[Ready2Transform]

  @ that letter. What a pathetic lump. I remember seeing it on your thread, but it still doesn't disappoint. And you're not divorced, so you see what kind of commitment your H was ultimately willing to make. She split up her family (good for them, honestly - the child deserves better than a borderline mother.  Had one, got free, don't look back!), and he still just makes drop-in visits. And she's such a lump, that's what she accepts after all of this time.

Reminds me of the OW in my case, but she was after cash. Told my late business friend (because that's normal, for someone to hunt down all of your connections while they're playing old timey footsie in a tent with your H) she needed to escape her H's (magically not hers) debts and medical bills from his serious illness because they were "annoying" her. Enter my H to save the day! Her response to being outed as a cheater on FB by me? That she was having an "exhausting" week. My friend said at the time, "Then don't firetruck someone else's husband, and you'll have more energy!".

And here the OW and xH are supposedly married now, but he won't finish the settlement with me. Because...they NEVER get off the fence until they are PUSHED!

[Hopeful Romantic]

I will start by saying I do not post often at all, but i am hear reading about the LBS's  experiences everyday. I am 8 months into this (newbie, still married with no papers drawn up, H is living with the OW) and this site has been a lifesaver for me . I am no longer standing, as i have no respect left for who this man has become (i'll call him crazypants, or CP) and the things he has said to justify leaving me and my babies can never be forgiven. Though I have learned to detach and GAL, and am getting better at both, everything that has happened in the last 8 months still affects me everyday. I am still grieving for my marriage and for the loss of my husband and father of my children, and still find myself thinking way too often about CP and her.

The reason for my post today...I spent a long time in the days after discovery of her wondering what she had that I didn't, how she must be such a wonderful person to be described as a saint by my own husband! and just giving her too much headspace in  general. As i read the articles, and read the experiences of others, and started putting together what I knew of her (CP used to talk about her prior to bomb drop as she is his assistant) and started to realize quickly that she IS an affair down, and looooves to play victim, which is probably one of the things that attracted him to her is his crazy MLCer mind. The perfect person to play knight in shining armor to. However, even after my realization, there were still days when I doubted myself, and compared myself to her. Made her out to be bigger in my mind than i should have, and gave her too much power over me. I doubted the concept of affair down, thought it may just be a theory to make LBSers like me feel better and told myself that it may just be that he found someone new and smart and interesting and was over his SAHM wife.

Last weekend there was a gathering that I would have normally been at, that was attended by CP and OW. I heard in detail from two of my closest friends who attended, who know almost everything that has happened between us in the last 8 months, that what all the articles talk about and what everyone keeps repeating about the OP is absolutely accurate. The OP are broken individuals, who have been lied to and deceived by our spouses. Don't feel sorry for them though, because they have put themselves in this position, and are so weak themselves that they use the same excuses to justify their awful behavior and betrayal to everyone. The OW approached these two friends (separately) and attempted to strike up conversations, be friendly, incite pity for herself and CP, tried really hard to make excuses for him and his behaviors by telling them that he had been unhappy and had married me because he thought it was expected of him, etc...(the last of the same excuses he has made to me, because the earlier reasons of me being too controlling with the kids and not getting along with his parents were not working with anyone he would tell them to). She was shut down and told off by both my friends, and actually had the gall to say to one of the two "it really sucks to be me tonight." My friends spoke to each other after, and both could not believe her nerve.

One of them told me that they just kept repeating to each other that CP left me for HER? They both had so much respect for CP before all of this (their Hs were CPs closest friends as well, which is how i know these ladies) and cannot believe that this is happening. CP has cut himself off from everyone, and both of my friends heard comments from various people all night about how he's not himself, he's stupid for doing what he did, and that the grass isn't greener. Apparently CP and OW left early...an event where he would have normally been the life of the party and tearing up the dance floor with me and the other ladies present. They slunk away into the night, barely speaking to anyone.

