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Author Topic: My Story 4 Years and counting !

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My Story 4 Years and counting !
OP: May 18, 2020, 09:04:19 AM
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#1: May 20, 2020, 05:05:59 PM
Ex came for a visit today. Back to no eye contact. He is having a hard time as my daughter will not budge with him. He seems upset but not able to connect with her. It’s sad as he thinks she will snap out of it and want to be around him, every day he is shocked that nothing has changed.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#2: June 10, 2020, 01:09:23 PM
Journaling

Ex is still with OW. My friend seen them on Facebook. The crazy thing it that the pictures were taken closer to my town this his, places we used to go. He lives 30 minutes away and he comes around here with her.  He canceled his time with my daughter as he is going away with her this weekend. Maybe this is what he wants a life with out me and kids.
I am thinking this is just who he is. After 5 years nothing has changed and I really don't think anything is going to. I do have my own life as I'm not sitting around pining over him. But after 5 years I think I'm am going to start dating and move on from this. He looks so miserbale when he is here, I thought he was miserable with his life but now I'm thinking maybe he is just miserable when he has to come here.
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4 Years and counting !
#3: June 10, 2020, 01:12:37 PM
More likely, he is just miserable full stop......those darned consequences right?  ::)
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#4: June 10, 2020, 02:55:01 PM
hi treasure

Maybe he is miserable, but he makes no effort here. I don't know if he has suffered any consequences, other than my daughter not liking him. I can only hope he has
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4 Years and counting !
#5: June 10, 2020, 10:03:20 PM
From reading here, I think the amount of miserable is an inside job more than about outside consequences, if that makes sense em. I think they are miserable bc they just are and that is their lens on the world.....if they are not angry or replay happy, they see themselves as miserable misunderstood victims of an unfair world and/or a mean LBS  :)......your xh may just have run out of MLC angry/replay steam right now......as you said earlier 'he is shocked nothing has changed' with your daughter, life has bowled along without him full of burned bridges, he probably like others has no real sense of how long it has been.....so he is (in his head perhaps) stuck with what's he got isn't he? Whether he likes it or not. Which I increasingly think is how the real karma bus shows up for these folks  :) The real consequence is that they get what they wanted and then, with time, realise they are still not happy..... ::)
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#6: June 18, 2020, 01:36:26 PM
Attaching em xx
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Me 52
H53
Divorced 3/dec/2019
Together 30yrs
BD 20/10/2014
Left first 12/12/2014
10 come backs and leaves again for same ow
Last left 7.03.17.
Ow 16 yrs younger, no children never been married. co worker. EA turned to PA and lives with ow
Divorce bomb drop by him 31/8/17 by solicitor letter after being caught by ow at lunch with me 3 wk earlier. Finances Not yet finalised.
Crazy divorce started by him.
Clinging boomerang for 3 yrs now Vanisher but  twice a yr pops his head up. ow has balls in a vice!

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#7: June 18, 2020, 02:07:05 PM
Journaling

Today is my birthday, it's been almost 5 years since my ex left. He sent me an email saying happy birthday, hope you have a great day. Im shocked. He hasn't said anything nice to me or even acknowledge that I exist, Not even for mothers day. But he told me the year before he left that I'm not his mother so I don't deserve a happy mothers day from him. Maybe this is progress, who knows. On his last visit, he looked horrible. So angry every time he comes here. I couldn't imagine living with someone who is just so mad all the time. 
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4 Years and counting !
#8: June 18, 2020, 02:20:41 PM
Well, happy birthday, em  :) :) :)

Yup...weird but who knows....and as you say I'm sure your birthday is more peaceful without Mr Angry around  :)
How is your daughter doing!
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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4 Years and counting !
#9: June 18, 2020, 02:27:50 PM
Happy Birthday, fellow gemini!  8)
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Me (W) 43 - W 41
BD - Jan 17, 2020


OW status unknown, don't care, not relevant.

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4 Years and counting !
#10: June 18, 2020, 02:35:22 PM
Happy birthday!
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M-42
H-44
S-20 (mine)
D-18 (ours)
S-15 (ours)
Friends 7y before M
Married 14y
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniv.
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17 (told me 4 days before)
Eng. off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
New GF 2/29/20 (Told me 4/22/20)
Married her 4/24/20 (Told me 4/22/20)

Link to my journey: 
https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11618.0

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass - it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Don't become a container for bitterness.  It's a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes - some things have to break apart so better things can be built."

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4 Years and counting !
#11: June 18, 2020, 03:20:39 PM
Happy Birthday from me too!
 I think they reserve their worst look for the lbs. Its funny, now mine is at home with us and he works from home too. He talks and acts  miserable sometimes towards us and then he goes into "his" room gets on video calls and   we  hear how happily he talks and laughs  when he forgets that we might hear him.
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"Attachment is the great fabricator of illusions; reality can be attained only by someone who is detached."
Simone Weil
Bd: 03-2015

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4 Years and counting !
#12: June 18, 2020, 05:06:43 PM
Happy Birthday!  And yay for the kind regards from him.  I think I would fall over to get a HBD.

Mine treats me like a bastard at a family reunion!
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« Last Edit: June 18, 2020, 05:29:26 PM by megogirl »

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#13: June 18, 2020, 05:16:52 PM
Treasure, lbs, faithwalker and upintheair. Thank you for the birthday wishes.

