur. Very possible that the idea that a total stranger, a malign one knows intimate stuff about us and is even making decisions that affect us. It's such an injustice.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Rising Phoenix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1337
  • Gender: Female
  • Mlc- Cake eater for 3 yr now vanisher
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #67 on: October 12, 2019, 03:02:47 AM »
Milly, I totally get the ow wants to destroy you. My h ow even text my h whilst back with us in one of his many returns that could my h drug our son and poison me or cud he lose my phone for a couple of hours so she could destroy me. Would he like her to come round and start ww4 as she can make the b!tc# cry. I have only responded by putting a complaint into her place of work as she is in a position of dealing with societies most vulnerable people and it is standards of behaviour within a govt dept and it was upsetting my kids who look on social media for a glimpse of their father. It did stop for 6 mths but has recently started again. Apparently I used my kids and manipulation to force him to return. You would think after nearly 5 yrs she would give up.
I do think that it is because we are still a threat and they are annoyed at us for not engaging in their drama. I do have anger towards her as she knew h was married with kids and did all she could to remove me from his life including trying to get police involved when I ask for child maintenance and trying to get h to do a non Molastation order which carries a 5 yr prison sentence. There is nothing to put in a non molastation order.

Ow is currently learning how to play a shooting game so she has something in common with son. Never going to happen that son or daughter will engage with her. Never met her and have no intention of it. I have said when they are 18 if they wish to that is up to them but at present my children will go no where near a woman who asked my h to drug our son so she could speak to him in the phone.
I feel resentment but pity a little bit for her that a woman has to resort to such low tactics to feel wanted be h. Validation almost for their twu luv! 🤮
I am not jealous of a woman who had to resort to placing her morals in the gutter to get a man. Xx
Me 51
H52
Married still, 22yrs
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #68 on: October 12, 2019, 04:37:30 AM »
Gosh, Phoenix, what horrendous suggestions by your H's OW. Probably inline with Treasur's H's OW. I wouldn't be surprised that my OW could say stuff like that, too, but having proof of it really does confirm the fact that they are crazy, evil, something-wrong-with-them people. What I still can't understand though, is why our Hs are ok being with someone who would do this to their kids. My H has been ok with his OW suing my D and let her influence him to sue his D, too. This I just can't understand. I mean they knew their married boyfriends had kids.

Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Rising Phoenix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1337
  • Gender: Female
  • Mlc- Cake eater for 3 yr now vanisher
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #69 on: October 12, 2019, 04:47:24 AM »
I don’t understand either milly. I do have proof and proof she tried to run him over when he was returning. She sent him the bill for the windscreen wipers he pulled off whilst in her bonnet before she turned up at my house to check whether I was in the house or not. Screeched to a jolt outside my house then drive off as fast as she arrived. I found a dossier on me in his boot once. I kept it. Apparently I have mental health issues and obsessive ex syndrome and the start of  a letter on non molastation plus how to get a quick divorce and get custody of your kids. Wtf my h said I am like I can only imagine!!xx
Me 51
H52
Married still, 22yrs
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline Keep believing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1305
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #70 on: October 13, 2019, 12:35:06 AM »
What is a dossier  and a non molestation ?

Offline Rising Phoenix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1337
  • Gender: Female
  • Mlc- Cake eater for 3 yr now vanisher
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #71 on: October 13, 2019, 12:44:54 AM »
A dossier is a collection of documents about a person, subject or Event
4 pages of what she thought my unreasonable behaviours were, such as packing his belongings for him and asking him to retrieve them. Asking h to pick up the children at a certain time and arrange when to see them which we still aren’t able to do. Asking h for money (child maintenance), ringing h re help which childcare during school holidays as I work. ( didn’t get any help) no taking care of his kids and no money towards child minders.
Non-Molestation Orders
This is a type of injunction which prevents one person from harassing the other. Non-Molestation orders  often include provisions that mean you cannot have any contact with the person who has obtained the Order, or come within a certain number of metres of that person, or their home.
All of this was within first 6 mths.
She couldn’t get a non molestation order as nothing to put in it. She just didn’t want any contact between us. Still doesn’t. Doesn’t know about the texting then !!!
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 01:08:56 AM by Rising Phoenix »
Me 51
H52
Married still, 22yrs
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline Thunder

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 22189
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #72 on: October 13, 2019, 03:08:25 AM »
Thanks for that Rising, I was confused too.   :)

So your Non-Molestation order is like our Restraining order.

Man, you've gone the ringer with that one.  She must be terrified of you.   ;D ;D
A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #73 on: October 13, 2019, 04:40:53 AM »
Thank you all for sharing your feelings about OW and various legal problems we can get into when they are involved. I think it is useful to know and post. I have one of the craziest OW on here and when you have one of those, they can cause a hell of a lot of additional problems so might as well write about it and hopefully help other LBS protect themselves. My main advice to anyone who has one of these OW, stay away from her, do not answer her texts, do not answer her if you are face to face with her. They are provocative and experienced. Chances are, you will end up in trouble, which can cause you lots of anxiety, legal problems, legal fees. The OW might end up in trouble, too, the difference being, that the legal problems only add to her excitement.

I had dinner last night with my SIL (H's oldest S) and her S who is 37 so much older than my kids but we have always been very close. I was anxious I have to admit. I think I was worried that they'd met OW or had been spending the days with H and OW and were liking her. I prepared myself for this as much as is possible to. We'd arranged to meet at 7 at their hotel and walk over to the restaurant which was booked for 7.30. At 6 they sent a message that they were running late and could we just meet directly at the restaurant. This delay had me monkey braining. They were out golfing with H and OW. My H is golf mad and I am no good at sports, never showed any interest in his golf (would be interested now), and OW is very into sports, plays golf....

So I get to the restaurant first and order myself a glass of Prosecco while I waited. They arrived and embraced me. I think my SIL was more scared than I was. She looked at me not knowing whether to hug me or not.We had not had the best relationship the last few years before BD and the very last year, I felt her encouraging my H to think badly about me so I was particularly distant with her. I of course, immediately hugged and kissed them both.  They told me that they had hired a driver and had gone to visit H at his house, so they had spent the day with him, went out to lunch and hung out in my old village. SIL did make a point of telling me that it was the first time they'd been to his home and he was alone. I appreciated her telling me this since this was my big worry. So another sister who has not yet met OW.

However, maybe because of courtesy, or maybe because of time and growth, we were very nice to each other and then real warmth came, too. We reminisced about the many times we spent together (with H, too). We laughed, talked a lot about my kids, S's tennis, my oldest D. They didn't know that my D25 hand't talked to me for 2 years. Since this involves the influence of another one of H's sisters, I didn't dwell on it too much, but I think they are now aware of ramifications in the family disaster that made it even harder than it was.

The meeting left me sad. There were a couple of times that my SIL spoke to me and acknowledged that my pain must have been terrible, like a mourning. Although this is a very nice thing to say, it also sort of finalized it, like there is no going back, like she had some insider knowledge from having spoken to H that he was never going to come back to me. She also said that she didn't want to talk about H and what happened, putting her hand flat out in front of her like a stop sign. I had no intention of speaking about what happened, but she obviously wanted to put that barrier up. Then she said that even if I was divorcing her brother, they weren't divorcing me. Nice intentions, but I said to her that I wasn't divorcing anyone. She looked downwards and said I know. Even this made me feel that she had insider knowledge of how it wasn't my choice, how I had been heartbroken, and how my H has no desire to be with me ever again.

We hugged when I left them to come home. They are still here for another couple of days. They will be seeing H tomorrow night. Today SIL has been texting me and sending me photos of her and her S having lunch and hanging out. This is good for me. It is so hard to lose the in laws as well. When your partner dies you don't lose half your family, they circle around you. When you are BD'd, you do and it adds hurt to hurt. Last night SIL told me she'd told H right away the first night they arrived (they saw him every night as I had imagined) that they would be having dinner with me on Saturday night. She said H said 'yes, of course.' SIL said to me that we have history together. I thanked her.

I have a lazy day today, much needed. I fly to London on Thursday for a wine fair on Saturday. I'm looking forward to seeing D22 and getting a change of air. I am going to be meeting up on Friday with Nerissa who I met on the Tuscany trip. What a gift to have a new friend to hang out with when I go over to the Uk. I'm so looking forward to it.

H will be looking after my doggie/our doggie while I'm gone. He is also going to use my car so will have to drive me to and back from the airport. I hope he remembers because he's kind of vanished lately.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline One day at a time

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1159
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #74 on: October 13, 2019, 05:07:38 AM »
Milly, I don't necessarily think your SIL has inside information.. People in RL probably can't understand how you have hopes 5 years down the road.. Disposable marriage culture and all that!! I used to feel hurt with those kind of comments but I think people do it because they want to see you move on and be happy... But the reality is that it will happen when it happens, not on anyone else's timetable!

It's nice you reconnected with your SIL, specially if you miss your in-laws.. I can't say the same about mine!  8)
H - 42 (40 @BD1)
M - 42 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.
Confirmation H and OW are together, presume PA  - 3rd June 2019

"One of the happiest moments in life is when you find the courage to let go of what you can’t change"

Offline Mortesbride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2605
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #75 on: October 13, 2019, 05:58:42 AM »
Aww man I wished Id know you guys were meeting up. This weekend coming is my kid free weekend! I could have met up with you or something.

Ah well maybe next time. Hope you have a great time at the wine tasting.  ;D
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Rising Phoenix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1337
  • Gender: Female
  • Mlc- Cake eater for 3 yr now vanisher
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #76 on: October 13, 2019, 10:00:45 AM »
Absolutely milly. Stay well away from crazy ow. It’s not worth our sanity or our kids well being in some cases or risking any trouble that will impact our lives or children’s lives.

Enjoy your trip in England and meet up. Next time your in the uk perhaps some in they uk could do an over night meet up with you and each other. Have a lovely time xx
Me 51
H52
Married still, 22yrs
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #77 on: October 13, 2019, 10:22:27 AM »
Oneday, thank you so much for your alternative point of view. What you say does make sense. In RL people don't know that a MLC separation is different from a regular one. Thank you for that.

Rising and Morte, and anyone else reading and in the UK, this coming Friday I'm in London and would love to meet anyone who wants to join Nerissa and me. In the future I will inform you earlier.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Nerissa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 635
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #78 on: October 13, 2019, 10:50:24 AM »
Aww man I wished Id know you guys were meeting up. This weekend coming is my kid free weekend! I could have met up with you or something.

Ah well maybe next time. Hope you have a great time at the wine tasting.  ;D

You can come too - it’s london though so a long hike for you.

