[xyzcf]

Since Trump by an executive order (? meaning he alone makes that decision) wants to stop all immigration to the US on the false premise that this will "protect" us from COVID and save jobs for Americans then will he also close our borders so there is no possible exchange of bodies or goods from anywhere else in the world to possibly "contaminate" the country?

What will be next, anyone on a work visa or with a green card will be "eliminated" to prevent any non-American from taking a job away?

Sounds very much like COMMUNISM to me. Building "walls" to keep people out or to keep people in?

Not much freedom there.

The dangers of this ideology from an economic standpoint are immense. The humanitarian effects will also cause lasting issues as this country is further divided into them and us. The "others".

[MyBrainIsBroken]

I live in New York state in the United States. It bothers me when I hear complaints about God being removed from our public schools.

I'm 61 years old. I was raised a Catholic in a small town in rural America. I still consider myself to be Catholic but attend a Wesleyan church. I served in the US military, both Air Force and Air National Guard. I consider myself both a Christian and an American.

I've learned over the years that there are a lot of places in the United States that are nothing like the place where I was raised. We are United States but we have a lot of different backgrounds and beliefs. Although sometimes a source of controversy, I believe that is also one of this country's greatest strengths.

When people see me, a white, slightly beyond middle-aged male, they may have a hard time accepting that I am a member of a minority that was highly discriminated against but it's true. My ancestors were Irish Catholics, two groups that were both despised in the America they immigrated to. They were fortunate to find jobs as menial laborers. They were considered to be drunken papists. A major milestone was achieved two years after I was born when John F Kennedy became the first US president with Irish Catholic ancestry. Maybe this has helped me to be more accepting of people with other backgrounds and beliefs. BTW, I am not an Irish-American. I am an American with Irish heritage.

So why does it bother me that God has been removed from the public schools? It bothers me because the US is not a theocracy, it is a republic, and I am glad that it is because that provides me with the freedom to worship the God of my choosing. If God were to play a role in our public schools I have to ask, whose God? The Christian God, If so, which version? Catholic, Wesleyan, Baptist, Episcopalian, Presbyterian? Or maybe the Mormon God or the 7th Day Adventists God? But why not the Hindu God or the Islamic God? Do we really have room for all of these Gods in our public schools? If not, how do we choose the right one?

If you want to have God in your children's school, you can. You can send your children to a religious school or even home school them. But children attending public schools shouldn't have be forced to worship somebody else's God as a condition for attending.

Since Trump by an executive order (? meaning he alone makes that decision) wants to stop all immigration to the US on the false premise that this will "protect" us from COVID and save jobs for Americans then will he also close our borders so there is no possible exchange of bodies or goods from anywhere else in the world to possibly "contaminate" the country?

What will be next, anyone on a work visa or with a green card will be "eliminated" to prevent any non-American from taking a job away?

Sounds very much like COMMUNISM to me. Building "walls" to keep people out or to keep people in?

Not much freedom there.

The dangers of this ideology from an economic standpoint are immense. The humanitarian effects will also cause lasting issues as this country is further divided into them and us. The "others".

We on this forum should be very familiar with this type of behavior. This is what naricissts do.

https://thoughtcatalog.com/shahida-arabi/2016/06/20-diversion-tactics-highly-manipulative-narcissists-sociopaths-and-psychopaths-use-to-silence-you/

https://theconversation.com/pathological-power-the-danger-of-governments-led-by-narcissists-and-psychopaths-123118

Returning to the thread's topic, Covid-19, I have to admit I am not a big fan of my state's governor, Andrew Cuomo, but I also have to admit that he has done a lot of things right in dealing with this pandemic, including battling with the federal government to try to get the federal government to do their proper part.

Cuomo is continuing to move in the right direction, IMO, by instituting statewide SARS-CoV2 antibody testing that started this week. Even though there are still questions regarding what the presence of antibodies means with respect to immunity, having the data will help our decision makers to make better informed decisions and that is something that I am very much in favor of.

https://www.newsday.com/news/health/coronavirus/blood-test-antibodies-immunity-1.44000316

[Nas]

I imagine that, given your past health trials, this is a particularly difficult time for you Nas and I hope you know that you are still in our loving thoughts even if you have stepped back from posting for a while. Bc HS is an 'us' too I hope. And you are always part of 'us'. Xxx

Thanks, Treasur, that means a lot, and you have all been in my thoughts as well.   