Treasure, my daughter is doing better, she doesn't want to be around her father. She has been easier to live with, thank god. I have no plans to be around mr angry at all. I was just shocked he remembered me.

Upintheair. I have read your thread. I haven't seen much of my ex to know that they save there nastiness for there family, but I'm not surprised. When he comes to see my daughter you would think that this is the last place he wanted to be.
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4 Years and counting !
#14: June 18, 2020, 07:14:01 PM
Happy Birthday Em!
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BD End of April 2017
Moved out - kind of, May 2017
Denied affair
Cycled hard April - Oct 2017, my son figured out affair, I confronted husband, we were going away as a family for the weekend - H monsters hard and files for a D end of Oct, 2017
D final Sept 2018
Many touch and goes
He lives in monster, kids haven’t been with him overnight since Jan 2019
Moved in with MOW, a former friend of mine, May 2019

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#15: June 19, 2020, 12:08:40 AM
Happy Birthday, Em! Hope you had a good day. it's my D's birthday today.

Bizarre how these MLCers can pop out of nowhere and suddenly remember you.
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Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D25, D22, S15
OW Physical Affair same one. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 52 this year.

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#16: June 19, 2020, 06:44:19 AM
Thanks Milly

It is bizarre, he has not said anything in 5 years. It probably means nothing. Im sure I won't happen again fro another 5 years
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4 Years and counting !
#17: June 19, 2020, 07:48:30 AM
Em

Don’t you think he may be poking out of the tunnel and is now testing the waters with you?

I’m just saying....five years seems to be around “that time.”
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#18: June 19, 2020, 09:09:12 AM
Hi Mego

He might be. He is still with Ow as far as I know. I think he try's to get my attention sometimes. Just dropping a crumb my way will not make me give him any attention. He needs to act like and adult and a parent before I will even bother to have a conversation with him
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4 Years and counting !
#19: June 19, 2020, 11:01:21 AM
Happy birthday, Em! I haven't had much time lately to read on here but I have been thinking of looking into your story at some point.  I think we have some similarities as to when our (x)Hs left, the age of our Ds (mine just turned 12) and the struggles they have had.  My D is feeling better now but there were times when she lashed out at me a lot. It was very tough for me at times to deal with this challenging behavior and see the immense pain that lay at the bottom of her anger and outbursts.  It is heart-breaking what many (most?) children of MLCers go through.

I totally get what you are saying about your H trying to get your attention.  My xH seems to do that, too.
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Me: 49 (43 at BD1)
H: 54 (48 at BD1)
D: 12 (6 at BD1)
Met in 1995, married since 2000
BD 1: August 2014
BD 2: October 2015, H moved abroad
August 2018: Received divorce papers in the mail unexpectedly
May 2019: H gave up his job and moved about 1.5 hours to where D12 and I live
Divorced: January 2020

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4 Years and counting !
#20: June 19, 2020, 11:08:56 AM
Happy Birthday!  Mine is another who will try to get my attention when he thinks I've "moved on." I equate it to a petulant teenager who doesn't want me, but doesn't want anyone else to have me either. It is beyond childish.
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Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#21: June 19, 2020, 05:09:50 PM
Thanks  Puzzled

I just read your thread we do have a lot of similarities, Its sad what are children had to go through because there dads don't have there crap together. I have had a lot of issues with my daughter to. She will not admit that she is angry, she also has outbursts. It sad that she doesn't trust anyone. I guess I don't either, but its sad to watch as my ex basically ruined her childhood
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#22: June 19, 2020, 05:14:34 PM
Thanks KIT

My Ex is also a petulant teenager. Mine also try's to help me around the house or buy things that I need. He will hear things from my older daughter, I guess that helps with the guilt. I don't really talk to him, I do respond if he asks a question but other than that I'm no contact
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#23: June 21, 2020, 12:01:57 PM
Journaling

Ex shows up 2 hours late for his visit, he did email to say he would be late, unlike him to let us know. But he did this time,  He said to my daughter will you please forgive me I know I have made alot of mistakes, (that knew for him to admit). My 12 year old daughter said NO. You are an adult you should know better, she came in locked the door and never went back outside. I m glad she was able to express how she feels. And for him I hope that hurt like hell !
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#24: June 23, 2020, 02:58:30 PM
My older daughter called today, she is very close to her dad (ex). She said that he would help me more financially if I would be willing to sit down and talk to him about things. I don't know what that means. Thats all she said and I didn't want to push it. I guess he said he knows I won't talk to him. But he wishes we could a conversation.  He has never reached out to me. I don't know if I can talk to him as he has done so much to me and my kids. I don't know if he thinks we can be friends. He is still with ow as far I know. Its kind of thrown off my day today. Maybe he wants to talk about my younger daughter.
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4 Years and counting !
#25: June 23, 2020, 03:25:10 PM
Awe em

I guess I’m just a sucker or perhaps a glutton for punishment but I almost feel bad for him.  It sounds like he’s trying at least but I certainly don’t blame your daughter for being pissed.

