[kaffe diem]

WGH, I do not know which Infidelity sites suggest that the LBS proceed with D with prejudice...

Much of the information I have read with regards to Infidelity are M friendly...  The LBS may or may not choose D after infidelity...  It really depends on whether the LBS feels that is a deal breaker...  and that is regardless of the reasons...  MLC does not excuse infidelity...  not by any stretch...

The understanding remains that regardless of whether the spouse is MLC or WAS...  the LBS work is exactly the same...  and MLC or WAS, there may or there may not be infidelity...  there is not always infidelity with MLC...

Let me repeat and only because newbies might be reading this...  MLC or WAS...  THE WORK IS THE SAME, regardless of whether there is infidelity...  it is still up to you, fellow LBSers, to choose to forgive the infidelity, because labeling our spouses as MLC will not fix the pain in our hearts that is caused by infidelity...  that is up to us to accept or to walk away from, individually...

[WarriorPriestess]

i think if i was a newbie i would be put off by reading this thread it seems to go against most things that are mentioned in the articles and what the aims of this forum is for.........when i came here it was because i knew after reading the infidelity forums my h wasn’t just a WAS....... my gut/instincts told me there was more to it  and the way my h and many other MLCers are acting is insane my instinct was right and ive seen with my own eyes to believe it....xxxxxxxx

Yeah, this thread bummed me out a lot.  I want to be supportive of everyone and read all of the threads, but I'm realizing now that I am not in a place where I can do that and stay healthy emotionally myself.  I realized looking back over the last couple of days that my outlook became extremely negative after reading through it.  But I'm impressionable that way.  Although I'm still following along, I'm just skimming now. 

[Anjae]

Let me repeat and only because newbies might be reading this...  MLC or WAS...  THE WORK IS THE SAME, regardless of whether there is infidelity...  it is still up to you, fellow LBSers, to choose to forgive the infidelity, because labeling our spouses as MLC will not fix the pain in our hearts that is caused by infidelity...  that is up to us to accept or to walk away from, individually...

Yes, the work is the same. But, and this may shock you, infidelity is not the worst. At least not for me. Mistreatment, abandonment, projection, monster, financial deprivation, been dragged to a fault divorce, having somenone that as always protecting you attacking you, are all worst for me. Not saying infidelity does nor hurt, it does, but the abandonment is, for me, really the worst thing.

One way or another THE WORK IS THE SAME.

[kaffe diem]

Yeah, this thread bummed me out a lot.  I want to be supportive of everyone and read all of the threads, but I'm realizing now that I am not in a place where I can do that and stay healthy emotionally myself.  I realized looking back over the last couple of days that my outlook became extremely negative after reading through it.  But I'm impressionable that way.  Although I'm still following along, I'm just skimming now. 

WP:  What specifically is giving you concern?

I'd like to explain something to anyone who is here, newbie and vet, alike...

Again, let me be as clear as I possibly can...  I really believed...  I really WANTED to believe my W was a WAS...

Regarding infidelity, let me be very clear...  I really believed it was a deal breaker...  I have come to understand...  it does not have to be...

Now that it appears more likely that my W is MLC...  I still feel the same hurt regarding the infidelity...  MLC or WAS...  the feelings of the LBS DOES NOT CHANGE...  we still have to work through the pain...

Why do I want my W to be WAS?  Because of the issue of time...  that is it...  that is all...  I do not know that I am strong enough to wait the many years that it might take for my W to come out of the tunnel...  not knowing that she will be someone whom I would want to spend the rest of my life with...

And I...  am generally an A type personality, who thrives on risk...

So from this LBS to the rest of you...  I can honestly say that now that it has become more apparent that my W is likely MLC...  I am feeling a lot more comfortable with a choice that I did not like...  that...  I will probably file D once I am legally allowed...

Am I abandoning my poor, sick, MLC wife...  shame on me...  how could I do that...?  Well...  if/when she ever comes out of the tunnel...  we can always take another look at a new R...  if we are both in a position to do so...

[kaffe diem]

Yes, the work is the same. But, and this may shock you, infidelity is not the worst. At least not for me. Mistreatment, abandonment, projection, monster, financial deprivation, been dragged to a fault divorce, having somenone that as always protecting you attacking you, are all worst for me. Not saying infidelity does nor hurt, it does, but the abandonment is, for me, really the worst thing.

One way or another THE WORK IS THE SAME.

Yes, Anne!  Exactly!

All of those "other" things an LBS must endure...  those are terrible things...  and MLC does not excuse them...  it is up to the LBS to work through them and decide...  are they prepared to stand through all that...

Betrayal...  It has many, many faces...

+ lies and deception
+ infidelity
+ abuse in it's many forms
+ abandonment
+ etc, etc, etc...

These are the things that happen in BOTH MLC and WAS...

The work...  remains the same...

[With Gods Help!]

Hi there are plenty of infidelity sites that encourage the LBS to throw the spouse out if the spouse is committing infidelity ..........i didn’t mention Divorce...this site is for those that want to stand and by standing i mean GAL working on ourselves and allowing the MLCer to continue with their journey.....this site advocates not throwing your mlcer out...................that is what i mean....if you go to some infidelity sites you are ripped to bits for allowing the affair partner to continue living with you......here you are not judged, which i believe this site was created for......yes its healthy to have debates but not when newbies question whether what they thought to be mlc is not.........sometimes this a persons last hope and if it helps people to believe in mlc who are we to take that away xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx   

[WarriorPriestess]

Oh no worries Kaffe,
I think we are all drawn to different threads depending on where we are currently at on our journey.  While we all need to rant and question at one point or another, right now it is just hard for me to read some of those threads and not be affected after awhile.  The energy is just so raw, if you know what I mean.  Please don't take my comments the wrong way. 

