[Wildfire]

I have read a few returning stories and the common theme is that the MLCer is so very thankful that their wife was always there for them.  That the option of return was always open. 

MIMIx,

Can you say more about this? I have read that IF MLCers try to reconnect, they typically don't come back showing remorse and spilling out "I'm sorrys." However, I had not heard that they express gratitude.

I ask because when my H asked for the "chance to be in my presence" and meet with me right before Thanksgiving, he said he was at the cemetery of his brother who was hit and killed at the age of 7, and he had really intense thoughts about me, there was white light, and he felt gratitude. He said gratitude wasn't exactly the right word but he really couldn't articulate his experience. I still have no idea what he meant by that. For all I know, he could have just been saying, hey, thanks for the 15 years.

Thanks for starting this discussion, it's really helpful.

WF

[mamaman]

Mimi, I think much of what our discussion is telling us is that we do, indeed, lead the way. However, it is by example. The MLCr seems to be mostly in a teenage mindset. Sometimes they are mature and other times they are childish and rebellious. And ALWAYS they are turned inward. I think our only hope is to catch their eye from time to time for all the right reasons. Like RCR says, grace and agape. Unconditional love.

It's hard! But we have each other for support.

Thanks for posting and generating such beneficial conversation, lady!!

[nah]

Females aren't attracted to weakness (generally speaking).

Isn't this the core reason male MLCers run instead of face their depression?

It's the perception that depression = weakness

Being weak, for a man, takes away what he was always taught to be, a man is supposed to be strong, physically and emotionally.  Big boys don't cry.

So my understanding of paving the way, is to quietly wait for them to come to us, listen instead of throwing their mistakes into their faces.  It might not always seem like it, but I do believe they very much know what they are doing is devastating to all the people in their lives that they promised to love and protect. 

[MyBrainIsBroken]

Isn't this the core reason male MLCers run instead of face their depression?

I think the reason any MLCer runs, male or female, is because they're depressed and they interpret that as being unhappy. And they look outside themselves for happiness instead of inside and so they turn to an OP, partying, drugs, alcohol, race cars, anything that brings them some temporary happiness in order to medicate the depression.

Maybe they turn back towards us when they see that we seem to be happy in spite of the massive pain they know they've caused and that's why leading the way is important.

[MIMIx]

Yes BIB, in my situation, you are right on.

Wildfire, I am quite sure that if my H returns, he will not vocalize his remorse but he will certainly show it with his actions. I have taken the brunt of the storm driven at me.  Many would say "why would you do that?"  But, you do what you feel you need to do.  Almost two years ago now, my H was ready for a fight, wanted a divorce, wanted to get on with being free.  I did not react.  I did not fight with him.  I bought some TIME until he could settle down the part of his brain that was driving him.I have just stood still and managed my way through with determination.  Determination to look after MYSELF.  TIME IS KEY in my mind.  Stay still, don't argue, don't give advice.

So, yesterday, my H called out of the blue and wanted to come spend the day with me.  Funny timing, I was packing up a bunch of his things and putting them away!  I just said 'sure' and he appeared so thankful to be able to come home, if only for the day.  Here is what I learned from yesterday,

H is now VERY unhappy
His new living arrangements are driving him crazy
He is spinning, trying to adapt, trying to force himself to be happy
His new life sounds dreadful  and I'm glad to not be part of it

In the early days, I thought I was the needy one.  But I now think that needy can defined  on a deeper level. I now think my H is the truly needy one. He is royally screwed up! Chronically needy on a deeper level.  He looks to me and others for his happiness.  I think this is the reason for him to have gone searching for greener grass.  From what I saw and heard yesterday, he is finding the grass to be rather BROWN.  Perhaps it is finally starting to sink in.  It is just taking TIME.  TIME IS KEY.

I feel pretty good this morning.  If he makes a decision to not come home, it will all be okay for me.  I realized yesterday that I am in a good place.  And the ironic thing is, the life he seems to be searching for is the life I am presently living...nice and quiet, stable. 

What the h is his problem that he can't see it?  Brains and feelings are weird destructive things. 

Keep going Forum friends.  Live your life with quality.  Give him/her time and space to figure it out.  It seems to take them a long time.  Show them  good quality living, filled with happiness.  If they don't want that, then you should not want them.

[MIMIx]

Wildfire,

I have read a few returning stories and the common theme is that the MLCer is so very thankful that their wife was always there for them.  That the option of return was always open. 