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #79 on: October 14, 2019, 01:28:54 AM »
Feeling a bad day coming today. Meeting my SIL on Saturday has really frazzled me. It has taken me back someways. The feeling that she knew from speaking to my H that he was never going to come back to me has uprooted some pain from earlier on in this crisis.

I have had some very kind messages from other LBSs, telling me that the in-laws are looking at the MLCer and seeing what a mess they are and that I am ok. This did help to hear, however I just can't shake that fear factor I'm feeling. Then this morning I find out that H is going to London in a couple of weeks, London = OW. It's clearly all still roses with her. I have butterflies from my tummy to my throat and my heart is thumping hard. I guess this is what PTSD is. I'm so sick of it all. I really need a knight to rescue me and yet I know they don't exist. I'm going to have to rescue myself again and it's really tiring.

Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #80 on: October 14, 2019, 01:44:11 AM »
Milly, if it helps PTSD is a whole different kind of beast...like comparing a wolf to a dog  ;)...but it does sound like anxiety and maybe some other feelings mixed in.

I don't know the answer to this but maybe other standers here do.

What it looks like is that a little info leads to a chain of assumptions. And most of those assumptions are about what feels bad to you? It sounds as if standing bc you want your h back involves seeing or looking for 'evidence' that this is more or less likely to happen? Hence the anxiety? What sil says or might think or unseen conversations that might have taken place. What your h is or isn't doing in London and what that means or doesn't. Is there a difference between what you think and what are facts you know?

Not getting into the rights or wrongs of standing, or even your situation tbh, but that kind of 'checking' sounds quite hard as a way of living with the uncertainty? Is there a way for you to unhook HOW you stand (assuming you still choose to do that) from the checking or the assumptions? I'm conscious for instance that you seem to have found a way to do so in the equally difficult situation with your oldest daughter? Just a thought...but I'm not a stander so others here might be able to help more from their own experience.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline Savoir Faire

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5461
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #81 on: October 14, 2019, 03:20:48 AM »
Milly, the horrible feelings will go away soon.  Any contact with those around the MLCer is certain to bring up old feelings of hurt.

If it helps, each time it happens, it seems to get easier, you will only see this in hindsight.  It's as if we are tested each time to see how far we have come.

There is no way it is 'all roses' with the ow, it never is and never will be.  They are totally delusional.  Take yourself over to Shock's Sis thread or read Denjef's in my signature.  It may help.

((((((((Hugs))))))))
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Offline Maleficent

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 291
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #82 on: October 14, 2019, 05:57:09 AM »
Milly, I am sorry about how you are feeling. I hope that nothing horrible happens. I understand how you feel after spending time with your inlaws. I do see them more than you, so not sure it is better or worse. A month ago while with my inlaws, I had to contact h.  My SIL was surprised by his curt and barely civil reply. She looked at me sadly and said she was sorry and did not understand why he was like this. She and I have a neutrality agreement of sorts, but I felt the same way as you wrote this weekend. For days. MIL mentioned something he was doing in passing last night and I thought why is she doing this to me.  So, I have no words of wisdom, but I understand your internal reaction. I see my inlaws more frequently, so it is like a million little knives rather than a dagger of pain.

We have to rescue ourselves again and again. You can do it.
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #83 on: October 22, 2019, 11:47:28 AM »
Thank you Treasur, Savvy, and Male for your comfort and advice, and sorry I haven't had time to reply sooner. I guess it's everything you all said.

Male, I'm sorry you have to face your in laws often. I used to be envious of people who still had contact with theirs, but now I don't know. Little knives is exactly what it's like. It's nice to be in close contact with someone connected to my H, but the anxiety was not worth it to me.

Treasur, I know you're right in that I'm making an assumption and running with it, and it's masochistic in a way. I'm ok now because I've been distracted by other stuff, but at the time it was hard. I understand that PTSD is something very different and much more intense, thanks for pointing that out.

Savvy, it did pass as you said.

I have been away in London the past few days. It was a business trip to do a wine fair but I took a couple of extra days on each side to be with D22. I actually stayed with her in her student room, sharing a bed as we've often done before. It was really lovely being with her. I also went out for a fabulous lunch with Nerissa. We couldn't stop talking. It's bizarre how close I can get to someone I've just got to know. I feel very safe with an LBS.

I got back last night really late. My H took care of my dog (our old family dog) while I was away. I asked him if he could to save me money since I'm paying for S15's expenses at his tennis academy. H agreed. I also offered him the use of my car if he drove me to and from the airport. He said ok. But this was a few weeks prior to my departure.

I wrote about it already on my thread so sorry for repeating myself, but I'm going to be doing another fair in Milan next week and want to go see S15 as he's close by. I asked H if he would take care of doggie again, but he said he was going to be away next weekend, presumably to London - OW town. I was annoyed at that. Of course it happens  all the time, but most of the time, I'm not aware of it.

By the day I was due to leave for London, I could tell H had retreated into the tunnel. I could tell from his answers: 'yes' 'ok' that he was probably regretting having to help me. I was, too. So on the day I'm leaving, he's supposed to drive me to the train station to catch the train to the airport. H asked if I could take the train and I had said ok as this airport is far. But when I went to pick him up to drive me (he has no car) to the station, he said I should take the bus to the station to take the train to the airport. I said no way was I going to the station by bus. I also had a big suitcase. After he huffed and puffed and threatened to get out of the car and not look after my dog after all, he said ok, let's go to the airport.

I was driving. I knew it was weird when he didn't drive. It's as if he wanted to be as far away as possible from doing something for me. I didn't start any conversations at all, just drove in silence. Slowly, he started making conversation with me. First he brought up wines, as he usually does. We spoke for quite a while about some local wines and grapes. Then he asked me a little about D22 and where she lived, her courses, etc. I only answered questions politely but didn't encourage any of the conversations. He asked me what I was going to do about my old car and I said I was going to repair it. He said that was a waste of money and I should just buy a new one. I said that I just can't face dealing with it, that as he knew, I couldn't do the numbers. He said, 'I know you can't.' He said it in a gentle way, the way you do when you acknowledge something you are both aware of. He then proceeded to give me advice on how to choose a car payment and what to expect and how to go about it. This was actually quite helpful for me.

By the time we got to the airport, his demeanor had changed. He was friendly and smiling. I was coming back on the last flight last night, landing at 11.30pm. He asked me about my return flight a few times, I'd already given them to him 3 times. He said what are we going to do? I suppose he meant about getting him back to his house afterwards. I said 'I don't know.' He said, 'well ok.' I had no intention of taking him back to his house afterwards especially since I specifically asked him if it was ok for me to book these flights. After he dropped me at the airport, he phoned me twice on his way home. Nothing much, just how to open the gas tank and did I leave him the house key, but in the past he would not have phoned for this stuff, he would have texted.

Anyway, the morning after, he texts me about doggie and her ears. We share a few messages, then I hear no more from him. I can feel the retreat again. The day I'm returning, I send him my flight details and get him to confirm he's coming. He says 'ok.' 

He waits outside in my car and he has doggie with him. I've very happy to see my dog and he lets me hug and kiss her while he puts my suitcase in the trunk. He tells me he will drive. I think he's ok so I ask if doggie's ears were ok. H barely answers, I know he's in a mood. I then try to say something about how warm it is in Italy compared to London but he wasn't interested. I told him I spoke to the academic coordinator (actual schooling) at the academy and how S15 will be doing 2 years in one and could catch up. H barely answered, so I shut up.

We get on the freeway to go around Florence and he gets off at the stop before mine. I say where are you going? He says, you have to drive me home. That will add over an hour to my ride home. I said 'No, I'm too tired, please take me home and then bring the car back tomorrow.' Well this sets him off. He says how he hasn't got an hour to waste the next day coming back and forward bla bla bla...... I told him ok, my misunderstanding, I thought I was being helpful but that I wouldn't let him use the car in the future if it was going to make my life harder. He gets all pissy, Replay mini-monstery about how hard it was to look after the dog, that she doesn't just sit there, that it's like looking after a toddler, in fact, it's more like having a puppy, and how he couldn't leave her in his house because she wrecked it and even when he took her out, she was crazy, and that it wasn't easy you know......

I just shut up, let him go on and on about how the dog (6.5 year old, female, Cocker Spaniel) needs training, that I need to give her 'just a little training as to 'heal' and to come back......I just let him rant away. I couldn't help thinking how not normal he sounded. He went on about my little car, which is D22's little old banger, and said it guzzled gas and was it a sport's car? Wish I could do the little eyes up emoji. You should see this car, it looks like it's had an operation and has been hand stitched back together again. It's one of the smallest cars on the market. I mean 'sport's car?' 

So I sat completely quiet for 30 minutes as he drove towards our old village, which he lives 15 minutes beyond and up a hill from. When we reached the intersection that went in one direction to our old village, and the opposite to my house, he said, 'I guess I can take you home and bring the car back tomorrow.' I said, 'but then you'll have to come back,' he said it was ok.

As we drove to my house, his mood changed again. He started making light conversation, tried to be funny. Asked if I was working the next day (today), I said I had a tasting at 2.

When we got to my house, he drove right up to my door and unloaded my stuff right into my house. He was cheery and touched me as we exchanged the car keys. This is something he would do a lot the first year after BD. I would always tell where his head was if he would touch my hand as we exchanged stuff, or if he did everything he could to avoid touching me. I was not expecting him to touch me last night, so I was touched (physically). When I opened the house door he needed the keys back for the car and put his hands out for me to put them in his palm but I was a little upset about the car behaviour and I just set them on the table for him to pick up himself. We settled on a time for him to come today, 12.30.

It was an incredibly beautiful day here today. I'm going to say it was 25-26 degrees C. I was boiled after London. I was ready by 12.30 and was doing some work on my computer when he arrived. He drove right up to my house again and knocked on my glass door and waited for me to come down. I took doggie out who made a big fuss of him. H looked around my (overgrown) garden while I got my shoes on.

I told him my tasting got cancelled and did he want to go to my garage and check out the space for his car. He said ok. I talked a little about S15 and his wins lately. H asked me what ranking S15 is. It's really weird for a father of a ranked child to have no clue whatsoever how ranking works. He listened with interest as I taught him. I mentioned D25 coming to visit in about 3 weeks but his face tightened. I let the subject go. When we got to my garage, he was weird again. Went around saying I should remove this or that. I said I wasn't removing anything. That this was my storage space and I wanted to keep everything. He said that I should throw away stuff, that it will make me feel better. I told him that when I moved out of the family house/winery, I threw away a ton of stuff and I wanted to keep all of the stuff in my garage. That kind of annoyed him. We left and started driving to his house.