Also, I have been having some personal reactions to some of the threads started by men.  I realized that they were triggering memories of when my mom left my dad, and  the hurt and anger that I read on the board here was reminding me of that horrible past situation, of having to watch my dad go through many of the same emotions.  I can relate to so much of what is written at times, but from the perspective of a child watching from the outside, if that makes sense. 

[Anjae]

Why do I want my W to be WAS?  Because of the issue of time...  that is it...  that is all...  I do not know that I am strong enough to wait the many years that it might take for my W to come out of the tunnel...  not knowing that she will be someone whom I would want to spend the rest of my life with...

And I...  am generally an A type personality, who thrives on risk...

So from this LBS to the rest of you...  I can honestly say that now that it has become more apparent that my W is likely MLC...  I am feeling a lot more comfortable with a choice that I did not like...  that...  I will probably file D once I am legally allowed...

Am I abandoning my poor, sick, MLC wife...  shame on me...  how could I do that...?  Well...  if/when she ever comes out of the tunnel...  we can always take another look at a new R...  if we are both in a position to do so...

Now you're starting to feel like I do. The time...the time MLC takes...I'm on the star of year six and nowhere to see the end...Even if, must say, now it looks like the end is near than the star...But there is still that thing, even with husband out of the MLC don't know ifhe would be a person I would like to be with. Current husband is not.

Are you really abadoning your wife, or are you divorcing but being fair with her? There is a difference. At least, to me, there is.

[Anjae]

WGH, MLC can, in my opinion, be fairly stated aside from WAS. The monster, the crazy things. Anyone that has lievd it knows it is just no a WAS.

Don't know how long you have been on this, nor how is your spouse. Some, and RCR writes about it, only pull out of the tunnel if they feel the marriage is really over. Divorce included. You can remarry, later on, if that is what you want.

I don't like the infidelity sites nor the other MLC sites. They are all very agressive and rude. Infidelity, in itself, is nor a deal breaker for me. But the unfaithful spouse needs to be up to work on the damage and the marriage.

kaffe, I did not knew, if I could stand all the things that happened/are still happening. Things just turn out to be that way. It is not even a choise, more like the divorce is dragging, so, I'm still in this.

With me is more, well, so far, survived all this, but would I risk having a future life with husband?... Don't know. We are still in the middle of the second of husband fault divorce processes, so, the storm is not over yet. A lot of healed done, a lot of work done, but there is some that can only be done after present circunstances are over.

[kaffe diem]

WGH:  Oh, OK...  I have heard about instances of the LBS being chastised for being compassionate with the betrayer...  including being civil, allowing the betrayer to stay in the familial home, being a door mat, as it were...

I do hope that members of this forum are not forgiving infidelity because their MLC spouse is "mentally unstable"...  MLC is not an excuse...  just as alcohol or other drug use is not an excuse...  if our MLC spouse recognized they were suffering from depression...  they could get medical help that could "balance" their emotions...  perhaps then they might opt out of some of the choices they make...

I do not...  not one bit...  change my attitude of holding my W responsible for her choices...  any future R...  or the continuation of the M...  would still require all the "normal" work to restore the M...

I am without a doubt M friendly...  and yet, I am prepared to D...  perhaps I sound like a hypocrite...  who am I to stand in the way of what someone else wants...  or alternately, in the case of my W...  doesn't want...  ie.  she does not want to be M...  even though she does not want to discuss D...  *shrug*  tough call...

But I encourage everyone to stand as long as you feel you can...   and then...  I'd encourage you to try to stand...  a little longer...  because really...  if M wasn't important enough to do...  then why do it in the first place...  if it was important enough to do...  then why not stand for it...?  At least, as long as you can...  without making choices based on reaction...  ie.  Do the work...  think through things rationally...  and THEN...  make choices...

WP:  I completely understand what you are saying...  I am an adult child of Alcoholic Parents...  My father is recovered, my mom...  she might just now, be recovering...  jury still out...  I have been witness to things...  well...  yeah, it's ugly...  I've thought sometimes that maybe it would have been better had they D...

And yes, on this board and on another board I'm on...  I see some threads from women and I sometimes...  well, I have negative reactions...  because the words...  the thoughts...  being stated on their threads are things my W would say to me...  similar personality types...  and so the triggers hit and sometimes it makes me very angry...  and other times, very sad...

A year and a few months later...  I'm feeling...  better...  most of the work done, I have found my peace...  the negative emotions are very far between and generally mild...  it gets better... 

Anne:  *sigh*...  Yes, the time...

Again, I would encourage EVERY LBS to find their courage and strength and compassion...  and STAND...  for as long as you can...  and do the work to better yourself, regardless...  do NOT stand still...

Yes Anne, I believe that I am being very fair to my W...  I love her...  she told me from day one...  from the moment that I asked her to marry me, she cautioned me...  firmly stated that she was a little...  crazy and unstable...  hahah...  back then...  that was part of what I loved about her... 

I want my W to find her happiness...  I know that standing nor moving on will help her find her happiness...  she will find her happiness when she does...  I M'd her with love and I let her go with love and I will put it all to faith...  I wish the best for her...