Again - I’m probably just a wicked sucker.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#26: June 23, 2020, 05:21:01 PM
Mego

I don't see it that way. Talk is cheap. I haven't seen any effort on his part. Trying to be a human after 5 years of crap, he needs to do the work and make amends for what he has done. My daughter really can't stand him. I stay away from it and let them deal with it.
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4 Years and counting !
#27: June 23, 2020, 05:48:40 PM
Agreed. He needs to man up and be the father worthy of this forgiveness he seeks.  Asking Mommy (you) for help is certainly not the answer.  And not reflective of someone who has put in the work. It's definitely sad. But not something we (LBS) can fix for them. Nor should we. These things make me spin too Em. I get it.
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Me 49
H 47
S13
BD 5/16
H Moved out 6/16
OW--yes. Worked for H. EA turned into PA while I was in chemo. On again/off again like every high school romance

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4 Years and counting !
#28: June 24, 2020, 01:49:23 AM
Hi Em,

These things make me spin too! I really don't like the triangulation stuff where messages are passed through someone else because the ML'er does not have the courage to speak with us directly. I have had such conversation via teachers and the kids when he was in touch with them. It is not our job to fix their mess. Sorry if I am sounding cynical but saying that he will give you money if you would sit down and talk to him sounds manipulative.  Agreed - he needs to man up and be the father worthy of this forgiveness he seeks.......I get it too - 5 years of hurt cannot be fixed in a 10 minute conversation. PG xxx       
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4 Years and counting !
#29: June 24, 2020, 02:28:17 AM
The 'I'll meet my financial obligations if you will talk to me' thing? And via a third party?
Well, you don't get what Chump Lady calls a b!tc# cookie for meeting your basic obligations imho.
And I would tell your daughter that you are only going to pay attention to anything when he a) acts first and b) speaks for himself.....y'know like a grown up  :P
Not bc you don't respect her, but bc you refuse to be triangulated via her.....
And yes it is manipulative. And yes by 'talk', he likely either means listen, be nice or fix my problem for me.....

With a detached compassionate eye, em, there is no doubt that your xh is in a pickle and has no idea how to even get your youngest to give him the time of day. Which is sad....but still not your problem....he has plenty of ways he could find ideas on what he might do from Google to books to professionals.....and quite rightly your priority if you have to be involved at all is to support your daughter and validate her feelings whether you agree with her actions or not. Well, quite the conundrum for your xh......he's tried rage, self pity, now attempted bribery and using a 'flying monkey' to speak for him.....I wonder what he will try next?  ::)
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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4 Years and counting !
#30: June 24, 2020, 03:02:12 AM
Looks like some of us are getting educated..
Good job Em.
Great post Treasur, Philly Girl, and KIT
And yes Mego you are on the naive side of things. There's no feeling sorry for them.
Stand your ground Em. Talk is cheap.
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There are two ways of spreading light:
Be the candle; or the mirror that reflects it

Don't ask why someone is still hurting you; ask why you keep letting them.

At some point you have to get sick of going through the same sh!t.

Women are NOT rehabilitation centers for badly raised men. It is not your job to fix ,parent, raise or change him.
You want a partner not a project.

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#31: June 24, 2020, 07:30:05 AM
Kit. If he wants to speak to me and can reach out. I'm not in middle school anymore. You are right he needs to fix his relationship on his own.

Philadelphia. It does make my head spin, you are not cynical at all. Until he shows remorse and is truthful, I don't have anything to say. I don't think he will man up. he seems afraid to speak to me. He has none me my whole life. He knows there is no way I can just sweep this under the rug like it didn't happen and speak to him like a human. I don't think he has the balls

Hi Treasure
He meets his obligations . He can see I need extra things done around the house. I don't trust my oldest daughter at all. I told her I don't want to discuss him or his family again, and that if he needs something he can send an email. He is in a pickle of his own doing, she treats him horrible and he has allowed this for so long and now he doesn't have the power to stop it. I want to help there relationship as I don't want her to be a screwed up adult. But he needs to fix it and right now she will not listen to me as far as he in concerned. I also wonder what is next. Lol treasure.


Hi Init

I don't know if I'm educated on mlc or I have just had enough of it. Im not a door mat, I am not putting up with the games. He needs to grow up and take responsibility for his actions. I have learned a lot about myself during this process.  I used to put up with a lot of crap, I have learned to have a back bone, and to think of myself first and not him. That is a huge change for me

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4 Years and counting !
#32: June 24, 2020, 09:51:58 AM
To some extent I feel sorry for all these MLCers. I mean, how rubbish must it be to see your ex and kids living a happy and fulfilling life without you. However it also serves them right.

I don’t blame you for not wanting your daughter to be in the middle aside from anything it’s unfair on her!
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Me - 28
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3 children together D3 D6 D8 (D1 D4 and D6 at the time of BD)
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017
Moved in with Ow - November 2019
Ow met children - December 2019

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4 Years and counting !
#33: June 24, 2020, 10:57:39 AM
Most certainly you are not a doormat, and playing games with these guys gets old after a while.
After too much crap enough is enough.
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There are two ways of spreading light:
Be the candle; or the mirror that reflects it

Don't ask why someone is still hurting you; ask why you keep letting them.

At some point you have to get sick of going through the same sh!t.

Women are NOT rehabilitation centers for badly raised men. It is not your job to fix ,parent, raise or change him.
You want a partner not a project.

