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Author Topic: My Story My wife's MLC

J
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My Story My wife's MLC
OP: July 17, 2020, 09:04:03 AM
Hello I'm new to the site ,I've reading it alot.
My story wife had said she was unhappy and she was put on antidepressants , I asked  her if her unhappiness was down to me she kept saying no ,one day she was in tears and said I kept saying the wrong things ,so I stopped saying certain things (which were only jokes nothing nasty ) entered the world of egg shell treading.

Fast forward to September last year ,we had joined a local motor bike group and went on ride outs ,one guy lived in our village so she started taking his dog for a walk ,one particular ride out we stopped and she was mucking around with him a bit to much and it started an alarm bell they spent time together which I wasn't overly concerned about because I could trust her , I got home from work one day and our wedding pictures were laid face down I asked why and she said this other guy was making jokes about them which I found odd .We went out to a local cafe on the motorbike but my gut feelings told me something was wrong , so I asked her if we were splitting up to which she said ' yes' .

Back home I said what's going on to which I got ' I love you but I'm not in love with you ' she'd developed feelings for him and said 'it told her something was wrong in our marriage ' she said something very odd 'i wish I'd have met you years and I'd have had children with you' she's adamet she doesn't want children within a week she rented a place moved out  and was talking about a financial split , I was a total mess (  a great diet plan to aid rapid weight loss ) she didn't want to talk  , but she's adamet we stay friends .

I started to look for somewhere to live she was even emailing me details of properties I might like , there was very little contact between us , she did say she wasn't even sure if om even liked her but the more questions I asked the deeper she dug in .I found a property and moved out , but all the way through this I kept giving her the chance to cut me free but she wouldn't , shed mentioned divorce at the start of all of this closing the joint back account etc she won't change her will she's leaving it all to me . I entered no contact which didn't go down well with her .

She kept emailing me about house stuff but most of it was of no use , she seemed to want to keep a connection. I called around to collect some stuff from the garage , I was asked in for coffee so we chatted then she announced she was seeing OM  , I kept my dignaty and said that we should end our friendship her face dropped , so I agreed to email once a month unless it's an emergency .

A few months later and the odd conversation , I'd get little glimpse of her stance changing , she asked me look at the bath as it wasn't draining , as payment she'd make me tea , I couldn't find anything wrong with the bath so we sat down and had tea together but she sat next to me which she'd never done before , I asked about a divorce and she said she can't afford it then she said there's no rush , she hasn't closed the joint bank account so all the things she'd said she was going to do are on hold .

I asked during a talk if she missed me she said ' I miss making memories with you but I don't see us living together '
She popped around with some food for me which I hadn't asked for  she said during a conversation ' your my husband and we aren't living together at the moment ' she then announced she's not seeing OM , it feels like she's dropping hints and her whole demeanor has softened.

Any thoughts would be good
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My wife's MLC
#1: July 17, 2020, 10:09:00 AM
While in MLC, they are consumed by confusion.   One day they want to never see you again, the next day they want to be friends, the next time they may want to try again, the next time OM is their "Soul Mate"

All you can do is detach and continue to do what you are doing. 

Spend time with friends, find a hobby, act as if your marriage is over, and detach from her emotions and behaviours.  Its a rocky road and it can be a 2-10 year adventure.

Sorry you find yourself here, but you are in great company with a lot of experienced LBS'ers
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My wife's MLC
#2: July 17, 2020, 02:51:14 PM
I'm so sorry for what you're going through ( I truly know how it feels) and I agree with what LBS Les said: MLCers are plagued by confusion mixed with depression and other various overwhelming emotions and things they are trying to figure out.

My H was very similar; I asked him ( when his MLC began) if his depression and anger was because of me, and he vehemently denied that, saying it was everything, from his job ( which indeed was very stressful) to the house and cleaning and his routine. Up until the end of anger, he kept repeating that and when I kept asking, he said ' I don't know why you think this is about you!'

Fast forward til he was with the OW: all of a sudden, I WAS THE PROBLEM and everything to do with me was the issue. Our home, our things ( which he essentially boxed and got rid of by not paying storage), I was the issue.

I suspect in a few years, he may one day see no, no it wasn't me and all my flaws. It was something broken inside of him that he tried to fix with external solutions.

As LBS Les says, DETACH. I know how hard it is. I know you will want to take things personally ( I still do this and am trying hard not to blame myself) but detaching is the key.
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H born in 80
I was born in 83
Started dating in 2004; both felt we were soulmates & kept that feeling for 14 yrs
Married H 2006
D born in 2008
H entered MLC in late 2017
Replay started 2018
H moved out in April 2018; was supposed to be gone a month & focus on getting rest; he instead started an affair w/ 21 yr old waitress
H tricked me into moving internationally to stay w/my Mom in June 2018; he abducted our daughter for a YEAR in a desp attempt to cover up the affair

OW seems to be masterminding everything in his life and looks like she wants a green card.
Little to no contact with MLCer but he encouraged me to file for divorce
What's helping me:
meditation, reading/listening to audiobooks

J
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My wife's MLC
#3: July 18, 2020, 01:18:59 AM
I'm struggling to decide if it's an MLC or the menopause or both
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Re: My wife's MLC
#4: July 18, 2020, 05:46:23 AM
Welcome to the Board

You are in a good place.
Your H/W  is on his/her own journey.
You can not do anything to control this trip.
Come here and read or vent, we will listen.
Give your H/W space  he/she needs to heal himself/herself.

I would not ask him/her anything unless you can have no expectations.
Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure.
You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H/W as controlling or pressure.

Your need to start working on you.
There is nothing that you can do to help your H/W.

He/She has given you a gift.
It is time!!

Use the time wisely to make yourself a better person.
Look in the mirror to see what it is that you can improve.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
GAL.

Read some books on depression. Both for yourself! And for H/W.
Believe none of what he/she says and 50% of what he/she does.

Read the resources from this site.
The links that are in my signature.

Detach. - The single most important thing you can do

The detach link and HB's 6 stages of MLC(rewritten from Jim Conway) located in the resources above.
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=4.msg380#msg380

Developing Detachment
http://jamesjmessina.com/toolsforcontrolissues/developdetachment.html

http://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/self-focus_releasers_detach.html

http://www.livestrong.com/article/14712-developing-detachment/

RCR has asked everyone to keep to one thread until  that thread is 150 posts

Keep posting and asking questions and we will try to answer them.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
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My wife's MLC
#6: July 18, 2020, 06:12:31 AM
Hello,

Quote
I'm struggling to decide if it's an MLC or the menopause or both

Who knows? However, menopause doesn't lead to a crisis. We all transition from different aspects of our lives as we go through different stages, early childhood to adolescence, young adulthood to midlife, midlife to senior age and so forth. Erikson stated their were eight stages of life. However during your wife's transition it became a crisis. Instead of acceptance, there became a need for great change. Not just her hairstyle, but her life. The regret of things she wished she had done (children) now that she can't. MLC is a term we use, but the ages can vary greatly. We have several where the crisis started in their early to mid thirties and some in their early sixties. Regardless of the age, their actions, thoughts, and feelings have put them in crisis of who they are, the desire to create a new identity or life as their current situation makes them miserable.

Quote
It was something broken inside of him that he tried to fix with external solutions.

I couldn't have written this better myself. Your wife can't fix herself, and you can't either. She needs to complete her crisis all by herself and you can't control this. However, you can be a light that guides her by being true to yourself and shifting the spotlight from her to you.

The forum is about your journey to health and well-being with or without her. Self-focus is not about "fixing" yourself for the better. It is about grounding yourself into a growth mindset so that you can recover and live as if she is or isn't coming back into your life.

Quote
I asked during a talk if she missed me she said ' I miss making memories with you but I don't see us living together '
She popped around with some food for me which I hadn't asked for  she said during a conversation ' your my husband and we aren't living together at the moment ' she then announced she's not seeing OM , it feels like she's dropping hints and her whole demeanor has softened.

You still hear the confusion and yet she seems normal. This is probably your first touch and go. I was caught off guard by my first one as well. During the crisis, they can come back and check on you, to see reconnect briefly and then go back into the crisis. (Be advised that some just disappear completely for years and make no attempt to talk to anyone-especially their spouse). The important thing is not to get caught up in her cycle so that she doesn't crush you again. Be friendly and supportive, but not connected. You might add that the tea and food was lovely and you enjoyed your time with her and if she needs anything else repaired, you would gladly do it again.

Then go about your merry way.

[Man Hug]

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My wife's MLC
#7: July 19, 2020, 09:35:20 AM
 Be friendly and supportive, but not connected. You might add that the tea and food was lovely and you enjoyed your time with her and if she needs anything else repaired, you would gladly do it again.

I'm mainly doing the above . I feel full no contact won't  be good for her , keeping a safe distance works 
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My wife's MLC
#8: July 20, 2020, 11:45:06 AM
I think what I don't really understand is how we were going along fine and then out of the blue we suddenly split up . But then she won't cut all ties I given her many chances to cut ties .

About 18 months ago we had a chat and she said I was saying all the wrong things , so I made a point of thinking before I spoke and stopped making jokes
Last week she said she likes my jokes
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My wife's MLC
#9: July 20, 2020, 12:10:26 PM
Ohhh, Neil....welcome to the Wonderful World of MLC!

The rapidly-changing moods and constant mind-changing are both lovely hallmarks.  They are basically crazy and have no idea what they want at any given time.

