[Wed2Him?Whatever.]

I should just say to my friends that I just feel like buying a BMW because I can now afford it, and not say that my Old Corolla was not fast enough, or flashy enough, I put up with short comings of this Corolla for 4 years and now I would have the nerve to say it wasn't good.

We were BFF, talking, laughing, going to dinner.   Right up till the end.   Till BD.

I have to pick one:

1.  I married a true sociopath and for 19 years he hid that from me and others and it's coming out now.
2.  MLC

Very well said!!

[Anjae]

And what of the cruelty they dish out?   Needlessly, zero reason, for no gain.

Mine (and I think most here) wasn't just a situation of "I don't love you anymore I'm leaving and filing divorce" and  having some empathy and kindness in the immediate process.   Far from it.  For no reason.  We were BFF, talking, laughing, going to dinner.   Right up till the end.   Till BD.

I have to pick one:

1.  I married a true sociopath and for 19 years he hid that from me and others and it's coming out now.
2.  MLC

Maybe we are all wrong and should pich option one! 

stayed, I think standing does both, protect us both also makes us feel like many doors are closed. Think it has to do with timming, how far into our jorney we are.       

I’ve dated, and will do it again in the opportunity present. For me its like for SD “have no desire to join online forums, trawl bars and have friends hook me up with their single/divorced friends”, so dating, for me, it to see a man I like and keep the romantic possibilities open.

What dating has bring me was, like with Lisa, being more picky.             

"Not only that but when you are together VERY young you expect that you KNOW everything about the other person - you tell each other everything, you know each others histories almost like they are your own (because lets face it you don't have a very long life history before 18) and then you ASSUME that you continue to know everything about that person. In a new, older relationship it would seem absurd to expect that I could know and understand EVERYTHING that has happened in his 44 years on the planet. So the starting point is completely different."

This is so true, SD. A relashionship started now will be very, very different than the one we've had with our spouses.

[stayed]

My Dear, dear S&D, Lisa, AnneJ and anybody else that is considering dating.  Goodness, me of my, do it!  Why in the world should you not?  We are not dead, hehehe.  All I was saying, was initially, I was way too vulnerable to even consider talking to the opposite sex unless he was a son, brother, husband of a close friend... hehehe... I really was, just too messed up. 

Just because I was, does not mean others were in my state.  For one thing, all you ladies are much younger then I am/was at that time.   S&D, you are only 3 years older then my oldest daughter, I would not want her to curl up into a ball and hide inside her cave.  NO!  NO!  NO!  Never, not my girls, or my sons either.  I would want them to get busy living. 

Bare in mind though and I would say this to my children, there is no guarantee, this could not happen again.  If you have not done the whole soul searching, the healing and return to your whole state, happy, healthy and cured, it is very easy to choose exactly the same type again.  Or worse yet, go completely OPPOSITE to what you had, assuming that it was the type of person he was, blah blah, blah.  There are lessons to learned and if we rush the process, we are no better then our spouses who are keeping house with the first person, who stroked their ego's. 

I think all of you deserve more then that.  Just go slow and take care.  Choose wisely.  Don't rush into anything and most of all, don't let ANYBODY rush you.

hugs Stayed

[Anjae]

My Dear, dear S&D, Lisa, AnneJ and anybody else that is considering dating.  Goodness, me of my, do it!  Why in the world should you not?  We are not dead, hehehe.  All I was saying, was initially, I was way too vulnerable to even consider talking to the opposite sex unless he was a son, brother, husband of a close friend... hehehe... I really was, just too messed up. 

Just because I was, does not mean others were in my state.  For one thing, all you ladies are much younger then I am/was at that time.   S&D, you are only 3 years older then my oldest daughter, I would not want her to curl up into a ball and hide inside her cave.  NO!  NO!  NO!  Never, not my girls, or my sons either.  I would want them to get busy living. 

Bare in mind though and I would say this to my children, there is no guarantee, this could not happen again.  If you have not done the whole soul searching, the healing and return to your whole state, happy, healthy and cured, it is very easy to choose exactly the same type again.  Or worse yet, go completely OPPOSITE to what you had, assuming that it was the type of person he was, blah blah, blah.  There are lessons to learned and if we rush the process, we are no better then our spouses who are keeping house with the first person, who stroked their ego's. 

I think all of you deserve more then that.  Just go slow and take care.  Choose wisely.  Don't rush into anything and most of all, don't let ANYBODY rush you.

hugs Stayed

Thanks stayed. 

I agree with you, in the initially a LBS is very frail, vulnerable and messed up. We need some time on our own. And, even more down the line, we still need time on our own.

You are right, we need to be careful in our choices. At least for another serious relashionship/marriage. But I think we can date a bit, may even be good, before commit seriouly again. Of course we cannot know if this could happen again. Except, of course, we got someone that already had had a MLC and was years past it, healthy, happy.

Have to say that I think we did choose well the first time around. They did not come with a sign: "will have MLC and wreck everything. Do you still wanna take me?" 

Very important the don't rush into anything not let anyonw rushes us into anything.

Hugs

[Rookie13]

Bravo Thundarr! excellent posts! The long and short of it all is: MLC is the enemy, not the true spouse who has been bitten by it.

Done. lol, next thread! Lol

[honour]

however what MLC'er say do have elements of truth in it.

Of course they have some truth in them. Any human can point at another human and identify their flaws. All humans are flawed. Manipulators and personality disordered people are acutely aware of the flawed nature of humans and they use this to victimise and to control. They use shame, guilt and fear to control others and to justify their selfish, victimising behaviour.

Beware of wolves in sheeps clothing. A MLCer, the one firing the truth darts, is, while firing truth darts, actively engaged in deception and adultery. At the very least lying by omission.

Someone on this thread said that their MLCer's accusations where like  a truth dart to their heart. Of course they were. The LBS is revealing that they have a healthy conscience and empathy. They are acknowledging their human condition. They are willing and able to make changes. Self-improvement is possible. The MLCer on the other hand does not do introspection, they do blame and shaming. The disordered personality is not interested in self-improvement, the giving up of self and negative emotions to replace them with faith, hope and love. The MLCer, if they were healthy and had compassion and empathy would diplomatically, with kindliness, with gentleness and encouragement use positive strokes to lead their "flawed one" to a better place. But they do not,  instead they blame, they shame, they lie, they betray and they runaway because they are consumed with self-interest.

"The MLCer is not the enemy" is correct but awareness of what the MLCer is, is vital to the LBS' recovery and the LBS' mental health. With our awareness of the MLCer's condition we can have the forgiveness and the "unconditionals" for them and to see them not as the enemy, but like us, flawed human beings.

Awareness is vital. The majority of us here who have been at the receiving end of adultery have been savaged by a wolf in sheep's clothing.

With statements like FOR THEM what you were doing to them hurt them deeply until eventually they hit an inner crisis point. FOR THEM it was bad enough to consider doing what they know is wrong and what makes them internally ILL the original post could be interpreted as shaming and blaming the LBS. It isn't a gentle post leading "flawed ones"  (us) to a better place. It comes across as finger pointing and a telling off.

honour

[stayed]

Wow, Honour, I must say, I believe you have proven your point. You are absolutely right that we do have to be very wary of our MLCer, as they do blame and shame, with a skill that easily fools and convinces us, that what they are saying is ONLY speaking the truth.  Oh yes, had that one, up close and way too personally!!!! 

This is an extremely well written article Honour.  Well said!

hugs Stayed

[OldPilot]

Honour I totally agree with what you wrote, very well said.

[hobo1]

Honour

My sentiments exactly.  I agree with what you posted.

[Tigger]

 BRAVO