[Songanddance]

This is so reassuring - NOT!

My MIL had alzheimers and lasted 17 years from diagnosis at the age of 72 to her death in 89.

H has repeatedly said that he fears that his memory loss is a sign of dementia.  He phoned me two weeks ago asking where he lived as he couldn't remember where the house was.  That was a huge trigger for me as MIL used to do that in her very early stages repeatedly asking me where her two sons were as they hadn't come home for tea.

My own mother had early stage alzheimers and deteriorated very quickly from diagnosis at the age of 64 and died at 66 having lost her ability to speak clearly and to move.

However both women smoked and that is certainly a contributing factor.

There is also evidence that dementia is genetic so now I am through menopause and H is in MLC ....aaargh!!!!

[xyzcf]

I will be obtaining more information about this and will share it here as I obtain it.

This morning, I went to an professional development training on Substance Abuse. I have heard this speaker, Lynn Reimer speak twice before. It was especially interesting as she discussed the impact of legalization of marijuana in Colorado. Not a pretty picture unfortunately.

I was struck by two things. That drug use burns through our dopamine transporters. We only have a finite number of these transporters and drugs use especially when the brain is still developing (at least until age 25) destroys this finite number. People who use drugs in their teen years, after the high wears off, they will not be able to feel happy ever again due to the decreased number of dopamine transporters...they basically will be depressed for the rest of their lives...existing in a state of anehedia- they feel nothing. They learn how to cope without "feelings" and manage to get through life. They will never get these transporters back.

Being a teenager in the 1970's, I know that my husband used lots of drugs and alcohol. Apparently it doesn't require really heavy drug use to destroy these transporters. He was somewhat moody when we first met, and throughout the 35 years together, he never really got very excited about anything...I now believe that he has been depressed all the time I have known him, possibly due to his experimentation with drugs at a time where his adolescent brain was in a critical developmental stage.

The other thing I learned were a few things about addiction. How exhibiting "good behavior" is used as a shield. To show the world that you are fine. With any addiction, it takes over your life. You have no morals, everything you care about goes out the window, you struggle with feeling good and stop caring about everything that matter to you once, you just do not care anymore.

The young women sharing her story of addiction, which by the way started when she was 13 and her parents divorced talked earnestly about how it did not matter what your addiction was to...the end result was the same. Destruction of everything that mattered.

I am a nurse, I do know about the neurotransmitters dopamine and serotonin that make us feel happy. Indeed, antidepressants stimulate the neuroreceptors to produce dopamine and serotonin...but if your brain does not have the transporters, to get these substances across the synapses, then AD's won't work.

A light went off today...not really one that I would have asked for but never the less a very good theory of what may have happened to those of us who have spouses who abused drugs or alcohol in the past.

I am going to contact the speaker and obtain more scientific research results and will post them when I get them...but wanted to share this because it struck me as being absolutely the truth.

[1trouble]

XYZ

I found your post very interesting, I have repeatedly put on my thread about 'Lettinggo', a past LBS having this theory that those MLC'ers that have had previous addiction problems would be more susceptible to the infatuation hormones from the OW, I think she had a point.

My H had a big coke problem years ago, he use to say he knew he had an addictive personality and that's why he stayed away from gambling because he realised he would have a problem if he started.

Also when I hired a private investigator to find out who OW was (after I saw the obsessive phone records and saw someone out side our house), the private investigator told me he had had a midlife crisis and had lost his business, his house, a ton of money and nearly lost his wife, he was also sectioned twice.
The last time he was sectioned the psychiatrist put him on SSRI's, this was the start of his recovery (he is still on them). The psychiatrist put him onto them because of his previous drug use.

He had been a big drug user during the 80's (as was my H) starting of with dope moving onto ecstasy and then onto coke binges (like my H).   Through the work he does now as an investigator he sees, what he believes, are so many cases of MLC and he calls it the "Essex disease" (the area we live in) because being near London it was associated with the Rave scene in the 80's 90's where drugs were rife.

He feels, like him, all these men and woman have damaged their receptors and this exacerbates the crisis. Whilst I've read SSRI's do not work for everyone, I think for those who have had a past like the PI and my H they might, though I note the expert you saw said AD's wont work, but was the lecture mainly about  marijuana?  because that works in a different way to coke.

People who use drugs in their teen years, after the high wears off, they will not be able to feel happy ever again due to the decreased number of dopamine transporters...they basically will be depressed for the rest of their lives...existing in a state of anehedia- they feel nothing.

The more I have read about depression I can now see my H has been battling silently with it for years and though I think he isn't living in a permanent state of severe anehedia I do believe he generally struggles and I do think there have been times when it has been pretty bad.  Sometimes he has articulated how he is feeling but it was cryptic and I didn't know then what I know now..

Its very very sad

[OldPilot]

. It was especially interesting as she discussed the impact of legalization of marijuana in Colorado. Not a pretty picture unfortunately.

So are a lot of young people in COLO addicted to pot?
Interesting findings although I am not sure I have the same results, please let us know.

