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Author Topic: My Story How did I get here?

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My Story How did I get here?
OP: December 27, 2019, 09:10:46 AM
Hi all this is my story.

I am 53 and wife is 51,  We have been married for 22 years and together for 26.  We have 2 sons aged 18 and 20.  I came home from a fishing trip on 9/29/19 to find the wife moved out of our family home and rented an apartment less than 3 miles away.  All I got was note on the counter consisting of 5 lines.  She had never nagged or complained about our relationship prior to this but I could sense that things were not right with her for the past year.  We never fought.  She has always bottled her feelings and we had a lack of communication in our relationship.  She was a great mother to the boys and we had just dropped off our youngest at college the previous month.  Her actions before and after the move lead me to believe she is in a MLC here are a few.

1. When I asked her why she left I get weird/different responses.
2. She has not offered to discuss anything about us other than telling me she needs time.
3. She has only confided in her sister and avoids friends who ask questions.
4. She just tells people/friends/coworkers we weren't getting along and have separated.
5. She has been on a circuit of fun attending sporting events, plays, movies, etc.
6. She called my sons at college to inform them that she had moved out telling them we weren't getting along.  Letting them think our split is mutual.
7. She works out a lot and has lost weight. (been going on for 6 months prior to move)
8. She has had cosmetic procedures including botox injections.  (this is not like her at all)
9. There is no physical or emotional affair taking place.


Not sure if shes in a MLC or is just a WAS.  I made mistakes at first but have been following the guidelines found here for the past month.  She is a devout catholic as am I and after she had a private meeting with our priest all he told me was it was the weirdest conversation he had ever had with a spouse in this situation.  Said she would not really talk about anything.  He was the one who initially suggested MLC.  I am currently doing much better and have gotten a ton of great information reading other people stories.  I am just confused about whether she is in a MLC or is suffering from some other issue and would like any and all opinions.  Our sons are devastated and have had limited contact with her through this.  They live with me when they are home from school on breaks.  They are worried about her as am I.  She says she is happy but how can this be true when our sons are hurting?  She has started to make more consistent contact with them but they elected to stay home with me for Christmas rather than travel with her for the day to visit her family.  Her mother and two sisters have all run from relationship problems before.  Her mother and younger sister have both divorced twice.

Any help appreciated.

HD



 
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Re: How did I get here?
#1: December 27, 2019, 10:03:40 AM
Hey HD,

Hmmmm... lots of  stuff in there. Learned behavior from family (running), empty nest syndrome, bottling up emotions........
She's probably very lost and confused.... asking herself if her value and purpose are all used up.
Sounds like she's searching for help or to escape aging..... talking to the priest, getting in shape, botox,  etc.
Worried about being the bad guy...... making it sound mutual... she knows it isn't.
Leaving a letter...... not facing you is guilt.
The shadow/Pre-BD sounds spot on...... getting ready to escape to some fantasy reality.

She'll need time and space, try not to let yourself take it personal. It really isn't.

Hang in there,
She'll go away for a bit, and as she feels safe will stick her head back into your life. That's when your openings will start for communicating, and that's somewhere you will need to shine when she comes looking. Communication was bad, and she'll be thinking about that. You're going to have to show that it's different, constantly. You will get your chance in that area when she's ready.
This is the time to fix you, and improve. No being weak while she's going thru this period. She will act strong and happy but won't be on the inside. She will be attracted to strength, and that needs to be you. If there was genuine things she had identified in the past (about you), now is the time to deal with them. Since she moved out, when she does see you again (or drops in) it needs to be a "wow" moment for her while still being familiar (and totally safe).


You got this, you can do it, you can succeed.

-SS
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Re: How did I get here?
#2: December 27, 2019, 10:59:24 AM
Welcome Hoosier,

I'm sorry you are going though this, but you found a good place with people who will support you, and understand what you are going through.  You're not alone.

From everything you said , she pretty much ticked all the boxes for a MLC.  Unless she is going through menopause, they seem to act about the same sometimes.  My mom went though it for a few years, then slowly came out of it when her hormones settled down.

But it really doesn't matter what the reason is, she left and wants space.  All you can do is give it to her.  When you do talk to her I would stay away from any relationship talks or questions.  It will just be pressure to her and she has no answers for you anyway.  She pretty confused right now.

Standing is right, try not to take anything personal, it really has nothing to do with you or your marriage.  You didn't break her and you can't fix this.  She has to figure this out by herself.

If you saw problems in your marriage it would be a good idea to do a little mirror work.  Just to better yourself, not to win her back.  Do it for yourself. 
I'm glad the boys are with you.  They need one sane parent right now.

This is not going to be easy, but you need to put yourself first now and live your life.  IF she comes back it will take a long time.  Some do, some don't so don't put your life on hold.  She won't.

Are you ok, financially?  If you are just be sure to protect your finances.

Keep posting and reading.  There's usually always someone around.
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Re: How did I get here?
#3: December 27, 2019, 11:29:12 AM
Hoosier -
Attaching...
Welcome and you've gotten great advice from two great people already.
Old Pilot will come along and give you articles, etc.

We are here for you so read, read, read, post, post, post and work on yourself to be the best version of you possible.

I'm sorry you're going through this, but you're in good company.

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Re: How did I get here?
#4: December 27, 2019, 11:46:44 AM
Welcome to the Board

You are in a good place.
Your H/W  is on his/her own journey.
You can not do anything to control this trip.
Come here and read or vent, we will listen.
Give your H/W space  he/she needs to heal himself/herself.

I would not ask him/her anything unless you can have no expectations.
Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure.
You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H/W as controlling or pressure.

Your need to start working on you.
There is nothing that you can do to help your H/W.

He/She has given you a gift.
It is time!!

Use the time wisely to make yourself a better person.
Look in the mirror to see what it is that you can improve.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
GAL.

Read some books on depression. Both for yourself! And for H/W.
Believe none of what he/she says and 50% of what he/she does.

Read the resources from this site.
The links that are in my signature.

Detach. - The single most important thing you can do

The detach link and HB's 6 stages of MLC(rewritten from Jim Conway) located in the resources above.
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=4.msg380#msg380

Developing Detachment
http://jamesjmessina.com/toolsforcontrolissues/developdetachment.html

http://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/self-focus_releasers_detach.html

http://www.livestrong.com/article/14712-developing-detachment/

RCR has asked everyone to keep to one thread until  that thread is 150 posts

Keep posting and asking questions and we will try to answer them.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
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Re: How did I get here?
#5: December 27, 2019, 12:28:35 PM
Hoosier,

So sorry you are here, your spouse sounds fairly classic MLC. Unfortunately this typically comes with an OM, I know you don’t believe one is in the picture right now, but please prepare yourself that this is quite likely happening - your W will do things you never ever imagined. I got sooo angry when people would suggest my H was having an affair - he would NEVER do something like that - turns out he was having affairs with not one but 2 of my girlfriends as well as hook ups from online apps, Asian massage parlor prostitution etc. I was absolutely stunned and baffled - within a couple of weeks after BD, when I repeatedly asked him if he was having an affair he told me “absolutely not” more times than I can count as well as “if either one of us has an affair it would be a deal breaker” - I am not trying to give you more heart ache - I do believe had I listened to well meaning friends, I may have detached more quickly and protected our family finances differently - that six months cost me at least $30k, plus the traumas kept coming as secrets and lies revealed constantly over the first year...

I wish you some peace. Take deep breaths, go for walks, your mind is likely reeling, find a couple of friends you can confide i in RO, and take care of you and your kids.

3Boys
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Re: How did I get here?
#6: December 27, 2019, 12:49:11 PM
She definitely sounds like she's having a MLC. Sometimes they do things rather abruptly, like moving out without telling anyone or having a BD. As others have stated, there isn't much you can do right now but take care of yourself and be prepared for an OM to surface at some point. No one wants to believe their spouse is having an affair at first but they're very common for MLCers.
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Re: How did I get here?
#7: December 27, 2019, 03:02:46 PM
It's now 2 days past Christmas and she hasn't even attempted to contact our sons.  We last saw her Christmas eve when we attended church together as a family and gave her gifts afterward.  When the boys are in town she always invites us to attend mass with her.  She typically acts like everything is fine and even goes out with us for dinner afterward.  Some people at church know the current situation but most don't.  Is this typical behavior?  When the boys are at school she will not sit with me and typically tries to attend a service that she knows I don't typically attend.

HD



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Re: How did I get here?
#8: December 27, 2019, 03:09:12 PM
HD -
I believe that that is pretty typical MLCer behavior.
She doesn't want to be with you, be seem with you, etc.

FWIW - It's good that the's still going to church, imo.
So often, they turn from God and their beliefs as well as their family.

Keep praying.  God listens.

Sea
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Re: How did I get here?
#9: December 27, 2019, 03:14:09 PM

This is not going to be easy, but you need to put yourself first now and live your life.  IF she comes back it will take a long time.  Some do, some don't so don't put your life on hold.  She won't.


I'm sorry you are going through this HD, but I hope you will find some wisdom and encouragement here that will help you. 

Thunder has been here for awhile now and has given you some very good advice.  Use what you think pertains to you and your situation. 

I quoted four of her sentences that applied to me when the bomb drop hit me in 2016. 

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Re: How did I get here?
#10: December 27, 2019, 03:56:08 PM
Hi Hoosier,

How does this happen, without warning, without a conversation, without trying to get therapy and work on sorting out what needs sorting...how does this happen as we have knelt together at mass..in my marriage, for 32 years.

Our priest talked to my husband as well...our priest comment to me as he shook his head, that there was a disconnect between my husband's head and his heart.

I still see my husband, it's been 10 years since he sent me away. I think, based upon our latest contact is that he is still in crisis. He appears normal, seems to function well...but something is missing in him...something that once was.

