[Flummoxed]

Sending hugs, Tailspin! I am so incredibly sorry- to say this is rough is the understatement of the century.

Maybe I’m just a silly optimist, but I do believe their real selves truly are in there deep, deep down. However, it’ll take time and strength for them to break through and we just can’t know if or when that will happen- we can just have hope and faith and carry on.

It’s fantastic that you’re keeping busy and spending time with loved ones. Distance makes it a bit easier to detach, I can at least attest to that. I think it helps me at least to remember that the person acting out right now isn’t the person I married- it’s like dealing with the adolescent version of him on steroids. And I’ve never been good with teens.

All you can do is keep calm, continue with the space, keep taking care of yourself, and keep chatting when you can. You’ll get through this day and feel way better tomorrow knowing you made it through. It’s all just one step at a time up the mountain. But, no matter what, we’ll get a hell of a view once we make it to the top!

[Baxter1]

FL,

Thank you for that message, it was just what I(and many others I'm sure ) need to hear. This isn't who she is and hopefully she will break through one day. Keeping calm,detaching and chatting when we can has worked for 18 months now,who knows what will happen but it's good to have those little pep talks to keep people going.

[Flummoxed]

Absolutely, Baxter!! I know the team has been there when I’ve hit rough spots myself and I’d love to do the same.

It’s great to know that these steps have been helpful for the past year and a half (I didn’t find HS until about 2 months ago so this is new for me)- I feel like if we stay on this consistent path, it helps us continue on as a lighthouse (if standing) and become even stronger versions of ourselves (regardless of stand status).

We just have to keep remembering to keep on keeping on and that the MLC is not about us. The hate and vitriol? Not about us. The prospective indifference to come? Again- not about us. But we will keep on keeping on, be the best we can be, show compassion but also detachment as we live our lives the best we can. And if ever in doubt, we have this phenomenal forum of people who truly wish us well.

[UrsaMajor]

FL,

Thank you for that message, it was just what I(and many others I'm sure ) need to hear. This isn't who she is and hopefully she will break through one day. Keeping calm,detaching and chatting when we can has worked for 18 months now,who knows what will happen but it's good to have those little pep talks to keep people going.

I hate to be a wet blanket on the party but, if anecdotal evidence here is any indication, the majority of the Mid-Lifers will not have the strength to actually do the work they need to do in order to get their heads out of their .... fog....   That is usually why they ended up in the MLC in the first place. They are similar to addicts in many ways in that, as long as they don't go <splat> on the rocks at rock bottom and CHOOSE to take responsibility for their own loves, CHOOSE to work through the issues that are plaguing them, and CHOOSE to be held accountable for their actions, they will continue to live their lives in a state of "tunnelism."

I see it still in my MLCxW. She still projects and tries to rewrite history, even though her D was final 5 years ago.....

[Tailspin]

Thanks everyone for the vote of confidence and up lifting words.  Wife has told me her move out date.  She actually had the nerve to say that she hopes we can settle the money stuff soon.  She said she needs to start living. 
I'm actually happy she's leaving at this point.  There are no words said and nothing but a constant scowl on her face when I'm around.  She wants her new life with OM (He's not leaving his wife). 
A year and 2 weeks to the day of BD. I told my brother that it's sad that I feel relieved but seeing someone become a completely different person and truly hate you has been an eye-opening experience.   I am learning forgiveness the best I can right now and will live for my children.  Don't know if time heals everything and if I can ever be friends with my wife.  Time will tell.  We still have to finish the divorce, and I hope to be financially ok till I'm allowed to get my other job. 

[Tailspin]

So as I negotiate with the lawyer now on custody and payments it's amazing how selfish my wife has become.  She is trying to arrange everything being easier for herself and the new life she wants.  All while writing emails that I need to think about the kids and that I should make this easy.  It's amazing how the person you once did everything for now only sees her "Sex in the City" lifestyle that she wants.
The only personal things she keeps saying is "I thought long and hard about this and you can't see it".  The next line is "Accept that I don't love you anymore"
I'm just a paycheck now to her. 
While I know that MLC brain talking, I can't get past just how cold someone can be.  All the while demanding I give in and I accept what she wants. 
I bite my tongue for the most part but sometimes I throw in a subtle dig here and there.  I know I shouldn't but there comes a point where the betrayal hurts too much.  Maybe I just am still amazed at all the hate she harbors for me.  Maybe it will lessen when she's out next week. 

[OffRoad]

I am sure you know this, but hold your ground. Don't give in to unreasonable or unfair demands just because it's "easier". Reversing bad decisions is difficult if not impossible.

Forgiveness is not required.  You can have acceptance and be able to manage just fine. You accept that this is who your W is at this time (might be forever, but at least at this time). She doesn't think she is doing anything wrong so does not require your forgiveness. You accept that you can do nothing about what she does and how she feels. You accept that at this point, everything is a transaction: money, kids, time with kids, everything. That is all it is to her. Put forgiveness aside and put on your business transaction hat just for now.

In my experience, it was much easier once xh was out of the house. No more weird behavior from a familiar face. The cognitive dissonance  caused my own behavior to suffer.

Remember, you can still stand even if divorced if you want to. Some MLCers get their head back on straight in a couple of years. Some much longer. Some never. You can't control that. But you can control yourself and what you choose. My line was the divorce, but that is me. Whatever my xh is now is nothing I want, but I have not closed any doors to if he changes and wants to come back (I'm not expecting that). Time to take care of you and your kids, Tailspin. Just keep being the sane parent.