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#34: June 24, 2020, 11:25:41 AM
Sachat

At one time I did feel sorry for him as he looks like crap. But thats the life he chose. My daughter actually can't stand to be around him. its a battle every time he show.

Init
He chose this life and I want know part of it. The games do get old, they really need to grow up and be adults.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#35: June 26, 2020, 06:41:56 AM
I got an email from my ex today, he had a drinking problem for years. He wasn't always that nice to me or my children.He said he was so sorry for being horrible to us back then. I don't know what to make of it. I guess I'm glad he feels sorry now. I didn't respond as I don't know what to say, this was a very bad time in my life. Its right up there with BD. Do you think he is taking stock in his life, he is thinking about the past. 
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4 Years and counting !
#36: June 26, 2020, 07:59:36 AM
Yes, em, I suspect he is....there were a few glimmers a little while ago iirc before he romped back to selfpity and rage. And he has a lot more self repair work to do doesn't he? It sounds, reading between the lines, as if he is apologising for his behaviour while drinking specifically but not other things? So, maybe a partial look?

If you don't know what to say, it's ok to say nothing until you do. Or indeed to just say nothing. Or to say you don't know what to say lol.
Who knows, maybe he is working some 12 step programme....if so, he'll know (or learn) that people have no obligation to respond just bc you apologise and would like them to. That an apology is not a downpayment on a future favour or a magic erasing wand lol. And you will see if his apology is worth much by how he responds if he had an agenda which didn't get met  ::)....which sadly is possible bc I think your xh is in a real pickle and wants help with his daughter bc he doesn't know what to do....so if you do nothing and he flips back to anger or selfpity, well that will tell you quite a lot about how genuine his recovery progress/efforts are.

Out of interest, has he apologised to anyone else like your older kids as far as you know?
And does he still drink?
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« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 08:01:10 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#37: June 26, 2020, 08:49:57 AM
Hi treasure

This was something that happened 20 years ago. My son doesn't speak to him. He was sober for 15 years until mlc happened. Now I have no idea if he drinks or not. He said he can not believe that he had treated us so bad. He is not talking about current events. My son thinks he is doing this for attention as he receives none from me. I just thought is was interesting that after all this time he has regrets about. I wouldn't not even know what say to him.
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4 Years and counting !
#38: June 26, 2020, 09:57:14 AM
Then don't say anything Em.
He has to learn to take personal responsibly for his actions. Maybe he's working on himself maybe not.
He may want you to join in the oh poor me party.
A bit of remorse is there as he acknowledged how badly he treated his family.
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There are two ways of spreading light:
Be the candle; or the mirror that reflects it

Don't ask why someone is still hurting you; ask why you keep letting them.

At some point you have to get sick of going through the same sh!t.

Women are NOT rehabilitation centers for badly raised men. It is not your job to fix ,parent, raise or change him.
You want a partner not a project.

K
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4 Years and counting !
#39: June 26, 2020, 10:03:11 AM
Em I know how you feel for sure. I have received MANY apologies from H--for things he has done and continues to do. And only now do I realize how self serving it is. I simply say thank you and move on from any kind of expectation. True remorse requires one to actually change the behavior for which one is apologizing. And that determination can only be made through the passage of time. I agree with In It though in that the acknowledgement is something.

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#40: June 26, 2020, 10:42:10 AM
HI init

Im not saying anything to him. Im glad he ackwolegdes the pain he caused back then, he seemed remorseful in his message, But that event happened 27 years ago. Unfortunately he has done many bad things since then. Hopefully for his kids he is working on him self.

kiT
Im sure he is trying to get me to say thats ok, I forgive you. I don't forgive him. I learned to live with it. It is something that still bothers me to this day. Maybe he feels bad. nice of him to join the party as I have been living with this for years. He is changing for sure, no Monster and he has admitted to my daughter that he has made at lot of mistakes. But that monster can show up at anytime.

 
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#41: June 26, 2020, 11:01:34 AM
It does occur to me em that, if his processing and remorse are genuine, if he is just at the 27 years ago mark now it might take him quite a while to get to more recent transgressions  ::).....like watching paint dry  ::)....makes complete sense to shrug and leave him to it imho  :)
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#42: June 26, 2020, 11:07:55 AM
Treasure do you think he is working his way up the years of his life. Maybe that’s why he isn’t acting like a teenager. Interesting
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#43: June 26, 2020, 11:23:38 AM
Treasure do you think he is working his way up the years of his life. Maybe that’s why he isn’t acting like a teenager. Interesting