He is still receiving the Eucharist. Still attends mass.

Sometimes it did not feel like there was a lot of support or understanding that I continue to love him and continue to remain faithful to the Sacrament of Marriage. God and I talk a great deal about this.

Here is one resource you might find helpful:
The Gift of Self: A Spiritual Companion for Separated and Divorced Faithful to the Sacrament of Marriage Paperback – July 1, 2015
by Maria Pia Campanella

They also have a monthly conference call. I used to participate but it's been a long time since I did so.

The other resource that I have found incredibly helpful is Rejoice Ministries.
  https://www.rejoiceministries.org/devotions/charlyne_cares/

They have daily devotionals and there is also a Saturday devotional that you can explore written by men.

Some of my Catholic friends encourage me to get an annulment. I disagree. There was nothing in our marriage that would have given cause to it's invalidity, although these days there are many annulments granted quite easily.

This hurts so terribly, it takes it's toil on us and we have to take very good care of ourselves, physically, emotionally and spiritually. If you priest identified it as MLC, then you have a very good person to confide in.

I am blessed that our priests have been amazing with me.

Take care, pray, ask Our Mother to intercede.

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" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: How did I get here?
#11: December 27, 2019, 05:43:24 PM
It's now 2 days past Christmas and she hasn't even attempted to contact our sons.  We last saw her Christmas eve when we attended church together as a family and gave her gifts afterward.  When the boys are in town she always invites us to attend mass with her.  She typically acts like everything is fine and even goes out with us for dinner afterward.  Some people at church know the current situation but most don't.  Is this typical behavior?  When the boys are at school she will not sit with me and typically tries to attend a service that she knows I don't typically attend.

HD

Very very common HD..... actually more than likely it will be the norm for a long time. The MLC'er tries to keep up appearances as best they can.... not for you, not for the kids..... so that everyone thinks all is swell and dandy. It's like those fake people on Facebook, trying to make their lives look so wonderful and they are just a disaster in real life. That's the MLC'er, but they apply the same principle to their whole life.

Hang in there, you're on the way.

-SS
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Re: How did I get here?
#12: December 28, 2019, 05:05:09 AM
HD -
I believe that that is pretty typical MLCer behavior.
She doesn't want to be with you, be seem with you, etc.

FWIW - It's good that the's still going to church, imo.
So often, they turn from God and their beliefs as well as their family.

Keep praying.  God listens.

Sea


Yes,

Her faith has not faltered through this fortunately.  Her twitter page is full of spiritual messages.  I am glad for this but it kind of makes it seem that she is really struggling to find herself.  I am preparing myself for her to find an OM soon.  I will have to accept this because it seems that this needs to happen for her to progress to the next stages.

HD
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Re: How did I get here?
#13: December 28, 2019, 07:20:03 AM
Yes Hoosier, they do tend to find someone else when their in this state of mind, but not all of them do.
I would just prepare for it, like you said, so you're not blindsided.  They do lie a lot.  Oh my goodness some lie over the most ridiculous things.

I hope maybe her faith will help her through this without getting too crazy.

Just take good care of yourself, Hoosier.
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A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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Re: How did I get here?
#14: December 28, 2019, 07:40:51 AM
Ditto what Thunder said.

AND - you never know because sometimes the "other person" is also a "valued member" of the church, so...

Just guard your heart, listen to God.

Sea
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Re: How did I get here?
#15: December 28, 2019, 11:55:54 AM
So she stopped by the house today to drop of Christmas gifts for our sons and to let me replace a fog light on her car.  She included a short note in their cards trying to explain to them why she left.  My oldest son read his to me.  It basically said she was sorry that she made him sad but she left because she felt that I did not care about her the past several years and she couldn't go on pretending that everything was ok anymore.  Said she hopes to find someone in the future that cares about her.  He wants to respond to her telling her that she and I should of talked about our feelings toward each other rather than pretending all was good.  Should I let him or would that be a bad idea? We don't want to make matters worse.  Any guidance on this would be appreciated.

HD
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Re: How did I get here?
#16: December 28, 2019, 12:09:47 PM
HD -
I would let your son speak his heart.
From him -- not from you.

That's my opinion.
Out of the mouth of babes...

Sea
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Re: How did I get here?
#17: December 28, 2019, 12:38:40 PM
In my experience, your son needs to figure out his own relationship with his mother. As long as he knows that what she wrote is her interpretation and that you had no idea she felt that way, let him have whatever conversation he needs to have. The only thing older children need is to know both her position and yours, from as close to a factual point of view as you can get. My kids were told to lie to me by their father. When I found out, I told them they got to choose what they do, but it's really screwed up when someone tells you to lie to another and that I was upset that they decided not to tell me the truth. I asked "why is what he wants more important than what I want?" It didn't ruin my relationship, in fact made it stronger and made them think about how their actions affect others.

Btw, her saying "you didn't care about her" is the same garbage I got. Your wife has no idea whether you cared about her or not, because she did not bother to express her feelings and find out from YOU  how you actually felt. Imo, she does not care for herself and projects that onto you. Ie, if I feel this way it must be true, so he must feel this way.
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Re: How did I get here?
#18: December 28, 2019, 07:38:33 PM
So she stopped by the house today to drop of Christmas gifts for our sons and to let me replace a fog light on her car.  She included a short note in their cards trying to explain to them why she left.  My oldest son read his to me.  It basically said she was sorry that she made him sad but she left because she felt that I did not care about her the past several years and she couldn't go on pretending that everything was ok anymore.  Said she hopes to find someone in the future that cares about her.  He wants to respond to her telling her that she and I should of talked about our feelings toward each other rather than pretending all was good.  Should I let him or would that be a bad idea? We don't want to make matters worse.  Any guidance on this would be appreciated.

HD


I forgot to add that his mom told him he could not open the card till after she left.
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Re: How did I get here?
#19: December 29, 2019, 03:54:47 AM
I'm sorry she choose to do this.  Seems to be a pretty cruel thing to do at Christmas.

But then it is all about her, isn't it?   ::)

I agree, I would allow your son to say what he feels and I hope you don't take this personal.  They get so strange when their in this crisis.
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A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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Re: How did I get here?
#20: December 29, 2019, 04:50:00 AM
I'd say too that the whole letter/note thing is very typical: Not wanting to be responsible or allow others to give feedback about what they're doing. Very typical. Can't allow any guilt, but the need to justify is so strong (often silently or one-wayish).

I think you'll get to a point on that which changes from outrage or shock to one of just shaking your head..... or laughing.

-SS
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Re: How did I get here?
#21: December 29, 2019, 06:11:13 AM
I'd say too that the whole letter/note thing is very typical: Not wanting to be responsible or allow others to give feedback about what they're doing. Very typical. Can't allow any guilt, but the need to justify is so strong (often silently or one-wayish).

I think you'll get to a point on that which changes from outrage or shock to one of just shaking your head..... or laughing.

-SS

No outrage here I'm just shaking my head.  I feel sorry for her and guilt that I can not do anything to help her.
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Re: How did I get here?
#22: December 29, 2019, 06:19:08 AM
Yes I did too Hoosier.

I know this was not my H in his right mind.  We were together for many years and he never had a selfish bone in his body.  Always a very kind man.

It's terrible what happens to them.  No one chooses to have a midlife crisis.
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A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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Re: How did I get here?
#23: December 29, 2019, 07:20:16 AM
I'd say too that the whole letter/note thing is very typical: Not wanting to be responsible or allow others to give feedback about what they're doing. Very typical. Can't allow any guilt, but the need to justify is so strong (often silently or one-wayish).

I think you'll get to a point on that which changes from outrage or shock to one of just shaking your head..... or laughing.

-SS

No outrage here I'm just shaking my head.  I feel sorry for her and guilt that I can not do anything to help her.

You are right that you can't help her until or unless she starts to help herself.
Please don't feel guilty, my friend. This is her creation.
And, worth pointing out a bit of reality too in case you missed it...
Her justification is that you didn't really care about her...but she knew you'd care enough to fix her fog light.
And her justification that you didn't care about her....has nothing to do with her choice to not see her young adult sons over Christmas, ask them how they are feeling and try to have a respectful honest loving conversation with them as their mother instead of a hit and run Mrs Sadz self pity card with control rules about when they could open it.
I hope you can see that.
It's important not to let their gaslighting justifications become our truth.

And your son should speak his truth as he sees fit without fear bc after all, if he does not, how can he ever have a mutually respectful independent relationship with her? But it must be his choice and his feelings not yours imho.
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Re: How did I get here?
#24: December 29, 2019, 08:06:56 AM
HD, welcome to the unthinkable.   Where everything you ever thought you knew about your (ex) spouse will become a questionable lie.  You've been given lots of good, solid advice to this point, so I don't have much more to really add.

I do think that her adding that she's hopes to find someone who cares for her is just a guilty segue into the OM making his "sudden" appearance,  unfortunately.   And, the fact that she enforced the timing of them reading this just screams of control and cowardice.....two things the MLC'er doles out in spades.  She's got a lot to say in her defense, but she sure isn't going to stick around to hear anything that will deflate the fantasy bubble.  Mlc or whatever, she's got some issues.
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Re: How did I get here?
#25: December 29, 2019, 08:49:14 AM
Hi Hoosier,

How does this happen, without warning, without a conversation, without trying to get therapy and work on sorting out what needs sorting...how does this happen as we have knelt together at mass..in my marriage, for 32 years.

Our priest talked to my husband as well...our priest comment to me as he shook his head, that there was a disconnect between my husband's head and his heart.

I still see my husband, it's been 10 years since he sent me away. I think, based upon our latest contact is that he is still in crisis. He appears normal, seems to function well...but something is missing in him...something that once was.

