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Author Topic: Discussion Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8

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Discussion Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
OP: September 24, 2019, 12:10:40 PM
Previous thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10273.0

I will answer here since Thunder requested a new thread being started.


Apparently there is a school of neuroscience looking at the relationship between developmental trauma, the brain and psychotherapy. https://www.psychotherapy.net/interview/allan-schore-neuroscience-psychotherapy and https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2016/may/why-bad-experiences-are-remembered-out-context

There is. There is also neuropsychiatry, a far better type of psychiatry. The tendency here, and in other places, is for psychiatry to become diluted in neurology or even disappear. It will not happen overnight.



Because the environment acts upon inborn temperament, which differs in each of us.  Or there may be mitigating factors such as a grandparent or mentor who helps ‘right the boat.’


Or because the biology and neurobiology of each of us responds differently. Or because of several other things.

As for Freud - well he is not obsolete.  He died almost 100 years ago so his ideas are developed and superseded in some cases , but the UK NHS spends millions of its scarce resources on training therapists in Psychodynamic techniques which are still based very firmly on Freudian ideas.


Here he is. He was totally discarted. I was clear to say in my post that it was here. Here is not the UK, or the US. Fruedian ideas have no basis to hold on and cannot be proved. They were also made by a cocained addict.


If the UK still spends milions to train people on Freud's theories, I am not certain I would like to be seen by a UK therapist or psychiatrist.

Mlc people aren’t being diagnosed with c ptsd because they aren’t presented to be diagnosed.

Of course. But a HS member cannot diagnose them instead. It is wrong.


Of course most MLCers aren't diagnosed with CPTSD. 1-Because they would need to go to a psychiatrist first, 2-it is a newly recognized illness in the past couple years, 3-Since MLC is not a diagnosed illness itself, how do we know if MLCers have CPTSD?, 4-Even if an MLCer goes to a psychiatrist and gets a diagnosis, they are under on obligation to tell the LBS this. So saying that MLCers aren't diagnosed with CPTSD means nothing.

It was also PTSD and . PTSD is not a new illness. And indeed, no one can diagnose a person that was not seen by a professional. As it means nothing saying they do when you have never meet them. Can you not see how wrong and unethical it would, and would be even if the person was a professional?


... but if anyone uses red herrings like the above one about MLCers not being diagnosed with CPTSD, I will not respond

It is not a red hearing. No one, not even a professional, can say/claim someone, let alone an entire group of people, suffer from something they weren't diagnose with.

Remember, that is just LBSes who are aware of the abuse.

We are now accepting as fact what a third part, the LBS says/thinks? It is unethical to draw diagnose conclusions from it. It is unethical to diagnose people we never meet or spoke to, let alone us, lay people.

There is no lack of logic on my part. There is quite a lack of logic from some of you. Some of you are doing what not even a serious professional would do.

I am sorry if you guys cannot see and understand how profundly wrong and unethical it is.


I'm sorry your husband was beaten/torture by his father Goner, but please do not put his reality upon others.
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« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 12:21:58 PM by Anjae »
Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together. (Marilyn Monroe)

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#1: September 24, 2019, 09:23:50 PM
Attaching.... :)
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"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#2: October 02, 2019, 04:51:10 PM
This article explains a bit the neurobiology of the affair: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-fantasy-and-reality-of-an-affair_b_10417310?guccounter=1

"Because that part of your brain - your limbic system - hijacks any sensibility and rational thought when you are knee deep in the throws of an affair."

" Two primary parts of the brain are at work during an affair that extend to opposite ends of the spectrum and, unfortunately, don't work in unison. The limbic part of our brain holds all the emotions and functions outside of morality and good decision making that the neocortex - or the most developed part of our brain for working memory, impulsivity, executive functioning -- handles"

"An affair charges up your dopamine (neurotransmitter) to your reward system. It makes you feel alive and charged up! All you can see is this person."

"Soon you will find yourself breaking all of your rules and devaluing your 'values' that, at one time, felt so strong."

