[Synicca]

LOL!!!! ya, Pretty much!!  ha ha ha

[Anjae]

No. After he left, some five years ago, he wanted me to go to his bithday party. OW1 would be there as well. I said I would not go. He also wanted to come to my birthday party, alone. At first I thought, well, why not? He is being nice lately. But I end up thinking it would not be a good ideia.

Six months after BD I have move back to our home town, he remained in capital city. He used to come to our town for christmas, did not do so last years, but we never saw each other. We have not seen each other since may 2008. And, after he filled, the first time, for a fault divorce against me, I have even stoped text him happy birthday, merry christmas or happy new year.

[Trustandlove]

Well, I've had lots of years of this....

I guess the summary is that yes, he does get invited to participate, more or less.   Slightly depends on what.

As he has never acknowledged my birthday since he left, I haven't asked him to celebrate.  I have so far always, or almost always (it's been so long that it's getting hazy...) acknowledged his, at first with a present as it seemed appropriate given where we were at the time, this year just saying happy birthday when he came to do kid driving that day.

The first 2 years he asked to have Christmas with us, I said yes.  Last 2 years he hasn't been here, once because he wanted to go see his mother, last year I did invite him and he didn't reply and didn't show up; I heard through a friend that he "would have found it too hard".   Those first 2 years we exchanged presents, not the last 2. 

He has always been welcome for kids' birthday; this year we had a "family party", with us and the godparents.  He cooked a lot of the food for it and stayed for most of the day.  Other years he hasn't attended kids' "kid" parties, but has come on the day to participate in our morning ritual (can't remember if he's done it every year, but most). 

So a very mixed bag....  trying to stay flexible on the tightrope.

x

[LifeGoesOn]

Hey T&L, You have been on my mind the past few days. Hope all is well....


this is the trick:
"So a very mixed bag....  trying to stay flexible on the tightrope."

You may not want Monster at your happy event. Or a surly teen that spends the whole time texting in a corner can put a damper on things. Sometimes you don't know what you will get, but often you catch a vibe. Consider if your family can roll with rude and/or 'life of the party' behaviors, and/or if their presence is comforting no matter what.

For example, Christmas 08, our first in crisis, I did not include H in any celebration. Not the a.m. Santa activities or dinner at my mom's. I did ask him to join us at the movies in the evening. This worked out great b/c the kids got to see him, without any pressure or awkwardness. (BTW, he literally clung to my arm throughout the movie and there was only 1 trip to the bathroom. )

This last May, I felt I had to insist he attend DS's graduation and dinner. H sat at the table and pouted, went to the bathroom over 6 times, refused to order anything, OW was clearly upset he was there and b/c of the drama, he was punishing us. Put a HUGE damper on the celebration. Wish I had let him go with the 'I have to work' excuse...

[stayingthecourse]

This is an issue I have been thinking about recently.

Last year Thanksgiving and Christmas were a few months after BD.  My birthday and our anniversary were about three weeks after BD.  My H was invited for Thanksgiving and Christmas and he did come.  He actually shopped for gifts for the kids all by himself - something he had never done before.

This year, I really don't want to be around him.  It is not that I am being spiteful, but the reality is he walked away from us, and therefor, our holiday celebrations.  If the kids want to invite him they can but I will ask that they have a celebration that is separate for ours.

Maybe, I have detached to much?

[Affaircare]

Nope stayingthecourse, I think you're doing just fine. 

I personally think that celebrations like Holidays, Birthday etc. should be up to the individual doing the celebrating taking reality into account.  For example, it is not really "realistic" to have a spouse living in another home, in bed with another person, not contributing financially or spiritually or emotionally or anything to the family...and have them come to Christmas because they don't want to do a tree of their own.  They left.  That's reality.  If they want to deny reality they are free to do so, but they are not free to drag everyone else into their delusion! 

So for those holidays I suggest "What do you feel up to doing?" and "What is the right thing to do?"  Do you *want* to have them there?  Then ask them!  Do you want to have your own, private celebration?  Then do not invite them or turn them down if they try to invite themselves.   "NO" is a legitimate response and you don't need to explain.  Likewise it is reasonable and legitimate that if they make the choice to leave their responsibilities, they also leave the "benefits" like shared family celebrations.

In a summary, what I'm saying is that for the sake of reality, it may be misleading to yourself or the kids to continue to pretend or act like you two are together.  On the other hand, if the kids are happy and your MLCer is able to curb the Monster and you feel up to it...WHY NOT?  This *IS* their real family and it just may remind them that life with you and the kids is happy and fun.  There is no definitive answer, and yet it's always helpful to think of "doing the right thing" even when it's hard.  It may be more right to tell them "no" and let them experience what leaving means!  Or is may be more right to offer a hand of graciousness and demonstrate that family = happiness too. 

