Skip to main content

Author Topic: My Story Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
My Story Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
OP: April 22, 2020, 07:16:26 AM
Hello Friends,
Time to start a new thread.  Keeping the same thread title with the #4. Either I lack imagination or am simply afraid I won’t find my own thread if I change the name.

Quick recap. I am 2 1/2 years from abrupt BD when, while on a rare date, h said he was unhappy and left within the week. In the first 18 months before I started posting, there was much drama and monstering, projection and blame. There was an ow, which I learned about much later, but that supposedly ended almost a year ago and not sure if h has replaced her with one or many or none. I don’t go looking for information that will hurt me. H is on his 4th move since he left and is currently living in the same town, 1/2 a mile from me. The arrangement ends soon. We have had too many close encounters, so if he finds place #5 farther away it would be healthier for me.

We are also stuck in a cycle where he gets friendlier and then churns up the lawyers. Makes my head spin. From the little I see, his new life does not seem bright and shiny.  I have had some other losses during this time, some heartbreaking, some not so much. Wedding approaches for our only son this summer. Through the lawyers I have asked for a pause until the wedding. No answer yet. And no contact either. Waiting.

And me? I am facing my fears and starting to accept what has happened. I am getting ready for battle and although I have compassion, I am beyond tired of drama and cycles and beginning to get angry. Still searching for courage and the elusive grace. Remembering to breathe.  Emotionally I am still a bit of a wreck. I am so grateful for all of you.   :-*

What I have learned is what people tried to tell me at the very beginning. This is a journey. For. both. of. us. Am I learning a lot about myself? Yes. Yet, I wish I never had to take this journey.

Old Thread:
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11230.0
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1216
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#1: April 22, 2020, 07:23:57 AM
Following along Mal! It is a journey indeed...
  • Logged
H - 43 (40 @BD1)
M - 43 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.
Confirmation H and OW are together, presume PA  - 3rd June 2019
H gets engaged with OW (we are not divorced) - Oct 2019
H "finally" asks for divorce - Aug 2020

"One of the happiest moments in life is when you find the courage to let go of what you can’t change"

E
  • ****
  • Sr. Member
  • Posts: 297
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#2: April 22, 2020, 02:57:06 PM
Following along Mal. Xx
  • Logged
M: 50 (48 @ BD)
H: 53 (51 @ BD)
Married 20yrs, together 23yrs
D: 21 (19 @ BD)
D: 19 (17 @ BD)
'Extra D': 19 (17 @ BD)
BD (that I didn't recognise as such) Easter 2018
BD 9th Sep 2018
OW (45, now 47) - he met her in the pub a week before BD, told me about her a week after BD. Thinks 'their planets have collided' because 'their eyes met across the room' and they had an 'instant connection'. Lives with her. Is building a life with her. Jun 20: H plans to buy a block of land and build a house with her.

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#3: April 22, 2020, 03:02:40 PM
I had a great response. Lots of super deep stuff [lol] but it got lost somewhere. Probably too wordy as usual. Anyway, point was this:  you are absolutely filled with both courage and grace. Summoning it can be challenging, but you have done it every time it mattered.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10526
  • Gender: Male
  • You can't please everyone. You are NOT a pizza!
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#4: April 23, 2020, 03:23:44 AM
By George, I think she's GOT it!

  • Logged
Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#5: April 23, 2020, 03:46:49 AM
Following, Male. Your H is like mine in that mine moved several times those first 2 years after BD, then settled close to me which caused those uncomfortable run ins. I hope he moves away from you this time. Mine also gets friendlier, then chumps in the lawyers.

I hope your H will agree to a legal pause until after your S's wedding. You are graceful and kind and certainly don't deserves what has happened to you. I just want to encourage you to enjoy the lead up to your S's wedding and try to fully immerse yourself in his day, as apposed to what your H could do to hurt you. Not easy, I realize. Making your S's wedding day the best it can be for him, is what I imagine will make you happy, too. Whether your H is an idiot or not, you will be able to enjoy your grace to your S on his day for years to come.
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#6: April 23, 2020, 12:54:44 PM
Mal -
Attaching and following along.

Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#7: May 03, 2020, 06:21:53 PM
Thank you all for following xoxo. You all keep me going.  And UM, I do love Audrey Hepburn....Still trying every day to show that grace and courage.. Processing my latest visitation today.

Slap my little hands
He made it two weeks without contacting me. Then, he texted me at a tough moment. Frustrated and lonely and firewalled out of a zoom party, I was sipping on too much margarita, learning how to make them during the pandemic; this one was too strong.

Let me know he spoken to our son, that he knew S had been here for dinner the night before- mother exception to social isolation- and that S was coming back this weekend to help with projects. So, h obviously peppers our S with questions about me.  Then h mentioned he would swing by this weekend to get mail and see S at the same time-finally saying in advance when he was coming. Then he disclosed how he may have saved someone's life earlier in the week and would tell me about it in person.It takes a long round of texts to get substance from him, and then he reels me in by showing he still has a Heart. It was a few hours of texts. It was a strong margarita.

Afterwards I was resentful that he would encroach on my time with our S, which is becoming even more valuable to me. It was a year ago, last major touch and go started when he came by to help with last spring’s projects.....Btw, still no word back from lawyers if he agreed to truce before the wedding.

So, he came and went today, another weird encounter. My S and I were in the middle of some projects and I happened to look up at the very instant and see h turn the corner and enter the driveway. My S and I both looked at each other in shared horror. I quickly asked my S  if he had seen his father recently, and he said not in months although he’s apparently dropped some food and gifts off at their door and then left. H was wearing a full respirator so it was difficult to hear him speak.

I might have called him Darth Vader.

The tension between h and my S was so palpable, I could feel it in the air. If my S ever looked at or treated me that way, I would spontaneously combust and die. They were so close once upon a time.

Dressed more normally, still with thick silver chain. Very very thin.

He didn’t stay long, asked for his mail, gave us suggestions about how to do things and suggested more house projects for us. I asked him if he had moved yet and he has another temporary house rental lined up on the other side of town. (Milly, yet another move.) I tried my best to keep a short light conversation going.  “See you guys later,” he said. After h left, I asked my son if h was okay. He shrugged and said it wasn’t my problem any more.

The whole story is heartbreaking. He has reconnected with his mother though. I am slapping my little fingers now so I don't send a follow up text.
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#8: May 03, 2020, 06:59:25 PM
I had to laugh at Darth Vader because that's exactly what I was thinking...

Now, what purpose would sending a text accomplish?
What would be your goals, and how would you feel if you got -- monster? --- no reply??

Just food for thought.
Lay off the margaritas!
Loose lips...

Hugs,
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#9: May 04, 2020, 04:07:14 AM
Male, so your H is still running. That was quite a bit of contact there and the visit? Strange, especially since he had a respirator. Maybe he's feeling vulnerable. I feel it was a little touch and go, the suggestions for the home repairs. I hope he continues in this way for the wedding.

I do love a margarita, but I prefer them weak with lots of crushed ice.
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#10: May 05, 2020, 04:32:28 AM
Cycle whiplash
I did not text, I held back. Sea, you asked what I sought and well I misguidedly hoped there was an opening to pave the way. You were right. And Milly, after every touch is a nasty "go." You all knew it, and I live in the House of Mirrors, as Treasur once aptly named it. I so understand why RCR coined the phrase Boomerang.

Last night I received another long late night email missive about how a divorce is what is best for him now and he is tired of living in one temporary arrangement after another and tired his life is in limbo etc etc etc and I need to review his horribly skewed proposed separation agreement and set him free. He says it's been three years, but I only count two and a half.

I don't even know how to respond anymore. I am tired of these angry late night surprise missives. I have tried to be gracious and friendly in response to all of his communications although it is hard to talk when someone is wearing a figurative and literal mask. Is he lashing out at me because of the tension in the air Sunday when he appeared? That his home no longer feels like his any more and his son does not welcome him with open arms?

So many of you have been through this before. I still feel pretty naive. I have referred him to the lawyers time and time again. I am at a loss how to respond any more. I prepared a simple draft in anger referring him back to the lawyers, who have spoken recently and stating that we owe it to our son to hold it together for the two months leading up to the wedding. I will wait a few days to decide whether to send anything. There is more I would truly like to say, but I will let it go.

He has left his home, lost the respect of his son and their close relationship, lost all our mutual friends, closed off his own relationship with his sister and brother, is living like a nomad- his possessions are scattered, likely facing some health issues, and is having financial problems. Is rock bottom any lower?

Objectively I know that all this stuff has happened since he left. Not my fault.  Yet I know he is still blaming me.

The cycles are getting closer together, and he cannot seem to leave me alone.

We have to coexist he says. Well, we don't. I am just about done. I will have ptsd forever.  He gets friendly and then decides I am what is horrible in his life.  I am getting whiplash from these cycles.

Thanks for listening. I cannot vent about these cycles to anyone else in RL any more. They cannot understand the torment.
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10723
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#11: May 05, 2020, 05:52:29 AM
We get it, Mal.
The simple truth is how he feels and what he wants is no longer your problem, is it?
How wise of you to take a pause before replying. You may decide to say nothing much or simply to restate that his lawyer should talk to your lawyer, that from respect for your son you would prefer to wait a few weeks until after the wedding but he must do as he sees fit.

It's a strange process with an MLCer. I remember that my xh seemed somehow to almost want my permission or approval towards the end of the process. And that, no matter the facts about his tardy responses vs my timely ones, he would bang on and on that I was 'refusing to let him go'. It was very weird looking back. My life got easier when I filed most of the things I might say under F for Futile....he had his story despite the obvious facts, bizarrely wanted my sympathy almost about how stressful HIS divorce was....I just ran out of sane responses tbh so pretty much just said the same thing.....get your L to talk to my L (but I did find out that part of his problem was that he had lied to his own L plus ow pressure so some of his self-created chickens were coming home to roost lol) My xh got much loopier and angrier in the last few months of his divorce process....almost as if it all came as a bit of an unwelcome and irritating challenge  ::).....I have often thought that MLCers essentially want a 'zipless divorce' like that Erica Jong book title, where they simply announce it and everyone else does the legwork  :)

But I remember that time. And how simply impossible it was to have any kind of rational exchange at all. So it was nice to stop trying  :).....like you, I just ran out of sensible responses after a while.

We get it though, Mal, we do.
And i am here to tell you two things from my own experience.
That PTSD does not have to be forever; it can be for a season, not for life.
And that brutal as it is to go through an MLC divorce against your will, there is a peaceful spot away from drama on the other side of it. Wise vets told me that and they were quite right. You mourn your h and the loss of your m, true enough, but you also feel very grateful to be off the battlefield and away from an MLCer's WTF rollercoaster. X
  • Logged
« Last Edit: May 05, 2020, 05:56:45 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

N
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 875
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#12: May 05, 2020, 08:33:21 AM
Quote
And that brutal as it is to go through an MLC divorce against your will, there is a peaceful spot away from drama on the other side of it. Wise vets told me that and they were quite right. You mourn your h and the loss of your m, true enough, but you also feel very grateful to be off the battlefield and away from an MLCer's WTF rollercoaster. X

All true.  While you React with hope that this might be a ‘touch and go’, you keep yourself embroiled.  If he ever wants to re connect meaningfully, he can ask you to meet him somewhere neutral and behave like an emotionally whole adult. 

Detachment, v low contact and keeping him away from your home and life except for occasions like the wedding will help you grow your own strength. 
  • Logged
« Last Edit: May 05, 2020, 08:40:40 AM by Nerissa »

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#13: May 05, 2020, 02:07:44 PM
Mal - I agree with what's been said.
Only thought is to maybe put him on "do not disturb" between say 5pm and 5am so you won't get these late=night texts which I am sure disrupt your sleep.

I was so traumatized by the whole divorce process.
But, not what it's over, my life is pretty peaceful.
I have my sons who love me, and I have monster who makes me laugh sometimes -- or at least smh.

In all reality, does it really matter if he pushes the divorce along?
I honestly don't think it could strain your R anymore than it already seems, regardless of the wedding.

Just a thought.

Hugs,
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#14: May 05, 2020, 02:29:34 PM
Male, I have no miracle cure to what you're going through, just wanted to join the others in saying I completely understand. I don't have a clinger, but I have a MLCer who has dragged out his divorce for years, whilst accusing me of not letting him live his life.

What I will say is that this doesn't last for ever. Eventually, the legal battles will end one way or the other, there will be no need for communication, which also cuts down on the nasty go. I know how frustrating it is to feel that however you behave with your H, you get nowhere, he still can flip and turn around and accuse you. With my big monster baby H, I can't be too tough or cold or he will throw it back at me. I find the distancing has to be something internal for myself. If I go NC on my H, he will get me for it. I tell myself that I'm dealing with an unstable person so I must think a long time before I respond. For me, short and business like sounding replies work the best.

I wouldn't be surprised that you're feeling particularly on edge because of your S's imminent wedding and the fear of how to deal with your H that day. I bet that your H is stressed about this, too. This might be part of the reason for his recent cycling, moving again, pushing for separation to set him free, yet wanting you to co-exist. He's scrambling and panicking. I don't think he even knows what he wants from hour to hour. He's a very unhappy man right now. He got what he wanted but it's not working for him, so he's searching for other solutions. He's going crazy.

You just come here and get it out of your system. If those night texts get to you, I do like the idea of switching your phone off during the night.
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#15: May 06, 2020, 06:58:25 AM
Treasur, Sea, Nerissa and Milly,  Thank you for understanding. I do appreciate that it gets better, or maybe some day I will care less. Milly, agreed, the message is not from a happy person. I think your explanation is spot on.  I have not replied back yet, in part because I know he will want the last word. Nerissa, yes, I deserve more than flashes of h and teases. I need to keep him away more. The last time I literally said goodbye, he showed up at the door. I need to be stronger.

The wedding does have me on edge, so his message set me in knots. I am so angry at him for sucking the joy out of the wedding. " Is it still going forward?" h keeps asking, almost as though he hopes it will not. And he is controlling my access to our family beach house as well, usually rented this time of year. I am worried he will go back on our agreement about what weeks I can have. I am hosting our extended family/inlaws and friends for the third summer post BD. H is using the house for storage right now. Although he told me I can go down, he is setting restrictions.  I see this as a cat and mouse game of control.

His texts, in person visits and e-mails each have a different personality.