He is still receiving the Eucharist. Still attends mass.

Sometimes it did not feel like there was a lot of support or understanding that I continue to love him and continue to remain faithful to the Sacrament of Marriage. God and I talk a great deal about this.

Here is one resource you might find helpful:
The Gift of Self: A Spiritual Companion for Separated and Divorced Faithful to the Sacrament of Marriage Paperback – July 1, 2015
by Maria Pia Campanella

They also have a monthly conference call. I used to participate but it's been a long time since I did so.

The other resource that I have found incredibly helpful is Rejoice Ministries.

They have daily devotionals and there is also a Saturday devotional that you can explore written by men.

Some of my Catholic friends encourage me to get an annulment. I disagree. There was nothing in our marriage that would have given cause to it's invalidity, although these days there are many annulments granted quite easily.

This hurts so terribly, it takes it's toil on us and we have to take very good care of ourselves, physically, emotionally and spiritually. If you priest identified it as MLC, then you have a very good person to confide in.

I am blessed that our priests have been amazing with me.

Take care, pray, ask Our Mother to intercede.


We went to mass together again last night.  She asked if me and the boys were going and I told her yes and she was welcome to join us.  This week was the feast of the holy family - how ironic.  The homily was about relationships and how they define ones true happiness.  Priest went on to bless all families including those in estrangement and divorced.  I had to hold back my tears and remain strong.  I glanced over at her and she just had a stoic look on her face showing no emotion. SMH.  After mass she asked if we were going out for dinner which we were so we invited her along.  We had a nice time and good conversation.  Should I have said no and not invited her to either?  Am I breaking the rules of detachment?  It seemed the right thing to do but I don't know.  Much confusion in my head these days.

HD
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Re: How did I get here?
#26: December 29, 2019, 09:02:00 AM
No HD, you did the right thing.

Detachment is about keeping your emotions in check, not brushing them off. Inviting her was the right thing to do. It shows that she is welcome, loved, and wanted. They need that, and to feel not judged.
Many of them feel like they are discovering themselves (not sure if yours falls into this category) and the need to feel welcome is very important.... otherwise they run to find welcome elsewhere.

You did good. The service was also a good thing in that a message was sent to her by someone who isn't you. Very good.

That she's asking to be included is also very good.

Go slow, be gentle, be strong. Love, empathy, patience, support.

If she opens up and starts talking about her feelings openly (which she may), same rules: Listen, don't judge (no matter what), empathize, congratulate good things and behaviors, and above all listen with undivided attention. Tell her the good things you like and admire about her (honestly). She will likely want to know more about this. Be honest and real, but don't push or apply pressure or expectations. Gentle. This is how you win a new trust, and gain value in her eyes (as a trusted friend).

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Re: How did I get here?
#27: December 29, 2019, 09:17:41 AM
HD
Don't worry about feeling confused. It's a confusing situation and how you feel is normal.
And don't worry about any 'rules' of anything.
There are none bc this isn't a situation where you slot A into piece B like that.

Detachment is for you. To reduce the damage to you and to enable you to choose your responses rather than react based on how you feel.
If dinner didn't cost too much emotionally or lead you to have inappropriate expectations, no biggie. Kindness and respect is only a bad thing if it damages you or your sons bc folks in crisis are given to take an inch and turn it into a self-serving mile without respect for anyone else.

Time will show you more about what is going on and what you can or can't do with your w, or indeed if this is an MLC situation or one in which she is open to you acting as a friend in any way as Standing describes.

My honest belief is that if your spouse is in crisis, very little you do will influence them positively. A common newbie way of thinking - and we all did it - is to believe we can nice them back and to worry that detaching ourselves from them and their crisis will push them further away. That rarely seems to be so bc normal 'rules' no longer apply.

If it is important to you to treat your w with some basic civility and kindness, and you can do so without making life worse for you, imho nothing wrong with that. That is about who you are not who she is right now...but it can be hard to do without having expectations.

But detachment is for you, to gradually unhook yourself from whatever rollercoaster she is riding and to be able to focus on putting you and your son's needs first when your w will not. It is not easy after a long marriage and family life....which is why the church theme was moving for you...but you will learn through trial and error what works best for you in your situation. And all of us struggle with it and doubt ourselves and make some mistakes along the way. In this instance, it sounds as if church and dinner were both fine and without drama or distress. Some wives, and I think more wives seem to do it than husbands perhaps, do seem to want an appearance of family life even when they are saying they no longer want to be part of that family as they were....you'll see it referred to as cake-eating here....sometimes it is just part of their story that everyone will be fine and what they are doing is no big deal, sometimes it is a bit of denying the real consequences perhaps, sometimes a kind of reassurance and sometimes simply wanting the good stuff without the responsibility. Time will tell if this is a pattern with your w and what you can safely afford to offer while looking after yourself.
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« Last Edit: December 29, 2019, 09:21:28 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: How did I get here?
#28: December 29, 2019, 10:35:02 AM
Good morning Hoosier,

I just came from Mass....Our priest asked us to focus on each of the three individuals of the Holy family, Jesus, Mary and Joseph and went on to talk about their obedience to God, Mary's fiat, Joseph taking her as his wife even though she was pregnant, Christ's "I came to do the will of the one who sent me"...all obedient to Our Lord.

Going to mass with your wife and as a family is in a whole different league than whether you are detached or not. It is mass. Absolutely no reason not to go together, pray together and be blessed together. Going out to dinner together is also a way of showing unconditional and agape love.

As an LBSer, I have to put aside my wants/needs and desires as long as he is in crisis. Both because God has asked me to and because my Beloved will remember that I shown him kindness regardless of what he has done.

The readings today: Saint Paul to the Colossians 3:12-21...."Put on, as God's chosen ones, holy and beloved, heartfelt compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience, bearing with one another and forgiving one another , if one has a grievance against you; as the Lord has forgiven you, so must you also do.......Husbands. love your wives and avoid any bitterness towards them"

Pretty well sums it up..if I am going to live a Christian life than I must try to live as Christ asked..."Love one another as I have loved you".

Don't worry that by "allowing" her to be a part of your family life that somehow this is "wrong". It truly is not.

God bless you and your family on this feast of the Holy Family.
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« Last Edit: December 29, 2019, 10:36:20 AM by xyzcf »
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: How did I get here?
#29: December 29, 2019, 12:26:26 PM
I kind of agree with xyzcf apart from what she says about her choice to put her needs to one side for a spouse in crisis.
It is her choice and her right to make.
And bc xyzcf is a wise woman as well as a grace-filled one, I am going to assume that she doesn't mean that her needs don't matter at all but that she has found a balance between these things.

I don't think God wants any of us to be a sacrificial lamb on the altar of someone else's crisis.
I think we matter just as much to Him as our spouses do.
And for all I know, the loss of my attachment to my former h may be necessary for my xh's path to healing that God can see and I can't. But I am pretty sure that God thinks I matter just as much as my xh does.

And I think he knows that we are human and we have limitations even with his guidance.
I think he wants us to treat ourselves with love and compassion too as well as doing our best to treat others that way. He wants us to be whole and healthy, all of us. But sometimes I think he knows that we need to carry our own load and hand some things over to him bc they are above our paygrade lol.
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: How did I get here?
#30: December 29, 2019, 12:58:26 PM
Just to clarify, yes our needs matter and I have had to find other ways to have those needs met. My husband, while in crisis cannot met them.

I do not expect him to. If we ever reconcile, certainly that would be different than now.

Yes as a friend once told me, God loves me immensely. When I think of His love for me it is beyond imaginable.

As the Divine Mercy picture expresses  “Jesus I trust in you.”

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« Last Edit: December 29, 2019, 01:04:00 PM by xyzcf »
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: How did I get here?
#31: December 29, 2019, 01:08:15 PM
Ah, good to know that I didn't misinterpret you, dear xyzcf  :)
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: How did I get here?
#32: December 30, 2019, 06:25:39 AM
I spent a lot of time reading other posters journey's this weekend.  It has been enlightening to say the least.  It has also generated many questions.  A lot of posters talk about their spouses monstering.  I have not seen this from my wife.  Why is this?  She has always been a peaceful non confrontational person who is shy and introverted to a degree.  Does this not change during the MLC?  Sometimes it makes me question weather she is even in one and that maybe I was just not a good husband.  My sons tell me otherwise but sometimes doubt creeps.  Even early on when I called her to apologize for snooping through phone records and emails she just said "I'm glad you told me - I want to move my phone to a personal plan"  I met her at the phone store and helped her with this and she was appreciative.  I spent a ton of time looking for answers at first and found nothing.  I am an engineer so my need for facts and logic when looking at this situation have not been met.  Luckily I am a very patient person so I am prepared to stand for a long time.

When people ask me whats going on with us what should I say?  Should I tell them she left me and is potentially having a MLC?  Should I lie?  She is good about seeming normal to everyone but me and the boys.  Sometimes I worry that other people will think I did something terrible to her to cause this.

HD
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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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Re: How did I get here?
#33: December 30, 2019, 06:43:26 AM
So she stopped by the house today to drop of Christmas gifts for our sons and to let me replace a fog light on her car.  She included a short note in their cards trying to explain to them why she left.  My oldest son read his to me.  It basically said she was sorry that she made him sad but she left because she felt that I did not care about her the past several years and she couldn't go on pretending that everything was ok anymore.  Said she hopes to find someone in the future that cares about her.  He wants to respond to her telling her that she and I should of talked about our feelings toward each other rather than pretending all was good.  Should I let him or would that be a bad idea? We don't want to make matters worse.  Any guidance on this would be appreciated.

HD


I forgot to add that his mom told him he could not open the card till after she left.