I was quiet and left it up to him to talk or not. He brought up some old friends of ours. One of their sons got married a couple of years ago and H went to the wedding in my place. H told me that the bride's parents were such a happily married couple (our age). How lovely it was to see old married couples look at each other with such love. Hmmm, eye up emoji. H then asked me if it was true that some old friends of ours had split up. I said yes. He said that was so sad. He asked why. I said it was a long time coming, that they'd tried therapy for years (he gasped), and in the end she wanted to go ahead. H couldn't believe that it was the wife who wanted to split up. There was no infidelity and the couple are still friends and good parents to their one child.

H told me about our old friends' three sons and what they are up to work wise and girlfriends wise. It was a nice conversation. I can't help thinking that it's not a conversation he could have with OW because she doesn't know these people. Maybe H would tell her about them but I doubt it, I think she would consider them 'Milly' people and would therefore not be interested.

When we got closer to H's house, he asked me about my trip up to Milan this coming weekend and where was I staying. I told him I was staying with an old friend that he knows, too. He said why don't you leave Saturday instead of Sunday and spend 2 days with S? I said I had the problem of the dog and would have to spend money on an extra night of kennel. H said 'I'll take care of her.' I said 'I thought you were going away.' He said, 'well I might not go away after all.'

H got out of the car and said that I could bring my doggie to him and he would look after her. I asked if he was sure. He said yes, that he likes looking after her, that she's really sweet, and he even likes going out and about with her.

I thought I would journal this for future reference. Whatever happens, I think it's interesting to see how they yo-yo. So, looks like H is not going away after all, and he's going to give me free doggie care. This is good for me.

My impressions from having spent a little time with my semi-vanisher/off and oner is that he is still going through his crisis. I think he's moving in and out of the tunnel continuously. When he talks he still sounds like something is wrong with him. I mean, he doesn't sound like a 58 year old man, he's too confused about simple stuff. Their brains really are messed up. It's as if he can't understand basic things.

My impression is also that anger is still around. It's close to the surface and gets triggered easily, but compared to before, he's able to block it and turn it around to a positive quickly. Previously, during his crisis, I mean a few years before BD even, when he got angry it could last for days, even weeks. If he got angry at all, it would only escalate, it never ever ended easily. So I'm seeing a small improvement in his capacity to realize he's getting angry and stop it.

I thought I would share these thoughts.




 
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Mortesbride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2605
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #84 on: October 22, 2019, 12:04:08 PM »
Last Wednesday I was not feeling the best...

Beast came to bring the kids home from contact...and was asking me directions to somewhere.

I said:
''At the end of the street take a left...go all the way to the roundabout and take a right....then at the 2nd big round about take a left....''

It seemed very clear to me what I was saying. He asked me 3 times in a row...I repeated the same instructions to him three times...trying to figure out an easier way to say ''Left, roundabout, right, roundabout, left''.

By the 4th time he asked me I audibly sighed...then he decided to monster and scream at me that I was an ass-hole.  :o

Because it is my fault his brain can't understand simple directions.  ::)

They are just completely scrambled up there.
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline Anon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 773
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #85 on: October 22, 2019, 12:05:24 PM »
Good grief Milly - that is quite the update.   Your h is all over the place isn't he?  And isn't that weird that he was going to be out of town and then he wasn't?  Do you think he cancelled his plans to be out of town or did he lie about those plans in the first place?  Either way,, he's quite the confused mess.   If this erratic 'all over the place' behavior is different than the last few years, do you think he is coming close to the end of the tunnel where they get super confused again, just like in the early days when entering the tunnel?   I wouldn't be surprised given the time he has been in MLC.  Very interesting though.  Quickly cycling moods - shut down one minute and chatty the next.   Your head must be spinning.   How do you think he will be with you after you get back from Milan?

Offline Anon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 773
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #86 on: October 22, 2019, 12:12:33 PM »
Last Wednesday I was not feeling the best...

By the 4th time he asked me I audibly sighed...then he decided to monster and scream at me that I was an ass-hole.  :o

Because it is my fault his brain can't understand simple directions.  ::)

Morte,,, He may not understand the directions but I think even more... he senses your recent shift and your obvious movement away from him.   He knows he is about to be left behind, or already has been left behind.  That could be why he called you an ass-hole. 

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #87 on: October 22, 2019, 12:45:38 PM »
Dear Lord Milly I am dizzy from that whole encounter. Just the flip flopping on how he feels about the doggie is enough to make you crazy.  I wonder if that is how they flip flip on how they feel about us and OWs? 

Just look at poor Beast asking an A$$h0!e for assistance. 

We should lock Beast, the Pumpkin King and Mr. Milly in a room with a problem to solve and watch their progress on camera from a room filled with comfy chairs,  snacks and wine. 
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline Acorn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3111
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #88 on: October 22, 2019, 02:25:35 PM »
Here is another person who is feeling rather dizzy after reading all that emotional see-saw. 
You really can’t make this stuff up.  Written out like that, you know you are dealing with emotionally out of whack person, AKA MLCer.  You did good by zipping.  The person that benefitted most from silence was you, of course! 

Added later:

I used to think zipping was good for our relationship above all else.
In hindsight, it was good for me.  It was a gift I gave myself without even realizing. 
It gave me a sense of achievement because I could control my tongue. I saved myself unnecessary heartache that I might have suffered had I engaged my H with words.  I did it for our R but, it turns out, it was for me.  Just sayin’.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 03:06:26 PM by Acorn »
Live-in MLCer
Feb 2015: BD.  H has a Nuclear meltdown. 
Oct 2015: ILYBIANILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #89 on: October 22, 2019, 03:13:46 PM »
Morte, that's exactly what it's like. They can't hold onto information, or can't add up sentences. It's as if they are on drugs or slightly asleep.

Anon, I don't know if he changed his mind about going to London, or if he never was leaving in the first place. We LBSs do reach the same reasonings, don't we? Either or, he's changed his mind about helping me this weekend. I have no idea how he will be when I return from Milan. He could be exactly as he is now, yo-yo or who knows? It's fascinating actually at this point. This is new behaviour as far as I'm concerned so I am curious.

DF, interesting point you make: do they flip flop about us and OW this way too? It's quite possible. Maybe not while they are deep in the tunnel, but at the beginning and end of Replay as we've been told it can happen. If this is what's happening, it will be interesting to journal it and see how it presents. And your last sentence made me laugh. Wouldn't it be fun to watch these guys from soft chairs, snacks, and wine. Love that!

Acorn, thanks for saying I did well to zip. I do feel a little proud of myself for this. I don't think in the past I would have been able to keep my mouth closed after a while. What I learned from zipping was that it diffused the situation. Not only did my H calm himself down, he turned around and did what I had wanted in the first place, and I didn't do a thing to make it happen.

One more thing that I just remembered about this afternoon, while I was in the car with H driving, there were a series of phone 'pings' - message alerts going off like a semi-automatic rifle: ping, pi-pi-ping, ping, ping, ping.......I thought it was my phone, which was at my feet in my handbag. I checked it because it was such a flurry of messages, it sounded very urgent. It wasn't my phone. H ignored his. This is quite significant to me because last Thursday, as I drove to the airport with H in the passenger seat, he not only checked his phone continuously, he answered several texts in front of me. He knows this is a 'no no' for me.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Acorn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3111
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #90 on: October 22, 2019, 03:22:39 PM »
You know, Milly, my mom used to say ‘you can’t clap with one hand.’  In other words, you starve the energy of contention by not holding up ‘the other hand’.  It was one of many sayings I used to silently repeat to myself when I felt the urge to verbally engage H. 
Live-in MLCer
Feb 2015: BD.  H has a Nuclear meltdown. 
Oct 2015: ILYBIANILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

Offline 9393roo

  • MLCer Type: Clinging Boomerang
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 446
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #91 on: October 22, 2019, 04:08:18 PM »
Milly, There must be something in the air.  My H too has joined the ranks of doing the classic strange cycle.  I'm afraid there is not a rational thought in his head at the moment!  Hang in there and realize it is all part of this process.  None of it makes any logical sense, none of it. 

Quote
You know, Milly, my mom used to say ‘you can’t clap with one hand.’  In other words, you starve the energy of contention by not holding up ‘the other hand’.  It was one of many sayings I used to silently repeat to myself when I felt the urge to verbally engage H.

Acorn I'm adding this to my silent head sayings too.  I'm afraid I've had a couple of verbal confrontations with my H the last week that have left me spinning.  I really need to put my zipper back in place. 
Husband 54
Me 54
Kids 3 sons 28, 26, 23 1 daughter 19
BD #1 Spring 2016
BD #2 Winter 2017
married 32 years.  Together 34
H never moved out except 3 weeks after BD #1
OW 30 year single mom employee-He says EA only I don’t believe him.
He is working on things and far from being cooked.

Offline Maleficent

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 291
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #92 on: October 22, 2019, 04:58:09 PM »
Milly, Thanks for sharing.  It all sounds so fascinating to watch, it is a pity it is real life and not a movie.  You sound fabulous though and in control and with boundaries and strength and direction. 

I noticed that D25 is coming to visit in a few weeks--I hope that goes well.  Will your son and D22 be able to join you?  I am hoping it is a lovely healing reunion for you. 

Hope the Milan trip goes well. 
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

Offline UrsaMajor

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9369
  • Gender: Male
  • Live like they are never coming back
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #93 on: October 23, 2019, 01:57:05 AM »
OK Milly, I now have Whiplash and it is YOUR H's fault.... He changes his mind/moods faster than most people change their underwear... I am impressed you could keep up with that at all.... But, even MORE impressed with your Zippedipity.... (Combo of Zippedness and Serendipity)<snort>  not to mention your simple, short "No, I am keeping these things." reply to his control attempts....

Interesting too about the phone pings....

Good on you! Hope that you enjoy your time with D25! And in Milano...
Me - 56
xW - 49
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #94 on: October 23, 2019, 02:39:32 AM »
I like the word Zippedipity  :)
And wow, Milly, you handled it all like a sane calm adult

I hope the gift for you from it is that a few things are blindingly obvious.
Your earlier blip about assumptions was wasted energy.
Your h is a mess of a human in a whole bunch of different ways that have nothing to do with how you behave at all. Which of course frees you to carry on doing what is best for you.
It is possible but seems unlikely, that this kind of mess only appears in front of you, so probably quite a lot of his life generally is the kind of mess you would expect with someone who behaves and thinks like this.
It is probably rather sad to see what a mess he is, but if you were ever the problem, why would he be a mess like this now years later? And whatever he thought he was running to find, he doesn't look like a happy healthy man does he? Which also means that most of your mind monkeys about his new 'improved' life with ow were far from the truth maybe after the initial flurry of escape.