Buckle up - it’s a rough ride!
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« Last Edit: July 20, 2020, 07:21:23 PM by readytofixmyselffirst »

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My wife's MLC
#10: July 20, 2020, 02:50:26 PM
Very sorry you're here John. But I'm glad you found us.

I don't have much to add to the advice you've already been given except to echo it. I know you are probably starving for some resolution, but I would advise against bringing up divorce. Any relationship talk may feel like pressure to her.

Also - eat healthy, drink lots of water, breathe, take long walks and get enough sleep (easier said than done, I know!). Talk to yourself like you would talk to a buddy who is going through the same thing.
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Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
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My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

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My wife's MLC
#11: July 21, 2020, 10:46:18 AM
She seems to keeping in touch with me increasingly , finding reasons to keep a connection
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My wife's MLC
#12: July 21, 2020, 12:00:54 PM
She seems to keeping in touch with me increasingly , finding reasons to keep a connection

My W did this in the early stages.   She's since gone dark

You may have a clinging boomerang, you may have a vanisher - but dont read into what she's doing right now, its all chaos and confusion.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#13: July 22, 2020, 01:24:52 AM
Speaking as a post meno-pausal woman - the symptoms I experienced (and this started after my MLCer's BD) were extreme exhaustion hitting suddenly, loss of appetite versus a need to eat the "wrong" things.
I felt emotional and weepy at unpredictable times, I hated any form of conflict or disagreement because I would over-react.  I felt sluggish and I also felt that my mind should be read by others.
The worst thing was loss of memory not just from yesterday but from weeks, months and years.  (This terrified me personally as my mum died in her early 60s of early onset alzheimers)
Every woman is different and menopause lasts a lot longer than some medical sites would have you believe.

So is what your wife doing purely symptomatic of menopause I would say not, because I and other menopausal friends  were still capable of knowing what was morally right and wrong - none of us would go and seek solace elsewhere and put it down to menopause.  None of us would deliberately hurt those closest to us to simply assuage our menopausal needs.

However if she is in menopause she will be emotionally erratic, she will be feeling tired and get easily bored, she will be feeling as though she is "getting older" but this is not the cause of the MLC - it will just add to the enormous range of symptoms that MLC has.

I would also suggest that she is a clinging boomerang - clingers tend to find excuses to bounce back and then try to seek some sense of "normal".  Clingers also show their guilt through this action.  It doesn't stop them carrying on but they sometimes wear their guilt and confusion on their sleeves.

Keep reading, keep journalling and keep learning. This is a long haul.
 

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Reconnection started 2017 through 2018.
2019 is the year of Decisions!

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My wife's MLC
#14: July 22, 2020, 02:44:11 AM
Songanddance
So is she just in menopause or MLC or a bit of both,shes never suggested the menopause has caused this split (it's my personal take on what's going on with her ) she refused to accept she was entering the menopause she has said 'She's a miserable cow'  I'm just trying to make sense of what's going on with her and why her personality has changed .
She messaged the other day to say she was worried I was ignoring her , i did point out that what a split is i followed it up by saying i wasnt ignoring her ,since then she's getting in touch a lot,she has said ' let's keep talking '

She wants to take me for a meal to say thanks for helping her,she wants me to have a key to her house ,she has said she won't change her will , shes leaving everything to me .

But then in conversation she's not ready to talk about us

I am getting so many mixed signals
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« Last Edit: July 22, 2020, 02:56:49 AM by John T »

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Re: My wife's MLC
#15: July 22, 2020, 07:30:33 AM
Songanddance
So is she just in menopause or MLC or a bit of both,shes never suggested the menopause has caused this split (it's my personal take on what's going on with her ) she refused to accept she was entering the menopause she has said 'She's a miserable cow'  I'm just trying to make sense of what's going on with her and why her personality has changed .
She messaged the other day to say she was worried I was ignoring her , i did point out that what a split is i followed it up by saying i wasnt ignoring her ,since then she's getting in touch a lot,she has said ' let's keep talking '

She wants to take me for a meal to say thanks for helping her,she wants me to have a key to her house ,she has said she won't change her will , shes leaving everything to me .

But then in conversation she's not ready to talk about us

I am getting so many mixed signals

You will because this is MLC.  I'm 7 years in and one of the many things I have learned from here is that  MLCers are confused themselves so do not expect any logic from them. One day they will leave you everything in their will and the next they will insist that the house is sold so that they can buy a new car. 

My H insisted he didn't want a divorce.  I said he clearly didn't want a marriage either so what did he actually want?  He didn't know. 
Once he said that he would never sell the house and two days later monstered that he had had enough and he was going to force me to sell so that he could have everything he earned and put towards the house back for himself.  When I told him that as joint and separate owner on the land registry, he couldn't force me to do anything but he was welcome to leave as my salary was paying the mortgage and 50% of the bills anyway.   

What I'm trying to explain to you is that you are in early days and menopause has little to do with MLC in the long run. Menopause is a side effect that can add to the frustration of an MLCer and certainly the hormones are out of whack. However a man at 50 has more oestrogen in his system than a woman so by that token hormones are NOT the culprit or cause.

MLCers in the beginning are bewildered by what they are doing and saying.  They try to identify the cause " cr*p marriage" " hair is too grey"  spouse doesn't like the colour green", spouse refused to cook them toast to the right temperature in 2006"

Whatever it is - this is script.  There is so much written about this on here.

Please abandon the idea that this is just menopause.  This is more than menopause and yes she may be going through it but it is no excuse for what is clearly the signs of MLC.

The hard part for you is to be able to step back and see what she says and does for what they are - just words followed up by actions that either contradict the words or are completely out of the norm for the wife you knew.

Her phrase " Let's keep talking" will keep you dangling and there will come a time when she will want to talk but not to listen.

The best thing you can do is to learn to detach. You can still love her and still stand for your marriage, You can still believe in the woman she once was and you can still hope but do it with a degree of detachment as this is much healthier and whole way for you to navigate your way through this.
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BD march 2013
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2019 is the year of Decisions!

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My wife's MLC
#16: July 22, 2020, 08:57:17 AM
Hi there,

    Welcome and sorry you are here. My wife wanted to play tennis together still and have weekly dinners as a family. Two years later we haven't talked in 18 months. I have no thoughts on menapouse as I don't think I was dealing with it when it came to her. I will add my wife wants to be friends but I believe that is only to relieve the guilt she has. She has never apologized for any wrong doing and in her eyes I am just a sensitive guy who is taking the breakup bad.
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BD1 March 2018 - I wish I could give you more of what you need
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Re: My wife's MLC
#17: July 22, 2020, 04:45:44 PM
Please reread Song and Dance´s reply- all good info.

Menopause does bring a shift in hormones but while that may alter moods, it is not to be the source of the blame for changes in behaviors. Sure, it´d be nice to be able to say that all will normalize once she gets to the other side of menopause, but that just puts you in limbo waiting on someone else´s biological timeline.

Self-care is the key. You are about to go on a long journey of self discovery and growth whether you wanted to or not. Best to plan to enjoy the adventure by investing time and energy into you. Sinking it into the relationship with someone with one foot out the door will not bring her back.

Loving the person she was is fine. Try not to delude yourself that she is that person now- that just leads to more pain for you.
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#18: July 22, 2020, 10:03:33 PM
Thank you for the replies

I now see that the menopause is a symptom  within her MLC she's never said it's the cause of her changes  it's hard enough to get her to even acknowledge she's entering the menopause .

The more I try to detach the more the contact occurs , I still see some of her old self and more seems to be coming back , the overriding feeling I get is she is not certain of what she's done , she's scared I'll walk away from her and there's no way back for her hence the contact .

She's never really monstered me , she has said she is learning about herself what ever that means

I've learned that I'm a good reader of people and have learned to listen to people, im now happier in the company of woman more so than men , I've got a much better understanding of women and there needs
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#19: July 23, 2020, 02:59:58 AM
I have recognised some of my failings as a person and am making changes to me for me I've done a huge amount self reflection, and putting into practice the changes I need to make , shes even commented about my stress levels being very reduced, shes seems very interested when I mentioned my observations about people and how they impact on me and what I do to avoid them .everywhere I look I see stressed people who can't see it , and people who want to belittle others to hide there own miserable life's.

 I need to let my old marriage go and look forward and not back , I'm desperately trying to distance from her , but she clings on tighter.

I've had so much good help and support, you all can't be wrong , I want to pull out of this roundabout I'm stuck on
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#20: July 23, 2020, 06:01:38 AM
Hello,

Quote
I've had so much good help and support, you all can't be wrong , I want to pull out of this roundabout I'm stuck on

Remember, this..... you have control, you have choice.....over you. You can pull out anytime you want. I am not telling you or advising you to leave her, but to instill in you the power of choice. You can leave and you will be fine. You also can stay and you will be fine. The person in crisis is your wife, not you. Knowing you have power, choice will help alleviate the sense of helplessness.

Right now your wife's mindset is inward and centered towards herself. Just imagine if you cut yourself in the kitchen really badly. Would you continue to make dinner knowing everyone is hungry, or would you seek the attention of a doctor? In the moment of crisis, all your attention is focused on the need of the moment, and that brings your focus inward and self-centered.

Your wife is self-centered right now. She doesn't see you as a person, but as an object. Going back to my cut hand with a knife analogy.  If your wife was driving you to the hospital how would you feel if she kept talking to you? "Oh that cut looks real bad.." "I bet it hurts real bad." "You should be more careful when you use a knife you know."