I've heard stories here that suggest they might. I think RCR might mention the idea somewhere actually. That basically in crisis they subconsciously regress to a point in time of whatever most wounded them and subconsciously recreate patterns in an effort to deal with whatever that was about. In fact, my first trauma IC, based on a short potted history of my then h, said that I would most likely see him behaving like an angry abandoned 15 year old which was pretty close to what happened....no idea if he has made it into his 20s by now lol
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#44: June 26, 2020, 01:06:46 PM
That is very interesting. I didn’t know that. We had been married for 5 years if thats where he is now. Hopefully yours is in his 20s. Lol. Ex had all his childhood issues way before that. Maybe he already worked through it. But I’m sure the last 5 years will be a doozy for him. Lol
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#45: June 27, 2020, 10:35:20 AM
I mentioned to my older daughter that my car was having some issue, and she recommend a mechanic. He fixed my car and when I went to pay he said the bill has already been paid. My ex called before I got there and told them to bill his credit card. Shocking !
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#46: June 27, 2020, 10:56:25 AM
I am so glad to hear that.  I’m like you, skeptical of everything the MLCer does, but am so glad he did that for you.  I tend to get anxious about my future and sometimes my thoughts run ahead of me.  I just finished a devotional which told me to just be grateful for this moment and see the blessing in the present day and instead of worrying what tomorrow brings.  So grateful for your blessing today.  Who knows what tomorrow holds but we can be thankful for today. 
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#47: June 27, 2020, 12:14:55 PM
Em

 :o :o :o
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There are two ways of spreading light:
Be the candle; or the mirror that reflects it

Don't ask why someone is still hurting you; ask why you keep letting them.

At some point you have to get sick of going through the same sh!t.

Women are NOT rehabilitation centers for badly raised men. It is not your job to fix ,parent, raise or change him.
You want a partner not a project.

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#48: June 27, 2020, 02:21:54 PM
At first I thought who is he to know what im doing and pay my bills. But then I seen the amount and said ok.

Gracie I am skeptical as he has been around a lot and trying to do descent things. My thoughts used to be all over the place as well. I could not stop thinking about all of this and it got better as I do think of it but just in a different way now. You are right we never know what tomorrow brings as I never lived in the present until all of this and now I am grateful for every day I have
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#49: June 27, 2020, 02:28:16 PM
Hmm...for some reason the phrase about Greeks bearing gifts springs to mind, em  ::)
Ah well, if your xh has expectations, that is his problem. If you are content to see it as a small recompense for what I imagine is a large amount of financial obligations he previously failed to meet lol....no problem for you  :)
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#50: June 27, 2020, 03:06:00 PM
Hi Treasure

I don't know if he has expectations, I have nothing to offer him. I didn't ask him to pay for me. I think for him its easier to throw money at a problem than to have to deal with it. When I see him in person he looks like a crab thats afraid of me. But he will do things financially for me. Maybe thats his way of feeling relavent to us. Who knows. It saved me a lot of money today !
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#51: June 29, 2020, 12:56:31 AM
Clington is the exact same. If he can throw money at something he will do. Without hesitation. Each and every single time he has the girls I can see from D8 TikToks it’s “dad bought this” “dad bought that”. Every other weekend he easily spends £100 on the girls. When I think, we’ll that £100 could be a nice day out making memories. Not on toys. But his money. His issue. One day his money will run out! So take the mechanic repairs whilst you can lol
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#52: June 29, 2020, 06:44:26 AM
Ex used to buy my younger daughter everything when they were talking. He still does this with my older daughters. It’s sad they really can’t have a relationship with someone so they throw money around. He sent an email saying if I need any money for anything to please let him know. I won’t do that as I feel like he is trying to buy me.
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4 Years and counting !
#53: June 30, 2020, 12:50:20 AM
I have the same issue. It was only the other day his brother was moving house and said I could buy his tumble dryer. He only bought it in March so it’s practically brand new. Clington visited  his brother picked it up etc, brought it at child drop off and then when I tried paying him for it (he paid his brother!) he was adamant I didn’t need too. But I still did. I refuse to give him the satisfaction of “I paid for that”. He can spend his money on his kids if he wants, I can’t really stop that but I’ll focus on memories and moments over materialistic items.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#54: June 30, 2020, 09:16:54 AM
Hi Sachat

Mine pays for things, but we don't talk face to face, if he knows I am getting things done, he try's to pay. I will not respond if he asks me to pay for something. Looking back at out marriage he always bought us things rather than being present in our lives
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4 Years and counting !
#55: July 02, 2020, 02:02:24 AM
Yeah I think that’s fairly common.

With me and clington, we barely made ends meet when we were together. However it appears he’s got himself a sugar mama. So the spare money he does have gets sqandered. However it makes me laugh because recently I bought the kids a load of new summer clothes. Nothing major just shorts, T-shirt’s etc and he said “wow you must be made of money?” No clington, but the kids need summer clothes not 27 million LOL dolls.

The sad fact is, children won’t remember money spent. They remember who was there and things they did than what they got bought.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#56: July 03, 2020, 04:37:00 PM
HI sachat

 Kids will remember who was there at dinner time and who took care of them. Not who bought them toys so they don't have to deal with them. Hopefully our childrens dads realize that
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#57: July 13, 2020, 05:21:57 PM
Journaling

Ex showed up for visit, late as usual. He looks horrible, I can do so much better than that ! lol. He has a long beard that is 3 different colors. He must still be in replay, hearing stories from my older daughter. There is no way the guy I knew would do the things he is doing. He has basically lost 2 of kids they want nothing to do with him, he makes it seem like he is doing everything in his power to win my daughter back. I don't know if he thinks im stupid. He really isn't do anything but complain she is not nice to him. crazy !
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4 Years and counting !
#58: July 15, 2020, 08:18:57 AM
I think they honestly believe they are “doing everything” to make things right. And maybe they are bc they are such broken people now. I’m not excusing it. But to them even the smallest of efforts they make can seem  overwhelming. These are not well people. My H is now completely avoiding our son. I think I’m his mind he is bring honorable bc I’m pretty sure he was exposed to Covid while on vaycay with his “peeps.” So, it works out. And truly, at the end of the day, I’m grateful my S doesn’t have to be around a person with horrific values and no morals right now. I think 4 years is when so many of them are determined to make their new lives work. And yet they are finding themselves in a whole new level of depression.