And yes, Sea and Milly, I need to self-control checking the emails. Perhaps in the stillness of the world I can practice not checking any messages, although in general they help fight the isolation.  A text is easier to ignore, and usually innocuous or even friendly, but the emails come out of the blue now. I checked late because I was expecting a message from a neighbor about plans for a joint project. The emails are also triggers.  When h first left he would send horrible messages to my work e-mail, which was entirely inappropriate. I tried for so long to get him to stop and his timing was mean spirited. Between the surprise messages and having to check the home security system remotely to see if he was sneaking into the house, every work day was trauma.

Treasur, I do look forward to being off the rollercoaster. Never liked rollercoasters. Thank you all for keeping me calm and steady.  :-*
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#16: May 06, 2020, 10:38:49 AM
Oh boy Mal. Does sound like he is doing some late night thinky time wondering how to make it all better. Oh I know, I'll poke Mal to see if she tells me how much she still loves me. Only my take of course, but I personally have done this. Told H I wanted a D now--mostly so he will tell me that is not what he wants. (I don't do this anymore by the by) But having been on the giving side of it, I can tell you what my personal intention was. And a wounded LBS can have some strikingly similar methods to the mclers.

"Is it still going through?" What a weird inappropriate question. And one coming from a person who no longer values the sanctity of marriage I would guess. 

Also, I read on Hearts Blessing one time about how MLCers are testing things when they say "I am never coming home." Maybe it was from the Prodigal Husband. Don't remember exactly. Anyway, the point was that they proclaimed this b/c they are in such inner turmoil trying to find an end to their pain, they say these things hoping for it to end. And likely change their mind a million times.

Just throwing these things out there not to give him a pass. But I find sometimes it helps me knowing these things. More confirmation it isn't me at all. But him and his F'd up issues!

Stay strong girl. You got this!
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#17: May 11, 2020, 08:10:58 AM
KIT, thanks. The Prodigal Husband is an interesting thought. Sometimes I want to believe that he has second thoughts and thinky time and is cycling, but then he tells me in no uncertain terms that he wants out. I did not express any sentiments about his nomad life or his desire to be free of me. His statement about co-existing was curious. Sociologically wondering what does it mean to coexist with someone you abandoned?

Anyhoo, I responded to the email, referring him to the lawyers once again. He had claimed I was ignoring him. Also added a long strident message that the kids were getting married in two months and we needed to put a pause on it and give them a happy day rather than an event where the groom’s parents are engaged in combat. Although, I can be strident in the work world, this may have been a first for me in my home role.  I almost added some language about never having anything to do with him in the future, but KIT, I stopped and paused based on what you had said, and what Nerissa advised awhile back, and decided not to go there.

No response, but then I received a Happy Mother’s Day text- first since he left. And, he wanted to know about contributing to our share of rehearsal dinner.

Whatever? Sent a brief polite response, with maybe one other reply about his mother, not engaging with his friendly texts anymore. The subsequent e-mail missives just kill me. Such a dance, when this all ends he is not my friend.

Had a lovely MD though, my S spent the day with me, brunch, mimosas, one short house project together, a walk, and my first mushy card from him with a heartfelt note. I am blessed. At the end of the day, I felt happy and loved.

Woke up this morning thinking of Maya Angelou's poem And Still I Rise.
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#18: May 29, 2020, 06:26:51 AM
Reading along on everyone’s threads and seeing so much sadness. How did we all get here, with lost of trust, betrayal and abandonment? So many references to kinsugi and repairing the brokenness with gold. Not sure there is enough gold.

Quiet and the days blend in. Some signs that things may open again. My S’s wedding is still on schedule in less than 2 months, but so many changes and still much uncertainty. Simple tasks now take so much effort.

No word from H in a few weeks, not even for mail pick up, strangely quiet, like I expect him to jump out of the bushes with something terrible to say. He never responded to my email asking for a pause until after the wedding. And likely he is in the midst of move #5. His most recent missive had lashed out about his having to move again with all of his possessions scattered. Two weeks ago I went to the beach house between tenants, and found that he was using it as an interim storage facility. All of his coats and jackets were lined up in the master closet. Some I recognized, some were new. I could write an essay about the coats and what they represent it, from a leather jacket that I saved up for and gave him just before we married, to some new camo and trendy jackets he acquired after me. In between were the comforting jackets I remembered from our 30+ years. It was like a time capsule of his life. Trying on different identities.  So sad. I touched my favorites gently.

The surrounding sadness everywhere seems overwhelming. And now the violence. Stay safe.
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#19: May 29, 2020, 05:01:08 PM
Mal -
Following along after a brief hiatus.
I'm sorry that you see so much sadness.
I am hoping that the joy of your son's wedding will soften your heart and bring you happiness amidst these tumultuous times with your H.
Breathe, rest in it.

We're here for you.
Stay safe too, my friend.

Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

C
  • *
  • Trial Subscriber
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 589
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#20: May 29, 2020, 05:25:00 PM
Mal,

Just a thought.....perhaps your H’s strident messages about needing a divorce is more about his need to end attachment.

What I mean by that is attachment is fear based. It is a scarcity mindset. It is driven and fueled by fear.

Does divorce hurt you.....yes, it does. I’m so sorry for that.

But divorce for an MLCer May be more about facing a fear of giving up that attachment....and the illusion of control over that attachment.
Do I think they understand this at the time....no.....I just think they want the pain to stop. But their actions are the very thing that forces them to finally confront that pain of “losing” an attachment.

They don’t know that they have handed you so much power and individuality. They don’t know that they severed the thing that was keeping you tolerating so many of their antics. They don’t know or anticipate that you might just chose to go NC with them once the divorce is final. Or that there will be new boundaries in place afterwards.

And every time they confront these truths they are forced one tiny step at a time to recognize that they don’t control you and your emotions and you don’t control them or their emotions.....and that you are responding to their actions.

I pray for strength and peace for you. I hope there is peace and love and joy at the wedding. And I know you can do this. And not just survive it....but use it as fuel and strength for your journey.

Hugs

Courage
  • Logged
Me 37
H 37
S15
Wallower/Chaos kid
EA discovered 3/31/2019
BD March 31 2019
EA ongoing? 🤷‍♀️ (Who knows?)
“God allows us to feel the frailty of human love so we’ll appreciate the strength of his.” C.S. Lewis

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10723
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#21: May 30, 2020, 12:11:27 AM
There is imho something simple and truthful about what Courage wrote here.
And I write as someone on the other side of a divorce I never imagined would be part of my story, that I didn't want and with a long-vanished xh.
It never felt like my then h had a plan....just a series of knee jerk reactions that took him inevitably to a different life without any bit of me. I honestly think he was quite often surprised by where he found himself. And he has lost a great deal that is irrecoverable; I did too, but he did it to himself. I suspect Courage is right that some MLCers feel a compulsion to rip off that attachment bandaid to us....but anecdotally it rarely seems to deliver what they expect even if they invest full-on in another attachment. Bc after all, what other attachment can replace years and years of a shared life with someone who really knows you and the bigger story of your life, no matter how much fun it feels? Chalk and cheese.

When they sever these threads, believing I think that it will liberate them, the truth is that actually it liberates us too. Maybe even a bit more. When my h was still my h, I felt a bunch of often unarticulated obligations towards him. And now I don't. And that frees up a lot of space for other things. Including being in control of your own story.

Swallowing the reality of a divorce you didn't want and an end to a phase of your life that you did not want to end is always painful. I'm so sorry, Mal. But from the other side I can tell you that, with a little time and distance, your perspective shifts. The reality is that you are mourning the loss of the marriage you had but truthfully that was already lost......the real reality is that you will be freed from what is now a paper marriage that brings nothing good or useful to you, marriage to a person who doesn't see (or no longer sees) family and marriage the way you do. And it is possible to mourn one and feel a sense of relief to escape the other. I did/do...I didn't think I would, but I do. LBS vets from the other side told me I would and they were quite right. It just takes a bit of swirling and a bit more time. I suppose like a plate stops looking like an empty plate and becomes a clean one  :)
  • Logged
« Last Edit: May 30, 2020, 12:13:16 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#22: May 30, 2020, 06:05:57 AM
Mal -
Thinking about you again today.
Courage and Treasur have (as always) give such wise and comforting words.
I am not quite as eloquent.
I hope that their words help.

Sending Hugs,
Sea

  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#23: May 31, 2020, 05:42:43 AM
Dearest Sea and Courage and Treasur,
Thank you for your guidance and your strength and your words of wisdom. The older I get the more I find that I do not understand about human behavior and feelings. I am just a simple girl.

I did some crash course learning on Attachment behaviors after reading your very thoughtful reply, Courage. He was definitely some form of avoidant all throughout, and a stereotype of the emotionally unavailable male.  He prided himself on being independent, even articulating it.  I gave him much freedom, perhaps I valued him more than me. No clue as to my own type. I thought I was secure, but now just a mess!

Even after a lifetime I do not know what his FOO issues are. I now sense some abandonment fear and much anger, and of course he built one huge wall. I can climb it thought Humpty Dumpty... Until the wall was literally too high.

Treasur as you experienced, his decisions seem completely unplanned to me. Lost, but still fiercely maintaining independence.

When he ran in the beginning he wanted nothing to do with me, caring for his family anymore or living in our town.  But now he’s moved back to the town- as a nomad, he helps his mother again but not to the same extent, and has touch and gos with our son, but all superficially as a ghost. 👻 Yes, he thinks, if he breaks his attachment to me he will be free and happy.

True, I am looking forward to peace at the end. I am so tired of trauma drama and never knowing what will happen next. In some ways our  marriage was a constant series of anxious wondering “what will h do next?” For he was high maintenance.  I can see the distant shore of peace, on the horizon and the sun is shining.  Yet I have much to lose at a late point in life with little to use as an anchor to rebuild. My crystal ball tells me that if we could work things out, we would be better together.  So yes, looking forward to peace, but it comes at a high cost.

Courage, so true, he cannot expect how the boundaries and the contact level will change on the other side. He has spoken of building a new relationship and co-existing, but I will be done. And as you so understand, I will not tolerate his antics when the last thread is broken. He thinks of me as steady and unchanging. He thinks this is all amicable simply because he still has all of his body parts. We obviously define amicable differently.

Some day he may regret the loss of me, but that too will pass. “I may regret this all my life” he said as he left, “but I will live with that consequence.”

H is lost. I mourn the loss of who he was.

He may have regrets in the future, but I have them now. I regret I stayed so long - thinking that the last few years together when the sky seemed to be falling were simply a bad season that would pass. I regret that I became invisible.  I regret that everything I sacrificed within this marriage was for naught, which makes me feel meaningless.  I regret and mourn the loss of my own identity and the family we built.

But I do not regret "not" being with the shell of a man he has become. Because truly only the memory of love, and compassion, keeps me from despising someone who ran away and all but left me for dead.  I acknowledge that I have a problem with forgiveness, particularly when the person keeps hurting me.

Thank you for the prayers and blessings wish. I have survived so many things in the last several years, that I expect I will survive the wedding. Want unmitigated joy.  Need Grace. Have love.  The kids have enough stress with a wedding in the middle of a pandemic.  Will have my family and my peeps with me. And I will dance with my son on his wedding day. “Every day is the hardest thing I have ever done.” (My motto)

Thank you for giving me strength and courage and understanding.  I feel much comfort in being here virtually with all of you.
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#24: June 01, 2020, 01:39:12 PM
Male, I have nothing to add that the others haven't already said, but just wanted to let you know I'm following and sorry these days are so hard for you. So many of your feelings and regrets are/were mine, too. There is nothing strange about you. You are not defective, you were just a kind and giving lady, doing what you thought was best for your marriage and family at the time. I suspect that just like many of us, you would not be as giving to your H or any other partner in the future. You would probably make sure that your needs are met, too. At least, that's what I have learned since BD.

The imminent thought of divorce hurts, of course. I have it coming soon, too. But I know that we will get through that day and it will not compare to what it was like to get through BD. We have the skills now to handle these difficult times. I'm hoping that it will actually be a relief to have that moment be over and done with.

Sending you hugs and lots of strength. x
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#25: June 01, 2020, 02:20:49 PM
LBS are all too often waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too hard on ourselves aren't we?  I know I am guilty of it. And so many of us seem to have a rough time of getting over the trauma, if we ever do. That we seemed to have lost our individual identity during the marriage. That maybe we were just going through the motions. Sure, there was joy and happiness. But maybe not fulfillment?

I don't know. I often go down that regret path too. But if I didn't marry H, there would be no S. And I may have been with someone else whose imperfections I pretzeled myself to accommodate. Or worse yet, another MLCer. The journey for us is one of self discovery. And it is a painful and lonely one indeed. But I believe there is a point to it. And even better, a reward.

I am so sorry you are going through this crap right now Mal.  And I know you will survive the wedding. And even better I think you will find some joy in it. Try not focus on the rantings of H. He is a bit of a crazy person now searching for his "happy." And the things he says are what a teenager might.

You are amazing and strong.



But I do not regret "not" being with the shell of a man he has become. Because truly only the memory of love, and compassion, keeps me from despising someone who ran away and all but left me for dead.  I acknowledge that I have a problem with forgiveness, particularly when the person keeps hurting me.


This right here shows you looking yourself straight in the mirror. And at the present reality. It is excruciating. But like everything else, it is temporary. For many more blessings are in store for you after the storm has passed.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

F
  • *
  • Trial Subscriber
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1176
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#26: June 01, 2020, 02:30:03 PM
I really relate to how you expressed your feelings in your last post.  The process of healing is long, but try to keep inching forward.  You will find that peace you spoke of.  I can only imagine a wedding in the midst of this MLC nonsense.  The feelings involved have got to be overwhelming and yet there is always great joy and hope in a new marriage.
  • Logged
Married 20 years
Husband is 43
Me-40
4 kids 6-15 years old

BD-October 2018-ILYBNIL, wants a divorce, this after I found out about OW 1(EA), OW2(PA) no longer together.  I believe he is single. 
April 2019 He got an apartment and moved out.
Oct 2019-Apologized for a years worth of monster behavior.  Still wants to start divorce this Spring, is distant, but friendly.  Tries more with kids, but mostly just helps haul them around(superficial).
Spring 2019 H agreed to put off the divorce another school year to keep the kids and I from moving back to TX.
2020-He has continued to help out when asked and be polite.  I do think he questions his choices at times.  I do not believe he has OW.
Oct 30 2020-He wants to get back together.  I am unsure.