That's how our MLCer's face relationship talks especially in the beginning. My advice is to let her talk, and you listen to validate. You don't have to own up or buy in to her talk, but you can hear her pain and acknowledge her confusion. Empathy goes a long ways. Just realize that she is not rational in her thought process- but emotion driven and that leads to the cycles.

Put you actions and focus on how you can live. You goal is to influence her not guide her or fix her. Live your life well. If you want to help others, volunteer. Be with those that need your help and want you. You will feel better and have a better mental state to deal with her confusion. Detaching doesn't mean leaving, it means to pull yourself out of the fire to a better position where you are safe and can tactical re-engage at the right time. Just like the kitchen cut, once you are taken care of, your focus goes outward to others again.

Since you can focus outward, focus outward and know that at this time, she can't.

[Man Hug]

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#21: July 23, 2020, 07:16:58 AM
John T,
really listen to the Veterans like Ready .  We LBS's need to have our own fog cleared so we can move forward..  The MLC PHENOMENON is real and will take time, patience, tears and a lot of deep breaths.......

5hill
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#22: July 24, 2020, 12:36:40 AM
I suppose I'm struggling with the emptiness we did a lot together and that's all gone we were into motorbikes together and now I can't bear to be near a motorbike, I haven't been on a bike since BD. I suppose  breaking contact will push her away  but I'm probably  being nieve as she wants contact and will do what ever it takes to keep it that way , but I fully understand that I must let my marriage go and focus on me ,

 I realised this morning a guy at work was b!tc#ing about another guy to me and I just don't want to endure listening to it as you end up getting sucked into the world of negativity, I guess it's like being in a swimming pool and swimming to the edge and wanting to stay there
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#23: July 24, 2020, 04:47:03 AM
Hello Mr John T , I have been reading your story and I am sorry . You might find some of the understandings you are longing for inside of your wifes childhood or family of origin . I does not mean you will be able to do jacksh#t about it because it is her crisis , not yours. It has ZERO to do with you or your marriage. Less than zero actually. It may give you some deeper insight as to the wounds she is attempting to heal externally ... rather than facing them internally. What do you know about her childhood , her life experiences and where she came from?
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My wife's MLC
#24: July 24, 2020, 09:52:57 AM
Her childhood was normal, her mum and dad split in her late teens which did hit her hard as nobody saw it coming, her dad moved in with another woman and slowly she was pushed aside . She had some bad relationships prior to meeting me ,the last one before me was a long term relationship and he cheated on her and she never got closure.
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#25: July 24, 2020, 10:01:31 AM
Her childhood was normal, her mum and dad split in her late teens which did hit her hard as nobody saw it coming, her dad moved in with another woman and slowly she was pushed aside .

This is her FOO issues, right there.

She will have to address the feelings she felt back at that time - this is essentially, what has transpired into her MLC.  But only she can make a decision IF and WHEN she wants to revisit that time in her life, to address her feelings of abandonment.
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#26: July 24, 2020, 10:21:46 AM
Do you have kids?
And how long have you been together/married? How old are you both?
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#27: July 24, 2020, 10:53:57 AM
Quote
Her childhood was normal, her mum and dad split in her late teens

Late teens doesn't mean they are no longer a child. 

As LBS Les says - right there are her FOO issues.   Nothing about splitting up the marriage is normal for a child.
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#28: July 24, 2020, 06:34:57 PM
Well John, you seem to be able to sum up her childhood in a very short paragraph as "normal".  In her "late teens"  ( she would still be a child) it appears that her father had his own MLC and abandoned his family ...abandoned your wife.  This is very very traumatic for a father ( who gave her a normal childhood ...) to very suddenly leave for another women. I frankly cannot imagine anything ( short of death) more traumatic to a young girl. I have daughters John ...lots of them. I feel rather an expert on the ways of the teenage girl . When my H left our home , I had adult girls in their 20's  and 4 in thier 30's and they wept like their  hearts shattered. It exploded their lives , their trust in all the world and in their own marriages. Their Dad/ hero left. Trust me when I tell you, your wife has trauma and pain that she has not resolved in her heart and soul. This is where her work is ...healing that wound . This is what her journey is about .
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#29: July 24, 2020, 06:44:36 PM
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The Journey Of Reconciliation .. is for the brave .

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#30: July 25, 2020, 01:32:45 AM
We have no children together,we were together for 13 years , another aspect that I think has a part to play is her and her dad virtually lost touch  I didn't meet her dad until we had been together 12 years and old of the blue the woman he left for died his world fell apart and he immediately reached out to my W all of a sudden she was going to his home which is 2 hours drive away alot  to the point I was hardly spending time with her .
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Re: My wife's MLC
#31: July 25, 2020, 02:15:00 AM
We have no children together,we were together for 13 years , another aspect that I think has a part to play is her and her dad virtually lost touch  I didn't meet her dad until we had been together 12 years and old of the blue the woman he left for died his world fell apart and he immediately reached out to my W all of a sudden she was going to his home which is 2 hours drive away alot  to the point I was hardly spending time with her .

In which case John - Barbie's post is even more important for you to get to grips with.  My two Ds were also in 20s when H BD'd us all and their heartbreak was worse than mine in a way.   
It sounds like her father might have had an MLC himself all those years ago and is now trying to get a sense of normality or he is a narcissist and needy for female support and approval.

In which case this has most definitely contributed and is probably the major source of her issues.  Until she has resolved that she may remain very single minded and distant.
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My wife's MLC
#32: July 25, 2020, 04:45:45 AM
Are people in an MLC manipulators as a friend has suggested about my W
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#33: July 25, 2020, 05:19:33 AM
Are people in an MLC manipulators as a friend has suggested about my W

The majority of them.

They also lie.  About everything.
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M=51
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D=8
BD Feb 17 Thinking of divorce
Atomic BD June 17 Spying revealed OM at work
Still home.  Threatened to leave several times and has asked me to leave about a dozen. 
Says divorce proceedings will start Jan 18.
She has scheduled mediation Feb 7,  2018
I moved out March 16, 2018
Several mediations, mostly instigated by me.  Foot dragging by STBXW.  Nothing filed. Yet.
5/2019 STBXW filed D behind my back despite signed agreement to mediate.
I retain attorney.
STBXW still hasn't told me and no further action.
Elephant in the room has been addressed.  No further action atm.  Weighing my options.
12/16/19  She files financial paperwork.  Divorce proceeding.

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#34: July 27, 2020, 02:39:17 AM
Another aspect that I think has a part to play is her and her dad virtually lost touch  I didn't meet her dad until we had been together 12 years and out of the blue the woman he left for died his world fell apart and he immediately reached out to my W all of a sudden she was going to his home which is 2 hours drive away alot  to the point I was hardly spending time with her,this when I suspect the change started in her mixed in with her fears of the menopause starting.
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#35: July 27, 2020, 03:01:53 AM
Hi John
I have only been on here a little longer then you. It’s a rough journey so far mate so I have empathy for you. The people on here are great and although the road maps they give us are bumpy atleast we are informed about what’s coming.

I have two wonderful teenagers that I am close too so to be told in one night . I love you but don’t love you and I want you to move out and I want a divorce etc etc.

We never thought and have never had any counselling so no real warning before bomb drop. I will follow your thread John good luck and stay strong.
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#36: July 27, 2020, 04:24:51 AM
What has taken so much to get my head around, is I never saw it coming and my W is the last person on this planet I would have expected it from , we always talked and rarely argued.

Something I will take from this is to trust my gut instinct far more it's been absolutely spot on so far in all of this .

I've made significant changes to me all ready , but I've got more areas to work on .

Thanks to all of you for your support it helps to feel I'm not alone .
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#37: July 27, 2020, 02:12:35 PM
Hi John T,
spot on for me too...we always talked (could be not enough), rarely argued and every day he made me laugh for 40 years.  He is a quiet man, did not like confrontation but extremely protective of our family. I knew he loved me more than life and he was not afraid to tell me and our Adult children he loved us every day.

I will say be cautious, when you think you see your real W and maybe she is coming back to her old self don't let your guard down.  In a matter of minutes, hours she will be gone again until she can get through her MLC.
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#38: July 27, 2020, 02:22:01 PM
Attaching not in here that often these days but I'm 18 months in since BD now and still my STBX continues in her ever increasingly bizarre behaviour seemingly still deep in replay. Sinking further into depression, she lost her job at the start of the month but still posts on social media about how wonderful her life is! Everything is my fault and yes had to do a ton of work on myself and in retrospect could have been a better husband but still nothing explains her lies and accusations which fluctuates in every lawyers letter. Reading your story I see a lot of comparisons with mine. Stay strong it takes awhile to stop spinning but you will be able to detatch in time not stop loving but enough to be able to read between the lines. I don't know where I would be now without the amazing people in here. Take good care of yourself  my friend.
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#39: July 28, 2020, 09:10:28 AM
I've been told that the OM is really getting on her nerves, weirdly this has given me the kick of reality I needed to push the distance I need to have from her.

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« Last Edit: July 28, 2020, 10:41:58 AM by Songanddance »

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#40: July 28, 2020, 12:55:16 PM
I didn't ask about the OM somebody just came out with it , that piece of information has shown me the way to my path , I've been at a fork in the path for a while but now know which path to fully head down ,after a few false starts and being pulled back
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#41: July 31, 2020, 09:13:27 AM
No contact so far this week
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#42: July 31, 2020, 02:26:05 PM
No contact so far this week

Can be quite common with our MLC'ers.   Im about 7 weeks NC with my spouse, right now.
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#43: August 01, 2020, 02:59:03 PM
Just had an email telling me I've got post . She explained why the email was late , because she went to her mum's .

