[Picton]

Hi Stayed - I will do some research and get back to you.  A lot of the Maori designs have a "meaning" to them so will see if I can find something appropriate. Maori tattoos were historically for warriors - I think all LBS, especially those who choose to stand need to be a bit of a warrior who kia kaha.
I will be in touch soon.

Kia kaha (stay strong)

[stayed]

Kia Kaha to you as well.  Thanks.

Hugs Stayed

[Thunder]

HeartTattoo-How could you say our M is over when there was no discussion that our M had "problems"?  How come I don't get any say in this?  How can you be throwing away this (10, 20, 40 year) M without even an attempt to "fix" what you think is wrong with it?

Mine told me after BD he was feeling unhappy and was giving it 3 weeks to see if I changed.  Of course he didn't let me in on his thoughts.  I was somehow just supposed to know he wanted me to change because he was unhappy.
 

Then they wonder why we were so shocked.   Guess we were supposed to be mind readers.

[bipolared]

A year later and I am still in disbelief, I still don't understand what happened. Or how it went from I am unhappy, it is me, to it is all your fault because you wouldn't change. I think on BD was the closest to the truth I will ever have, we lost the spark, life is mundane, same thing day in day out. OK so you were bored, so instead of talking to me, and US trying to work it out, YOU decided to have an affair and leave your family and the only person who has stood by you for 28 years for some chick, 16 years younger, who you lied about for a year. This is the man I believed was honorable, truthful, faithful, loyal. I had utter and complete trust in him, I felt loved and safe. Funny, now he says I was arrogant. Arrogant in believing my Husband, believing in my marriage? The stuff they come up with truly defies logic. The only choice we have is to let go or be dragged down with them.

Yes!  I didn't get exactly what you got but I think I got more truths in those first few weeks than lately, and I am still disbelieving sometimes.  He even conceded early on that it might be midlife crisis but denied it later.  Everyone else was in disbelief as well.  D18 walked in on him kissing me and grabbing my butt the morning of BD and I remember D14 talking about her friends' parents "fighting like they might get divorced but that would never happen to us".  That broke my heart as it came when I was agonizing about soon telling them what was going on.  I had a few friends saying that the kids would be so much better, that they knew when something was wrong and would be relieved at no more fighting.  But there was no fighting and the kids had no idea anything was amiss!
I don't think we should be so hard on ourselves about the begging/bargaining, Stayed.  I mean, we are just trying to get them to really THINK about throwing away several years and damaging our children.  And how were we to know about what was really going on when no one acknowledges this terrible mess beyond jokes about sports cars and hair plugs?

[stayed]

So true bipolar!  I think it's hilarious how every single one of us took these people at their word. They told us, WE NEEDED to change... they didn't of course... and all of us JUMPED through hoops trying to make ourselves into the caricature that they said they wanted.   Now that is embarrassing, hehehe!

I have learned to live with my begging, groveling, bargaining early days, hehehe!  I was pretty busy jumping through hoops.  Fixing every flaw my perfect husband deemed was wrong with me. 

Oh well, it is what it is... get healthy, see what happens after that.

Hugs Stayed

[Medusa]

The way I see the begging/groveling and changing ourselves for them is that its a step in changing ourselves for ourselves. We listened to what they thought was wrong with us and were able to go deeper.

[bipolared]

The way I see the begging/groveling and changing ourselves for them is that its a step in changing ourselves for ourselves. We listened to what they thought was wrong with us and were able to go deeper.

That is absolutely correct.  Some of the things he said were things that bothered me as well, and I have made very positive changes for myself.  He has only himself to blame if someone besides me benefits from that.

[blackice]

i agree as well. it may have started with me changing for him, i agreed they were things i needed to work on and they had bothered me too, but it evolved into me bettering me for myself and my kids. it enabled me to survive some of the worst times.

[Thunder]

Medusa,

You are so right on.  The changes I started making for him turned out to be great things for me. 
I guess we can all better ourselves in one way or another.  EVEN these perfect (gag) MCer's.   

[HeartTattoo]

They told us, WE NEEDED to change... they didn't of course... and all of us JUMPED through hoops trying to make ourselves into the caricature that they said they wanted.   

Mine couldn't even come up with anything that was wrong with me.  The things he said were totally absurd (see "$h!te MLCer's say") or were dredged up from 15-20 years earlier.  All that pertained to the present was "We were too comfortable".        This is why shock & disbelief were my major reactions.  I bargained a lot--with God, not with H, he wasn't wavering a bit & we went NC.  But I have never had much anger.  Moments of it maybe, lots of frustration with the impossibility of being able to "do" anything about my H & my M.  Detachment takes awhile to figure out.