This theme came from stories written by WSs who finally figured themselves out.  What I took away from their words was that a WS needs to FEEL that you will be open to their return without actually appearing to WANT them, or are deperate for their return.  They do now want to feel tricked into coming back to a life that was making them unhappy.  And, I do think there is an approriate time to show them this.  It is NOT in the early days when all they want to do is run away from you.  It is later when they have calmed down and are experiencing disappointments in their new life.  You just have to be patient a quiet...let them run and don't stop them.

It is a very fine line. 

[Wildfire]

Wildfire,

I have read a few returning stories and the common theme is that the MLCer is so very thankful that their wife was always there for them.  That the option of return was always open.

This theme came from stories written by WSs who finally figured themselves out.  What I took away from their words was that a WS needs to FEEL that you will be open to their return without actually appearing to WANT them, or are deperate for their return.  They do now want to feel tricked into coming back to a life that was making them unhappy.  And, I do think there is an approriate time to show them this.  It is NOT in the early days when all they want to do is run away from you.  It is later when they have calmed down and are experiencing disappointments in their new life.  You just have to be patient a quiet...let them run and don't stop them.

It is a very fine line.

Mix,

Thank you very much for answering my question...and answering it so well. This is really helpful information. Yes, I have seen with my own H that if he thinks I am just saying whatever to try to get him back, then he backs away. I have not just said "whatever" to try to get him back, but he is so paranoid. The MLCer as a scared animal is an appropriate metaphor. They don't want to be trapped. They'll run if they fear a trap. They have to approach us on their own and feel safe in doing so. They want to see that they are not coming back to the same spouse, the same situation that they left. If we've done our work, they aren't coming back to the same spouse. In fact, they are coming back to a spouse that has moved forward with his/her life.

You're right, it is a very fine line.

[Neo]

Brain,

This is in a nutshell is a perfect description of the whole MLC process and why they run.

I think the reason any MLCer runs, male or female, is because they're depressed and they interpret that as being unhappy. And they look outside themselves for happiness instead of inside and so they turn to an OP, partying, drugs, alcohol, race cars, anything that brings them some temporary happiness in order to medicate the depression.

MIMIx,

I bought some TIME until he could settle down the part of his brain that was driving him.I have just stood still and managed my way through with determination.  Determination to look after MYSELF.  TIME IS KEY in my mind.  Stay still, don't argue, don't give advice.

This is exactly what I did. I didn't get sucked into the drama. I bought time, by stepping out of the way. I have remained quiet, stable, don't get angry and don't pursue. I am just letting my wife BE. I can't interfere, for this is all about her and her finding out who she is. She is lost and as such, needs to find her self, in her own way. If I was to interfere, I would only hinder the process and cause it to be drawn out, even longer.

We are all born into this world as individuals and as such, we are on our own separate paths, even though we like to think because we are married to them, that we are on the same path. Maybe, but each of us has our own personality, life experiences and issues, which have to be dealt with by ourselves. At any given moment we can be deviated from that shared path and go our separate ways. It doesn't mean that those separate ways will be permanent, but there is a reason that one person can be deviated to another path, that is different from the one that we had been sharing with them.

TIME is the key. Time is to be used by both the LBSer and the MLCer for their own unique purposes. I believe it has been said many times on this forum, that this whole MLC process is a shared event, whether we like it or not. It's a force that can be very destructive or very creative. Look what happens when a volcano erupts, it lays waste to the surrounding countryside, but given TIME, nature has a way of creating a whole new environment out of something that was laid barren.

[Dji76]

I consider leading the way to be livin a good and healthy lifetime yourself and your kids. Lead by example, just like you would with a child. The MLCer is a scared child... Show them you are safe to be around through words, actions and body language. Smile, make eye contact, be quietly confident. The key to all of this for me was letting go of fear. That is when the tables started to turn and I believe w looks at me as the strong one in our situation. You can only lead someone who is willing to follow. The challange for me when opportunities to lead the way do arise is not turning it into pursuing as I try to build her confidence.

[Strongcurrent]

Thanks Mimix for starting this discussion topic.  There have been some great replies , in particular neo and my MBIB.  I have been down lately questioning if H just isn't interested in his wife and kids and just concerned with himself.

Reading the posts has helped me refocus on the process.

Thx SC