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Author Topic: My Story My wife's MLC

J
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My Story My wife's MLC
OP: July 17, 2020, 09:04:03 AM
Hello I'm new to the site ,I've reading it alot.
My story wife had said she was unhappy and she was put on antidepressants , I asked  her if her unhappiness was down to me she kept saying no ,one day she was in tears and said I kept saying the wrong things ,so I stopped saying certain things (which were only jokes nothing nasty ) entered the world of egg shell treading.

Fast forward to September last year ,we had joined a local motor bike group and went on ride outs ,one guy lived in our village so she started taking his dog for a walk ,one particular ride out we stopped and she was mucking around with him a bit to much and it started an alarm bell they spent time together which I wasn't overly concerned about because I could trust her , I got home from work one day and our wedding pictures were laid face down I asked why and she said this other guy was making jokes about them which I found odd .We went out to a local cafe on the motorbike but my gut feelings told me something was wrong , so I asked her if we were splitting up to which she said ' yes' .

Back home I said what's going on to which I got ' I love you but I'm not in love with you ' she'd developed feelings for him and said 'it told her something was wrong in our marriage ' she said something very odd 'i wish I'd have met you years and I'd have had children with you' she's adamet she doesn't want children within a week she rented a place moved out  and was talking about a financial split , I was a total mess (  a great diet plan to aid rapid weight loss ) she didn't want to talk  , but she's adamet we stay friends .

I started to look for somewhere to live she was even emailing me details of properties I might like , there was very little contact between us , she did say she wasn't even sure if om even liked her but the more questions I asked the deeper she dug in .I found a property and moved out , but all the way through this I kept giving her the chance to cut me free but she wouldn't , shed mentioned divorce at the start of all of this closing the joint back account etc she won't change her will she's leaving it all to me . I entered no contact which didn't go down well with her .

She kept emailing me about house stuff but most of it was of no use , she seemed to want to keep a connection. I called around to collect some stuff from the garage , I was asked in for coffee so we chatted then she announced she was seeing OM  , I kept my dignaty and said that we should end our friendship her face dropped , so I agreed to email once a month unless it's an emergency .

A few months later and the odd conversation , I'd get little glimpse of her stance changing , she asked me look at the bath as it wasn't draining , as payment she'd make me tea , I couldn't find anything wrong with the bath so we sat down and had tea together but she sat next to me which she'd never done before , I asked about a divorce and she said she can't afford it then she said there's no rush , she hasn't closed the joint bank account so all the things she'd said she was going to do are on hold .

I asked during a talk if she missed me she said ' I miss making memories with you but I don't see us living together '
She popped around with some food for me which I hadn't asked for  she said during a conversation ' your my husband and we aren't living together at the moment ' she then announced she's not seeing OM , it feels like she's dropping hints and her whole demeanor has softened.

Any thoughts would be good
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My wife's MLC
#1: July 17, 2020, 10:09:00 AM
While in MLC, they are consumed by confusion.   One day they want to never see you again, the next day they want to be friends, the next time they may want to try again, the next time OM is their "Soul Mate"

All you can do is detach and continue to do what you are doing. 

Spend time with friends, find a hobby, act as if your marriage is over, and detach from her emotions and behaviours.  Its a rocky road and it can be a 2-10 year adventure.

Sorry you find yourself here, but you are in great company with a lot of experienced LBS'ers
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My wife's MLC
#2: July 17, 2020, 02:51:14 PM
I'm so sorry for what you're going through ( I truly know how it feels) and I agree with what LBS Les said: MLCers are plagued by confusion mixed with depression and other various overwhelming emotions and things they are trying to figure out.

My H was very similar; I asked him ( when his MLC began) if his depression and anger was because of me, and he vehemently denied that, saying it was everything, from his job ( which indeed was very stressful) to the house and cleaning and his routine. Up until the end of anger, he kept repeating that and when I kept asking, he said ' I don't know why you think this is about you!'

Fast forward til he was with the OW: all of a sudden, I WAS THE PROBLEM and everything to do with me was the issue. Our home, our things ( which he essentially boxed and got rid of by not paying storage), I was the issue.

I suspect in a few years, he may one day see no, no it wasn't me and all my flaws. It was something broken inside of him that he tried to fix with external solutions.

As LBS Les says, DETACH. I know how hard it is. I know you will want to take things personally ( I still do this and am trying hard not to blame myself) but detaching is the key.
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H born in 80
I was born in 83
Started dating in 2004; both felt we were soulmates & kept that feeling for 14 yrs
Married H 2006
D born in 2008
H entered MLC in late 2017
Replay started 2018
H moved out in April 2018; was supposed to be gone a month & focus on getting rest; he instead started an affair w/ 21 yr old waitress
H tricked me into moving internationally to stay w/my Mom in June 2018; he abducted our daughter for a YEAR in a desp attempt to cover up the affair

OW seems to be masterminding everything in his life and looks like she wants a green card.
Little to no contact with MLCer but he encouraged me to file for divorce
What's helping me:
meditation, reading/listening to audiobooks

J
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My wife's MLC
#3: July 18, 2020, 01:18:59 AM
I'm struggling to decide if it's an MLC or the menopause or both
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Re: My wife's MLC
#4: July 18, 2020, 05:46:23 AM
Welcome to the Board

You are in a good place.
Your H/W  is on his/her own journey.
You can not do anything to control this trip.
Come here and read or vent, we will listen.
Give your H/W space  he/she needs to heal himself/herself.

I would not ask him/her anything unless you can have no expectations.
Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure.
You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H/W as controlling or pressure.

Your need to start working on you.
There is nothing that you can do to help your H/W.

He/She has given you a gift.
It is time!!

Use the time wisely to make yourself a better person.
Look in the mirror to see what it is that you can improve.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
GAL.