And.....3 colored long beard? Ummmmmm no.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#59: July 15, 2020, 10:42:18 AM
KIT, my ex believes he is doing everything right and anyday she is going to come around. He is actually shocked when he doesn't get through to her. I think staying away from your son is probably a good idea, especially if he was exposed. It's funny how theses guys, once well respected men go on vacays with girlfriends and friends. My ex doesn't seem to realize he is in his 50s not his 20s.

The beard, good grief, its a bad look, yuck.  When he is being nice to me he doesn't have it. I can always tell when things are going to go back to monster.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#60: July 15, 2020, 04:15:03 PM
Em, isn't it funny (bizarre) how we can see when our Hs are back in the tunnel-back with OW? Coloured beard, or in my case it's how my H dresses. Definite sign of Replay, well said. A normal person dresses the same way, does their hair/beard the same way every day. There's no changing depending on who is around. You know there is something wrong with them if you are not sure of which person is turning up.
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4 Years and counting !
#61: July 16, 2020, 04:37:34 AM
I say the same Milly. If I mention MLC to my friends, I think especially because clington is on the younger end I get the “oh are you sure it is” almost like it’s a excuse. But if it was just a relationship breaking down. Why isn’t he speaking to his cousins and friends? Why have they gone too? They didn’t with the breakups before me. Why has he changed cars twice. Why has he changed jobs and looking for a new one. Why has he moved out or the area. Why has he changed his hair. His dress sense. Why has literally everything changed about him barring his name and date of birth? 😂
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#62: July 17, 2020, 01:21:56 AM
Sach, I don't mention MLC to my friends any more. I've had people say to me 'it'd definitely not a MLC.' But they know absolutely nothing about a what a MLC is. I find that people don't want to hear about my separation, or that I should still love my H. They want immediate closure as in: 'you didn't get on any more and you decided to split up. Everyone now moves on.'  So that's what I give them. I don't talk to my friends about H. If they ask, I just answer that he's the usual. 
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#63: July 17, 2020, 08:27:05 AM
it is bizarre, when I see the crazy beard, I don't expect the child support on time. It is generally put in to my account at 6 am, if the beard is crazy its 1159 pm. I haven't really told anyone at mlc either. Everyone that I know just believes he wanted someone else and left. Which I guess is kind of what happened. Milly there is definitely nothing normal about this.
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#64: July 18, 2020, 12:53:47 PM
Well yes, they did want someone else. True. But then did they also decide to quit bring a parent too? And for many, find all new friends, dumping the old? And “breaking up”
With their FOO too? I do find that most of my friends understand mlc. And they agree H is the poster child for it. But they also think this is who he is now. Which it is. So what difference does it make in terms of walking away and “moving on?”  They don’t get the pain and agony inflicted upon us bc we don’t share the worst of it for the most part. Or that we need a lot of time to recover from the trauma of it all.  And I don’t like talking about it too much anyway bc it tends to stir up feelings of despair.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#65: July 18, 2020, 03:00:29 PM
My friends understand it, they just think its a deal breaker and its not my problem, and that it doesn't excuse the way he treated me or my kids. My friends also think that ex is just the person he has always wanted to be. That he was a family person as long as he could be and that he is done with it. I just don't talk about it with anyone as like you it brings up a lot of feelings that I have put away.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#66: August 21, 2020, 05:52:10 PM
Journaling

A house on my street came up for sale and my estranged daughter put a bid in. We haven't spoken in years, she is  basically my ex 's shadow(he has the money). Thank god she was out bid as she planned on living there her her father, he was going to live in the in law apartment over the large.This house is 2 houses away from mine. I would have just ruined my life to have my ex and OW and my daughter and her family so close. I thought I was going to have a nervous break down. I am so shocked my daughter would have put me through that. I guess that shows me how little both of them care about my feelings 
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#67: August 22, 2020, 01:46:31 AM
Em, so glad the bid didn't go through. I think it's not so much that your D and ex are not considering your feelings, it's more that they are only considering their own feelings. We don't seem to figure into the picture at all, not even in the negative way.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#68: August 22, 2020, 10:35:18 AM
Milly, you are probably right. it just would have ruined my life, I would sell my house and get out of town if that happened. I don't know why they would even look in this town.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#69: August 22, 2020, 03:25:19 PM
Em, I would sell and move away too if that happened to me. I think they come close to the LBS for a few reasons. Our Hs are drawn to living near us, because something in their subconscious makes being close to us feel safe. If the OW is the usual psycho, she likes to push their relationship in our faces.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#70: August 22, 2020, 07:14:27 PM
Milly. I have never met the the OW, Ex never confirmed her, I have never asked my kids. But I do know he brought her to our divorce hearing. So she is cleary a piece of work. My lawyer told me after, as his lawyer was saying what kind of person does that. I think he is afraid to be around me. Well he should be lol
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#71: August 24, 2020, 01:46:54 PM
I’ve never met my ow however she does occasionally sit in the car when he drops the kids off. Usually a door or two down.

