[One day at a time]

It feels rather strange to start this topic but I have been struggling with this for a few weeks and I'd like some feedback.

A bit of background, my closest friends have been dished the MLC gift. I liked them both but I was always closer to the LBS and considering how much I can relate to that role, my compassion and support went to the LBS from day one. The MLCer has been unravelling (depression, acting out, etc) for the last 18 months but I only heard about this right after BD.. The current situation is that the MLCer moved out of the marital home into a rental with the AP who is 15 years younger than him  but keeps telling the LBS that it was a big mistake and that he wants back (maybe) first it was in 2 weeks.. then the end of the month... You get the picture. The MLCer is clearly feeding the LBS a pack of lies, we belong to a wider group of friends so we all know he is out, living his best life, publishing all over social media (although he hides that from the LBS, me and who knows who else)

My LBS friend has been taking all the breadcrumbs and has simply sat there waiting for the MLCer to come back. I feel the LBS, aside from being heartbroken and lost, is quite exposed financially and I fear things could get a lot worse if the LBS doesn't put the right protections in place... But the magical thinking that this will blow over and things will get back to normal is hard to contest when I feel it would be too cruel for me to expose what the MLCer is actually doing.

Over the years I have learnt a lot from my own situation and other stories here.. I'm just finding it really hard to strike a balance between supporting my friend in the way I think is necessary (ie Encourage to seek legal advice, cut the MLCer off and let him get on with his crisis, live as if, etc) and simply offer a safe place to talk, letting the LBS go through the process and reach the right conclusions when the time is right.

From my own experience, I know I didn't feel particularly supported when people in RL told me to move on, forget about xH, etc so I don't want to do the same with my friend. But how do I help without delivering more BDs? I really don't know what to do..

[forthetrees]

Share this website and point out the info for newbies link?

[Nas]

It must be really hard to watch an LBS that you care about being in a precarious financial position and not acting in their own best interest. I think you can offer to be a listening ear for this person, and in the course of that, you can share your own experience and see how the conversation goes.
There’s a lot of things I wish I knew to expect earlier on. People kept telling me their interpretation of legalities: “You’re ENTITLED to half of X,” “ He will HAVE to do Y or Z…” That’s all fine and good but when there aren’t children involved, those laws that everyone cites are not actually just a given, they only work by paying lots of money for lawyers to get a judge to order that those laws must be adhered to. And if they are not adhered to, then you pay lawyers again. I had to be on top of everything, I couldn’t afford to be delusional or lost in my feelings, and I still lost. And as many here can attest, a difficult MLCer will cause a long drawn out battle over even the smallest thing.
All that said, there’s a fine line between warning a friend and telling a friend what to do. It’s clear cut if your LBS friend is asking for help, then you can tell them what you know about the experience. Otherwise, I would have a conversation and see what they share, and from there you can offer to talk out solutions. Keep the focus only on the LBS. You don’t have to share what you know about the MLCer or what they are up to, but you can try to get the LBS to take the focus off the MLCer and talk to them about what they need to do to mitigate damage and protect themselves financially.
I get what you’re saying, a lot of the early advice that people get is to just move on, and I think many people do say that in sort of a throwaway manner, but other times, behind that statement is an intent to actually impress upon the person that they better get moving to protect themselves and take what is rightfully theirs and to put their own security ahead of saving the relationship. There’s a world of difference between “you need to move on” and “you need to protect yourself financially because it could potentially become unrecoverable…” You unfortunately have the experience behind you to know how to verbalize it better than many people who simply say “you just need to move on.” I hope that your LBS friend is open to hearing you.

[KayDee]

This must be tough, and perhaps triggering for you OneDay? My feeling is that if you can cope with this, you could say something like 'as you know, I have been through something similar, and if you ever want to ask me about my experience, I am open to it'. That way you de-personalise it in terms of her and H, but create a reflective space for her to consider what can happen. I had a friend who had experienced an abrupt abandonment some 5 years before my H's crisis. I found it really helpful to ask questions, not just practicalities, but how she felt, and her approach to communications etc. I didn't see that as carbon copy handbook for me, it just helped me consider things, and talk it through with someone who understood the madness (on both sides    ). Aside from that, the best support I had in the early days, was from people who where non judgemental and allowed me to vent and rake things over. And when necessary, take me out for a pint 

[xyzcf]

My two best friends during the first several years did not give me advice...they listened, they supported, they verified the way I felt.....I needed them to help me get through the day.

Even on HS back then, we didn't "give advice" to one another...a few of the old timers, RCR, Stayed and Heartsblessing might have a bit more, but the "advice" was focused on the LBSer's needs.

But the magical thinking that this will blow over and things will get back to normal is hard to contest when I feel it would be too cruel for me to expose what the MLCer is actually doing.

I only wanted to hear stories of restored marriages as I was comforted by them. I wasn't ready to see anything else.