Read some books on depression. Both for yourself! And for H/W.
Believe none of what he/she says and 50% of what he/she does.

Read the resources from this site.
The links that are in my signature.

Detach. - The single most important thing you can do

The detach link and HB's 6 stages of MLC(rewritten from Jim Conway) located in the resources above.
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=4.msg380#msg380

Developing Detachment
http://jamesjmessina.com/toolsforcontrolissues/developdetachment.html

http://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/self-focus_releasers_detach.html

http://www.livestrong.com/article/14712-developing-detachment/

RCR has asked everyone to keep to one thread until  that thread is 150 posts

Keep posting and asking questions and we will try to answer them.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
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My wife's MLC
#6: July 18, 2020, 06:12:31 AM
Hello,

Quote
I'm struggling to decide if it's an MLC or the menopause or both

Who knows? However, menopause doesn't lead to a crisis. We all transition from different aspects of our lives as we go through different stages, early childhood to adolescence, young adulthood to midlife, midlife to senior age and so forth. Erikson stated their were eight stages of life. However during your wife's transition it became a crisis. Instead of acceptance, there became a need for great change. Not just her hairstyle, but her life. The regret of things she wished she had done (children) now that she can't. MLC is a term we use, but the ages can vary greatly. We have several where the crisis started in their early to mid thirties and some in their early sixties. Regardless of the age, their actions, thoughts, and feelings have put them in crisis of who they are, the desire to create a new identity or life as their current situation makes them miserable.

Quote
It was something broken inside of him that he tried to fix with external solutions.

I couldn't have written this better myself. Your wife can't fix herself, and you can't either. She needs to complete her crisis all by herself and you can't control this. However, you can be a light that guides her by being true to yourself and shifting the spotlight from her to you.

The forum is about your journey to health and well-being with or without her. Self-focus is not about "fixing" yourself for the better. It is about grounding yourself into a growth mindset so that you can recover and live as if she is or isn't coming back into your life.

Quote
I asked during a talk if she missed me she said ' I miss making memories with you but I don't see us living together '
She popped around with some food for me which I hadn't asked for  she said during a conversation ' your my husband and we aren't living together at the moment ' she then announced she's not seeing OM , it feels like she's dropping hints and her whole demeanor has softened.

You still hear the confusion and yet she seems normal. This is probably your first touch and go. I was caught off guard by my first one as well. During the crisis, they can come back and check on you, to see reconnect briefly and then go back into the crisis. (Be advised that some just disappear completely for years and make no attempt to talk to anyone-especially their spouse). The important thing is not to get caught up in her cycle so that she doesn't crush you again. Be friendly and supportive, but not connected. You might add that the tea and food was lovely and you enjoyed your time with her and if she needs anything else repaired, you would gladly do it again.

Then go about your merry way.

[Man Hug]

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My wife's MLC
#7: July 19, 2020, 09:35:20 AM
 Be friendly and supportive, but not connected. You might add that the tea and food was lovely and you enjoyed your time with her and if she needs anything else repaired, you would gladly do it again.

I'm mainly doing the above . I feel full no contact won't  be good for her , keeping a safe distance works 
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My wife's MLC
#8: July 20, 2020, 11:45:06 AM
I think what I don't really understand is how we were going along fine and then out of the blue we suddenly split up . But then she won't cut all ties I given her many chances to cut ties .

About 18 months ago we had a chat and she said I was saying all the wrong things , so I made a point of thinking before I spoke and stopped making jokes
Last week she said she likes my jokes
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My wife's MLC
#9: July 20, 2020, 12:10:26 PM
Ohhh, Neil....welcome to the Wonderful World of MLC!

The rapidly-changing moods and constant mind-changing are both lovely hallmarks.  They are basically crazy and have no idea what they want at any given time.

Buckle up - it’s a rough ride!
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« Last Edit: July 20, 2020, 07:21:23 PM by readytofixmyselffirst »

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My wife's MLC
#10: July 20, 2020, 02:50:26 PM
Very sorry you're here John. But I'm glad you found us.

I don't have much to add to the advice you've already been given except to echo it. I know you are probably starving for some resolution, but I would advise against bringing up divorce. Any relationship talk may feel like pressure to her.

Also - eat healthy, drink lots of water, breathe, take long walks and get enough sleep (easier said than done, I know!). Talk to yourself like you would talk to a buddy who is going through the same thing.
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Together 28 years, married 27
Two adult kids, ours

BD #1: 2016 - EA
BD #2: 2018 - FA
W moved out - June 2019
OM#3 - July 2019
W asks for divorce - August 2019
Divorce final - September 2019
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My thread: https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=11537.new#new

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My wife's MLC
#11: July 21, 2020, 10:46:18 AM
She seems to keeping in touch with me increasingly , finding reasons to keep a connection
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#12: July 21, 2020, 12:00:54 PM
She seems to keeping in touch with me increasingly , finding reasons to keep a connection

My W did this in the early stages.   She's since gone dark

You may have a clinging boomerang, you may have a vanisher - but dont read into what she's doing right now, its all chaos and confusion.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#13: July 22, 2020, 01:24:52 AM
Speaking as a post meno-pausal woman - the symptoms I experienced (and this started after my MLCer's BD) were extreme exhaustion hitting suddenly, loss of appetite versus a need to eat the "wrong" things.
I felt emotional and weepy at unpredictable times, I hated any form of conflict or disagreement because I would over-react.  I felt sluggish and I also felt that my mind should be read by others.
The worst thing was loss of memory not just from yesterday but from weeks, months and years.  (This terrified me personally as my mum died in her early 60s of early onset alzheimers)
Every woman is different and menopause lasts a lot longer than some medical sites would have you believe.

