[limitless]

I thought I would add a comment - as I am (most likely) one of the divorced, bitter moderators.

Sigh.

I agree with all you wrote EXCEPT that you are a bitter divorce moderator - TOTALLY DISAGREE with that statement.

You are divorced and you are a moderator but NOT bitter. NOPE!

Thanks, OP. 

I wrote that a bit tongue in cheek.   

As I am divorced - I put myself in the "bitter" box.....I certainly couldn't put myself in the divorced and "happy" box.  There is no joy in divorce.  I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

I do feel bitter, at times.  But those times are rare and brief.   

As for the comments about negativity.  I have sometimes been described as "negative".  I struggle with the words negative and pessimistic vs. realistic or "hopeful."

Is the glass 1/2 full or 1/2 empty?  Well, for me, that depends upon what the glass represents.  If the glass is my husband - then the glass no longer exists.  It is very difficult (read impossible) to be 1/2 full - when it isn't there anymore.  Maybe it is 1/2 full in the kitchen where it resides?  I would have no idea.  If the scant info I am given from my kids is any indication - the glass is empty.

I really wish that I could have some compassion towards my Ex.  If I am being completely honest - I don't.  I used to think that would come with TIME.  But, it hasn't.  I had more compassion for him in the early days after BD, as he had been completely successful in convincing me that ALL of it was my fault. 

I look back at what he did, what he chose, the pain he caused....etc. and I feel no compassion.  I feel that he let his family down. 

I have now lowered my expectations to zero and he no longer disappoints. 

If that is negative...that's ok.  It is honestly how I feel about it today - after 69 weeks post BD.

L

[Mitzpah]

What I suggest is that that there are a few topics that perhaps should be openly discussed.

• Whether standers should be the only ones who are on the HS forum?
• Whether NC (which as far as I can see - I really was never in) is a doomsday to a R?
• Is there a role for the "Bitter" divorced moderators on the forum?

But I suggest that you take these discussions to an independent thread so they can be discussed objectively - and not in context of how I have lived my life.

Airmid requested a separate thread be used to discuss these issues I will start it here.

I believe that every LBS is welcome and that we need to be respectful of each other because it is clear that our journeys have different aspects. There is no one size fits all! Our commonalities bring us together, our shock at BD, our struggles to get back on our feet, the anguish and pain, the realization that what we had once dreamed is dead - this community helps us feel less alone and sets us on the path to recovery, of course, what this recovery looks like is bound to be different from person to person, the time it takes, varies a lot, too. I think the mix is good, what is not good is lack of respect for individual positions.

NC is not my favorite subject - when I was a very little girl, growing up with five younger brothers and sisters, my father used to be very firm with us regarding the usual bickering and squabbling among siblings. He would not allow us to 'refuse' to talk to the offending party. He always said that we did not resolve things in that way
I do not initiate contact with my h. who is mostly unwilling to talk to me, so we go long, long stretches without any contact, however, I initiate for Christmas, Easter, Father's day, and his birthday with no expectations of being corresponded. I allow him to control any other communication and when that happens, I correspond in kind. I do not like NC being proposed and I don't think I have ever recommended it. I can understand that it may be necessary to protect the LBS from "monster" - I never had a very bad monster and I am very good at avoiding painful situations, I am not a sucker for suffering  

I am divorced, I have examined myself and I don't think I am bitter, perhaps a little 'jaded' but not bitter. I have too much to do and think about to be bitter! I can't think of any moderator who is divorced and bitter, actually.

Hey Limitless, you aren't bitter!!!

[UnconditionalLove]

I have no idea what happened on Air's page and I read it so I must have lost the final something but I did want to chime in because our paths are kind of the same.

2014 my Now EX started actually strange.  He was a professor and was given a girl age 32 to help with her research project the summer of 2013.  I have no idea but something in me said this wasn't a good idea and I voiced that.  He just started this new teaching job and I must have felt something brewing in my soul because i told him I thought they should give this girl to a woman.  He had never cheated, looked at anyone that I knew of and I had no reason to think he would ever cheat but I must have felt something was going on before I registered it mentally.

By Feb 2014 he did the whole change look thing, fitness thing and by March of 2014 he started to not come home saying he was hanging out with students.  By May of 2014 I actually said to him you are leaving me which in turn started the whole BD thing.  He never even to this day as he has now moved to the same state as the OW said or talked about their relationship.  He will still say he didn't have an affair.  2 weeks after BD he went and saw an attorney and about a month later some charges showed up in the mail which scared the crap out of because he was actually moving forward with this divorce.  I called a attorney who informed me that I better do something because he's probably going after the IRA.  So off to the attorney I go and as thought he did go after the IRA.  I'm guessing he found out how much it was going to cost to get a divorce and used that as his open door to getting some of the money out.  I served him papers before he had a chance to serve me and it was good for me to have done that as it marked him as being in an affair.