She asked how I am .

I've not replied
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Re: My wife's MLC
#44: August 02, 2020, 01:02:47 AM
Quick question - does your MLCEr know that you have gone NC with her?

If you are standing and hoping at some point down the future for a reconnection,RCR is quite clear NC is a boundary that needs to be explained to the MLCer.  Just going NC without explaining why can cause confusion.   

I understand why you have gone NC and agree with you doing so - just be aware that unless she knows why you have gone NC she will think you are acting out of spite or being petty (MLCers just don't get it) and either persist with contacting you or leave well alone and any form of future contact you may have is reduced even if you want contact with her.

It's just a question of whether you are standing.  If not - no worries.

What you could do is apply the rule of 3 and reply briefly in 3 days time,politely tell her how you are and then explain very simply that whilst she is with OM or living away you will not be keeping in contact with her.  Have a look at RCR's types of contact article.

All that said - if going NC really helps you then no worries.
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#45: August 02, 2020, 01:46:56 AM
Song makes a good point.

Contact exists on a spectrum.....and you have choices. Although I believe there are some times and situations where complete NC is necessary for the LBS, such as abuse, threats or extreme monstering, it depends on your needs and intentions at a given time. And being honest with yourself about what you need vs trying to influence someone else  ::) you might find this link helpful https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/standing-actions_contact-and-communication_contact-levels.html

Of course sometimes they vanish and go NC with us lol so there is no need to muse on it much  :)
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« Last Edit: August 02, 2020, 01:48:21 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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#46: August 02, 2020, 04:51:05 AM
I'm so torn about NC because she has wanted to remain friends all the way through this it's been important to her , her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk .

I'm torn because I get advice to go NC ,but she keeps contact going not me , she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her ,when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time ,I've been told the OM is annoying her .

The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words , she wishes she could take my pain away . She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone . I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' . In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite'

If anyone can make sense of this please as I no longer can
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Re: My wife's MLC
#47: August 02, 2020, 06:27:55 AM
I'm sorry John but it sounds to me like she is throwing crumbs out to keep you where you are.

If she can't make a decision the decent thing would be to leave you alone until she figures it out.  In the mean time you need to live your life "as if" she is not coming back.
She may not.

Putting your life on hold just makes no sense.  She could be in this for several years.
Make your life the best you can.

Maybe that could be how you could tell her you are going NC.
Until you make up your mind who you want to be with, and decide to work on the relationship, I will not be engaging with you.  It's too painful for me.

Then stop responding to her.  Then she knows.  She can not have you both.

Just my suggestion.
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#48: August 02, 2020, 06:51:13 AM
I'm afraid Thunder is right, John.
And it makes no sense bc a) it makes no sense b) it is incredibly and unreasonably self-centred and c) your w probably doesn't even understand her own emotions and d) she is trying to keep you as some kind of friendly Plan B.

It really is all about her....
Which I suspect is not working out great for you....bc actually she is offering you nothing useful to work with.

Decide what works best for you right now in terms of contact or not. It might change but focus on what is best for you currently. And please remember that if your w doesn't like it, that is no longer your problem bc she fired you from being her h and best friend. As you say, this is what reality looks like when you have an affair and leave your h isn't it? And you are under no obligation to justify or defend your choices to her now. There is no We anymore....by her doing....so it is reasonable that you look after yourself and no longer care much how she feels or what she wants. After all, just bc she wants something doesn't mean that you can't say 'no thank you'.

Most LBS struggle for a while with the 'habit' of being concerned about how their spouse feels. Usually the spouse is not at all concerned about how we feel of course, or they would have behaved differently. And sometimes we believe that less contact will reduce the chance of reconnection....I'm honestly not sure that is true while your w is with OM and behaving like a nutso selfish a$$hat  ::)....and you don't want a wife like that anyway do you?

Reflect on how you feel. How much/what kind of contact makes life easier or better for you right now? Do that  :) and if you decide that means NC at all, that's not unreasonable given the circumstances.
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H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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#49: August 02, 2020, 07:52:45 AM
Hello,

I was just agreeing with Treasur and Thunder.  Going NC is your choice and your control on how it is best for you to heal. It has nothing to do with her feelings and everything to do with your feelings.

You are doing well, keep posting and read carefully the advice you are being given, it's invaluable.

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#50: August 02, 2020, 08:33:25 AM
Quote
The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .
.

Hi John . I just have a quick comment about the statement above. I have seen this said to LBS many times...that they "might" be back , that this is "temporary" ,  that it is" possible " someday over the rainbow etc etc .   Many feel hopeful , relieved and committ to waiting it out. I had an entirely different response and feeling when my arrogant, strutting and swaggerring teenage husband said this to me .  And he did say " this is hopefully temporary and I will want to come home in the future ".   Say the firetruck what ??   Hmmmmm ?  . I just looked at him and said the 1st thing that came to my mind ..."  Whether you return to our home and family or not , is entirely up to ME. YOU do not get a vote whatsoever . I decide whether or not you EVER have a home with me and your daughters again.  Remember that and do NOT EVER say that to me again. Period.

I know it is entirely a different response than most ..but it is absolutely how I felt . NOT is a million years will YOU decide anything more about MY life.  Its mine. A truth dart so to speak.  He just was utterly totally stunned and said not another word as I walked away.   

Quote
her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk .
.

Again... what is there to "sort" when you are living with another man ?. It just seems to me another tactic of control . And this is just food for thought, as I know this is utterly excruciatingly painful. I am not discounting any of the anguish. Take a bit of control back John...in tiny bites.  When she is living apart from another man , has NO contact with that affair partner and wishes to book an appointment with a therapist ....you will consider the "sorting things out conversation". Until such time, there will be no "sorting, talking, communicating etc".   Bam . Ball is in her court, your expectations and boundaries are VERY clear and you have a bit of authourity and control over your own life.  My thoughts ... and my experience . I feel for you John ..I really do.
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#51: August 02, 2020, 08:55:15 AM
Just to clarify she's not living with OM and she's been at pains to point out she's not seeing him ,by the sounds of it he's peeing her off .

Any contact we have she always points out what she's up to where she's going .

She knows that if all contact is ended by me , she'll end up in my mental filling cabinet ,and I tend to shut the draw and that's it ,she's seen me walk away from people never to be mentioned again .

There are so many ifs ,buts ,maybes.  I feel like I'm a tractor stuck in a muddy field I get a little forward then slip back in to the rut I've just pulled out of ,she's the driver ,but doesn't know what to do about it.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#52: August 02, 2020, 09:22:25 AM
I'm so torn about NC because she has wanted to remain friends all the way through this it's been important to her , her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk .

I'm torn because I get advice to go NC ,but she keeps contact going not me , she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her ,when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time ,I've been told the OM is annoying her .

The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words , she wishes she could take my pain away . She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone . I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' . In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite'

If anyone can make sense of this please as I no longer can

Here we go.  I had this from my H 7 years ago and nothing he said or did ever changed his way or means of behaving.

I am going to translate MLC speak for you.

she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her.
Hello, you haven't chased me in a few days - does this mean that you don't want to speak to me or have anything to do with me. I'm worried about me and when you ignore me it makes me feel more important.

when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication

she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time
I am alone in my head but not really If I emphasise this hard enough you will believe me,

I've been told the OM is annoying her .  (what proof do you have here JohnT?)

The last time I mentioned us
she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .
You know we could get back together again but I want to play first and to have fun and serious stuff like talking about having a relationship is too boring.  So I'll deflect what you're thinking and try to let you down gently but really - yoyu want to talk about us now?

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words
I am a miserable cow for doing what I have done but I'm not miserable; it had to be done
 she wishes she could take my pain away
If I take your pain away, I can walk away from this relationship guilt free.  I do feel really guilty for what I have done and OM well he's just a good excuse to assuage my guilt.  I don't want to feel guilty anymore so if I say something nice about your pain; it might make it easier on me.
She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone
I had these exact words from my H - it's called script and is a load of BS.
I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' .
I do know that you care about me and I appreciate it but feel sorry for me because nobody else will care about me that way and I feel that if I return your love will stifle me

In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite
'
I am legally married to you.  I am not emotionally or spiritually married to you so there's no point in us living together and I really don't want to discuss it but I see you are keen for a bit of hope so what I will do is let you down gently and choose my words carefully.

John - There are so many of us on here who have had these words; it's called script.  I remember exactly 3 months after BD where I was when my H told me that I wasn't to wait for him and that I was to find someone else. When I said I didn't want to find anyone else his response was " well you should - he will be a lucky man."   This is whilst he was getting ready to see OW.   He then said he didn't want a divorce. My response was " You don't want a marriage either - so what do you want?" 
His reply - " I don't know."  and walked out.

She is dropping you crumbs and this is not to say that none of what she thinks is false or deceptive; Most of the time MLCers say one thing one day and something else the next. They just know that they don't want us for now.  They don't really know why and they don't understand why they are behaving the way they are but they lack self awareness to face upto themselves and so would rather run away from anything that might cause them a tiny bit of grief.  That would include her OM too.

Read up on the pursuit and distance dance as well.  That is so illuminating and once you become a student of it you will see exactly when that behaviour applies to you both.  Her initial text about worrying that you were ignoring her is pursuit and your feeling is to dance back to her worry.  Then she will distance and you will hang on for any crumb of what she might have said.