So is what your wife doing purely symptomatic of menopause I would say not, because I and other menopausal friends  were still capable of knowing what was morally right and wrong - none of us would go and seek solace elsewhere and put it down to menopause.  None of us would deliberately hurt those closest to us to simply assuage our menopausal needs.

However if she is in menopause she will be emotionally erratic, she will be feeling tired and get easily bored, she will be feeling as though she is "getting older" but this is not the cause of the MLC - it will just add to the enormous range of symptoms that MLC has.

I would also suggest that she is a clinging boomerang - clingers tend to find excuses to bounce back and then try to seek some sense of "normal".  Clingers also show their guilt through this action.  It doesn't stop them carrying on but they sometimes wear their guilt and confusion on their sleeves.

Keep reading, keep journalling and keep learning. This is a long haul.
 

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BD march 2013
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Reconnection started 2017 through 2018.
2019 is the year of Decisions!

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My wife's MLC
#14: July 22, 2020, 02:44:11 AM
Songanddance
So is she just in menopause or MLC or a bit of both,shes never suggested the menopause has caused this split (it's my personal take on what's going on with her ) she refused to accept she was entering the menopause she has said 'She's a miserable cow'  I'm just trying to make sense of what's going on with her and why her personality has changed .
She messaged the other day to say she was worried I was ignoring her , i did point out that what a split is i followed it up by saying i wasnt ignoring her ,since then she's getting in touch a lot,she has said ' let's keep talking '

She wants to take me for a meal to say thanks for helping her,she wants me to have a key to her house ,she has said she won't change her will , shes leaving everything to me .

But then in conversation she's not ready to talk about us

I am getting so many mixed signals
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« Last Edit: July 22, 2020, 02:56:49 AM by John T »

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Re: My wife's MLC
#15: July 22, 2020, 07:30:33 AM
Songanddance
So is she just in menopause or MLC or a bit of both,shes never suggested the menopause has caused this split (it's my personal take on what's going on with her ) she refused to accept she was entering the menopause she has said 'She's a miserable cow'  I'm just trying to make sense of what's going on with her and why her personality has changed .
She messaged the other day to say she was worried I was ignoring her , i did point out that what a split is i followed it up by saying i wasnt ignoring her ,since then she's getting in touch a lot,she has said ' let's keep talking '

She wants to take me for a meal to say thanks for helping her,she wants me to have a key to her house ,she has said she won't change her will , shes leaving everything to me .

But then in conversation she's not ready to talk about us

I am getting so many mixed signals

You will because this is MLC.  I'm 7 years in and one of the many things I have learned from here is that  MLCers are confused themselves so do not expect any logic from them. One day they will leave you everything in their will and the next they will insist that the house is sold so that they can buy a new car. 

My H insisted he didn't want a divorce.  I said he clearly didn't want a marriage either so what did he actually want?  He didn't know. 
Once he said that he would never sell the house and two days later monstered that he had had enough and he was going to force me to sell so that he could have everything he earned and put towards the house back for himself.  When I told him that as joint and separate owner on the land registry, he couldn't force me to do anything but he was welcome to leave as my salary was paying the mortgage and 50% of the bills anyway.   

What I'm trying to explain to you is that you are in early days and menopause has little to do with MLC in the long run. Menopause is a side effect that can add to the frustration of an MLCer and certainly the hormones are out of whack. However a man at 50 has more oestrogen in his system than a woman so by that token hormones are NOT the culprit or cause.

MLCers in the beginning are bewildered by what they are doing and saying.  They try to identify the cause " cr*p marriage" " hair is too grey"  spouse doesn't like the colour green", spouse refused to cook them toast to the right temperature in 2006"

Whatever it is - this is script.  There is so much written about this on here.

Please abandon the idea that this is just menopause.  This is more than menopause and yes she may be going through it but it is no excuse for what is clearly the signs of MLC.

The hard part for you is to be able to step back and see what she says and does for what they are - just words followed up by actions that either contradict the words or are completely out of the norm for the wife you knew.

Her phrase " Let's keep talking" will keep you dangling and there will come a time when she will want to talk but not to listen.

The best thing you can do is to learn to detach. You can still love her and still stand for your marriage, You can still believe in the woman she once was and you can still hope but do it with a degree of detachment as this is much healthier and whole way for you to navigate your way through this.
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BD march 2013
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2019 is the year of Decisions!

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My wife's MLC
#16: July 22, 2020, 08:57:17 AM
Hi there,

    Welcome and sorry you are here. My wife wanted to play tennis together still and have weekly dinners as a family. Two years later we haven't talked in 18 months. I have no thoughts on menapouse as I don't think I was dealing with it when it came to her. I will add my wife wants to be friends but I believe that is only to relieve the guilt she has. She has never apologized for any wrong doing and in her eyes I am just a sensitive guy who is taking the breakup bad.
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BD1 March 2018 - I wish I could give you more of what you need
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Re: My wife's MLC
#17: July 22, 2020, 04:45:44 PM
Please reread Song and Dance´s reply- all good info.

Menopause does bring a shift in hormones but while that may alter moods, it is not to be the source of the blame for changes in behaviors. Sure, it´d be nice to be able to say that all will normalize once she gets to the other side of menopause, but that just puts you in limbo waiting on someone else´s biological timeline.

Self-care is the key. You are about to go on a long journey of self discovery and growth whether you wanted to or not. Best to plan to enjoy the adventure by investing time and energy into you. Sinking it into the relationship with someone with one foot out the door will not bring her back.

Loving the person she was is fine. Try not to delude yourself that she is that person now- that just leads to more pain for you.
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#18: July 22, 2020, 10:03:33 PM
Thank you for the replies

I now see that the menopause is a symptom  within her MLC she's never said it's the cause of her changes  it's hard enough to get her to even acknowledge she's entering the menopause .