I read the note again last night.  The last line said - "you can always call me anytime you need to talk" -  WTF.  Talk about what?  The weather?  Doubt she will ever talk to him about this.   
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Re: How did I get here?
#34: December 30, 2019, 06:50:57 AM
Not all MLCer's "monster". My husband has been angry and reactive, but he did not "monster" at me. Other MLCers have  been physically abusive and threatened their spouses lives.  There are many "differences" in how the crisis manifests.

The questions that people ask can be difficult to respond to. Prior to BD, I thought that when people separated or divorced, that surely it must be because they had been having difficulties and that it was somewhat mutual. I too think that people look at me (because he is such a "good guy" and very highly thought of, and feel that I must have been responsible for leaving, or that we both agreed ...which is not the case...I am pretty sure he tells people that I am fine with this and we are "friends".

Some people will look at you as though you have 2 heads if you try and explain MLC, while others know of people who have been through this, or have been through this themselves. A few people, even if they do not understand, will support you.

It is normal to question if this is a MLC or not. For me, the suddenness of BD, the change in his personality, the unpredictability of his actions...all point to his being in a crisis. It is hard not to question this though.
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« Last Edit: December 30, 2019, 06:52:38 AM by xyzcf »
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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Re: How did I get here?
#35: December 30, 2019, 06:55:02 AM
HD, fwiw not all MLC spouses directly 'monster'....my xh was a silent vanisher so actually didn't monster much directly more by passively ignoring me tbh, but did start spewing rage and self pitying blame at me towards the end of the divorce HE wanted  ::)...and some don't until the LBS starts saying no or establishing some boundaries that they don't much like. And if MLC is a kind of depression with added excitement and go slower stripes, there do seem to be some gender differences in how depression shows itself sometimes.

The good news. Monster is awful so be grateful to not have that in your face maybe?

Reading between the lines I think you are really asking two other questions perhaps.
How do I know this is MLC? (And an underpinning question is probably what it means to you if it is or it isn't)
How can I influence what other people think about it/me?

I have exactly no magic answers at all lol
But I can reassure you that the questions are normal if that helps.
Trusting your own eyes and instinct and judgment helps.
Accepting that if it is MLC, the 'not normal' stuff will probably get worse and will show up as time unfolds events no matter what you do or say. And will keep going after a divorce too. Easier to see the WTF stuff for what it is when you are looking from slightly further away probably. Or the stuff that is logically nothing to do with you or your marriage at all like how she behaves towards your sons.

And to work out why it matters if it is MLC or not to you.

And what others think? Well, many folks in RL don't get MLC and may think you are just in denial. Although sometimes people surprise you and share their own experiences of depression, addiction or MLC type crises. Your w may be spinning all kinds of stories and you can't control that. And you can't control what other people think about you either. Find your own short phrase maybe that feels close enough to the truth without going into mega-detail e.g. 'My w decided that she didn't want to be married anymore' or in my case, if asked, I say something like 'my h was diagnosed with depression and decided he wanted a new life without me' or even 'I don't know but it was my w's choice'. Trust that those who know you best will know what is real and who you are. Jmo.
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« Last Edit: December 30, 2019, 06:59:14 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: How did I get here?
#36: December 30, 2019, 08:21:26 AM
Hoosier,

I like those short, to the point suggestions from Treasur.  No need for a long dragged out explanation.

Just remember Standing is not still.  You still need to live your live as best you can.  They will be living theirs, such as it is.  Make plans with family or friends to get you out of the house for awhile.  Even if it's just a movie or a dinner.

Hoosier, I think when they are in this crisis the best thing you can do is be friendly and treat them politely.  That's what they need.  She will learn to trust she can talk to you without pressure.

Now I suggested you treat her friendly, like you would anyone else, but she really is not your friend right now.  There is a difference.  Friends have each others back and go out of their way not to hurt you.
Be you're own friend now.  Take good care of yourself in every way.  Allow her space to figure herself out.
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A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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Re: How did I get here?
#37: December 30, 2019, 07:05:39 PM
So I was speaking to a mutual friend who was visiting wife in her apartment. Mutual friend told me that wife seems extremely restless.   Said they were watching a TV show and wife was constantly leaving room to get something fiddling with a stack of papers.  Lining up the remotes every time she picked one up.  Putting on lip balm, filing her nails just constantly doing something.  This is not her pre BD typical behavior.  Does this mean anything?

She also told me that she is having a PA with a battery operated device!  I was shocked she would have never used one of those when I knew her.  Offered to buy her one once for when I was travelling and she told me no way and that they were disgusting.

HD
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Together 28 Married 23
S21  S19
BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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Re: How did I get here?
#38: December 30, 2019, 08:22:58 PM
Hoosier,

Ehhhhhh the rustling around restlessness is usually anxiety. Pretty common and typical. So probably a heads up to you to brush up on some techniques for communication with a person with anxiety for whenever you have encounters with her.

As for the battery operated friend. I say be open mind and grateful. This is definitely a preferable option to anything else and as a nurse I will sh it’s clinically speaking a good and healthy thing.

Don’t monkey brain it too much.

😊
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Me 37
H 37
S15
Wallower/Chaos kid
EA discovered 3/31/2019
BD March 31 2019
EA ongoing? 🤷‍♀️ (Who knows?)
“God allows us to feel the frailty of human love so we’ll appreciate the strength of his.” C.S. Lewis

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Re: How did I get here?
#39: December 30, 2019, 10:51:55 PM
Yeah, that behavior is typical. My xh would watch political YT videos while working (worked remotely), at the dinner table, in the bathroom and would sometimes try it while driving. He also picked up doing Uber/Lyft a bit over two years ago and is still going at it even though his main job pays reasonably well (tech lead). He would sometimes drive upwards of 20+ hours on weekends between different apps and gloat about how he was able to circumvent Uber's driving rules. Would even nap at gas stations. :o And I agree with Courage, be thankful the latter part of your post is all she's doing right now.
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MLC XH - 40 at BD
M - 32 at BD
My grandmother died 12/16
Mini BD - Jan 2017  - Doesn't want to be married to a "sad" person.
BD - July 2017 - spent the previous 3 months in his home country with OW
OW discovered Aug 2017
EA started Dec 2016? PA start unsure
Filed for D - Aug 2017
D - Nov 2017
Married - 15 Y
No kids
Married OW - 01/2019

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Re: How did I get here?
#40: January 01, 2020, 07:43:10 AM
I have read hundreds of posts over the past few days and have learned a lot.  I also feel very fortunate to not have endured the monstering and financial issues that some on here have been through.  Also blessed by my faith and the fact that my sons are older and don't have to deal with raising the children through this.  I am sleeping well now,  eating right (have dropped 15 lbs and weigh the same as I did when I graduated college) and exercising 2x more than before this happened.  I feel that physically I am in a good place.

I know I have been fixating on why this happened a lot the past 3 months and that I need to move past this but the engineer in me is having a tough time letting go.  One of the things I am quite interested in is the theory that traumatic experiences in childhood and later in life may lead to a MLC.  So of course I have put together a list of what I know about my wife's life.

Age 0-15 - Assume all was well don't recall hearing about any bad experiences (parents may have argued a lot not sure)
Age 16 - Teenage pregnancy got an abortion
Age 17 - Parents split up and divorce
Age 19 - Father died in a car accident depression ensues
Age 23 - graduates college struggling financially cant find full time teaching job
Age 24 - We start dating I help her financially she feels guilty
Age 25 - She gets a promotion and moves 2 hours away it strains our relationship gets depressed checks herself in hospital/suicidal thoughts
Age 26 - She breaks up with me for unknown reasons gets pregnant abortion #2
Age 27 - We reconcile she moves back all seems good
Age 29-48 - We get married have 2 children, she becomes catholic, new job as payroll admin with school district every thing seems good
Age 49-50 - Boys grow up and move to college she seem off (empty nest?  Dissatisfied with marriage? Something else?)
Age 51-  bomb drops

Wow after typing all this I think I answered my own question.  She has endured a lot between the ages of 16-26 and bottled most of it inside.  One would think that she should feel good about the last 20+ years of her life.  Am I getting blamed for what she endured previously?

HD
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S21  S19
BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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Re: How did I get here?
#41: January 01, 2020, 09:16:38 AM
Even just enduring one abortion can effect a women for a lifetime.  I have a close friend who had one before she became a Christian.  It can truly ruin a woman’s life.  The guilt, shame.  Especially if she is now catholic, but of course she can heal if she does the work.
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Married 20 years
Husband is 43
Me-39
4 kids 6-15 years old

BD-October 2018-ILYBNIL, wants a divorce, this after I found out about OW 1(EA), OW2(PA) no longer together.  I believe he is single. 
April 2019 He got an apartment and moved out.
Oct 2019-Apologized for a years worth of monster behavior.  Still wants to start divorce this Spring, is distant, but friendly.  Tries more with kids, but mostly just helps haul them around(superficial).
Spring 2019 H agreed to put off the divorce another school year to keep the kids and I from moving back to TX.
2020-He has continued to help out when asked and be polite.  I do think he questions his choices at times.  I do not believe he has OW.

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Re: How did I get here?
#42: January 01, 2020, 11:53:24 AM
One of things that seems to happen with mlc is that they find ways to try to re write history. The things they find too painful they project onto others, often the spouse, or pretend like certain things never happened. They often try to reinvent themselves into something they thought they should have been or wanted to be, but since they didn't do the work to get there, they may or may not get where they think they should be, and it can't be their fault, so it must be someone elses, often the spouse. The mentality I often see and read about is that the mlcer feels they can't or didn't do x or y or feel empty, usually due to some underlying previous issue, then blames the rest of the world for their own choices or lack of choices that were often never even voiced.

