[Treasur]

Makes perfect sense to me.
I know we vets choose our words carefully in responding to newbies bc we remember what that was like. Having said that, I’m not sure you should temper your thoughts on your own posts - newbies may not find it chiming but your experience and reflections are solid in their own right.

On a tangent, OMG that ow is something else. And something very weird indeed. Trying to imagine any circumstance where I woukd think it appropriate to trot along to a psychiatrist appointment with someone else’s husband, let alone an employer - even some of my long standing dear male friends of over 30 years - and I just can’t. That is one twisted puppy, very textbook ow imho whether there is an affair or not. And I suspect the psychiatrist saw it for the far from normal thing it was.  Very very weird imho.

Still, it’s another good reason to not get drawn back closer to him right now - what healthy normal person wants that kind of dysfunctional BS in their life, right? And if he can’t see it, well….that’s another choice with consequences, isn’t it?

[KayDee]

I just can't imagine anyone would consider you callous.

I would hope not but when you are a newbie  and you read my actions;  when you are in so much pain and still very much enmeshed in your love for the MLCer - it might seem that my words and actions are those of a tired and frustrated LBSer who is losing patience and becoming terse - something that as a newbie you hope you would never become.   Does that make sense?

It does. And I am a so-called newbie, but I sometimes feel old and wizened, and pickled in vinegar and it's only been a year  so, you know, hats off to you S & D, for remaining so balanced. I guess I wanted to say, that what shines through your posts, is both strength and compassion.

[Songanddance]

That is one twisted puppy, very textbook ow imho whether there is an affair or not. And I suspect the psychiatrist saw it for the far from normal thing it was.  Very very weird imho.

Agreed - I have had several conversations with H about his feelings for her and he is adamant that there is nothing going on (I've told him I don't believe that he doesn't have feelings for her)  and she has certainly distanced herself considerably in both personal and business terms.

Last year she was giving him lifts all over the place - and this year she has stopped and only turns up for work when there is something she actually needs to do.

Like all people H attaches to since MLC - they soon get tired of him. 

[forthetrees]

I´m surprised that the psychiatrist was willing to even have the appointment with a third party in the mix - one who had contributed to the dysfunction. Was she there to keep him "honest" or to make sure that he didn´t throw shade on her? And, who gives a $h!t- he is still oh so messed up to do that, tell you and then act surprised at your reaction. Keep you peace and sanity. Step away from the mess.

[xyzcf]

Hi Songanddance,

Thanks for the update. You sound in a good place.

You continued to live with your husband for a long time. You have been together for decades.

My thoughts? It is possible to still have care and concern for these men. It is possible to lend them a hand if necessary, all the while doing what you are already doing...living your own good life.

It is different for other posters...they will not see or speak to their spouse again. But some of us do continue to have a relationship with them.

My message is always the same broken record...these spouses had a crisis at a variety of levels. They did do many things, yes divorce being one, but I do not want to hold any of this against him..because I truly believe that with MLC, as evidenced by the thousands of stories here,  they do many things that make no sense..especially in comparison to the person they once were.

You have made your own choices about contact with him all along. You know what you are doing, always have and always will.

What you do show him is compassion, while at the same time protecting yourself.

[Songanddance]

Christmas came and went and as usual for the last ten years - it wasn't a family get together.

S refusing to even be in the same room as H so separate meals for little groups all over the place and me torn between all of them.

Anyway - it's just a day and tbh - apart from my GD still believing - it's no big deal and it's a first world problem.....so much more important stuff going on in the world.

H is getting more and more open and expressing how he feels. He has asked me to consider us getting back together at some point - but that was because he was feeling lonely - so not really an attempt at reconciliation.   
My response was - " Who knows H. I like my life as it is  and we can continue to see each other once a week and continue to be good parents - what more do we actually need?"

However he has definitely turned a bit more of a corner and is less about him and more about what is going on with me and the family.

When a huge argument blew up recently between S and D (and I totally agreed with S in my head) I was on my way to see H. S phoned and was fuming - so I phoned H - told him I wasn't coming over after all - turned the car around and went to find S.