This is why you need to know exactly what NC is - how it will help you and how you need to let your W understand your course of action.


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My wife's MLC
#53: August 02, 2020, 11:48:32 AM
I'm so torn about NC because she has wanted to remain friends all the way through this it's been important to her , her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk . Oh yes, the Its really important that we remain friends - my wife said this.

I'm torn because I get advice to go NC ,but she keeps contact going not me , she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her ,when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time ,I've been told the OM is annoying her .

The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us . My wife said the EXACT SAME THING

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words , she wishes she could take my pain away . My Wife said the same
She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone . My wife said she thinks she's making the biggest mistake

I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' . In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite' My wife always made it a habit of pointing out that we are married, even though we no longer live together

If anyone can make sense of this please as I no longer can

As you can see John, this is typical script - you cannot rely on anything she says.  They all follow the same script.  You need to detach so that you dont hold on to their words.
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My wife's MLC
#54: August 02, 2020, 01:06:52 PM
So in your considered opinions is this a MLC based on my observations
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Re: My wife's MLC
#55: August 02, 2020, 01:13:19 PM
Very possible.  It is clear that your wife is depressed and is acting out of character. 

She may be MLC - she may be a MLT (midlife transition) - Either way she is not her "normal " self and the advice we give you is applicable across all eventualities.

OP mentions Time being a gift - that gift is for you to learn, to grow and to heal so that if she is an MLCer you can deal with it as an emotionally and spiritually healthy being.   Time would also tell you if it is an MLC too; it is still early days for you. 
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My wife's MLC
#56: August 03, 2020, 04:45:35 AM
She's been in touch asking about when I'm going to take her up on her offer of food at our local favourite cafe
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#57: August 03, 2020, 05:09:53 AM
Quote
She's been in touch asking about when I'm going to take her up on her offer of food at our local favourite cafe
.

How do you feel about this John?  What is your initial reaction?
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Re: My wife's MLC
#58: August 03, 2020, 05:20:12 AM
She's been in touch asking about when I'm going to take her up on her offer of food at our local favourite cafe

In addition to Barbie's question apply the rule of 3.  Wait 3 hours or days before replying. This will give you time to consider and reflect how you feel and whether it is what you can handle.

She is using the food at favourite local cafe to reel you in (pursuit and distance dance).

If you can go knowing that nothing she will say or do will really make a difference to the current situation then go. 
Go without expectations. 

If it is too much for you to consider then don't go.   

Treat it as a business meeting if you do go - be authentic but no R conversations even if she brings it up.

If you do go Listen carefully, validate- use the word "Uhuh" often to show you are listening but nor reacting and if needs be throw in the odd truth dart but with NO expectations!
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#59: August 03, 2020, 05:52:13 AM
Hello,

Quote
Treat it as a business meeting if you do go - be authentic but no R conversations even if she brings it up.

If you do go Listen carefully, validate- use the word "Uhuh" often to show you are listening but nor reacting and if needs be throw in the odd truth dart but with NO expectations!

This is a key point. No expectations. Keep it light, keep it simple. This is not the time or place for you to "fix" everything.  I know this is hard as you see the "now" as an opportunity to swoop in and save the day. Just know it isn't going to happen and now is the time to focus on your healing and mindset first before you even think of trying to deal with your MLCer.

This isn't a race, just a slow and determined run that you take one day at a time.

[[[[[Ready]]]]]

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#60: August 03, 2020, 10:29:37 AM
There's no such thing as a free lunch lol
I will go with the attitude of its business meeting  , if she wants to talk that's fine but I'll not be bringing it up .
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#61: August 05, 2020, 02:04:50 AM
Something has changed within me , she feels distant and consuming my thoughts less and less with less intensity, this in stark contrast to the weekend when I couldn't think about nothing else , it slightly feels like I was in the final death throes of something like an alligator taking it's prey underwater to roll it around to kill it .I feel like I've just bobed up to the surfice and see a different outlook ( thinking about it so much it's burnt itself out) , if any of that makes sense.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#62: August 06, 2020, 01:42:10 AM
It makes perfect sense; however be aware that you too are cycling.  You will have days when you feel you have clarity and days where you feel desperate for a crumb of contact.

This cycling takes time to burn out so enjoy the moments of seeming detachment and know that the low moments will pass.
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#63: August 06, 2020, 02:42:40 AM
Your spot on about cycling, I'm on a distance away from her feeling.

Went for some food last night with her (she owed me for a favour) made a point of no relationship talk ,she did drop into  conversation  she an 'idiot' I could sense she was admitting she's messed up I didn't ask what she meant .

I picked something up for her on my to meeting her , so she says she owes me a meal again next week .

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#64: August 06, 2020, 10:30:34 AM
Looks like I might have worked on childhood issue without realising it.

A work colleague said to me' I didn't want to do anything ' coming from him (storeman who does very little)  I  worked  hard on a job and to hear that just switched my anger on, so he got a short sharp lesson in what not to say to me , when I was younger I wouldn't have reacted and just tolerate it , no more a inner toughness is established in me ,'no more good ole D*** will solve my problems and help me out and do my work for me


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« Last Edit: August 07, 2020, 02:09:06 AM by Songanddance »

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#65: August 07, 2020, 11:02:21 AM
Something has changed within me , she feels distant and consuming my thoughts less and less with less intensity, this in stark contrast to the weekend when I couldn't think about nothing else , it slightly feels like I was in the final death throes of something like an alligator taking it's prey underwater to roll it around to kill it .I feel like I've just bobed up to the surfice and see a different outlook ( thinking about it so much it's burnt itself out) , if any of that makes sense.

Agree with Songanddance.....the LBS cycles, and can cycle hard at times.   Enjoy the moments when you feel detached, and dont beat yourself up if you fall down.   Understand the moment is temporary, and the longer you go through this, you'll find that you bounce back much quicker, each time.
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#66: August 07, 2020, 04:45:00 PM
All so true, my bomb drop was 5/2019.  Every time i feel i got this and i have the bull by the horns, SURPRISE!!!  Tread tightly John T, it does get better over time but it's the unexpected that drags u down.  Keep posting and stay close, the Veterans will talk you off of your cliffs.

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#67: August 11, 2020, 01:40:04 PM
I'm thinking less and less each day,with less intensity about her, this has been consistent for 2 weeks now
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#68: August 11, 2020, 04:29:34 PM
I'm thinking less and less each day,with less intensity about her, this has been consistent for 2 weeks now

Thats great!  But dont beat yourself up if you cycle - the cycle is brutal, for the LBS
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#69: August 12, 2020, 11:33:55 AM
Had to meet her today ,no talk about us . I was tempted to ask  but felt it's better to not to pressure her . I was invited in her home  by her  , she was keen for me to see her rabbits , I was about to go and she asked me to have a coffee. Then she's asked if we can meet next week.
Not sure what her agenda is.
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#70: August 12, 2020, 12:40:32 PM
Hello,

Quote
Not sure what her agenda is.

First of all, you are not a mind reader and don't try to be one. I wasted many months trying to read the tea leaves. I was too focused on her. "She got up 30 minutes earlier than before, is that a sign?" "She stopped drinking tea, is that a sign?"

Your wife is caught up in emotions and reactions as opposed to rational thought and responses. You can't figure her out. As I have stated before, if you want to go and see her rabbits. Go and enjoy the rabbits but leave all expectations behind. As long as you can keep things light, no talk about "us", and you leave as if you just spent some time at a friend's house, you will be fine.

As many have stated, you can't fix her or control her. However, you can be a positive influence on her. Just be friendly and be present, and those actions will leave you in a better place when you leave.

((((Ready))))
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#71: August 12, 2020, 04:12:42 PM
Such great advice here...and it seems like you’re handling it well. Some days will be easier than others, but the important things are to keep the conversation to non-relationship topics as much as possible, to be friendly and approachable without being needy, and to keep your expectations at zero. Sure sounds like that was how this interaction went.
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#72: August 12, 2020, 10:33:09 PM
Seem to be back overthinking , a neighbor told me that the OM crush is not going around much and there take is that he's just a mate ,they also said after I'd moved out he was spending time at hers  (but mostly outside the front of the house) and she was acting like a teenager her body language was 'come and get me '
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#73: August 12, 2020, 10:57:30 PM
She seems fine on her own , shes admitted the menopause has started .

She asked me to do a repair at her home I refused, ll probably do the repair but she has to get used to me saying no to people, I'm noticing if I say no to something now she accepts it without question
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#74: August 13, 2020, 05:16:19 AM
My STBXW blamed menopause early on as one of the reasons for her erratic behavior.
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#75: August 13, 2020, 07:25:58 AM
Not sure what her agenda is.

What does green taste like?  You'll have about the same level of success trying to figure that one out...

She may not even have an "agenda." She may just be lost in the fog...
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#76: August 14, 2020, 11:18:13 PM
I'm also a member on the hearts blessing site ,some of there advice I find a little difficult to put into practice, they keep saying end all contact which I've pretty much done , but there is still some contact from her .This site is a little more well it feels like distance your self ,but if she contacts me be polite but firm and do things on my terms which I do , I only reply when she emails .

I've been advised to cut all contact  until the OM is out of the picture,from what she says and others have said he's a friend ,the relationship idea I think she got her teenage crush from never  materlised.

She has asked me to go for food with her at a local cafe,  I have not mentioned us it's up to her to raise the subject I wanted to but feel this is clingy behaviour , she seems a little worried about upsetting me , I feel like she's checking out if I've changed ,and desperately wanting and increasing a connection.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#77: August 15, 2020, 02:24:35 AM
Hi John T - the advice on HB is a little more radical; this is why RCR's advice on the types of contact that the LBS can choose are much more useful.

