[Thundarr]

AnneJ,

Ironically, as I just said on my thread it seems that those who adopt the mindset you seem to have are the ones who truly survive this.  I don't think I'm cut out for it, though.  Things would be so different if our spouses had died as we would still be able to hold onto the beliefs that we had about marriage.  Now, given everything that's happened and what I have seen here and elsewhere, I don't know if I'll ever believe in marriage again.  It seems like most of the world doesn't anymore.  So, if you call realizing that moving on is not an option standing then I guess I do as I know it's better for the kids than this Hell they're being put through for no good reason whatsoever.

[Anjae]

Thundarr, why do you think that those who adopt the mind set I have adopted are the ones who survive? Here in the board we have people who never divorced, their MLCer had an alienator and reconciled. There are also divorced LBS who are willing to wait for their MLCer.

I believe in marriage, Thundarr. Always have, always will. That is why I don’t think it is healthy to remain married to a cruel MLCer. Let alone one like mine, who undermines and drags any chance of divorce. By doing that he is, in fact, undermining any chances of reconciliation. Probably, in his MLC mind that is not how he sees things…

Even in the most normal (nom MLC), amicable and nice divorce on earth I think a year is the minimum for a person to wait until moving on/forward/considering having someone else in our lives. If it is a MLC situation we need more than one year to seriously consider certain things.

True, things would be very different if our spouses had died and we could still hold to our beliefs in marriage. But one of the many things MLC does is to challenge and shake our beliefs regarding marriage and what marriage is.

[Thundarr]

Anne,  I wasn't counting the ones who reconcile with their MLCer and I still hope to be in that elite group one of these days.  My comment was for the ones whose MLCer IS gone for good.  It seems to me that the only way in those cases to reach true healing is to eliminate all feelings for the MLCer and "dump" them in your heart, completely destroying any chance of R in doing so.  I will be torn either way I go, on one hand choosing moving on and leaving all semblance of the family behind or standing from now on and slowly dying. 

[Anjae]

Thanks for the clarification, T. I’m not sure mine is gone for good… with an MLCer we never know. But the crisis has been going on for too long. More a case of changing your feelings towards the MLCer than eliminate them. From spouse/life companion feelings to neutral or friendly, but detached, feelings. Also, at a point we do realise we will absolutely fine if they don’t return. And, sometimes, we have moved in another direction, found/discovered new things. No room from who your MLCer was before the crisis (and, of course, they may also not have room for who we were before their crisis) and it is a little useless to think in trying to fit a new improved version of them into your current self and life. If, someday, they happen to cross your way and there is an interest, fine. If not, also fine.

[Trustandlove]

As another who has been in this for a long, long time, yes, i do think about this often.  For a long time the idea of "standing" was in order to repair my marriage, to have my H back with us.  That's slowly evolved; along the way I've looked a lot at life and my family and what is important. 

Standing, if that's the word, means really thinking it through.  My r with my children is probably closer as a result of all this; we really do talk about deep issues, rather than just live on the surface.  I know that just living on the surface isn't an option for me any more, if it ever was.    I also know that right now I need to be focusing on what the children and I need as a family, rather than just on my own personal needs.  And that, too, will evolve over time.   That is what I am standing for.  And yes, I very much would want H to be a part of that, but that isn't within my control. 

Yes, life is forever changed because of H's MLC; but then there are other things which forever change life as well.  Having special needs kids forever changed life for me already; it took me years and years to fully integrate that, why should this be any different? 

I've been spending a lot of time this week with a friend who lost a baby, at the point in pregnancy when it was already a baby, so she had to give birth and say her goodbyes the same day.  And then live with a body that was already prepared to feed an infant.  That has forever changed her perspective and her life.    Something, like this MLC for me, over which she has no control.

I look at my H and see that he really hasn't got much further, and yes, I had very much hoped that he would have done so by now.  But there can't be a firm timeline.  Nor is there a firm timeline for me, it really is about living one day at a time and doing what needs to be done now.

In a sense I am surprised at myself, I always thought of myself as a "kick-em-to-the-curb" kind of person....  so standing has taught me a lot.  I like myself better now. 

I think of the Stockdale paradox often, it really is very relevant. 

[B]

Not sure if I am too new to be here but here goes. 

I stand because I meant my vows, because my H, not the MLC loon, deserves my loyalty.  Because we've shared so much and almost 18 years simply can't be erased even if he and OW2 think it can.  I stand because I do honestly think he's lost, I think he's in pain, and because I was taught to never quit or give up on someone you love.

As long as I'm married I will not become involved emotionally or sexually with another.  Until we D I will not give up on my marriage.  My biggest fear is that when we D I will at last be done.  I worry that is letting him down.  Totally insane I know, but my H was worth such loyalty. 

I recognise much of my feelings about him are related to control.  But I also recognise what will be will be. 

[LearningIamOk]

Initially, I Stood to get back the M. Now I Stand to get me back. I have stated on more than one thread that I feel Standing is a grace period, a resting place where no decisions have to be made. You can just be. I Stand to heal myself as I watch my personal Turtle, Condo Carl, and wonder will he ever start to move? I am just glad that Standing has taught me to be less reactive and more responsive. It has also alleviated a lot of my guilt that I should be doing "something" to fix this.

[stayed]

Initially, I Stood to get back the M. Now I Stand to get me back.

I like this... a lot!  This says all that needs to be said!

hugs Stayed

[LearningIamOk]

Thanks Stayed, 

[wondering]

I agree Learning.  Standing is for us, while it's the one thing that leaves the door open to reconnecting with our spouses, it is so more about learning to cope, to heal, to gain strength to, in the end, make the best decision for us.