[Thundarr]

LGO - I think you did right to insist he come to the graduation as it is a once in lifetime thing, the dinner I don't know about.

AC - I agree about it being to your comfort level, but I think one really has to take into account first what is most important to the kids.  I hate to even think about my W and their mother not being here Christmas morning this year to share with them what Santa has brought them.  I also hate to think of Christmas shopping alone as that was always special to us.  I don't know how we're going to decide who buys what, and I'm not ready for the kids to have to be split at Christmas.  They already have 3 Christmases as we do one at my mom's and at her parents' as well, so adding another would screw things up royally.  Also, they live HERE so that should be where their primary Christmas is at.  Thanksgiving is another holiday that I can't imagine my W sharing in our traditional night-before dinner.  That one I can live with as she will be missing out on something that was always special to her that I think the kids will get over.

[Affaircare]

Thundarr~

You make a good point--thinking of the kids.  At this time your wife has not definitely left, filed, and divorce is eminent so there is no reasonable reason to have your kids learn that mom made the choice to ditch us and our family holidays.  However, it is reality (painful reality) that she in fact HAS chosen to leave your family holidays.  So in an instance like yours maybe it would be reasonable to say "I'm choosing to continue our holidays as we traditionally did them when you lived here.  If you want to join the kids and I, we would like that.  If you do not want to join us, that is your choice to make."  Make sense?  In other words YOU may be hurt about "their mother not being here Christmas morning this year to share with them what Santa has brought them" but in reality that is what she has chosen to do!   Then it's up to her to figure out how or when she would do it, given that SHE chose to leave and SHE chose to add yet another monkey wrench into the works. 

Does that make sense?  Sometimes holidays can be a real eye-opener.  Celebrating with the family CAN be fun and happy--maybe it's not all bad "at home."  The cost of my choices is that I don't have Christmas with my kids--maybe it's not all good "away from home."  See what I mean? 

[kikki]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts.

it has helped clarify things for me.  H has been gone 15mths.  Lives with OW.  Despite threats whenever I tell him he cannot see me, he has not followed through with any legal action at all.  We still own property and our company together.

I think because of the above (despite the OW), and because of the kids, I will invite him here again this Christmas.  We also have two kids birthdays in November, and will also invite him to join us should he choose. 
He was with us last Christmas (his suggestion) and it ended up being a disaster with Monster spew.  I asked him to leave - it was hideous!  I went as dark on him as possible for weeks after that.  (as dark as you can go with a business and kids together).

He has come a long way since then, and we haven't seen Monster spew for many months.  I doubt that, even in this state, he'd allow that to happen again. 
How he would explain Christmas with us (if that is what he chooses) to the OW will be his problem to solve, or not.
The kids have already said that there is no way they are going to his place on Christmas, and having the day broken up.

To complicate things slightly - my siblings are organising a large gathering (they all live in another part of the country) and of course would love us to join them.  Part of me would love to be there, but another part would feel sorry for my H (yeah - I need my head read!!)
I guess I would also officially need his agreement to take the boys, and I'm not sure that he would give it. 
Hmmm .....  My family thinks I am nuts to even ask him - thinking what rights does a man who bails have to his kids?  As he continues to pay for them, I think he probably does.  Tricky!

He wasn't invited to join in on my birthday this year, although I could tell he was hoping I'd ask (I didn't).  He did help the boys buy presents for me, and sent me a txt on the day with a large X on the end.  Plus, made some excuse to phone me on the day (unrelated to my birthday).   

He also asked to join us at New Year.  I said no to that one - we had a bunch of friends coming over, and it wouldn't have been appropriate. 
He also asked if he could join us for Easter dinner.  I agreed to that one too.  He was 'beautifully behaved'. I have no idea why these days are so important to him?
What about the other 360 something?

[kikki]

Bumping this up for those new to the forum. 
For the past two years my H has been invited to join us here for Christmas and the boys' Birthdays.

This year, because he is once again pursuing legal action and vacillating between life number one and life number two, I have recently set a boundary where he is no longer allowed in our home.  He will now have to make his own arrangements for Christmas and Birthdays.

It makes me sad as I know it most likely means the days will now be split up for the boys, and that I will be on my own for part of Christmas day, but that is the reality of the situation and a consequence of the choices that he continues to make. 
I'll handle this far more easily than I would have in the years prior though, and will plan something nice for myself, or possibly join friends as my family all live so far away.