"During an affair, it's difficult to stay rational and hope that the part of your brain - the neocortex - steps in and takes over the limbic system that sends you on a constant roller coaster, leaves you emotionally and mentally exhausted, and feeling like there is no end in sight - the end that you want."

Not the normal article about the affair, but provides an insight to part of what goes on (there are million other things happening) in our brain when involded in an affair.
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#3: October 02, 2019, 11:28:04 PM
Not sure if fun or not, but this might be a good cause to get a massive water blaster, fill it with icycold water, and then give MLCr  a good run for the money  ;D   The bad news is that the effect lasts 30-60 minutes. 

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/aekz4a/truth-through-cold-water
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Together - 20½ Years, Married 19 Years
Me: 43, W: 41 (Acts 20-25) - a low energy live-in wallower
BD ("I don't love you"): Feb 2019, 
BD2 ("I don't want to fix this marriage."... I'm filing for D): May 2020
Kids (at time of BD): G19,G18,G14,G12,S5


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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#4: October 03, 2019, 05:12:52 AM
FROM THE UK TIMES

Mid-life crisis men need help, not mockery, says doctor

Jonathan Leake, Science Editor
May 5 2019, 12:01am, The Sunday Times
It has been suggested that a new medical speciality is needed to cover the years between paediatrics and geriatrics
It has been suggested that a new medical speciality is needed to cover the years between paediatrics and geriatrics

The middle-aged man who dumps his wife, buys a Porsche and starts wearing black T-shirts needs help, not mockery, according to one of Britain’s leading researchers on ageing.

“It’s time to stop trivialising the midlife crisis,” said Professor Mark Jackson of Exeter University.

He will tell the Royal Society next week that a new medical speciality is needed to cover the years between paediatrics and geriatrics. He suggests calling it mediatrics.

“The assumption is we get to 20 and stay much the same till we’re 60, but we don’t,” said Jackson.

The creeping realisation that we are “slowing down and becoming less attractive” can easily turn into a “depressive crisis” that can be hugely damaging to families and others affected.


“Many people can reach 40 and suddenly realise that all the success in relationships and jobs they once hoped for had not quite happened,” said Jackson, who is director of Exeter’s Wellcome centre for cultures and environments of health.

“You should be in your prime but never quite made it. Now you are slowing down and becoming less attractive,” he added. “The realisation looms that death is on the way and that makes many people try to reclaim some youth — for example by shagging someone younger.”

Hoping to boost lost self-esteem, some men resort to fast cars and faster women. Others become obsessed with cycling or Ironman events in the hope of reupholstering sagging physiques.

“There is a lot of research showing these strategies seldom make people any happier,” noted Jackson, 59, who said he managed to avoid having his own midlife crisis because of his expertise in the subject.

Less clear is how many women suffer similar crises and whether they respond in the same way.

Jackson argues that plenty of advice is available to children on what to expect when they reach puberty and where to turn at times of stress. Older people benefit from intensive research about dementia and other age-related ailments, but people in their forties and fifties are vulnerable to psychological pressures that often go unaddressed.

“My view is that just as we teach kids what to expect in puberty and adolescence, so we should teach adults what to expect in middle age — how difficult it can be and how to cope,” said Jackson. “It’s not your wife or husband that’s the problem — it’s in you.”

He said many marriages, after the seven-year itch, go through a second time of trouble at around 20 years.

“It’s the peak time for a crisis because your kids are adolescents, your parents are getting old and your job is a dead end or pressured. And you are losing your youth and fitness,” said Jackson.

He concluded: “If we prepared people for [midlife] rather than mocking them they might be far better able to cope.”
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#5: October 03, 2019, 01:31:26 PM
Not bad and a good idea, but I wonder how Dr Jackson wants to help the men (and women, women also have MLC) in MLC. Merely telling people it may happen and how the middle years can be will not cut it.

If his aim is only at 40 onwards many MLCers'crisis will be missed. Same if the focus is only on married people. Single, divorced (not MLC divorce) and widowed people have MLC.
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#6: October 09, 2019, 05:56:41 AM
I was just cleaning out some old documents on my hard drive and came across this thing that I had downloaded some years ago.