That is what I see, though others might see differently. My XH was very much like a person with Borderline Personality,Disorder. The website Outofthefog.com helped me immensely, also BPD family..

If you share a joint account, you might want to consider opening your own account and moving your half of the money there.  My mlcer spent over $20,000 in one month. Fortunately, I already had my half safely tucked away. He started off normal in the financial department, then went off the rails about 18 months in.
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« Last Edit: January 01, 2020, 11:55:58 AM by OffRoad »
When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

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Re: How did I get here?
#43: January 05, 2020, 09:27:41 AM
So my sons head back to college today.  They barely saw their mother over the past few weeks.  I feel like a single parent cooking, cleaning taking them clothes shopping,  going to movies , out to eat etc.  My youngest still will not open the Christmas card she gave him.  I talked to them repeatedly telling them that their mother and I love them very much.  It hard to see them struggle with understanding what mom is going through.
 
I just wish she could talk to them and help them understand.  She will text them occasionally when she wants their help or if she wants us to attend church as a family but thats about it.

I have forgiven her for leaving me but not for leaving the boys.  Any chance that she will open up to them soon or will she need time for that too?  She has been a great mother to them and it seems as if she is throwing all that away.  This is sad.

HD
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Re: How did I get here?
#44: January 05, 2020, 09:52:32 AM
I'm sorry Hoosier, but this is probably too early for her to deal with all her demons this soon.  I wouldn't expect anything from her just yet.  Let her have her space.

Just try to keep taking care of yourself and the kids and be there for them.   You're doing a good job.
They need you right now.

Your W will need to figure this out for herself, there isn't anything you can do to help her.

This is all very hard, but you are doing the best you can.
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Re: How did I get here?
#45: January 05, 2020, 09:57:41 AM
It is sad, HD, but as you have probably read here, not uncommon.
It must be very hard to see your sons struggle without being able to give them easy answers or make it all ok.
And yes sometimes they take a long time to reconnect even with kids....and of course while that is going on, your sons will be reaching their own conclusions about what they expect of her now and how they see her and what they are prepared to do or not in future.

I'm not a parent but reading stories here of those in shoes like yours, I honestly believe that the best you can do is tell the truth as you see it, including being honest about no longer knowing what your wife thinks or feels. Validate how your sons feel, encourage them to protect themselves but have compassion if they can and support them in working out how/if they want to interact with her. The sad truth is that your w has currently fired you from being a co-parent as well as a h so you can't fix or mediate their relationship with her now....but you can continue to be a great dad and role model for the life skills we need when SHTF.
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Re: How did I get here?
#46: January 05, 2020, 11:29:34 AM
Thanks for your support and kind words.  I told her soon after she left that I would have left so she could stay in the house and be here for the boys.  I now realize that she was also escaping from being a mom and not just a wife.  This is indeed hard but I will soldier on for them and myself.  Thanks for your support.

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Re: How did I get here?
#47: January 05, 2020, 12:04:11 PM
You are very welcome, HD.
Keep posting if you need any suggestions from others with young adult kids who have been in your shoes. You are not alone and others have survived this and managed to help their kids navigate too. You will be ok but I know it is not an easy path. Turn to your faith if you can and let God carry the things you can't
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Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: How did I get here?
#48: January 05, 2020, 07:00:47 PM
Attaching Hoosier.  I just lurve your name  ;D ;D

My H didn’t monster at all. Once he said “I feel like I should be angry with you”. ( I think it’s part of rationalising and justifying leaving, hurting us, the other person)

Just as well he didn’t as we also had a business together And I had to see him every day.... really hard it is. Now we’ve sold the business. That’s what he must have been escaping. The business stress and there were other big stresses around the time of BD.

Following along
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Re: How did I get here?
#49: January 09, 2020, 09:52:19 AM
So today I had a session with my younger son's clinical psychologist.  She has helped him with some issues he has had in the past and she has provided the paperwork to allow him extended time for testing at school.  My main focus was to get some suggestions for helping him deal with his mother going AWOL on us as it seems to be affecting him socially and I was worried (his academics are going great despite the current situation).  She gave me some great suggestions that I will use.  So we spent a fair amount of time discussing my wife's issues.  While she did not call my wife's current state a MLC she reinforced a lot of the behavior tools that I have learned here such as NC, showing empathy and compassion toward her at all times if possible, do not pursue, beg, or plead for a return, etc.  All this was great to hear.  She feels my wife is depressed from bottling a laundry list of issues from her past plus her current situation with empty nest, aging, menopause, etc.  She said to give her time and space and hopefully she will eventually realize that she needs help and running from her family was not the answer to her problems.  Nothing else I can do for her. 

"you have to admit you have a problem before you will seek help for it."

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Re: How did I get here?
#50: January 10, 2020, 07:38:43 AM
Sounds like a good counselor who sees things pretty clearly.

I second his/her advice.
"give her time and space and hopefully she will eventually realize that she needs help and running from her family was not the answer to her problems."

You're doing real good, Hoosier.
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Re: How did I get here?
#51: January 17, 2020, 11:56:01 AM
So after no contact for over 2 weeks I get a text out of the blue asking me if I wanted her W2's so I could assemble the taxes.  I waited a few hours and just replied back that "yes but no rush .  Won't do taxes till first of March".  My older son reached out to her after Christmas telling her we all cared about her and hope she is doing ok and gets through whatever she is dealing with.  She did not reply.  I let him pen his own message to her as suggested.  Not sure if she has tried to contact younger son since Christmas.  I'm doing ok and am keeping busy running, lifting, reading, home projects, work etc.  Still working on detaching emotionally.  Some days are easier than others.  This is going to take a while (detaching).

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Re: How did I get here?
#52: January 22, 2020, 10:35:14 AM
This past weekend our S18 was in town so I reached out to invite W to join us for dinner.  After dinner S18 started to break down about an issue he was having at college so we all went to the house to discuss.  S18 revealed that he is not happy at college and would like to transfer to a different school that has different degrees.  He is currently at a private engineering school and he has determined that he does not want to be an engineer.  I think he is also dealing with homesickness and the fact that mom is not home anymore.  W looks at me and asks "did you already know about this"  I calmly respond "no but I am not surprised  I could tell that something has been bothering him about school".  I started to see some emotion from her while S18 was talking but just a glimpse.  She then gave him an awkward looking hug.  She does not seem to grasp that S18 feels as though she has abandoned him.  It was heartbreaking to see him reaching out and not getting the response from her he needed.  He said he will finish out the year at current school while researching alternatives.  I ended up driving him back to school that night as his car needs minor maintenance and he did not want to drive it back due to the inclement weather.  After I got home I texted wife and told her he was back at school safely which she replied "good".  I then thanked her for being there while he opened up about it telling her that he needed her during this and that she is a great mother to him.  I got no response.  The old W would be crushed by all this.  The current W appears to not be concerned.

While visiting friends the next night I told them of the interaction between W and S18.  They like me can't understand her reaction or lack there of.   All of this helps me realize that I am currently a single parent and its up to me to care for S18 and S20.


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Re: How did I get here?
#53: January 22, 2020, 10:52:33 AM
One more thing that has been bothering me throughout all this.  When S18 and S20 are home W always invites us to join her for mass.  Prior to BD when we attended mass W was always adamant that we arrive 10 minutes before start to insure that we get a good seat and not be late like it was a sin or something.  Since BD the boys and I have have joined her for Mass at least 6 times.  For some reason she now arrives just barely in time or just after the start.  WTF?
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Re: How did I get here?
#54: January 22, 2020, 11:05:47 AM
One more thing that has been bothering me throughout all this.  When S18 and S20 are home W always invites us to join her for mass.  Prior to BD when we attended mass W was always adamant that we arrive 10 minutes before start to insure that we get a good seat and not be late like it was a sin or something.  Since BD the boys and I have have joined her for Mass at least 6 times.  For some reason she now arrives just barely in time or just after the start.  WTF?

It's great she's still going. Normally they stop. Glass half full  :D

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Re: How did I get here?
#55: January 26, 2020, 04:45:47 PM
So one of W’s friends approached me to have a chat.  She is curious what W’s infatuation is with my son’s former high school which W did not attend as a student.  She was always involved and interested when they were students but seems she has taken it to a new level.  Not only does she follow multiple sports teams, clubs and faculty on twitter she has also become a die-hard fan of the football and basketball teams.  Not only did she attend all the home football games she also drove to three away playoff games one of which was a 3 hour drive by herself to sit outside in sub-freezing temps to watch a game that is most likely only attended by the players parents.  Her friend thought this was crazy (so do I).  She also spent 10 hours at the state championship game including pre and post-game festivities (that's longer than she spent in child birth). 

By the way my sons did not play any of these varsity sports or attend many games as fans.  This is now extended to the basketball games.  I think we attended 2 the whole time while our boys were students and now she hasn’t missed a home game.  She claims she likes to go because they are so much fun.  Seems to me that she is trying to recapture something.  Perhaps her youth or maybe this has something to do with empty nest.  I think this is very strange as do most people I know who have asked me about it.

Any opinions?

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Re: How did I get here?
#56: January 26, 2020, 09:57:44 PM
Following along HD. Sorry you're here but I'm glad you found us.

Yeah, the High School thing. Weird, huh? My XW has been the same way. My theory with my XW is that she regressed to teenager-level again because that is the age she was when she suffered some trauma that she never fully processed. Her MLC and replay activities are a response to that. But, who really knows? It does seem to be par for the course, however.

I see you've been getting some great advice here. I'll just join the chorus of those advising you to work on yourself and to GAL. Whether your marriage survives or not isn't really up to you. But whether and how you survive your W's crisis (if that's what this is), is up to you.