Take heart everyone, especially the newbies like me. They may have turned our lives upside down, but we will come out of this stronger. Their lives suck, and as much as we think those two are happy with each other, and life is coming up roses for them, it isn't. They are two miserable, deeply insecure and unhappy individuals who only have each other to lean on...and two unsteady people holding each other up is not going to end well. So it's important for us to live our lives the best we can, and move forward and keep our heads up. We will have light after our period of darkness, and every day is one day further away from the pain we felt at BD. We have been through the worst and are digging ourselves out and getting better. They haven't faced anything yet, and keep adding more and more crap to their pile, so when the time comes to dig themselves out...I see why some people decide to never come out of it, and dig themselves in deeper and deeper.

I hope this helps someone out there, because the feelings these people incite in us isn't fair, and we all deserve better.

[paradigmshift]

It's not always an affair down but more often than not it is, since the MLCer goes for the first person who strokes his ego, either through words or a perceived potential to lift him up from the dump in which he thinks he is mired.

I have learnt that the kind my MLCer went for may look really enticing to a middle-aged man when she is merely a 2D picture, but the moment she animates and/or opens her mouth, the bubble bursts. It's like killing your friends over a $1000 bill you find on the pavement when you're dead broke, only to discover later that it's only monopoly money.

My MLCer's OW is the kind that many men from my country and even from America and Europe lust after, only to come out broke and broken. I have had their gremlins snatch food off my table when I was vacationing in their country. If anyone finds that this is a treasure, then I wish him a happy life.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uX_jUhTyj7U
http://meebal.com/foreigners-being-financially-ruined-by-thai-wives/

[hopeandfaith]

Agree with EVERYTHING you said.  I had the same type of troll experience.

[nah]

Oh this thread will fill up quickly.  I could do it myself and I have put very little time into thinking about "the girl".

She's half his age and when they met she was in debt.  He makes a lot of money.

She moved in with him 3 months later, when he was still married, at the time she hadn't met our kids, any of his friends or family.  He described her to his friend as "controlling", (this was at the beginning) yet he still left his wife of 28 years and moved in with this stranger.

Coworkers said she does not have one friend, not one, when people see her coming they walk the other way. 
Husband has lost all respect at work, and has also lost all of his friends, either from hiding from them or b/c no one wants to be near her.  Husband is no longer allowed to mention my name, he is not allowed to talk or even look at another woman, he had to sell his motorcycle (which he loved), he was recently kicked out of his band by his former friend of 30+ years b/c according to his band mates the girl is a "huge tw@t".

I hope someday to hear stories of how bad it really was...

[roxyshin13]

Thank you so much HR for this thread i needed to hear all this so much, I am also in it for 8 months and always wondered all the same things.   So Thank You this has helped

[nah]

I only heard little snippets the first 1-2 years about the girl.

I heard she was "controlling" (said by my MLCer)
by coworkers - she never went to the dentist in her life, in debt, had too many anxieties, hated by everyone, etc

That was mild to what I heard from his bass player a few months ago.  That's when I really got a window into her disorders.  He is still with her though.  Good, I think her crazy is pushing him through the tunnel. 

[Thunder]

I truly believe for some reason they DO need an affair down.

I think I mentioned somewhere that my H only met one woman after BD through a dating service.  She was beautiful, 9 years younger than him, owned her own home and had a great job with the Army (a chemist).

He saw her once had coffee together and once they met for an hour to shoot pool.  Than nothing.
I believe why it didn't work out was because she WAS NOT broken.  She had her life together.  She didn't need rescuing.

To me it made sense.  She would not have been an affair down so she was worthless to him.  She would never have fed his ego.

[ArmySpouse]

 Broken people only get broken people!
 As you said a healthy person would never date an alcoholic or anybody that is just not right or in their right mind ..

 that is something that I just came to realize I think within the last month or so ..
 That's why I do not envy her at all anymore, I'm over that..
I kind of pity her ,because she only knows to shell of the man that I once married and I know that deep in down inside he still is and hopefully in his own time when he's fixed will come out again .. And then he will want nothing to do with that woman .

