[FrenchHusband]

Hello all,

I would like to add one recent contribution to the very interesting topic  Why do professionals shy away from the term MLC?, but it is not possible for me as it is archived.

I think your question already contains the answer    People shy away because of... fear.

The name of MLC has been widely killed off in scientific publications.  If a person of science admits MLC is real.... you basically lose your creditability in eyes of peers.  And for person of science.... creditability is everything.

Of course this creates the chicken vs. egg dilemna.  Things cannot change unless somebody does some new research on topic that popularizes an alternative perspective.

Now there is at least one recent study that shows that there is something. Looks to me (not an expert) that the study is a serious one (datas of 500 000 people) even if it has been done by Economics researchers. There is no person from Medical department, and it is a bit strange to me as the authors are speaking about mental health and depression.

There is nothing in this study about marriage breaking and affair (not surprising)

Nevertheless, it is better than nothing from my POV

There is the link where you can download the study for free.

People in their midlife are disproportionately more likely to suffer from clinical depression, take their own lives, become dependent on alcohol, have trouble sleeping, and exhibit other extreme-stress ailments.

In the CAGE working paper, ‘The Mid-life Crisis’, Osea Giuntella, Sally McManus, Redzo Mujcic, Andrew J. Oswald, Nattavudh Powdthavee and Ahmed Tohamy use a wide array of population-level health data across all ages to prove that midlife crises are real and affect a high number of people in developed countries.

Strikingly, the data shows that those in midlife are twice as likely to be depressed than those under the age of 25 or over the age of 65. Suicide rates, the ultimate measure of exceptional distress within a society, were also shown to be the highest among individuals in their early 50’s.

maybe this recent study (February 2023) has been already discussed ? Anyway I see it as a small ray of hope that one day the MLC (or existential crisis, identity crisis) will be recognized and acknowledged as it is the case already for "teenage crisis".

[Baxter1]

FH-

If nothing else this confirms that MLC is a depression. High energy or low it’s all depression as RCR says. Thanks for the link

[marvin4242]

I guess I am a bit confused by the "confusion" around this topic. There is definitely believed to be another "developmental stage" psychologically for most people that occurs in the time frame we call middle age. This is parallel to various stages (teen, 20's, etc) that we go through. It is a general guideline and idea, not an absolute. And this is the time most of us go from viewing ourselves as eternal and young to more accepting that we are at a certain point and that we are not "young," whatever that means to most, anymore.

But what happens in this stage is not a singularity. Some people mature even more or decide to give back and focus on others. Some go through depression. And I believe this is where deep issues and fractures tend to stop being able to be papered over. It makes perfect sense, if I am always thinking that in the future I will do xyz, then suddenly I start to see future is not forever the issues underlying suddenly become acute.

What we tend to call MLC is a mixture of multiple psychological issues and disorders, and although the patterns are the same the exact details are as varied as the individuals. Which is what is said here in many different forms.

I don't think we need to "study" MLC, rather we need to create societies that value self awareness, empathy and growth over "accomplishment," rigid role models, and material wealth. Because if we raise children who are self aware, caring, flexible, inclusive and kind they can handle what life brings and continue to cope and thrive. I know my wife for one definitely did not develop the skills in her childhood to do that.


MLC is sadly predictable.

[WHY]

I think it's fcking outrageous that MLC isnt widely publicized and studied, even if there is no way to deal with it. 

Something is clearly wrong with my W.  She became a different human being in the space of a few months.  This is not fiction.  This isnt a grey area.  No, her personality completely altered.  This thing is very real.   

And there are soooooooooooo many stories out there of this thing happening over and over.  I think MLC is way more widespread than people at HS think.  50% of marriages end in D right?  I bet you a much, much, much larger % for the reason this is, is due to some form of depression/MLC.  Now that my blinders have been taken off, when I hear stories about other marriages that didnt work out, you can smell it a mile away.

Perhaps in 100 years people will look back and say it was crazy that this thing wasnt fully recognized.

[KayDee]

Something we forget - it isn't just married people that have these crises. A friend of mine, his brother recently BD his close family with a story from the past that he claims traumatised him. He's blaming his mother and by extension the rest of the family. It came completely out of nowhere, never mentioned before and none of them recall anything of the sort happening (they are a large family of siblings, with parents still alive). He has completely upended his FOO, and this is the interesting part, he has a new GF who (from what I hear) sounds like a classic alienator. He has completely isolated himself with her, cut off old friends too. He had the triggers preceding and is acting completely out of character. Not sure what this all adds to the mix, I guess that something can tip at middle age - we often refer to a perfect storm him, and Marvin articulates this well in his post. Even if not 'diagnosable' maybe a better recognition and understanding of this kind of depression would be a start. Not many people understand the complex and myriad ways in which depression manifests.