The point here is YES I did file but did so to protect myself as my EX for some of you who has been reading my threads was extremely Manic and angry so I had no idea what he would or wouldn't do and he wasn't consistent.  He never took money out of our joint account because I think he also lived off the IRA so he could have money to use I wouldn't see but then he would hound me on other thing over and over.  I was still living in the same house with him and then he started recording me and I had to get him out.

Filing for the divorce kind of gave me some control.  I was able to string in a long a bit hoping for change.  It actually worked in my favor because in Feb 2015 we had to go into mediation and mediation worked in my favor because MLC'er H could figure out anything so they all had to relay on what I said and I was being fair.  So, I got what I needed and MLCer didn't fight anything.

Filing for the divorce also protected me so I had someone to turn to when he did all the crazy things he did.

Filing for divorce and this is my one regret labeled me as the one who wanted the divorce.  NOW, MLCer gets to tell his parents I left him.  All our friends know that isn't the case and why I did what I did but MLC wanted me to file so he pushed and pushed me to do so through his action knowing I would at some point have to do something and it work.  I still hate that I was the one to file but I was scared.

Am I a stander?

YES but I do believe he will never come back.  I do believe he is one to leave and never look back.  He acted fast by going to an attorney.  He isn't one to do things reasonably and all he could think about was OW.  If he ever questioned anything about staying I never saw that.  I think the divorce will keep him from coming back and that is a risk we take for protecting ourselves.

As of OCT 5th our divorce was final and as of NOV something, something changed in La la land because for the most part he response to my emails, does what I need him to do with business and if I do the work he will sign everything I need him to sign.  He treats me better now thing in the last 2 years.  I don't know if he is still seeing OW or not because he never says anything but I'm pretty sure he still wants the divorce as is.  He doesn't really contact me unless he needs something or I needed something and contacted him.  There is never any chitchat.

I still believe I am a stander.  MY EX H is in my soul.  I can't get rid of that.  I will always love who he was, pray for healing.  I'm moving forward as though he's never coming back but that doesn't lessing my stand.

[Faithfully Yours]

As I am divorced - I put myself in the "bitter" box.....I certainly couldn't put myself in the divorced and "happy" box.  There is no joy in divorce.  I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

This is so TRUE Limitless. Divorce is a path I would not wish on anyone and definitely not one I would have chosen for myself. I have bounced back and am doing well, but I still see the pain that it has caused my children on a daily basis. They are forced to live out of duffel bags as they are bounced back and forth from house to house. They are not sure which place is their home and never really know where they are going to be. I try my hardest to be the consistency that they need, but it is so difficult when you have someone constantly working against you.

The cold hard reality is that none of us imagined our lives ending this way, and the best we can do is pick up the pieces and move forward the best we can.

Hugs to you.
Faithfully

[Passiflora]

Whether standers should be the only ones who are on the HS forum?
Whether NC (which as far as I can see - I really was never in) is a doomsday to a R?
Is there a role for the "Bitter" divorced moderators on the forum?


OK here is the verdict from the Swedish jury! 

A, It's an almost open forum isn't it? Am I standing or not. Honestly I have no freaking idea. I was abused so "standing" would make me a kamikaze pilot, doesn't it? Am I not standing? Don't know this either. I'm not rushing around trying to find someone new. Take one day at time. IF I happen to run into someone nice and interesting and it's mutual, I would not turn him down. Is that not standing? Conclusion, me myself and I cycle about this question so much and I think I'm not the only one, so why should not, NOT standers be allowed on the HS forum?

B, NC doomsday to a R. I have no idea! I do know, for me (only talking about me here) I put more value in my own healing, not ever want to have contact with a person who has no respect for me. This, for me, goes for all interactions I have with people. I cut them out of my life. NOT MY KIDS!!! Speaking from my experience with my mlc dad (never came out of the tunnel) he ran away for 4-5 years or so (back in the early 80th) he then contacted me and behaved like he never left, still confuses me a lot that someone can do this. He died 2006 or something and all these years he tried to contact me several times. As for my mlc mother (she was the one who had the affair, lasted 3-4 years weekend and holidays only) she is now in her 80th, she never apologized (what I know about) to my dad, still in her tunnel, tried to apologize to us children when I was in my 30th. She got worse and worse, more and more narc behavior when she got older, pity parties a lot. I cut contact approx. 2008. She tries to contact me, trough my coworkers/friends etc. and some direct contact. Got one HUGE birthday card 2 years ago, really strange card with lots of photos of me when I was young/younger. My Conclusion, I think NC or no NC, they still reach out, may take a little bit longer but they reach out.

