[geist]

Hi, first post and, of course, my (M38) partner (F40) of 15 years and recently celebrating our 10 year wedding anniversary has completely changed over the last 4 months. I'll explain in bullet points in more-or-less chronological order with as little spin as I can possibly do, though by necessity this is from my perspective. Apologies for the walls of text. We married October 2013, bomb drop of "I love you, but..." was December 2023.

Context:

* She had COVID in September. She rebounded after paxlovid, and was ended up being sick for about three and a half weeks. During this I learned to make her tea the way she likes, brought her food, made her soup, texted with her (assuming she was sleeping most of the time), and brought her as many creature comforts as I could. It was rough, but I slept on an air mattress while she convalesced and I checked in as much as I could.

* She has other health concerns that we've lived with throughout our relationship (POTS and Endometriosis), and after recovering from COVID, her heart rate would skyrocket at the drop of a hat, and her orthostatic blood pressure got even worse whenever she'd bend over. This was common already, but it became severe enough that she went to a doctor. I drove her to her appointment, where she had an ECG that freaked the doctor out enough that he sent us to the ER for some tests — fearing she may have an enlarged heart. I admit I didn't take it too seriously because I felt (armchair doctoring) it was probably just an effect of long COVID.

* We went to the ER. I've never had great bedside manner and default to gallows humor to vent the stress. We got admitted into the ER, and were quickly pulled out of the room we'd gotten to make space for a heart attack victim. Woman may have survived, but fewer than six feet away from us a literal medical drama played out while we were in the hallway. This threw me off, even though I had told myself to be on my best behavior for my spouse. I sort of disassociated for the rest of the time there, but I tried to take care of her. She had a lot of tests done, and we went home finally.

* She followed up with getting an appointment with a cardiologist who gave her a heart monitor to track her spikes. She would get mad at me and pull away whenever I offered to help her figure out how to track the spikes. I didn't think too much of it at the time.

* We had our anniversary (late October) and her birthday (early November) back to back, which was both our 10th and her 40th. I went all out as much as I could, getting her a new iPad, headphones, and a new iPhone. She was on new medication that made her tired, and I thought she was still having long COVID. So she didn't want to go out, she didn't want to drink, and she was "off" at this point.

* She then had a stress test — I had no idea what they were. I offered to drive her there, but she declined. When she got home, I asked her how it went and all I got was "it firetrucking sucked." It felt like she didn't want to talk about it, and I was still working (we both work from home.) So I decided to give her space and nodded, getting back to work.

* About a week later, she was going to to on-site for a day with cupcakes she was making from scratch. She asked me to get some ingredients for her and I obliged. (This is important for later.)

* Extra info: She's clearly depressed, was self-harming without me knowing about it. She didn't want to return to office, but now sounds like she wants to use it as a reason to move out. She had stacking health conditions, and just turned 40.

The actual marital conflict, where the MLC may be?:

* The next morning, we walked the our dog who I'll call Nugget, and once we made it inside, she gave me an awkward side-hug. I asked what was going on and she broke down crying saying she didn't feel supported during hear health concerns, and that she wasn't even sure we wanted the same things anymore.

* She said that me not showing concern or interest in the stress test caused the "bottom to fall out" and she lost her love for me.

* Throughout all of this, she'd been talking to a coworker who also has health concerns, and was working with her to get full remote status (tech companies are doing recall to office, as the techies among us may know). I was a little concerned he was offering her glimpses into his HR and legal forms, but didn't think too much of it. She would also go on long walks at random times, saying she just wanted the space and to talk to her friend in another state.

* For the next six weeks, I slept on the air mattress and we would talk some about every other day about her concerns with our relationship. She would make comments like "I didn't want this." and "Maybe I'm going through a midlife crisis." while eventually working her way up to crying and having visible panic attacks when we'd talk.

* The week before Christmas, she had a mandatory on-site week at work, and had actively been pulling away more and more. Despite having what I thought were several "good" conversations, she'd notably be even colder the next morning. I was confused. She started saying "I just need space." and I'd intended to give her that. Then, two days before she would go out of town, she drops the bomb: "I love you, but I'm not in love with you."

