[When is your preferred time to visit Porto?]

When is your preferred time to visit Porto?

1st week of September

2nd week of September

3rd week of September

Mid October

[Mermaid]

If only we could realise more deeply that we need men like fish need bicycles...

What do you mean by this, Mermaid?

Do fish need bicycles?

The point is that we attach ourselves so deeply to our partners that we think we are incomplete without them. The greatest journey we can do within ourselves is to find ourselves, whole and beautiful, and not as shadows or parts of our partners. It sounds an easy, even trite thing to say, but becoming whole is not so easy. We regard ourselves in relation to others, a mother, sister, friend, wife, and put ourselves in second place. It's not that we have to be selfish, but we have to be able to step back and let the others find their own wholeness, not do so much that none of us can grow.

[xyzcf]

It feels a bit surreal.....being in "Europe" with people I have met over the internet who feel more like family than family......thank you Mermaid for these
 very special few days.

Being with the others gives me hope.....hope for myself...hope that my life can be wonderful...my choice.

Wonder where  I will next meet some of you? Wherever it may be, I know it will be incredible!

[Mermaid]

Our wonderful weekend has come to an end; I learnt a lot from my visiting  forum friends, and it was also great fun. Today we visited the Port wine cellars and had a traditional (and cheap) meal in a local café. Much better service than the five star gourmet restaurant that we went to last night!

I suppose someone can unsticky this now...

[justasking]

Hello Mermaid

I have unstickied this with a sad heart. I think we have all watched as the planning unfolded and the updates you gave when everyone met. It gave us all a feeling of happiness at the good time you were all having but sadness we couldn't be there.

Here's to the next one     

xx

[niff naff]

WELCOME HOME EVERYONE !!!!!

[stayed]

Thanks for an amazing weekend Mermaid.  We loved Portugal and will certainly add it to our list of COUNTRIES that must be revisited.  The food was mazing, the sites were sensational, the drive.... bone-jarring hehehe but most of all the company was BEST. 

Great to see you all again and Mermaid, again, thank you from the bottom of my heart... hugs Stayed..

[Anjae]

The point is that we attach ourselves so deeply to our partners that we think we are incomplete without them. The greatest journey we can do within ourselves is to find ourselves, whole and beautiful, and not as shadows or parts of our partners. It sounds an easy, even trite thing to say, but becoming whole is not so easy. We regard ourselves in relation to others, a mother, sister, friend, wife, and put ourselves in second place. It's not that we have to be selfish, but we have to be able to step back and let the others find their own wholeness, not do so much that none of us can grow.

You've said men so I thought that you may be dismisive of males. I get what you've wrote above. Thought many times about the fact that, maybe, at times husband and I were so much One that it was hard to say where one begin and the other end. And we both loved it that way. Still, a couple must be One and, of course, we need our spouses.

It is a pity that to find individual wholeness so much damage and pain has to be caused. On that sense, finding our individual wholeness while we are young and before marriage/long term relashionship is  better, is may avoid a lot. But it would had made no sense to break with husband because we were teenagers and maybe, one day, something like this would happen.

[Mermaid]

Thought many times about the fact that, maybe, at times husband and I were so much One that it was hard to say where one begin and the other end. And we both loved it that way. Still, a couple must be One and, of course, we need our spouses.

This is how we feel at the beginning of a relationship, but as psychologists often point out, this is a mistake. Maturity in a relationship somes after this fusion phase, when each person begins to find their individual paths. The role of the relationship changes, and it's important that each partner feels supported in their own projects.

Neediness or dependence in a relationship is not healthy. It means the needy partner has not grown. Sometimes it is inadvertent; in my case, H was always working so hard that I took over all the financial, house and child management. He felt, as he said "like a fly without wings".

It is a pity that to find individual wholeness so much damage and pain has to be caused. On that sense, finding our individual wholeness while we are young and before marriage/long term relashionship is  better, is may avoid a lot. But it would had made no sense to break with husband because we were teenagers and maybe, one day, something like this would happen.

It doesn't have to be this way. For many couples it is not. And over dependency is not the only "cause" of MLC. MLC is a deep personal crisis of feeling and identity, which may have had the lid on for so long so that when it emerges, it is like an explosion.

But, as OP says, this is a gift of time to find ourselves. We can use it to grow stronger, to become whole, and find our direction in life. If we fail in this task at this time, we are in danger of becoming bitter, focussing too much on them and how they have hurt us instead of on ourselves and our growth.

It's not easy; this weekend, we discussed that the most difficult thing to overcome is the hurt, resentment and anger. But we know we have to.

[stayed]

But, as OP says, this is a gift of time to find ourselves. We can use it to grow stronger, to become whole, and find our direction in life. If we fail in this task at this time, we are in danger of becoming bitter, focussing too much on them and how they have hurt us instead of on ourselves and our growth.

It's not easy; this weekend, we discussed that the most difficult thing to overcome is the hurt, resentment and anger. But we know we have to.

We have focused way too much on our SPOUSES.  Probably way too much most of our married lives.  That's ok though, we honestly didn't know any better and had no reason to question the sense of it.  Now is different, we have experienced up close and personal what our desire to PLEASE and be NEEDED by our spouses, has created.  Spouses that took us completely for granted and even resentful of that we did these things, as if in some way it PREVENTED them from having something THEY wanted/needed.  quite bazaar actually.

As difficult as it is to find out the person you really are, especially when we are experiencing such intense rejection and abandonment, once able to work around these things and actually overcome and go through it... all begins to become clear.  We don't have to change everything about ourselves but I believe in our hearts we know what needs to be changed about ourselves.  As time moves on, slowly we see the changes within ourselves, joy and pride over simple achievements are felt. 

At that point, there really is no turning back. 

hugs Stayed...

[hyperglad]

I would just like to thank Mermaid for a wonderful time in a beautiful country. It was great meeting the other LBS's and a former , now reformed MLC's, Aka stayeds H.

It is so nice to take time for ourselves, to eat drink and laugh  and watching everyone support each other, even whilst going through their own tumoil, made it apparent what a special group of people we all are.