C, Bitter? What is "bitter"? Is bitter someone who is harsh? direct? have different views of stuff? Who is envious? Angry? Negative? I can be all of the above and so can everyone else. Somedays S*CKS (try living in my part of the world when it's 0 degrees and raining + darkness 6 months every year)  , that's just the way life is. These are the days I want a baseball bat and my mlc in close range!    Other days are not so bad and positive, these are the days when your pupils return from winter holliday with a chocolate box specially for me. Conclusion everyone that is on this forum and contributing with the healing, with their knowledge in medicine/psychology/law or what ever has a role in this forum, mentor or not.

I try to do my best on this forum, I do have a vanisher so I don't have so much info (yet) but I can give my thoughts and maybe some will find them useful some might not. Conclusion on this, this is my way of trying to pay back to others, the help I got from all of you on this forum, when I was at the bottom of this mess.

[hawk]

Personally l've always thought the forum needs lots of other open sections.There are so many things to this new life we've all been thrown into , not only the marriage or what's left of it stuff itself .
lt'd be good to just be able to talk about all sorts of things too with others going through all this but just on your own thread doesn't cover it.

But then just reading what some have said about the earlier days and the more R's and whatnot , maybe it is better or the intention of the forum to just stick to solely the marriage and mlc stuff , l'm not sure.
l can see bug advantages in the focusing on all that too and so l've never taken it further.

[Mac49]

Hi all:

This is easy commentary for me - BD was 8 years ago last Friday.

X still drifting in fog, pokes head out occasionally to see if I'm still around.

LBS Epiphany moment was realization that X did less than nothing in relationship when you take out intimate moments.

Angry, absolutely however tempered with pity.

Bitter - Not, Logical yes. Help in solving my issue with attracting damaged women.

It was helpful early on after initial BD to express the overwhelming rage I felt for this destruction heaped on by the MLC'r. I raged on another site and started to temper commentary when I hooked up with HS, although I can truly say I have been chastised for various opinions.

Kindest words spoken on my behalf came from my last surviving uncle - "Thank God for you"

Peace to you all

Mac

[OldPilot]

I raged on another site and started to temper commentary when I hooked up with HS, although I can truly say I have been chastised for various opinions.

Yea I seem to remember that you were Mac47 at that time............
Now you are 54.... LOL

[Mac49]

OP

I like to show that the LBS survives whether or not the MLC'r is in the picture.

Mac

[in it]

I'll express myself even though I wasn't ever dealing at any time with a loving kind thoughtful considerate spouse who simply ( from the postings I've read) just appeared to simply stop caring..

My thoughts on NC are this:

At the very least you end up suffering a lot less damage from their abusive attacks and language or filling you in on the OW/OM . Trying to drag you down with them and inflict their misery on you.Your well-being is what you need to concern yourself with -not theirs. Self compassion it crucial.

 It gives YOU time to breathe and refocus. If you are human.. you need time to heal.

And I can cause more damage ( and so can they) that is why I have left it up to my adult children to contact me if they want too. They have had very little control since this started.

I have made a small token move in my youngest D's direction through a relative. No response yet which is good. I haven't been blocked on social network And I have to be content with that.

In my own defense I had no idea what I was dealing with.Until I was completely away from it. I was unaware lied to and mislead for pretty much the entire time of the relationship. All he and I did was fight..unless I agreed with him.

I have forgiven myself for being soooooo stupid. I stayed as long as I did due to foo issues, finances, and because the family being intact once meant everything to me.

It took my head hitting the pavement to wake me up to just what kind of whack job I had been dealing with.

I once read someone post that what the OW/OM didn't get was their youth, the way we did.

Well nothing depresses me more than the fact that the x got mine. I have to move forward from that and accept the truth that I spent half my life with someone who never cared about me. To him it was all a big lie and a game.

I love myself more than to go back. Or even go back in time and try and paint some romantic mutual fulfilling picture of a relationship that didn't exist. Or even something that could be "fixed" as I don't ever planning putting the effort out in that direction again.

Bitter?.. maybe at times..jaded...I guess....mostly disillusioned.