The more I try to detach the more the contact occurs , I still see some of her old self and more seems to be coming back , the overriding feeling I get is she is not certain of what she's done , she's scared I'll walk away from her and there's no way back for her hence the contact .

She's never really monstered me , she has said she is learning about herself what ever that means

I've learned that I'm a good reader of people and have learned to listen to people, im now happier in the company of woman more so than men , I've got a much better understanding of women and there needs
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#19: July 23, 2020, 02:59:58 AM
I have recognised some of my failings as a person and am making changes to me for me I've done a huge amount self reflection, and putting into practice the changes I need to make , shes even commented about my stress levels being very reduced, shes seems very interested when I mentioned my observations about people and how they impact on me and what I do to avoid them .everywhere I look I see stressed people who can't see it , and people who want to belittle others to hide there own miserable life's.

 I need to let my old marriage go and look forward and not back , I'm desperately trying to distance from her , but she clings on tighter.

I've had so much good help and support, you all can't be wrong , I want to pull out of this roundabout I'm stuck on
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#20: July 23, 2020, 06:01:38 AM
Hello,

Quote
I've had so much good help and support, you all can't be wrong , I want to pull out of this roundabout I'm stuck on

Remember, this..... you have control, you have choice.....over you. You can pull out anytime you want. I am not telling you or advising you to leave her, but to instill in you the power of choice. You can leave and you will be fine. You also can stay and you will be fine. The person in crisis is your wife, not you. Knowing you have power, choice will help alleviate the sense of helplessness.

Right now your wife's mindset is inward and centered towards herself. Just imagine if you cut yourself in the kitchen really badly. Would you continue to make dinner knowing everyone is hungry, or would you seek the attention of a doctor? In the moment of crisis, all your attention is focused on the need of the moment, and that brings your focus inward and self-centered.

Your wife is self-centered right now. She doesn't see you as a person, but as an object. Going back to my cut hand with a knife analogy.  If your wife was driving you to the hospital how would you feel if she kept talking to you? "Oh that cut looks real bad.." "I bet it hurts real bad." "You should be more careful when you use a knife you know."

That's how our MLCer's face relationship talks especially in the beginning. My advice is to let her talk, and you listen to validate. You don't have to own up or buy in to her talk, but you can hear her pain and acknowledge her confusion. Empathy goes a long ways. Just realize that she is not rational in her thought process- but emotion driven and that leads to the cycles.

Put you actions and focus on how you can live. You goal is to influence her not guide her or fix her. Live your life well. If you want to help others, volunteer. Be with those that need your help and want you. You will feel better and have a better mental state to deal with her confusion. Detaching doesn't mean leaving, it means to pull yourself out of the fire to a better position where you are safe and can tactical re-engage at the right time. Just like the kitchen cut, once you are taken care of, your focus goes outward to others again.

Since you can focus outward, focus outward and know that at this time, she can't.

[Man Hug]

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#21: July 23, 2020, 07:16:58 AM
John T,
really listen to the Veterans like Ready .  We LBS's need to have our own fog cleared so we can move forward..  The MLC PHENOMENON is real and will take time, patience, tears and a lot of deep breaths.......

5hill
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#22: July 24, 2020, 12:36:40 AM
I suppose I'm struggling with the emptiness we did a lot together and that's all gone we were into motorbikes together and now I can't bear to be near a motorbike, I haven't been on a bike since BD. I suppose  breaking contact will push her away  but I'm probably  being nieve as she wants contact and will do what ever it takes to keep it that way , but I fully understand that I must let my marriage go and focus on me ,

 I realised this morning a guy at work was b!tc#ing about another guy to me and I just don't want to endure listening to it as you end up getting sucked into the world of negativity, I guess it's like being in a swimming pool and swimming to the edge and wanting to stay there
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#23: July 24, 2020, 04:47:03 AM
Hello Mr John T , I have been reading your story and I am sorry . You might find some of the understandings you are longing for inside of your wifes childhood or family of origin . I does not mean you will be able to do jacksh#t about it because it is her crisis , not yours. It has ZERO to do with you or your marriage. Less than zero actually. It may give you some deeper insight as to the wounds she is attempting to heal externally ... rather than facing them internally. What do you know about her childhood , her life experiences and where she came from?
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My wife's MLC
#24: July 24, 2020, 09:52:57 AM
Her childhood was normal, her mum and dad split in her late teens which did hit her hard as nobody saw it coming, her dad moved in with another woman and slowly she was pushed aside . She had some bad relationships prior to meeting me ,the last one before me was a long term relationship and he cheated on her and she never got closure.
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#25: July 24, 2020, 10:01:31 AM
Her childhood was normal, her mum and dad split in her late teens which did hit her hard as nobody saw it coming, her dad moved in with another woman and slowly she was pushed aside .

This is her FOO issues, right there.

She will have to address the feelings she felt back at that time - this is essentially, what has transpired into her MLC.  But only she can make a decision IF and WHEN she wants to revisit that time in her life, to address her feelings of abandonment.
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#26: July 24, 2020, 10:21:46 AM
Do you have kids?
And how long have you been together/married? How old are you both?
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T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#27: July 24, 2020, 10:53:57 AM
Quote
Her childhood was normal, her mum and dad split in her late teens

Late teens doesn't mean they are no longer a child. 

