[Which of these do you believe was the main factor triggering your spouse's MLC?]

Which of these do you believe was the main factor triggering your spouse's MLC?

Stress and/ or burnout

12 (25%)

Medication

1 (2.1%)

Dealing with childhood issues

10 (20.8%)

Hormonal changes

3 (6.3%)

Depression

8 (16.7%)

Neurological changes, unrelated to anything outside

1 (2.1%)

Underlying personality disorder,

7 (14.6%)

Social fears (aging, mortality, children leaving, etc.)

2 (4.2%)

Genetics

0 (0%)

External factors (work, OW, etc.)

1 (2.1%)

None of these (please add a note) Death of his mother

3 (6.3%)

Total Members Voted: 48

Voting closed: August 20, 2016, 03:03:33 PM

[Roma]

I said FOO issues because the stages of MLC started right after his father passed about 4 or 5 years ago now that I look back. When it first started he would talk about his family a whole lot and I really didn't know why, yet also knew nothing about MLC back then.

[Anjae]

I don't have a problem with a formula for MLC. Regardless of the source/cause of those, depression + stress seems pretty accurate.

Plus, humans are not designed or equipped to deal with such constant levels of stress. We are able to deal with acute short physicall stress (if we have to run or respond to an emergency situation), but not with prolonged emotional or physical stress. That will cause us a lot of problems, often even leading to a series of illnesses.

Evidently, unless it is illness related, stress comes from external causes. But as soon as it is felt inside body and brain, it becomes an inner issue that will reflect in behaviour, mood, etc. If the person does not change what is causing the stress, the stress is not going to go away, and will remain a brain and body issue.

Stress can easily lead to depression. Depression clouds judgement and way of thinking. Even if the depression came from external factors, it is only depression because it affected the brain, therefore becoming a neurological problem.

I have trouble understanding depression as " deep issues of self in the social world and relationships", probably because I don't really understand the self thing, other than in Jung. And in Jung I see it as a poetry thing.

I read what you wrote Mermaid, but even if the depression comes from any of those things "medications, drugs, alcohol, food" it is the brain and body that process the mechanisms. Regardless where the depression come from, the brain mechanisms are the same, the effect will be the same. what may be different is the treatment/cure. May, because once the brain is firing or not firing, all sorts of things, the game changes.

So, social, genetic, biological, it does not matter, depression is present in MLCers. So is stress.

Burnout is indeed a physiological reaction to stress. And psychological. And it also leads to depression. I know, I suffered from it three times and it always lead to depression. So did Mr J twice before BD. His MLC response to stress and depression is different. Before BD he would crash and have the behaviour that one normally associates with depression, lack of motivations, incapable of getting out of bed, etc.

I have never come across a MLC who is not depressed. The two common denominators seem to be stress and depression. MLC is not a normal crisis. It is not something that leads to a brief crisis mode. It lasts, and lasts and lasts, and while it lasts it adds more things and makes it all much more complicated.

Anyway, in Mr J case he himself said he was depressed pre and after BD. And the doctor from his company confirmed. So, in his case, depression was a fact. And so was stress. The same is true for my cousin, friend and acquaintances who have MLC.

[beyondblessed]

Anyway, in Mr J case he himself said he was depressed pre and after BD. And the doctor from his company confirmed. So, in his case, depression was a fact. And so was stress. The same is true for my cousin, friend and acquaintances who have MLC.

So, is your H still depressed then, Anjae, as his crisis continues?

[Velika]

I am wondering how sexuality plays into MLC. A new sex partner seems to be the catalyst for bomb drop for almost everyone on the forum. Sometimes MLCer has been secretly involved in an emotional affair with this person for years.

Does euphoria of affair/hormones create the catalyst for the "mania" we see at bomb drop. Is this the straw that breaks the camel's back?

Another question is there anyone at all out there who had really good sex life with MLCer right up until bomb drop?

I know that not everyone who has an affair will continue the affair once it is out in the open, but that this is the trend with MLC. What makes a MLC different than a "typical" affair?

[beyondblessed]

I am wondering how sexuality plays into MLC. A new sex partner seems to be the catalyst for bomb drop for almost everyone on the forum. Sometimes MLCer has been secretly involved in an emotional affair with this person for years.

