[OldPilot]

I think many I us have felt depressed but that doesn't mean we have depression. I know what it is about clinically but like Passiflora I have never experienced it myself. I have felt sad in many instances including when grieving my best friend but the the hopeless, despair associated with depression I can thankfully say I am not familiar with.

Well I dont think I was ever clinically depressed either however I have been prescribed anti depressants during this mess and at one point following my divorce final, the room started to spin around which I believe was also stress related.

My point is that our bodies have a way of taking care of ourselves and their is nothing wrong with admitting that we may not always be thinking straight.
The real test is whether you can look in the mirror and see yourself for who you really are.
And make the changes you need to make to propel yourself forward.
MLC'ers tend to DENY anything is wrong.
It is always someone elses  fault.
We dont want to fall into the same trap.

[Passiflora]

Sorry OP, for late reply

And Passiflora - you have never been depressed? Sad, yes, experienced the 5-6 stages of grieving yes.
Never had someone die or feel like staying in bed all day? Someone close died, Yes! Want to stay in bed all day. NO
Never had the energy to do things that you used to love? NO
Had no appetite - lost weight on the LBS diet? Lost appetite, YES, first month after BD. Which is a normal reaction to a abnormal situation
Yup you probably have experienced it but
like are MLC'ers are in denial about that. No, I don't think I'm in denial about it. I think that different people have different coping strategies to stress.

I think, some of us, much since "how" we tackle stress is due to our upbringing and our environment, experience sadness and some mild depression (weight loss for example) but major depression/ psychotic depression/ bipolar is very different, what I have read. The symptoms from major depressive like; hallucinations, delusions, psychosis lack of impulse behavior, suicide  etc.

But my main question is still; is "our" mlc'r, having depression "only" (as in male depression signs are what most of us describe here), or do they have a NPD disorder first and a depression on top of that? (cluster B personality types experience more depressions). I think depression comes on 3rd or 4th place over world health issues. Male depression has signs of being "bipolar" but this still don't explain the lying and other pure evil stuff, it might explain "monster". One last thing, people having major depression in quantity is way higher % than what is diagnosed with a cluster B personality.

[OldPilot]

But my main question is still; is "our" mlc'r, having depression "only" (as in male depression signs are what most of us describe here), or do they have a NPD disorder first and a depression on top of that? (cluster B personality types experience more depressions).

Simple answer is NO it is not depression only as we have established above you and I became depressed and did not then have any other symptoms or have a crisis.
So depression is part of it, add in some hormonal issues, childhood issues, possibly FOO, enabling partners, midlife issues, and maybe some other factors(transitions) and you have a perfect storm to have a MLC. Forgot to mention empty nest, deaths, illnesses or some other trigger.

I am not sure why being bipolar or depressed does not  explain lying as my experience shows that lying comes very naturally to my bipolar mother.

I can only say that since you have never been so depressed that you could not get out of bed,
that some depressed people are that way, and if you translate that into MLC,
you can see why some are vanishers.
They can not even get out of bed, have no energy to do anything so they are like a wounded
animal hiding in a cave trying to repair themselves

Oh and I totally agree that mental illness is totally under reported and diagnosed in the world.

Here are some depression books that I would suggest

I Don't Want To Talk About It: Overcoming the Secret Legacy of Male Depression
by Terrence Real
Unmasking Male Depression by Archibald Hart
The Pain Behind The Mask: Overcoming Masculine Depression by John Lynch,
Christopher T. Kilmarting
My book review
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=1965.msg175299#msg175299

[calamity]

Also there is enlightment to be had via the website The storied mind.  They recently [?] had an article on depressed spouses who leave but I'm too lazy to look up the link.

[Trustandlove]

I've also read things on "the storied mind", generally found them pretty good.

Depression shows itself in many ways; I've struggled with it, but have never just stayed in bed all day -- I found that made it worse.  But I do know how it can colour everything, make you see just the bad, or at the least amplify the bad.  Or make the bad negate the good in something.

It sounds glib; but men in depression, especially those in denial about it, tend to act out -- hence the behaviours that we see.  Women have more of a tendency to cry, to "act in".  That is a huge generalisation, but can help explain some behaviours.

As to whether it is "just" depression or another clinical disorder; IMO depression and their response to it plays a huge role.  For some it may really be a bipolar disorder, but I think that is much less common.

I agree with OP that it's the perfect storm of many things; that is why it is often so hard to pick apart the reasons.  If it were just one thing, we reason, we could deal with it....

Lying is an element of depression -- generally because of the shame they feel that they are even depressed or anything else in the first place.  That is my own take on it; lying is also another way of expressing anger, which they all seem to feel.  And that makes sense if you think that depression is anger turned inward....

That all may not have come out clearly, does any if it make sense?

Again, if we have clingier MLCers we see more of this, which can drive us nuts but also teach us to deal with it better; I'm sure vanishers go through the same thing, we just don't see it, so we can perhaps heal better. 

[Nas]

I read storied mind stuff over and over and have multiple articles saved as reference. 

This article and others on storied mind are the only reason I didn't completely fall to pieces in the months after H left:

http://www.storiedmind.com/self-esteem/why-depressed-men-leave-1/