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10723
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#27: June 02, 2020, 03:06:17 AM
As others say, Mal, looking in the mirror and trying with some self-compassion to be as honest as you can be with yourself is part of the process of healing. It is imho part of finding our own sense of peace with it all. We may not reach the same 'answers' but that probably doesn't matter; what matters is whatever your close spitting distance of truth is I think. And it is messy, not a straight line equation at all in my experience. And our perspective evolves with time and as our vista evolves as we move forward.

I have made thousands of mistakes in my life. But I have made very few with intentional disregard for hurting others....and when I have inadvertently done so, that has usually mattered to me enough to stop, try to do better or try to make some kind of amends. Tbh most of my mistakes probably hurt me more than they hurt others. But I think the same principle applies....once I realise I am hurting myself, I should stop, try to do better and try to make amends if I can. Whatever the cause, the reality is that usually we are dealing with spouses who are, or have become, so dysfunctional and emotionally disordered that they simply don't think or act this way. Which is often quite bewildering and painful for us to see and accept isn't it?

I found it hard to regret my marriage or relationship with my former h even if 'on paper' it makes perfect sense that I should bc the cost and damage was so big. Why? Bc I had never regretted it for one moment before my h changed so much and bc it had brought unanticipated great joys. Bc I believe that good reciprocal love (and it was for a very long time) is a blessing to experience in life and I am grateful that I know what that kind of love feels like tbh. And, most of all, bc many of my potential regrets were futile. I can't go back to 1997 or 2003 or 2008 or 2015 and make different choices. I did my best then based on my knowledge and experience at the time. And who knows what the paths untaken might have looked like. It matters to me that, even when I failed, even when I was spitting in a cruel wind, even tbh when I was being duped.....I still did my best to behave like a decent human and to honour what both my h and marriage and my core values turned out to mean to me. That imho is not chump change. It might not matter to anyone else at all, but it darn well matters to me....it is part of finding peace with it all I think. And it is simply not the factual reality of how our spouses behaved, which is their burden to carry. They should find some of their own actions despicable and they should feel ashamed of some of their behaviour if they are ever going to evolve into a better kind of human....to reach a point where they stop, try to do better and try to make amends where they can.  Some will and some won't, I'd guess.....

Your story is your story, Mal. As we grieve and detach and start to move forward with our own story, it is very easy for the pendulum to shift to the other extreme. But black glasses are no more true imho than rosy ones.....with time most of us find the middle point that feels close enough to our own truth as we adapt our story and start writing the next chapter. I am rather sad that my former h can't live the rest of his life thinking of himself as an essentially decent, honest and loyal person who has walked through life with a gentle tread.....unless he lies lol.....he rewrote his own story too....and that means I don't see him now in the way I used to. Which seems like a big loss to me bc I would have valued being loved and valued and trusted as much by so many people as my former h was. Sadly no one - including him if he is honest - will ever be able to look at him in quite the same way unless they are delusional or deceived....maybe that's less pressure for these damaged folks, idk

A wedding is both an end and a beginning, a step into the unknown landscape of a shared life. I hope on the day that your prayers and thoughts are about the courage, grace and trust involved in doing that for your son and his wife, and not about your h's failure. How much your son must love his wife to be and trust himself to make that commitment after seeing what his father did to his....which seems to me to be a lovely and hopeful thing, choosing the light rather than the darker side of human nature. And that, with time, when it feels safe, you will also be able to remember the good of your h and your shared life.....bc that was real too.....perhaps the best of him tbh....before he failed himself, his family and others so spectacularly.
  • Logged
« Last Edit: June 02, 2020, 03:11:11 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#28: June 02, 2020, 08:37:46 AM
Maleficent - I haven't posted much these last several months but I have been on in the evenings reading. 

I am so sorry that your H is making things even more difficult right now. 

I know the beach house is a place of rest and rejuvenation for you.  I hope that he will not become unreasonable about the sharing of it.  I know you look forward to your time there. 

As you've stated, weddings are usually stressful - even more so right now during a pandemic.  Lean on us for support and encouragement. 
  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#29: June 02, 2020, 10:57:19 AM
Still and Treasur, Milly, KIT and FJ,

Thank you for the words and strength and hugs.  You know the feeling when you look back and reflect at one's own words and wonder omg am I simply melodramatic?  Am I on the road to bitterness? 

FJ and Milly and KIT, thanks for understanding "the regret path." Maybe it is necessary for me to heal.  Because if I remember only joy, then there must be something horribly wrong with me that caused h to leave without trying.  Milly, yes, I will not love so fully or give completely of myself in that way again.   

Some low days.  Perhaps it is the world and all of the sadness and violence and pain? Perhaps the world mirrors what I feel in my heart?  Perhaps it is coming to terms and accepting that my marriage has been over for some time. 

And KIT, so true, having my son makes it all worthwhile. If I take a different angle of perspective and view the sacrifices for him then they have meaning. I cannot imagine if he didn’t exist.

Treasur, such a good metaphor - the rose colored glasses and the dark colored  glasses. It’s like when I believe people are either all good or all bad, and I need to be reminded that everyone is somewhere in the middle. In the beginning after the shock, I saw all the good, now not so much. Treasur’s pendulum.

I need to believe that I did the best I could with what I had at the time. 

My son did choose joy and I rejoiced in his decision to get engaged in the aftermath. He struggled when his father left and in some ways his father’s walk-away made a man out of him, a good man.  Yet I hear echoes in my mind of h saying to me that “vows are just words.” I need to block them out at the wedding. My son shares my values; he knows that a vow is a promise. Yes, FJ, such hope and such joy. 

Still, Thanks for being there and sending support.  You understand well my love of the beach and my fear that h will take it all away and my need to preserve it for my son.  Although since his father left, he does not love it quite so much, I see the pain in his eyes.  "The sea, the sea, the call of the sea...." 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#30: June 06, 2020, 02:13:15 PM
Mal - Catching up.
Others have said so many wise words.
I am/we are with you on this journey.

The wedding vows may be difficult to hear.
We believed that they were truly vows for so many years.
But you're right - your son has learned through his father's MLC and actions.
You've been the light and strength for him to learn right from wrong.
I'm so happy that you have each other.

Hugs,
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#31: June 14, 2020, 07:21:06 AM
One month until the Wedding

I am a bit of a mess.

A month before wedding, h has gone into Vanishing mode- his mail and bills pile up, but he has diverted checks to his P.O. Box. No sighting even around town.

Reading the RC thread listing our painful collective struggles.  Reading the postings on Milly's thread and megos about Moving On, I cannot imagine the beyond. Feeling empty. Nearly everything in my life has imploded in these last two and a half years. I am the common denominator. So grateful to my friends and family. I laugh and wear a strong mask in the outside world.  I cannot imagine my life after my son's wedding. Another chapter ends and perhaps the D actually begins.

Would so appreciate hearing from any of you who navigated a child's wedding in the midst of crazy.

As the mother of the groom, I am struggling with my understanding that my role is to acquiesce and smile. The bride's family alludes to logistics, but no one answers my questions about details-it is a destination wedding, although only one state away. I have a hotel room, but bride mentioned staying with all the girls the night before and the morning (which means I'll miss my son getting ready, although I expect my H will be with him. FOMO). Her mother implied I could stay at their place after the wedding. Not actually invited anyplace. Where will H stay?   Distances between hotel and their family home and the venue are a triangle each 45 minutes away.   I am a vagabond, with no family and no place. Feeling invisible.

And then the "revenge" dress... well with the pandemic, seamstress finally agreed to fit me- she wanted to do the dress by mail. Now she is off on her own design and I am frantically buying back up dresses online. Promised my son I will show up even if in trench coat. Feeling invisible.

Laughed with friends yesterday about developing bingo cards about inappropriate things that can go wrong at the wedding - I added, "mother of groom catches bouquet." Still have my humor.  It is my mask. 

Melancholy. Wishing for my h, my life partner, to talk to about the wedding and to reminisce about my S growing up, and his childhood struggles and how he grew into a fine man. It is what parents would do when they launch their child into his own family. No one there. If h had passed away, I would be able to talk to his spirit.

Pandemic finally loosening. Bride and groom are on edge about the logistics. Some guests are coming, some are uncomfortable. S working from home and trying to squeeze in another licensing exam. I offered a few times to drop off lunch, but no one responded. Hello?

Started bereavement group counseling by zoom. Family losses that I compartmentalized during the pandemic, all unleashed.  Cried on zoom. Handout on how people "mis"behave during bereavement so reminiscent of many of H's activities before BD. Received notice from my mother’s retirement community that deposit refund is now being processed. Cried again. It is real, she is gone.

Reading Barbie's thread about anger and emotions and wishing I had not kept feelings to myself. Wishing I had lashed out at h- he mostly hides behind the company of others. In the beginning, I was in shock and too bewildered and devastated to be angry. Then I felt I needed to be nice and compassionate and kind in our rare meetings. Never raised issue of ow to him - followed advice of therapist - I think she was afraid for me and the chance was never right.  I hate his amicable world, I hate his word "amicable." Today I am full of unexpressed rage.

So grateful to all of you for sharing your own pain.  I feel more real here in this virtual world where you all understand. 

Pandemic cocooning was safe. Want to look forward to wedding with unmitigated joy....
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10723
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#32: June 14, 2020, 09:06:33 AM
Ah dear girl.....mess and all  :)
I have no pithy advice or words of wisdom. Just wanted you to feel heard....
Well, maybe one....perhaps it is worth letting yourself feel how you actually feel, joy and not-joy alike, rather than aiming for somewhere else? You don't have to let how you feel drive your actions but trying to feel other than how you actually feel is quite a task  :)
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#33: June 14, 2020, 09:41:13 AM
Milly - I'm here too, listening and feeling your whirlwind of emotions and questions.
I'm sorry that this isn't what you envisioned for your son's wedding.
I'm sure that the pieces will fall into place as time passes.
You'll look beautiful in whatever you choose to wear -- because you are beautiful.
You're a gentle, kind, loving person and that can be seen.
Make sure that you remember your crown to wear with that dress.  You deserve it - wear it high and straight.
You may be alone in RL, but we will all be with you in thoughts and virtually.

Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

C
  • *
  • Trial Subscriber
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 589
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#34: June 14, 2020, 10:44:42 AM
Mal,

You are angry....rightly so. It is okay to be angry, it’s alright to not be alright.

Want to do a cathartic rage burn off?  Go to the dollar store and buy some plates and a sharpie.....write down every reason you are mad angry or furious.....the smash those plates!!!! Just and idea🤷‍♀️

Anger is of course our natural and proper response to injustice......and what is MLC if not unjust.  It’s okay to let yourself feel how you feel.

Sending you love right now.

❤️ Courage
  • Logged
Me 37
H 37
S15
Wallower/Chaos kid
EA discovered 3/31/2019
BD March 31 2019
EA ongoing? 🤷‍♀️ (Who knows?)
“God allows us to feel the frailty of human love so we’ll appreciate the strength of his.” C.S. Lewis

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#35: June 14, 2020, 03:38:03 PM
Oh, Male, I'm so sorry you're feeling so bad but it's totally understandable. Such an emotional time and your S's wedding fast approaching and you feeling left out. I would imagine it might be common for the parents of the groom to feel a little left out. I do feel for you having to face the wedding on your own though. I do hope you can let the thoughts of what you are missing out on go by the wayside and just enjoy the beautiful day for what it is: your S's happiness, the beautiful venue, and lovely food. I would think this will be a new good time ahead. Your S is marrying the woman he loves and will be building a family with her. You'll be able to see your S have this happiness. Just wear your revenge dress and smile and be happy.

I hope the bereavement counseling helps. And please don't berate yourself for not lashing out at your H. I did lash out, and it didn't help me at all. It made my H run, and worse, made me feel like a crazy fool. I know I have berated myself for not having behaved in certain ways before BD and people told me it would have made no difference. I'm telling you, nothing could have made a difference. Your H had problems long before you met him.

I do hope you can reach a bit of inner peace. Don't know how. No advice to give you, just sending you lots of hugs of support. xxx
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#36: June 16, 2020, 01:51:01 PM
I lashed out in the beginning too....well for about 2 years pretty much. And he's still a clinger. Their problems are their problems. I do believe there will come a time when expressing our emotions about all that happened will be the "right" time. And that is usually when we just don't care enough to say any of it. But I do understand the anger. Boy do I!

I also understand the vagabond/invisible feeling. That is especially hard when  we add that to the fact that our H's are in a new relationship and they have their person while we are still alone. But the thing is, look who they have. It isn't pretty. Maybe from the outside. And maybe not even then.

I understand your anxiety over all this. And your pain. It is unbearable at times bc we just want to talk to our H's like we used to. It is hard to come to terms with the fact that the person they were is long gone. Replaced with a shell of a person who doesn't really care about anyone but himself.  Hard hard hard to accept.

The revenge dress? Keep getting those back ups. You will find the one and look amazing. And when all the festivities begin, my guess is you will take in the moment and enjoy the day as best you can. A little Champs doesn't hurt.  ;D

And, in case H has any kind of pompous, arrogant, belittling look on his fat ugly face (sorry that is how I refer to my H when I'm really pissy), just keep in mind, he is far more miserable on the inside that you will ever be. Trust that. And adjust your crown while you're at it. You are the queen. And always will be.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#37: June 16, 2020, 05:56:58 PM
KIT -
I know your post was for Mal, but also resonated with me today.
Thank you.
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#38: June 23, 2020, 01:54:28 PM
And with those dress choices go for some fabulous shoe choices as well. 

I wish that you could have a whole troop of us with you on that day. Mal.   

There was a poster here (Shocked) whose daughter was getting married right at the beginning of her husband's MLC.  She hasn't posted in some time but I remember her also being quite nervous and anxious about how it was all going to go. 