Why don't you go dark on your wife? She is a clinging boomerang and the best way to treat them is to go dark.
Going dark means choosing when to respond (after applying the rule of 3) and choosing whether to go for lunch or not.

Going dark is an emotional boundary for you and in this situation it may help.  So you could say to your W " I appreciate your suggestion of going to the cafe but whilst you are seeing OM - it is not appropriate for us to spend time together like this"

So you are setting a boundary.  You're not cutting all contact; you're just simply saying NO not at the moment.

Going NC means explaining to your W that you intend to have no contact and the boundary needs to be explained clearly. 
"W whilst you are with or spending time with OM; there will be no communication between us. I will not respond to texts or calls or meet up with you. The length of the time of no contact depends entirely upon your R with OM. When he is completely out of your life, then I will consider resuming contact with you. The only time I might respond is if there were a genuine emergency."

That is going NC and it means NO contact at all. If you cannot do that at this stage that's fine and TBH perfectly normal.

So that's why I suggest that going dark is better for you in this instance. You pick and choose the level of contact to work out for you what you can handle and what you can't.
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#78: August 15, 2020, 05:34:13 AM
She got really panicked when I was didn't reply to her communications , she asked if I was ignoring her  I sort of am going dark .
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#79: August 15, 2020, 06:21:54 AM
Hello,

Quote
She got really panicked when I was didn't reply to her communications , she asked if I was ignoring her  I sort of am going dark .

Don't make the same mistake I made. The moment my boundary had an impact on her, I reacted. Then the boundary fell to the wayside. Boundaries are not to control or change the MLCer. They are to protect you from being pulled into their mess. Going NC is when they are in full monster or purposefully putting the affair in your face. Regardless of the choice, if you set a boundary of limited communication and she sends three texts and you start replying, she knows she is still in control.

Think through, even though it is menopause and MLC, she choose to move out and she is seeing someone else. Don't become her handyman  for free. Plan and do things for yourself. Now if she calls and you have plans, you can honestly tell her that you have plans. Put her and her concerns on the back burner.

My point is that she has to do her work on her own. Standing is hard work, and it takes time. Lot's of time. It took my ex almost a decade to reach out to me and apologize.

Go slow to go slower my friend and above all else, be good to yourself.

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#80: August 15, 2020, 07:01:20 AM
From what I get from her the OM thing never really got started , it was a fantasy in her head , I said I won't do her decking repair and she immediately dropped the subject normally there would have been more asking  . Outwardly she seems ok but there's odd things said that indicates she's not right .But I should be not concerning my self with her actions and thoughts  .
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Re: My wife's MLC
#81: August 15, 2020, 07:41:53 AM
From what you "got from her" the OM thing never really got started.

John please MLCer's are notorious liars.  Some lie about the om/ow and were actually seeing them for a year or two.
Of course she panicked, you were not sitting around waiting for her texts.  You weren't where she left you.

I think Dark is a great idea.  It will give her time to sort herself out.  They need that alone time to think.

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#82: August 15, 2020, 10:28:28 AM
From what I get from her the OM thing never really got started , it was a fantasy in her head , I said I won't do her decking repair and she immediately dropped the subject normally there would have been more asking  . Outwardly she seems ok but there's odd things said that indicates she's not right .But I should be not concerning my self with her actions and thoughts  .

Lies - remember, they lie.  Believe NOTHING she says.

As for the deck, you said you told her no, but you would probably do it - you need to show consistency.  If you told her No, dont do the deck
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#83: August 17, 2020, 03:00:57 AM
 I decided to make a change for the better for me by not suppressing my feelings to keep others happy.
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#84: August 17, 2020, 04:39:02 AM
Hello,

Quote
I decided to make a change for the better for me by not suppressing my feelings to keep others happy.

Good for you, I for one avoided conflict as I saw conflict as bad. Instead of  confronting the issue, I tended to suppress everything. It doesn't work. Let me know how it works for you. It was hard for me at first but now I feel I can address any issue with people and I feel much more free to let others know how I feel.

I still have my times where I just keep quiet to keep the peace, but not like before.

You can do this,

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#85: August 17, 2020, 05:24:04 AM
As for the deck, you said you told her no, but you would probably do it - you need to show consistency.  If you told her No, dont do the deck

This was a lesson I had to learn as well... it is OK to say "No!" to the Mid-Lifer.... I had to do that and xW was NOT happy about it. It was at that point that I realized that she still expected me to be there at her every beck and call, although I am in a new R since her D was final. When the fact that I was no longer going to drop everything and run if it didn't directly have something to do with my kids hit her in the face like a 2x4, she first tried Monster, then tried to guilt me. After that, she realized that I was not kidding and I wasn't backing down from my boundary.... Suddenly, she found ways to either do whatever it was herself or get someone else (her TGF usually) to help her....
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#86: August 17, 2020, 07:07:03 AM
You have to pick your issues to deal with , do it to many times and you come across as difficult, not enough and your soft it's a balancing act .
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#87: August 17, 2020, 02:34:59 PM
Something I'm noticing increasingly is negative miserable people bring down others , I've made the decision to limit moaning and being miserable.

I've finally started to realise I need to look at my poor qualities and work them rather changing for her .
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#88: August 19, 2020, 12:34:52 PM
Hello,

Quote
I've finally started to realise I need to look at my poor qualities and work them rather changing for her .

Now you are thinking and this will get you to move forward.

Fist bump,

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#89: August 23, 2020, 07:07:38 AM
I'm not sure why she's still holding on ,she intiated the separation but wants to keep the connection going .
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Re: My wife's MLC
#90: August 23, 2020, 07:17:36 AM
John this seems to be what a lot of them do, unfortunately. 
I believe it is to make themselves feel less guilty about what they are doing.

If you remain friends with her than everyone is ok with their decision.  No one is hurting.
See we're still friends.

Then they have the best of both worlds.
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#91: August 23, 2020, 11:25:52 AM
John,

My wife BD was July 2019.  Over the next 2 weeks, all she said was get me my money for half of everything we own so she can move on.  From July 2019 until Feb 2020 she lived at home 4 days a week and spent 3 days a week at her mothers (dementia).  Feb 2020 she left to live at her mom's full time.  Barely sees our kids. 
No talk of divorce since late July 2019.  Most of her stuff is still here.  She pays me child support (even though I make more than her) because I am raising the kids.  When she does come by to see the kids, the conversation is very relaxed and totally normal. 

So just like you, my W wanted a divorce and follows through with physical separation, but will not move forward with any formal separation agreement or divorce paperwork.  Where we live, we need a formal separation agreement +1 year of separation.  Only then, can divorce be processed.  If she truly wanted, we could be divorced by now (we are at 14 months since BD).

Sadly, my patience is wearing thin.  I can totally do the single dad thing.  I've been doing it for over a year now.  But I really want a partner in life to share life experiences with. 

I am seeing some very small steps by her.  She is spending much more time with the kids and is now reaching back out to friends (she went silent on them as well for over a year).  I still speak with her brother (we are good friends) and he doesn't know what she is doing or why.  He makes it clear that he much prefers us together.  She doesn't speak to him much.

Good luck.  This process is absolutely draining.  I am virtually fully detached from her but it still is draining since we have kids together.  I am not sure if ripping the band aid off (me file for divorce) is better than letting it fall off on its own (waiting for her to make a decision).  Totally crappy position to be in.
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#92: August 23, 2020, 01:27:42 PM
We are on similar tacks , divorce  talk came and went very quickly , she wants to keep talking seems to want to spend more time with me , she's not closed the joint account despite saying she would , a motorbike she had bought for me as a thank you for fitting a new kitchen I've given her back to sell but she hasn't sold it .
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#93: August 23, 2020, 11:41:20 PM
Of late my relearning of me is gathering pace the more I look the more I change , I'm now fighting negativity as hard as I can , I've got a new belief in myself  . I've come to realise I don't need my W to be happy and continue on with my little adventure  on this planet.
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#94: August 24, 2020, 12:41:58 AM
Of late my relearning of me is gathering pace the more I look the more I change , I'm now fighting negativity as hard as I can , I've got a new belief in myself  . I've come to realise I don't need my W to be happy and continue on with my little adventure  on this planet.

Well done John T!

You are doing so well!

LW
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#95: August 26, 2020, 10:29:39 AM
Been out for food with my W , we chatted about everything but us ,I talked more and little things we'd done in the past which bought a few smiles  . I gave her a hand with her rabbit . I noticed she's biting her thumbs with is an indication of her being stressed. She did say she can't remember what she's done a few hours ago (does show her brain is foggy maybe)

I suggested we meet again for food and she wants to do it every other week . There is a elephant in the room around us . Not sure what to think.
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#96: August 26, 2020, 10:37:23 AM
Been out for food with my W , we chatted about everything but us ,I talked more and little things we'd done in the past which bought a few smiles  . I gave her a hand with her rabbit . I noticed she's biting her thumbs with is an indication of her being stressed. She did say she can't remember what she's done a few hours ago (does show her brain is foggy maybe)

I suggested we meet again for food and she wants to do it every other week . There is a elephant in the room around us . Not sure what to think.

Its best to have no expectations from your MLC'er.  Just be the lighthouse when she turns to you, but also understand that with every positive interaction, withdrawal usually follows.
 