[Nas]

I think it's fcking outrageous that MLC isnt widely publicized and studied, even if there is no way to deal with it. 

This isnt a grey area. 

WHY - MLC is a catchall term for a variety of different issues arising in midlife. It's ill-defined and there is no one existing linear set of "rules." It's the exact definition of a gray area.

While I can see the initial inclination to wish there was actually one clear cut diagnosable "disorder" called MLC, I believe the desire to see something defined, studied and publicized is part and parcel of wanting to "fix it." Even with a defined label, the afflicted would need to be the one who wants to get well, so it's out of anyone else's control.

[WHY]

I think it's fcking outrageous that MLC isnt widely publicized and studied, even if there is no way to deal with it. 

This isnt a grey area. 

WHY - MLC is a catchall term for a variety of different issues arising in midlife. It's ill-defined and there is no one existing linear set of "rules." It's the exact definition of a gray area.

While I can see the initial inclination to wish there was actually one clear cut diagnosable "disorder" called MLC, I believe the desire to see something defined, studied and publicized is part and parcel of wanting to "fix it." Even with a defined label, the afflicted would need to be the one who wants to get well, so it's out of anyone else's control.

I hope RCR publishes her life's work and pursues a PHD/thesis on this stuff, carrying on the memory of Heart's Blessing.  The world needs to know this thing is real.  At least be accepted in academic circles etc.  To give it some credibility.  So LBS isnt seen as being crazy.  It will make a difference to the world. 

[HeavenlyFocus]

Thank you FH for sharing this article.

I really liked their conclusion below and agree with Marvin's comments about focusing on self-awareness, growth, and empathy.   If anything, this crises has changed me for the better in that I am definitely more in tune with relationships although I now spend much less time involved in relationships.  Everything was more superficial and I know focus on having a deeper relationship with others.   

HF

Excerpt from Article

Finally, we believe it is not currently clear whether:

(i) there is a timeless and innate form of human middle-aged crisis, or
(ii) the midlife pattern documented here is some kind of perplexing, and perhaps
temporary, byproduct of today’s affluent world.

Whichever of these turns out to be true, the hill-shaped pattern of extreme distress over the
human life-course in rich countries appears to constitute a foundational puzzle for economists,
behavioral scientists, and perhaps other kinds of scientific researchers.

[WHY]

I think it's fcking outrageous that MLC isnt widely publicized and studied, even if there is no way to deal with it. 

Something is clearly wrong with my W.  She became a different human being in the space of a few months.  This is not fiction.  This isnt a grey area.  No, her personality completely altered.  This thing is very real.   

And there are soooooooooooo many stories out there of this thing happening over and over.  I think MLC is way more widespread than people at HS think.  50% of marriages end in D right?  I bet you a much, much, much larger % for the reason this is, is due to some form of depression/MLC.  Now that my blinders have been taken off, when I hear stories about other marriages that didnt work out, you can smell it a mile away.

Perhaps in 100 years people will look back and say it was crazy that this thing wasnt fully recognized.

This is what I’m talking about.  Is this some kind of joke?

https://youtu.be/6gWgAIrBDD8?feature=shared

[HeavenlyFocus]

Hi Why,

I share in your frustration with how the world currently views MLC.

Here is a Cleveland Clinic article with recommendations for women experiencing a MLC..  I put the recommendations list and provided my own commentary with my XW MLC behavior)

Sorry if I am a little cynical 3 years in but the truth is society doesn’t like to acknowledge or look closely at mental health.

HF

https://health.clevelandclinic.org/why-midlife-crises-are-different-for-women/amp/

Recommendations
1. Acknowledge it ( Lol!  MLCers don’t acknowledge anything)
2. Do a self-assessment ( Instead let’s blame the person who dedicated their life to you for all your problems)
3.  Lose the guilt ( What guilt?  MLCers living in fantasy land)
4. Keep a gratitude journal ( Can’t remember last time I heard gratitude from my XW.  She was so different before this)
5. Make your health a priority ( Prioritize drinking, not getting sleep, and making poor life decisions)
6.  Tap into the sisterhood ( Lie to your best girlfriends and only hang out with your divorced friend to wallow in self pity in your fantasy land)