For two years post bomb drop clington lived next door to me and it was hell. Usually he would stay in a hotel or at ow. Luckily she never stayed at his but still. I think I was happier them moving in together than him living next door to me.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#72: August 25, 2020, 06:33:37 AM
Hi Sachat

My daughter won’t get in the car with him. Sometimes he parks at the end of the drive way. She could be in the car during his visit. As long as she stays in car I could care less. I don’t know how you did it with clington next store. I thought I was having a panic attack when I found out. I am also happier with him living with ow in another state. I never bump into him anywhere.
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#73: August 25, 2020, 03:05:24 PM
I know that feeling well. Although, this weekend they did decide to go to the supermarket local to me. No idea why 😂
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#74: August 25, 2020, 07:22:01 PM
Mine has done that as well. I don’t like it. But I have only seen him there twice and he was by himself. Maybe just trying to be in a familiar place.
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#75: August 26, 2020, 02:41:13 AM
Yeah luckily I’ve never bumped into him in public which is handy Cos I’m not sure how I would react. Although I wouldn’t mind if I was on a fancy date with a big hunk
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Re: 5 Years and counting !
#76: October 09, 2020, 06:53:04 PM
Journling

I found out that OW is 15 years younger than exh, has never been married and has no kid. She is acting like a grandmother to my estranged daughters chidren. That bothers me. not ex she can have him. Everyone says he is very happy. I guess when you throw your famly in the trash get a younger girlfriend have no relatioship with 2 of your kids how can you forget what you have done. i just don't understand how he is happy. Don't get me wrong, I am not unhappy it just seems like there was no consequences for his actions.  Most days I could care less, today its pissing me off that she is with my grandchilren that I barley know because when he left my daughter stopped talking to me. I guess im just venting. I will get over it tomorrow i always do.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#77: October 09, 2020, 07:53:37 PM
I hear you.  I know you will be okay tomorrow, but it’s okay to be pissed today.  Sending hugs your way!  Is the OW the original alienator? 
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#78: October 09, 2020, 08:14:31 PM
Hi Gracie. Yes it is as far as I know. The karma bus will hit him some day.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#79: October 11, 2020, 09:47:32 AM
I got more of an insight into my ex h every day life. I thought he was happy, thats just for me to think. For the lbs that thinks you are missing something in there life. I dont think your are. My ex accually cant stand the OW, he treats her badly and tells her to leave his house and she doesnt. But he is not man enough to kick her out. From what i heard is that he cant get rid of her. I always thought i was just replaced, he would not get a way with treating me like that. i do think his life cant be that happy living like that. Does that make my day. Hell ya !  grass in not always greener ! 
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#80: October 11, 2020, 11:22:04 PM
I get a similar insight from my kids too. They’ve been witness to a few arguments. And things they have heard clington say to ow are shocking. He wouldn’t dare say them to me. I never get monster, but I assume she does.
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4 Years and counting !
#81: October 12, 2020, 02:49:23 AM
It hasn't always felt this way lol, but rationally it makes sense to me that many of these relationships are inherently dysfunctional, MLC or not. That they are just not the kind of relationships most of us chose to have with our spouses or indeed previous relationships. Or would want to have now.

Blowing up your old life/family etc to 'win' an ow/om is logically putting all your eggs in one high risk stakes emotional basket isn't it? And that must add some pressure and latent expectations about the relationship being 'perfect' and 'worth it'. And no relationship can easily carry that weight. It's a bit like the difference between me moving a few miles to live with someone vs moving to Alaska....the stakes are just bigger lol.

Plus both of you know....even if you don't admit it....that you are in a relationship with someone who is capable of tremendous deceit and betrayal, who is capable of throwing people who loved and trusted them, for much longer than you have known them probably, under a bus if they are not 'happy'. I'm sure for a while your 'twu luv' story combined with some shared narcissism allows you to tell yourself that you're special so it will be different with you....but I imagine over time that might fade a bit. It's not a great foundation to build a solid future on is it?

Plus in many cases it seems that both MLC spouses and the type of ow they pick who agree to play are not emotionally very healthy adults full stop. Rationally - although it is so hard to really get this as an LBS in our bones - if we didn't make them act this way, then ow/om can't stop them either can they? It is about them, in them...and they carry that mess off with them into their new lives. And what do you do when your magic Happy is no longer magic or happy....when the normal challenges of real life and relationships appear as they inevitably do for all of us?

Tbh with time and distance I am probably more surprised if I hear stories that the ex/spouse is living a good healthy stable life years down the road.
I think the reality of the karma bus is usually that they get to both live with exactly what they chose, the predictable consequences that come with that and the people they have become  :)
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#82: October 12, 2020, 09:48:13 AM
Hi Sachat and treasure

Im sure it it dysfunctional. Not something I would want to be around. It is good to hear that his life sucks. After everything that has happened he really needs to suffer. I could never be around him after what he did, so dysfunction is what he deserves.
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4 Years and counting !
#83: October 12, 2020, 01:30:18 PM
Hello,

Quote
I got more of an insight into my ex h every day life. I thought he was happy,

Happiness is not found from external sources, but instead comes from within. A lot of our MLCers find a high with the new partner, but it only treats the symptoms not the issue. A lot of excitement with someone new. The chemicals in the brain, the buzz of the many firsts. Most of all, it justifies their reasoning that it was all about you in the first place. When I am with my LBSer, I am in pain and miserable. However, when I am with the new person. Well, she/he gets me. They make me feel like I am alive again.

