[OldPilot]

I don't recall RCR advocating standing forever for all LBS, as a general course of action, but she does acknowledge Covenant Keepers and the length of time as a personal decision as long as standing is not static.

I think that this is true and this discussion and the one on the mod board is exploring what that length of time is and how all of us continue to move forward in a healthy and mature way.

[heroIam]

"We are all capable of helping and hurting. We are all giving at times and selfish at others. Every last one of us has the potential for darkness and light. So forgive others, forgive yourself, look for light in the world, and shine your own. And never forget that people can grow and change. Never stop believing in the healing power of love and kindness. And most importantly, never stop believing in yourself.”"

[Phoenix]

I think that this is true and this discussion and the one on the mod board is exploring what that length of time is and how all of us continue to move forward in a healthy and mature way.

I don't know that we, as a board, can or should determine a specific length of time or that people are moving in a healthy and mature way. That is so personal and for individual reasons. We won't all agree on each other's decisions or paths, if in context of our own lives, circumstances, faith and philosophies, but we don't have to. Information and support can be offered, but I believe we have to let go of any need to judge or determine that for another and leave people to their own process and their own outcomes.

Phoenix

[Kat0465]

I had posted a while back on how long is too long to stand.... Crazy me, sometimes I think this whole thing should certainly have a time line..  BD or standing it does not really.
I worry about lost time that I cannot get back... I'm 51 and feel like I'm missing all this quality time with my spouse. So I had to sit and do some work on ME.  I had reverted back to not being good to me and moving on in my life without H.

So,I'm GAL once again, trying to move forward where I feel God is leading me....one day at a time.
This takes years, with no guarantees. Why not work to be the better person that comes out of this.
I miss my H, I miss waking up to him, ending my day with him, and everything in between... And I have realized that unless my God sends me in another direction, all I can do is remember all the great things about what I had, and maybe just maybe will have again, only better... Time after all, it's not a bad thing. Time is living, time is loving, time is giving. It is truly a Gift

[Onward]

I think that this is true and this discussion and the one on the mod board is exploring what that length of time is and how all of us continue to move forward in a healthy and mature way.

I don't know that we, as a board, can or should determine a specific length of time or that people are moving in a healthy and mature way. That is so personal and for individual reasons. We won't all agree on each other's decisions or paths, if in context of our own lives, circumstances, faith and philosophies, but we don't have to. Information and support can be offered, but I believe we have to let go of any need to judge or determine that for another and leave people to their own process and their own outcomes.

Phoenix

Hear, hear -- Completely agree - which was the motivation for my non-addressed questions at the very beginning of this thread. There is a fine line between information, and interference.

For what it's worth,  I don't think RCR is seeing much on the forum at all. She herself has said she is very busy with several young children and cannot spend time here as she once did. Completely understandable.

So I suspect RCR is guided and counciled by the moderator team. And the moderator team is a group of people who bring their own range of perspectives and experiences and stances. So that range of inputs is inevitably going to have sway. I suspect what RCR sees on the forum is only the slices that are drawn to her attention now.

[Roma]

I'll just add one more thing. When I arrived in December of last year, I looked around at many many people's status looking for hope and most said 'Divorced and Done' which I found very discouraging.

[Songanddance]

So I suspect RCR is guided and counciled by the moderator team. And the moderator team is a group of people who bring their own range of perspectives and experiences and stances. So that range of inputs is inevitably going to have sway. I suspect what RCR sees on the forum is only the slices that are drawn to her attention now.

Sorry Onward but that is not how it works.

RCR sees much more than you think and has taken enormous care over allocating mentors to newbies by reading the threads and personal emails in detail. She is also coaching individual members.   More often than not she will point things out to us and any guiding is when we may have had greater contact or  communication with a member or so. We are invited to be a mentor and RCR is the one who does that after studying our responses to others as well as keeping tabs on our own progress.  We don't have to accept and indeed there are some fab people on the forum who have been invited and turned it down.

Our discussions are very diverse, interesting and at times frustrating.  However, some of our discussions are in response to something that RCR has noticed or observed when reading a range of threads. If we raise separate certain points or concerns she will respond with her perspective.

None of us would ever assume we could "sway" or guide her opinion or ideas.   