Old Pilot once asked me "what will you do if he doesn't come back?" and my very serious and scary response at the time was "I don't know......" I was in deep denial.

Reading your post, I thought about how our marriages ending = grief and the five stages of grief that people go through which I think applies to the LBS.

"The five stages of grief, also known as the Kübler-Ross model, are a theory that describes the emotions people experience when grieving:
Denial
Anger
Bargaining
Depression
Acceptance"

These stages are not linear, you can go back and forth a great deal before true healing occurs.

And that takes time and work, not just on the financial and legal aspects, but really on our inner selves...deep, intense work that takes a long time.

She may need you right now as a friend who is able to hear her voice, and sometimes that means not saying anything at all but being there....not abandoning her as some people did to me, because my pain was too hard for them to deal with.

[One day at a time]

Thanks FTT, Nas, KD, XY. I really appreciate all the input and advice. It's reassuring to hear that my first instinct of not saying everything I know was the right approach.

FTT, I have mentioned this forum to my LBS friend but I didn't see any interest so I didn't push it.

Nas, absolutely, this is my biggest problem. I know my friend will not be able to keep up the mortgage repayments without the MLCer contribution.. So far, he's contributing but what happens when that stops? I also know they were looking to remortgage and take a lump sum out  . This was being discussed as of last week!! I told my LBS friend that I didn't think that was a good idea considering the circumstances but, that at the end of the day, it was entirely their decision. I just wouldn't like to see my friend lose the house but at the same time, it's not my place to dictate what happens as hard as it is to watch my friend walking into a potential financial disaster.

KD, this friend was my rock at the time my marriage ended. She knows everything I went through, she listened to my struggles and saw me crying multiple times. She came to me first when all this kicked off because she knew I would understand and I did. For a couple of days, I remembered the pain I went through but it also made me realize my level of healing as it didn't trigger me as much as I thought it would. We talked quite a bit during the first few weeks, I validated her feelings of concern and compassion for the MLCer, I get it!! But she's giving him all the power right now and that worries me. Especially when I hear what he tells her vs the truth.

xy, I think you hit the nail on the head, my friend is in complete denial and for a few weeks, I met her where she was because I knew she couldn't take any more pain.. My post might not sound like it but I honestly was very gentle. I completely agree, it takes a very long time to get to grips with an event like this. It took me a lot longer than anyone knows as eventually, I decided to keep it to myself.  I guess the big difference between my story and my friend's is that, even when emotionally I was nowhere near ready to accept xH was gone, I secured my finances, home and future. I didn't have to go through losing my home on top of my marriage which I know many LBSs here had to do.

Anyway, I think I get the gist. Listen, validate, ask questions and help when asked. It's hard to watch people so close to me suffering like this 

[KayDee]

I think, in that case, a bit of well timed tough love about finances is OK. Sometimes we need that reality 'slap'. My BF did that for me. I think her exact words where 'right, we cannot expect anything from him now'. She was referring to honouring his financial commitments (she was right, he bailed of paying the mortgage pretty soon after). I loved that she said 'we' 

[WHY]

Seriously why you would want to beat around the bush on this one?   She’s your BFF.  Protect her.   

Rip off the band aid and tell her what lies ahead.  She needs those truth darts so she can make informed decisions and protect herself. 

[xyzcf]

I totally disagree WHY..she needs someone who will accept her where she is at right now....she is in a crisis of her own and although a BF can offer some important information for her safety, she must also respect her at the place she is at in this moment.

"Terrifying her" with what might happen will add to her stress level and of course every case is different so we don't know what will happen in the future.

I was gently advised by friends that I had to see a lawyer, they stood with me by the phone while I made the telephone call.

Information can be given in such a way..." have you thought about this" .....but ultimately she must make her own choices...she's an adult and she is going to have to take on some huge issues and responsibilities....I was so frozen but my best friends allowed me to cry and spit and scream as much as I needed to and I am grateful that they didn't try and tell me what I had to do...because nobody knows how things will go down.

Kay Dee's approach is much better IMHO

"I think, in that case, a bit of well timed tough love about finances is OK. Sometimes we need that reality 'slap'. My BF did that for me. I think her exact words where 'right, we cannot expect anything from him now'. She was referring to honouring his financial commitments (she was right, he bailed of paying the mortgage pretty soon after). I loved that she said 'we'  "

[Ready2Transform]

Only you know if your friend will be receptive. I tried to do this with a friend in the past whose now xH was clearly in MLC. I didn't point her toward the forum because I knew it wouldn't align with her approach, but I did try to bring up MLC and sort of "predict" what would happen next (which always did). It gave her resistance and made her very defensive that her situation was not at all like mine (except it was). I would still probably try to ease her into it, BUT be prepared that just like you figured out on your own the best way toward acceptance and figuring out your path, she'll do the same. Just be there for her. That's always the main thing. Making her see any particular diagnosis or possibility in her situation is way secondary to just being a good friend.