  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

E
  • ****
  • Sr. Member
  • Posts: 297
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#39: June 23, 2020, 03:55:05 PM
Hey Mal. Nothing to add that wiser voices haven’t said. Just wanted to say that I can feel how you feel, and I know that empty melancholy invisible feeling as well. And I know the mask of humour you wear. I also know that saying ‘I know those feelings’ doesn’t take them away or really help. I just wanted you to know that you’re not alone.
  • Logged
M: 50 (48 @ BD)
H: 53 (51 @ BD)
Married 20yrs, together 23yrs
D: 21 (19 @ BD)
D: 19 (17 @ BD)
'Extra D': 19 (17 @ BD)
BD (that I didn't recognise as such) Easter 2018
BD 9th Sep 2018
OW (45, now 47) - he met her in the pub a week before BD, told me about her a week after BD. Thinks 'their planets have collided' because 'their eyes met across the room' and they had an 'instant connection'. Lives with her. Is building a life with her. Jun 20: H plans to buy a block of land and build a house with her.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#40: June 24, 2020, 01:33:35 PM
Thank you all  :-* Treasur, Courage, Milly, KIT, Sea, Still and Evermore,

I am just so emotional with the wedding that I am so comforted by being able to reach out and know that you all understand. Thank you ALL for understanding, the anger and the empty melancholy feeling and the mask of humor.

Courage, I love love love the idea of writing my anger out on the dishes and smashing them.  I was going to try it and then report how it felt.  Somehow with the world opening up again, I lost a week, and no dishes.  I may try it with paper plates just to feel the effect!!!

Treasur, thank you for the "permission" to not feel the unmitigated joy that I believe I should be experiencing.  It felt good to be told that it is okay, I feel what I feel--more like a mosaic of many different emotions, anger, sadness, grief gratitude and joy all at the same time.  Perhaps I need to find a kintsugi jar for a wedding gift for the kids or maybe one for me. 

Still, Thanks for the recommendation on Shocked--I will try to look up her threads and see about words of wisdom.  I will see the whole troop of you there with me.  We will all be wearing fancy shoes and pretty clothes.  I really do have to look good for this one. Thinking of a song from the musical Aida, when the other heroine, Amneris, whose heart is broken, yet becomes the female pharaoh, sings "So forget the inner me, observe the outer, I am what I wear and how I dress."   KIT, I will adjust my crown that day. 

Milly - so true--
Quote
Your S is marrying the woman he loves and will be building a family with her. You'll be able to see your S have this happiness. Just wear your revenge dress and smile and be happy.

Planning the wedding, thrilled it will happen.  Had some sad moments last night working on the seating chart with the kids and the bride's mother.  Seemed so sad, that my h and I will be sitting at two separate tables, with plenty of space in between.  It all became real when up on the white board.  I "sat" him with his mother.  And then the bride's mother asked, "who is sitting at this table?"  My son answered, "my dad."  And then he repeated "my dad."  He was always just "dad' before.  If ever I thought my heart was done breaking, it broke again when I heard his mournful, plaintive answer. 

A little boy remembering his dad and his once happy family.  I held it together though. 

I'll save you all a table.  When I walk down that aisle alone, you will all be with me.   :-*
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

N
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 875
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#41: June 24, 2020, 02:39:22 PM
Quote
And, in case H has any kind of pompous, arrogant, belittling look on his fat ugly face (sorry that is how I refer to my H when I'm really pissy), just keep in mind, he is far more miserable on the inside that you will ever be. Trust that. And adjust your crown while you're at it. You are the queen. And always will be.

I think there is a lot of truth in this although it doesn’t seem like it.  It’s such a shame the wedding has come now, while
You are still so hurt and life has been strange for the past months.  Do you have special friends attending Who will be your emotional support?
  • Logged

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 6192
  • Gender: Female
  • How I long for your precepts! Psalm 119:40
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#42: June 25, 2020, 06:43:48 AM
Maleficent,

Following along here with bated breath. Your son will begetting married around my 36th wedding anniversary. I share with you the angst and emotion...

Due to the pandemic, my son 28 has put off his wedding plans, they were planning to have a big party next year but this crisis has hit both of them financially. They already live together and as my father (minister) would say - they are in fact married. I am feeling rather relieved that the wedding bash has been put off as I feel that I couldn't deal with the extra tension and this is after nine years :(

We had such a happy and long marriage, yet weddings are so difficult to go to nowadays, especially weddings where both of us need to be present.

At the last wedding we both attended (his niece's), I was taken under my SIL's wing at the ceremony and she held both my hand and her husband's during the vows  - very sweet of her. At the party, my other nieces and nephews rallied round coming to sit at my table with my kids, out of sight of the main table where h. and ow were seated. I refused to be in the picture with ow so I slipped out. Later, they called me back to have me in the picture. The groom was particularly understanding and gave me a hug, saying that he loved me.

I am sure you will carry this off with elegance and dignity - we are with you all the way!
  • Logged
M 59
H 59
S 28
D 25
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#43: July 02, 2020, 04:47:31 AM
Nerissa and Mitzpah, Thank you.  Yes, I will have my tribe of close family and friends.  I will not be alone. And, of course, you will all be with me along the way.  Mitzpah, Thank you as well for the story of your experience--so helpful to understand what to expect.  I am sorry your son's wedding was postponed, but hopefully all will be better when it proceeds.

Collision

Two weeks until the wedding.  Shower was last weekend. Only MLC moment, was when I told my MIL she looked lovely -a bit fancy for event, but still lovely. She replied that it was the dress she wore to my wedding. Omg.  Were we still together it might have been a sweet gesture. Then she mentioned my h at least 3 times in our initial conversation. Perhaps she is pretending that nothing has changed.

H and I have had NC for almost a month- until yesterday. Longest silence yet. Then yesterday, our S was rear-ended on an errand to search my house for his birth certificate for marriage license. Of course I am at the beach and a bit far away to be of any use. Feeling guilty b/c I probably could have located certificate in one minute, but S didn't think he needed it before I left. S was okay, thankfully!  but truck is a mess and the other driver knocked down a phone pole that hung precipitously over S's truck for 6 hours. Although in one of my brave moments in the first year of BD trauma, I got h to sign over the title to S, stubborn insurance agent wouldn't simply give S his own binder and policy. Too complicated for agent (now worse situation).

Anyhoo, had several calls with S. Only briefly thought about letting h know, but I let that thought pass. So out of the blue I get text from h, telling me he knew about accident and went on about finding birth certificate. He hoped I was having a good time at beach house. His "postcard from camp" as I consider his random light and airy messages infuriated me.  Ultimately replied simply that I was relieved S was not hurt.  No reply.  Six hours later after truck extricated and towed and S home, I thought it would be a nice gesture to text h and let him know.  Nothing back. Not even civil reply.

Kids have seen h a few times this spring after a lapse of months. He popped over their house wearing either his mask or respirator. There is some question about whether he will show up for wedding and how long. Very anxious about COVID, hopefully not so to miss his only S's wedding.

I let h know over a month ago that when my health insurance ends, he is on his own.  No reply or acknowledgement.  I am a bit worried about being on cobra and the expense--planned my whole life so carefully to keep coverage and now I am adrift at the end. 

Beach is lonely. Postponed annual bash due to pandemic. Only small group of people in the bubble. Now not sure my son will make it down without truck. Without him, it doesn't feel like home anymore. House still shows h's lack of usual loving care. MIL has been down daily, but I am seeing signs of early dementia.  Last year in midst of T&G, I invited h to join us for the 4th. Not this year though, for so many reasons including his lack of concern following my mother and aunt's deaths. His lack of reply yesterday after the accident was telling. We are slowly erasing each other.
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#44: July 02, 2020, 12:11:33 PM

Beach is lonely. Postponed annual bash due to pandemic.


Mal - sorry that you aren't enjoying the beach - that seems to be a place where you usually find peace and relaxation. 

Also sorry to hear of the accident involving S but good to read that he wasn't injured. 

  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

E
  • ****
  • Sr. Member
  • Posts: 297
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#45: July 02, 2020, 07:45:03 PM
Mal, I'm so glad you will have a tribe of loved ones around you (and yes, we'll be there with you in spirit as well). And so glad your son wasn't hurt!

I completely 'get' the surreal feelings you get when talking to someone like your MIL when they ignore what is happening and just carry on as though things are normal and fine (my FIL says similar things to me).

The 'postcards from camp' analogy is absolutely spot on! I get those types of messages too. 'Nothing to see here. Move along, move along. Just normal life, nothing crazy is going on.' Mind boggling.

Your last line 'We are slowly erasing each other' breaks my heart. It makes me think of the scene in HP where Hermione wipes her parents memories with the Obliviate spell. I think of it often as I feel that is what my H is also trying to do. So needless (and cowardly and senseless and blah blah blah). Onwards and upwards I guess is the only answer when we feel this desolation. Keep on slogging through, I am slogging through with you. xx
  • Logged
« Last Edit: July 02, 2020, 07:46:13 PM by Evermore »
M: 50 (48 @ BD)
H: 53 (51 @ BD)
Married 20yrs, together 23yrs
D: 21 (19 @ BD)
D: 19 (17 @ BD)
'Extra D': 19 (17 @ BD)
BD (that I didn't recognise as such) Easter 2018
BD 9th Sep 2018
OW (45, now 47) - he met her in the pub a week before BD, told me about her a week after BD. Thinks 'their planets have collided' because 'their eyes met across the room' and they had an 'instant connection'. Lives with her. Is building a life with her. Jun 20: H plans to buy a block of land and build a house with her.

N
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 875
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#46: July 03, 2020, 09:50:19 AM
For me, the ‘Postcard from Camp’ style of communication hurts and infuriates because it denies the years of intimacy and shared lives.  It feels like a new rejection every single time.   Unfortunately, when they write more intimately, it keeps us entangled and that’s probably worse in the long run.

I’ve fairly recently come to a place where I can be somewhat objective about these and about replying.  It is a great relief.  I believe the only way is time and distance and re building our own life so that eventually we don’t feel left out and left behind.  And somehow their new life seems unattractive.  It’s hard but it’s the only way, I think.
  • Logged

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#47: July 03, 2020, 09:53:01 AM
Well as far as erasing each other, I do not believe it is possible. Yes, the sting will dissipate and the longing might go away. But far more likely for the LBS to move forward in a new and healthy relationship bc we are doing the work. And if we do get there, we can look on the past with a smile and fond memories. But an mlcer? Not likely at all. Shoving down emotions, avoiding conflict and uncomfortable situations (by their own making) will generate no peace for them. Only way to erase us is through further distraction. And that is only temporary. We are a big piece of their world. Trust that.

Sorry the beach was lonely Mal. I wish I could come hang out there with you. I feel lonely too, though I’m ashamed to admit bc I do have my S13 with me. But well, adult interaction is important. And well, we do miss those mlcers don’t we? The old version of course.

I too think mil was completely uncomfortable and embarrassed. And hey maybe her wearing that dress was her making a statement without making a verbal one.

Hugs friend. Wish I were there on that beach having a glass of champs with you today!
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#48: July 03, 2020, 09:55:01 AM
Nerissa—I love what you wrote!
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#49: July 10, 2020, 05:59:34 AM
Thank you so much Still, Ever, KIT and Nerissa,

Ever, yes--just like Obliviate. Perfect analogy.  I have that image etched in my mind now.   

Still and KIT, not sure whether COVID or everything around me, but the beach is different this year.  Fewer people as we kept to the core group.  My son had a rental car and came down for a few days, but I absorbed some of his stress about the wedding and the accident. Not himself.   In limbo waiting to see if the car is totaled.  KIT, wish you could have come for some champs--signature drink this vacation is a pear martini with elderflower. 

KIT, love the thought that my MIL wore the dress to make a statement.   :-*  She keeps talking about my h this whole vacation - a bit hero worshipping, favorite child sort of thing that annoys her other two children.  Funny that I am here with all of them and not him once again. 

Nerissa, thank you for this perception--
Quote
For me, the ‘Postcard from Camp’ style of communication hurts and infuriates because it denies the years of intimacy and shared lives.  It feels like a new rejection every single time.   Unfortunately, when they write more intimately, it keeps us entangled and that’s probably worse in the long run.

Since I have been here, he has ignored anything having to do with emotions--the wedding and my son's accident and the aftermath.  H sent random business messages about the birth certificate, how the septic folks are coming to clean the system and finally recognizing that he needs health insurance, but asking me to gather documents for him.  I have ignored him - although I went home and retrieved the certificate so my S can get marriage license and I handled the septic system clean out.  I am not his mother and h fired me from the role of wife, partner, secretary.  If he cannot bother to respond to a message about how our son is doing after the accident, sewer system not worth my reply.  Read a response Acorn wrote on another thread-if I am sending a kind message, need to do so for me, and not with any expectations. 

Vivid dream the night before last- My son was a small child again and he and I went into the city with my parents (magically and healthily in their 70s again) and two cousins.  My father presented me with a pallet of legos, each arranged orderly and beautifully into a city scene with happy people.  My toddler son and I got separated from the rest and I was still carrying the beautiful lego town. My cell phone disappeared; we were on our own.  Every step I took, however, jiggled the legos.  They broke apart and I tried to fix them.  The breaks became too much and I finally gathered the pieces in the box, put it on the ground and danced wildly with my son in my arms.  Then I walked into a building and gave my son to a nurse (DIL to be is a nurse) who could give him a better life than I could.  Woke up sad and crying.   

The wedding is a week from tomorrow.  I can do this.  Have visions of pouring a bottle of champagne on my h's lap if he looks at me smugly.  We all know I will not do it, but it gives me comfort to picture it so. 

Thank you - love you all. 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#50: July 11, 2020, 06:40:20 PM

The wedding is a week from tomorrow.  I can do this.  Have visions of pouring a bottle of champagne on my h's lap if he looks at me smugly.  We all know I will not do it, but it gives me comfort to picture it so. 
 

Yes, indeed.....you CAN do this! 

I hope that your S and new DIL will be very appreciative of the effort you put in to help make their day a joyous and festive one. 

Keep us updated as you have time, Mal! 
  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#51: July 11, 2020, 07:00:46 PM
Oh girl you CAN do this. Elegantly, with dignity, grace and some bada$$ strength. You are going to look stunning with a beauty emanating from the inside. B/c my dear, YOU are a beautiful soul. And God loves you and chose you to be the mother of this amazing boy about to take the vow of matrimony despite the poor role model of his father. B/c of YOUR strength. B/c of YOUR love. You made this happen. I am awe struck by you right now.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#52: July 20, 2020, 04:22:36 PM
The Wedding
The wedding was spectacular. Thank you all for your good thoughts. The bride was beautiful, the groom beamed with love and the groom's parents were on their best behavior.

