[underpressure]

I'd like to start a discussion specifically about behaviors of the OW, what she did concerning your children.

Did she ever try to approach them even if you had told your husband there would be no contact between her and the kids while he was with them?

Did she try to turn your H against his child/children?

For instance: Did she try to keep him from making plans with his kids, or from enjoying family time (calling/texting specifically during family time).

DId she ever succeed?

Did she hurt your children directly?

Early in the affair or later?

Is there any way I can stop my children from being around OW, for instance, by proving she has BPD or a history of destroying marriages?

And what do you think drives her to do destructive things toward your children? Or does she feel motivated to take them over and turn them against their mother?

[Doc Hudson]

My guess?  She doesn't want anything to do with your kids.

[underpressure]

Thanks for your support, Doc.

[dbpb]

When my ex and I divorced, many years ago, my youngest child was 13, my other kids were in their late teens. In the beginning, my daughter was not around ex that much, but when she spent a day  with him, he always included OW. He said it wasn't fair to leave her home alone while he spent time with his child!!

The OW never had children of her own, by choice, I've been told. During my daughter's high school years, if my ex gave her any spending money, he always told her not to mention it to the OW, as it would make her mad.

My oldest son was diagnosed with schizophrenia approx 5 yrs ago, but has always had problems. The OW does not like him, has no interest in learning about his illness. He comes to my house on Friday nights and goes back to his own place on Saturday morning. He has never in all these years been allowed to stay overnight at their house, but it is not a problem with the other kids if they are in town. He has never spent one holiday there, he is always with me.  Ex lives within 3 miles of me.

OW seems to run the show, and he seems to like it that way. He is retired career military and has no trouble speaking his mind, except to her. In the beginning of this, I think he liked it that way because he could blame her and he wouldn't look like the bad one. He wanted his freedom from parental responsiblities as much as possible. The last couple of years there has been some movement into him trying to establish more of a relationship with all the kids.

For what it is worth, none of my kids particularly like this woman, but are respectful because of their dad.

[plibbs02]

UnderPressure, as someone who lives in a no-fault state and in this country at least, there is very little you can do about OW unless there is legally-proven/documented proof of damaging or harmful behavior. Just because we think the alientator is an affair down, an idiot, a person of low morals, etc. does not mean a court will stop him/her from being present in your child(ren) life/lives. You cannot control anyone, least of all an adult who has rights too.

I am eight month post bomb drop but in years of MLC affects. You will see in my posts that our very young daughter first met the alienator only six weeks after H moved out and bomd dropped. We were covering up why daddy wasn’t home by saying he was always busy at work. Imagine then a then 3-year old going to a hotel and spending the night with her father and daddy’s new special friend. They have been to our first time ice-skating, swimming, outings to the mall and other places. D4 knows daddy lives with the alienator and goes to their home on their weekend day visits…notice I said “weekend day.” Early on, about four months after BD H wanted to try the overnight hotel stay again, and I put an end to it. I changed the locks, left for the weekend and said “your plans are off the table!” I was taken to court that Monday. His court order states many things including “no unrelated females during his parenting time;” and “no overnights” for him, HIS court order. I have been taken to court several times, he filed D, all because I choose to protect our child from his fantasy of creating a new family with his great new love. MLCers (and alienators) forget the fairytales that stepmothers don’t fare well and the stepchildren suffer at their hands during the turmoil. The message in all of the fairytales is always the same…no woman can truly love the child of another.

Your child will know it. Your child knows who is mommy and daddy. They may be tempted with toys, going out to fun places, and leniacy in their household but when push comes to shove children go to their parents;. At some point the OWs façade will drop around H and the kid(s). Keep giving your child consistency and structure and they will thrive. The OW will be just be a playmate for a while and that’s it. Trust me it does hurt and infuriate me that ANY other woman means anything to my child but I have to let it go because I live in society of laws. I can’t make her go away or banish her to an island with the other Misfit OWs (Toys.) I want to run away with my child all the time (and have the means to do so) but I don’t because I am standing, I have a life that is my own with or without H, and what would I be teaching our D4 anyway (and I don’t want to be a fugative.)
Yes, the OW wants to push you, the mother, out of the picture. She is insecure and needs validation from our pathetic MLC spouses. You are competition and will always be. You are the creator of the most prized entity the MLC has…your child. If OW does try to physically harm your child you must document and report it to your attorney and possibly child protective services immediately. Until you start using the law to your advantage there is nothing you can do.