[marvin4242]

I just wanted to say it is such a pleasure to read so many well thought out, honest, open and interesting viewpoints that are shared here. Usually in most places these kind of conversations can devolve, but not here. And regardless of viewpoint and agreement I for one greatly appreciate well thought out, argued and reasoned viewpoints in any context.

So thank you all.

[Thunder]

I like what you said about the public schools.  There are too many religions so who would choose?
I chose to sent my kids to private Catholic schools, because I did want that religious aspect, and we are Catholic.

I have to tell you, I have become quite a fan of Cuomo.  I like how he stands his ground and it's afraid to stand up for the people of his state.

Here in MN we have governor Walz, who also has been a pretty good governor.

Hugs, Nas! 

[Finding Joy]

Marvin, we cannot really discuss this because neither of us believe in the other ones premise. 

You are free here to do as you please.  That is not in question.  But if you are here to complain and you are not from here, well, I’m sure the country you miss and is so great would hopefully take you back!

Some taxes are necessary.  However you saying me believing In low taxes and a small government is false.  Haha!  Is everything you don’t believe misinformation!  Seriously!  It is a different way of running a government, it is not a false way, it’s just not the way you want.

We have different beliefs and we could talk endlessly about those differences, but you won’t sway me, and I won’t sway you.  So, again.  I agree to disagree and just don’t want to waste my energy.  We have different beliefs and visions for this country and probably life.

I will say, if as an American I became a citizen of a different country, I hopefully would recognize that it was my choice.  Not come and try to make the new country like the one I came from.  Because each country is unique and has good and bad things.  If your old country is so great, again, please feel free to catch a flight when Corona ends.

[Finding Joy]

Ready!  Ha!  Yes!  These crises change things and because of 9/11 people are weary here of long term new laws and rules that may work for this crises, but may stay when it’s over.

[marvin4242]

Marvin, we cannot really discuss this because neither of us believe in the other ones premise. 

Some taxes are necessary.  We have different beliefs and we could talk endlessly about those differences, but you won’t sway me, and I won’t sway you.  So, again.  I agree to disagree and just don’t want to waste my energy.  We have different beliefs and visions for this country and probably life.

I will say, if as an American I became a citizen of a different country, I hopefully would recognize that it was my choice.  Not come and try to make the new country like the one I came from.  Because each country is unique and has good and bad things.

I find it hard to believe that you don’t “believe” in the premise that we need others to thrive and function in society. I am guessing you are part of a community of peers, friends, like minded people and support networks. We all are.

And this is part of what I think has gone very wrong in America today. Its not about swaying anyone, but people seem incapable of actually talking about topics without just holding on a hard position and shutting down discussion. Topics discussed are not about “winning and losing,” “convincing” others. It is about sharing ideas, seeing and accepting differing viewpoints, tolerance and coexistence. This to me is what makes a healthy and thriving society. There are opinions, and there are facts, the two are no longer differentiated.

Its very easy to demonize others, shut them down, reject them and simply hold ideas and positions without examining or deepening why we hold them.

[Finding Joy]

Let me repeat!  I do not want to speak with you on this topic.  I believe in small government.  I do not believe big government is the answer. 

I am mostly here to heal, and support others and find support.  I just don’t want to spend my time this way.  If you do, I’m sure you can debate endlessly online. 

I did not say we do not need others.  We disagree on this topic.  I do not want to waste my day endlessly for no point and will not react if you reply on this topic.

You believe in big government, I do not.  I believe in private enterprise.  Thank you.

Also, you and others are on an international forum putting my country down.  If I got on here and spoke bad about any other country it would not be ok(besides maybe China). 

But several see no harm in bashing the USA on an international forum.  What happens in a family is that publicly you support one another and privately you discuss issues.

Obviously those who live here, but publicly bash this country do not consider it home.

[marvin4242]

FJ: that is fine, but then why do you keep repeating your position? I didn’t repeat mine and that is not even my position?

I was talking about the inability to discuss things in US. I think we are simply talking past each other.

I wasn’t the one who dragged this topic about politics and beliefs. I am much more interested in discussing Covid information and up to date findings. Hopefully we can get back to that.