[barbiedoll]

Ugh..its like some men are just endlessly spinning from pillar to post with no stability or direction.  And is there just an endless supply of these OW's that have no respect for marriage , boundaries or families.  How do these men keep finding these types of women ?.  I am sorry that once again he "doesn't get it ". He may never , you are right. I have one of those as well, there are many things that I feel he just doesn't "get".  Nothing we can do about that , nothing at all. I am glad you are finally moved and feel happy , it is just a huge transition to be on your own after 35 years.  I imagine it will be a mixture of good and bad for a period of time and hopefully a more stable and healthy life.   I fully and totally understand how hard closing the door ( the final time) on a 35 year marriage is .  Extremely difficult in all ways .  And the new EA ? .  She has her work cut out for her in ways she is blind to . Idiot.

[Treasur]

I hope that your new home, albeit not the forever one, gives you some peace and a space to rejiggle your boundaries with H, S and crappy EA woman, Song. (And i’m sorry that EA woman turned out to be just as your instinct told you......as LBS I think we get to a point where we trust our gut on what quacks like a duck more but that doesn’t mean it’s a nice thing to be confirmed regardless) You deserve some peace and quiet without other folks’ drama for a while. And a chance to focus on just you and your next chapter and things that bring you joy, big or small. Wishing you all the best from my bit of the planet.

[UrsaMajor]

What more is there to say?

You called it and were, unfortunately, correct... As long as there is some EAOW available to rescue him, why bother to do the hard work of sorting himself out? Easier to just push it off on someone else... The thing is that nothing is going to change for him in real terms... Wash, rinse, spin, repeat ad nauseum....

I hope that your new digs bring you comfort and peace from H's shenanigans...

[xyzcf]

I have been thinking about your post today.
There are not many people who write here who have contact with their spouses many years after BD.
I have a thought. Although they have some feelings for us and they seem not able to cut all ties, they do not feel romantic love for us anymore. Their EA’s are important to them…..we are part of their past.
Because they interact with us, we mistake that for interest. Some will actually say things that seem like they wish to still have us in their lives but their actions do not.
I find it confusing. There is still something there, but for them, they have travelled a different direction. One in which they want to be free to explore relationships with others and not have to engage in any real relationship with us. No longer accountable to our relationship.
This is what they want. Over and over they show us that their wants/ their needs/ their lives are in one direction only and we are only on the periphery.
I am not saying this is the case with your situation, I see this in my own situation but I do see some of this in others who post here whose relationships never seem to progress forward or really end totally.
Not sure if a I am expressing myself, just some musings after reading your story today.

[Songanddance]

Totally interesting and valid musings.

I guess because of the amount of contact I do have with H - he remains a clinger but a clinger who wants to not cling but doesn't know how to do that and so resorts to being rescued and given a way out.

At BD I told H that he had always run away from difficulties in his life and that he suppressed and when life became too difficult - he ran rather than putting his big boy pants on and facing it (whatever it was or is).  This has happened repeatedly throughout the 8 years since BD and was made blatantly obvious on moving day. 

We had a van assigned to each of us because of course we were separating.  H started the day by joking around with the removal people - getting in their way - contradicting the items that were going into the various vans and generally not helping.  He stood and watched as my sister (who is my angel) washed, cleaned, wiped and vaccummed as much as possible once each room was empty.  He then decided half way through the moving out process to drive off because he wanted to warn the new next door neighbours (his new place is 45 mins away) and without even telling me this - he just left. 
I tackled him on this when I saw him last week. I said - "You couldn't even say goodbye to the house with me. You couldn't even say goodbye to me."

His response " Oh I was busy...."    Um busy - doing what precisely H? 

He ran away from even that responsibility.  He is likely to remain a runner and I have to reconcile my thinking that even if this EA disappears up the chimney - if after all that has happened with H - nothing will make him stop, reflect and face himself then  nothing for him will ever change.   I will but he won't.

[xyzcf]

No responsibility. Like a teenager who is only focused on me, me, me.

When our house was for sale, he lived in another country so he did absolutely nothing to prepare the house, be here for the showings, make sure the house was clean..that was all on me.

I ended up keeping our home and he left absolutely everything here. I had to dispose of all of it, not knowing what I should "keep". I eventually boxed up some stuff, his coin collection, things of his parent's, expensive golf clubs, other things that would seem important to me and they are stashed under the stairs in the basement. A few months ago he asked me if I had ever heard of "Got Junk" which is a company that comes and hauls stuff away as he thought they could come and remove it all. I expressed that what I had boxed was not "junk", told him what was there and said it's ok. It can stay there as there is lots of empty space.

Nothing from his past, not from our past and not even from his childhood. He has his own place now where it could be stored. At a minimum, he should sort through it and dispose of what's left as he sees fit.

There is nothing in his new place from his past. One picture of our daughter and her wedding photo album.

He has not asked what I did with all his things and never offered to take it from my house.

RCR told me a long time ago that he left everything with me because he trusted me. I think it is because he doesn't have any connection to any of it. He has fabricated a very different life. Which makes sense because indeed he is not the same person and neither am I. But, I have not wiped my past from my life, rather I have very fond and beautiful memories of all of it....