* I started to get suspicious, and asking probing questions at this point. I knew something was wrong that wasn't me — so after she left for the week, I had a billing error on the cell phone. So I just happened to look at the call logs. She was calling a local number on her walks. Not the out of state friend. So I asked her obliquely what she was doing on her walks, where she lied and said it was her friend. It was the coworker. I knew she was lying, so I asked her why she lied — and I got a pithy "I didn't know how to tell you he's helping me."

* She had never wiped her old phone, and after a few days of rumination, I checked it. She joined a private discord with this guy the day after the ER visit, and after a bit of $h!te-talking me, she engaged in an emotional affair with him. He is married also, to my knowledge. And as far as I know, she had plenty of chances to make the affair physical while she was away for the week. On this discord, she made special note about how the cupcakes she sent me out ingredient hunting were "just for him!" I helped make cupcakes for the guy my spouse was cheating on me with. (Told you it was relevant.)

* We called a few times during the offsite week, and I'd finally had enough of the lies and told her I knew. She wilted, and pleaded with me not to tell her work. As of yet, I have not reported it. And she offered finally to go to marriage counseling with me. This did not happen because that night she remote-erased her phone, and vanished. She would only tell me through text that she was "safe" and that she wouldn't talk to me while there was "so much anger."

* I tried to figure out where she was, because I didn't know if the coworker was blackmailing her, and all things besides — my best friend of 15 years was behaving erratically and was cheating on me — so I called her friend (who didn't answer), and then texted her parents. I came to learn she fled the state. This was just before Christmas. She proceeded to tell me the affair was my fault due to "years of hurt" and that all of her good feelings were gone.

* I spent Christmas with a friend's famly. I cried a lot. She proceeded to ghost me for weeks. She finally texted me saying she hasn't been her "best self" and that I "deserved better." We finally had a phone call, but she still wants to move out, and says she doesn't "feel that way" about me anymore.

* She's been with her parents (or so I'm told) ever since. So, about 8 weeks. We're in essentially no contact now, and I have no reason to believe she's cut off the affair — which was primarily on Discord anyway. I've spent Christmas, New Years, my birthday, and am on track to spend Valentines day alone and in effective limbo.

* I've been trying to give her space, because what I've learned about what may be a mid-life crisis, or avoidant attachment styles — this is what I'm supposed to do if I want to have any hope of reconciling. Before you ask, yes, I still love her. We've never really had a fight before this year. We were going to buy a house, but it felt like she kept moving the goal posts or refused to compromise. I pushed for a new house, and, well, we bristled at each other a bit. But I tried to make up with her for it and even commented "if we've been together this long, we must be doing alright to have only one real fight like this, right?" — Famous last words, I know.

* Without going into a terrible number of specifics, I know we haven't been perfect. I know I haven't been perfect. But I was (falsely) under the impression we were doing okay, and were even on the upswing in terms of the depth of our relationship. She'd thrown out the term "walk away wife syndrome," but the timeline matches up mostly to the beginning of the affair. Throughout all of this, I did what I could to make changes, make sure she felt heard, and grow as a husband.

* In 15 years of knowing her, this is completely out of character for her. Throughout our time together I've always asked her (when things were good) to tell me if there's anything I could be doing better, or what-have-you. I had thought I'd done well to avoid being blindsided by something like this, but I clearly failed — or it was out of my hands.

* Notably, she only says more "aggressive" statements when she's panicking. "Separate" is the strongest word she's said, never the D-word yet.
Hopefully I've given enough information. I've been going to therapy and started antidepressants because of all this. I do not know what to do, because I'm stuck in limbo as she hasn't really moved out yet (all her stuff is still here), nor has she filed for divorce. But her words are cold and distant when I do get any kind of text. She has said space is how she heals, but this is a lot to deal with.

What — or can — I do? My self-esteem is at an all time low, and I feel fairly psychologically abused and abandoned through all of this. I have had a consult with a lawyer, but I'm not pursuing it. If we get divorced, we're in a no-fault, 50/50 split state. I don't want this, and have no real idea of how long she's been struggling with what I'm thinking is an MLC.