Some MLC highlights-

"Stern as death is love" (my scripture reading for the ceremony)

Rehearsal went smoothly, h ignored me completely at the church, even though I was sitting next to him, and at the dinner at the bride's family home.  H met bride's parents for the first time at the church.

Thankfully two nephews escorted me down the aisle, so we didn't have to walk down together. We did sit in the same pew. I practiced my reading and looking around, I noticed H staring at his phone and texting, no eye contact. At the dinner, our only contact was when I went for dessert in front of him. H left early.  I said goodbye as he walked by me, but no response.  Noted h was wearing some odd jewelry- thick rope gold necklace, green beaded bracelet and a black scrunchy bracelet- learned later it was a survival bracelet with a hidden knife. Had I known weapons were expected, I might have brought my own.

Morning Of
H was with my son and the groomsmen, I was with the girls. The best man FaceTimed me for a quick second so I could see my boy. I heard through the grapevine that H was taking lots of pictures, so I swallowed up my pride and texted him for a few which he sent. 

The bride's limo bus to the service never arrived, so I texted my son, the best man and finally H. H wrote back telling me he was speaking to my cousins- some of them anyway, one side plus my gal pals decided not to speak to him. So, that broke the ice and we spoke when I arrived.

Wedding ceremony
As I started down the aisle, I stepped inside the church, a wave of emotion came over me, everything at once. Joy, love, sadness for the quick passing of time.

Held it together. Gave a reading about love and devotion without crying, actually did a pretty excellent job. Got back into the pew and h commented "good job." Might have been his first compliment in decades. Then, the priest's reading and sermon was on the subject of divorce and how it's all very good in the early years, but couples need to lean on each other during the tough times and avoid divorce. We both stood stiffly, as he seemed to be speaking directly to us.

I started bawling during the vows. H turned to me, teasingly said "no crying." It was like the real H returned for just a few seconds. When the priest asked the kids if they would accept children lovingly from God, I nudged H and said "grandchildren." H smiled back.

Reception
We had very little contact during the reception. Pictures were quick. After the cocktail hour we were supposed to proceed into the venue as a couple. They couldn't find H, son's new MIL looked at me and said where is he? Then we both smirked "not my problem anymore."  He showed up, I grabbed his arm, gave a big smile and waved my bouquet as we stepped inside the room. Then we went our separate ways. I heard he left early. Had a moving mother-son dance; h had left the building.

My MIL apparently told my cousins that I will always be her DIL and one of h's nephews expressed to me how upset he was about our split- stressed repeatedly that it s!cked. Then he said some really nice things about how I was able to hold everything together for the wedding. I told him that it was for my son, and it was simply all about love.

H gave an impromptu toast- went up and grabbed the microphone. I had a moment of mortification. His toast began self-centered, but it ended nicely with how happy he was for his son. I never heard him call our boy his "son " before. I was touched, and felt some of his emotion, but some of my friends and relatives were horrified.

Then, I danced with joy all night.

At midnight, just for me, I texted H, and told him we had done well and raised a strong and kind son.

Not sure how I was able to channel the grace and strength. It came from the universe. And I thought of all of you there with me.

Then Monday, I had an email from my lawyer wanting me to contact her. At least we were still married for the wedding. The downward roller coaster continues.


"For stern as death is love,
relentless as the nether-world is devotion;
its flames are a blazing fire.
Deep waters cannot quench love,
nor floods sweep it away."

  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 6192
  • Gender: Female
  • How I long for your precepts! Psalm 119:40
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#53: July 20, 2020, 05:35:38 PM
Maleficent,


That was lovely. So proud of the love shown!

You are truly a lovely mother and partner - I am guessing he realized it
  • Logged
M 59
H 59
S 28
D 25
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 11209
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#54: July 20, 2020, 05:57:19 PM
So so well done!
  • Logged
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/chapter-contents.html

9
  • *
  • MLCer Type: Clinging Boomerang
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 600
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#55: July 20, 2020, 06:51:58 PM
You were a Queen and you wore that crown well!

So proud of you Mal, just so proud! 
  • Logged
Husband 55
Me 55
Kids 3 sons 29, 27, 25 1 daughter 20
BD #1 Spring 2016
BD #2 Winter 2017
married 33 years.  Together 35
H never moved out except 3 weeks after BD #1
OW 30 year single mom employee-He says EA only I don’t believe him.

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#56: July 21, 2020, 08:20:31 AM
You did it!  Well done.   

Thanks for sharing the wedding day with us. 

I'm sorry that you feel it's a downward roller coaster right now.  We're here to support you along all aspects of the ride. 
  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#57: July 21, 2020, 09:20:20 AM
Not sure how I was able to channel the grace and strength. It came from the universe. And I thought of all of you there with me.


No my dear, that was all  you. We of course were there for you, but you did the heavy lifting all on your own.

And having had the opportunity to see photos of you on the big day, I will say that your beautiful soul came through magnificently. One of the most gorgeous Mothers-of-the-groom I ever saw!
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

N
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 875
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#58: July 21, 2020, 01:38:06 PM
It sounds a beautiful Wedding and you were marvellous.  H sounds a bit of a saddo to me. Going early doesn’t sound like a happy man.
  • Logged

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#59: July 21, 2020, 02:09:47 PM
You were a perfect example of grace and love. As hard as this day must have been for you, I sense that you had a wonderful day and weekend, and that's all that matters. So good of you to share the wedding day, so that others who will have to face a day like this, can have a positive example to follow.

There's no doubt that your in-laws and nephews love you. Your H did not come off that well. And fancy he was texting during the wedding! And then he leaves early. I would imagine that he wasn't getting enough attention, or you looking awesome, was making him feel bad. And to make sure you feel as bad as him, he hits you with a D request the following morning. Tit for tat, judy like a hurt child behaves. It's a primal behaviour to lash out against someone who is hurting you. Not that you have any blame in his pain, but he hasn't figured that out yet. Don't dwell too much on the D request, they pretty much all do it, and it's often a reaction. It's just more Replay. To be honest, as I face a D any minute now, I'm relieved to get this last hit behind me. Enough of this psychological black mail.

I hope that for the next few weeks, you keep happy images of your S's wedding in your mind. I hope you exchange loads of photos and stories with friends and family. I would imagine your S might have been a little apprehensive about his parents having to be together on his day, but you made sure he had only good memories. He will love you for this. x
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#60: July 23, 2020, 05:29:02 AM
Oh, you are all so kind and sweet.  Thank you Milly, Nerissa, KIT, Still, Roo, XYZ and Mitzpah for your very kind words. And your continuing support.  I was touched.  And, Roo, thanks for lending me the jeweled crown.  KIT, I still do not know where the grace came from, I do think it was from some place divine. And, thanks for the compliments!

Milly, I do feel loved by those around me.  I am blessed.  We all fear losing our old lives sometimes more than the marriage unit, but I think I have been able to hold onto the people who are important in my life, my family.  I am approaching the part, too, as you say, when I need to get the psychological black mail behind me.  I will not heal until he is truly gone.  Had another drive by sighting this week - first since COVID, I was out trimming the hedges, looked up and saw him drive by - it is a busy road; he looked straight ahead, no emotion on his face.  I do not know what caused me to look up at that second, but we are still connected somehow in this universe. 

Nerissa, I did see a candid picture of h - following me out of the church pew, he was scowling and did not take his mother's arm to escort her down the aisle.  You are correct, that is not a happy sign.  It made me sad that he did not think of his mother. 

And now the D battle looms ahead, that which I truly dread.  I did feel at the wedding that I was able to detach from him, so I can turn it on and off now, I hope.   

But now, I not only have a son, I now have a daughter!

Love you all.   :-*  Thank you for being here. 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#61: July 31, 2020, 08:55:57 AM
Struggling this week with the concept of Surviving v. thriving.

Reading through the threads and am so impressed with the strength and the rebuilding that I see.  Following Watcher as he runs and kayaks through history and gelato stops.  Maybe we see in the threads what we need next.  Am not a runner or anything approaching athletic.  Cannot ride a bicycle so no Harley therapy for me either.  Trying Roo's meditation challenge. 

I have been out of work one year now today.  Fastest "gap year" of my life, with deaths and family medical appointments and hospice and settling my mother's estate, and COVID and crazy h and my son's wedding.  I  expected to be further along with my own growth by now, or have a sense of what I want.  Beginning to see that it is all about the journey whereas I was more destination focused in my past.  I have had many interesting different careers, but now I need to figure out what I will be when I grow up.  Something with meaning.  Did some online courses during the pandemic, but I am still a dilettante in life.  Attended an uncle's funeral service yesterday - he had a life well lived.  Death is starting to feel like a part of my family now; I have learned much about life with all the deaths since h left.  2 years, 10 months. Mother, two aunts, three uncles, a few friends.  Death needs to go away for a little while. 

Saw my lawyer yesterday.  I always feel better when I see her - like more empowered.  H never produced documents during the pandemic, pre-wedding pause.  My lawyer has never seen a D like this one - he pushes forward and then disappears.  Of course, I find that comforting, because I will always wonder whether he broke or was it the M or was I truly horrible.  I might have been the last person to see the cracks and understand he built a wall I could never climb.  I am starting to feel as though I may survive the end.  Beyond that, not sure; refuse to play happy fractured family.  Not enough grace or forgiveness in my wheelhouse.   

Saw h a few days ago - always sets me back a step or two in my healing.  He did contact in advance this time about coming for his mail.  I finally got that boundary down.  Exchanged pleasantries.  He promised me some wedding photos and then offered to take away a fallen tree.  Promises, promises.  Then, of course, he had to mention D -  why can't we have a basic 5 minute conversation without him having to raise the purple elephant in the room - he was wondering about taxes and whether we would be D'd, by the end of the year.  Could not look at me when he spoke.  I did not answer.  Dressed in camo, some jewelry and a mask and gloves.  I mentioned the wedding and how happy the bride and groom were, but he brushed aside the topic-he cannot handle any simple discussion involving emotions. 

Sightings of him are always unsettling.  I guess I would call him a "semi-close contactor" if I am looking for a type.  Interestingly he did not appear at all in the kids' wedding highlight video.  A ghost. 

How does one get from surviving to thriving?  I have fun, I have moments of joy (and incredible sorrow), but I do not feel as though I have purpose.  So, maybe I am stuck in survivor mode.  Reading comments on Kit's thread about purpose and waiting patiently for direction from God.  I am trying to be quiet, but I am impatient. 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#62: July 31, 2020, 09:40:28 AM
You've dealt with a lot of deaths in a short amount of time. That is so very difficult. My mother passed away 20 years ago and I still miss her every day. Some holes are just too big to fill. I wonder if our H's are like that too. Strange to think that since they have become such vapid, immoral creatures not seeming to care at all about the person/people they left behind. But I suppose the hole is for their former self, the H's we USED to have. B/c that version is gone. And is that large hole all them? Or is it more the entire life we shared with them. I suspect it is the latter. And I also suspect that you were the major, if not entire, creator of that former life.

I know for me, it was mostly me. And maybe it wasn't all great, the things I did. But I did them. Was there purpose? Mmmm, not sure I really thought much about those things then. But, if we did it before, we can again.

Seeing my H jars me as well. So I am trying to not see him in person. It's been 3 weeks and though it was so hard in the beginning, it is really much better. Of course, with a clinging boomerang, JUST when I am feeling really great, he will resurface. Like a cockroach you thought you had killed before. Glad you made that boundary. Maybe now just proceed with the business end of the D and get it done. Easy for me to say from the cheap seats, but I think so many of these MLCers get stuck. We cannot get them un-stuck. But we also don't need to be stuck with them.  It is hard b/c we are a fiercely loyal bunch. But if you think about the D as business only, and that anything can happen after, then maybe it gets better.

The marriage we had is dead. I often think that IF H and I were to ever reconcile, BIG IF, it would be totally new. Like we never met (ish), b/c with children, history, etc, that is not possible. But then we would also have to enter into a new relationship. Everything is changed. Will we even like the new versions? Maybe, assuming they did the work. And then if all the planets are in alignment, then a re-marriage, vow renewal is possible. I guess my point is, that you and I see the D as so final. And truly any finality with the old R with these MLCers happened at BD.

I am impatient too. But seeing what we need to see. And doing what we need to do is all we can right now. Listening to God with an open heart. We will find our paths my friend. I suspect we are already on them and just don't realize it.

Hugs.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

9
  • *
  • MLCer Type: Clinging Boomerang
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 600
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#63: July 31, 2020, 09:50:45 AM
Don’t sell yourself short on thriving Mal.  From those of us following along we see it more and more every time you share your story.  You have dealt with death better than most of us and you knocked it out of the ballpark in the handling of your sons wedding.  I hope you can look back and see that you are indeed thriving. 

Finished up my first 21 days of meditation and on to a new series focusing on getting unstuck.  It has taken me 4 years to be able to calm my mind enough to meditate and I’ve also started reading books again, which completely stopped during replay.

I’m learning how to live in the moment and enjoy each day.  It’s a hard lesson for all of us planners.  Take the time to recognize all the things you have done to thrive.  There are many.

Lots of hugs.

Roo
  • Logged
Husband 55
Me 55
Kids 3 sons 29, 27, 25 1 daughter 20
BD #1 Spring 2016
BD #2 Winter 2017
married 33 years.  Together 35
H never moved out except 3 weeks after BD #1
OW 30 year single mom employee-He says EA only I don’t believe him.

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#64: August 01, 2020, 10:17:14 AM
As KIT says.......some holes are just too big to fill. 

Maleficent - pretty certain that most folks here understand the concept of surviving vs. thriving.  I'm further ahead of you on the path and I'll be honest and tell you that there are days where it's still just about surviving.  Oh sure, I have lots of days where there is thriving happening but the hole is just too big to fill.   You are in the trench now with him pushing to get the D wrapped up.  It hurts and it sucks.   I sure get that. 

You've had a lot of loss over the last couple years, combined with the pure craziness of living through the crapshow your H has created.  No surprise that you feel a bit like you're trying to survive and that there's not a lot of thriving currently happening. 