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#97: August 26, 2020, 01:38:00 PM
She seemed a bit more distant and took more work to talk today . I'm still wondering if it's a midlife crisis, depression, menopause all mixed together , some of the  behaviours all point that way.
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#98: August 27, 2020, 04:00:24 AM
You will have about as much success figuring out which one or what percentage of which one it is as you would trying to figure out what green tastes like using your elbow.

Menopause is not something that can be "cured" although, in theory, the symptoms can be minimized by following a doctor's advice. The other 2 are things that, quite frankly, are fully in her court to deal with.... One can lead a horse to water but they can NOT be forced to drink....

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Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
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A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

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#99: August 27, 2020, 04:59:38 AM
She seemed a bit more distant and took more work to talk today . I'm still wondering if it's a midlife crisis, depression, menopause all mixed together , some of the  behaviours all point that way.

JT

I feel the same way about my W.  It’s a mixture of all 3.  Sometimes she seems normal for the hour or so she is with me and our sons but she runs back to her hideout (Apt) and we don’t see her for a few weeks.  We haven’t seen her in almost two months now so I assume it’s getting to difficult for her to act as though all is good.  Just as UM says like tasting green with your elbow.  Who knows what she is thinking?  Maybe her but probably no one.

One of her friends recently told me “I don’t think she was raised right”.   I think she is on to something.

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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#100: August 27, 2020, 05:36:06 AM
Hello,

An LBSer was walking on the beach and found a bottle. He rubbed the bottle and out popped a genie. The genie told the LBSer that he had one wish and the LBSer said, "I love Hawaii, but I am afraid to fly. Could you build me a bridge from California to Hawaii so I could drive. The Genie looked at the LBSer and said, "You've got to be kidding me. The logistics of this bridge are enormous. The depth of the piers and making it safe is too much work for me. Think of something else." The LBSer said, "Come to think of it, I just want to understand my MLCer, her thoughts, her needs, how I can know what she is thinking."

The genie paused and asked, "On your highway to Hawaii, do you want two lanes or four?"

Lot of truth in that joke my friend. Just keep focusing on you. Do your thing, be open to your MLCer, but no expectations.

Ready
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#101: August 27, 2020, 09:59:00 AM
Many a true word is said in gest , I'm trying to understand the impossible I guess.
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#102: August 27, 2020, 10:11:00 AM


I've started going to a gym and seem to be able to run for quite a while , strange really as I haven't liked running for the whole of my life , it's feels good to burn myself out and mentally dump all of this for a while.

Started going to a golf driving range as well , my mate who I go with gets wound up , I mentally refuse to get wound up I'm putting my new skills I've been working on into action.
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#103: August 27, 2020, 01:32:08 PM
Hi JT,
the best therapy i can do for myself is doing stuff i have not done before.  Not because it was on some bucket list it's just because the opportunity comes up and i say why not. I combine that mentality with all of the home maintenance my h used to do and i stay pretty busy.  And when i do start to think too much i come to the Hero's Spouse site.....

Ready,
thank you for adding some levity to what we all know is so very real.

5hil
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#104: August 31, 2020, 10:54:33 PM
My W seems to have gone very quiet, no contact at all, whether this is another phase of her MLC beginning.
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#105: September 01, 2020, 01:55:41 AM
JT,

My W has been quiet for the past 2 months as well.  They cycle between phases all the time.  I know it’s tough not to notice and question where they are at in their heads.  I  personally just ignore it and keep it to myself any more unless one of my sons brings it up.  It just contributes to our cycling and keeps us stuck if we try to apply meaning to theirs. 

HD 
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« Last Edit: September 01, 2020, 02:10:17 AM by Hoosier Daddy »
W51
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BD 9/29/19 (Moved out while I was away for weekend with no prior warning.  I was shocked)

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#106: September 03, 2020, 01:49:43 AM
Nearly a year on and I still feel like BD has just happened
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#107: September 03, 2020, 05:25:33 AM
Hello,

Quote
Nearly a year on and I still feel like BD has just happened

There will be days possibly weeks that you will cycle down. During these times, it is imperative that you engage yourself in meaningful actions that benefit you. Volunteer, go for a hike, read a great book, or build something for you.

Your essence and view of yourself as a man and a husband took a huge hit from bomb drop. I could be wrong, and I am using my own situation to guide you. Have you asked yourself, outside of just being a good guy, why do you help your MLCer with the odd jobs?  Yes, I did things for my ex as well. Yes, being nice is important. You seem to be the guy that would pull over and help a stranger with a flat tire. But deep down, I did things for my ex to show her and myself that I still had value. That I could play a meaningful role in her life. Somehow, I was still important.

Now that you are faced with the uncomfortable silence from her, the negativity rises up from the pit of your stomach that maybe I'm not important to her; she really doesn't need me.

That is all in your head, and your own fears feeding the darkness you feel.

Your MLCer may bring some value to your life, but she doesn't validate your existence or essence.

Take the time to plan something for yourself this weekend. Make it all about you. If you want to stay in and sit in your underwear, do it! Tackle some odd job that you wanted to do for a while. Then come back and post about all that you did for you.

You've got this,

(((((Ready)))))
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#108: September 03, 2020, 07:27:55 AM
Ready,
you can always make me smile "stay home and sit in your underwear" .

JT,
I get the "i feel like BD just happened".  I too cycle in and out, my BD was May 19 a few months before our 40th wedding anniversary.  I am glad H left 12/19 as it gave me time to cry, heal and plan.  For the most i do pretty good and i give myself kudos for that. 

I say that but then i get that infrequent text asking me to do something.  All of sudden all the pain and anxiety comes rushing back as i feel i am now a temporary wife until i accomplish his request.
Yep that wound just got reopened, just recently i realized that i am allowing my H who fired me as his W to control my feelings and actions.

I recently asked in my post how will i handle my 41st anniversary coming up on 9/29 as it will be the first one w/o H.  But since then i have thought about it, i figure since i was fired from being a wife i will treat it as another day. That's my plan and i pray i can execute, i am planning to keep myself focused on other activities.

JT you are doing a great job, allow yourself some time to reflect and make it about you! Maybe you can go somewhere or do something you have never done.  Go somewhere and just sceam at the top of your lungs.  (I don't know if guys do that) I will tell you every time i let go and do something my H and i have not done together he is never on my mind.

5hil
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#109: September 03, 2020, 10:17:50 AM
Ready

I've got a plumbing project lined up for the weekend, might try and squeeze in a gym session in and golf ( took it up since BD) .You seem to have a good understanding of how I work .

5hil
Been sacked as a W is a good phrase, I'm now thinking that I've been made redundant.

Thank you all for your views and support it really helps me see things from other perspectives.

I have said to her don't take me for granted, the reason for saying that was she had said she used and abused the OM to do stuff for her ,it was my of saying don't take me for a fool .
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#110: September 05, 2020, 12:48:21 AM
My W asked if I would collect a mouse trap for if I was near a shop ,I had said to her don't take me for granted (she had said use and abuse the OM)which I said I'm not going to be used . I got the trap and went and dropped it off , we got talking and she broke down crying saying she's struggling with life , she has massive guilt for what she has done to me she said she's screwed up everything  , I said do you regret what you've and the reply I'm not sure ,I think this was her reply about us splitting up.

I could see in her face the regret and remorse,  I think it's all hitting home very hard maybe the fog is clearing slightly
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#111: September 05, 2020, 03:29:17 PM
John,

I periodically have similar discussions with my wife... she tells me she’s sorry she messed everything up, she talks about the guilt and shame she has, she gets tearful and says I shouldn’t trust her. I tell her that I want to be able to trust her again but that I know she is going through a difficult time and that yes, right now I do need to protect myself. It’s hard because it is at least related to relationship talks, and I definitely don’t want to do that. For me, I notice that my wife is more likely to be depressed and tearful and apologetic after her therapy sessions. For you, I would say that I imagine this is where the lighthouse analogy comes to mind. Let her see you as someone who won’t shame her and who can be a safe person to talk to. Just remember to keep your expectations at zero, to protect your own heart during this time.
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#112: September 05, 2020, 05:45:41 PM
Hello,

I think you are doing a fantastic job considering the time you are in and that your w is deep in the tunnel. I don't know if you can really do anything different. However, I do think you need consider throwing the occasional truth dart.

Quote
she has massive guilt for what she has done to me she said she's screwed up everything  , I said do you regret what you've and the reply I'm not sure ,I think this was her reply about us splitting up.

Let's clarify, guilt is from the ego. Remorse comes from the heart. I think you wife is showing guilt, not true remorse. So the next time your ex says she has screwed everything up, then ask her, "How do you plan on fixing it?"

Don't do this all the time and by all means, change the question to wording you want. However, when she has moments of clarity, then give her something to chew on and reflect on.

I hope you weekend is going well. Today was a successful day and I got a lot done as well.

Keep posting and remember, her issues are not your issues.

(((((Ready)))))

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#113: September 06, 2020, 05:16:34 AM
Thank you
Ready and LBS some very useful words for me to mull over
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#114: September 08, 2020, 05:56:53 AM
I'm grateful for the input from all of you ,I am putting into practice the changes recommend and in recent days it's not the first thought when I wake up and has stopped being the main thing I read on the internet looking for answers , I get the support from you good people ,it's hard beyond belief to break away but im slowly achieving it.

Thank you
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#115: September 08, 2020, 06:27:08 AM
Just keep going John, it does get easier.  Just takes awhile.