As LBS Les says - right there are her FOO issues.   Nothing about splitting up the marriage is normal for a child.
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#28: July 24, 2020, 06:34:57 PM
Well John, you seem to be able to sum up her childhood in a very short paragraph as "normal".  In her "late teens"  ( she would still be a child) it appears that her father had his own MLC and abandoned his family ...abandoned your wife.  This is very very traumatic for a father ( who gave her a normal childhood ...) to very suddenly leave for another women. I frankly cannot imagine anything ( short of death) more traumatic to a young girl. I have daughters John ...lots of them. I feel rather an expert on the ways of the teenage girl . When my H left our home , I had adult girls in their 20's  and 4 in thier 30's and they wept like their  hearts shattered. It exploded their lives , their trust in all the world and in their own marriages. Their Dad/ hero left. Trust me when I tell you, your wife has trauma and pain that she has not resolved in her heart and soul. This is where her work is ...healing that wound . This is what her journey is about .
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#29: July 24, 2020, 06:44:36 PM
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The Journey Of Reconciliation .. is for the brave .

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#30: July 25, 2020, 01:32:45 AM
We have no children together,we were together for 13 years , another aspect that I think has a part to play is her and her dad virtually lost touch  I didn't meet her dad until we had been together 12 years and old of the blue the woman he left for died his world fell apart and he immediately reached out to my W all of a sudden she was going to his home which is 2 hours drive away alot  to the point I was hardly spending time with her .
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Re: My wife's MLC
#31: July 25, 2020, 02:15:00 AM
We have no children together,we were together for 13 years , another aspect that I think has a part to play is her and her dad virtually lost touch  I didn't meet her dad until we had been together 12 years and old of the blue the woman he left for died his world fell apart and he immediately reached out to my W all of a sudden she was going to his home which is 2 hours drive away alot  to the point I was hardly spending time with her .

In which case John - Barbie's post is even more important for you to get to grips with.  My two Ds were also in 20s when H BD'd us all and their heartbreak was worse than mine in a way.   
It sounds like her father might have had an MLC himself all those years ago and is now trying to get a sense of normality or he is a narcissist and needy for female support and approval.

In which case this has most definitely contributed and is probably the major source of her issues.  Until she has resolved that she may remain very single minded and distant.
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My wife's MLC
#32: July 25, 2020, 04:45:45 AM
Are people in an MLC manipulators as a friend has suggested about my W
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#33: July 25, 2020, 05:19:33 AM
Are people in an MLC manipulators as a friend has suggested about my W

The majority of them.

They also lie.  About everything.
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D=8
BD Feb 17 Thinking of divorce
Atomic BD June 17 Spying revealed OM at work
Still home.  Threatened to leave several times and has asked me to leave about a dozen. 
Says divorce proceedings will start Jan 18.
She has scheduled mediation Feb 7,  2018
I moved out March 16, 2018
Several mediations, mostly instigated by me.  Foot dragging by STBXW.  Nothing filed. Yet.
5/2019 STBXW filed D behind my back despite signed agreement to mediate.
I retain attorney.
STBXW still hasn't told me and no further action.
Elephant in the room has been addressed.  No further action atm.  Weighing my options.
12/16/19  She files financial paperwork.  Divorce proceeding.

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#34: July 27, 2020, 02:39:17 AM
Another aspect that I think has a part to play is her and her dad virtually lost touch  I didn't meet her dad until we had been together 12 years and out of the blue the woman he left for died his world fell apart and he immediately reached out to my W all of a sudden she was going to his home which is 2 hours drive away alot  to the point I was hardly spending time with her,this when I suspect the change started in her mixed in with her fears of the menopause starting.
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#35: July 27, 2020, 03:01:53 AM
Hi John
I have only been on here a little longer then you. It’s a rough journey so far mate so I have empathy for you. The people on here are great and although the road maps they give us are bumpy atleast we are informed about what’s coming.

I have two wonderful teenagers that I am close too so to be told in one night . I love you but don’t love you and I want you to move out and I want a divorce etc etc.

We never thought and have never had any counselling so no real warning before bomb drop. I will follow your thread John good luck and stay strong.
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#36: July 27, 2020, 04:24:51 AM
What has taken so much to get my head around, is I never saw it coming and my W is the last person on this planet I would have expected it from , we always talked and rarely argued.

Something I will take from this is to trust my gut instinct far more it's been absolutely spot on so far in all of this .

I've made significant changes to me all ready , but I've got more areas to work on .

Thanks to all of you for your support it helps to feel I'm not alone .
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#37: July 27, 2020, 02:12:35 PM
Hi John T,
spot on for me too...we always talked (could be not enough), rarely argued and every day he made me laugh for 40 years.  He is a quiet man, did not like confrontation but extremely protective of our family. I knew he loved me more than life and he was not afraid to tell me and our Adult children he loved us every day.

I will say be cautious, when you think you see your real W and maybe she is coming back to her old self don't let your guard down.  In a matter of minutes, hours she will be gone again until she can get through her MLC.
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#38: July 27, 2020, 02:22:01 PM
Attaching not in here that often these days but I'm 18 months in since BD now and still my STBX continues in her ever increasingly bizarre behaviour seemingly still deep in replay. Sinking further into depression, she lost her job at the start of the month but still posts on social media about how wonderful her life is! Everything is my fault and yes had to do a ton of work on myself and in retrospect could have been a better husband but still nothing explains her lies and accusations which fluctuates in every lawyers letter. Reading your story I see a lot of comparisons with mine. Stay strong it takes awhile to stop spinning but you will be able to detatch in time not stop loving but enough to be able to read between the lines. I don't know where I would be now without the amazing people in here. Take good care of yourself  my friend.
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#39: July 28, 2020, 09:10:28 AM
I've been told that the OM is really getting on her nerves, weirdly this has given me the kick of reality I needed to push the distance I need to have from her.

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« Last Edit: July 28, 2020, 10:41:58 AM by Songanddance »

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#40: July 28, 2020, 12:55:16 PM
I didn't ask about the OM somebody just came out with it , that piece of information has shown me the way to my path , I've been at a fork in the path for a while but now know which path to fully head down ,after a few false starts and being pulled back
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#41: July 31, 2020, 09:13:27 AM
No contact so far this week
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#42: July 31, 2020, 02:26:05 PM
No contact so far this week

Can be quite common with our MLC'ers.   Im about 7 weeks NC with my spouse, right now.
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#43: August 01, 2020, 02:59:03 PM
Just had an email telling me I've got post . She explained why the email was late , because she went to her mum's .