Let us know how you feel without him under foot. I will be curious to hear how you are feeling.

Moving is stressful, the world is stressful and it is hard to have to make every decision "alone".

[KellBell]

The inability to face the hard things and deal with the direct repercussions of their actions is mind boggling. And so immature. I can't imagine living like that. Never having closure. Such typical MLC behavior...and if your MLCer was like that prior to MLC then wowzers! I can't even imagine that personality trait magnified.

My xh is acting like that right now. I sold our 'dream' home that we built and put so much time and energy into. He didn't come back once. Not to take anything. Not to take one last look around the property (property that had been in the family for 20 years). Nothing. Acted like it was no big deal I was selling. I think it's the guilt and shame. When hard feelings start to bubble up- they run for the hills. "Not wanting to do anything that makes them feel bad. The really sad part is that 'not dealing' with things is what got them to this point. So they are really just hurting themselves and stunting their growth. No one can run forever. And without closure...wounds will eventually fester and infection will spread. It's the same with painful experiences and the shame/guilt/anxiety/depression that will grow if not properly dealt with.  Hopefully someday they realize that.

Just know it did affect him. He felt something and it was a hard sad feeling so he ran. He couldn't do it and wanted to get away. To us it looks like they don't give a flying fig, but they do. My daughters told me the last time my Xh was in town that he drove by the house and properties a few times with them and that he was quiet and sad. So I know it affects them.

[xyzcf]

I think it's the guilt and shame. When hard feelings start to bubble up- they run for the hills. "Not wanting to do anything that makes them feel bad. The really sad part is that 'not dealing' with things is what got them to this point. So they are really just hurting themselves and stunting their growth. No one can run forever. And without closure...wounds will eventually fester and infection will spread. It's the same with painful experiences and the shame/guilt/anxiety/depression that will grow if not properly dealt with.  Hopefully someday they realize that.

I am not sure KellBell that this is just a way for us to explain their behavior which may or may not be true.

I guess the past 13  1/2 years and watching some other long time MLCers that do not show any sign of shame/guilt or a desire to face up to things, my experience is that some are able to compartmentalize and move along. We truly do not know what they are feeling or experiencing.

In a sense, my "best" coping mechanism now seems to accept that he's gone. His body is still there and we have contact but he closed the door firmly and completely on "us". It is as though he has a completely new identity. All the things that I once thought would shatter that, have had absolutely no effect on him.

Again, I don't have a clue of how he feels on the inside but from the outside he has a wonderful life and what hurts me still, is that I should have been enjoying that wonderful life with him.

As much as I try, I am still limping while he is soaring like a bird that has been freed from it's cage after never wanting to be in captivity.

[KellBell]

xyzcf...

perhaps it's just a way for me rationalize the irrational. But according to my therapist, there is a disconnect. And an avoidance of dealing with hard complicated feelings. For some- it's to completely run away. Leave it all and start over. Never to face the repercussions. And that's horrible. And for some...they find a sort of peace with this new life and new version of themselves. It doesn't mean it's not wrong or hurtful. LBS are definitely deserving of an apology and/or indepth conversation. For many of us that will never come and that sucks. It's crappy that most of us will never have complete closure. And it's horrible that someone we loved and trusted 100% could have such total disregard for us and our feelings. There is no making sense of this craziness. And not every MLCer is the same. Some are irreversibly broken.

but more to the point. I wish and hope that you can get past looking at his life as being so spectacular. It's not. You will never get to see what he's feeling or his thoughts or his regrets. For some- they lock it away and compartmentalize...possibly forever. We can never truly know what someone else is going through or how their life really is. But someone who just leaves, deceives and traumatizes another person can never be truly happy. And if they are...they are not a person worth having in your life. You are worth more. I get that is easier said than done. But you should get to do all the things you want to do. Live and fly free yourself!! 

[xyzcf]

Thank you for your insight and kind words. I was thinking it might be even harder for LBSers with vanishers because they never even see or know anything at all about their lives.

We often speak here that the MLCer is "not happy" and that may or may not be true. Sometimes I think since they do not "feel" the highs of life or the lows, they are missing out on the richness of all that life has to offer.

I agree with your therapist that there is a severe "disconnect".

And for some...they find a sort of peace with this new life and new version of themselves.

I also don't understand how you could hurt someone so terribly and not feel something.

His life is "spectacular" because he does not seem to "feel" . He is highly successful and very much respected and has many many friends around the world who think he's wonderful. Even some of our oldest friends who know what he's done have told me that they still think he's a really great guy (ouch) and consider him a good friend.

But you should get to do all the things you want to do. Live and fly free yourself!! 

Definitely doing  this. Covid caused me to withdraw from the world and all the things I love so I am making up for that time as much as possible.

Sorry Song for the hijack.

Thanks KellBell. I think we are somewhat saying the same thing in that some may not have the capacity to actually feel anything and so they are quite content to live the lives they have established for themselves.