[Loyal]

xyzcf  & 1trouble, my P has smoked pot regularly as long as I've known him (over 29 years) and thinking about it, he has always been very irritable & moody. What really worries me ist that he recently told me that his now ,not so new bunch of best friends sometimes take coke but he wouldn't dream of taking anything like that as he had tried it a couple of times when he was young and knows how addictive it can be. He has locked himself into his room 4 times for a period of 3-4 days each time since the beginning of December and has always led me to believe that he was sick. The last time this occured was over Easter, he went into his room on Thursay evening and didn't come out until the afternoon of Easter Monday. He kept sniffling and blowing his nose and it was only then that I realised what he'd been up to the times he's said he was sick  . That's one of the things I confronted him about yesterday (see my post), when I just flipped out. It's so sad that he's gotten into such bad company but this crowd of 50+ & mostly divorced male & female "In People" are now his "best friends", and he just loves telling them that I'm the bad one!

[Anjae]

People who use drugs in their teen years, after the high wears off, they will not be able to feel happy ever again due to the decreased number of dopamine transporters...they basically will be depressed for the rest of their lives...existing in a state of anehedia- they feel nothing. They learn how to cope without "feelings" and manage to get through life. They will never get these transporters back.

I don't think this is true. At least not to all recreational drug users. I know several people who have used drugs as teenagers & young adults and they are perfectly fine, happy, healthy adults. I think it may depend of a series of factors: when it started, amount used and for how long, the person in itself, type of drug, etc.

Using marijuana is legal in Portugal. And there has not been any disastrous effect of it. In fact, there has been far less people in jail just because they have smoked a joint. No known increase in usage or in extremes cases. In fact, we are below the European average in drug usage. http://observador.pt/2015/06/04/droga-portugal-da-media-europeia-no-consumo-trafico/ (it is in Portuguese, but Google translator will give a help.  )

As you know, I have done the Drugs and the Brain course by Caltech on Coursera, and I'm slowly doing the The Addicted Brain, also on Coursera.

It is true drugs can damage the brain, but not everyone who uses drugs becomes an addict (with heroin one will), and of those who have become an addict, some can come out of it. Not all drug users have such damaged brains.

Xyzcf, I don't think your husband's drug use when he was young means he has always been unhappy/depressed and that he will never be out of MLC, or be happy again. That would be that there is no hope for former drug users, let alone true hard addicts, and there is.

Also, some MLCers, like Mr J, never used drugs. Yet, they have as deeper and messy crisis, they are as depressed and unhappy, as the MLCers who have used drugs.

And we need to establish a difference between people who have used drugs for a period, and those who have become addicts. It is not exactly the same thing.
Alcohol often causes far more damages than drugs. Well, alcohol is a drug.

[xyzcf]

Drug use when the brain is still forming is only one thing perhaps that could have some causation. Indeed, there is now a clear link between marijuana use and schizophrenia, but the individual was predisposed to the illness...but it may never had surfaced if not for their use of marijuana.

What struck me was that the transponders, once they have been destroyed do not regenerate. They are necessary for the transportation of dopamine and serotonin and the comment made that once they were diminished, that someone might never be able to feel "happy". In an addicted brain, this seems to be what happens. People may not have developed an addiction to a drug, but they still may have sustained damage.

Marijuana is not the same plant today as it was in my teen years. In the 60-70's, the THC level was 2-7%, 2003 it was 14% and now, what I can easily buy in the several stores close by, the THC level is 18-35%, Wax, dabs, oil and hash are running at 50-90% THC. There is a transparent wax that is 98% pure THC.

In Colorado, teen marijuana use is 56% higher than the national average. In those developing brains and with the high concentration of THC, there are several serious problems.

She told a story about two recent grads, top of their class who were hired by a NY financial firm. When they got there, prior to starting work, they had to have a hair sample which showed they had been exposed to marijuana in the last 90 days. Their contracts were immediately cancelled.

Other stories involved kids who were refused scholarships because they tested positive. The impact is significant. 36% more drug related traffic deaths in Colorado since marijuana was legalized.

Just like one alcoholic beverage during a critical time of pregnancy can cause a serious damaging effect on the fetus, it is not inconceivable to me that drug use could cause the development of a mental health issue. It is just another part of the puzzle.

When I look back, my husband just never got very excited about things in life. Getting a new car, traveling, being promoted...he just did not respond with the enthusiasm that I did.....I thought he was just "quieter" than me...but I have always known him to be this way...just not very turned onto much (except music perhaps). His work has been his addiction for several years prior to BD. I used to think that I would stand a better chance against another woman than I would against his job.As it turned out, that was the truth.

[Hopeful Romantic]

Saw this today and thought to put it here....I know almost all of us are waiting for a true apology, and know that some of us may never get it, but here's what a REAL one should look like (according to science). Happy reading!

http://www.iflscience.com/editors-blog/heres-best-way-apologize-according-science

[Anjae]

Interesting article. Hopeful Romantic.

I think 2 is not possible for MLCers. They have no idea what happened, let alone what went wrong.

I would do with 3 and 5. 1 would also be ok, but 2, 4 and 6 I could pass. The most important ones for me really are 3 and 5, especially 5.

[31andcounting]

I agree with Anjae.  I received all of this when H came through...but #2 "the why"  was not complete as he did not know why?  He knew he had checked out and pulled away from me but as to why really.....no answers just "some thoughts"
31

new thread: http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=7723.0