She asked how I am .

I've not replied
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Re: My wife's MLC
#44: August 02, 2020, 01:02:47 AM
Quick question - does your MLCEr know that you have gone NC with her?

If you are standing and hoping at some point down the future for a reconnection,RCR is quite clear NC is a boundary that needs to be explained to the MLCer.  Just going NC without explaining why can cause confusion.   

I understand why you have gone NC and agree with you doing so - just be aware that unless she knows why you have gone NC she will think you are acting out of spite or being petty (MLCers just don't get it) and either persist with contacting you or leave well alone and any form of future contact you may have is reduced even if you want contact with her.

It's just a question of whether you are standing.  If not - no worries.

What you could do is apply the rule of 3 and reply briefly in 3 days time,politely tell her how you are and then explain very simply that whilst she is with OM or living away you will not be keeping in contact with her.  Have a look at RCR's types of contact article.

All that said - if going NC really helps you then no worries.
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#45: August 02, 2020, 01:46:56 AM
Song makes a good point.

Contact exists on a spectrum.....and you have choices. Although I believe there are some times and situations where complete NC is necessary for the LBS, such as abuse, threats or extreme monstering, it depends on your needs and intentions at a given time. And being honest with yourself about what you need vs trying to influence someone else  ::) you might find this link helpful https://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/standing-actions_contact-and-communication_contact-levels.html

Of course sometimes they vanish and go NC with us lol so there is no need to muse on it much  :)
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« Last Edit: August 02, 2020, 01:48:21 AM by Treasur »
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD) No kids.
H diagnosed with severe depression Oct 15. BD May 16. OW since April 16, maybe earlier. Silent vanisher mostly.
Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
Healing and growing found here https://littleplotbythesea.wordpress.com

"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

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#46: August 02, 2020, 04:51:05 AM
I'm so torn about NC because she has wanted to remain friends all the way through this it's been important to her , her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk .

I'm torn because I get advice to go NC ,but she keeps contact going not me , she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her ,when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time ,I've been told the OM is annoying her .

The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words , she wishes she could take my pain away . She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone . I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' . In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite'

If anyone can make sense of this please as I no longer can
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Re: My wife's MLC
#47: August 02, 2020, 06:27:55 AM
I'm sorry John but it sounds to me like she is throwing crumbs out to keep you where you are.

If she can't make a decision the decent thing would be to leave you alone until she figures it out.  In the mean time you need to live your life "as if" she is not coming back.
She may not.

Putting your life on hold just makes no sense.  She could be in this for several years.
Make your life the best you can.

Maybe that could be how you could tell her you are going NC.
Until you make up your mind who you want to be with, and decide to work on the relationship, I will not be engaging with you.  It's too painful for me.

Then stop responding to her.  Then she knows.  She can not have you both.

Just my suggestion.
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#48: August 02, 2020, 06:51:13 AM
I'm afraid Thunder is right, John.
And it makes no sense bc a) it makes no sense b) it is incredibly and unreasonably self-centred and c) your w probably doesn't even understand her own emotions and d) she is trying to keep you as some kind of friendly Plan B.

It really is all about her....
Which I suspect is not working out great for you....bc actually she is offering you nothing useful to work with.

Decide what works best for you right now in terms of contact or not. It might change but focus on what is best for you currently. And please remember that if your w doesn't like it, that is no longer your problem bc she fired you from being her h and best friend. As you say, this is what reality looks like when you have an affair and leave your h isn't it? And you are under no obligation to justify or defend your choices to her now. There is no We anymore....by her doing....so it is reasonable that you look after yourself and no longer care much how she feels or what she wants. After all, just bc she wants something doesn't mean that you can't say 'no thank you'.

Most LBS struggle for a while with the 'habit' of being concerned about how their spouse feels. Usually the spouse is not at all concerned about how we feel of course, or they would have behaved differently. And sometimes we believe that less contact will reduce the chance of reconnection....I'm honestly not sure that is true while your w is with OM and behaving like a nutso selfish a$$hat  ::)....and you don't want a wife like that anyway do you?

Reflect on how you feel. How much/what kind of contact makes life easier or better for you right now? Do that  :) and if you decide that means NC at all, that's not unreasonable given the circumstances.
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Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.
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#49: August 02, 2020, 07:52:45 AM
Hello,

I was just agreeing with Treasur and Thunder.  Going NC is your choice and your control on how it is best for you to heal. It has nothing to do with her feelings and everything to do with your feelings.

You are doing well, keep posting and read carefully the advice you are being given, it's invaluable.

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#50: August 02, 2020, 08:33:25 AM
Quote
The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .
.

Hi John . I just have a quick comment about the statement above. I have seen this said to LBS many times...that they "might" be back , that this is "temporary" ,  that it is" possible " someday over the rainbow etc etc .   Many feel hopeful , relieved and committ to waiting it out. I had an entirely different response and feeling when my arrogant, strutting and swaggerring teenage husband said this to me .  And he did say " this is hopefully temporary and I will want to come home in the future ".   Say the firetruck what ??   Hmmmmm ?  . I just looked at him and said the 1st thing that came to my mind ..."  Whether you return to our home and family or not , is entirely up to ME. YOU do not get a vote whatsoever . I decide whether or not you EVER have a home with me and your daughters again.  Remember that and do NOT EVER say that to me again. Period.

I know it is entirely a different response than most ..but it is absolutely how I felt . NOT is a million years will YOU decide anything more about MY life.  Its mine. A truth dart so to speak.  He just was utterly totally stunned and said not another word as I walked away.   