Sounds as if it is pretty tricky to rely on him for anything consistently, but you seem to be navigating it very well.
So a gazillion reminders of reality here as well as your own progress.

I know that - whilst I never got too hung up on the ow, maybe bc other things my then h did were even more shocking to me - there was a time when I used to imagine that my h was off being my h but with someone else. The scale of change was so hard to wrap my head round and bc I didn't see him, I think I could remember how he was as a person but not imagine how he is. I probably had some mind movies in which he was just the same but across a dinner table or chatting or waking up with someone else in my place....but sounding the same, same jokes, habits etc.  And that hurt so I stopped thinking about it.  It is very difficult to do more than intellectually accept, I think, how very strange and irrational and very different these folks can become. Or how much of themselves they lose in the churn of it. Now in my case I don't know bc he vanished and I don't look....but posts like this are a useful reminder perhaps that the assumptions we make are often not at all how it is. I know that you had a long time with very little contact and a lot of insane monster so you made similar assumptions perhaps to the ones I did/do....but a lot of them seem likely to not be how it was or your h would not be what you saw.

It's a tricky balance isn't it? One bit of you wanting them to be a mess so your assumptions were wrong and perhaps bc the mess suggests a process that they might get through. And another bit of you wouldn't want anyone you loved for so long to be this kind of mess so it feels sad and hard to imagine how they could ever be an un-messed normal again. I wonder if they know they are a mess? If they feel that they are less capable or healthy than they used to be? Maybe it is part of why some work so hard to stay away from any bit of their old life bc it reminds them of what they used to be and how they used to feel? Idk...it sounds as if your h at least is beginning to recognise that his short fuse is not right and he is trying to manage it.

Idk if you are still standing or not or just getting on with your life regardless.
Certainly your h still seems a million miles from anyone cooked enough to have a sensible deep or normal adult conversation with...but it does also seem that there has been some shift in him over the last few months too.

I suppose I have come to the resting place that either my xh lost himself or found himself.
If he lost himself, that's very sad but also means that my h stopped existing so of course our m did too.
If he found himself, then who he wants to be is not my kind of person at all so our m would have needed to end anyway.
The million dollar question of course is what if they do the first to do the second, and what kind of human will come out the other end.....but I guess until or unless that happens there is simply no way of knowing so best to get on with life and assume they are lost for good imho.


Is your oldest daughter coming to visit with you? Have you spoken with her recently?
« Last Edit: October 23, 2019, 02:43:37 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline Not Your Monkey

  • MLCer Type: Clinging Boomerang
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2327
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #95 on: October 23, 2019, 03:18:42 AM »
It all sounds so fascinating to watch, it is a pity it is real life and not a movie.

 :o
Beware "MLCers" telling lies.

Offline CanLetGo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 990
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #96 on: October 24, 2019, 04:16:41 PM »
Gosh there’s been a lot happening for you Milly, it’s enough to send you spinning, but you’re handling it all like a pro! Hope you enjoy time with S, fabulous you’re getting away to see him, no sitting around and wallowing for Milly! 😘
Me 45
H 49
3 young adult kids
BD December 2013, left home August 2014, D June 2018
OW 17 years younger

Offline KeepItTogether

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5083
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #97 on: October 24, 2019, 04:26:03 PM »
Oh my, those personality shifts are dizzying. I wonder if he is even cognizant of them.

And yes, your zipping skills are quite enviable Milly. Good on you!

My H has a terrible memory as well. He is forever accusing me of not telling him something about S's schedule, which honestly, he probably wouldn't make time for anyway.  So now I just apologize for "not telling him."  But I have read on more than one occasion that their memory is just a mess during this.

London sounds amazing. I am so happy you were able to go and that you could fit in some time with friends and D22. 
Me 48
H 47
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline Savoir Faire

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5461
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #98 on: October 24, 2019, 06:55:35 PM »
I could feel the emotion of that car trip Milly.  He was SOOOOOOO confused.

I bet at first he didn't want to be with you and was telling himself he just needed to get away.  The more 'involved' he felt he had to be, the worse he got - hence the nearly not looking after your dog etc.

As the journey went on, he started to feel quite relaxed in your company, in fact , it felt good and 'normal' and 'safe' so he started the conversation because you had allowed him just to sit and process.

He liked it so much he wanted to do more but it did frighten him.  He actually feels 'nothing' but being with you is familiar and he likes it.  He tries to work out why he likes being with you but can't.

He felt bad for being nasty, and also thought about ow who is actually making him feel really uncomfortable because she's so controlling and just plain stupid and he thought to himself "I'll show her and not visit"  His  feelings are all  fleeting but  there and confused him to bits.

He got a bit weird again at the house because you mentioned something that triggered him a little and his memory is bad and he can't access the feelings that go with liking your mutual friends, so he withdraws.

He is happy with his decision to help again but now probably has pressure from ow and is accessing the way she makes him feel, not how he actually feels about her, they are two different things.

He really likes they way he feels when he's with you, it's a bit like an old slipper for him and he wants to feel that good again, but still can't access  the actual feelings that go with it and it bothers him.

Expect him to be a bit weird again when he has to look after the dog, his emotions and what he thinks he wants just gets pulled in so many different directions, it's exhausting for him.

I love the way you handled him, could you imagine handling him lime that at the beginning?  It would have ended badly, you are now an LBS pro Milly ;D
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #99 on: October 25, 2019, 01:58:24 AM »
Oh, guys, thank you so much for all your posts. They make me feel like I'm not crazy when I notice my H's bizarre twisting personality.

Acorn, love the 'you can't clap with one hand!' Great reminder!

Roo, interesting to hear that your H is like this, too, even at the stage you are at. It does help to share and to encourage each other to accept this, as it's just part of the process. I'm finding it's a great lesson for me, too, how not to get involved, don't butt in, people can work things out themselves. I guess this is exactly what happened by me letting it go. He processed. Very good lesson for me and for him, too, I imagine.

Hi, Male, yes D25 is coming mid November with her new boyfriend. She has asked if her siblings could come but D22 is in the Uk and I just can't afford these extra trips any more. I have booked S's train tickets for the weekend D25 will be here. She asked that we go to her favourite restaurant. I'm hoping to use my new zipping skills with her, too. She has been coming closer again lately, which really makes me happy.

UM, thanks for complimenting my zippdipity! I did it without thinking, which I now consider to be a great sign of my growth. At the time, it felt like the safest way to behave but now that you are all pointing this out to me, I realize how far I've come, big proud Milly! And yes, what a boundary I laid out about my stuff! I have to admit, it was a little scary for me while I was doing it, but it does seem to work, doesn't it? Thanks for the good wishes for Milano.

Treasur, I did laugh at the 'sane, calm adult,' we're not used to those any more, not even from ourselves! Yes, you are absolutely right in that those assumptions can be some of our own worst enemies. I like everything you said because it should be the bleeding obvious but when it's my H, I can't see it. Yes, my H is a mess isn't he? As you say, he must be a mess with OW, too. Yes, he looks awful, miserable, not a success story. All these years without me hasn't given him this wonderful life. Thank you so much for pointing it out. It does help me to hear this, because as you know, the OW still has a big effect on me.

NYM, it should be a movie, then we could all have a great laugh! It would be one of those dark comedies like Little Miss Sunshine!

CLG, thanks for your sweet encouragement as always! Yes, off to Milan tomorrow. Hoping to get to watch my S play a tournament during the weekend!

Kit, yes, memory is useless. He's for ever asking S15 the same thing over and over, too. S just shakes his head. When my H said I never told him my flight times, I just said calmly 'Yes I did, I wrote them 3 times,' and left it at that. He shut up after that, but had he not, I would have left it. I think that's the secret.

Savvy, I found your post soooo enlightening!! I do think you had an insight into the MLCer's brain! I was very interested in how you read my H's behaviour, and it makes total sense. The triggering in the garage/house, might have been that I mentioned having had to move out of our old home/winery and had to throw so much stuff out. Maybe it reminded him that I sold and we don't have that any more. H has been talking to OW a lot since my return, I can see from the whatsap online times. I think it's as you say about her. She is probably putting on a lot of pressure, he maybe is beginning to be confused about her. It will be interesting to see. Thank you so much for your take on my H, it was very eyeopening for me.

Early tomorrow morning I drive up to Milan. S will be playing a rodeo-tournament, that's a tournament that starts on a Saturday and must end by Sunday night so if you win your match, you hang around until your next turn, and so on. This is a bit of luck for me, because there's a good chance I'll be able to watch him play more than once. He's been playing a major tournament this past week and won 5 matches which gained him many points for his ranking. His progress in these 6 weeks has been phenomenal. The ex-champion even left me a voice message to say how incredibly S has been doing and that he hoped I was equally pleased.

The tennis academy is moving to a new set up next week, big house (with guest room for parents) that they've been working on for months. All the kids are coming home for 5 days, so S will be able to drive back down with me on Tuesday. I'm looking forward to that so much! An added bonus!

I'll be doing a wine fair on Monday and will be staying the whole time with an old friend whom I used to work with when we lived in Milan. H and I moved to Milan right after we married for his work. I then got a job, too, and D25 was born there. We lived there for 5 years. I also lived in Milan when I was a child.

Tonight after my tasting, I drop doggie off at H's. I asked yesterday if it was still ok and he answered yes, bring doggie over to mine. So I will be dropping doggie with all her baggage up at his house tonight. H has been online on whatsap continuously since yesterday. I imagine (I know presumptions!) with OW. I am prepared for him being cold when I see him.

Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Nerissa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 635
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #100 on: October 25, 2019, 06:37:03 AM »
Good luck Milly.  You are lovely. 

Offline hopeandfaith

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2139
  • Gender: Female
    • Clare Brown Life Coach
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #101 on: October 25, 2019, 02:47:50 PM »
It will be interesting if he is not cold when you see him.  My H got really sick of the ow pressure towards the end which made me seem like a breath of fresh air.  If he is cold, I predict that it won't last long.

I also thought that maybe he wasn't supposed to pick you up that last time and that's why he didn't answer his phone (i.e she didn't know he was doing it?). My H would do that...delay the $hit fight until later.  On the first trip, he might have been reassuring her.