And again, I do still love her, but I also have a lot of strong emotions around all of this. I'm trying to be a point of stability for her, but this seems to be happening so fast and yet so weirdly all at once. I've watched Kenda-ruth's video series and tune in to the YouTube channel whenever I see a good video pop up.

TL;DR — Wife got COVID, health complications followed. She said I didn't support her during the health concerns, then slowly started expanding from there to essentially saying I was an awful spouse for years and the wants to leave me while having hidden an affair from me.


From what I can tell, this is escape and avoid behavior. I don't think she's being much of a clinger or a boomerang, but I'm only so familar with the terms. Was getting COVID the instigator? Was it the opportunity to have an affair? Is it just a slow boil?

[AlvinTheMaker]

Hi geist,

So sorry you are in this club nobody wants to member of.

Is this MLC? Basically there is no way to tell for sure. At six year mark I feel what matters more is that you can put a tag on it - it helps you to process and move on with it. Some call it MLC, some call it walkaway wife syndrome, for some it is rough patch, some call it plain and simple cheating. What's common with them all is your partner feels she no mores love you, she has had an affair, and relationship between you two is in deep trouble.

Is it about you... Loving another person is a personal choice. The same way you cannot force another person to fall in love with you, the same way you cannot force them to fall out. It is a personal choice, and she is the one that needs to work it through her part the same way as you need to deal your part.

What drove her into it.....I think everyone who goes through abandonment would like to know a cause. Sadly there is no way to tell what triggered it. Most likely she does not know true reason neither - and you might hear multiple (even conflicting) reasons from her over time. You can spend an eternity chasing the options, but please do acknowledge that intternal peace becomes only when you drop the rope and accept "so happened, what's life got next".

What you can and should do first is slow down. A LOT.  The first 6-12 months is pure emotional rollercoaster as you are trying to understand which way is up or down. Just like in plane crashing down, your first task is to put your personal mask on. Only that way you can help you, and later your partner. How are you doing physically, intellectually, emotionally, and spiritually (PIES)? Are you getting some support from friends, family or healthcare professionals?

Regardless how you might feel now, a lot of the actions and drama are nothing more than emotional knee-jerk reactions. As long as you let your emotions be on drivers seat, it is not like watching a trainwreck, but also feels as such...  What you can do is put the eyeballs on yourself instead of her. Focus on healing, focus on things you control. Anything else is basically feeding ground for emotional rollercoaster.

So sorry your life was turned upside down. Hugs....This is great place for support and knowledge. I know some of the advice I gave was direct and even blunt, but sugarcoating does not make things better. Your life will eventually get better, but it will take time and it will require you to work for it.

Alvin.

[superfly]

I'm so sorry, one thing you may have heard, they can be financially irresponsible so be sure to maybe move half of your funds and/or ask the attorney what you need to do to make sure you don't become responsible for her new debt. Glad you found us, you're not alone. None of us deserve this s%$#, we are all heartbroken over our spouses/partners mental health issues that have destroyed our families for no good reason. It's so unexplainable, so devastating. I'm sorry, definitely protect your finances. They are not acting rationally!! 

[Baxter1]

An expert I’m not but I got ‘need space’,’’ILYB speech’, she’s been more aggressive (I see monster occasionally)and completely different from who she was. Sorry you’re here, but there are good people who been (and some who still are) in your shoes.

[Treasur]

I've been going to therapy and started antidepressants because of all this. I do not know what to do, because I'm stuck in limbo as she hasn't really moved out yet (all her stuff is still here), nor has she filed for divorce. But her words are cold and distant when I do get any kind of text. She has said space is how she heals, but this is a lot to deal with.

What — or can — I do? My self-esteem is at an all time low, and I feel fairly psychologically abused and abandoned through all of this. I have had a consult with a lawyer, but I'm not pursuing it. If we get divorced, we're in a no-fault, 50/50 split state. I don't want this, and have no real idea of how long she's been struggling with what I'm thinking is an MLC.

First of all, I am really sorry that you need to find yourself here.

I would agree with the others about focusing on protecting your finances in the short term and focusing on your own self care. It sounds as if you are already doing some smart things about that, and that’s hard in itself so well done. Whatever it is that is going on, it’s more like a marathon than a sprint and self care is part of how you find the battery level to navigate it.