Quote
her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk .
.

Again... what is there to "sort" when you are living with another man ?. It just seems to me another tactic of control . And this is just food for thought, as I know this is utterly excruciatingly painful. I am not discounting any of the anguish. Take a bit of control back John...in tiny bites.  When she is living apart from another man , has NO contact with that affair partner and wishes to book an appointment with a therapist ....you will consider the "sorting things out conversation". Until such time, there will be no "sorting, talking, communicating etc".   Bam . Ball is in her court, your expectations and boundaries are VERY clear and you have a bit of authourity and control over your own life.  My thoughts ... and my experience . I feel for you John ..I really do.
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#51: August 02, 2020, 08:55:15 AM
Just to clarify she's not living with OM and she's been at pains to point out she's not seeing him ,by the sounds of it he's peeing her off .

Any contact we have she always points out what she's up to where she's going .

She knows that if all contact is ended by me , she'll end up in my mental filling cabinet ,and I tend to shut the draw and that's it ,she's seen me walk away from people never to be mentioned again .

There are so many ifs ,buts ,maybes.  I feel like I'm a tractor stuck in a muddy field I get a little forward then slip back in to the rut I've just pulled out of ,she's the driver ,but doesn't know what to do about it.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#52: August 02, 2020, 09:22:25 AM
I'm so torn about NC because she has wanted to remain friends all the way through this it's been important to her , her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk .

I'm torn because I get advice to go NC ,but she keeps contact going not me , she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her ,when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time ,I've been told the OM is annoying her .

The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words , she wishes she could take my pain away . She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone . I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' . In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite'

If anyone can make sense of this please as I no longer can

Here we go.  I had this from my H 7 years ago and nothing he said or did ever changed his way or means of behaving.

I am going to translate MLC speak for you.

she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her.
Hello, you haven't chased me in a few days - does this mean that you don't want to speak to me or have anything to do with me. I'm worried about me and when you ignore me it makes me feel more important.

when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication

she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time
I am alone in my head but not really If I emphasise this hard enough you will believe me,

I've been told the OM is annoying her .  (what proof do you have here JohnT?)

The last time I mentioned us
she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us .
You know we could get back together again but I want to play first and to have fun and serious stuff like talking about having a relationship is too boring.  So I'll deflect what you're thinking and try to let you down gently but really - yoyu want to talk about us now?

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words
I am a miserable cow for doing what I have done but I'm not miserable; it had to be done
 she wishes she could take my pain away
If I take your pain away, I can walk away from this relationship guilt free.  I do feel really guilty for what I have done and OM well he's just a good excuse to assuage my guilt.  I don't want to feel guilty anymore so if I say something nice about your pain; it might make it easier on me.
She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone
I had these exact words from my H - it's called script and is a load of BS.
I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' .
I do know that you care about me and I appreciate it but feel sorry for me because nobody else will care about me that way and I feel that if I return your love will stifle me

In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite
'
I am legally married to you.  I am not emotionally or spiritually married to you so there's no point in us living together and I really don't want to discuss it but I see you are keen for a bit of hope so what I will do is let you down gently and choose my words carefully.

John - There are so many of us on here who have had these words; it's called script.  I remember exactly 3 months after BD where I was when my H told me that I wasn't to wait for him and that I was to find someone else. When I said I didn't want to find anyone else his response was " well you should - he will be a lucky man."   This is whilst he was getting ready to see OW.   He then said he didn't want a divorce. My response was " You don't want a marriage either - so what do you want?" 
His reply - " I don't know."  and walked out.

She is dropping you crumbs and this is not to say that none of what she thinks is false or deceptive; Most of the time MLCers say one thing one day and something else the next. They just know that they don't want us for now.  They don't really know why and they don't understand why they are behaving the way they are but they lack self awareness to face upto themselves and so would rather run away from anything that might cause them a tiny bit of grief.  That would include her OM too.

Read up on the pursuit and distance dance as well.  That is so illuminating and once you become a student of it you will see exactly when that behaviour applies to you both.  Her initial text about worrying that you were ignoring her is pursuit and your feeling is to dance back to her worry.  Then she will distance and you will hang on for any crumb of what she might have said.

This is why you need to know exactly what NC is - how it will help you and how you need to let your W understand your course of action.


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My wife's MLC
#53: August 02, 2020, 11:48:32 AM
I'm so torn about NC because she has wanted to remain friends all the way through this it's been important to her , her veiw is things can't be sorted if we don't talk . Oh yes, the Its really important that we remain friends - my wife said this.

I'm torn because I get advice to go NC ,but she keeps contact going not me , she text a while saying she's worried I'm ignoring her ,when we spoke I pointed out that this is what separation is she choose this path not me .I've noticed in any communication she always points out what she doing as if to say she's alone all of the time ,I've been told the OM is annoying her .

The last time I mentioned us she said she's not ruling out or in us getting back together , but says it's to early to talk about us . My wife said the EXACT SAME THING

She's admitted she's a miserable cow her words , she wishes she could take my pain away . My Wife said the same
She's also said if I want to move on and not wait for her she'll understand , it's her bad luck if I'm gone . My wife said she thinks she's making the biggest mistake

I had a text saying 'I'm the only that's ever cared about her' . In conversation she said 'your my husband and we're not living together at the moment, 'your my husband and I care about you'  also she's said ' I don't see us living together  but that's not definite' My wife always made it a habit of pointing out that we are married, even though we no longer live together

If anyone can make sense of this please as I no longer can

As you can see John, this is typical script - you cannot rely on anything she says.  They all follow the same script.  You need to detach so that you dont hold on to their words.
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My wife's MLC
#54: August 02, 2020, 01:06:52 PM
So in your considered opinions is this a MLC based on my observations
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Re: My wife's MLC
#55: August 02, 2020, 01:13:19 PM
Very possible.  It is clear that your wife is depressed and is acting out of character. 