You are sounding great Milly and I am so pleased with how things are going for S and that D25 is coming for a visit - yippeee to both!!
BD's in May 09, Sept 12 - suspected OW
Left home Jan 12 2013
OW confirmed Feb 2013
Moved home April 11 2014
BD again in April 2017 - clinging. 
Moved out July 2017
D19, D17 and S15

Online stillbaffled

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4505
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #102 on: October 25, 2019, 03:52:43 PM »
Soak up all the tennis, Milly.  I hope your S plays well and that you get to see some of what your hard earned money is paying for. 
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

Offline One day at a time

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1159
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #103 on: October 26, 2019, 03:27:40 AM »
I'm caught up Milly! I hope you have a lovely time away! Your H is up and down like a yo-yo!
H - 42 (40 @BD1)
M - 42 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.
Confirmation H and OW are together, presume PA  - 3rd June 2019

"One of the happiest moments in life is when you find the courage to let go of what you can’t change"

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #104 on: October 28, 2019, 10:29:38 AM »
Go enjoy your S!!
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #105 on: October 29, 2019, 02:27:01 PM »
Thank you so much Nerissa, Hope, Still, One, and DF!

Had a really lovely weekend up in S15 land. Got to see S win 3 matches, so exciting! Then Sunday, we spent the day on beautiful Lake Como. I hadn't been there in 25 years. I'd forgotten how beautiful it is. S wanted to go to lunch in a particular café/restaurant on the lake that he'd been to with one of the coaches once. We waited for an outside table and had a lovely light lunch. S had a big ice-cream cup at the end. I had been texting H during the tournament and he answered regularly. I sent him a photo of S with his ice-cream and H said nice and asked if we were at Lake Como. H and I would go there regularly when we lived in Milan in our early married years.

Monday I did a wine fair. It was really tiring but a very good event. I saw tons of people, poured wine all afternoon until 8.30pm. I woke up this morning, feeling like my body was in need of the Tin Man's little oil jug.

I stayed at an old friend's house. We used to work together in Milan years ago. It was wonderful reconnecting. She's married with one daughter that they both adore. Her H inherited a beautiful apartment in the center of Milan and they appear to have a phenomenal life. Well, he's just started a MLC. I spent 3 nights with them. I had forgotten what it was like to live with one. My friend walks on eggshells. Luckily she is aware of what's happening. I have given her the link to HS so she might get some information to help her.

This afternoon S and I drove back home together. He's in bed with doggie as I write. So cosy to drive with him and chat in the car. We went straight to H's to get doggie.

Hope, interesting take on why my H might have been cold. So, when I took doggie to his house, he smiled. I'm not sure it was a genuine smile, it was more an embarrassed smile. H came out of his house and unloaded all doggie's stuff from my car. I told him what to do when he wants to leave her on her own and H listened as I talked. H was dressed in the usual bad MLCer way he has been doing lately: same jeans, tight t-shirt and tight little sweater, always exactly the same ones. I'm not sure if I mentioned that when he took me to the airport a week ago when I went to London, he smelled of cigarettes. H was a non smoker until he met OW then he started smoking at 54. H smelled so bad of cigarettes that day, he must have been smoking all day. So sad, really. He kept the window open in the car until I was too cold. He knows I'm a non-smoker and would have realized I could smell it. I do believe he was self conscious.

Anyway, S and I arrived at H's tonight to get doggie. I let S go to the door and ring the bell. This is the 5th time I've been to his front door since BD, 5 times in 6 weeks. Doggie was all excited and squeeled when she saw S, so H shut the door to stop her running out. I was by the car, he wouldn't have seen me. Then they both come out, S holding doggie in his arms. H is dressed better. He's got the usual jeans but a beautiful cream sweater I bought him years ago for Christmas. He looked smart. This instinctly set off my radar: was OW around? Well she couldn't be because doggie was there and H had no car but it still could have been a sign of OW influence. Then I waved the thought away. H smiled nicely, not as awkward as the first time. He went and got all doggie's stuff and put it in my car. S asked H is he would take him to his old tennis school tomorrow so he could play with his old tennis mates and H said yes right away. H then said but with mummy's car? and looked at me. S said yes. They/we then discussed what time my tasting was and how H would get to the winery by himself, get S and the car, take him to tennis, wait for him, come back and get me and take me home, then go out with S until after dinner.

I asked H is it had been easier with dog this time and if he'd been able to leave her at home alone. H said, no, not really. I'm taking that to be a little victim behaviour coming through. H then asked if he could have a bottle of wine. I said 'which wine?' H said there were two bottles in the back of my car. I said ok. I then told him that it got hight points recently in a German language wine magazine and that a well known Italian wine journalist had written this month that this wine was in his top 10 wines of Tuscany choice. H said 'yahoo!' The reason I told him is because this was the first vintage I made after he left, but he did help me with it. It was during those first years when he would come to the winery and help me when I would ask.

I am very proud of this wine, but he did contribute to its outcome and wanted him to know. S said, 'did you hear what Daddy said?' I said, 'what?' S said, 'Yahoo.' I said, 'I know, a little childish.' Even though H's expression was immature, in reality, he was chuffed. He would have no interest in being pleased about these scores if they were someone else's wine or even just mine. HIs reaction clearly showed he felt the wine was his too. This might seem inconsequential to some, but H distanced himself from the wine making side too. He used to spend hours in the cellar pumping wine and then about 2 years before BD, he lost interest in the wine, too, and let mistakes happen. So H distanced himself from me, the wine, and then finally the kids, too.

So, anyway, H is supposed to come take S from me tomorrow in the village. Hopefully, it will work out.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Nerissa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 635
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #106 on: October 29, 2019, 02:51:53 PM »
Congratulations to S.  it sounds like a wonderful weekend.

Offline Maleficent

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 291
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #107 on: October 29, 2019, 04:31:35 PM »
Milly, wonderful that your son did so well and that you had such a lovely weekend with 3 wins and a great visit with him! I am so happy for you that even though your son is away at school, you are still spending wonderful moments together. 

Interesting observations on h.  Regardless of how things develop, it is encouraging that he is taking more of an interest in your son's tennis and that he has been helping with doggie.  Congratulations on the wine accolades, too.  All good.  May it continue.
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

Offline Savoir Faire

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5461
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #108 on: October 29, 2019, 06:24:32 PM »
Glad you had a good time.  Yahoo!!  :o
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #109 on: October 29, 2019, 07:34:18 PM »
Hooray for S!! He sounds like he is getting along.  I am glad you got to see him play and win!  You both sound wonderful. H ..  well, that is a whole other story.
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline Mortesbride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2605
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #110 on: October 30, 2019, 03:00:10 AM »
Well I am proud of you Milly! Good job getting all that recognition for your wine.

Let me just throw in a Bazinga to go with the yahoo! ;D
You know this is MLC when you have played emotional hot potato with a pair of crotch-less tights.

Offline CanLetGo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 990
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #111 on: October 30, 2019, 05:20:39 AM »
Wonderful update Milly, except for friend in Milan, wishing her all the best. Lovely to hear your stories, giving me a smile remembering my visit, can’t wait til the next time! Congrats to S, and pleased H is being pleasant. Congrats on the wine, amazing considering how you must have been feeling at that time!
Me 45
H 49
3 young adult kids
BD December 2013, left home August 2014, D June 2018
OW 17 years younger

Offline KeepItTogether

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5083
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #112 on: October 30, 2019, 09:33:03 AM »
Well a big YAHOO to S too! Isn't it amazing where he is now compared to that low of last year? I firmly believe everything happens for a reason. And now S is doing so well, in fact he is flourishing.

One thing about MLC that I've observed Milly is that they do tend to distance themselves from all connections of the past. That includes children sadly, and in your case, wine making. That he can now consider this particular vintage "his", and is proud of it AND acknowledges it,  is a way of making a connection I think.

And that sweater? That was all for you my friend.
Me 48
H 47
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #113 on: October 30, 2019, 12:40:02 PM »
Thank you Nerissa, Male, Savvy, DF, Morte, CLG and Kit for your support for S and my wine and the laughs 'Yahoo and Bazinga!'

So, as might be predicted, met H today at lunch time so he could take my car to take S to his tennis and then hang out with him for a few hours, and H was very, very cold. I was in the car with him for maybe 7 minutes as he drove me to the winery and was then going on to pick up S. I could feel his stiffness immediately. He got in the car and was not even going to say hi. He was wearing the bad MLC outfit again: jeans, tight tshirt, same old tight little sweater, big belly. As he got in, I saw him glance at his phone and stick it under a bag he was carrying.

I said nothing in the car until he asked some small question about a neighbour. I decided to mimic him as I was reading on someone's thread, Acorn's I think. I learned later from S, that H tried to drop S at his tennis and just go home. He was going to drive right back and leave me the car and S to pick up at the end of the night. S said H got a little pissy on him. But S (bless him) said, 'No Daddy, you can't change your mind on an agreement you made yesterday with Mummy. You can't make her have to come get me tonight. She thinks she'll be finished at the end of her tasting and we'll be there to pick her up. It's not fair to make her come all the way here.' S told me that when he went into his tennis lesson, he wasn't sure if H would be there at the end or if he was going to have to wait for me. Well, H was there. S told me he thanked his dad for being there. They then went to the sport's store and H bought S some new gym shoes as his old ones have holes.

So then they come pick me up and I drive H back (with S) to his house up the hill. It's pitch black, long windy road up a hill to his house in the boonies. Bad enough with a car, never mind living up there with a bike. H was driving. I ask S some questions in a joyful manner about seeing his old tennis mates and teacher. I can feel H's coldness. I don't say anything to H at all. I'm mimicking. If he's going to be nice, I'll be nice. If he's distant, I will be distant. Can't get blood from a stone.

H eventually makes a little wine conversation. I tell him a little about the wine fair in Milan. He talks wine some more. H complains about D22's little car, the lights aren't good enough, what is this red light here (the seatbelt light)? I answer his questions, tell him I just got it serviced last week.

We drop him at his house. H is awkward and jittery. I've decided I'm just going to ignore him. H gets out, tries to make light conversation with S, S is not interested. H tells me he forgot to give me doggie's dish and did I want it. I say yes. He says I'll have to wait while he goes down somewhere to get it. I said I'll wait. He says he needs to get his stuff in the trunk. Then he asks what is in the back seat, I ignore. He fumbles, there's nothing of his. He's still around. He asks S what he's doing tomorrow, S says nothing that he's really tired. I offer nothing. H says bye (to S presumably), S says bye, I say nothing, pull off the hand break and drive off. I can see through my rear view mirror that he's standing there looking at us drive away.

So I thought I'd post this because I've been reading on other threads about how our MLCers cycle. If you think that last night H's parting words were 'yahoo!' and today he can't crack a smile or a word, not even to S, I think it's interesting to put it down for research sake. S told me about H being pissy with him on the drive home. I told S not to think twice about it, that H was clearly in a bad mood for his own things. I did praise S for standing up for himself and me.