My H always involves the alienator as much as possible thinking he is hiding it,  and even when she is not directly there he is constantly allowing text messages to come through and repsonds to them during his parenting time. Our D4 already feels like a third wheel in his MLC life. She spends time with her father because she misses him and loves him but she is competing for his attention and sadly she knows it. That is what the Judge tried to caution my H about and he didn’t hear that message one bit.

[Moving Forward]

I have a very simple view on kids being introduced to the OW/OM in that we cannot control when/if it happens and we are wrong to try. Unless the child/children is in real danger of abuse or harm by this person then it isn't something we can control.

I see time and time again that children are used as a weapon against the 'walk away parent' in the name of the child's/children's best interests by LBS's who don't want the child to meet the OW/OM. This desire often comes from a place of fear - fear that the child will replace them with the alienator or will grow to love them or have fun etc.

When a spouse is in MLC they do not listen to reason or even follow through on agreed actions. Even when one parent (often the LBS) is trying to parent appropriately we are still faced with an MLCer who works on emotions and a huge sense of entitlement. They get what they want via fair means or foul.

I believe then only thing we can do is endeavour to influence the timings of such events and demonstrate pro-actively to our children that we are 'ok' with the situation and that they should go and have fun and enjoy the time with their Dad/Mum. We need to let go of the outcome and be the better option. We then need to be the rock the kids return to with their thoughts and feelings and emotions and be able to allow them to be expressed freely and without judgement. Meeting a new 'significant other' in a parents life is a huge step for children of any age and often it comes at a time when they handling lots of other change too. Kids need one 'sane' parent they can trust to put their interests first.

As kids get older they will be able to make their own minds up as to whether they meet or continue to have contact with the OW/OM in their 'walk away parents' life......time does its thing.

Just my 2 cents

[underpressure]

Moving Forward:

Quick question: What if the affair started only 6 weeks ago? Shouldn't one try to protect one's child? If the affair may just burn itself out very quickly, shouldn't we take precautions to expose a very young child to the OW?

(btw, I am talking specifically about the OTHER WOMAN here, not an Other Man. That's a whole other dynamic, I am sure.)

The OW is an affair down, but also more often than not has borderline personality issues, and can be dangerous. I am trying to anticipate how she might be dangerous in a very early but very fast moving situation, where, say, the OW has threatened the H and is forcing him to stop spending time with his family.

[Moving Forward]

I have to say UP, 6 weeks or 6 years doesn't really make any difference - the MLCer will do what the MLCer wants to do. Plus it is down to the MLCer to have the relationship with his/her child and to make it work (or not) and deal with the fallout. The MLCer's future could see them hooking up with lots of people over the years.....we just don't know right now.

As an adult the children caught up in these situations will see the WAP (Walk Away parent) for what they are as long as they have one anchor in this sea of madness. I am reading a book about the impact of divorce on children and the now adults say they see the WAP for what they are and that the volume or wives/girlfriends/husband etc made very little difference - the children of divorce have to align keeping secrets and new houserules and new people in each of their parents lives - not just girl/boyfriends. It is the ones who had a secure relationship with at least one of their parents and had a safe place to vent/be heard etc that have fared best into adulthood - although it has to be said it is the best of a bad situation rather than what is actually what is best .....but that is a whole different conversation!!

Keep your focus on your son, you and your healing and having sensible boundaries which keep your son emotionally protected, and growing would be my advice.

[justasking]

UP

I also think the age of the child matters. At 5 your S needs you to set the boundaries and keep him safe. Small children rely on adults to keep control and maintain their safety.

As older children/teenagers they have more control and are able to set their own boundaries and expectations plus know when situations are not positive for them.

xx

[toughtimes]

I am in a similar situation with young kids S7 and D2. I am scared about the day he will introduce OW, petrified in fact. He said in one of his discussions when he first moved out that "neither of us should introduce new partners to kids without the others approval and that we should set a timeaybe a year of being together before introducing." I was absolutely dumbstruck, this was utterly alien concept for me at time (I hadn't found out about his affair at this point so he had given this a lot of thought!).
I know we have to follow laws and can't control what our H or W do when they have kids but I believe as main carer and grown up I am going to step up and try and make sure the children introduced at an appropriate and sensible time (aaaaargh I hate the thought!). I feel that this man I married who was such a dedicated dad has just totally neglected the kids and their needs. Every single time he sees them he had presents for them or buys them stuff (and this is the guy who says he can't afford his own flat). I can see this is guilt but it's the thing my son is interested in when he sees his dad. Very very sad to watch. We just have to step up and try and be the constant and loving carer. Aaaaargh I'm so angry at what this is doing and going to do to them, so unbelievably angry.
Don't know if my perspective is any help, I am so new to all this so not really offering advice just my feelings and experience!