[stayed]

However, I've then been accused of being judgemental.  So I'm confused about my reactions and my strong stance that he not be invited or welcome with OW in tow.  Am I doing the right thing and what is healthy for the kids??  ie to Have mum and dad together at their party or to keep the door shut to H while he behaves this way.  And what after the divorce is final?  Does that make it different?

You are not being judgmental in the least.  So much for faith based organizations, I would have expected them of all places would have been the MOST CRITICAL of what your h is doing.  Shows what I know!!

As for once you are divorced... your h is then free to date whomever he wishes, as are you.  Go wherever he wants, as are you.  For now, he is still married to you, doesn't seem right to be flaunting his latest infidelity.  Uggggggggs.

hugs Stayed

[OldPilot]

Thanks OP
I wasn't confused about his non-action at the party. but more along the latter part of your post.

I do not want to let the kids think it's ok to have an OW.  I've been very outspoken on this.  It upsets me how he and OW are invited out with the children and that MIL has not met OW also but still wanted to be friends with me.  I feel as if they condone or enable him to continue in this wrong behaviour.
However, I've then been accused of being judgemental.  So I'm confused about my reactions and my strong stance that he not be invited or welcome with OW in tow.  Am I doing the right thing and what is healthy for the kids??  ie to Have mum and dad together at their party or to keep the door shut to H while he behaves this way.  And what after the divorce is final?  Does that make it different?

After the divorce or now it is not your job to enable the relationship between his kids and himself.
So I guess I would take the stance of doing no harm.
It is not your job to help him.
Let him help himself, if he cant that is not your problem.
If your kids need help you will give it to them.
But I do not see why we must do something we are not asked to do.

[DCD]

I have a question and i do apologize if it's already been discussed somewhere - i haven't been able to find anything really that answers my question...maybe there really is no answer.

i am curious as to WHY they lie about things that are known and established.  for instance, why lie, downplay, deny strong feelings about and for their "committed relationship" when it is a well-known fact that they are together? why go away for a weekend and deny that it is with the "girlfriend"? even going so far as offering out that information without even being asked?  i guess right now my question in my situation is why is he mentioning a vacation that he may or may not go away on...and then follow up again with "i haven't decided if i'm even going but if i do it'll be between this time and this time, but i'm not sure if i'm even going" and meanwhile on his "friend"s" FB, she has the countdown going on.  he did this last year, as well, stating he would most likely not be going but then later said he had to go "because of financial commitments". 

why? do they get off on this type of behaviour? is it a type of gaslighting? is it meant to pull our chains? do they honestly believe as they are saying it that it's the truth or what they want to be the truth.  why don't they just not say anything at all or even better, tell the truth (heheheh...i joke, of course!)  I honestly don't get it.  i really am better able to let this crap go and "believe none of what they say and 50% of what they do" but literally, within 12 hours, after he hadn't yet decided if he was going away, she posted her countdown...so very likely booked at this point and now "a financial commitment"  any insight would be welcome and then maybe i can devote my headspace to something way more important, like contemplating my navel or counting the holes in the acoustic ceiling.  thank you!.

[stayed]

Different-colored days, I actually think it is a type of gaslighting, but honestly I really don't know.  I have a son who is a compulsive liar.  I will stupidly ask him a simple question and as soon as he opens his mouth I can tell I am going to get an honest or a dishonest response... if it's a lie, I instantly say... "I retract that question, forget...".  He always looks so hurt.  He will even try to say, "no honestly Mom"!  I usually cover my ears and do the la la thing. 

When my h was in crisis, it took me the longest time to realize he had become our oldest son.  I have often wondered if it wasn't perhaps a genetic thing, perhaps my h always was a liar, but stopped doing it for while, then went into crisis and returned to his NORMAL state.  I just don't know. 

You did it now girl, cause you know I gotta say my favourite joke.

Q:  How can you tell your partner is lying?