I hope you can find a therapy that works for you, gives you some peace and helps you feel like you can face whatever needs to be faced.   This place is one of the things that helps me because it helps me to see that there are so many others that truly understand what it's like.   Sending you a cyber hug!
  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

C
  • *
  • Trial Subscriber
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 589
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#65: August 01, 2020, 11:29:42 AM
Mal,

How do you get to thriving.
By becoming the main character in your own life. By romanticizing your life.
By deciding that you write your own narrative and then say the damn thing aloud over and over and over and over again until you believe it.
 
By recognizing that wherever you go next, you want, deserve and need to come first....and recognizing that you teach people how to treat you....so you must put yourself first.....and do it over and over and over until it’s a habit you won’t break. Until your first instinct is to honor yourself and you recoils from people that don’t treat you with honor respect and love. 

I like to say to myself.....what would the main character (courage) do next in her story? And instinctively my heart leaps in a direction....wether that’s a bubble bath a walk or buying myself a new houseplant.

❤️ Courage
  • Logged
Me 37
H 37
S15
Wallower/Chaos kid
EA discovered 3/31/2019
BD March 31 2019
EA ongoing? 🤷‍♀️ (Who knows?)
“God allows us to feel the frailty of human love so we’ll appreciate the strength of his.” C.S. Lewis

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10723
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#66: August 01, 2020, 12:03:18 PM
If it helps, Mal - fwiw, sample of one - I am finding that there is something else between Surviving and Thriving but I'm not at all sure what it's called  :)
I just know it bc I know I am no longer just Surviving.....and I am not yet Thriving either. But it is not a bad spot at all, some of it is quite nice.....just don't know what it is  ::)....
So you might want to not beat yourself up about failing to leap in one mighty bound from one to the other  :)

And purpose? Yup, I struggled with that a lot last year. I think I even posted about it. Again, sample of one, but I am noticing that when I stopped chasing it, somehow in a weird way it started to sneak towards me (slowly, so slowly). As if I was letting the universe speak rather than demanding it answer if that makes sense? Not there yet, but almost there....and more important maybe my faith in a lovely There has come back. Keep faith; give it time, my friend. Let your beautiful interesting jigsaw pieces, that got thrown in the air so painfully, settle.....
  • Logged
« Last Edit: August 01, 2020, 12:05:11 PM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#67: August 11, 2020, 09:03:55 AM
KIT and Roo and Treasur, Still and Courage,  Thank you for leading me along and your words of wisdom and understanding.  Roo, you do give me too much credit for growth, but thank you!  Kit, you made me laugh - " Like a cockroach you thought you had killed before." Treasur, perhaps there is a middle ground between Surviving and Thriving--where for every step forward there is another one in reverse.  And, Still, and KIT you are right, perhaps it is too soon - I have felt so much loss lately, but I want to be in that better place where there is no pain.  Holes too big to fill.  Time is passing too quickly while I wait to heal.   I cannot yet hear the voice of God or the voice of the universe.   Still, I agree, HS gives me comfort through our collective pain and understanding and attempts to heal.  Courage, loved the definition of being the heroine in my own story.  My heroine is lost in the tangled woods right now and she keeps going into the same house made of candy canes and meeting the same witch.

And back into the candy cane house in the forest full of pain -

Over the weekend, pretty much confirmed the existence and identity of ow-2.  The barmaid/proprietress at the local Asian restaurant.  This is the one who gave me the once over and hustled me out of the restaurant just before covid when I went to pick up takeouts for my inlaws hospital-related stay and spotted h, drinking at the bar and chatting up the barmaid.  We took the measure of each other in one stare.  She was hard and cold and calculating.  He was the patron spending money.  Two people using each other.  Only all of h’s assets are tied up with me and include my retirement.  Need to fight to protect myself.

The final clue came during girls’ weekend with new DIL, when my S saw his dad and texted new wife a Korean bread recipe.  This is the man who avoided most cultural foods, yet was at the bar drinking and eating sushi and tofu.  It explains his Jade beaded bracelet and Asian style trendy watch (but not the survival bracelet with weapon) at the wedding and the new style of dressing. 

Wondering if each new ow is progressively more calculating?  AD.

And, few in RL, even knew about ow-1, so feeling a bit alone.  My work family knew, but not my family or our mutual friends – keeping the information closely held was part of my paving the way strategy.  The work family is now spread to the wind with staff reductions and COVID. I had to calmly process this weekend -so thank you for being here for me. Silent rage.  Silent screams.  Channeled my anger to win game night. 

Glad now I did not send birthday greetings to h last week-thank you.  With you all behind me, I held back. Told myself I would break my little fingers.  It was a significant birthday for him.   

So many “last straws.”  This ow is not “true love.” I saw her look at me. She did not look at him with love.  I am disgusted. I am beyond angry now at how he has treated me, both leading up to and after BD.  I am angry that I have to grovel to use our beach house, and he commandeers all the rent.  He left me to fend for myself financially, leaving me with expenses, and now he wants what he wants.  His manic spending along the way and his need for “things.”   Cold and heartless when my family members died.    Financial, emotional, and physical betrayal.  I can see him going now from ow to ow.  Needing attention and adoration.  So angry.  I do not want him back.

Ow-2 hurts in a different way. 

Perhaps I will cycle, perhaps not.  I do not want to see him again. 

Love you all.  Thank you. 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#68: August 11, 2020, 12:45:13 PM
Oh Mal, I remember you writing about that encounter. Your spidey senses were triggered.

I think it is really healthy to remember how abused we were by these MLCers. We LBS tend to get so invested on the healing part and paving the way for our wayward spouse, we "forget" and forgive way too soon. We want so badly for the pain to stop, we are willing to do anything to get that old life back. But I am starting to see now that having a returning MLCer would likely cause way more pain for us in the beginning.


I am angry that I have to grovel to use our beach house, and he commandeers all the rent.  He left me to fend for myself financially, leaving me with expenses, and now he wants what he wants.  His manic spending along the way and his need for “things.”   Cold and heartless when my family members died.    Financial, emotional, and physical betrayal.  I can see him going now from ow to ow.  Needing attention and adoration.  So angry.  I do not want him back.


I think this is the right attitude and appropriate to feel after what they have done.  I mean, would we ever expect this kind of behavior from someone we are just starting to date? Why would we accept it from someone who knows us better than anyone else?  We deserve so much better. And more importantly, they don't deserve us! Hard fact to accept. But I think we get there sloooooooooooooooowly.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4221
  • Gender: Male
  • Back to being #1 for my daughters!!!!
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#69: August 11, 2020, 01:20:56 PM
Hello,

Quote
Two people using each other. 

Couldn't have said it better myself. People use drugs and that is what ow2 is to your h. A substance to fill a void. Best advice is to stop wasting energy on either one of them. The principal to take is that regardless of whether he stays with her a week or decades, as long as he is with her, he can't be with you. His loss, not yours.

When you see your value and worth that's when you go from surviving to thriving. I remember the worst parts of Bomb drop, when I felt less than her, that it was my fault and that Om was better than me. That my ex deserved OM.

Quote
Only all of h’s assets are tied up with me and include my retirement.  Need to fight to protect myself.

Yes, and know that he will try to take advantage of you at any opportunity. Drug addicts will cheat and steal from anyone- especially family. He is know different. You never want to be dependent on an addict.

Quote
I do not want him back.

In his current state, he doesn't deserve you. Not in the least.

I think you need to stop seeing yourself as Maleficent but instead realize you are Magnificent.

(((((Ready)))))
  • Logged
"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#70: August 12, 2020, 02:32:36 AM
Male, I can hear strength in you. This revelation about the OW, which your spidey senses had already informed you of, has been like an awakening. We hope and pave the way, forgive and let ourselves be abused in the process. But then one day, when we see a little more clearly, we realize that if we give to them, they will just take, and for nothing that will benefit us.

This new information hurts, any information about the OW still hurts me. But I think the pain is being directed to anger now, and I've found that to be a very useful tool for getting myself to the next level.

Male, you are a gorgeous, ladylike, smart, kind woman and a man like your H is right now, is way below you. Trust your gut, as it has proven to be correct. Do make sure your finances are justly protected as he will blow every penny he gets on bracelets and what nots. x
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#71: August 16, 2020, 01:25:28 PM
Milly, Ready and KIT,  Thanks for your thoughts.  Milly you made me blush a bit--thanks for the boost.  And, Ready, thanks for the new name!  Made me laugh.  Milly and KIT, yes - the anger is empowering and helping me move along.  KIT, so true, would not put up with this behavior from anyone I met now.  Maybe we met too young and behaviors grew into patterns.

This was a hard week.  Maybe because of isolation and not having a job and the D in progress.

And the H sightings and behind the scenes drama still throw me.  Discovered h closed out one of his life insurance policies that I had been paying forever.  He did not tell me – I noticed automatic withdrawal did not go through.  Then I discovered on the same day that he wrote two recent checks to ow-1.  Seething.

Reviewed his old document production – overwhelmingly more things not produced than produced—keeping secrets.  I felt like the COO who realizes that the CEO was “skimming” money.  Financial betrayal.

Ready – you said something that resonated—

Quote
addicts will cheat and steal from anyone- especially family. He is know different. You never want to be dependent on an addict.

I trusted him too much, I felt "less than".  I have grown much since BD.  Milly, yes, they just "take."  Ready, I like your definition--
Quote
When you see your value and worth that's when you go from surviving to thriving.

Then, landscaper comes over.  He mentions h—they are casual friends.  Tells me where h is living now (5th move last month) and expressed concern about his volunteer community obsession-that it will not end well. 

So, just as all this was happening, h texts to pick up his mail.  And, he is very friendly and chatty. Talks about the cake his family had for his birthday – first time he has celebrated his birthday with them since he left, talks about the wedding, talks about his nephews, learned about my uncle who just passed—must pepper our S with questions.  Offers me the beach house for open times this fall.  He doesn’t ask about me, but I mention in passing girls weekend with new DIL.  Slight shadow crosses his brow.  His arms are covered in poison ivy.  Still handsome.  Helps me figure out where the underground garden pipes were buried—garden faucet blew off in microburst.  I am holding the pipe and I so resist the urge to use it.   I cannot taste green, but I assume he is happy in la la land with ow-2. 

Later discovered he bounced two checks on one of his accounts.

I wanted to lash out about my discoveries this week- but leaving it for the lawyers.  My competing emotions balance each other out and I appear calm and steady. I feel like I am watching myself from afar.   Wished him a happy birthday as he left. 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

G
  • **
  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 57
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#72: August 16, 2020, 03:41:38 PM
Hope that the bounced checks were to ow1.  Mail, I’m still in the boat with you.  Still lifting us all up in prayers. 
  • Logged

G
  • **
  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 57
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#73: August 16, 2020, 03:42:21 PM
Mal not mail.  Autocorrect on my phone.  Sorry
  • Logged

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#74: August 24, 2020, 06:41:54 AM
Oh the bounced checks! H”s bank statements still come here. And there are always several of those skinny envelopes that inevitably start coming toward the end of the month. Pathetic. Especially for a man in his position.

Hope you have a better week Mal. The rough ones are really so very hard but I do believe they shape us and help us grow and ultimately heal. Sorry your H is such a childish and irresponsible being now—seems very common in mlc world. Sadly. Yes, very much like addicts.

Have you discovered any more about that insurance policy? Seems like that would/should be part of the property agreement in the D process.
  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

N
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 875
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#75: August 24, 2020, 09:37:42 AM
In a cruel way, these unpleasant moments ultimately help us to detach.  My hardest times are when H is kindly and mature sounding.   I eventually decided to remind myself of the underlying dysfunction that impedes honest and direct communication and realise that I wouldn’t settle for that now.

Well done for not lashing out.  That has been a challenge for me.
  • Logged

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10723
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#76: August 24, 2020, 10:25:28 AM
Quote
This was a hard week.  Maybe because of isolation and not having a job and the D in progress.

Well, duh, Mal  ::)
It's like that traditional list of stressful life events.....how could it not be? So I hope you are being kind to yourself.

Quote
I felt like the COO who realizes that the CEO was “skimming” money.  Financial betrayal.

Oh dear, yes. I remember the horror when the divorce process started showing things up. I'm not sure if I was more horrified by the facts in black and white or more horrified by the incomprehensible reality of what my then h had let himself become. It made me feel like vomiting at the time. I was repulsed by him tbh.

Nerissa is right that it helps us detach - either bc of the shocking scale of the multiple betrayals (and of course financial betrayal is always part of the mix isn't it?)  or bc we simply can't see that they are worth anything other than letting go.
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#77: August 25, 2020, 01:34:28 AM
The financial irresponsibility is mind blowing because they are very grown men. How can they enjoy living like this? My H is the same as most. Credit cards maxed out, has spent everything he had and spends every penny he makes. Money is definitely one of their issues.
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#78: August 29, 2020, 10:40:55 AM
Mal -
Trying to catch up with recent events.
I am SO SO sorry for your discovery of ow-2, but it sounds as if you understand what she is, and what she is to him.
They deserve each other, and you certainly deserve better.
At least better than what he is now.

I also remember seeing what H had been spending his money on, completely oblivious to me.
Victoria Secret, hotels, ear buds for ow, UGH.  I clearly remember the hurt and deception and feeling so blind-sided.

We're here for you. 
I'm here for you, and you always know how to reach me if I'm not posting...

Hugs,
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#79: September 13, 2020, 03:11:45 PM
Dear Sea and Milly, Nerissa, Treasur, KIT, and Gracie,  Thanks for following along.  I so appreciate you all.   :-* So interesting that the financial irresponsibility is common among all of us. 

Catching up. Almost 3 years since BD.  Not much to report – same stuff, different day.  I will spend some time during the next two weeks reflecting how the 3 years have changed me – some changes for the better, some for the worse, like loss of trust and innocence.  Always good to take time for mirror work.  Some devastating losses, much gratitude.

Journaling – unless h has some secret stash, he could be hitting financial rock bottom.  I doubt it will make a difference.  Another recent notice that he bounced the line of credit payment on the beach house.  Okay now, but made me angry.  Accountant is chasing him for payment...paid taxes late, got a fine.  Hope he pays it. 

I am an angry bird now.

Every. Single. Day. There is some kind of trigger or an issue. And I am nearly 3 years into this adventure. 

Had a lovely week at the beach last week – tenant canceled due to quarantines, so my S and DIL and the in-laws came down with me.  H had the house the prior week, but he did not invite family.  SIL had to chase him for two weeks to see if her S could stay the night before – she called him numerous times before he answered yes.  H left early and left the place a bit of a mess. 