Take care of yourself, Hoosier.
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BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
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OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
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Re: How did I get here?
#57: January 28, 2020, 07:27:08 AM

This is not going to be easy, but you need to put yourself first now and live your life.  IF she comes back it will take a long time.  Some do, some don't so don't put your life on hold.  She won't.


I'm sorry you are going through this HD, but I hope you will find some wisdom and encouragement here that will help you. 

Thunder has been here for awhile now and has given you some very good advice.  Use what you think pertains to you and your situation. 

I quoted four of her sentences that applied to me when the bomb drop hit me in 2016.

Thanks PJ,

I just finished reading your entire thread.  You are a warrior and an inspiration.

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Re: How did I get here?
#58: January 28, 2020, 10:08:10 PM
You read my entire thread?
* First of all, I'm sorry to hear that. I hope you're not too traumatized.
* Secondly, thanks for the kind words.

Hope you keep posting and sharing your story. This is a great place to journal, vent, rant, and ask questions. There are some kind and wise souls here. Forward!
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BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
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Re: How did I get here?
#59: February 13, 2020, 07:31:55 AM
Been a few weeks since I posted.  Still no sign of a PA.  Her circuit of fun continues as she just returned from a trip to the Caribbean with my friends wives.  I advised my friends wives not to force any conversations with her about our R and they reluctantly agreed.  They want answers also but it is not yet the time.

She is still distant with our college aged sons as she just sends a text every two weeks or so about nothing of importance.  She did bring the family cat over to the house for me to watch while she was gone on her trip which I didn't mind.  She is always nice and friendly when I see her but that is most likely because I treat her the same and apply no pressure.  This is becoming easier for me as I follow the rules of NC and start to GAL.

What are the rules for Valentines Day?  Would it be ok to send her a light/humorous card from me and the boys?

Hoosier



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Re: How did I get here?
#60: February 13, 2020, 08:25:57 AM
BD was Sept 19? And you live apart? And your sons are adults?
No, I wouldn't. Let your sons acknowledge it if they want to; tbh it seems a bit weird and disrespectful to 'speak' on their behalf about something that is a 'partner/romance' kind of thing. Jmo.

And whether your w is an MLCer or a WAW, she has currently fired you from the job of being her romantic partner hasn't she? (Sorry to be so blunt) Given that, she will either see it as pressure or denial or weakness on your part, i suspect. Maybe even disrespectful or invalidating of her wish to leave tbh.

It is often safer as an LBS to not initiate, to do nothing, if only bc it reduces the risk of a negative reaction or throwing logs on the fire  :)
I would do nothing. If she does something, you can be pleasantly surprised and respond in a low key way. But safer to assume she won't probably.
But nothing to stop you giving yourself a little VD treat for being an all round good chap  :)
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« Last Edit: February 13, 2020, 08:28:55 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
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Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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Re: How did I get here?
#61: February 13, 2020, 08:50:58 AM
I so agree with Treasur on this.  She honestly would, most likely, not even care one way or the other.
She is not at the point where anything from you would bring her joy.  I'm sorry.
Cards are very personal, even humorous ones....especially on Valentine's Day.

Your better off buying yourself something nice, because you deserve it.   ;D

I mirrored what my H did the first few years.  If he chose not to get me anything for my birthday, he got nothing for his, and so on for other events.  I let him set the tone.
Although we did acknowledge the day with a "Happy birthday" or ""Merry Christmas."...when I think back I doubt there was ever a "Happy Valentine's Day."  Too romantic I suppose.   ::)

After a couple of years he started buying me little gifts, from the dogs.  He then got little gifts, from the dogs.

Eventually he gave me gifts from himself, but it took a few years.

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How did I get here?
#62: March 29, 2020, 08:52:18 PM
Well today marks 6 months since BD,  the day I returned home from a weekend fishing trip to a half empty house.  I’m getting along fairly well and have S20 and S19 here at home with me doing their elearning as the universities sent them home.  Being a single parent is tough my hats off to those who have been doing it much longer and with younger more dependent children than what I have.

W has been fairly silent and I don’t contact her unless she initializes it.  Last month I let her drop her cat off here for 5 days while she went on a Caribbean trip with her girl friends.  A couple weekends ago she dropped her car off here at the house and had me look at a few issues.  ( I know cake eating, but I offered and I enjoy working on cars). The day she dropped it off was my birthday.  She didn’t mention it at the time but did when she thanked me later.

The virus has her working from her apartment and her circuit of fun activities are derailed for the meantime.  Must be tough hanging out by yourself in the apartment while I tend to our sons and maintain a home.

She did reach out to my mother on her birthday a week before mine and they started a dialog.  My mother adored her and treated her like a daughter.  She told my mother that she loves my family and is sorry that she made them sad but our relationship has been bad for a very long time.  This was news to me as she never told me this.

S19 had a birthday this past Wednesday.  She texted me the day before asking if she should stop by the house or just drop his gift in the mailbox if he didn’t want to see her.  I told her she should come by the house and join us for dinner which she did.  We all had a nice visit.  After she left S20 said “That was weird.  She acts like nothing is wrong then just leaves.  Guess we won’t see her again until my birthday next month.”

Still don’t understand what she’s going through.  Still no PA, still no mention of D, or any explanation/ discussion of what is going on.  We keep things light and don’t ask any questions.  I know her friends have told her she needs to talk to us.  They all think she is fine and don’t believe she is in MLC or depressed.  Of course the three wise men here at the house know something is not right with her.

I’m going to keep doing what I’m doing.  Be kind, empathetic, work on myself,  raise my sons,  and pray.

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How did I get here?
#63: April 15, 2020, 07:36:56 PM
Thanks for all the supportive posts.

A brief update. Out of the blue she brought lunch for us to the house one day last week. Odd that she brought a sandwich for me as she knows I am still working at the office. I think that is the nicest thing she has done for me since she left.

With Easter upcoming I asked S20 if he wanted to invite W over for Easter dinner. He did and she enthusiastically agreed. She brought a few entrees for dinner and Easter baskets for the boys and one for me. Seems odd that she brought one for me after ignoring me at Christmas and on my birthday last month. Oh well sure it means nothing but it was a nice gesture.

Back to no contact and keeping busy. I have enjoyed the time to build my relationship with my sons and accomplish many tasks around the house. Worked with S20 the past week installing a new clutch in his car along with new suspension components. Saved a bunch of $$$ and it was good to teach him a few things.

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How did I get here?
#64: April 16, 2020, 09:15:50 AM
Hello,

Thanks for the update and your great progress.

Quote
Back to no contact and keeping busy. I have enjoyed the time to build my relationship with my sons and accomplish many tasks around the house. Worked with S20 the past week installing a new clutch in his car along with new suspension components. Saved a bunch of $$$ and it was good to teach him a few things.

That is what is known as "Getting a life, and paving the way". By focusing on what you can control and taking action over what you can do. Puts you in a better frame of mind and supports the young men in your life on how to respond to adversity.

High five!

Ready
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How did I get here?
#65: April 17, 2020, 09:42:44 PM
Just catching up Hoosier.

I'll echo Ready. Thanks for the update. You sound great.

Bravo for building your relationship with your sons during this time. She's given you the gift of time and you're using it wisely and productively. Well done, good sir.
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"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

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How did I get here?
#66: May 02, 2020, 02:48:51 AM
So Monday was S20’s 21st birthday. W planned a drive about where we visited 8 friend’s homes. Each family friend had a drink waiting for him. Some of them hung out for a bit at a safe distance and had a drink with him. It was a great evening and S21 really enjoyed it. She was just like her pre BD self. We all had a great time. She even gave me her phone to text to let people know we were on way in between homes in the car. I was tempted to snoop but didn’t. I’m sure I would have discovered nothing anyhow. After returning home I thanked her for organizing and went in the house. Of course we haven’t heard from her since. It seems like she is just content seeing the Boys once every two weeks. Looks like Mother’s Day may be the next reach out touch and go.

There is one other thing I want opinions on that I haven’t mentioned before. Some time prior to BD W asked me if I remembered a friends wedding we attended. I said of course as I was a member of the wedding party. She brought up the fact that they had a wedding party dance and I danced with the girl I escorted down the aisle. She then said “You didn’t dance with me at that wedding!” This wedding was 25 years ago. We were not even engaged at the time. I apologized and said I wish she would have talked to me about it at the time. She just turned around and walked away. I was confused at the time but didn’t realize she must be setting the stage for her departure. She has brought this up to some of our friends lately to justify why she left. They are as confused as I am about her bringing this up now.  Just another example of her bottling up negative emotions only to have them resurface later I guess.

HD
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« Last Edit: May 02, 2020, 02:50:47 AM by Hoosier Daddy »
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Re: How did I get here?
#67: May 02, 2020, 03:40:20 AM
Oh yes Hoosier, they bring up things from years ago.  My guess is anything that can justify what they are doing, or about to do, is now on the table....and they dig deep.   ::)

I would just ignore things like that.  Most of the time they change the facts too.
It's very strange. 

I'm glad your S enjoyed his birthday.
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A quote from a recovered MLCer: 
"From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

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#68: May 17, 2020, 03:07:23 PM
So mother’s day was a week ago. S21 and S19 each texted her “Happy Mother’s Day” she just replied with a simple “Thanks”. I resisted the urge to wish her the same. Part of me wonders if that was a mistake but she hasn't acknowledged me on past reach outs so I decided not to. The boys also attempted to drop off a card but she didn’t answer her door so they just left it taped to the door. She claimed she was napping and didn’t hear the knock.

I heard from her for the first time in three weeks on Friday. She texted me about church resuming limited attendance mass starting in June. Wanted to know if she should respond that all 4 of us plan on attending or if I wanted to respond separately for me and the boys. I just said it was fine for her to respond for all of us.