So, H was semi-decent last night, might have been wearing a nice sweater to impress me (loved that Kit!) and today he's as cold and detached as he's ever been. No biggie, it won't last. He's clearly got stuff going on that has put him in a bad mood. I think the safest thing to do when H is like this is to zip and ignore, aka: zipnore. He has stuff going on that only he can sort. He has stuff going on that he needs to deal with. My interference would most probably go against me. My staying away, can only help me. I do not want to be a part of any of his (and OW's) crappy drama-filled failure of a life. This is how I'm going to approach the go parts of the touch and goes, or the cycling away days.

I hope it can be useful for someone out there to see this behaviour in my H. It will be interesting to see how the next encounter will be at this point.

In RL, I am back at work. My boss is here with his wife this week and stressing me continuously for this and that. I went to do a tasting this afternoon and could tell my boss is in a bad mood. Probably didn't help that it's raining here and their boiler is kaputt, making it chilly in the house, no hot water, and he has to buy a new one. I have to say that the book 'The Four Agreements' has been invaluable to me for not taking on other people's $h!te the way I used to. My boss clearly is pissed off at his own stuff and taking it out on me. I have my own stuff, he needs to deal with his.

Now I'm back home with S. It's raining and a little chilly in the house. I haven't put the heating on in my little house yet because it's liquid gas and costs a fortune and it hasn't been cold enough. However, I ordered in a big load of wood for my open fire and just lit a beautiful fire before I sat down here on HS. I have a glass of wine on the mantel piece next to a lit candle and a packet of Hoola Hoops! The English will know what these are, little potato hoops (chips) I bought in the airport store before leaving London last week.

S is up having a long bath. I'm going to make him dinner when he's ready. I asked him in the car if he wanted burgers for dinner. He answered that he was too tired to cook. I said I'll make them! Poor thing, he's so used to having to do everything for himself.  I have it all ready to go.

Tomorrow I work from home. Friday night I'm having some friends and their sons for a late Halloween dinner. Tomorrow S and I will go do the supermarket to get stuff for the dinner. S is going to make salsa and short bread.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline KeepItTogether

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5083
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #114 on: October 30, 2019, 01:15:07 PM »
Oh Milly--bless S's little heart that he was ready to make those burgers but was too tired. Had no expectation that you would do it. And how loved he must have felt that you would make him dinner. Such a sweet interaction. I love it.

And of course, on the opposite side of that, my heart absolutely broke reading that he wasn't sure if H would be there after practice. That insecure feeling. Oh, how could these MLCers do this to these little humans?

Thankfully S had YOU. And you two are quite a team!
Me 48
H 47
S12
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

Offline seahorse

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1034
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #115 on: October 30, 2019, 02:17:36 PM »
Milly - I LOVE "ZIPNORE"!!!
I'm going to use it - Thank you!
Sea

Seahorses have one mate for life...

Online RedStar

  • MLCer Type: Off-N-On
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 257
  • Gender: Female
  • MLCer is in high energy replay.
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #116 on: October 30, 2019, 02:28:47 PM »
Milly - I LOVE "ZIPNORE"!!!
I'm going to use it - Thank you!
Sea

Yes! Great word Milly!!  ;D ;D ;D

Offline Savoir Faire

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5461
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #117 on: October 30, 2019, 11:07:10 PM »
Sounds like you are very cozy Milly, think I'll join you :)

Your son is like mine.  He often takes a bath while I cook if he's really tired, it's such a pleasure to do things for someone who supports you through this.  We all need a medal.

Your H has had too much interaction with you lately and is cooling off.  What a shame he isn't there to be as comfortable as you are.
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Offline Nerissa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 635
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #118 on: October 31, 2019, 03:18:49 AM »
Your children have you Milly and that is truly their blessing, despite H’s failings.  They are a credit tonyou.

Online stillbaffled

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4505
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #119 on: October 31, 2019, 09:35:02 PM »
It is interesting to me to read about your H's behavior from one day to the next.  I, of course, got nothing like that.  Just plain old runaway, hide and pretend that SB died! 

Sounds like you and S are enjoying the his visit. 

Your time in Milan sounded very nice.  Pretty sure I'd love Lake Como.  I know I love ice cream! 
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

Offline Acorn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3111
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #120 on: November 01, 2019, 02:54:04 AM »
Milly, you sure you didn’t get mixed up with ‘H’ and ‘S’ in your latest post?
It sounds like S is the adult (his reprimand to his father and the burger) and H is a petulant irresponsible teenager that thinks nothing of reneging on the driving agreement.  It’s mind boggling, isn’t it?!

May I share what helped me cope with cycling warm/cold interactions I had with H while he was deep in the tunnel?  Of course, every situation is unique and one cannot use identical mental attitudes.   I’m sharing my experiences, just in case. 

I tried to stop framing those recurring warm/cold periods of interactions in MLC terms.  I tried to delete from my head the words ‘Touch and Go’ and merely treat it as fluctuations in H’s emotional state.  Everyone has them.  I have them. Why can’t H?  This way of thinking helped me keep that pesky thing called ‘Expectations’ away.  Alas, the ‘delete’ button for MLC terminology did not function 100% of the time as I could not unsee and unlearn all those MLC-related words... 

When I framed it as T&G, my thought went to ‘when is it going to turn into Reconnection?’  Now, if that is not the perfect fuel for Expectations, I don’t know what is.    I’m in no way suggesting that you are doing that.  That’s what happened with me and believe that there might be a risk the same thing happens with other LBSs, too.  Or, maybe I’m the only one!

You have described the winery owner’s bad mood because of his circumstances and that resulted in him taking out his frustration on you.  One would not call that ‘Go’ part of T&G.  Just normal fluctuation in life.  You consciously opted for the attitude of not taking it personally.  I’d say that way of looking other’s words and actions, especially that of MLCers, is such a relief!  Less MLC lens, more life lens. 

(((((HUGS)))))

« Last Edit: November 01, 2019, 03:00:57 AM by Acorn »
Live-in MLCer
Feb 2015: BD.  H has a Nuclear meltdown. 
Oct 2015: ILYBIANILWY.
Apr 2016: Affair discovered
Dec 2017: Seriously reconnecting

Offline Trustandlove

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5992
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #121 on: November 01, 2019, 03:18:49 AM »
Hi, Milly,

What Acorn says is interesting; years ago RCR also advised me to take off the MLC glasses and see what I saw when not filtered through the lens of MLC....    it did help me to see things how they are rather than how I might have wanted them to be.  And yes, doing that does keep those expectations at bay, which is a good thing. 

It didn't/doesn't change my thoughts and beliefs about standing and the crisis, but it did help deal with the immediate situation and help me respond appropriately -- which I do think you are doing, btw. 

It helped me speak the truth, so for example when he tried to say that he was always there for the kids I was able to say that no, he wasn't at all, rather than something that might sound appeasing. 

And I love your word zipnore! 

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #122 on: November 01, 2019, 03:23:55 AM »
This perspective from Acorn feels like a little jewel to me.
There is a time when I think we need to use the MLC lens to just try to answer some basic questions - is this normal? Was it my fault? Can I do anything about it?
Then the MLC script behaviour lens - why are they acting in ways that make no sense? What/who is this person now? Are they trying intentionally to hurt me? How can I respond appropriately to some of this WTF behaviour to keep myself sane and safe?

And then as Acorn says, and perhaps it takes a little time and distance from the active 'battlefield', to start to see the behaviour without needing to label it in the same way helps us to avoid expectations, good or bad. To see it less as 'MLC' and more just a pattern of behaviour in an individual human being that seems a bit messed up, something that is as it is just as Trust says.
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Online RedStar

  • MLCer Type: Off-N-On
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 257
  • Gender: Female
  • MLCer is in high energy replay.
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #123 on: November 01, 2019, 07:01:23 AM »
If you will, though, from another perspective: while I agree with what you all are saying, I think that the MLC lens can actually work the other way too -- as in, "well, this is just a T&G and therefore nothing super meaningful." And that is the way I have usually seen it applied in many threads over the years.

I find this a super helpful stance that I am using right at this minute in fact. :P If I weren't thinking "it's MLC," I might have read a whole lot more into the latest from him. If it were not MLC, I'd think it a big step forward, but instead, I am taking it in stride and am rather more wary and skeptical and know *not* to expect much.

So, either way of framing things can help an LBS quell expectations, depending on what leads that particular LBS to or away from them, if that makes sense. :)

Offline 3Boys4Me

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #124 on: November 01, 2019, 08:24:10 AM »
Just wanted to pop in and say this conversation is incredibly helpful - particularly the insight to frame behaviors through a variety of lenses - it is like wearing glasses - I have glasses for reading, glasses for night driving, but most of the time I wear no glasses at all. Being able to look at my spouse’s behavior through different lenses, that allow me to remain detached, lower expectations, while still affirming my sanity. How liberating! It is ok for me to understand this is a crisis and his behavior is whacked and completely opposite from his former self. I can understand his touch and go’s are relative to his own emotional state and may or may not mean anything relative to his progress in MLC or movement through the tunnels. Seriously, your comments are all brilliant... my sincere gratitude- more helpful than you all might know.
BD End of April 2017
Moved out - kind of, May 2017
Denied affair
Cycled hard April - Oct 2017, my son figured out affair, I confronted husband, we were going away as a family for the weekend - H monsters hard and files for a D end of Oct, 2017
D final Sept 2018
Many touch and goes
He lives in monster, kids haven’t been with him overnight since Jan 2019
Moved in with MOW, a former friend of mine, May 2019

Offline Dumbfounded

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2749
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #125 on: November 01, 2019, 08:56:34 PM »
Your S sounds so sweet Milly. Glad he is home for spell and you can enjoy each other for a little while.

It must be exhausting to be in your H’s head. I agree zipnore.
Married 1998
MLC H 48
LBS W 47
D16, S12
BD March, 2016
Left home Sept 4, 2016 - living with parents
H filed for D - July 24, 2017
D final March 14, 2018 - still living at parent's house

“You've seen my descent, now watch my rising.”
― Jalaluddin Rumi

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #126 on: November 02, 2019, 12:27:31 PM »
I am going to call this post: ZIPNORE, because I need to do this tonight.

Thank you all of your, so many of you for posting! It's been wonderful having S at home. I have loved it. He leaves tomorrow.

Kit, I'm about to make my S a burger right now! He's going to turn into a burger soon!

Sea and Red, I'm reminding myself tonight that I must ZIPNORE!!

Savvy, thank you so much for your take on where my H is. I think you're right, H has had a lot of interaction with me lately, and he needs to cool off, or so he thinks. I think I'm in for a major cool off phase presently.

Nerissa, you are sweet as always! Wished I lived next door to you!

Still, I think my H is cycling wildly right now and I need to get out of the way or I'll be thrown about. If you like ice cream, anywhere in Italy will be perfect for you!