He had been so loving toward the house – before BD.  I look around and try to do what I can in my limited time there, but he abandoned the house, too. He did admit to his sister that he realizes the house needs work – well, what did he do with the rental proceeds?  I am an angry bird again.   I see the house as an analogy to the marriage, when only one person is trying, then things fall apart.

So, I was cleaning and discovered two children’s paint-your own birdhouses, signed and dated last week when h was there.  Simplest explanation, ow-2 has small children.  Well, it’s still my beach house, the birdhouses are gone now.

Got home yesterday and had a long e-mail last night from h, trying to explain that he did not intend to insult new DIL on FB.  OMG.  She has had some depression challenges and he apparently posted a comment he thought was funny.  I am not on FB, but the comment sounded appalling.  Son had to text him to delete it. According to h, he spoke to our S later and they worked things out, but I am not sure h understands how our DIL must have felt.  I briefly considered calling him to discuss and say WTF, but at the end of the message, he asked me to hurry up and review the latest draft of S.A.  Well, that is a conversation killer. Like why even tell me the story.  So, I had Chardonnay instead.

Then today, I was walking around the yard and discovered he came while I was on vacation and stored his snow tires under the barn again.  They have been gone a year.  The ghost strikes again. 

So, different day, same story.  I am getting tired.  Nerissa, as you noted, the anger and unpleasantness are helping me to detach.  We all deserve so much better. 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#80: September 13, 2020, 05:01:08 PM
Mal -
Following along.
So glad that you had some time at the beach house (I would have never had the nerve to throw the bird houses away - SO glad that YOU did!).
I'm sorry that you're an Angry Bird.  So many triggers, so easily evoked.
I hope that your H does hit financial rock bottom, but I hope that it doesn't affect you.
Probably good to try to get the SA completed ASAP for that reason alone.
Chardonnay does sound better though!

I'm sorry about DIL.
I just don't think that the MLC brain functions at even 20% capacity, and the ability to have empathy, judge their own actions or play nice is completely out of the question.

Have another glass of wine.
Deep breath...

Hugs and more
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#81: September 13, 2020, 07:13:37 PM

I briefly considered calling him to discuss and say WTF, but at the end of the message, he asked me to hurry up and review the latest draft of S.A.  Well, that is a conversation killer. Like why even tell me the story.  So, I had Chardonnay instead.
 

Yes, it seems that most of the time having the Chardonnay is the best (and often most logical) answer. 

I'm glad you got to be at the beach house with family, Mal. 

FWIW - I think you had every right to throw away the bird houses.  If they wanted them they should have taken them with. 

  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

N
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 875
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#82: September 14, 2020, 02:23:11 AM
Quote
Yes, it seems that most of the time having the Chardonnay is the best (and often most logical) answer. 

I spent a lot of time trying to explain and ‘help’.  It took me far too long to understand properly that whatever I suggested he was likely to do the opposite and I was the one left puzzled and astounded - or enraged.  Such a waste of energy in the end. 

I try to think of it like having an oppositional teenage child, trying to separate emotionally from his/her parents.  They want approval but they also want to escape.  We have to live with the ambivalence or preferably, since they aren’t our children, stop worrying about them. ☹️
  • Logged

K
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 5547
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#83: September 15, 2020, 11:25:47 AM

So, I had Chardonnay instead.


I do find these days that Chardonnay, or a little bubbly, is far better company than these MLCers.  No idea what he could have said on that post, but I am guessing he really thought it was "super cool" at the time and was not expecting to be called out for it. And now crying to mommy to make it better. I like a good non-response. So much power in silence.  You did great!

We all deserve so much better. 

We do deserve so much better! They are but a shell of the person we used to know.  And not worth our good graces for the most part. Sad thing is, I am pretty sure most MLCers are more than aware of this.

  • Logged
Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#84: September 20, 2020, 01:37:39 PM
Still, and Sea, Nerissa,and KIT, thanks for being there.  I did think what would KIT say, and realized Chardonnay was the calm solution. 

3 Year anniversary of BD, this week, more than 1000 days … Journaling…

I initially thought this would be a 6-month separation, that there was too much love between us, and then after reading some HS and HB, thought 18 months to 3 years.  The first year was a trauma-induced fog as I tried to pick up the pieces.  And, disbelief.  Then, there was sadness.  Now anger.  And nightmares about ow-2 and an entourage trying to drive me out of my house.

Ready wrote these words of wisdom on another thread recently –
Quote
I gained a lot more insight and perspective from others. It was a challenging time, difficult on the heart and soul, but I found an inner strength and saw how much I could endure. My ex didn't come back as a better person, but I did. In the end I realized,  the forum isn't about MLC, it is the story of us.

I have not found Ready’s peace, joy and love, but I have endured things I could not imagine – Sudden Abandonment, loss of my mother and other much beloved family members, job loss after a long career and starting again when I should have been thinking of retirement.  Discovery of lies and betrayals and ow – plural.  And, celebrating my son’s wedding alone.  My ability to get up every day and move onward has surprised me. Some days the pain was unbearable, it still is. 

I have the love of my son and new DIL and cousins and friends who became even closer during this process.  And the HS community has been a godsend.  :-* Thank you all for the support and hugs along the way.  Yet, there is still a big hole. 

Where am I now? What have I learned? 

I have done much mirror work, and I am accepting that I will be “alone” for the rest of my life.  I made mistakes in our marriage, but nothing that deserved sudden abandonment. Too broken to trust or love another again.  I need to work on rebuilding me.  I am rediscovering the girl I was.  And, I like her. 

Many friends’ seemingly happy long term marriages (b/y 25 years) are going through challenges.  I am trying to preach communication and acceptance of their partner, but I am not sure why they seek my advice.  Perhaps they want me to validate that it is okay for them to bail, but I cannot.  They are in situations where they can at least communicate with their partners and try to fix what is broken.

And h? He is still running fast.  Am realizing that he has issues beyond MLC, and those issues probably precipitated the crisis.  But, not my circus. Our life together was a different world.  I do not know him anymore.  I am stronger now on my own, but lonely. 

We have our lawyers and we are “negotiating.”  Every day there is some new trauma, even in places where I do not look for it, it finds me.   Small town, shared family sightings and triggers, memories, finances.  Not sure I will find peace at the end.  I have so much anger now about everything.   I will not reach the stage of forgiveness.  Compassion yes, ...later.

Still finding gratitude for the little things and the happy moments.  Thank you for following along on my journey.

***

During the pandemic I have been listening to the Hamilton soundtrack and random lyrics tell our story, too -

“Then you walk in and my heart went Boom!” …
Helpless!
Look into your eyes, and the sky’s the limit I’m helpless!
Down for the count, and I’m drowning in ‘em.”
Helpless

“He’s penniless
He’s flying by the seat of his pants
Handsome, boy does he know it…
“…And I know
She’ll be happy as his bride
And I know
He will never be satisfied”
Satisfied

“You have married an Icarus
He has flown too close to the sun.”
Burn
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#85: September 20, 2020, 06:04:39 PM
Mal -
Thanks for posting - good to hear from you.
I'm so sorry that you've hit the 3-year mark and it keeps going...
I think we all figure "ours will be different" -- my MLCer will come out faster, better, different...  But, sadly, they don't. 
You're right - you were abandoned without recourse, without explanation.  Just, abandoned -- blindsided really.  It's typical.  Sad but true.

Yes, your H is still running.  Running fast and far - away from his "problems" that are only following him - chasing him.  He needs to do his work, as you have done yours.

This forum really is about us - all of us -- all of our experiences, sadness, grief, loss, mourning -- but ALSO growth, revitalization, strength, joy, happiness.  You ARE a better person (like Ready posted), you have found some peace and joy because you've posted about it.  You will find final peace.  Anger now is okay.  You WILL find forgiveness and compassion.  With time and patience and love of yourself. 

Yes, you've been through so much, and none of it is fair.  BUT - you have us, and we'll always be here for you -- either on the forum or by DM.  You're NEVER alone.  You may be LONELY, but you're never alone.

I'm glad that you're liking the rediscovery of yourself.  A few of us have said that today as well.  It's nice, refreshing.
Keep rediscovering yourself and keep reminding yourself of how wonderful you are. 
We all see it - you must see it as well.

Hugs,
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#86: September 21, 2020, 01:29:14 AM
Male, always a difficult week the BD anniversary, so hugs. However, you have come so far in these 3 years. Your post is full of self reflection and acceptance. I, like all of us, thought my H would be back in 6 months and then 18 months, because we had such a strong bond. Here I am 6 years later and my H still in Replay.

I love that you are rediscovering the girl you were and that you like her, and that your bonds with family members are stronger than ever. I do believe that our relationships with our loved ones improve after BD also because of the work we have done on ourselves. We are attracting love.

I know what you mean about everything being ok but you're lonely. Same here. I sometimes think I will be alone for ever, and it feels like the easier solution, but who knows. Three years is a short time. If we had been widowed, three years would be a minimum. I know that for my situation, until I am settled in my new life, have sorted the finances and D, have reached a new rhythm that is permanent and stable, I will probably not be open to a relationship with someone new.

Sending you hugs. x
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10723
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#87: September 21, 2020, 04:12:11 AM
Well, dear Mal, yup, normal stuff. Sucky but normal. Not very different in some ways from those moments where the 'new virus normal' suddenly bops you on the nose.... Still, you're in good company here  :) I think we all thought our spouses would be 'different' didn't we? Until we realised that this wasn't so. And that our world became something unimaginably different bc of that. But keep faith, Mal, we all adapt step by step....it just takes a lot longer than we could have foreseen doesn't it?
  • Logged
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

9
  • *
  • MLCer Type: Clinging Boomerang
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 600
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#88: September 21, 2020, 05:18:59 AM
Mal,

Year 3 was a tough one for me as well.  For me it was a turning point that this was not going to be a short stint in MLC land and I was not going to be one of those lucky ones that was going to come out of this different. 

Know that this is all part of your own journey, a journey that none of us ever asked for.  I get the scratch your head feeling all time asking myself “how did I get here”.  I honestly believe now that we are going to come out of this stronger and wiser and learn that we deserve more, because we do.

Know that you are never alone. 

Roo
  • Logged
Husband 55
Me 55
Kids 3 sons 29, 27, 25 1 daughter 20
BD #1 Spring 2016
BD #2 Winter 2017
married 33 years.  Together 35
H never moved out except 3 weeks after BD #1
OW 30 year single mom employee-He says EA only I don’t believe him.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#89: October 25, 2020, 05:41:38 AM
Hello, I have not written in a while, settling into, I do not know what stage at 3 years in, anger and perhaps a sad resigned acceptance. Writing more for posterity if this can help someone some day. Waking up in the middle of the night with panic attacks now, not sure what dreams I am fleeing from.

Sea, and Milly, and Treasur and Roo, Thanks for walking along with me on my journey.  It means so much. 

 Still working on job search and life is locking down more with CoVid.  Grateful I can survive and OK for now but the days are long. I'm wishing I could send this extra time back to myself 20 years ago when I wanted to stay home with my small son.

Looking back, I think the few months of connection after ow-1 were a touch and go- at the halfway point, but he is deeper in the proverbial tunnel.

After more bullying by h, and blaming me that the beach house is in disrepair b/c his L told him not to put any money into it now, my L sent his another draft SA, asking again for his documents. As a reward he sent an early morning text "allowing" me to have the beach house for a weekend. He also let me know that he had seen our son recently. Why he feels the need to tell me each time he does, I do not understand. I had a nice visit with my MIL while I was down there. I would have stayed longer, but my home security camera system had #EpicFail, so having flashbacks of the times he would go in the house when he knew I wasn’t there, and when he reprogrammed the cameras, I hurried back. MLC, the gift that keeps giving.

And he recently sent his contact lenses to my house for delivery. I thought about recycling them, but he contacted me- not an accidental delivery, I have turned into either his M or his secretary in his eyes.  When he showed up we chatted awhile and  touched superficially on some issues- his consulting business is slow with covid, my concern about what he said on FB about DIL, why he put the tires in the barn- claims  he did it last spring (why does he lie as the sneaking is the issue not the timing? I take pictures now of strange things to remind myself what is true.)   He commented about a couple we know that he claims have a bad marriage because they're always fighting. We looked at each other - perhaps he recognized the unspoken that we were the couple that never fought, and here we are. Most of the visit he looked at a wall, off at a 90 degree angle, not at me. He curiously used "we" a few times in the conversation. I am so angry at him for so many things, but I held it together trying to channel compassion and grace.

On the macabre side, in the last week I discovered his Instagram site. I was not looking for one, did not imagine he had one, but I saw a curious picture on another site and followed the trail. I was spellbound and went back about a year. He probably started the account after he and 0W1 split. His photos are beautiful. Sad and haunting. In the beginning the pictures are very artsy, but the most recent half years worth include macabre and creepy pictures and captions. H posted lots of selfie's, uses his high school nickname, and he appears to be hanging out with a group more than half his age. So regardless of the million reasons he could have left our marriage, and regardless whatever it was at the beginning, at this point 3 years in, it does look like an MLC. I tried to stay away from the comments, but I inadvertently clicked on one and saw some groupie posted lots of  ❤️❤️❤️. He has a growing following. He posts several times a day, and I need to stop looking. He suddenly changed profile to private and I wonder with paranoia if he realizes I viewed him. I am left with an impression of depression and sadness and masks. Maybe that's why I keep waking up with panic attacks. He threw everything away for this....


Well, that's been the last month.

**
Reading and learning from the thread on grace.  I am working hard on grace and compassion, but no can do on unconditional forgiveness.

**
Not sure if this might be helpful, but I have been watching Dr. Ramani videos on narcissism on You Tube.  I have no clue if h is or was a narcissist, but the behaviors she talks about - lack of empathy, devaluing and discarding, projection, gaslighting & etc. are part of all of our collective stories.  I find it comforting to get the reaffirmation in a simplistic fashion. 
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

E
  • ****
  • Sr. Member
  • Posts: 297
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#90: October 25, 2020, 01:31:25 PM
Hello Mal. I’m following along too. I’m no good at giving advice so I just mainly follow stories and cheer quietly without commenting.