It is research into what kind of people "poach" others' mates, as well as the type of people who are ripe for poaching:

https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Karl_Grammer/publication/8646929_Patterns_and_universals_of_mate_poaching_across_53_nations_The_effects_of_sex_culture_and_personality_on_romantically_attracting_another_person's_partner/links/0fcfd505d4cf48267e000000/Patterns-and-universals-of-mate-poaching-across-53-nations-The-effects-of-sex-culture-and-personality-on-romantically-attracting-another-persons-partner.pdf

A caveat is that most of the research was done on college students. But it still may be of interest.

The one mystery to me is that I downloaded this file in 2008. I have no idea WHY I would have been downloading such an article back then!

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« Last Edit: October 09, 2019, 05:59:23 AM by Not Your Monkey »

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#7: October 30, 2019, 11:12:32 AM
This link takes you to a webpage with an audio recording (scroll down the page until you see it).   It's talking about affairs and affair recovery, not MLC per se, but it's excellent and it talks about a lot of MLC stuff without calling it that... anger, shame, monster, abandoning kids, fog, addiction to OW/OM, etc.    It's worth listening to: 

https://www.emotionalaffair.org/empower-sarah-interview/
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#8: November 08, 2019, 02:54:34 PM
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"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#9: November 08, 2019, 03:25:39 PM
The midlife crisis. A Jungian/personal reflection

https://medium.com/@iangrantchess/the-mid-life-crisis-a-jungian-personal-perspective-3b29f40b596a

The author seems a bit narcissistic doesn’t he?  I’m
Losing patience with the long term self absorbed, despite having been so for the last few years!
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#10: November 08, 2019, 03:53:08 PM
Quote
The author seems a bit narcissistic doesn’t he?  I’m
Losing patience with the long term self absorbed, despite having been so for the last few years!

I agree..how long does it take someone to find themselves? Shouldn't we all somehow have to face these questions? Then why don't we leave our spouses and families and show no remorse or concern or anything really for people who at one time mattered in their lives.

Did 35 years of one's life matter so little? That is is as though it no longer exists?

Too many questions for a Friday night.
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"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#11: November 20, 2019, 06:46:19 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66cYcSak6nE

The Power of Addiction and The Addiction of Power: Gabor Maté at TEDxRio+20

Terrific talk about why people are addicted and the effect of childhood "trauma" on the development of later addictions in life.
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"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#12: January 13, 2020, 08:02:09 AM
Very interesting article about the dark side of compartmentalization

https://richardnicastro.com/index.php/2019/03/05/the-dark-side-of-mental-compartmentalization/
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Me: 56 (when he left in April 2017)
MLCer: 57 (when he left in April 2017)
Together since: 1986
Married: No
Children:No
Begin of P`s MLC: around Spring 2010 with breaks inbetween when he behaved like his pre MLC self.
OW: YES , he`s living together with an old spinster who just happens to live up the road.
Animals: 1 doggie, belongs to both of us but MLCers has abandoned him too.

"Surrender to what is, let go of what was, have faith in what will be"

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#13: January 13, 2020, 08:22:10 AM
Nodding my head as I read this article about compartmentalization. Explains how one goes from being a moral and value orientated individual into this secret world.

Everything I read says it is not sustainable and that a break will occur but it seems like some can continue to live like this for decades
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"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#14: January 14, 2020, 03:22:19 AM
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Me- 47 at BD
MLC husband -45 at BD
1 daughter - 2 1/2 years at BD
BD 1 - January 6, 2018 moves out
November 2018 - moves back in for 1 month then leaves saying relationship over, wants a divorce then flies over last minute to be with OW on holiday.
BD 2 - OW confirmed December 14, 2018 - meeting up with her for holiday
BD3 - engaged to OW December 21, 2018
BD 4 - tells me he is moving back to home country on January 27, 2019. Gives me 5 days notice. His flight date is February 1, 2019.