To explain why H has turned the corner......
The argument was over a dog's lead. S has struggled with the loss of our wonderful dog 3 yrs ago now  and we use his lead to walk our current dog (sort of keeping the memory alive on a daily basis).  D cavalierly announced that she had dropped the lead on a three mile walk and play with the dog (there are a few places near us where dogs can run free safely) and had made no attempt to find it (stating that she was tired)
She made no attempt to apologise or even suggest to go and look for it again.  Meanwhile it is dark and storm Henk is hitting the UK shores. S is furious and leaves the house - meanwhile I have received his angry phone call and am  turning around to come back.

S drove upto the field and I arrived soon after.   Together we searched in the torrential rain and S found it 30 mins later in a massive puddle. He sobbed and sobbed because it meant so much to him. Back at home - he hugged me and thanked me for turning round to help him as it really made him feel that I was important to him.

How did H respond when I told him I was going to turn around and why?   
 " S&D - our children have to the number one priority no matter how old they are.  Go - help our son - I will ring D and explain why she needs to change her thinking. This is the right thing to do.  You are a good mum and he needs you.  "

This is the corner he has turned.  It can happen.   MLC takes TIME!!!!!

[FaithWalker]

Thanks for sharing that S&D.  That is definitely a different mindset.

[KayDee]

Thank you for continuing to share your journey S & D,

H is getting more and more open and expressing how he feels. He has asked me to consider us getting back together at some point - but that was because he was feeling lonely - so not really an attempt at reconciliation.   
My response was - " Who knows H. I like my life as it is  and we can continue to see each other once a week and continue to be good parents - what more do we actually need?"

I'm curious to know, what this would look like for you? Or is it one of those situations where you'd know when you see it (feel it)? It seems you are pretty content with life as it is now. I notice, reading other reconnection and beyond stories that there can be, for want of a better word, a stubbornness in some who are recovering from MLC, which perhaps masks an inability to be vulnerable to rejection. Given that fear of rejection and abandonment is often an issue with MLC, is this something you recognize in you H? Or more that he still has not fully faced the issues?

[MadLuv]

I'm curious to know, what this would look like for you? Or is it one of those situations where you'd know when you see it (feel it)? It seems you are pretty content with life as it is now.

I also wonder after so much time if reconnection just stays at a friendship or if it stays at a friendship and then slowly builds to a new relationship if ever. I think it’s great that he is finally opening up a little.

[Songanddance]

Morning all

Been a little while.   Just wanted to mark the fact that on March 31st (first day of British Summer Time) it was 11 yrs to the day of BD.
Ironically I looked back at the calendar for 2013 March 31st and that was exactly the same day of the week as this year and also the start of BST then.   Co-incidence?  Maybe.

Nothing major has changed since my last update. H and I still living separately, (officially 2 yrs now) and I'm still seeing him regularly.  We walk the dog, we talk and we spend nice times together.  But he's still in his own little bubble.

He has acknowledged so many times now that he was responsible for breaking the family apart, that the life he is living on his own now is something he never wanted but now has to accept. He is increasingly saddened that he has no relationship with S at all.  He is becoming more proactive in helping out financially too. He has paid for certain bills that affect the children such as  S's car needs a major repair and H and I paid for it upfront but H  and insists that S just pays me back and not him.

He is becoming clearer in his head from the stroke and new medication and that is making him feel better too.

Last week we were walking the dog and she bounded upto him.  I said "isn't it lovely how she gives such joy to us all?"  H replied - " Yes and you are the other joy in my life. I am so grateful that you haven't given up on me and that we can spend time together"

So - the question I was asked in an earlier post was - what would reconciliation look like for me?

TBH I don't actually know.  It would have to include total openness, honesty, transparency and commitment to each other that would be boundaried but healthily so.  I don't know - I'm just burbling; One of the many things I have learned on this mad LBS journey is that you can only control the controllables; you have to remove expectations and focus on what genuinely matters to you at any point.

Does my marriage matter to me at this point?  Not really  in that I am very content with how I am currently living my life.

Would I like to reconcile - yes because that's always something I believed would happen. 

Will it matter if we don't reconcile and live together again?  Not to me because both of us are connected at a really good level and so at this moment in time, it isn't necessary or essential to be "reconciled"

There is life after BD, there is joy after BD, there is hope for yourself after BD. 
There are opportunities to grow after BD and there are times for laughter and tears after BD.
There is always the chance to choose joy after BD.
There is always the chance to learn and become a more whole person after BD
There is hope after BD, there is faith after BD and there is love after BD.

It's just a matter of time.