I can feel the weariness in your words but also your determinedness to keep moving forward (even if it feels like wading through a swamp in gumboots).  I just wanted to let you know that I’m slugging along in the trenches with you. Xx
  • Logged
M: 50 (48 @ BD)
H: 53 (51 @ BD)
Married 20yrs, together 23yrs
D: 21 (19 @ BD)
D: 19 (17 @ BD)
'Extra D': 19 (17 @ BD)
BD (that I didn't recognise as such) Easter 2018
BD 9th Sep 2018
OW (45, now 47) - he met her in the pub a week before BD, told me about her a week after BD. Thinks 'their planets have collided' because 'their eyes met across the room' and they had an 'instant connection'. Lives with her. Is building a life with her. Jun 20: H plans to buy a block of land and build a house with her.

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#91: October 26, 2020, 06:15:31 PM
Good to hear from you, Mal. 

I can understand how disturbing finding him on social media was for you.  I am glad that I don't have to contend with that with my MLCer.  He has never had a presence on social media.  The owifey posts occasionally but I have blocked her so I don't see many postings.  It's just too hard.  It's hard enough for me in this small town when I have to run into one, or both of them, in person. 

What is the end plan for the beach house?  Will you need to sell it? 
  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#92: October 28, 2020, 04:23:19 PM
Hi Male, I'm also following along. Sorry you saw the instagram. I used to check now and again, although I know you didn't do it on purpose, I did. I never saw anything that helped me so now I go out of my way to make sure I don't stumble on my H's or OW's accounts. But, you seeing the sad state your H is in just proves that your H is going through an identity crisis and that is not a good place to be. He might never grow out of it so best for you to keep moving forward as you are doing. Your H is deep in his crisis at this point like most of our Hs at this stage. Put him in the cupboard and shut the door for a couple of years.

I hope you soon enough find a job even if part time. Although I hate having to work most of the time, it is my salvation. Covid will eventually come to an end and you will find a job.

If my H were to send anything to my house at this point, I would leave the box outside my door and send a message to come fetch it and that I will not be responsible for it -also not to send stuff to my house again. I went through that phase of allowing my H to send stuff, bills, letters, whatever to my house, but I will not be his secretary any more. It got me absolutely nothing. Ok, it got me a sense of being used.

Male, you've had to face some difficult situations this past summer and you made it through brilliantly. I think you are doing just great.
  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 6192
  • Gender: Female
  • How I long for your precepts! Psalm 119:40
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#93: October 29, 2020, 03:47:03 PM
Maleficent,

Just catching up... I am sorry about the Instagram incident. It was the same for me - suddenly, he started an account (he has started two) and I went to look, nothing too terrible in the beginning, just motorcycles and such, then he suddenly made his profile private. I know that it is because ow began to make her presence known. Of course, I never "followed" him, but while it was open, I was able to see it.

My IG profile is totally open, as is my philosophy, I have nothing to hide and what I don't wish to be seen, I don't post ;D However, I don't think he looks at my IG. You can tell by Story views. I once saw ow looking, only once.

Social media is really a big source of pain for most of us. So I just concentrate on mine and post what I want to without showing too much if you know what I mean. Facebook is out of my grade - I find that I can't deal with all the cross connections, so I have deactivated it. Twitter is ok, and I use it mostly for news and no interaction. Linkedin is just for my professional profile and I am thankful that I no longer see suggestions that I connect with ow ;D

I hope you find peace, when we practise grace with others and ourselves, peace is a consequence, it comes with acceptance, I think.

I think you are doing very well at only three years in - I don't think I was as balanced as I see you :)

xxx
  • Logged
M 59
H 59
S 28
D 25
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#94: November 01, 2020, 05:53:43 PM
Mal -
Your husband truly seems to be the retro King.
Really - high school name?
They really regress don’t they?

You sound like you’re doing okay, despite the sad times and panic awakenings.
I have those sometimes, but I’m sure they’re unrelated to H but more due to anxiety of dying while sleeping (it’s happened to 3 friends in the last 3 months - completely healthy) so it’s really weird.
Try to go to sleep after doing breathing exercises and thinking postitively about tomorrow.

I just also posted about IG.  It’s so weird...
I want to watch the Social Dilemma on Netflix - Very enlightening I understand...
I am private, not because I post anything extraordinary, but I don’t feel like everyone is entitled to know what I’m doing or who I’m hanging out with (H and OW included).

Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#95: November 18, 2020, 05:52:17 PM
Mal - Just checking in to see how you're doing...
Miss hearing from you.
Sea
  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 522
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#96: November 19, 2020, 08:07:41 AM

Sea, Thanks so much for checking in on me.  And Still, Milly, Mitzpah and Evermore, thank you for following along and cheering me forward.  Still working on job search in the time of covid and working on house projects. A bit lonely. Cocooning.

Last week, H dropped by three times, all quick visits because he wanted things- his mail, a tool, a curiosity from his collection.  His visits set me back and then I have dreams about him and I wake in a panic.  He did two rare nice/helpful acts so now I fear what nefarious act will follow.

The day he came for his mail, the landscaper was out back taking down some dead trees.  So he walked back to take a look. He looked like a lost kid in a backwards baseball cap. Told me I was doing a good job with the project and the property looked good. Rare compliment especially as I am out of my league on house projects. Yet, when I asked him if everything was okay, he barked at me and answered too quickly, that "Everything was great, couldn't be better." Left instructing me to tell S and DIL he was here and said hello. Sheepishly admitted he has not been in touch with them. For the first time, I felt that he was using me as an anchor.

That night he texted looking for "his" leaf blower and he offered something nice spontaneously. He then came by a day or two later with the batteries for the leaf blower so I could use it before he took it away. And here is where it got weird.

He asked for one of his auction curiosities, a bear skin rug with the sad bear face and open month. Wanted it to make his rental look homey.  He blamed me that he could never use it because I wouldn't let it in the living room. I reminded him, not taking the blame, that he used to hide the bear around the house to terrify me. We laughed a bit.  So, he comes back 3 hours later to get the tool, and I present him with the bear. He looks at me and says "what's that and why are you giving it to me?" Forgot he wanted it for his living room and talked about wearing it as a prank.   He was a bit giddy, looked unkempt, hadn't done something he talked about three hours before, forgot that discussion as well, and his eyes were squinted and barely open. As he left, instead of slinking away as usual, he turned, gave a big wave and said "bye Maleficent" -- has not said my name aloud since he left. Drugs???

He didn't use drugs during our M, but now he is 17 again. And there's no one to intervene if necessary. His mother cares but she's fading into dementia and his sister is tasked with her care, both she and his brother have been turned away as has our S and I really can't put this one on our son.  I did some online research and I'm not sure about drugs, but he checked all the boxes for behavioral clues, and he's checked these for many years, with his video games, his secret spending, his obsessive hobbies and pre-BD stuff.  I am angry at myself that I never took action back in the day. Too accepting. Too avoidant.

So, back to his IG site for a wellness check. Mitzpah and Milly, I just cannot stay away. Some of his postings are downright creepy, either the picture or the caption or both. Others have beautiful photography and insightful comments that remind me who he is at his core. He has a growing bevy of followers, women of a certain age who call him babe and post hearts and kinky comments and some Satanic "girls," with Lucifer tail piercings in their nose. Not sure there is only one ow-2 now, likely several.

Thought I saw him in the bank yesterday while unsuccessfully trying to do forensics, but I couldn't tell with the mask. Had a mini panic attack about getting caught, but instead of hiding, I stared at this poor stranger until he had to look away. Still and Milly, you both understand the small town blues. 


Reading on another thread about what is rock-bottom?  I like the description Acorn gave, perhaps there's no one rock-bottom, but they are lost and wander around the morass of Mordor.
  • Logged
BD and moved out 9/2017
M 30 years at BD, together 34

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 10526
  • Gender: Male
  • You can't please everyone. You are NOT a pizza!
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#97: November 19, 2020, 08:14:56 AM
Reading on another thread about what is rock-bottom?  I like the description Acorn gave, perhaps there's no one rock-bottom, but they are lost and wander around the morass of Mordor.



Nope, one MLC's their way there.....
  • Logged
Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

Survival Instructions for Newbies
Site Map
 
A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

  • *
  • Mentor
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1923
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#98: November 19, 2020, 08:39:02 AM
Mal -
Wow - what an update!

First - I am sorry that you're lonely.  It's a difficult thing to deal with; especially during a pandemic when you can't even just get out into public to be around even strangers...

Perhaps if your husband's visits cause dreams and panic awakenings, you need to set some STOPS/boundaries that will be healthier emotionally for you?  Do you think the panic is the realization that it was a dream, or what is the foundation for the panic? 

When you asked how things were, that was probably a push for him, and he answered the only way he is capable of - denial, anger, lying.  I believe that the MLCer wishes no acts of kindness bestowed upon them by the LBS because it awakens their guilt - IMO.
Guilt for leaving you, guilt for the leaving the house in your care, guilt for not communicating with S and DIL...  It goes on and on.

When I read the story about the bear and forgotten request, the first thing I though of was "drugs".  That is pretty weird, to be sure.  Unless you think he has some kind of dementia onset?  I know he is young for that, and I would think some type of altered mental status would be the cause.  IDK if addictions to non drugs have that mental fogginess effect - I don't think so.  Not to that degree, maybe to the degree of preoccupation, but not to the level of completely forgetting an entire conversation(s) and not completing tasks.  Doesn't sound good. 

I'm not sure what you're angry with yourself for.  He didn't display anything that sent alarms off in your head.  I don't think video games alone would cause anyone to be alarmed or feel the need to intervene.  I suspect that the other stuff (excessive spending, hobby obsession, etc) came after the MLC was starting to take hold?  What are your thoughts about that?  Please don't beat yourself up anyway - you were his wife - not his "fixer" and he needed to take responsibility for his own actions. 

Sounds like he's still so deep in replay with his IG postings.  I really wish that you'd not look at them because it only causes more monkey braining. There is never anything positive that comes out of it for us.  It just justifies how messed up they are and more often than not hurts us in the process. 

Sounds like your H is at a rock-bottomish place, but I don't they actually hit rock bottom until they lose EVEYTHING that they had and valued.  I don't think your H is there yet.  He still has you and comes around to be sure you're still there and he hasn't lost you.  He seems to be more and more cooked lately though...

  • Logged
Seahorses have one mate for life...

  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 1216
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#99: November 19, 2020, 01:29:45 PM
Hi Mal

I really hope the job search brings you something good soon so you have a new focus. It will probably help you get your mind off things. You know you are more than capable of getting back into employment but with the pandemic things have slowed down a bit. I'm sure things will improve in a not too distant future with the vaccine.

I have to say, I agree with Seahorse in relation to stops/boundaries if his visits are affecting you.. I know you don't like having him as a ghost either (ie going into the house when you are not there) but in my opinion, it's probably better that way than actually interacting with him. I don't quite understand why he keeps getting mail delivered there, can he not get mail where he lives? I know that sometimes we are so devastated that whatever crumb we get, it's better than nothing but at least in my case, my healing really started when interactions stopped. I'm fortunate that H lives in another country and I haven't seen him in nearly 2 years.. I really have no idea how I would feel if I had to see him regularly.

Big hugs!
  • Logged
H - 43 (40 @BD1)
M - 43 (40 @BD1)
Together 15 years, M 8 @separation
No kids
BD1 - 26th Aug 2017 (Not happy, life has no purpose, "we have problems")
BD2 - 22nd March 2018 (Marriage is over, we want different things, confessed EA with someone 12,000 kms away although "she means nothing")
H moved in with parents 11th May 2018 (I asked him to leave as couldn't handle the EA rubbed all over my face)
H moved abroad 29th Dec 2018, not sure if OW will join him or if they are still in contact.
Confirmation H and OW are together, presume PA  - 3rd June 2019
H gets engaged with OW (we are not divorced) - Oct 2019
H "finally" asks for divorce - Aug 2020

"One of the happiest moments in life is when you find the courage to let go of what you can’t change"

s
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 4720
  • Gender: Female
Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#100: November 20, 2020, 06:13:23 PM

So, back to his IG site for a wellness check. Mitzpah and Milly, I just cannot stay away. Some of his postings are downright creepy, either the picture or the caption or both. Others have beautiful photography and insightful comments that remind me who he is at his core. He has a growing bevy of followers, women of a certain age who call him babe and post hearts and kinky comments and some Satanic "girls," with Lucifer tail piercings in their nose. Not sure there is only one ow-2 now, likely several.


Lucifer tail piercings in their nose...... ::)

Man, he's not living in the the land of reality - fantasy world is where he's hanging out. 

Hopefully something work related for you will happen along.   Hang in there, Maleficent. 
  • Logged
BD: 1/1/16
Together 15 years - married 7 years
His divorce final 7/26/16
Married the OW

After all, tomorrow is another day.

M
  • *****
  • Hero Member
  • Posts: 3622
  • Gender: Female
Re: Learning How to Live Again with Gratitude 4
#101: November 22, 2020, 12:21:29 AM
Male, your H forgetting the conversation about the bear rug might have been him having been up all night smoking dope and then getting all chatty with you on the phone, which once the effects wore off, he could no longer remember. Or it could be his MLC Jekyll and Hyde personalities. You spoke to one in the morning, but the other, slitty eyed one came to your house later. MLCers often forget stuff. I suspect the texting for the bear rug was just an excuse to reach out, a momentary story to connect, then when he came to your door he forgot the lie he'd texted you about. I agree with you that he was anchor checking. Those were touches and goes.

  • Logged
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

 

Legal Disclaimer

The information contained within The Hero's Spouse website family (www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com, http://theherosspouse.com and associated subdomains), (collectively 'website') is provided as general information and is not intended to be a substitute for professional legal, medical or mental health advice or treatment for specific medical conditions. The Hero's Spouse cannot be held responsible for the use of the information provided. The Hero's Spouse recommends that you consult a trained medical or mental health professional before making any decision regarding treatment of yourself or others. The Hero's Spouse recommends that you consult a legal professional for specific legal advice.

Any information, stories, examples, articles, or testimonials on this website do not constitute a guarantee, or prediction regarding the outcome of an individual situation. Reading and/or posting at this website does not constitute a professional relationship between you and the website author, volunteer moderators or mentors or other community members. The moderators and mentors are peer-volunteers, and not functioning in a professional capacity and are therefore offering support and advice based solely upon their own experience and not upon legal, medical, or mental health training.