You'll do little ups and downs, which is normal.
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#116: September 08, 2020, 06:39:16 AM
Just keep in mind John, there is a difference between regret and remorse.

Regret is, you tell them something is broken and they feel bad for you.  "Gee I'm sorry that broke for you."

Remorse is, they hear something is broken and they try to fix it for you.
Remorse is actions, not words.

Remorse is stopping doing things that hurt you.  Trying to make it up to you.
You'll see real remorse if she feels it.  Otherwise it means nothing.
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#117: September 08, 2020, 02:04:11 PM
My W has cancelled our meal out tomorrow, she said 'she won't be very good company ' I think she's struggling with her mental health, I knew she's struggling with what she's done maybe God is chipping away at her (I'm not a religious man ) but I believe he's pulling at her .Maybe she's moving along the tunnel. Any thoughts are welcomed
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#118: September 09, 2020, 06:19:12 AM
Maybe maybe maybe.....

You can fill your days with "maybe's," and "might be's" and "what if's." You can also try to taste green with your elbow or try to melt some chalk on a slice of bread instead of the cheese.....

If we "ass-u-me" anything, it is most likely to come back and bite us because it allows us to raise expectations with no valid reason to do so... Then, when those expectations are not met, we are disappointed.

Bottom line is that it doesn't matter if she is MAYBE moving..... Once you see clear evidence, that is true remorse and not just guilt, actions and not words, once she has really begun DEALING with whatever it is that has caused this identity crisis, THEN you an see where you are and how you wish to proceed going forward....

Until that, you are maybe just wasting time and energy that would be better off spent rebuilding your own life....
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BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

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#119: September 21, 2020, 03:14:06 PM
I can't help but think my W has gone totally quiet since I said I'm not being taken for granted.Starting to doubt I I'd done the right thing saying what I said but then I needed to be true to myself.
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#120: September 21, 2020, 03:26:27 PM
Yes you did!
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#121: September 22, 2020, 12:12:41 AM
Zion I don't understand your comment.
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#122: September 22, 2020, 12:16:54 AM
Had to register a new tablet and she got a notification, she messaged to ask if the notification was correct I said it was and asked how she was ,her reply was 'I'm ok ta' she didn't ask how i was which she tends to do .
Im deciding whether to check if she's alright or leave her alone.
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#123: September 22, 2020, 03:17:01 AM
Zion I don't understand your comment.

Not speaking for Zion, but I believe the response means you did the right thing. You seem very focused on what is going on with her and taking too much responsibility about how she is reacting. You stated you won't be taken for granted. That is perfectly reasonable and a healthy boundary. Yet you seem worried from her reaction that it may have been the wrong thing to do.

Truth is if she is in MLC what you do will not have much impact. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be kind and caring, just that you should not be analyzing every reaction, because it doesn't make sense to do so. And ultimately it may be hard to accept that we have no control over this process, and that what we do doesn't ultimately matter once MLC is in full swing.
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#124: September 22, 2020, 03:20:40 AM
John personally, I would leave her completely alone. 

They need to be left alone to think.  This "think time" is what they need to work things out.
The more think time the better.

You did the right thing telling her she not to take you for granted, so just let it be. 
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#125: September 22, 2020, 05:34:36 AM
I agree with Thunder . Leave her alone John and let her get on with it without interruption...no matter how hard that may feel to you.  It is her time to be alone with herself and do her "think time".
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#126: September 22, 2020, 07:59:24 AM
Hi JT,
in the beginning i always asked how my H was doing. He he would tell me all that was going on with him, sick, Covid, bills, living situation, a bit of poor me. He does say "hope you are doing well" but not really asking "how are you doing?" Before MLC he always started conversation with "how are you doing, what is happening?"  Now he is only my H in physical body and he does not really connect with me or the life he walked away from, i don't ask how he is.  Maybe later if i see some true interest or engagement.  I just keep our communication on point.  It hurts less and helps me continue to heal and move forward.

5hil
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#127: September 22, 2020, 12:39:22 PM
hello,

Quote
Starting to doubt I I'd done the right thing saying what I said but then I needed to be true to myself.

Boundaries are important. You never want to be taken for granted. Your request was not unreasonable and you sent out a strong but subtle message that you value yourself.

I agree with the others that you can't fix or control your MLCer, but you can influence. Maybe I am wrong, but this may have been the first time you stuck up for yourself to her. That's a big change in your interaction and she is now trying to figure you out. But that is on her, not you.

I also agree with Thunder, silence from you will say more than any words you speak.

((((Ready))))
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#128: September 22, 2020, 10:37:27 PM
Your right Ready  it was my first big line drawn in the sand previous attempts ended up getting watered down by her, all at her request .
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#129: October 01, 2020, 02:29:25 AM
All totally quite from my W I've resisted the temptation to get in contact.
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My wife's MLC
#130: October 01, 2020, 02:43:38 AM
All totally quite from my W I've resisted the temptation to get in contact.

Good..... She needs to feel your absence.... That is what life is going to be like in the future....
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Me - 57, xW - 50
Together 19 years - Married 17 at separation & 21 at D-Day
S - 13, D - 9
2 Dogs
BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold & separated - Mar 2016
Divorce final 30 August 2019

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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

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My wife's MLC
#131: October 03, 2020, 07:04:01 AM
Hello,

Quote
Can you please explain his or any LBS's ability to influence??

Good question. In most situations we seek to control, but reality has it that none of us have it on ourselves let alone others. After bomb drop, our focus shifts and suddenly we want our partner back. More than anything else, we seek a specific outcome of the restoration of the marriage. The more we try  control this situation, the more we come across to our MLCer as controlling.

Instead of focusing on the end goal, focus on the process. The more you learn to enjoy doing whatever you do, the end goal becomes irrelevant.
When we challenge ourselves to becoming better and succeed, through the power of influence we help them become better as well.

MLCers live in a world of feeling and justification. They think like teenagers in this mindset, and all of the self-centered thought that comes with adolescence.  From the mindset of the MLCer, they are miserable and empty, so you must feel the same. Better yet, when they are living their high life and they see you as miserable and controlling, it justifies all of their actions. "See it was my spouses fault. I have have found happiness. They are still in misery."

Let's flip the switch. You don't become miserable. You don't answer the phone the second that they call. You live for yourself and enjoy yourself. You maintain your core values and a call to do good for others despite the pain. John T needs to find satisfaction living in his world within his own skin. He should improve and fix his own home-not repair hers. He should still maintain relations with his friends and do the things he enjoys doing. Maybe even try something new.

This isn't to manipulate the MLCer, it is by being true to yourself and being positive about your present situation, that the MLCer no longer sees you as the source of their pain. Your responses as opposed to reactions, your ability to still be good despite their actions, and the fact that you no longer focus on a specific outcome all have influence on the MLCer.

This is not a guarantee that they will come back. Influence is not specific to one outcome. It is the acceptance of many outcomes. That as you go about your day, you are still good to others, you find peace and content in your own heart, and that your life has value with or without your spouse. That's the power of influence.

(((((Hugs))))

Ready


 
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"Always look in the mirror and love what you see."

J
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My wife's MLC
#132: October 05, 2020, 09:02:48 AM
I'm starting to feel  increasingly distant from my W and now questioning whether we have any real chance of getting back together.
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My wife's MLC
#133: October 06, 2020, 11:12:20 AM
Hello,

Quote
I'm starting to feel  increasingly distant from my W and now questioning whether we have any real chance of getting back together.

I want you to continue to feel distant so that you can focus on your self-care and healing. I wish I could answer your question about returning, but I can assure you that if you turn off the wife switch and focus on the John T switch, whatever the outcome, you will be in a better place regardless.

(((((Ready)))))
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My wife's MLC
#134: October 06, 2020, 10:49:58 PM
Quote
I'm starting to feel  increasingly distant from my W and now questioning whether we have any real chance of getting back together.
Sorry you're going through this. But I think Ready is right. It's not easy, but I think you just have to live as if she's not coming back and work on your own healing. Old Pilot's welcome letter talks about the gift of time. It's a gift nobody wants to receive for sure, but if you use it well you'll be better regardless of what she does.

You've come a long way already. You're going to be OK.
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"I'm slowly learning to expect nothing and appreciate everything."

Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
Card-carrying member of the Iffer Party

My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

J
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My wife's MLC
#135: October 06, 2020, 11:42:03 PM
I'm starting to mentally adapt to us parting for good, I know she's in a bad place which might be her coming to terms with her issues as I was let go of the other man never got started so now she's alone and unhappy (so I wasn't the cause of her feeling down) she got no-one to blame and nowhere to hide .
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My wife's MLC
#136: October 11, 2020, 09:03:37 AM
Had to contact her about a bill , I noticed that she was replying in exactly the same way as I was sending the email nothing more or less. She did say she's not been feeling very positive lately but is feeling a little better which I suspected she had been very down . She did say she's not my problem,  I've said I'll offer support if required. That's as much as I can do .
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My wife's MLC
#137: October 18, 2020, 10:06:21 AM
I realized that part of this journey is about the changes that you make to yourself as well as your MLC er ,I'm constantly working on me .
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My wife's MLC
#138: October 18, 2020, 11:19:18 AM
Hello,

Quote
,I'm constantly working on me .

This is the best you can do right now. By focusing on you, you are not focusing on her. This will help you heal and put you in a better mindset.

Remember, her crisis really has a little to do with you and is all about her. Let her do what she needs to do while you recover from the trauma she inflicted on you.

(((Hugs))) and know you are doing well,

Ready
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