She may be MLC - she may be a MLT (midlife transition) - Either way she is not her "normal " self and the advice we give you is applicable across all eventualities.

OP mentions Time being a gift - that gift is for you to learn, to grow and to heal so that if she is an MLCer you can deal with it as an emotionally and spiritually healthy being.   Time would also tell you if it is an MLC too; it is still early days for you. 
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My wife's MLC
#56: August 03, 2020, 04:45:35 AM
She's been in touch asking about when I'm going to take her up on her offer of food at our local favourite cafe
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My wife's MLC
#57: August 03, 2020, 05:09:53 AM
Quote
She's been in touch asking about when I'm going to take her up on her offer of food at our local favourite cafe
.

How do you feel about this John?  What is your initial reaction?
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Re: My wife's MLC
#58: August 03, 2020, 05:20:12 AM
She's been in touch asking about when I'm going to take her up on her offer of food at our local favourite cafe

In addition to Barbie's question apply the rule of 3.  Wait 3 hours or days before replying. This will give you time to consider and reflect how you feel and whether it is what you can handle.

She is using the food at favourite local cafe to reel you in (pursuit and distance dance).

If you can go knowing that nothing she will say or do will really make a difference to the current situation then go. 
Go without expectations. 

If it is too much for you to consider then don't go.   

Treat it as a business meeting if you do go - be authentic but no R conversations even if she brings it up.

If you do go Listen carefully, validate- use the word "Uhuh" often to show you are listening but nor reacting and if needs be throw in the odd truth dart but with NO expectations!
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My wife's MLC
#59: August 03, 2020, 05:52:13 AM
Hello,

Quote
Treat it as a business meeting if you do go - be authentic but no R conversations even if she brings it up.

If you do go Listen carefully, validate- use the word "Uhuh" often to show you are listening but nor reacting and if needs be throw in the odd truth dart but with NO expectations!

This is a key point. No expectations. Keep it light, keep it simple. This is not the time or place for you to "fix" everything.  I know this is hard as you see the "now" as an opportunity to swoop in and save the day. Just know it isn't going to happen and now is the time to focus on your healing and mindset first before you even think of trying to deal with your MLCer.

This isn't a race, just a slow and determined run that you take one day at a time.

[[[[[Ready]]]]]

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My wife's MLC
#60: August 03, 2020, 10:29:37 AM
There's no such thing as a free lunch lol
I will go with the attitude of its business meeting  , if she wants to talk that's fine but I'll not be bringing it up .
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My wife's MLC
#61: August 05, 2020, 02:04:50 AM
Something has changed within me , she feels distant and consuming my thoughts less and less with less intensity, this in stark contrast to the weekend when I couldn't think about nothing else , it slightly feels like I was in the final death throes of something like an alligator taking it's prey underwater to roll it around to kill it .I feel like I've just bobed up to the surfice and see a different outlook ( thinking about it so much it's burnt itself out) , if any of that makes sense.
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Re: My wife's MLC
#62: August 06, 2020, 01:42:10 AM
It makes perfect sense; however be aware that you too are cycling.  You will have days when you feel you have clarity and days where you feel desperate for a crumb of contact.

This cycling takes time to burn out so enjoy the moments of seeming detachment and know that the low moments will pass.
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My wife's MLC
#63: August 06, 2020, 02:42:40 AM
Your spot on about cycling, I'm on a distance away from her feeling.

Went for some food last night with her (she owed me for a favour) made a point of no relationship talk ,she did drop into  conversation  she an 'idiot' I could sense she was admitting she's messed up I didn't ask what she meant .

I picked something up for her on my to meeting her , so she says she owes me a meal again next week .

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My wife's MLC
#64: August 06, 2020, 10:30:34 AM
Looks like I might have worked on childhood issue without realising it.

A work colleague said to me' I didn't want to do anything ' coming from him (storeman who does very little)  I  worked  hard on a job and to hear that just switched my anger on, so he got a short sharp lesson in what not to say to me , when I was younger I wouldn't have reacted and just tolerate it , no more a inner toughness is established in me ,'no more good ole D*** will solve my problems and help me out and do my work for me


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« Last Edit: August 07, 2020, 02:09:06 AM by Songanddance »

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My wife's MLC
#65: August 07, 2020, 11:02:21 AM
Something has changed within me , she feels distant and consuming my thoughts less and less with less intensity, this in stark contrast to the weekend when I couldn't think about nothing else , it slightly feels like I was in the final death throes of something like an alligator taking it's prey underwater to roll it around to kill it .I feel like I've just bobed up to the surfice and see a different outlook ( thinking about it so much it's burnt itself out) , if any of that makes sense.

Agree with Songanddance.....the LBS cycles, and can cycle hard at times.   Enjoy the moments when you feel detached, and dont beat yourself up if you fall down.   Understand the moment is temporary, and the longer you go through this, you'll find that you bounce back much quicker, each time.
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My wife's MLC
#66: August 07, 2020, 04:45:00 PM
All so true, my bomb drop was 5/2019.  Every time i feel i got this and i have the bull by the horns, SURPRISE!!!  Tread tightly John T, it does get better over time but it's the unexpected that drags u down.  Keep posting and stay close, the Veterans will talk you off of your cliffs.

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My wife's MLC
#67: August 11, 2020, 01:40:04 PM
I'm thinking less and less each day,with less intensity about her, this has been consistent for 2 weeks now
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My wife's MLC
#68: August 11, 2020, 04:29:34 PM
I'm thinking less and less each day,with less intensity about her, this has been consistent for 2 weeks now

Thats great!  But dont beat yourself up if you cycle - the cycle is brutal, for the LBS
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