Also on Friday she invited the boys over for dinner and they accepted. S21 said they were there for 30 minutes. Said conversation was awkward and irrelevant. They left as soon as they were done eating.

She did return S19’s high school yearbook and Cross Country team pullover that she took with her when she left. He questioned her why she had them. She just said that she liked reading through the yearbook and that the pullover was comfortable. Is it possible that she took these because she was reliving her own high school days? Just seems odd that she took them with her.

Still detaching, working on self improvement, and providing a stable home for the boys.

HD
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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#69: May 17, 2020, 03:15:37 PM
You sound like you are doing great HD. Your W seems to be cooking, but likely touch and goes - in my case that went on for a year and a half before H slid far far deeper into the tunnel. He is all monster all the time now, but still contacts regularly even though he rushed a D that has been final for a year and a half.  My H also continued to go to mass with me, quite a bit for the first six months, then Christmas Eve and Easter. He won’t step in a church at the moment. I wish you the best of luck, I think they often remember very odd things - like the lack of dancing at a wedding 25 years ago, because the confusion is so great and they need to come up with reasons to justify how they are feeling about the LBS. it’s painful, so try to remember as best you can, her behavior is quite truly not about you.

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BD End of April 2017
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Denied affair
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D final Sept 2018
Many touch and goes
He lives in monster, kids haven’t been with him overnight since Jan 2019
Moved in with MOW, a former friend of mine, May 2019

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#70: May 21, 2020, 04:18:04 PM

Doing some thinking today which I know can be dangerous. One of the things W told me and our sons in separate notes on why she left was that she “was tired of pretending that everything was ok”. She has left us notes but has yet to speak to us about anything of substance.

I understand that always pretending that you are happy and have a perfect family and marriage can wear on your mental health. Here’s the weird thing, every time we see her she still just acts like everything is fine and dandy.

So I guess it’s ok to pretend some of the time (a couple of hours every two weeks or so). W is still running from something. I know it isn’t just me and our sons. We are just collateral damage.

Time to stop thinking and get dinner started.

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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#71: May 25, 2020, 10:03:38 PM
Just catching up after being away for a while. You sound good.

Quote
W is still running from something. I know it isn’t just me and our sons. We are just collateral damage.

Bravo for figuring this out so quickly. It took me a lot longer. I blamed myself for a long time and then tried to fix things.

Mother's Day was rough for me this year, too.

No advice from me - just keep up the good work.
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"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

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#72: May 25, 2020, 10:43:57 PM
Hi, I'm new here.  I started reading your thread and see a lot of similarities to my situation.
She told my mother that she loves my family and is sorry that she made them sad but our relationship has been bad for a very long time.  This was news to me as she never told me this.
This.  My husband didn't talk to me either.  Apparently, they can talk to other people but not us?

Still don’t understand what she’s going through.  Still no PA, still no mention of D, or any explanation/ discussion of what is going on.  We keep things light and don’t ask any questions.  I know her friends have told her she needs to talk to us.  They all think she is fine and don’t believe she is in MLC or depressed.  Of course the three wise men here at the house know something is not right with her.
This is all familiar to me too.  I actually asked my husband if he was looking for a divorce (I wish I hadn't but it just popped out of my mouth) and he shouted, "NO!" like that was a crazy question after he told me he got a job and was moving 2000 miles away in 36 hours.  I also see no signs of an affair with my H.  I find it strange that none of his friends are asking questions.  My H's excuse to give everybody for why he ran away is that his father is in poor health and he needed to go take care of him.  I guess they all think it's great because nobody is saying anything about it.    I don't know how anybody can look at him and  not see it.  He looks TERRIBLE. 
Can you see a change in your W's physical appearance?
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~JustMe~
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H 52
Married 25 years
4 kids @ home
BD 1- 5/2005 Moved out for 2 weeks
BD 2- 5/2011 Quit his job with no discussion, wanted to move across country without us but stayed & found a new job.
BD 3- 5/2016 Job transfer 2000 miles away, no discussion with me.
Returned- 8/2016.
BD 4- 9/2017  After telling me he no longer loved me, he started packing in the middle of the night.  I caught him & convinced him to stay.
BD 5- 1/2020  Told a series of lies.  Accepted job 2000 miles away& moved in with his dad.  Told me 36 hrs before leaving. 
Tried standing.
No longer standing.  I'm DONE.

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#73: May 26, 2020, 12:19:23 AM
Just catching up after being away for a while. You sound good.

Quote
W is still running from something. I know it isn’t just me and our sons. We are just collateral damage.

Bravo for figuring this out so quickly. It took me a lot longer. I blamed myself for a long time and then tried to fix things.

Mother's Day was rough for me this year, too.

No advice from me - just keep up the good work.

PJ is quite right and you are doing well to see that so clearly.
You may find that, for a while, you know it in your head without quite getting it in your bones if that makes sense. Which is normal, so don't worry. You might want to have a short phrase that you can think or say out loud to remind you when you feel yourself spinning. (Mine was that my h simply did not care what I thought or felt....so it reminded me that there was no point in behaving as if he did even though I thought he should lol)

More important is unpicking the statement to accept the reality of what it means.
Your w is running from something. It will look like she is running to something. Neither are fixable by you alone. And neither are your fault or responsibility to help her with while she has excluded you and your sons from the path she is taking. You don't have to be an a$$hat but it is her path so her responsibility to figure out how to walk it. (I say that bc MLC wives do seem to have a tendency to want husbands to smooth the path or help them practically as a h does, weird as that seems. Nope, any problem on her path is her problem; you are busy with your own  :) )
And yes, you and your sons are collateral damage. Which your w doesn't care about or will justify or diminish the significance of it if she notices. So, the only people who can limit the scale of the collateral damage on your lives is you and your sons. Which is not a bad guide to action....if it hurts or damages any of you, there needs to be a bigger reason to do it than your wife's opinion or trying to stand if that is what you want to do. Hence why we talk so much here about putting yourself first. After a long marriage and as a normal family, that feels strange at first but it gets easier with time.

How are your sons taking it all?
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Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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#74: May 26, 2020, 07:21:47 PM
 

Quote
Can you see a change in your W's physical appearance?

JM the first few months after BD she looked great.  She had lost 15lbs got Botox injections and was always dolled up when we saw her.  The last few times I’ve seen her she looks tired and wore out.  It appears she has put the weight back on and the lines in her face are showing.  She still looks good for a woman her age.

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« Last Edit: May 26, 2020, 07:25:38 PM by Hoosier Daddy »
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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#75: May 26, 2020, 07:34:28 PM

Quote
How are your sons taking it all?

Treasur,

S21 has always been independent.  He has taken this in stride and realizes that his Mom is going through something.  He even texted her a few months back telling her this.  She never replied to his text.

S19 was a Mommas boy.  He was crushed when he came home from his first college break and she was gone.  He avoids contact with her most of the time.  I try to talk to him but I can tell he’s not ready to discuss it with me.  I just give him space but remind him frequently that I’m here for him when/ if he needs to talk.

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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#76: May 27, 2020, 10:01:06 PM
The kids are the hardest part of all.  It's bad enough what they've done to us as spouses but when you see what it's doing to the kids, it's unbearably heartbreaking.  I'm sorry that your kids are suffering.
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~JustMe~
52
H 52
Married 25 years
4 kids @ home
BD 1- 5/2005 Moved out for 2 weeks
BD 2- 5/2011 Quit his job with no discussion, wanted to move across country without us but stayed & found a new job.
BD 3- 5/2016 Job transfer 2000 miles away, no discussion with me.
Returned- 8/2016.
BD 4- 9/2017  After telling me he no longer loved me, he started packing in the middle of the night.  I caught him & convinced him to stay.
BD 5- 1/2020  Told a series of lies.  Accepted job 2000 miles away& moved in with his dad.  Told me 36 hrs before leaving. 
Tried standing.
No longer standing.  I'm DONE.

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#77: June 26, 2020, 08:00:55 PM
So W reached out to me two weeks ago.  She had an issue with her car and the price to repair was more than it was worth.  I offered to take a look at it and ended up repairing it for her for about 15% of the estimate.  I know cake eating.  She fired me as her husband but will still let me be her mechanic.  I let her use my truck while I worked on it.  She was kind when she stopped by for inspection and the drop off and pickup. 

She chatted with me more than S21 and S19 on those visits.  She was very appreciative and thankful for the help.  Still no idea what her future plans are regarding the R and I never bring it up. I am becoming more detached each day.  It will be 9 months post BD this weekend.

Going fishing with 3 old frat bro’s tomorrow.  My goal is to not mention the situation at all and to catch my limit.

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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#78: July 16, 2020, 04:19:33 AM
Update,

Me and boys went to Mass and dinner with W on the fourth. This was our only contact in the past 3 weeks. Had some friendly chit chat about what we have all been up to. Afterward S21 said she might as well have Dimentia, it seems as though she has forgotten we exist. She did text the boys Yesterday to share a password for a streaming service she just enrolled in. This must be her fourth one now, she watches a lot of TV. I find this to be a bit unhealthy.

Still DBing and GALing. I’m really starting to appreciate the gift of time. S21 and S19 will be heading back to college in a month if things go as planned. This will give me a break but will sting a bit as well.

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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#79: July 20, 2020, 03:16:24 PM
Thanks for the update Hoosier.

Hey, I know that feeling when the kids go off to college. It does sting to be left alone. I always thought my wife and I would be standing there together waving as the kids went off to college. But instead, it's just an empty house. But I hope you are still happy for what your sons are doing and what you've accomplished in raising them.

The TV thing. Jeez. My xW would watch Big Bang Theory reruns for HOURS every night. 8-10 episodes. Avoidance and escape.

