[FaithWalker]

It makes a lot of sense P.  Early on I read an article about male depression and how it manifests.  It was my MLCer to a t.

[Nas]

It was not very long after BD that I had to resign myself to the fact that my husband had depression that would require extensive therapeutic work to overcome, rather than the definition of MLC I had been reading on many websites that is often talked about as in essence a self-resolving event.
I bought the book I Don’t Want to Talk About It and another book about men and depression by the author Terrence Real. My husband borrowed them from me a few months after BD, along with a few other books. I know he skimmed a few based on comments he made early on but don’t know if he ever read them. I know he never returned them to me. And I know that his behavior only got worse. Years have passed now and he’s done worse than ever imaginable and I do 100% believe that for him, if he does not seek professional help, this will be who he is until the end of his days.

[MadLuv]

NAS-
I could have written that in my XH. Severe depression and MLC. He has tried therapy twice, but only because I was pushing for it. He doesn’t want to go through the pain. It’s crazy because the alternative is living in pain anyways?? It’s very sad.

[xyzcf]

 

He has tried therapy twice, but only because I was pushing for it.

People really heal when they decide that the life they are living doesn't help them.

I was a smoker. 2 packs a day. No one could push me to stop smoking. It had to be my choice. The same is true of someone who is overweight, an addict, physically unfit, eating too much junk food.

Mental health issues are really complicated. The MLCer does not see any problem with what they are doing. No one can tell them they are "wrong".

I mentioned a poster from years ago, Mermaid who did a lot of research on anhedonia The MLCer doesn't feel things the way that we feel things. Just like someone who is an empath feels things more deeply than others.

"Anhedonia is the inability to feel pleasure. It's a common symptom of depression as well as other mental health disorders.

Most people understand what pleasure feels like. They expect certain things in life to make them happy. Maybe you enjoy riding your bike, listening to the sounds of the ocean, or holding someone's hand. But some people lose the ability to feel joy. The things that once made them content are no longer fun or enjoyable. That's anhedonia."

The psychiatrist that Pendragon quoted:

 "This kind of event often affects a person globally – that is, affecting multiple areas of life. So, in your wife’s instance, it is not just leaving you, it is moving to Denver, getting a new job, etc. That global unhappiness (rather than unhappiness about one thing in particular) is usually a product of depression in my experience --R"

talks about this as well. Trying one thing after another maybe just to be able to "feel" something. This type of behavior is a common theme in MLC

So many things could be causing this. I remember hormonal swings that I experienced before menopause, one day I would be fine, then for a few days a month, everything was wrong and then I would be fine again. The changes in hormonal levels definitely affected my state of "happiness".

So it is complex and whatever changes in the MLCer to allow them to either seek help, or in most cases I have observed, they seemingly "wake up" and truly without "therapy" they seem to be able to resolve their crisis.

This psychiatrist observed this in his client, several times it seemed:

"When the depression subsides, the crisis goes away. "

Something must change internally which is why we are always saying there is nothing that we can do to "fix" them. Indeed, the more people tried to push me to stop smoking, the more stubborn I became.

[HeavenlyFocus]

Thanks Pendragon for posting this description of MLC being  a produce of depression.   This really has helped me to detach and see my W's MLC as a severe depressive episode.  This have helped me to detach and heal.

HF

[Pendragon]

I wonder if, almost by rule, all the MLCers spoken of on this forum do are not having their depression treated.

That is to say, this forum self-selects for victims of untreated mental health issues that have manifested in mid life and come to a head.

[Nas]

If I’m understanding your question correctly, I think this is essentially what I mean when I say that I don’t believe they just have an epiphany one day and wake up, but that they actually do need some version of counseling/therapy/psychotherapy. People suffering from true depression and anxiety disorders do not just stop having depression and anxiety after an epiphany. They don’t just wake up out of a fog, they may go through cycles where they are more or less depressed and anxious, they may have stretches of time where they are not depressed,, but depression is not really a self-resolving singular event. Jmho

[Pendragon]

If I’m understanding your question correctly, I think this is essentially what I mean when I say that I don’t believe they just have an epiphany one day and wake up, but that they actually do need some version of counseling/therapy/psychotherapy. People suffering from true depression and anxiety disorders do not just stop having depression and anxiety after an epiphany. They don’t just wake up out of a fog, they may go through cycles where they are more or less depressed and anxious, they may have stretches of time where they are not depressed,, but depression is not really a self-resolving singular event. Jmho

MLC is very likely-- obviously in most cases-- their misguided attempt at self-medication.

Without therapeutic coping tools at their disposal my opinion is that they misevaluate their feelings, the cause-and-effect of their situation and apply a misguided solution. Rife with cognitive distortions-- they lack the tools to dispassionately cope with their thoughts and especially their feelings.

To them, logically, their main problem is the person closest to them-- their partner. Then they likely ruminate, over-think, and ultimately misevaluate the relationship in this state. Issues that are normal problems every couple faces, that would not affect a non-depressed person to this degree, are almost intolerable to them. That's likely where a lot of these ridiculous and petty complaints come from.

These new and novel situations they put themselves in when they go full MLC, do temporarily "lift" them, or more appropriately cover their issues enough so that they perceive positive reinforcement that their path is working. But without the core issues resolved they will always crash and crash hard.

In my situation, it seems like either one of two things are likely to happen. My ex wife will, at some point, reach a level of clarity about what she has done to us, and how heinous it is. It could even make her suicidal.

The other direction she could and may very well go, is to continue to move forward in this morally compromised state, whereby she fashions a whole new moral landscape that is separate from objective reality, rife with all the typical lame justifications and rationalizations. "Hatchet job morals" if you will.

They still want to think of themselves as a "good person" but the knowledge of what they've done, and on some level knowing how vile it is, causes cognitive dissonance and will, I think put them somewhere on a scale of sociopathy.

[Ready2Transform]

I absolutely agree with you, Pendragon.

The other direction she could and may very well go, is to continue to move forward in this morally compromised state, whereby she fashions a whole new moral landscape that is separate from objective reality, rife with all the typical lame justifications and rationalizations. "Hatchet job morals" if you will.

They still want to think of themselves as a "good person" but the knowledge of what they've done, and on some level knowing how vile it is, causes cognitive dissonance and will, I think put them somewhere on a scale of sociopathy.

This is absolutely my xH, ten years to the day of when he packed up and moved out (expecting me to make him breakfast that morning!). Even the most covert "wrongness" of his life, he is somehow able to re-frame.

[Thunder]

Why do professionals shy away from the term MLC?

It could be as simple as there has been no research done on it.
They do quite a bit research and studies on different mental problems/afflictions, with actual subjects they can test and monitor.

Who are they going to study?  Most MLCer's think there is nothing wrong with them.
I don't think they can talk to the spouse, they are not going through it.  So they can not describe how a midlife crisis feels like.  Only what they hear from their spouse and what they witness.

So I feel for it to be recognized in medical journals, or for training, as a mental problem/affliction they need data to back it up.  Subjects to study.

If that could be done they could possibly do research on how to cure it, or at least, give the patient some medication or tools to work with.

I also believe there are therapist who have to secretly believe in it, but for them to diagnose it it would probably be unethical. 

Maybe an Identity Crisis would be about as close as they could get.