It sounds as if (understandably) you feel in limbo. It won’t feel like that but for a little while, that limbo can also be your friend. Bc it gives you time to get up off your knees a bit and create a bit of mental stable ground before/if you need to make other big life choices in what comes next for you. That kind of time truthfully can be a strange unwelcome friend, but still a friend if you use the time wisely. Breathe a bit. Let yourself feel how you feel without the pressure to DO anything much with the feelings.

I don’t know if it MLC, nor do you, too early to tell. If it is, the WTF stuff will pile up in her life whether you are involved or not. The truth of these things does tend to come out over time whether we hunt for it or not. And that will bring its own questions about what you should do or not do, what is possible and what is beyond your control.

Until then, I’d encourage you to focus on the bare facts of the behaviour, as opposed to the causes of it, if that makes sense? It sounds as if there is/was an affair, your wife has left and is not telling you much and looks like she is given to avoidance? You would be wise at this point, MLC or not, to operate on the starting assumption that your wife will lie and that you should not believe much of what she says unless it is independently verifiable. Sorry, bc that is a WTF thing too isn’t it? But it seems to be how it goes.  By all means hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

And the same is true for any of the blame she tries to unload on you - take it at face value that she might believe it, but do not take it as THE truth. Just her current version of it, a version usually that helps her either get what she wants in the moment or avoid dealing with something she doesn’t want to deal with. And from what you describe, that sounds as if it includes your feelings, needs and wants, sorry. There is nothing fair or reasonable about that and you do not deserve it, but that is how it seems to be.

You will doubtless find, bc most of us here do, that this has very little to do with who you are or your marriage; it has a great deal more to do with who your wife is and her way of coping when her life gets a bit hard or not shiny enough. Understandable that your self esteem takes a hit, but truthfully you are pretty much the same guy you were before, a normal imperfect human. It’s very unlikely - unless you are about to confess to a litany of horrors now lol - that you have done anything as a man, a husband or a human that warrants being betrayed and essentially ghosted out of your own marriage.

Given that, you will probably find it more helpful to your own well-being to not initiate contact and to be thoughtful in responding to any contact she makes. That’s painful, and pretty weird feeling, but it’s how we avoid getting swung around on someone else’s rollercoaster. You need a bit of breathing space to look after your own ducks bc we here all understand that this is a traumatic thing, like being run over by a truck.

What do you see as your priorities right now? Both practical and emotional ones? How can we best support you through this life hurricane?

[geist]

Thank you all for the extraordinarily kind responses. I didn't expect to wake up to multiple responses.

As it stands, I don't want to stay in my current apartment longer than is needed — it's too expensive (Bay Area) and it feels a lot like a tomb. Waking up in the morning is when I remember she's not there and it leaves a pit in my stomach each time. So I've packed up the stuff I know is mine, with the essentials still left out for now. I may end up moving across the country to Missouri to stay with my parents for a while.

Financially, we thankfully only have one shared account. I've stopped depositing to it but have also not withdrawn anything from it, either — we have a financial advisor who handles the resources there and I don't want to make matters worse by suddenly moving around a lot of cash that she might be alarmed by.

I think you're all right — I've been wallowing in her truth, rather than mine. Her story has changed consistently each time she's talked about the whys of her behavior, so she's grasping at straws to justify her behavior. We travel in the same professional circles, so as this continues the truth will come out — she cheated on me. We have the same friends and she's often been the moral compass in the network, so this is all so strange and new still.

I struggle with whether I should report the affair or not — I'm sort of friends with her boss, if fairly distantly. I even interviewed with him multiple times to join their team but they wouldn't hire me because (get this) they don't want to have people in relationships working together. I know that reporting it would not help me at all and would only push her away further though. It's a moral quandary.

I am focusing on myself. I'm going to the gym every day(ish) and making time to sit in the sauna there while trying to clear my mind. Deep down I'm still hoping for reconciliation. I don't know how spiritual people are on this forum, but I've tried to lean into what the Universe is telling me versus what my fears are saying. It's likely delusional, but it helps me manage my stress levels. That and the antidepressants.