I just want the money and him out of my life!

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#15: January 14, 2020, 03:38:27 AM
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-7883575/The-midlife-crisis-REAL-Study-finds-misery-maxes-47.html

Lol....well that might mean my xh is building up to his lowest point then  :)
Funny though how it is bang on with the usual MLC standard age which as I recall is mid 40s. There is something about that 'sandwich' time maybe between growing kids, aging parents and a feeling of less years in front of you than behind you maybe?
I was pretty happy at 47 as I recall.....but 53 sucked ha ha
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#16: January 24, 2020, 03:19:06 PM
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The more relaxed you are, the better you are at everything: the better you are with your loved ones, the better you are with your enemies, the better you are at your job, the better you are with yourself. - Bill Murray

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#17: February 04, 2020, 07:02:06 PM
Interesting article on The Making Of A Cheater, and how FOO issues are at the bottom of all of it.

https://rudd-o.com/archives/the-making-of-a-cheater
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Married April 1985
5 children
Bomb Drop April 2013
Thrown out of house August 2013
Affair discovered November 2013 (i guessed who)
Home December 3 2013
The Journey Of Reconciliation .. is for the brave .

Anger is like a candle in the wind ... it blows out the light of all reason.

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#18: February 04, 2020, 08:12:47 PM
Interesting article on The Making Of A Cheater, and how FOO issues are at the bottom of all of it.

https://rudd-o.com/archives/the-making-of-a-cheater

Wow.  And thank you.   :(
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M=51
W=47
D=8
BD Feb 17 Thinking of divorce
Atomic BD June 17 Spying revealed OM at work
Still home.  Threatened to leave several times and has asked me to leave about a dozen. 
Says divorce proceedings will start Jan 18.
She has scheduled mediation Feb 7,  2018
I moved out March 16, 2018
Several mediations, mostly instigated by me.  Foot dragging by STBXW.  Nothing filed. Yet.
5/2019 STBXW filed D behind my back despite signed agreement to mediate.
I retain attorney.
STBXW still hasn't told me and no further action.
Elephant in the room has been addressed.  No further action atm.  Weighing my options.
12/16/19  She files financial paperwork.  Divorce proceeding.

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#19: February 04, 2020, 08:19:48 PM
That was like looking directly at STBXW
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M=51
W=47
D=8
BD Feb 17 Thinking of divorce
Atomic BD June 17 Spying revealed OM at work
Still home.  Threatened to leave several times and has asked me to leave about a dozen. 
Says divorce proceedings will start Jan 18.
She has scheduled mediation Feb 7,  2018
I moved out March 16, 2018
Several mediations, mostly instigated by me.  Foot dragging by STBXW.  Nothing filed. Yet.
5/2019 STBXW filed D behind my back despite signed agreement to mediate.
I retain attorney.
STBXW still hasn't told me and no further action.
Elephant in the room has been addressed.  No further action atm.  Weighing my options.
12/16/19  She files financial paperwork.  Divorce proceeding.

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#20: February 05, 2020, 02:10:42 AM
That is almost my WW and her upbringing, dad was an abusive alcoholic and wasn’t really in the children’s lives unless he was yelling at them or hitting them or their mother, mother stayed for years and only moved out after my WW came to live with me when she was 17.
A friend of the family was sexually inappropriate with my WW when she was very young, I can’t remember how old she said she was, 10 - 13 maybe, she told her mum who didn’t believe her and told her to never say anything like that again. WW told me at the time she had never told anyone else except me.
So much of that article sounds like my WW.
Funny how she can forgive parents for all the $h!te when she was growing up but she blames me for her unhappiness and no forgiveness for me  ::) ;D
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#21: February 07, 2020, 07:34:59 AM
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/feb/02/im-a-psychotherapist-but-therapy-didnt-help-my-grief-bereavement

Article about grief and how therapy may not be helpful initially...she is a psychoanalyst and found myself nodding my head. reading this. Her grief was due to the death of her husband but many thoughts and feelings are similar to our own experiences.