Just like any chemical dependence, their relationship is complex, complicated, but not necessarily healthy or wholesome. Each relationship has it's own dynamics and no two are exactly alike. Some, like my ex, loved the fantasy of someone being their "soul mate" and saving them from the misery they felt. Some are about control and power.

In the end, it just about two people using each other. It is not a transformational relationship, it is merely transactional. Some are satisfied with the arrangement and are content to use the other person for years; most are not. The high wears off and the misery returns and now the other person is the source of their pain. The alienator is not the cause of MLC, instead they enable the MLCer to escape and avoid the crisis and their issues. The affair is not the root cause of MLC, it just enables the MLCer to kick the can down the road.

In the end, it is still the crisis of the MLCer and they alone have to resolve the issues or live an empty life. Their choice, not ours

(((((Ready))))
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4 Years and counting !
#84: October 13, 2020, 05:14:39 AM
I couldn't agree more. There is a constant need for other people to fulfill their needs in some way as if that is going to solve all of their problems. I don't really have much insight into my ex and OW's life, but I hear the odd little story now and again from my son, but he never goes into too much detail. I also know when things aren't going well, when my kids tell me they've had McDonald's at their dad's house or he asks to drop them home early. It's generally when OW isn't on the scene for whatever reason to provide a home cooked meal for them and to look after them. He can't cope with the responsibility on his own.

At the moment, my ex has become transfixed on my son. He is constantly sending him messages on WhatsApp and is getting very frustrated when he doesn't reply, which is a lot! He is now needing the kids to fix him. He couldn't give a monkey's before that as the OW provided all his ego boosting needs. Instead, my son is getting messages about ex's new fish, his newly landscaped garden, all the lessons he is planning and the occasional message in block capitals 'WHY DON'T YOU ANSWER MY MESSAGES?, followed by 'I love you'. My son is losing his patience with it all.

Even OW messaged my son to say she can't wait for him to see the new garden. It's ace! My son is like 'This garden had better be amazing, otherwise I'm going to be disappointed. I wonder if there's a swing or a slide for my sister'.
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#85: October 13, 2020, 06:13:07 PM
Ready

When I thought he was happy I was a little disappointed, not because I want him back, because he caused so much damage to me and my kids he just doesn't deserve it. What you said makes sense. He needs this craziness to escape his everyday life. It is a transactional relationship. Whic he would have never received that from me. I know it mlc but its always nice to have it confirmed as this is not how normal people in their 50s behave. 
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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#86: October 13, 2020, 06:20:51 PM
New day

That's how my ex is, we have 4 children he really only has a relationship with one. He just can not get enough of my daughter. she is married with her own family he he is always with them, he brings ow as well, but from what I here he treats her so badly that its embarrassing.The whatsapp, the mlcer favorite place to be. Your ex seems a lot more clingy to your son than I have seen in other mlcers. He probably wants to show off his new things to prove how happy he is. Crazyness
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4 Years and counting !
#87: October 16, 2020, 04:31:46 AM
Yes em5731 they do sound very similar. My kids are younger. My son is 11 and so has recently got a mobile phone and so he can't contact my daughter quite the same as she's 4.

He wasn't always like this towards my son, it's only in the last few weeks where I am sensing that things aren't going to swimmingly with new wifey and so he needs a new outlet to feed his ego as he isn't getting that from her.

Yesterday, my ex decided to come into the house and call me 3x from my house phone. I had sent him a message in the morning to say that my daughter was getting her hair cut and so we might be 10mins late for when he collects them for a few hours. He didn't get the message as he had left his phone at home.

My son was home and could have explained the situation, but still felt is appropriate to come into my home and call me 3x off my home phone. If it was totally necessary to call me, my son could have done the calling or he could have used my son's mobile phone. So, I missed the 3 calls from the house phone and called it back expecting my son to answer and it was ex. I was totally taken aback by it. I couldn't say anything as I was in the hairdressers with my daughter and 6 other strangers. He crossed a boundary that I have been very firm with and he knows it.

I don't know if I should be this mad. I just envision him snooping around my house while I'm not around. Grrrr
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4 Years and counting !
#88: October 16, 2020, 07:41:17 AM
Personally I would also be mad. Clington rarely comes inside my house. And when he does he usually stands in the kitchen like a lost part. You would think my house had cooties the way he acts.
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Me - 28
H - 35
3 children together D3 D6 D8 (D1 D4 and D6 at the time of BD)
Together - almost 8 years

BD & MLCer moved out - November 2017
OW discovered - December 2017
Moved in with Ow - November 2019
Ow met children - December 2019

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Re: 4 Years and counting !
#89: October 17, 2020, 07:10:04 PM
New day

I wouldn't want my ex in my house either. He left this house. It took 3 years for him to come to my door. He would probably explode if he came in. lol
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