Essentially, until she actually moves out, I'm trapped in limbo. She may have purchased more clothing at her parents' house, or whatever essentials she needs to do her work from home, but literally everything else is here still. One of the few solaces I have is that her emotional affair is by necessity a long-distance one currently as well. Deep down I'm still hoping she comes to her senses, but as you all have pointed out — I'm trying to spend as much time as I can focusing on myself. (Gym, medication, therapy though I'm between therapists atm, and starting a better diet... today.)

I deeply appreciate all the support. As for whether she's having an MLC or not — I know she's suffering through a lot of guilt, but she's also an expert at suppressing her emotions. She herself even remarked she might be having a crisis once, but I didn't press her on it. I do know that reconciliation will likely require her to leave her current job one way or the other, but that's not where we're at currently.

I'm sure this will ring familiar to anyone who's here — this is the hardest thing I've ever gone through, bar none. So, again, thank you all for the kind words.

[mcm64d]

Hello geist,

I am six months in on Monday and there are a lot of similarities in our situations. Me and my stbxw were together 15 years and was about to celebrate our 11th wedding anniversary. She is around your age- 37.

I too have recently "celebrated" my birthday, and Christmas solo. (i had thanksgiving too, my actual favorite of the holidays). Thanking goodness neither of us cared about Valentine's Day, but I do feel for you.

I too hope for reconciliation and go back-and-forth on the whole what happened/ is it MLC carousel. I have highs and lows- Thursday night was a bad low, today a high. Generally my lows have gotten higher and my high are getting more consistent. Yours will too over time.

I am almost divorced. Her choice. The house sold almost a month ago.

My advice....and please take with a grain or more (maybe 1,000:) ) of salt since I am too new and still in too much shock....

* Yes protect yourself and finances above all else.
* My suggestion is not to make too many life-changing decisions too quickly. I would hate for your to come to regret decisions you made within the next month or two.
* Also, and I did say this to my stbxw while she was still approachable, while in a depression it is not the most advantageous time to make major decisions.
* If I had it all to do over again (why the hell would I want to- but you know what I mean), I would not have responded to some of her texts/ calls. I know how difficult it is to let go suddenly to someone who has been your main focus for the last 15 years, so I can certainly understand this difficulty. But I would have decreased my overall pain had I learned to stop sooner.

I have no family left of my own and our shared friends have basically disappeared. I know the solitude you are feeling.I know how tremendously difficult and unfair this is. I have been pretty successful in trying to enjoy my alone time without becoming lonely.

You and I are on opposite coasts of the US but please know that you are not alone in all of this.

You have reached out to a tremendous community of caring, empathetic, intelligent, and lovely human beings who know exactly what you are feeling at this very moment.

There are always choices in life....even when they don't seem apparent at the moment. You can hold out hope for reconciliation as long as you wish. You can change your mind about it at any moment you'd like. And you can change it again the next moment. You are allowed that. You are allowed to go dark or call her constantly. And you can change your mind about that as well.

There are few things in life we can control and of course right now our spouses are not one of them. But please try to remember to leverage whatever is within your control and use it to best serve YOU.

All the best and please keep posting.

[geist]

Thank you, mcm64d.

I don't know what the next few months will unveil. Limbo is going on for nearly 2 months now, and I feel like there's no light at the end of the tunnel. Thankfully, the few friends I've told about what's going on are generally caring and "on my side" — but I've asked them not to speak to my spouse about the issues because of the evident self-harm and not wanting to exacerbate things.

To my knowledge, no legal proceedings have been filed yet — and I don't want to be the person who does it. I aim to be the lighthouse, but given that the alienator is a coworker, he clearly has way more access to her (and is also a former lawyer, apparently.) — if the tables were turned, I feel she would have reported the affair. But I'm just not willing to burn that bridge, it's infuriating to have only two options — wait and see and try to be a lighthouse, or go nuclear. There's no in-between at this time.

Such as it is, I guess. If waiting is the only play I realistically can have at the moment, that's all I can do.

I really appreciate your insight on things... and I'm so sorry that it's gone that way for you. I would say I hope things turn around for you, but six months out is just unimaginable — then again, I'm sort of at three months myself. Thankfully there's no house to sell, nor kids to worry about. Just the finances.