 His father (who also went through a midlife crises and went through and reconnected with his wife) said once to her (his wife) :" I feel sorry for this other woman because I promised her a future and even to marry her ( she was on her second marriage ) , told her I loved her .. But I never did ..  I only used her for my selfish ego .."

 That combined with the knowledge that I have gained within the last couple of months and everything I read about the other woman, makes me like I said look at it a little bit more from a different perspective.. And distance ..

 And I know that two broken people (unhappy people) cannot be happy at all - it just doesn't work !  They are not able to fix themselves (at the certain stage in the crisis) , nevertheless each other ..

 So I think you for that observation and post.  I think it really helps those people who really still have their doubts, that the other life with the other person is truly really better as they say (MLC) and feel awful about what they have contributed to their marriage ..
 Knowing that it is not us or our marriage at all, but the other spouse who has the crises makes things so much easier !

 And the comfort is in knowing that in time ,whenever that will be, we will get our apology and the acknowledgment from them (MLC) themselves that it was never us in the first place ..

But all the all the hurt we had to go through of course we still remember ...but from it we come out a better and stronger person ..  That I am thankful for ..

[lawprofessor]

Hi all,

I never bothered with the OW too much in my situation.  She didn't have anything on me.  How could she when she is just a child basically? 

Student of his
Early 20's while he was late 40's at the time
No career but did work at Forever 21 for a while
No body curves.  In fact she is built like a preadolescent.  No hips, no chest.
She wears these clothes she bought in the children's section of the store.
She wore her hair in pig tails.
She just looks so young.  When he posted the one and only picture of her and him standing next to each other, a few of our business colleagues commented that they did not know he had a daughter and asked when she would be graduating from high school.
Lived with her parents until they rented a small apartment for her on campus.
Documented history of suicide attempts.
Documented history of depression when boyfriends left her.
Documented history of stalking them after relationship is over.
Documented history of having "fantasies" and obsessions
So immature-her facebook likes included spongebob and hello kitty.  She proudly declared she could speak two languages American English and British English.  In the circles we are involved in, most speak several languages.  I speak German, Russian, Arabic and Persian for example. Ex speaks French, Russian and German.

This little girl was of no interest to me.

When ex asked me if I was jealous of her, I replied, You must be kidding.  She is not important to me."  He sat there speechless.  Then he said, "Well, she must matter to someone."  I shrugged.  He then said, "Yes, yes she matters because she is a human being." 

Sound like true love?

She wasn't paying me rent for head space so I gave her no head space.  Mostly it turned in to a big joke.

When I went to the other house to get my things, I noticed he had a hickie.  I burst out laughing.  He asked what I was laughing about and I told him.  He was so proud of himself for the hickie.  He said, "well there was some nibbling going on."  I laughed and told him it looked ridiculous.  He said, some day you can have one too.  I replied, not as long as I date men not boys. 

I could fill pages with examples of her immaturity, victim playing, fantasy etc. 

Lets see:

There have been more than 3 suicide attempts that I know the first year all coinciding with him spending time with me.
She failed out of grad school because she "couldn't bear to be away from him."  When she returned home, he refused to allow her to move in with him. 
She pretended to have been given a sexually transmitted disease by her abusive ex boyfriend.  Way to make a man want you baby!
She spent more time on my facebook than I did.  She copied all my "likes" and added them to hers.  She started contacting my friends to see if they wanted to be friends with her.  She threatened to "beat me up."  I got a haircut.  She got a haircut.  I began teaching yoga.  She began taking yoga.  I posted a joke.  She posted a joke.  I posted pictures of me and my dogs.  She posted pictures of her with her parents dogs.  It got so funny a friend of mine posted pictures of me with Elvis.  She then posted a song by Elvis. 

Bottom line-a real affair down. 

She wasn't of much interest to me until later and only in relation to the stages and patterns of MLC.

Best, LP