What are you doing GAL-wise? What is making you happy and healthy? Inquiring minds want to know!
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"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

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#80: August 09, 2020, 05:59:14 PM
The boys and I haven’t seen or heard from W since 7/4 when we went to mass and dinner. She has not invited us to attend mass with her since. I suspect it must be getting to difficult for her to pretend that all is ok.

I’ve been cruising along working, home projects (prepping to pour a concrete sidewalk), hanging with friends, working out and running. Today I had a bad day for the first time in over a month. Not really sure why. Went on a four mile run to sweat out the negative emotions. This always seems to work wonders. I have no expectations other than tomorrow is a new day and I will continue to work on being my best.

Last week I was thinking that her lease will be coming up in seven weeks and hoping that she doesn’t ask to come home. I know she and I aren’t ready for that as we both still have work to do. I know I have a good start but doubt she has even started.

Still standing (after picking myself up of the ground today)

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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#81: August 09, 2020, 06:17:39 PM
I find Sunday the toughest day of the week. We always went to mass and then would either go out for breakfast or come home and make bacon and eggs...sometimes we'd visit our folks...we both worked full time so Sunday's were a "lazy" day...of course when football season started I could hear the games in the background as I went about doing house stuff...and usually we had a typical Sunday dinner...roast, potatoes, vegetables.

Or sometimes we'd take our sports car for a fun drive..it was just a good day, a day that we were together as a family.

I find Sunday's so empty now..what was a family day is now a day to get through. I recognize it as such...usually just happy when the day is over.
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"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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#82: August 09, 2020, 08:46:19 PM
Thanks for the update Hoosier. Sundays are difficult for me too. It used to be family day. And with COVID, I don't see as much of my church family either.

One bad day a month is pretty good. Keep up the good work, especially the squashing expectations.

To life!
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"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

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#83: August 23, 2020, 07:16:04 AM

So I got S21 and S19 off to there respective universities. It made me a bit sad but it was time. No word from W. Still no contact since 7/4 except seeing her at mass last weekend. She did ask if she could sit with us and I said of course.

Got me thinking about how no one in her immediate family has reached out to the boys to see how they are. Her FOO is not a healthy bunch when it comes to supporting one other. Probably the root of some of her issues as after her father passed while she was a freshman at college she was basically on her own. When we first started dating she never wanted to visit her mom and younger siblings. She used to comment that it was like a group of strangers when they got together.

Replay is back on after a hiatus. She’s back to chasing after fun and happiness by attending our sons former HS football team events. They are limiting attendance but her new recently divorced friend has sons on the team so she has access to her family allotment of tickets.

Time to get the house cleaned up now that the boys are gone. I see a few improvement projects on the horizon. I also have a trip planned with friends in a month if it doesn’t become a COVID casualty.

Still standing,

HD
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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#84: September 05, 2020, 07:36:23 PM
So after 9 weeks of silence I get a text from W at work last week, “Want to meet me tomorrow night at xxx?” Needless to say I was shocked. I waited 4 hours to clear my head and responded “Sure”.

It’s been 11 months since BD and this is the first time she’s wanted to meet with me alone. I went with no expectations but figured this could go one of 3 ways.

1. She is filing for divorce.
2. She wants to come home.
3. ???

So we we had dinner, a few beers and light conversation about our sons, families, sports and current events. No relationship talks. So I guess #3 was the outcome. I’m still perplexed by this random reach out. Was this just a temp check?

Still standing,

HD
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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#85: September 06, 2020, 07:29:15 AM
Hi Hoosier,
I am attaching to follow your updates.

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#86: September 07, 2020, 08:37:49 AM
That was kind of weird. Sounds like an anchor check to me. Or a guilt-alleviation exercise. But who knows with these people?

Sounds to me like you handled it well. It had to be difficult not to press her to decide on #1 or #2. Limbo is no fun.
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"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

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#87: September 08, 2020, 03:45:27 AM
Found a GIF of you from the other night... maybe a little older and greyer but....



As for her motivation... What does green taste like?
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Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
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BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
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Divorce final 30 August 2019

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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

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#88: September 08, 2020, 04:52:35 AM
UM - I think that describes our meeting to a tee.

I think green may taste a bit bland like an unseasoned vegetable or lettuce.

Still standing,

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#89: September 08, 2020, 04:58:05 AM
UM - I think that describes our meeting to a tee.

I think green may taste a bit bland like an unseasoned vegetable or lettuce.

Still standing,

HD

But trying to taste it with your elbow makes it even more "interesting."
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Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
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BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
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Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

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#90: October 07, 2020, 05:39:31 PM
I survived the one year post BD day. Went to Key West with a group of friends for 5 days and had a great time. W finally reached out to S19 and S21. She sent them each a card saying she missed them and wanted to spend some time with them. S21 said he texted her and told her that would be nice. Time will tell if she follows through.

S21 is really starting to mature and become an adult. The other day he told me that Mom currently has the communication skills of a middle schooler. This follows the script of them regressing to a younger age it seems.

Still Standing,

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#91: October 07, 2020, 07:44:54 PM
Glad to hear you made the year after BD.  Sounds like you had some good healthy fun.  Glad to hear there is some communication initiated from your W to your sons.  I hope this will continue and the communication gets stronger.

Thanks for sharing, it is nice to hear how strong you are.  Wishing you the best through this very crazy time.

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#92: October 17, 2020, 05:02:36 PM
Got a text from W today on my way into church. “I asked my attorney to file. We will email you more info next week.”

I haven’t responded. Any advice? Not sure how to validate that or even if I should.

I didn’t even know she had an attorney.  She still has never said or written the D word.

HD
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#93: October 17, 2020, 06:39:29 PM
Good evening.

I am sorry that she has done this, especially in this "strange way"...a text to tell you she is filing.

Something this important should at least require a conversation..some discussion perhaps, you know, you get to ask questions and have some input.

But that is not what people in crisis do. We are kept in the dark and then wham, we receive papers in the mail or a "text".

I received an email, 9 years after BD..we were already legally separated, he had filed for a divorce. It was done..within 60 days I received the final documents in the mail. Up until then, I was covered under his company's health insurance, divorcing me meant I had to pay $1279.00 per month for the next 18 months until I turned 65....I still do not know what the reason for the divorce was..everything is such a secret..he sent the same message to our daughter at the same time he sent it to me...really? I think I should have been informed first but that is truly how "crazy" they are.

But this hurts Hossier..no matter what...this hurts...I read a couple of weeks ago you had dinner together...you would think she could have mentioned something then...but this is so typical of MLCers..their reason is no way to understand what they are doing let alone why.

We both agreed to be married...but only one gets to decide to divorce us.

It was a shock to me and caused me to regress..even after so many years so be aware that all sorts of things will hit you...

I really wish this thing called MLC did not have such a confusing affect on our beloved spouses. Please know that we understand.
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« Last Edit: October 17, 2020, 06:40:51 PM by xyzcf »
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

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How did I get here?
#94: October 19, 2020, 03:27:05 AM
Got a text from W today on my way into church. “I asked my attorney to file. We will email you more info next week.”

I haven’t responded. Any advice? Not sure how to validate that or even if I should.

I didn’t even know she had an attorney.  She still has never said or written the D word.

HD

I know this is not what you want or wanted and I am really sorry

Now, for the advice part.....

As we said in the Navy, "Batten down the hatches, stow all loose gear and stand by for heavy rolls" aka "Get into your tornado shelter."

Get all your stuff together and get into one sock. You are about to be served with divorce papers and you need any and all evidence/backup/information you can get. Get an attorney of your own if that is appropriate and make sure that there is a fair and equitable agreement. In your case, I hate to say it but the way she has of springing things on you reeks to me that there is something going on behind the scenes so make sure that you are financially protected and that your kids (if applicable) are taken care of. You may very well be shocked/dismayed by the accusations that COULD (not WILL but COULD) be made in the complaint and the revision of history that Mid-Lifers are known for. 

Because she has sprung virtually every step of the way as a surprise on you, you need to consider that there will also be surprises here in her filing.

I think you could reasonably expect to be taken to the cleaners if the Mid-Lifer thinks he/she are "owed" something. Their sense of entitlement is exceeded only by their own over-inflated sense of their own self-worth. They seem to have the mindset of "What is mine is mine and what's yours is mine too if I want it...." Sort of like a toddler....

From here on out, it is NOTHING more than a business deal. No more "friendly" dinners, no more "light conversations over a few beers." STRICTLY business... Time to channel Don Coorleone... You are no longer dealing with your wife or anyone remotely resembling her. You are now dealing with her lawyer.....
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Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
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Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
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Divorce final 30 August 2019

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Re: How did I get here?
#95: October 19, 2020, 12:28:27 PM
Everything Ursa and xyz said. Tend to your emotional health and be kind to yourself. Divorce is a whole other bag of feelings to go through. But follow Ursa's advice to the letter in physically dealing with her. Your present AND future need to be protected from MLC, and that has to be your focus now.
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"Unconditional love is the highest of high standards, and while we are letting go of our need to control the process of anyone else, we are taking within our lives complete accountability for our own experience."

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How did I get here?
#96: October 19, 2020, 05:21:45 PM
Oh man, I'm so sorry to hear this. The D-word is a real punch in the gut. Even when it's expected, it is still such a painful, ugly thing. Divorce truly is a form of death.

Everything that Ursa said is correct. You have to separate the business from the relationship side of things. Anything you say can and will be used against you, so remember to be careful about if and when you respond.

So sorry. I've been there and it sucks. But if it's any consolation, in my case I found that once it was over I was better than I was when I was waiting for the axe to fall. But it sucks. Sorry. Take care of yourself.
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"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
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BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
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