Thankfully, I have a fair amount of money set aside that cannot be touched by her, and vice-versa. I do keep an eye on the joint account daily, which is mostly stocks and money market values. I'm not sure what protecting myself looks like in this case, but I should talk to the financial advisors and perhaps get a lawyer on retainer. It is considered "community property" regardless of all things in CA law, unfortunately. Woof.

I was really hoping someone would tell me there's a light at the end of the tunnel — but I also realize that all of the YouTube channel's videos explicitly say there's no guarantee of reconciliation, so I'm measuring my expectations heavily.

[KayDee]

Hello Geist,

Sorry you here - none of us expected this and we all know how crushing it is. Devastating, in fact. You are currently in the fastest, most turbulent part of the maelstrom and your thoughts are probably going at the speed of light.

Clearly your W is having a crisis of some sort. Because, well, who does that? As you list, she had a lot happen to her pre BD. A kind of existential smack around the head, with everything that happened with her health. Maybe she is someone who hasn't been tested in this way before. We don't know how good our coping mechanisms are, until they are really tested. Hers seem to be to runaway. This is a common theme on the forum - avoidant people run. This is her issue to resolve and it won't happen over night alas.  And, as others have said, it doesn't change the affect on you.

I don't know what the next few months will unveil. Limbo is going on for nearly 2 months now, and I feel like there's no light at the end of the tunnel. Thankfully, the few friends I've told about what's going on are generally caring and "on my side" — but I've asked them not to speak to my spouse about the issues because of the evident self-harm and not wanting to exacerbate things.

To my knowledge, no legal proceedings have been filed yet — and I don't want to be the person who does it. I aim to be the lighthouse, but given that the alienator is a coworker, he clearly has way more access to her (and is also a former lawyer, apparently.) — if the tables were turned, I feel she would have reported the affair. But I'm just not willing to burn that bridge,

At this point, the best approach to all your actions is to ask yourself - what is best for me. It's hard to disentangle oneself from someone we have been so intertwined with for many, many years, but sadly, she has disconnected from you and is not considering your needs or well-being - clearly, because if she was, she wouldn't be behaving is such a self-centred, callous way. I'm sorry this is blunt, but while she is in a crisis, this is who she is. Will she remain this way? Who knows - hopefully she will one day start to introspect and deal with the harm she has caused others, but this is likely a long way off, as not only is she running from herself (perhaps past issues), she has also added a cargo of guilt and shame connected to her treatment of you. She needs to face all of that and be ready and willing to want to address it.

it's infuriating to have only two options — wait and see and try to be a lighthouse, or go nuclear. There's no in-between at this time.

I know others will also jump on this. You have as many options as you wish to consider. The general wisdom is the middle way - give yourself grace to heal. For many that means a kind of triage of support from loved ones, IC and positive activities - particularly regular exercise (endorphins - nature's antidepressent )

I really appreciate your insight on things... and I'm so sorry that it's gone that way for you. I would say I hope things turn around for you, but six months out is just unimaginable — then again, I'm sort of at three months myself. Thankfully there's no house to sell, nor kids to worry about. Just the finances.

Thankfully, I have a fair amount of money set aside that cannot be touched by her, and vice-versa. I do keep an eye on the joint account daily, which is mostly stocks and money market values. I'm not sure what protecting myself looks like in this case, but I should talk to the financial advisors and perhaps get a lawyer on retainer. It is considered "community property" regardless of all things in CA law, unfortunately. Woof.

You may find that you are the only one abiding by that law - perhaps it is possible to move the funds, or your half of them, for the time being. Not everyone has crisis spouses that are bad with money, but most do.

So sorry - there is light and laughter on the horizon, but this is a process and journey for you too.

[AlvinTheMaker]

I was really hoping someone would tell me there's a light at the end of the tunnel — but I also realize that all of the YouTube channel's videos explicitly say there's no guarantee of reconciliation, so I'm measuring my expectations heavily.

Sad but true. There are no official stats available, but it seems less than 5% of LBS/MLC couples reconcile over time. If this was a regular rough patch, then your odds could be many times higher. But everyone's story is unique, so no predictions.

Work on you and your wellbeing, and life will become good regardless of what happens with her.

Alvin