Acorn, thank you sooo much for your advice on how I should take this hot and cold of my H. I read your post the other day and re-read it tonight when I needed a cold shower, and it's been very, very helpful. To detach from the MLC possible meaning, does help when I'm monkey braining or have reached a totally frustrated moment. We all have those days when we want to say 'enough already!'

Trust, it's true that I must take my MLC glasses off, good way of putting it. I guess what really gets to me still is when I feel that H is avoiding S because of OW, or because H seems to prefers OW, or OW has some control over him so when she's in his head H won't even have anything to do with S. This is how I'm feeling tonight. OW gets into my head, so I think I need not only to take my MLC glasses off but I need to push my H away and out of my life for a little so that I am not even aware that OW is still in his life. So I think it's what you say, the expectations that are always there and then when I feel OW is in my H's head, I have to ground myself.

Treasur, I know you're right and the advice that you and Acorn give is really good when it's just about my H and  the crisis, but when OW gets in my head like tonight, I don't have a solution and I have a really hard time zignoring.

Red, yes, thank you, I do share your thoughts on touch and goes. For me it's actually a kind of relief to know it's just that.

3Boys, I'm so glad these conversations are helpful to you. I hope they might be for many others, too. This is the beauty of this site that by airing our frustrations we help many more people than just ourselves.

DF, thanks. My boy and I do know how to make life cosy and just relax. I think his personality is very similar to mine. The house is calm when it's just us. We want peace but we do say what we need. He's a sweetie and full of love. As for Zipnore, I really need to listen to my own advice today!

Going to make my S his burger then will repost and tell you all why I'm so frustrated tonight. Nothing major, just I'm in a nervous funk.



Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #127 on: November 02, 2019, 02:02:40 PM »
I do like the sound of your son, Milly.  :) ooh, and burgers sound good too lol.

By all means, get the funk out here...as my gran used to say, better out than in  ;)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline seahorse

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1034
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #128 on: November 02, 2019, 02:43:46 PM »
Enjoy your time with your son and enjoy your burgers!

Going to diner with my son as well for his 18th birthday today!

Fill us in when you can...  and ZIPNORE!

Sea
Seahorses have one mate for life...

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #129 on: November 02, 2019, 02:49:00 PM »
Sea! you posted as I was writing. Hope you're having the most wonderful dinner for your S's 18th! These sweet kids of ours. xx

Treasur, love your gran! Better out indeed! Well, I hope you're ready, cos I'm about to let it out.

So to tell you why I'm monkey braining tonight. S15 came back down from Milan this past Tuesday with me and will return up to Milan tomorrow (Sunday). So he's been home for almost 5 days.

S saw H the night we arrived back because we went to his house to get our dog, whom he'd been looking after. He was really nice that night and asked to see S the very next day. He did see S the next day to drive him to his tennis lesson but he was grumpy, tried to cancel on S, and tried to just dump him at his lesson and have me pick him up.

Since then H has texted S on and off. Thursday he asks S what he's doing on Friday, all saints. S says we're having a little party at night. H asks S what he's doing during the day and can they see each other. S says he needs to mow my lawn and did he want to help him. H says, he might help him and would let him know if he could. H did not come to do the lawn. S couldn't do it without his help.

 Yesterday, he asked S to go out to dinner with him tonight (Saturday night). Said was happy to. H had asked me a couple of days ago if he could use my car to spend time with S. I said yes. The problem is H reaching me or my car since he lives up a hill in the boonies and just has a bike. So yesterday H texts me asking if I was going to be in our old village today to meet me to use my car for S. I tell H that I'm having my hair done in my old village at lunch time today. H says he'll take the bus down from his hill and meet me. He then asks if he can use my car while I was at the hairdressers. I said yes but please put a little petrol in it. I imagine he was going to use it to do his grocery shopping and drive it back up to his house. H asks me if I'm going to park my car in my garage and if so can I leave the keys to my car locked up in the garage (he has a key to the garage) so he can get them. I said yes. The plan was for H to drive back to my house with me and then go out with S for the day and dinner. H then asked me if he could keep my car until tomorrow morning if I wasn't going to be going out, so he could get home after dinner. I said yes he could. So it was all organized as these texts were all happening this morning. I go to my hair appointment, park in my garage. Leave the car keys, go to the hairdressers and relax.

In the meantime, I have been trying to get S a train ticket to return to Milan tomorrow, but with the All Saints weekend, there were no seats available, not at 5am and not at 11pm. I almost managed to get S a seat on an 8.20am train tomorrow morning, H said he'd be willing to drive S to the station. I said great since it meant leaving my house at 7.30am. But then when the seat was no longer available, I spent a couple of hours on several sites trying to grab every last seat but nothing, every time I reached the credit card details, it said: Sorry, there is no availability at this time, choose a different time. In the end all the trains were fully booked.  I tell H this. He texts back and forth with a few suggestions and he says, S will have to go back up on Monday morning. So I book S a train seat for Monday morning in case they get booked up too.

Anyway, I'm almost finished at the hairdresser and I text H to ask if he's finished his stuff and where is he, as in will he be ready when I finish 20 minutes later. H tells me that he can't come because it was raining and he couldn't come on the bike. So I say that he'd said he was going to catch the bus. He says, 'Oh, yes, I missed the bus.' So I say 'are you not going to see S then?' H says: Now that he's leaving on Monday I can see him tomorrow.

I get home and S says that the ex champion says that S has to get back up tomorrow one way or the other, that he's to call other kids in the area and see if he can get a ride up with them or get on the bus and come up. So S is anxious not to upset the ex champion. I'm not annoyed as I like this serious attitude the ex champ has. To be honest, I should have booked S's ticket last week. I forgot it was a holiday weekend.

So S looks up the bus times and tells me there are only 5 seats left. I tell him to text the 2 kids from the academy who are from Tuscany and see if he can get a ride up. One is playing in Tunisia at the moment but the parents are going up tomorrow since there's a big open day at the school. I tell H about this. H says what are we going to do? I say the two solutions we're working on: bus and friend.

S asks H if he's going to see him since he'll be leaving tomorrow. H says that he'd wanted to see him but couldn't get to him since he doesn't have a car. Is it just me, or does this sound so lame?

H then stops texting. S and I concentrate on finding a ride up. S says there's only 1 place left on the bus, luckily at that moment the parents of the boy playing in Tunisia says S can go up with them. They are leaving at 6.45 from near Florence. Phew, sorted!

I send H a message to tell him we've resolved the problem. This is maybe around 7pm. I have noticed that since this morning H has been online non stop, I mean chain smoking on whatsap.

So tonight H says, if you want I can drive S to the meet up point tomorrow morning at 6.45am. I say ok but how will you get here? H says, I can cycle down or we can meet at a local village. As S says, cycle down at 4am in the pitch dark?

So I say to H, well at that point, I might as well drive S myself. I mean, if I have to get up and get dressed, I might as well have the pleasure of delivering S to the boy's parents. It's only a half hour away.

H writes back, that yes, I might as well drive S myself, since they've predicted rain for tomorrow morning. Just the thought that we might be relying on H to drive S and then he could come up with today's excuses again. So I was pleased with myself for ending the conversation with me driving S as I had organized.

About a half hour later, H texts: What if I drive up to Milan with S tomorrow? I don't know why but this feels so fishy to me. I answer that S is sorted now. The I say: you would drive up and down in a day? I was really just curious if he was thinking of using my car, or if he'd had a last minute plan where he was going to rent a car and drive to Milan (OW's 2nd city and where they met).

H says: 'No, I could go up with S in the boys parent's car and then come back down by train.'

I guess this just triggered me badly. I had visions of OW swirling round my head. H was looking for a free ride up to Milan so he could spend time with OW. Scumming off the back of S and the solution we'd managed to find for him. I know, I know, I should not presume, but H had 4 good days to see S, and he didn't. Today was a good way for him to spend a lot of time with S, but H changed his mind at the last minute. H has been online all day and all night. Then all of a sudden he's hopping up to Milan, OW city. I smell a rat.

I should have zipnored as I try to tell everyone else but it was soooo hard.

I replied that S was sorted now. H says 'But why can't I go too?' I ask S how he feels about it. S says: 'NOoooo! what now!' So I tell S: 'I'm going to tell Daddy that you are all organized now for tomorrow and would not feel comfortable with H being in the car with these people he doesn't know.' S said, yes, to say that. So I did. So H says: 'Why?' So I say that S just wants to go up by himself. H says: 'But there's an Open Day right?' So I say: 'You can go up another time on your own.' H starts typing and typing, I wait and wait. Then he stops. Then he just writes: 'Weird.'

What a drag. I guess it's all just MLC behaviour. If I take my MLC glasses off, I don't feel it helps right now. One minute he's all ready to spend the day with S, going to get my car to do his things, then drive to get S, and the next he's not available at all, probably missed the bus by being online with OW, can't be bothered to find a way to see S before he leaves, then finds a sneaky way to get himself a freebe ride up to see OW. Ugh, it made me mad again.

I guess I could have answered in a smarter, more indifferent way. I should have taken some time. Mind you, a year ago I would have said something much worse like: 'You didn't have any time to see S at all while he was here but all of a sudden you want to scrounge a ride up to Milan to go have your personal fun!' At least I didn't write that.

So I'm a bit angry on one side, but also relieved that I didn't make things much worse. I think I have to prepare myself for H going back into the tunnel for a while. If he needs to go back in, there is a reason. Me, I definitely need to take a few steps back. I don't know why, but I sense UM coming to give me a well needed 2x4.

I think I allowed myself to have some expectations. I guess this is a lesson. I need to detach, ignore, and go very dim for a while. I have quite a few nice things coming up in November, like D25 coming to visit and I need to focus on this and away from H. I fell into the MLCer hamster wheel trap.

When I finished my previous post I was still fuming, OW still under my skin. But an hour or so has passed and I have been sitting with S while he had dinner.

Just to tell you how S is growing as a person, too. When I was frustrated with H, I let it out in front of S but S stopped me. He said he didn't want to hear me say this about his dad. My S is having the courage to speak up about his feelings. He set a boundary with me. It stung, but it is a great thing. I was worried that my S with his gentle way and fear of fighting, would keep things in the way his dad did. If there's one good thing that came out of all this, is that my S can stand up for his needs in a constructive way.

So, S and I sat and watched the Supertennis channel where a young Italian tennis player who has just become N. 8 in the world, Matteo Berrettini, was being interviewed. The interviewer asked his dad how he felt yesterday when he learned that his son had qualified for the ATP final (top 10 only) in London next month. The dad said: We said to each other, but is this real? Is it really us this is happening to?' This was so sweet to hear. Just a regular kid from Rome with the same dream as all the others. It put S and I in a good mood.