A:  His/her lips are moving!  hehehehe 

It really is the craziest thing EVER.. isn't it?  Bat$$h!te Crazy my friend... they are Bat$hit Crazy!!! 

hugs Stayed

[DancingInTheRain]

Newbie here so don't take this as fact...

My IC explained to me that they lie because if they tell the truth then they have to accept that they are the person that they never wanted to be. IF they admit their truths, then they have to "own" them, and they aren't willing or able to take responsibility for the betrayal and destruction that they are causing.

I'm not sure if that makes sense or not, but I hope it adds a new perspective to things.

[kikki]

Newbie here so don't take this as fact...

My IC explained to me that they lie because if they tell the truth then they have to accept that they are the person that they never wanted to be. IF they admit their truths, then they have to "own" them, and they aren't willing or able to take responsibility for the betrayal and destruction that they are causing.

I'm not sure if that makes sense or not, but I hope it adds a new perspective to things.

Hi jraff
Yes, makes a lot of sense, thanks for sharing that.

[DCD]

Stayed  that was a real groaner but I'm smiling, nonetheless! Better than cryin' 'cause it's SO TRUE!!!

Husband was honest but just not much of a communicator so, interestingly enough, a lot of his deception are "lies by omission". Big surprise, huh?  But he now seems to really have a knack for the verbal variety. It's really very gross.

Jhraff - I honestly believe one of my husband's biggest fears is that people won't see him as a good guy. What you said makes complete sense - I'm truly baffled by his thought processes. He really is so messed up.  Guilt drives a lot of what he does. In fact, I can tell when he's about to do something or has just done something by his behaviour and acts of service. Hugs and physical closeness comes before, as does little jobs around the place, extra cash "just because"...and so on.  After he pulls the boner, he disappears for a bit then returns like nothing happened, but a little nervous and quick to please.  He obviously twists himself up in knots, but clearly not enough to stop the deceit.  He continues to try and balance two lives, but to what end?  Even he doesn't know, I'm certain. He's had his moments of clarity but then somehow finds the "oomph" and back in the fog he goes.

Thank you for your thoughts!

[stayed]

jhraff, interesting.  One of the final hurtles we had was getting my h to even THINK ABOUT WHAT HE had done.  I remember him screaming at me... "don't want to remember!"  Eventually, he cried, "I can't believe I was that man!" 

He tried everything within his power to BLOCK this out.  It was me finally telling him," you can't do that hubby because I CAN NEVER FORGET THIS and if I have to live with it... they you are going to have to as well!"  He was obviously ready to hear that, because as I was crawling into bed that night... (this was a good 18 months into reconnection/reconciliation), he grabbed my hand and said, "I am so sorry Stayed!!!" 

He still says it every once in a while. Not when we have a dispute, usually after we have had a wonderful time/occasion/event.  I guess when we have a really, really good time together, that is when he is most AWARE of what he would have missed out on, if he had not come out of his crisis. 

I wish they all would come out of it.   

hugs Stayed   

[willitgetbetter]

Thank you so much Just Asking. You have given me so much to think about. So inspiring to see "veterans" who have gotten to where you are and not forgotten those of us behind you. I hope I can do the same for others one day. I know once you get to a certain point and there is no longer a strong mutual need for support, hearing about our sitches and how we handle them may seem a bit off. But emotions are complex and we were all hit with a ton of bricks for the first time. You, Sassy, Bon and Hyperglad's patience and guidance has helped me greatly and are priceless to me and I look up to you all. I will always remember and appreciate you all. Thanks again. 

[Niek]

Just a question. After BD, when H starts the affair with OW which he just met he became completely psychic and manic which lasted for more than one year. In the meantime he became Monster as well. How is that possible. Is it the OW fueling that kind of behavior. I guess she is a borderliner cause everything about this kind of personality I read in the articles from RCR I can relate to her. Besides that I once saw she texted him things like: 'OOOOOh please tell me this will last for ever'  and things like that. And I can tell that he after BD had all the traits from a borderliner as well.

Anyone experienced this?