I'm not quite sure why you would wish to make such comments about the mentor/mods team. We are an incredibly diverse range of people with hugely different experiences, viewpoints, some of us standing and some of us not. Some with vanishers, some with clingers, some with wallowers. Some of us have careers children and some of us don't. Some of us have small children, some have grown children and some have grandchildren and some don't. Some of us agree with other mentors at different times and then disagree at others.

As Phoenix states so eloquently:

This growing, aging board requires more tolerance, more patience, more caution with our words, more understanding and compassion, more walking in another's shoes. It also, and naturally, creates subdivisions based on beliefs, timelines, stages, and so on. It's not manageable to keep up with 4000 people so there is a natural gravitation toward certain shared beliefs, stages, circumstances, etc. That is normal and does not need to be errosion of the board or the message. It just requires more diligence to also remain an overall community because, no matter where we are on our own journey

 
The one thing we all have in common, though is the desire to help newbies and LBsers who face MLC and feel lost, lonely, hurt and bewildered.  We are all volunteers - we all have busy lives to live and we all do what we can when we can.   There is no hidden agenda - the only agenda is how to help others deal with this traumatic and life changing situation that we are all thrust unwillingly into.

[Onward]

Songanddance, I'm sorry if my comments read as a criticism of the moderator team. If they caused negative feelings, I am sorry.

I said exactly the same thing you did - that there is a very diverse group of moderators, and your perspectives are going to have sway. It's impossible that they wouldn't. That's not how community works, or teams work.

My comment was in response to Phoenix's comments, and my point was that RCR doesn't have the time to provide the same singular thought leadership to the board she once did. She has said so herself.

I said nothing about a hidden agenda, and haven't even suggested there is one. I said nothing about the mentor team.

I realize I have a direct way of speaking. And that directness is obviously viewed as criticism, when it is not the intent. I'll work on that.

Perhaps if the lens on me were more one of recognizing that my comments also come from a place of care and support, that would also help.

[handpuppets]

There are very few online communities that I've found in my search for information where the LBS' decision to Stand is encouraged or supported, especially for long-term Standers like myself.

I think we all come here knowing -consciously or subconsciously- that the odds are not in our favor. I would have found it very discouraging if I was reminded of the odds everywhere I turned.

I know there are some of us who want to protect newbies who show up on our community doorstep (i.e., learn from our mistakes so do this, that, and the other) but part of the journey for the LBS is to detach, let go, surrender, accept, and trust the process.

Because ultimately, IMHO, it's has nothing to do with the odds. It's about holding space and bearing witness to one another as we heal.

It is my hope for THS to be a place where each of us are able to show through our words and actions that all community members are valued regardless if you agree with someone (or not) and a place where we can practice grace and kindness with one another.

[Airmid]

The funny thing about all of this is -
if this were cancer - people would act much differently.
Well BD is like getting a cancer diagnosis.
All cancers are different.
Some can be treated and have great success - others are gravely serious.

Lets look at a serious stage 4 cancer.
The patient and family goes in for the diagnosis.
The very next questions usually are about treatments and....
probabilities for recovery.

In the case of pancreatic cancers -
the survival rate is very low - 5-6% (similar to the divorce and remarriage rate)
Patients want to know that statistic.
Because with that knowledge - you can make informed decisions.
Some choose not to go forward with more treatment - and choose palliative care.
Others choose some treatment - but not drastic medical intervention.
Others use every medical means possible to fight the cancer.
Most lose the battle - 95% die.
But its not about the final survival rate -
it is about how you want to live the rest of your life - knowing the odds.
Those that choose to fight with every medical means have no guarantee of a better outcome,
but it is how they want to live their life.

I think this is very similar to what RCR has done with the most recent post.
She has expressed how serious the situation is with MLC and the health of the marriage.
She has stated the odds as she sees it from her perspective.

Strangely - no one faults a Dr for stating the life and death odds.
In fact it would be considered malpractice not to disclose the risks of a serious illness.
And the odds are not in stone - they are guideposts.
If you are in the 5-6% cure rate - then from your perspective - there is a 100% cure rate (for yourself).
No Dr says - "have no hope" - they simply explain what the chances are - so that proper planning can happen.
Yet I am hearing LBS posters basically say - "don't tell me what I don't want to hear."

How very sad -
because knowing the odds does nothing but allows the LBSer more choice as to how they want to proceed with their lives.
And isn't choice the very thing we were robbed of at BD?