Does euphoria of affair/hormones create the catalyst for the "mania" we see at bomb drop. Is this the straw that breaks the camel's back?

Another question is there anyone at all out there who had really good sex life with MLCer right up until bomb drop?

I know that not everyone who has an affair will continue the affair once it is out in the open, but that this is the trend with MLC. What makes a MLC different than a "typical" affair?

Velika,  Quite honestly, I really see this as being about "the grass is greener on the other side" type of delusion.  They get bored with their current situations and think there's something better out there, but usually find just the opposite, but by then it's too late.

[trusting]

I believe the affair is just a band-aid, a desperate attempt to "feel better."  It is someone new and different.  And I believe many (most?  all?) suffer from poor self-esteem from their childhood wounding and so badly need that validation.  Never mind that their spouses provide that...

[Ready2Transform]

In my case too the affair was just one symptom. They get a lot of motivation from the affair partner for change, or do they? There are people here whose spouses ran off within weeks of meeting the alienator. There are some that knew them for years, and may have been in a relationship with them that entire time. I think that most of them have affairs is consistent, but many of the details about the affairs and how they relate to behaviors vary enough that I'm uncomfortable saying that's the scale-tipper for all or most of us. Doesn't mean it's not for some.

I think the difference is with "normal" affairs, the cheater is found out and feels shame. They will try to save the marriage or at least end it with dignity. With MLC affairs, they are more what Dr. Joe Beam (and I'm not a convert of his, but using this here as an example) refers to as "limerence" which is an obsessive state, and having the affair discovered may be a kind of relief. They can now get it out in the open and leave the marriage (or CHANGE the marriage, since many are motivated to continue compartmentalizing). With normal or exit affairs, the mental illness type behavior or strangeness ends with the ending of the affair. With MLC, it does not.

[in it]

Could be.

 The ex described the ex ow as a clean slate. Someone he had no history with.

Therefore he could feed her any bull$h!te he liked. She wouldn't know the truth and would think he was just wonderful. He could rewrite his entire life with her. She was someone he could feel superior to. She would worship and adore him. She fed his ego.

Both of them caught onto each other in fairly short order. She described him later as someone who only focused on her issues and never his own.

But if you asked him? He had the perfect childhood.

And she (he found out later) was far from who he thought she was.

 And he had done the same thing will me in the relationship to make me feel like I wasn't "normal" or something was wrong with me. ( Actually there was. It was my FOO and my desire to want a family is why I took the abuse I did).

 Mostly I think because I had feelings.  And somehow he looked at that as me being defective.

 I didn't ever have an original thought in my head that he didn't think someone else put there. When I would say something he'd say " Who told you to think like that?"

Boy and that's the truth Ready2. The affair ended but the bizarre behavior didn't. I wish I hadn't been around to witness it..or endure the abuse that was there with it.

[trusting]

The ex described the ex ow as a clean slate. Someone he had no history with.

Therefore he could feed her any bull$h!te he liked. She wouldn't know the truth and would think he was just wonderful. He could rewrite his entire life with her. She was someone he could feel superior to. She would worship and adore him. She fed his ego.

That's it exactly.  And also why so many MLCers (like mine) got a whole set of "friends" - they can tell them anything they like because they don't know their history.  They can't paint their spouses as evil as they like because they don't know them.

[Anjae]

Yes,  tocslave he is still depressed and his crisis continues. He still drinks a lot, he still is going strong with the replay behaviour.

The affair is about validation and trying to rise their low self-esteem. For the self-esteem has more to do with the depression than childhood issues, but it does not make a difference, the esteem is low.

The LBS does not provide enough validation because we do not nod our heads at all the crazy behaviour. The alienator is fine with whatever insanity the MLCer is up to. To the MLCer that translates into "love". Go figure.

Indeed. And that is one of the big differences between normal affairs and MLC affairs. The other was also pointed by Ready2, in a normal affair the person feels shame when found and tries to save the marriage, in MLC they don't care and carry on with the affair.

Exactly, with the alienator and a new set of friends, the MLCer can tell them anything they like because these people do not know them. Even if some MLCers get involved with people that have known for decades and who know their LBS. Some even get involved with a relative or close friend of the LBS. It is not always someone they did not knew before.