I am so pleased to see how quickly I can cycle out of this crap. I'm almost ok now and ready for my new dim contact phase. I guess it gives me a sense of control that I can go dim, a little like the feeling you get when you stop eating even though you're hungry. But it's the only control I have and I know it will make me feel better.

Sorry for rambling, but you're the only ones I can vent this to.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Treasur

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8778
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #130 on: November 02, 2019, 03:00:51 PM »
Milly, au contraire dear girl, I think you and your son dealt with it perfectly.
Too much random confusion from the Man With A Bike.
The only blip is your ow assumptions which a) may or may not be true and b) old news anyway
Besides her great prize is a Man With A Bike....who tries to cadge free lifts with strangers...

Dim sounds good. I have an evil suspicion that your h now sees Milly as Milly Rent-A-Free-Car so probably time to kill that dead in its tracks. Man With A Bike needs to get his own car methinks....or get better at cycling in the rain lol
« Last Edit: November 02, 2019, 03:02:13 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline seahorse

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1034
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #131 on: November 02, 2019, 03:26:19 PM »
Treasur - I ditto your response.

Milly - just listening to his shenanigans, or shenanigan thoughts, makes me tired!
So glad that it worked out,. and sorry that you had a little trigger, but you handled it amazingly well.

Keep that detachment. have no expectations, zipnore...

Hugs.
Sea
Seahorses have one mate for life...

Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #132 on: November 02, 2019, 03:35:34 PM »
Treasur, hilarious! You made me laugh out loud! That is so good for me! The Man With A Bike and Milly Rent-a-free-car! You are soooo right, I'm going to stop that free rental business right away! Thanks for that!

Sea, thanks for your support, I can feel your kindness and it really helps.xx
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Offline Anon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 773
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #133 on: November 02, 2019, 06:13:59 PM »
Milly,,, your update is hilarious with the bike and all  ;D  Your h is really 'out there' right now and good for you for shutting down the 'rent-a-free-car'.  It will be interesting how he reacts now.  Monster? Vanisher? Or just more of the same MLC with the bad MLC clothes, the texting or What's Apping addiction.   It does seem though that he connects with you through the car.  Are you really ready to shut it down and risk no connection for now until he finds another way? 


Offline MillyTopic starterTopic starter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2783
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #134 on: November 03, 2019, 12:05:04 AM »
Good question, Anon! I'm not sure would be my answer. On a diet, starved, and a piece of chocolate cake is presented to me. Don't know if I would have the strength to say no. Let's wait and see how I handle the challenge. Not sure myself yet!

7.57am here on a Sunday morning. Left S at the parents who are driving him back up to the academy. The parents were lovely. I've never met them before but they said I can text them for anything, any questions. Their S has already been at the academy 4 years. He's the one at a tournament in Tunisia right now.

I'm having a coffee although I really would like to go back to sleep. I guess that's the Libra in me. Lying on the couch with doggie resting on my legs.
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

Online Couragedearheart

  • Trial Subscriber
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 316
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #135 on: November 03, 2019, 03:15:40 AM »
Milly,

May I make a suggestion? And this is not from a MLC perspective but rather from a custody perspective as I have been navigating that for 14 years.

Why make your H’s relationship with S your responsibility?

Either physically, mentally, or emotionally?

If you make it your responsibility than guess who’s going to take the blame when things don’t go to plan or there’s a disappointment, or it isn’t what S or H wanted or hoped it would be.

If my Ex wants to see S15...he will find a way.  That he doesn’t says volumes about him....and absolutely nothing about me. I left the door open, and repeatedly say “you will have as much of a relationship as you are willing to pursue” that’s on him. And then I stepped back.

S15 is mad, he’s furious and hurt and he says over and over “Ex COULD come if he wanted to, he always makes excuses.” Which is true.

but When I tried to facilitate it they were both mad at me.

It seems like a lot of work you could reasonably take off your plate.

If any of this helps feel free to use it, if it doesn’t than feel free to ignore it.
😊❤️
Me 36
H 36
S15
Wallower?
EA discovered 5/31/2019
BD May 31 2019
EA ongoing? 🤷‍♀️ (Who knows?)
“God allows us to feel the frailty of human love so we’ll appreciate the strength of his.” C.S. Lewis

Online Couragedearheart

  • Trial Subscriber
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 316
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #136 on: November 03, 2019, 03:19:34 AM »
Fwiw I really used to think it was terrible that s15 was mad and hurt. Now I see that the good part is S15 KNOWS he deserves and should expect better treatment and puts the blame where it should be on my Ex instead of internalizing it and believing it is a statement about his value and worth as a person.
Me 36
H 36
S15
Wallower?
EA discovered 5/31/2019
BD May 31 2019
EA ongoing? 🤷‍♀️ (Who knows?)
“God allows us to feel the frailty of human love so we’ll appreciate the strength of his.” C.S. Lewis

Offline Rising Phoenix

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1337
  • Gender: Female
  • Mlc- Cake eater for 3 yr now vanisher
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #137 on: November 03, 2019, 03:35:22 AM »
Hi milly, I think courage has a good idea there and one I have been trying. I find it frustrating trying. Stepping back is certainly less frustrating and I’m am there when my kids need to offload their frustration with their father. Their soft place to land. It has strengthened our already strong bond. Mum is there and mum is not going anywhere. I just listen. It took h 3 days to reply to son about pick up time today. H text this morn that pickup is 1 ish! Son was angry yest at no response re pick up. I just listened and said so we will be ready for when he arrives. Son hugged me which is a rare thing for my autistic son. Xx
« Last Edit: November 03, 2019, 03:37:55 AM by Rising Phoenix »
Me 51
H52
Married still, 22yrs
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

Online Couragedearheart

  • Trial Subscriber
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 316
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #138 on: November 03, 2019, 05:20:23 AM »
Rising,

Out of pain something precious. My heart is happy for you, I’m glad you got that hug. 😊
Me 36
H 36
S15
Wallower?
EA discovered 5/31/2019
BD May 31 2019
EA ongoing? 🤷‍♀️ (Who knows?)
“God allows us to feel the frailty of human love so we’ll appreciate the strength of his.” C.S. Lewis

Offline Shelly7435

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 851
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #139 on: November 03, 2019, 06:55:49 AM »
Sadly. My D18 is one that couldn’t handle things. It didnt matter what I said or didn’t say I was always wrong!! ..she chose x ..which x wanted all along.. i believe for the show of it.  D has pretty much told me to leave her alone... sadly I do.  She will see someday but the waiting kills me. I feel very unloved.
 
Milky: your h sadly isn’t thinking about S.. only himself..the part where he wants to ride up with s and friend.,, childish.   Besides if it’s such a good r with ow. He can figure out how to get there or she could come get him. What a child.

M 53
H 48
M 12 years; together 17 years
D18, S28
Summer 2014 - H wanted to runaway
9/14 I was diagnosed with Breast cancer
11/14 Surgery for BC..3 day after my father dies
11/14 BD 2 days after surgery. I have no passion for you.
2/15 moved out
Dated each other all year affection back on..
3/16 moved home
7/16 Diagnosed with Breast cancer again
8/16 No affection again. I knew something was wrong.
9/16 Another surgery for Breast Cancer
9/16 BD 11 days after surgery discovered -EA with much younger W from Work. That is over. I think he has meaningless flings. Work is his mistress
10/16 I filed for D (financial reasons)
10/16 I moved out.
10/16 Now off and on vanisher
5/17 Divorce final

Offline SteelSpine

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 329
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #140 on: November 03, 2019, 09:50:39 AM »
Hi Milly, I just loved how you compared what you said to your H today, with what you would have said a year ago. That is something to be proud of.

I think Courage is right about leaving H to manage his own relationship with S. Trying to scrounge the ride was lame, especially if it was ow-related, but maybe H was panicking because he realized he had wasted all the time he could have spent with S and was trying to squeeze it in somehow.   Who knows, who cares.  Weird - and that's right from the horses mouth ;D

Just something to ponder, but you could have said to H, when he texted about hitching a ride, "Aw, what a great idea that would have been, too bad there was only one spare seat in the car".

I have not been beyond using such tactics to derail ludicrous MLC schemes. ;)
me 55, H 51
S13, S9 & S9
M 1/98

7/16 - BD - PA - OW
Monster until 1/17
T&Gs until 8/18
No legal action

Offline Keep believing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1305
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #141 on: November 04, 2019, 12:57:38 AM »
"Why cant I go"  i laughed at this. It reminded me of when we all went  out (at sons military grad)  H yelled out  "I want chicken nuggets"   shocked me to the core   This is an 8 year old .Right?

Offline UrsaMajor

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 9369
  • Gender: Male
  • Live like they are never coming back
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #142 on: November 04, 2019, 02:53:16 AM »
Hi Milly,

No need for a 2x4 from me - you took a whack at yourself all on your own <snort>

One thing that needs to be kept in mind is that Man(?)-with-a-Bike DOES have a car IF he were to pay the fines and get insurance on it.... Milly's Car Share Service really DOES need to close its doors here but good. Let Bike Man man up, pay the fines , get his own insurance and get his car back on the road...

As for the rest between S and H, that is really up to H to either decide to really BE a father or pretend and it will then be up to S to decide if that is really what he wants out of his R with his "father."
Me - 56
xW - 49
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation
S - 12
D - 8
2 Dogs (1 each)
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

Offline Maleficent

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 291
  • Gender: Female
Re: 5 years since BD: Me galloping forward. My H different this year
« Reply #143 on: November 04, 2019, 05:47:08 AM »
Milly, I am just following along, with not much useful to add.  I think you are doing a brilliant job of maneuvering the latest encounters and challenges. Yes, the car does seem to be a symbol of communication.  What would you like the car to mean in the future?   Love the new word Zipnore
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk
Legal Disclaimer

The information contained within The Hero's Spouse website family (www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com, http://theherosspouse.com and associated subdomains), (collectively 'website') is provided as general information and is not intended to be a substitute for professional legal, medical or mental health advice or treatment for specific medical conditions. The Hero's Spouse cannot be held responsible for the use of the information provided. The Hero's Spouse recommends that you consult a trained medical or mental health professional before making any decision regarding treatment of yourself or others. The Hero's Spouse recommends that you consult a legal professional for specific legal advice.

Any information, stories, examples, articles, or testimonials on this website do not constitute a guarantee, or prediction regarding the outcome of an individual situation. Reading and/or posting at this website does not constitute a professional relationship between you and the website author, volunteer moderators or mentors or other community members. The moderators and mentors are peer-volunteers, and not functioning in a professional capacity and are therefore offering support and advice based solely upon their own experience and not upon legal, medical, or mental health training.