[iamnottheenemy]

The part that has me worried is number three, "Make Amends and Move Forwards."  This early in the ball game, I can't see how H is going to be able to look at his mistakes, apologize and reflect on how he could have reacted differently. He is still in denial, unable or unwilling to see that his actions are having a major impact on his relationship with D.

[Trustandlove]

You're right; he can't reflect on that yet, not at all.

That part for them takes so much time I can't even describe it.  I've actually had conversations with my H where I've given examples of how to do this, using myself as fodder rather than him, talking about the kids, all sorts of things.  It just doesn't compute at this point.

Regarding that, the best we can do is to plant seeds and to model behaviour, rather like with a child.

What this article does do, however, is to remind us that when we are dealing with our children, we can model behaviour that is in line with our values, and teach THEM what is right, so that they will see for themselves that they can love their MLC parent without condoning his or her actions.   

Again, when the child is small it's planting seeds, with older ones discussions can be more open. 

IANTE, you are right, they can't see that their actions are having an impact on their r with their children, especially not this early in the game.  I think my MLCer is only slowly thinking that perhaps it has had an effect, as he said a few months ago that he "wanted to get them back in his life", at least recognising that they weren't really in it, but he STILL puts the onus on them, saying that they aren't wanting to be with him, and doesn't clearly see that it should be him doing all he can to be with THEM. 

It takes ages. 

[forthetrees]

Please read: http://news.yahoo.com/humans-controlled-tiny-parasites-180652943.html

also explains the urge to refer to the MLCer as a r@t b@$t@rd.

[Ready2Transform]

First off,  @ r@t b@st@rd!

But then  , because we have always had rescue cats (took part in a lot of spay/neuter clinics, too as volunteers), and at the time Hoss left, we had 6, one of which was a newbie he'd rescued from a rest stop along the highway. 

The plot thickens in this sci-fi horror show...

[forthetrees]

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/01/theres-more-to-life-than-being-happy/266805/

And there you have it- they seek happiness- spending, freedom of responsibility b/c they cannot fathom the meaning of their lives and the happiness factor is devoid of meaning.

[onlyjo]

FTT
wow.  right on the money.  and they are the takers...the LBS are the givers, to make a generalized statement.  it makes so much sense to me after reading all the stories on the board--stories about LBS who have meaning in life by parenting, or faith, or through adversity (of MLC and more!)...we are the givers.  and the MLCers are running, escaping, and avoiding finding meaning by constant pursuit of "happiness".

i remember having a conversation with my h prior to BD, during which i told him "i think you're just a gaping maw of neediness".  now this makes a lot of sense. HE IS!  he'll take anything from anybody if it makes him feel "happy".  and according to MIL, he's always been "selfish". 

so i am wondering now if i h has always been so (what i consider) damaged...so needy, such a taker, always focused on "happiness" and the lack thereof...in which case, i feel like i did not choose wisely when it came to choice of spouse...

onlyjo

[iamnottheenemy]

Good read.

[Thundarr]

Yep.  XW was the baby of the family and always content with taking.  Perhaps it was when she realized that due to parenting responsibilities and her aging parents she would have to start giving back.  Makes me take a look at this differently, but also reinforces the belief this will not end the way I want it to unless I want to be an enabler the rest of my life, which I will not under any circumstance.

[cherryblossom]

A fascinating read, FTT- thanks for sharing

I've been reading so much on this topic - around how it's important to find your purpose in life so that it has meaning.

I feel sad for my H when I read about this, because I see that he has no meaning in his life.  He has never been motivated to pursue anything except this intangible and ever-shifting notion of happiness.  So he has TAKEN a LOT - short-term fulfillment from sex, buying himself lots of stuff and even seeking validation from his friends and now OW.  Maybe one day (hopefully soon) he will find some meaning within himself - something that ignites a fire in his belly.  I have this myself and I know how much it adds to my life.  Without it I would feel empty....

x

[Trustandlove]

Truly a good read, for ourselves especially.  Yes, we can all say that our MLCers are just looking for happiness rather than meaning, but it is also good to reflect on what we are doing as well.

And in regard to my MLCer, he wasn't always this kind of taker, this is the MLC persona.  I remember us talking about that kind of meaning, and it used to be important to him as well.  Reminds me that the core him is still in there somewhere.