Sometimes we are really hard on ourselves..."why do I still feel such a mess" kind of thinking....she mentions time and I think this is very true...you cannot rush through the process of grief....each individual is different, our situations and beliefs are different and the trauma that we have experienced is much deeper than we give it credit for.
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« Last Edit: February 07, 2020, 07:40:51 AM by xyzcf »
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#22: February 07, 2020, 03:46:55 PM
Very powerful! I guess I'm not surprised to learn that my memories are my downfall. But how do I forget 36 years of memories without my whole life becoming insignificant?
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#23: February 07, 2020, 04:13:47 PM
Good article. Similar to what I feel we go through, yet different, too. We experience what feels like a sudden death. Yet it's not final like death, so it's harder to put behind us. Time does work though. As I head towards 6 years since BD, can't believe it's been so long, the pain is very much less sharp. In fact, there is probably no pain, just a sadness for the lost opportunities. Time does work.
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Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#24: March 05, 2020, 04:58:09 PM
A Ted Talk called "The Other Side of Infidelity": 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBPmZJEsaAA

The speaker also wrote a book on the same topic: 
Treating Trauma from Sexual Betrayal: The Essential Tools for Healing - Skinner, Kevin
 
I haven't read the book, but I have watched the video and it's excellent,,,, and very relevant.
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"This too shall pass.  It might pass like a kidney stone but it will pass."
"Don’t blame a clown for acting like a clown.  Instead, ask yourself why you keep going to the circus."

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#25: March 06, 2020, 12:18:51 AM
Thanks for this suggestions, Anon. I shall check it out. Always looking for help in healing from infidelity.
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Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

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Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#26: March 06, 2020, 12:23:51 AM
Link about MLC signs that I thought might be worth logging here too just in case http://whatismidlifecrisis.blogspot.com/2013/07/signs-of-depression-in-mlc.html
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#27: March 11, 2020, 02:43:24 PM
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Married April 1985
5 children
Bomb Drop April 2013
Thrown out of house August 2013
Affair discovered November 2013 (i guessed who)
Home December 3 2013
The Journey Of Reconciliation .. is for the brave .

Anger is like a candle in the wind ... it blows out the light of all reason.

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Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#28: May 29, 2020, 02:52:07 PM
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"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

nah

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Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#29: May 30, 2020, 06:30:39 AM
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H-55
me-53
ow-31
married 1986
BD April 6 2013 day after family went out for sons birthday.
I packed his bags two days later...semi-vanisher
https://heneversaidaword.com

S
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#30: May 30, 2020, 06:51:29 AM
Nah - Interesting blog, and so insightful.
I've added it to my favorites to research further.
Probably really good for a newbie on the site.

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Seahorses have one mate for life...

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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#31: May 30, 2020, 07:07:34 AM
Great article, Nah.

Thanks for posting it.
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A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

D
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#32: May 30, 2020, 08:29:28 AM
I would say this is spot on for STBXW, as well.  We see this pattern repeated over and over, dont we?
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M=51
W=47
D=8
BD Feb 17 Thinking of divorce
Atomic BD June 17 Spying revealed OM at work
Still home.  Threatened to leave several times and has asked me to leave about a dozen. 
Says divorce proceedings will start Jan 18.
She has scheduled mediation Feb 7,  2018
I moved out March 16, 2018
Several mediations, mostly instigated by me.  Foot dragging by STBXW.  Nothing filed. Yet.
5/2019 STBXW filed D behind my back despite signed agreement to mediate.
I retain attorney.
STBXW still hasn't told me and no further action.
Elephant in the room has been addressed.  No further action atm.  Weighing my options.
12/16/19  She files financial paperwork.  Divorce proceeding.

M
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Re: Links/Blogs/Articles for us all to share 8
#33: May 30, 2020, 04:07:54 PM
Both these articles left a mark on me. Maybe it's due to my timeline, but reading these articles at the point I'm at, was really eyeopening. And it wasn't just about my H, although it certainly was him too, but other members of my family. It really tied up loose ends for me.
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Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

 

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