[UrsaMajor]

I am sure you know this, but hold your ground. Don't give in to unreasonable or unfair demands just because it's "easier". Reversing bad decisions is difficult if not impossible.

Forgiveness is not required.  You can have acceptance and be able to manage just fine. You accept that this is who your W is at this time (might be forever, but at least at this time). She doesn't think she is doing anything wrong so does not require your forgiveness. You accept that you can do nothing about what she does and how she feels. You accept that at this point, everything is a transaction: money, kids, time with kids, everything. That is all it is to her. Put forgiveness aside and put on your business transaction hat just for now.

It is time to be channeling this guy:



Just because SHE wants it to be "easy" for her, doesn't mean that it has to be or that it is right..... You do what you need to do for you and your kids.....

[Treasur]

Maybe I just am still amazed at all the hate she harbors for me.  Maybe it will lessen when she's out next week.

I wonder if a bit of your brain is caught in a loop about this? We get it, it’s normal, and I think most of us - as we process the WTF - get stuck on something so it becomes a bit like that kids’ book…we can’t go over or round or through it for a while. And idk if you feel that is getting in the way for you or not.

To be clear, many of us know what it’s like to see our ex/spouses behave in ways that absolutely look like how people behave when they hate someone in normal life. Actually, not sure hate is a big enough word….idk despise? Spite? Contempt? Something in that neighbourhood anyway, right? And how bewildering it is when you really haven’t done anything that warrants anyone, let alone a spouse, hating you.

In case it helps, fwiw, I’m not sure they do hate us exactly. I think perhaps they hate what we represent to them, see us as an infuriating barrier to whatever it is they want and less of a human and more like an object. In most cases, it seems to me that MLCers - and people doing bad things that hurt others - dehumanise the object of their anger, frustration or shame. It’s how humans give themselves metaphorical permission to do bad things. And that’s not about you or me as the ‘object’….it’s about their way of doing what they are doing and feeling ok enough about it to keep doing it while avoiding the discomfort of empathy for someone else’s shoes. Or the awkwardness of holding oneself responsible for the effects of one’s own actions. Truthfully, I’m not sure they even see us as real people enough to hate….i think they resent what we represent to them some of the time, and don’t think about us at all most of the time. At best, it’s pretty immature; at worst it is almost pathological.

Still not about you though. 

The gift of changing one’s lens imho is twofold.
It can help you see that, as nothing you can do will make any difference bc it’s not about/bc of you, it’s ok to plough your own best interest furrow. As you can’t please her, you may as well please you lol. Putting you and your kids first will change nothing in her mindset, but it can make a real difference to the future for you and your kids.
And secondly, that there is nothing wrong with you….we don’t cause others to see us as objects and it isn’t your fault.

Will it lessen when she moves out? Well, practically speaking to some degree yes, bc you will be less exposed to it with less contact with her. Will that change her mindset? Idk….anecdotally here these folks seem to have a remarkable ability to blame the LBS for their ills long past the point when the LBS is present in their day to day lives. I suspect the mindset lessens, if it does, bc someone slowly starts to own their own choices and consequences as they sail off into their new ‘magic happy’. And perhaps some never do bc it makes life easier for them if they keep blaming others.

In the spirit of fairness, as an LBS, I had my own version of this I think. It’s true that my xh blew up large bits of my life and that created a lot of loss and damage. Some things I had to deal with WERE directly a consequence of his actions. But some things truthfully were not directly….they were just life events, or my own challenges, or parallel stuff that was harder to deal with bc of the other things. But I resented him for some of that for quite a few years. Ha ha, quite a few shouty conversations in my head with him long after he had disappeared from my day to day life  I didn’t hate him but I was angry and resentful and self-pitying about it. Every time I had to deal with something hard on my own, every time I felt less than or overwhelmed, every time I felt lonely or unloved or afraid…some bit of me blamed him for where I was and how I felt. Even though usually he knew nothing about it at the time lol. Imho that was understandable in the circumstances but not entirely accurate…part of the truth but not the whole truth.

My recovery needed me to separate those things out a bit more and that took a bit of time, but it got easier….perhaps it is just one of the strands involved in letting go, idk. Idk all of your feelings about your wife right now, but they are probably quite complex with some messy layers that are not so pretty to look at….maybe even occasionally something quite close to hate, idk…..which is normal too. But you might find it helpful to start slowly acknowledging and letting go of some of that rather than focusing on her apparent hatred for you….to try to be as honest and accurate with yourself as you can be about what belongs to her and what belongs to you.
Jmo of course 

[Trustandlove]

Every time I had to deal with something hard on my own, every time I felt less than or overwhelmed, every time I felt lonely or unloved or afraid…some bit of me blamed him for where I was and how I felt.

I was nodding along to this -- and I had to be honest and say that this feeling still crops up in some form from time to time, as hard things that should be couple things, parent things that I still have to deal with on my own still do come up.  I don't "blame" him directly, but I will admit the feeling comes up.

I was speaking to a widowed friend recently; she said she felt those feelings as well, and it obviously isn't her husband's fault that she has to do this, but no matter what the reason, he isn't there and she does.  So I think we need to be kind to ourselves, recognise the feelings, know that they are there, and then, as my go-to expression was for a long time : "put on my big-girl pants and get on with it". 

Keep swimming, just keep swimming....